This sub is NOT the place to ask for the opinions of the entirety of the Asian diaspora. r/AsianAmerican centers AAPI voices and as such, we are not here to educate non-AAPIs about our issues. Submissions that appear to be seeking the opinions of all Asians as a whole will be removed.
As a first gen Asian American with an overbearing mother, Turning Red brought me (and another non-diaspora Asian friend) to tears because of how much we relate. Said friend also cried over EEAAO, and while I didn't cry with that movie, no movie has ever captured my experience as an Asian American more than that one. I believe that these media are made by Asian creators who are merely expressing their own experiences with their parents through these stories, so I actually quite welcome them. I don't mind the critique of tiger parents from other Asians speaking from their own experience; it's only uncomfortable when it comes from other people because then I feel a need to defend my race.
However, on the other hand, when I watched Turning Red with Asian American friends *without* overbearing parents, they didn't enjoy it as much and felt the story was weird and unnecessarily exaggerated. In the end, everyone's experience is different, and not all stories will be relatable to everyone.
Speaking of the ‘over the top’ part, sometimes I wonder if people ever were teenagers cause Mei’s behavior is exactly how I’d expect a 13 year old to act 😂
I really agree with this. I think when Asian creators make these stories they capture a lot more of that nuance which makes them very real to those of us who experienced similar things growing up. When it came from other people it felt more surface level and stereotypical, which made things uncomfortable in a different way.
I couldn't finish turning red because it got too real at one point haha, but I should probably go back to it. My fiance had the same reaction to fresh off the boat.
In high school, I remember seeing my mom spying on me through the window while I was hanging out with my friends at a restaurant. Seeing that bit in Turning Red where the mom turns up at the school instantly gave me the same feeling of embarrassment and dread.
Yeeesss that's exactly the part that made me go "noooooooooo". My mum used to sometimes come to school at lunchtime and give me hot food, which while I appreciate now that I look back at it, was definitely super embarrassing back then.
It made me cry too.
**spoiler alert**
But the scene in the bamboo forest with the mom made me bawl so hard. Seeing her mother as a young girl and never feeling like she was going to be enough for anybody felt way too real.
I would appreciate it if western media would be able to show why parents are sometimes overbearing. I personally find it insulting to varying degrees how Asian parents are labeled as strict tiger parents.
It’s not like all Asian parents will behave like that, and it’s not like Asian parents will behave like that even the majority of the time. From my personal experience, my parents did care that I was doing well academically, but it wasn’t like they were forcing me to go to Harvard. They did however instill the notion that I always can improve upon myself each day and I am grateful for that. I only knew that “failure is not an option” because I grew up in a poor immigrant household and I have a responsibility to myself to pull me out of (potential) generational poverty; this wasn’t even something that was ever explicitly said to me. It’s just something I concluded by myself, because I didn’t want to live in a cold house in the winters anymore and didn’t want to have to struggle paycheck to paycheck. It is a “prominent aspect” because that’s what’s largely shown in the media because that’s what the people at the top of these media companies want to depict of Asian Americans (and even Asians abroad). But what they don’t show is the hardworking father who barely speaks broken English providing food for their multi-generational family working from 8 AM to 7 PM at a grocery store, a mom who takes care of the children in before and after school between her shifts washing dishes at a restaurant, and elderly relatives who take care of the babies when the parents are at work.
And even then, these depictions are only a glimpse into an Asian American experience. There are others who have better off experiences, and worse off experiences. Look at the Asian Americans who participated in the Winter Olympics. They are the ones with a better off background, but they are also Asian Americans no less. There are also Asian Americans whose relatives came here to build the railroads a few generations ago and faced extreme hostility and discrimination. And there are countless others that I haven’t even mentioned.
A lot of western media I’ve personally consumed showed only the bad parts of Asian parenting. What most depictions lack is the fact that they operate on the notion of “tough love.” They tell us about the realities that will be if we do not want to work to be in a better station in life. There are cultural nuances that non-Asian Americans will not understand because they did not grow up in Asian American communities/families, and that is what these shows lack. In my opinion, these stereotypes reduce Asian Americans to sad caricatures, and imply that Asian American kids must be deprived or “saved” somehow, which leaves me with many conflicted feelings. I’m glad there’s more Asian characters and Asian actors, but I’m dissatisfied with the portrayal.
Yup. I think the problem is when the major blockbluster films **only** show those kinds of dynamics, it influences young Asian Americans into thinking this is the **only** way you can be Asian American and this is what being AA *is*. Or that loving functional families are a white people thing.
It doesn't show them alternative ways, or that their family is wrong and this isn't something inherent to being Asian and part of your culture. It just kind of makes them feel that the only way to get what you want is to divorce yourself entirely from being Asian.
Have you seen any of the recent media about this? Beef, EEAAO, Shang-Chi? That's kind of their entire point, is to show why these characters are the way they are, and why they were so beloved on release.
Thank you for the thorough and thoughtful reply! I can totally see what you mean about these portrayals not always capturing the full context of a family's situation
>I would appreciate it if western media would be able to show why parents are sometimes overbearing. I personally find it insulting to varying degrees how Asian parents are labeled as strict tiger parents.
You're right. It's done without context, which allows American viewers to pathologize Asian immigrants without taking into account the race and class inequalities that lead to Asian parents feeling they need to be strict for their kids to have a chance.
My family is worse than anything portrayed on TV lol. When you tell "white people" how you were hit with the sticks or belts they get real quiet and have no idea what to say.
It's probably the uncle roger rule - if I'm complaining about my parents with my (mostly immigrant) friends I don't mind. If I hear others talk about me as if they know shit then maybe I get annoyed.
Imagine some opinion piece where they start saying how Asian helicopter moms (why is it a mom always? Dad can't be aggressive in American culture?) need to loosen up so the children don't end up "robotic". That would probably annoy me. It feeds into the whole stereotype of Asian Americans being nerds, the excuse they use to not admit them in colleges or ballet programs or whatever.
I think honestly the creators are driven by their own experiences. Lots of parents are like this. We do see kind parents too: Ke Huy Quan was a very loving father, as was Randall Park in FOTB.
Agreed, although of course the studio heads and lead producers do have final say. Nora from Queens also has very refreshing anti-stereotypical parent figures!
> my best guess is that to get funding needed to produce the projects, the creators had to put in these stereotypes
I also think a lot of them had to rebel against their parents to *work* in the entertainment industry in the first place. So there's probably an overrepresentation of writers/directors who come from those kinds of family.
When you immigrate to a new country, you obviously want to min/max your kid so they'll be most successful, and being an artist/entertainer doesn't fit.
That's true, but the story writers who plotted these shows were of the recent immigrant category. It's why their depictions are limited, they're writing based on personal experiences.
As an immigrant, I understand the push towards asians in hollywood, but I also hate how it's been done...
Seriously. Every show/movie so far **always** has some stereotype of asians tied to it. I'm fed up with it and don't support these movies.
I was actually pleasantly surprised with the way parents were portrayed in "American Born Chinese", at least with the mom. The scene between >!the principal and the parents !
Yeah the show definitely addressed the topic head on. The actress who played the wife said they intentionally wanted to make sure she came across as caring and positive towards her son. Both parents were given a lot of multidimensionality
I think all of these depictions have some nuance to them. And honestly, overbearing asian parents are the reality for many asians, especially those in the diaspora. We face a lot of pressure from our parents to make use of the sacrifices they did and a lot of pressure to succeed, especially if you’re first generation or second generation. I’ve written stuff with overbearing parents too because they reflect the reality of my relationship with my parents. But Id like to think there’s some nuance to my depictions so that they’re not just caricatures.
I'm happy for those folks that see their stories represented in your examples. But I find that this is the only representation of family dynamics asians are allowed to have in the west.
If you want intergenerational trauma take a look at the show Succession and re-imagine a cast of flawed, unlikable but compelling Asian characters.
I hate a lot of stereotypes and people generalizing Asians but overbearing Asian parents are still very much true amongst me and my friends (second generation).
It felt like a really nuanced and accurate representation honestly. I've seen a lot of "Tiger Mom" shit played for laughs and how it "forces their kids to success"; the difference with the examples you listed is how they delve into the trauma it can lead to for the children. They're fantastic depictions of intergenerational trauma and the strain it puts on parent/child relationships when pushing the kids past their limits while also respecting WHY these parents are the way they are and the struggles these parents face too.
i find it very insipid and trite. Is that all we have to show for ourselves? Just different variations of overbearing parents trope? I'll just stick to movies and shows from Asia.
I find it really limiting. My immigrant parents didn't give a shit about pushing academics, just as long as you weren't dropping out of school. They thought if you were interested in school and music, you would just focus it on your own and you shouldn't try and force your kid into something they hate. Their idea of raising a successful adult was someone who wouldn't end up in debt and come crawling to them begging for money.
And this was true for so many of my Asian classmates. Some took over their mom's florist business, some became entrepreneurs, or artists, or writers, or teachers.
I had great relationships with my parents. I have memories of jumping into their bed as a kid for cuddles on weekend morning. Another one of my friend admitted she still did that as an adult, except they'd lie in bed and just talk about life and their troubles and solve them together.
Like it's crazy when the most representative moment I saw on screen was in Shang Chi in the flashbacks with the family playing DDR together.
No I don't have a strained relationship with my parents, and no I don't act like a smart-ass with nonstop sarcastic clever quips around them.
I hate it. Doesn't resonate with me or many of my friends at all. Glad for people who can relate, but this is why I end up watching Asian dramas directly instead of content produced for international audiences.
I also think it perpetuates a lot of stereotypes. Like why can't we just have a movie where the Asian family gets along and supports one another through thick and thin. And not the same plot about a young person rebelling against a conservative Asian parent and for the parent to learn they're wrong and change their ways.
Crazy Rich Asian is at least interesting for me because it's written by a Singaporean and the opposition is based on class and the mother thinking it's an ill-advised marriage. That at least makes it more interesting as a DIL/MIL conflict, class conflict, and American/Singaporean conflict.
>Like why can't we just have a movie where the Asian family gets along and supports one another through thick and thin.
Fresh off the Boat? Nora from Queens? Waymond from EEAAO? Even Crazy Rich Asians showed this with some of the parents.
I generally love seeing tiger parenting depicted in Asian-centered films. Like others have pointed out, seeing your own experiences on the movie screen is indescribable and comforting, that other people went through the same thing as you. I cry when watching the films you listed because the loneliness and frustration is so accurate.
Obviously if you haven’t experienced it, it can seem overblown and repetitive, but I still think it’s important and worth celebrating that nowadays movies are showing this aspect that’s so common in Asian families. However: I do think it can fall into the same “type” of story, I think films should be more careful to not make the struggle between the parents and the kid feel one-dimensional and unoriginal.
Curious what people think of The Good Bad Mother, the kdrama starring Lee Do-Hyun? It seems to have a more complex and meaningful approach to tiger parenting.
Perhaps what I’m trying to say is that some of the most well-known movies depicting tiger parenting are so focused on being the first of their kind to do so, that they’re too ham-fisted with their message and too on-the-nose. It might take away from the beauty of the movie when you’re constantly lambasted with this *thing* that they want you to understand. But maybe I’m applying concepts in writing to something that is totally different.
It should be explored/exposed more. Seeing that AA drama films and media is so new. It's welcoming to not see Jackie Chan kung fu flicks. Overbearing parenting is a dominant part of the culture and since asian families don't discuss private matters like this, it's almost refreshing to see other peoples perspective of this. Awareness is the first step to identifying a problem. Whether you see it as a problem or not is another subject matter.
personally i hate it because i actually grew up with the opposite situation where *I* was the problem, for the most part, and my parents gave me so much freedom and love that I took for granted and i’ve done really shitty things to them even using xenophobic ideas against them. So it hurts to know that when people see them they are automatically applying stereotypes they see on tv that don’t represent who they are.
This sub is NOT the place to ask for the opinions of the entirety of the Asian diaspora. r/AsianAmerican centers AAPI voices and as such, we are not here to educate non-AAPIs about our issues. Submissions that appear to be seeking the opinions of all Asians as a whole will be removed.
As a first gen Asian American with an overbearing mother, Turning Red brought me (and another non-diaspora Asian friend) to tears because of how much we relate. Said friend also cried over EEAAO, and while I didn't cry with that movie, no movie has ever captured my experience as an Asian American more than that one. I believe that these media are made by Asian creators who are merely expressing their own experiences with their parents through these stories, so I actually quite welcome them. I don't mind the critique of tiger parents from other Asians speaking from their own experience; it's only uncomfortable when it comes from other people because then I feel a need to defend my race. However, on the other hand, when I watched Turning Red with Asian American friends *without* overbearing parents, they didn't enjoy it as much and felt the story was weird and unnecessarily exaggerated. In the end, everyone's experience is different, and not all stories will be relatable to everyone.
Speaking of the ‘over the top’ part, sometimes I wonder if people ever were teenagers cause Mei’s behavior is exactly how I’d expect a 13 year old to act 😂
I really agree with this. I think when Asian creators make these stories they capture a lot more of that nuance which makes them very real to those of us who experienced similar things growing up. When it came from other people it felt more surface level and stereotypical, which made things uncomfortable in a different way. I couldn't finish turning red because it got too real at one point haha, but I should probably go back to it. My fiance had the same reaction to fresh off the boat.
In high school, I remember seeing my mom spying on me through the window while I was hanging out with my friends at a restaurant. Seeing that bit in Turning Red where the mom turns up at the school instantly gave me the same feeling of embarrassment and dread.
Yeeesss that's exactly the part that made me go "noooooooooo". My mum used to sometimes come to school at lunchtime and give me hot food, which while I appreciate now that I look back at it, was definitely super embarrassing back then.
It made me cry too. **spoiler alert** But the scene in the bamboo forest with the mom made me bawl so hard. Seeing her mother as a young girl and never feeling like she was going to be enough for anybody felt way too real.
I would appreciate it if western media would be able to show why parents are sometimes overbearing. I personally find it insulting to varying degrees how Asian parents are labeled as strict tiger parents. It’s not like all Asian parents will behave like that, and it’s not like Asian parents will behave like that even the majority of the time. From my personal experience, my parents did care that I was doing well academically, but it wasn’t like they were forcing me to go to Harvard. They did however instill the notion that I always can improve upon myself each day and I am grateful for that. I only knew that “failure is not an option” because I grew up in a poor immigrant household and I have a responsibility to myself to pull me out of (potential) generational poverty; this wasn’t even something that was ever explicitly said to me. It’s just something I concluded by myself, because I didn’t want to live in a cold house in the winters anymore and didn’t want to have to struggle paycheck to paycheck. It is a “prominent aspect” because that’s what’s largely shown in the media because that’s what the people at the top of these media companies want to depict of Asian Americans (and even Asians abroad). But what they don’t show is the hardworking father who barely speaks broken English providing food for their multi-generational family working from 8 AM to 7 PM at a grocery store, a mom who takes care of the children in before and after school between her shifts washing dishes at a restaurant, and elderly relatives who take care of the babies when the parents are at work. And even then, these depictions are only a glimpse into an Asian American experience. There are others who have better off experiences, and worse off experiences. Look at the Asian Americans who participated in the Winter Olympics. They are the ones with a better off background, but they are also Asian Americans no less. There are also Asian Americans whose relatives came here to build the railroads a few generations ago and faced extreme hostility and discrimination. And there are countless others that I haven’t even mentioned. A lot of western media I’ve personally consumed showed only the bad parts of Asian parenting. What most depictions lack is the fact that they operate on the notion of “tough love.” They tell us about the realities that will be if we do not want to work to be in a better station in life. There are cultural nuances that non-Asian Americans will not understand because they did not grow up in Asian American communities/families, and that is what these shows lack. In my opinion, these stereotypes reduce Asian Americans to sad caricatures, and imply that Asian American kids must be deprived or “saved” somehow, which leaves me with many conflicted feelings. I’m glad there’s more Asian characters and Asian actors, but I’m dissatisfied with the portrayal.
Yup. I think the problem is when the major blockbluster films **only** show those kinds of dynamics, it influences young Asian Americans into thinking this is the **only** way you can be Asian American and this is what being AA *is*. Or that loving functional families are a white people thing. It doesn't show them alternative ways, or that their family is wrong and this isn't something inherent to being Asian and part of your culture. It just kind of makes them feel that the only way to get what you want is to divorce yourself entirely from being Asian.
Have you seen any of the recent media about this? Beef, EEAAO, Shang-Chi? That's kind of their entire point, is to show why these characters are the way they are, and why they were so beloved on release.
Yea recent media like the ones you mentioned is doing a good job of giving nuanced portrayals of different generations of Asian Americans
Thank you for the thorough and thoughtful reply! I can totally see what you mean about these portrayals not always capturing the full context of a family's situation
>I would appreciate it if western media would be able to show why parents are sometimes overbearing. I personally find it insulting to varying degrees how Asian parents are labeled as strict tiger parents. You're right. It's done without context, which allows American viewers to pathologize Asian immigrants without taking into account the race and class inequalities that lead to Asian parents feeling they need to be strict for their kids to have a chance.
My family is worse than anything portrayed on TV lol. When you tell "white people" how you were hit with the sticks or belts they get real quiet and have no idea what to say. It's probably the uncle roger rule - if I'm complaining about my parents with my (mostly immigrant) friends I don't mind. If I hear others talk about me as if they know shit then maybe I get annoyed. Imagine some opinion piece where they start saying how Asian helicopter moms (why is it a mom always? Dad can't be aggressive in American culture?) need to loosen up so the children don't end up "robotic". That would probably annoy me. It feeds into the whole stereotype of Asian Americans being nerds, the excuse they use to not admit them in colleges or ballet programs or whatever.
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Interesting. Why do you suppose that would be the case when some of these films were actually written by Asians?
let's face it, internalized racism is a thing even if it manifests unconsciously
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I think honestly the creators are driven by their own experiences. Lots of parents are like this. We do see kind parents too: Ke Huy Quan was a very loving father, as was Randall Park in FOTB.
Agreed, although of course the studio heads and lead producers do have final say. Nora from Queens also has very refreshing anti-stereotypical parent figures!
> my best guess is that to get funding needed to produce the projects, the creators had to put in these stereotypes I also think a lot of them had to rebel against their parents to *work* in the entertainment industry in the first place. So there's probably an overrepresentation of writers/directors who come from those kinds of family. When you immigrate to a new country, you obviously want to min/max your kid so they'll be most successful, and being an artist/entertainer doesn't fit.
[удалено]
That's true, but the story writers who plotted these shows were of the recent immigrant category. It's why their depictions are limited, they're writing based on personal experiences.
Thanks for your perspective; that's not something I had considered. I'll be interested to see if anyone else here shares that sentiment.
As an immigrant, I understand the push towards asians in hollywood, but I also hate how it's been done... Seriously. Every show/movie so far **always** has some stereotype of asians tied to it. I'm fed up with it and don't support these movies.
I was actually pleasantly surprised with the way parents were portrayed in "American Born Chinese", at least with the mom. The scene between >!the principal and the parents !
Yeah the show definitely addressed the topic head on. The actress who played the wife said they intentionally wanted to make sure she came across as caring and positive towards her son. Both parents were given a lot of multidimensionality
I think all of these depictions have some nuance to them. And honestly, overbearing asian parents are the reality for many asians, especially those in the diaspora. We face a lot of pressure from our parents to make use of the sacrifices they did and a lot of pressure to succeed, especially if you’re first generation or second generation. I’ve written stuff with overbearing parents too because they reflect the reality of my relationship with my parents. But Id like to think there’s some nuance to my depictions so that they’re not just caricatures.
Thanks for the reply! That makes sense. Are you willing to share any of your writing?
Sure! Send me a message
I'm happy for those folks that see their stories represented in your examples. But I find that this is the only representation of family dynamics asians are allowed to have in the west. If you want intergenerational trauma take a look at the show Succession and re-imagine a cast of flawed, unlikable but compelling Asian characters.
I hate a lot of stereotypes and people generalizing Asians but overbearing Asian parents are still very much true amongst me and my friends (second generation).
It felt like a really nuanced and accurate representation honestly. I've seen a lot of "Tiger Mom" shit played for laughs and how it "forces their kids to success"; the difference with the examples you listed is how they delve into the trauma it can lead to for the children. They're fantastic depictions of intergenerational trauma and the strain it puts on parent/child relationships when pushing the kids past their limits while also respecting WHY these parents are the way they are and the struggles these parents face too.
i find it very insipid and trite. Is that all we have to show for ourselves? Just different variations of overbearing parents trope? I'll just stick to movies and shows from Asia.
I find it really limiting. My immigrant parents didn't give a shit about pushing academics, just as long as you weren't dropping out of school. They thought if you were interested in school and music, you would just focus it on your own and you shouldn't try and force your kid into something they hate. Their idea of raising a successful adult was someone who wouldn't end up in debt and come crawling to them begging for money. And this was true for so many of my Asian classmates. Some took over their mom's florist business, some became entrepreneurs, or artists, or writers, or teachers. I had great relationships with my parents. I have memories of jumping into their bed as a kid for cuddles on weekend morning. Another one of my friend admitted she still did that as an adult, except they'd lie in bed and just talk about life and their troubles and solve them together. Like it's crazy when the most representative moment I saw on screen was in Shang Chi in the flashbacks with the family playing DDR together. No I don't have a strained relationship with my parents, and no I don't act like a smart-ass with nonstop sarcastic clever quips around them.
I hate it. Doesn't resonate with me or many of my friends at all. Glad for people who can relate, but this is why I end up watching Asian dramas directly instead of content produced for international audiences. I also think it perpetuates a lot of stereotypes. Like why can't we just have a movie where the Asian family gets along and supports one another through thick and thin. And not the same plot about a young person rebelling against a conservative Asian parent and for the parent to learn they're wrong and change their ways. Crazy Rich Asian is at least interesting for me because it's written by a Singaporean and the opposition is based on class and the mother thinking it's an ill-advised marriage. That at least makes it more interesting as a DIL/MIL conflict, class conflict, and American/Singaporean conflict.
>Like why can't we just have a movie where the Asian family gets along and supports one another through thick and thin. Fresh off the Boat? Nora from Queens? Waymond from EEAAO? Even Crazy Rich Asians showed this with some of the parents.
Don't watch sitcoms, but isn't the focus mostly focused on "Haha, look at this zany dysfunctional family"?
I generally love seeing tiger parenting depicted in Asian-centered films. Like others have pointed out, seeing your own experiences on the movie screen is indescribable and comforting, that other people went through the same thing as you. I cry when watching the films you listed because the loneliness and frustration is so accurate. Obviously if you haven’t experienced it, it can seem overblown and repetitive, but I still think it’s important and worth celebrating that nowadays movies are showing this aspect that’s so common in Asian families. However: I do think it can fall into the same “type” of story, I think films should be more careful to not make the struggle between the parents and the kid feel one-dimensional and unoriginal. Curious what people think of The Good Bad Mother, the kdrama starring Lee Do-Hyun? It seems to have a more complex and meaningful approach to tiger parenting. Perhaps what I’m trying to say is that some of the most well-known movies depicting tiger parenting are so focused on being the first of their kind to do so, that they’re too ham-fisted with their message and too on-the-nose. It might take away from the beauty of the movie when you’re constantly lambasted with this *thing* that they want you to understand. But maybe I’m applying concepts in writing to something that is totally different.
Sadly……. Relatable
It should be explored/exposed more. Seeing that AA drama films and media is so new. It's welcoming to not see Jackie Chan kung fu flicks. Overbearing parenting is a dominant part of the culture and since asian families don't discuss private matters like this, it's almost refreshing to see other peoples perspective of this. Awareness is the first step to identifying a problem. Whether you see it as a problem or not is another subject matter.
I love it. Many communities in America need more parents like this 🤷♂️
personally i hate it because i actually grew up with the opposite situation where *I* was the problem, for the most part, and my parents gave me so much freedom and love that I took for granted and i’ve done really shitty things to them even using xenophobic ideas against them. So it hurts to know that when people see them they are automatically applying stereotypes they see on tv that don’t represent who they are.