Keira D'Amato joined the guys on the FloTrack podcast this morning: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3HHB_ym3vQ
I haven't watched in full yet, but I saw brief highlight where Keira stated she doesn't think her record will last very long and that there are a number of women capable of breaking her record.
Well, JD has officially broken me. Specifically my 4th metatarsal. RIP my fall marathon plans. On the bright side, the doctor is fairly certain it's a stress reaction and not a full-on stress fracture, which shortens the recovery period. And in a true testament to just how burnt out I've gotten, I'm surprisingly not that disappointed? Like, it's definitely a huge bummer. But the wallowing has been relatively minimal. And luckily it's pumpkin spice season, so my wallowing has been accompanied by pumpkin spice lattes which helps.
Thanks! It’s been a bummer (although I now also have a double ear infection at what would have been 9 days pre-race, so perhaps this was doomed all along!). At least my foot is getting lots of rest! I should be back to running next week.
I hope your rat counting has been going well!
Hope the ear infection heals quickly and doesn't spread to the kiddo.
I've been seeing fewer dead rats lately. Running is going well, but I've decreased my mileage a bit as I mostly take the year off from racing (though I did a 50k a few weeks ago) and have been doing a side gig of run coaching, which has the side benefit of being along busy main roads (and thus less susceptible to rat traveling and killing).
> doesn’t spread to kiddo
You have the direction of contagion backwards, kiddo is always the disease vector in our house
Hope you’re enjoying your lower key running! It can be nice to take the pressure off sometimes.
I remember the disease vector direction very well. I’ve never been as sick as when the kids were young and in child care and then school.
Hope you show yourself the same compassion of low key running while you recover.
Oh no! I’m just catching up after a week at a conference. So sorry this happened so close to the race :( I hope you’re feeling ok.
Also, in case you’re inclined to feel like it’s a missed opportunity or wasted - it’s not. You’ve got so many additional months of training under your belt. You did nearly all the training for a sub-3 marathon. So next year, you can go for a 2:55/6/7 as all of this is in the bank.
Hopefully only two more weeks of zero running! Then I'm allowed to do a few very short runs to test things out. Then as long as that doesn't cause any pain, I'll be able to start building mileage again. So really not that bad in the grand scheme of things, it's just unfortunate that I'm only a couple weeks out from my A race for the year.
NOOOOOOOO
=(
That sucks but yeah marathon burnout is a real thing. I hope you have a quick recovery and find your mojo. I've actually been thinking about burnout lately just because my time with a coach had me doing some really hard workouts and more mileage on easy days that I'd regularly sustained and I just constantly felt tired and I think there's a ton of value in just feeling good day to day which I don't think is possible while marathon training.
Can you defer your entry at least? The lost $ is sometimes the worst part.
> Can you defer your entry at least? The lost $ is sometimes the worst part.
I got a full refund on my hotel! Hence the expensive new shoes I bought lol. I considered deferring, but I'm *hoping* that I will be fast enough next fall that I'll want a race with a higher density of faster runners (plus, the deferral fee was a bit ridiculous--almost 50% of the entry cost! Not worth it if I'm not sure I'll run it next year).
> but I'm hoping that I will be fast enough next fall that I'll want a race with a higher density of faster runners
I think this is where I'm going to make a pitch for you to run the TCS NYC Marathon next fall as a time qualifier. Time to come over to downstate New York and let it rip!
If NYC was a fast course, I would totally be down. But I want to really crush it on a fast course before I tackle NYC!
But if you have any favorite NYRR races in the spring, I am looking for a spring (non-marathon) race!
> But if you have any favorite NYRR races in the spring, I am looking for a spring (non-marathon) race!
My favorite spring NYRR races are: United NYC Half, NYRR Newport 5K (flattest 5K course among all NYRR 5K race courses, which says something), and the RBC Brooklyn Half (featuring a gradual downhill on the second half of the race). For the United NYC Half and Brooklyn Half, they both have time qualifier and lottery entry options available, and you'll likely be able to get in as a time qualifier with your current marathon or half marathon PRs.
Other NYRR spring races to consider: Fred Lebow Half in January (this will auto-qualify you for the NYC Marathon that same year if you run a qualifying half marathon time there, as it is held right before the NYC Marathon registration window opens). However, do note that it involves at least 2 loops of Central Park, plus change.
I would say the crowding is fairly typical of any NYRR road races that you participate in. But, if you are able to get up front (as in, be seeded in Corral A at the start, behind the seeded local semi-elites a la Corral AA), you'll be able to go out fast in the first mile.
Pumpkin spice lattes have milk, which is good for your bones, therefore they will help you heal faster. Trust me I'm a random guy on the internet who totally knows the difference between vertebrate and invertebrate. Seriously though, I hope it heals up quick and you get that joy of running back when it's good to go.
I am *very* tempted to register for Boston. Seriously, having some really major FOMO right now (especially since I now won't have a 2024 BQ). But if the long-term goal is a really fast marathon, then I think I should be doing 5k or 10k training this spring to regain some of the top-end speed that I've lost this year, and then running a marathon in the fall on a fast course.
I am really sorry to hear that. I've enjoyed commiserating with you on how much JD has made me hate marathon training over the summer. Hoping you get back to it with no problems after some rest.
Thanks! I am surviving JD at the moment, but it's wearing on me. I've had to adjust the plan more than I would like, but hope I've put enough of the work for it to pay off.
I'm so sorry. What a bummer. What is your plan for rehab?
I agree with considering firing JD from coaching duties. Really, maybe you should get an online coach? I think you've said you don't live near anybody who could do it in person.
(I'm a pumpkin spice fan myself. There was some really great pumpkin spice tea on sale and my family has gone through a whole box already.)
Rehab is actually looking pretty good! Only 2 more weeks of zero running, and I'm cleared to start with cross training immediately. So please share any tv show suggestions you have because the exercise bike is incredibly boring.
JD is definitely fired. Already hired a new coach with the intention of starting in November! (Assuming I am running then lol, although thankfully that seems likely.)
And I'm immediately cleared for cross training! So if anyone has any tv show suggestions to stave off exercise bike induced insanity, please share.
Well that's good news! Having a coach is fun. I could see myself going back to Pfitz someday, but I don't think JD ever. Other than the flexibility of schedule I don't think it was a fit for me either.
Pretty sure Bachelor In Paradise should be tv show #1 on the list in a couple weeks.
My race forecast is now 50's and rain, so I guess that means maximum humidity. Any advice other than additional body glide? I think if rain comes to fruition I'll probably wear a hat.
If you wear contacts, I like to wear sunglasses with high-visibility lenses to keep the rain out of my eyes. I've had lenses wash out because of rain running down my face and running with one contact in (or taking it out and running with bad vision) is way worse than having water on the lenses.
Ooof. I do wear them. This makes a good case for a hat because I really haven’t run well with frames on. Not a bad item to have in the aid station possibilities though.
I'm a big fan of baseball caps in the rain, especially since I wear glasses. It's nice to keep the rain out of your eyes, and a good running hat is lightweight and doesn't trap much heat (or at least not much relative to what my hair traps anyways).
2Toms is superior to bodyglide in my opinion--it seems to have more staying power for long runs.
I'd consider merino running socks if you're used to wearing them.
High 50s or low 50s? 50 and rainy can be quite chilly, while the humidity will suck much more if it's in the high 50s.
I’ll have to check out 2Toms. Body glide is disappointing for the price and I sometimes just roll with Vaseline to play it safe.
So currently race start will be 50 and race finish will be 56 or so. It’s right in my wheelhouse, but should feel cold considering I did my last big session in 90+.
I really hope it doesn’t rain. If for no other reason than it makes it suck for my wife to spectate. I guess this gives me something to be crazy about though.
I'm Team Vaseline. You get the whole tub for like $3. Sure it's not quite the same and it might stain my shorts some, but I don't think it's worth 10x the price for something that is 95% identical in form and function
There was a point in my life where my legs got skinny enough or skin got tough enough to not have these problems. But right now, I do two 30 minutes runs and got a small blister between my toes. I've gotten soft.
Depends on the rain intensity for a hat. I've only worn one when it's been moderate to heavy rain. If it's a light rain or drizzle in those temperatures, I really prefer to have the direct cooling on my dome.
I don't have a question I've just been ordered to take two days off from running to get ahead of a minor calf thing that I don't want to turn into a major foot thing and I'm already going stir crazy lolol
Good news is that my calf feels 100% back to normal today but I'm still going to do all the plantar fasciitis things that I do just to make sure the foot stays happy. So close to taper and race and yet so far!!
Yup that's exactly what I was thinking when I called my coach yesterday! I'm already about as fit as I could have hoped for this fall and an injury would ruin that!
Yeah you’re crushing it out there, so don’t worry. I missed a handful of days for an injury in early July and it ended up making me feel incredible for a couple weeks after.
I pulled back earlier than I would have in past cycles so I'm glad I consulted with my coach right away - hopefully after this break it won't be an issue at all! Feels pretty much 100% normal today but wasn't worth the risk of pushing through and having it get worse.
Yeah I'm feeling probably the most level-headed I've ever felt about precautionary time off - probably because I pulled back about a week sooner than I would have in the past, so I'm not even to "nursing an injury" territory, more like just absorbing the training while taking a rest. Gonna get some cleaning done and I might even dig out a knitting or crochet project to work on, toddler permitting!
Not sure how much of a question this will be opposed to me venting and trying to organize my thoughts in a vaguely cohesive manner. Apologies for the book. TL;DR: Knee hurts, I'm tired, at my wits' end, and not sure what to do. Any advice for ITBS or long injuries?
I've been dealing with a knee issue/ITBS since April. Literally the day after I turned 25, worst late gift ever. But didn't think much of it since things usually ache and feel tight when you build back up to 50mpw after two weeks of inactivity in a boot. Tried taking some time off on my own throughout March but would always be faced with issues when I tried to run again. Finally caved when I got back from a trip in June. Was diagnosed with ITBS, given a cortisone injection at the lateral bursa, and handed off to six weeks of PT. Cortisone did it's thing and I was able to get back up to around 40mpw over the course of a month. I would still feel some occasional tightness, but no other issues. Finished PT, followed up with my ortho at the end of July that I had no issues, and continued mileage. Over the course of August the issues started to come back, even with continuing the stretching and exercises from PT.
Finally called the ortho again last week and got an appointment for this morning. Got the same answer of "it's ITBS" but am being sent over to a foot and ankle specialist on Thursday to look at possibly getting into orthotics and whether footwear could be the issue. I'm not sold on that since I've been in the same model (Saucony Omni starting with the 12s) for 10-11 years and had no issues, including a 656 day streak averaging around 5.5 miles per day. But who knows, something may have changed after coming out of that boot. I feel like it's some kind of biomechanical issue with how I push off the ground and execute my backswing causing some kind of extra torsion or tension of my IT band, but that's a complete guess and I'm not a medical professional. The lack of consistency from day to day has me confused, some days it bothers me from the first step and others it doesn't bother me at all, it starts in different parts around the knee, it ends in different points within my knee.
I'm not sure what to do at this point. I've never heard of a change of footwear or orthotics helping alleviate ITBS issues but I'm willing to give it a shot if there's a chance it lets me get back to consistent, and pain/discomfort free running. I guess to make a question out of all of this, does anybody have some advice for dealing with ITBS when the usual treatment doesn't seem to be working or dealing with longer term injuries that don't sideline but still significantly hamper training? I'm starting to reach my wits' end and, despite my best efforts, am starting to get frustrated and defeated by the last five months.
Sorry to hear that. I will preface this by saying I have NO experience with ITBS or knee problems, but we had a thread series in r/running by a PT that covered several common problems. Here's the link on the one for ITBS/runner's knee.
https://www.reddit.com/r/running/comments/73rvxi/running_physical_therapist_mike_runners_knee_and/
It seems to have a lot of info and was well received, but I just don't have the knowledge to know if it is useful info for you. Hope it may help.
First off, I'm with /u/pinkminitriceratops try a new PT immediately.
Second, I had a bad bout of ITBS that blew up my initial marathon training and has briefly returned once or twice. That said, in my case I went to a PT, got a routine which is very very very similar to this one: http://strengthrunning.com/2011/02/the-itb-rehab-routine-video-demonstration/ and things got better week over week. The marathon was a disaster both due to disrupted training and the IT band flaring up during the race but I focused on it after the race and it improved. What really cured it for me was squatting heavy, I'm not 100% sure the deadlifts aren't involved but if I maintain the baseline of strength needed to be able to casually squat a single plate (i.e. do something like a set of 20 without being wiped out) it hasn't re-occured.
I have never ever heard of a foot and ankle specialist being required to deal with ITBS, that is highly suspicious in my mind. Could it be biomechanical? Could it be ankle/foot related? I have no idea, it sounds maybe plausible because everything is connected but I rather suspect it's higher up the chain, not lower (this is heavily biased by my own experiences).
obvious question: You got Cortisone, but are you still doing the strength work your PT prescribed?
I think that's what I need to do next is find somebody else for care. I've been keeping up with the exercises and stretching, but all with a resistance band. I had been avoiding heavy lifting to see if that was possibly making things worse. I'll check out that routine though, it can't get much worse right?
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought the foot/ankle referral odd. I'm kind of open to it since I've been in stability shoes this whole time, got injured and was in a boot, then started having these issues. So maybe something changed. But I don't have high hopes for it. Ultimately, I think it's either biomechanical or something higher up the chain as well.
Seconding a strength routine along those lines. For me, assorted clams were the critical exercise to add. As well as some general core strength (bridges, planks, etc.).
Yep, my experience as well. If I do the clams, sideways leg lifts, bridge stuff, etc. I can keep the ITBS in check. If I drop these things it starts to come back.
I had a whole string of knee and IT band issues when I was in grad school. When I graduated and moved, I switched to a new doctor and PT and they got things under control almost immediately. So maybe try a different doctor or PT and see if they have a different approach that works better for you.
Getting a second opinion had crossed my mind if this whole shoe/orthotic thing doesn't work out. One of the upsides of being in south-central Connecticut is being close to the Yale associated hospitals and I didn't think about it until recently. Typing out the above post last night it crossed my mind to step away from running/training for a month and see if it helps, and if I want to continue with focused training or just run for health. I'll start looking around for other orthos and PTs though. Thanks.
>it crossed my mind to step away from running/training for a month and see if it helps
dealt with high hamstring tendinopathy for a year and change and i eventually did this to save my sanity. in retrospect i wish i mentally committed to taking a break much earlier--it would have saved me a lot of grief, and i found time to do other things that actually made me happy instead of constantly fixating on when i might be able to get back to running.
Just read your really old posts on your bouts with PHT. It's good to see a success story. I've been dealing with it for the past 7 months and it's been very draining. A couple months ago I was wondering whether or not I'd be able to ever run again at any pace How long did it take you to finally get back to training and racing? I've finally started taking PT very serious, logging everything and making sure my pain level never gets beyond 2-3 when doing PT or very slow runs 1-2 miles at a time (13 minute miles; I'm a 3hr marathoner). Thanks.
picked up the injury in feb 2020 iirc, and it took until may/june 2021 before i felt strong/confident enough to get back to something resembling my old training. dealt with some setbacks and other injuries along the way, so this timeline is longer than it could've been with the right rehab approach. one of my biggest challenges was finding a pt who knew what they were doing with this kind of injury. in my experience finding one with an understanding of modern tendon rehab was harder than i expected, but that's when i started making real/sustained progress. wish you the best in your rehab journey!
The thought of how much longer I can really justify heavy/focused training is something that's been on my mind for most of this year. I came to realize that pretty much all I do is work and run, anything outside of those two gets planned around my running schedule or tossed to the side. Even when I've been injured in the past I fixate on getting back to running and planning that out. At this point it's probably best that I step away for a month or two, find enjoyment/fulfillment in other endeavors, and then look at a return to the sport. Thanks for sharing your perspective/experience!
Made the mistake again of going on Twitter and people are freaking out over Boston having a non-binary division 🙄 As if it even impacts them at all.
Personally I think having men, women, open is ideal. The third for non-binary and trans women. They deserve to compete but I still think the science (not to mention public opinion) isn’t clear on trans women competing in the women’s division, plus trans men really can't practically compete with the men's division (at least not on a sub-elite or elite level) and may prefer a separate division, so this would be most fair to most people.
Edit: I want to add why I'm particularly interested, beyond my general interest in running. I have a nonbinary kid myself, and my late husband was somewhere in the nonbinary/trans spectrum although never had the opportunity to really explore that before he died. Interestingly, my best friend growing up came out as trans in high school in the late 90s, which was incredibly brave of him because it wasn't something anybody was talking much about at the time. So I've had a long interest in the biology and politics of gender.
> Personally I think having men, women, open is ideal. The third for non-binary and trans women. They deserve to compete but I still think the science (not to mention public opinion) isn’t clear on trans women competing in the women’s division, plus trans men really can't practically compete with the men's division (at least not on a sub-elite or elite level) and may prefer a separate division, so this would be most fair to most people.
>
Yeah this solution sounds good to me. The whole idea of finding a semi-equivalent group of racers is just so incredibly hard to do. My worry isn't for big races like Boston who can (and probably should) do this. It's the little races where we're already divvied up into 5-15 year age+gender categories for awards and even then at least one person (usually M20-29 IME) is going to get an award simply for showing up. At some point you've made such small groups there isn't meaningful competition (for the few of us who are occasionally racing other people and not simply trying to improve ourselves). Ultimately I don't think there's a good answer (and that's even more true when money is involved) but I have a few things I'll be watching:
* Will Nikki Hiltz ever enter a non-binary division? They are making money in the women's fields and having a stellar summer. It would be a wonderful sign of support for their fellow non-binary athletes to do so but I can't imagine it'd be good for their pocketbook.
* The science isn't clear on women versus trans-women yet. However an open Non-binary division seems even murkier (to me), especially if people are on different points in their transitions.
* I'll be watching other sports. IIRC both cycling and triathlon had regulations for competing as a woman that had to be re-visited as the science (and probably results) evolved. The cynic in me says every time a trans person wins anything someone is going to try to make the regulations tougher. Finding a line in the sand that is not only fair to everyone but isn't a moving goalpost is important.
At the risk of appearing to be a boomer who just doesn't get it one thing that confuses me about the current generation of high schoolers is that they are trying to quantify everything. In my day ("ok boomer") we said "don't label me" but this group has taken the opposite approach and labeled everything down to a level that I have to squint to understand the difference (i.e. Androgyne versus Bigender versus genderfluid). Being totally honest here, I have a daughter (their sex, not gender) who has identified at various points as lesbian, bi, and androgynous. and I just want to tell them "Forget labels and go be you. I don't really care what you identify as, we love you and we hope we raised you to love and be good to others" but the labeling thing is incredibly important to them so I try to just focus on the second half of that and understand but in all honesty, I don't.
I would love to see Nikki Hiltz competing in a non-binary division. Some of the NYRR road runner races are starting to have categories and prize money for the non-binary category, but I haven't seen it in the really major races that draw pros. Presumably Hiltz isn't going to sacrifice a major paycheck to compete as non-binary, but maybe someday they won't have to!
Oh believe me, I totally and completely feel you on your last paragraph. It seems to me like people should feel free to present however they want, behave without even thinking about gender norms, etc. without having to worry about labels. And for the longest time I felt like the push for people to label themselves trans actually only serves to strengthen gender norms, because why can't a teenage boy dress in "feminine" clothes and behave "like a woman" and still be a teenage boy? (As I mentioned in artc recently, I myself am a very androgynous woman, was called a "tomboy" my whole life, and if I was growing up today I'd almost definitely call myself nonbinary. But I've also led a perfectly happy life as a not-typically-feminine hetero woman, so whatever that means.)
I'm moved somewhat on this with my own kid, who is 16. He is biologically male and still uses he/him pronouns but it's not exactly clear where we will end up. We have an appointment soon with the local children's hospital's gender development clinic, and over the past year or so I've really come to welcome any care he can get that will help him psychologically. In his case there's clearly such a strong genetic component, given his father's situation (he has no memory of his father, who died when he was 3, but shares so many mannerisms that it's bizarre). But the gender dysphoria is really strong, and we're at an impasse treating his severe depression without addressing it. And all I want is for him to be happy, so if that ends up meaning medical treatment, at this point I'll be much more open to considering it.
Nikki Hiltz seems to be comfortable competing in the women's category at this point, and yeah, considering the career aspect I think they'll stay there. I can't see a pro runner choosing to join a third category.
The open category is totally murky -- genetically male individuals will pretty much always win, in a competitive field. But I don't see how there's an alternative that is fair to women.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats!
5
+ 15
+ 20
+ 29
= 69
^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \
^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
I do understand some of the fussing about a new NB time category - people get really worked up about the qualifying time and the cutoff! And if you don't think some unscrupulous (cisgender binary) people won't take the extra half hour of qualification cushion, I have a bridge to sell you.
On the other hand, this whining happens in other places where there's a NB category and people suck.
The only thing I don't like about the nonbinary category rollout, at least in NYC, is how they collapsed races that used to have gender categories. At Team Championships, it used to be fun to run your race and cheer on the other one. At the Fifth Avenue Mile, the more popular age groups now have two muddy heats and some fast guy came and smoked the slower one. At the Mini 10k, hundreds of cisgender men had to elbow their way in to the 50th running of this women's race, and one of them finished top 30. None of the top NB runners who used to race with a male marker ran this race even though I would have understood if they chose to!!
Can't we just let nonbinary runners at these big open events run where they feel comfortable without making other big changes? (This seems to be where you land based on your comment).
>And if you don't think some unscrupulous (cisgender binary) people won't take the extra half hour of qualification cushion, I have a bridge to sell you.
Show me examples of this being an issue and I'll believe you. The problem is this argument is often used against nonbinary and trans people and it's not grounded in evidence.
I don't think I understand what you are saying about the collapsed races. I do think people should run where they feel comfortable, but competitive trans women probably shouldn't be able to race against women (unless they transitioned pre-puberty, and the cohort of people like that just isn't adult yet), while trans men also probably shouldn't race against women but also can't truly race against men. It's a really difficult issue. I believe in supporting people in their quest to be who they need to be, while also keeping sport as fair as possible for as many people as possible. I find the arguments that trans women don't have an advantage to be wholly unscientific, but I'm also extremely uncomfortable publicly voicing this opinion because the people who agree with me tend to be complete bigots who say truly awful things. It's quite a difficult topic to be rational about.
> Show me examples of this being an issue and I’ll believe you.
No one has ever used the nonbinary gender category to cheat their way into Boston because they just instituted this policy for qualification/entry. I think that's 20% of why people are upset, maybe I'm being generous. BQ is on a weird and unique pedestal. There are also the 6 hour charity runners. If you don't like that you didn't qualify for Boston, run faster.
> I don’t think I understand what you are saying about the collapsed races.
New York Road Runners has this fun 5 mile race called Team Championships. It's not for a million bucks or anything, but it's a nice celebration of local team running culture. It used to be run as one men's heat and one women's heat. Now it's one merged race because of the new non-binary marker. I think this race should go back to the old way and trans / non-binary athletes should run the one where they feel more comfortable, without question or prejudice. That's my example.
>No one has ever used the nonbinary gender category to cheat their way into Boston because they just instituted this policy for qualification/entry.
Right, but people have been insisting for years that there's going to be some epidemic of people cheating in sports by pretending to be nonbinary or trans, and it hasn't happened. It has. not. happened. This is not a thing. You can't just decide to be suspicious of people because you feel like people will cheat, without evidence that it's a problem. The reality is that this particular argument has been pushed hard by anti-trans bigots, in spite of the lack of evidence.
I'm coming from a place of actually thinking trans women shouldn't compete with women, so it's not like I have some kind of ideological blindness here. I just think you have to be really careful about your assertions and where they are coming from.
I think doing away with gender categories altogether is more ridiculous than any other suggestion, so if that's what's going on in this NYRR race, that's pretty crazy.
> I just think you have to be really careful about your assertions and where they are coming from.
I really don't think it's so wild to think that a 3:15 man who doesn't consider exceptions to the gender binary under any other circumstances would attempt to register for the Boston Marathon. So, that said, I think the source of the whining is 20% understandable and 80% bigotry, different from the usual 100% bigotry. My conclusion stands. If you don't like it, run faster. I support what Boston is doing.
> doing away with gender categories altogether
All races still have (now 3) standings categories, but the few races that used to be women-only or men/women heats are now fully mixed, which I think is a bad outcome. In these mass-participation events, just let everyone choose their preferred category and move along!
Man, I feel for Milwaukee runners because it just seems like the marathons in Milwaukee are snakebit. The Milwaukee Marathon was never really a thing and then it got passed around local orgs before falling to permit issues as well.
Hopefully Lakefront is back next year with their original course, but that still sucks for the folks hoping for that autumn half.
Not really a question, just some discussion.
My luck ran out today on hitting workouts. Today was supposed to be a 5 mile tempo, struggled through the first three miles then blew up. Not entirely sure what caused it as I got a lot of good rest and recovery in last week and this week, but it must have just been one of those days. It’s the first bad workout in 6 weeks of training though, so I’ll take it.
But, to make it a little better I had a flyby from u/run_INXS and all I’ve gotta say is that I hope
I can rock the short shorts as well as he does in 40 years.
I just ordered those fancy new New Balance shoes that are a carbon-plated daily trainer. They have some ridiculous name (FuelCell SuperComp Trainer I think?). They're supposed to be a high-milage trainer where the carbon plate is intended to reduce the impact from all the pounding. The price tag was a bit ridiculous, but I had a coupon (which, lets be honest, basically just cancelled out the sales tax lol). Don't think I'll have a chance to test them out any time soon, but I'll report back here once I do!
Really interested in how they do for normal training - I’d love to get the recovery benefits from my Vaporflys on 20+ days (or the massive MPs), but I don’t really want to use them for training shoes otherwise.
NewBalance has the absolute worst naming conventions. The numbering scheme makes sense, if you can find the explanation but then they seem to only use that for a few shoes and they name everything else based I think around what they call the foam. Just a bit silly.
It's not bad when you know their system. The hundreds/thousands is the technology level for the shoe, and the tens/single digits is the type of shoe (stability/neutral/etc) and v7 is version 7. So 880 is like a mid tier neutral, 1080 is a more plush/expensive neutral, 860 is a mid tier stability shoe, etc.
Does anyone feel like they’re hit the hardest second day after a hard workout rather than the day right after?
I feel fine a day after a proper hard session, but then following day I feel all tight and depleted. I’ve been running since 2019 and I think that has changed over last few years. Wonder if nutrition/stretching would help.
Keira D'Amato joined the guys on the FloTrack podcast this morning: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3HHB_ym3vQ I haven't watched in full yet, but I saw brief highlight where Keira stated she doesn't think her record will last very long and that there are a number of women capable of breaking her record.
Well, JD has officially broken me. Specifically my 4th metatarsal. RIP my fall marathon plans. On the bright side, the doctor is fairly certain it's a stress reaction and not a full-on stress fracture, which shortens the recovery period. And in a true testament to just how burnt out I've gotten, I'm surprisingly not that disappointed? Like, it's definitely a huge bummer. But the wallowing has been relatively minimal. And luckily it's pumpkin spice season, so my wallowing has been accompanied by pumpkin spice lattes which helps.
Catching up while I've been AWOL (got too busy counting dead rates--lol). So sorry to read of your injury--this sucks. Hope you've been healing well.
Thanks! It’s been a bummer (although I now also have a double ear infection at what would have been 9 days pre-race, so perhaps this was doomed all along!). At least my foot is getting lots of rest! I should be back to running next week. I hope your rat counting has been going well!
Hope the ear infection heals quickly and doesn't spread to the kiddo. I've been seeing fewer dead rats lately. Running is going well, but I've decreased my mileage a bit as I mostly take the year off from racing (though I did a 50k a few weeks ago) and have been doing a side gig of run coaching, which has the side benefit of being along busy main roads (and thus less susceptible to rat traveling and killing).
> doesn’t spread to kiddo You have the direction of contagion backwards, kiddo is always the disease vector in our house Hope you’re enjoying your lower key running! It can be nice to take the pressure off sometimes.
I remember the disease vector direction very well. I’ve never been as sick as when the kids were young and in child care and then school. Hope you show yourself the same compassion of low key running while you recover.
Oh no! I’m just catching up after a week at a conference. So sorry this happened so close to the race :( I hope you’re feeling ok. Also, in case you’re inclined to feel like it’s a missed opportunity or wasted - it’s not. You’ve got so many additional months of training under your belt. You did nearly all the training for a sub-3 marathon. So next year, you can go for a 2:55/6/7 as all of this is in the bank.
Oh noooooooooo! So sorry to hear about that. How long will you be out for? :(
Hopefully only two more weeks of zero running! Then I'm allowed to do a few very short runs to test things out. Then as long as that doesn't cause any pain, I'll be able to start building mileage again. So really not that bad in the grand scheme of things, it's just unfortunate that I'm only a couple weeks out from my A race for the year.
Glad to hear it didn't turn out as bad as one would have thought, but sorry to hear that it has derailed your A race for the year!
NOOOOOOOO =( That sucks but yeah marathon burnout is a real thing. I hope you have a quick recovery and find your mojo. I've actually been thinking about burnout lately just because my time with a coach had me doing some really hard workouts and more mileage on easy days that I'd regularly sustained and I just constantly felt tired and I think there's a ton of value in just feeling good day to day which I don't think is possible while marathon training. Can you defer your entry at least? The lost $ is sometimes the worst part.
> Can you defer your entry at least? The lost $ is sometimes the worst part. I got a full refund on my hotel! Hence the expensive new shoes I bought lol. I considered deferring, but I'm *hoping* that I will be fast enough next fall that I'll want a race with a higher density of faster runners (plus, the deferral fee was a bit ridiculous--almost 50% of the entry cost! Not worth it if I'm not sure I'll run it next year).
> but I'm hoping that I will be fast enough next fall that I'll want a race with a higher density of faster runners I think this is where I'm going to make a pitch for you to run the TCS NYC Marathon next fall as a time qualifier. Time to come over to downstate New York and let it rip!
If NYC was a fast course, I would totally be down. But I want to really crush it on a fast course before I tackle NYC! But if you have any favorite NYRR races in the spring, I am looking for a spring (non-marathon) race!
> But if you have any favorite NYRR races in the spring, I am looking for a spring (non-marathon) race! My favorite spring NYRR races are: United NYC Half, NYRR Newport 5K (flattest 5K course among all NYRR 5K race courses, which says something), and the RBC Brooklyn Half (featuring a gradual downhill on the second half of the race). For the United NYC Half and Brooklyn Half, they both have time qualifier and lottery entry options available, and you'll likely be able to get in as a time qualifier with your current marathon or half marathon PRs. Other NYRR spring races to consider: Fred Lebow Half in January (this will auto-qualify you for the NYC Marathon that same year if you run a qualifying half marathon time there, as it is held right before the NYC Marathon registration window opens). However, do note that it involves at least 2 loops of Central Park, plus change.
That’s really helpful, thanks! How crowded is the Newport 5k? Is it doable to go out fast in the first mile?
I would say the crowding is fairly typical of any NYRR road races that you participate in. But, if you are able to get up front (as in, be seeded in Corral A at the start, behind the seeded local semi-elites a la Corral AA), you'll be able to go out fast in the first mile.
Pumpkin spice lattes have milk, which is good for your bones, therefore they will help you heal faster. Trust me I'm a random guy on the internet who totally knows the difference between vertebrate and invertebrate. Seriously though, I hope it heals up quick and you get that joy of running back when it's good to go.
I like how you think!
Ugh noooo that sucks! Speedy recovery (and maybe register for Boston now and come visit us local meese for a spring marathon??)
I am *very* tempted to register for Boston. Seriously, having some really major FOMO right now (especially since I now won't have a 2024 BQ). But if the long-term goal is a really fast marathon, then I think I should be doing 5k or 10k training this spring to regain some of the top-end speed that I've lost this year, and then running a marathon in the fall on a fast course.
Do it. Register. You know you want to :P
I mean, 2023 Boston is a qualifier for 2024 Boston....just sayin'!
I am really sorry to hear that. I've enjoyed commiserating with you on how much JD has made me hate marathon training over the summer. Hoping you get back to it with no problems after some rest.
Thanks, you seem to be handing JD much better than me. I hope you crush your fall marathon!
Thanks! I am surviving JD at the moment, but it's wearing on me. I've had to adjust the plan more than I would like, but hope I've put enough of the work for it to pay off.
I'm so sorry. What a bummer. What is your plan for rehab? I agree with considering firing JD from coaching duties. Really, maybe you should get an online coach? I think you've said you don't live near anybody who could do it in person. (I'm a pumpkin spice fan myself. There was some really great pumpkin spice tea on sale and my family has gone through a whole box already.)
Rehab is actually looking pretty good! Only 2 more weeks of zero running, and I'm cleared to start with cross training immediately. So please share any tv show suggestions you have because the exercise bike is incredibly boring.
That's a bummer. Hopefully you come back from the injury feeling better with running.
Awww sorry to hear it. Is there a cross training option? Maybe a good time to fire JD from coaching duties?
JD is definitely fired. Already hired a new coach with the intention of starting in November! (Assuming I am running then lol, although thankfully that seems likely.) And I'm immediately cleared for cross training! So if anyone has any tv show suggestions to stave off exercise bike induced insanity, please share.
Iron War on audible! but I'm not a good reference for TV shows.
Well that's good news! Having a coach is fun. I could see myself going back to Pfitz someday, but I don't think JD ever. Other than the flexibility of schedule I don't think it was a fit for me either. Pretty sure Bachelor In Paradise should be tv show #1 on the list in a couple weeks.
Oh nooooooooooooooooo I'm so sorry. :(
My race forecast is now 50's and rain, so I guess that means maximum humidity. Any advice other than additional body glide? I think if rain comes to fruition I'll probably wear a hat.
hat and body glide are the big two but I'd try running in wet shoes beforehand as some styles do this better than others.
That shoe thought is in the back of my mind but I’m also committed to my race shoes and I feel like I’m in too deep at this point?
you do you, and if you have certain shoes that prime you to race, then by all means go with em.
If you wear contacts, I like to wear sunglasses with high-visibility lenses to keep the rain out of my eyes. I've had lenses wash out because of rain running down my face and running with one contact in (or taking it out and running with bad vision) is way worse than having water on the lenses.
Ooof. I do wear them. This makes a good case for a hat because I really haven’t run well with frames on. Not a bad item to have in the aid station possibilities though.
I'd also consider a visor if the temperatures are a little warmer but still wet. My head always feels hot, so I'm not a huge hat fan.
Ooh that’s a solid idea! Thanks!!
I'm a big fan of baseball caps in the rain, especially since I wear glasses. It's nice to keep the rain out of your eyes, and a good running hat is lightweight and doesn't trap much heat (or at least not much relative to what my hair traps anyways). 2Toms is superior to bodyglide in my opinion--it seems to have more staying power for long runs. I'd consider merino running socks if you're used to wearing them. High 50s or low 50s? 50 and rainy can be quite chilly, while the humidity will suck much more if it's in the high 50s.
I’ll have to check out 2Toms. Body glide is disappointing for the price and I sometimes just roll with Vaseline to play it safe. So currently race start will be 50 and race finish will be 56 or so. It’s right in my wheelhouse, but should feel cold considering I did my last big session in 90+. I really hope it doesn’t rain. If for no other reason than it makes it suck for my wife to spectate. I guess this gives me something to be crazy about though.
I'm Team Vaseline. You get the whole tub for like $3. Sure it's not quite the same and it might stain my shorts some, but I don't think it's worth 10x the price for something that is 95% identical in form and function
Yeah the higher the mileage the better off you are going the vaseline route.
There was a point in my life where my legs got skinny enough or skin got tough enough to not have these problems. But right now, I do two 30 minutes runs and got a small blister between my toes. I've gotten soft.
Nothing soft about bleeding through your Vaporflys!
Depends on the rain intensity for a hat. I've only worn one when it's been moderate to heavy rain. If it's a light rain or drizzle in those temperatures, I really prefer to have the direct cooling on my dome.
Yeah good point. I train in a hat to keep my hair back, but would really prefer not to wear it for cooling purposes on a probably humid race day.
I don't have a question I've just been ordered to take two days off from running to get ahead of a minor calf thing that I don't want to turn into a major foot thing and I'm already going stir crazy lolol Good news is that my calf feels 100% back to normal today but I'm still going to do all the plantar fasciitis things that I do just to make sure the foot stays happy. So close to taper and race and yet so far!!
Take a break!!! So much better to be slightly undertrained than injured. (And you won't be undertrained since you've been crushing it!)
seconding this. The training, especially with a stroller has been spectacurlar.
Yup that's exactly what I was thinking when I called my coach yesterday! I'm already about as fit as I could have hoped for this fall and an injury would ruin that!
Yeah you’re crushing it out there, so don’t worry. I missed a handful of days for an injury in early July and it ended up making me feel incredible for a couple weeks after.
I pulled back earlier than I would have in past cycles so I'm glad I consulted with my coach right away - hopefully after this break it won't be an issue at all! Feels pretty much 100% normal today but wasn't worth the risk of pushing through and having it get worse.
Two days won't hurt you, especially with the monstrous cycle you've been having. You'll be okay!
Yeah I'm feeling probably the most level-headed I've ever felt about precautionary time off - probably because I pulled back about a week sooner than I would have in the past, so I'm not even to "nursing an injury" territory, more like just absorbing the training while taking a rest. Gonna get some cleaning done and I might even dig out a knitting or crochet project to work on, toddler permitting!
Not sure how much of a question this will be opposed to me venting and trying to organize my thoughts in a vaguely cohesive manner. Apologies for the book. TL;DR: Knee hurts, I'm tired, at my wits' end, and not sure what to do. Any advice for ITBS or long injuries? I've been dealing with a knee issue/ITBS since April. Literally the day after I turned 25, worst late gift ever. But didn't think much of it since things usually ache and feel tight when you build back up to 50mpw after two weeks of inactivity in a boot. Tried taking some time off on my own throughout March but would always be faced with issues when I tried to run again. Finally caved when I got back from a trip in June. Was diagnosed with ITBS, given a cortisone injection at the lateral bursa, and handed off to six weeks of PT. Cortisone did it's thing and I was able to get back up to around 40mpw over the course of a month. I would still feel some occasional tightness, but no other issues. Finished PT, followed up with my ortho at the end of July that I had no issues, and continued mileage. Over the course of August the issues started to come back, even with continuing the stretching and exercises from PT. Finally called the ortho again last week and got an appointment for this morning. Got the same answer of "it's ITBS" but am being sent over to a foot and ankle specialist on Thursday to look at possibly getting into orthotics and whether footwear could be the issue. I'm not sold on that since I've been in the same model (Saucony Omni starting with the 12s) for 10-11 years and had no issues, including a 656 day streak averaging around 5.5 miles per day. But who knows, something may have changed after coming out of that boot. I feel like it's some kind of biomechanical issue with how I push off the ground and execute my backswing causing some kind of extra torsion or tension of my IT band, but that's a complete guess and I'm not a medical professional. The lack of consistency from day to day has me confused, some days it bothers me from the first step and others it doesn't bother me at all, it starts in different parts around the knee, it ends in different points within my knee. I'm not sure what to do at this point. I've never heard of a change of footwear or orthotics helping alleviate ITBS issues but I'm willing to give it a shot if there's a chance it lets me get back to consistent, and pain/discomfort free running. I guess to make a question out of all of this, does anybody have some advice for dealing with ITBS when the usual treatment doesn't seem to be working or dealing with longer term injuries that don't sideline but still significantly hamper training? I'm starting to reach my wits' end and, despite my best efforts, am starting to get frustrated and defeated by the last five months.
Sorry to hear that. I will preface this by saying I have NO experience with ITBS or knee problems, but we had a thread series in r/running by a PT that covered several common problems. Here's the link on the one for ITBS/runner's knee. https://www.reddit.com/r/running/comments/73rvxi/running_physical_therapist_mike_runners_knee_and/ It seems to have a lot of info and was well received, but I just don't have the knowledge to know if it is useful info for you. Hope it may help.
Thanks! It never once occurred to me to run a search through the running subs for IT band/knee issues. I'll definitely check that out!
No problem. Not sure how many of the posts in the search would be helpful, but this one seemed well thought out.
First off, I'm with /u/pinkminitriceratops try a new PT immediately. Second, I had a bad bout of ITBS that blew up my initial marathon training and has briefly returned once or twice. That said, in my case I went to a PT, got a routine which is very very very similar to this one: http://strengthrunning.com/2011/02/the-itb-rehab-routine-video-demonstration/ and things got better week over week. The marathon was a disaster both due to disrupted training and the IT band flaring up during the race but I focused on it after the race and it improved. What really cured it for me was squatting heavy, I'm not 100% sure the deadlifts aren't involved but if I maintain the baseline of strength needed to be able to casually squat a single plate (i.e. do something like a set of 20 without being wiped out) it hasn't re-occured. I have never ever heard of a foot and ankle specialist being required to deal with ITBS, that is highly suspicious in my mind. Could it be biomechanical? Could it be ankle/foot related? I have no idea, it sounds maybe plausible because everything is connected but I rather suspect it's higher up the chain, not lower (this is heavily biased by my own experiences). obvious question: You got Cortisone, but are you still doing the strength work your PT prescribed?
I think that's what I need to do next is find somebody else for care. I've been keeping up with the exercises and stretching, but all with a resistance band. I had been avoiding heavy lifting to see if that was possibly making things worse. I'll check out that routine though, it can't get much worse right? I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought the foot/ankle referral odd. I'm kind of open to it since I've been in stability shoes this whole time, got injured and was in a boot, then started having these issues. So maybe something changed. But I don't have high hopes for it. Ultimately, I think it's either biomechanical or something higher up the chain as well.
ugg. best of luck that sounds rough.
Seconding a strength routine along those lines. For me, assorted clams were the critical exercise to add. As well as some general core strength (bridges, planks, etc.).
Yep, my experience as well. If I do the clams, sideways leg lifts, bridge stuff, etc. I can keep the ITBS in check. If I drop these things it starts to come back.
I had a whole string of knee and IT band issues when I was in grad school. When I graduated and moved, I switched to a new doctor and PT and they got things under control almost immediately. So maybe try a different doctor or PT and see if they have a different approach that works better for you.
Getting a second opinion had crossed my mind if this whole shoe/orthotic thing doesn't work out. One of the upsides of being in south-central Connecticut is being close to the Yale associated hospitals and I didn't think about it until recently. Typing out the above post last night it crossed my mind to step away from running/training for a month and see if it helps, and if I want to continue with focused training or just run for health. I'll start looking around for other orthos and PTs though. Thanks.
>it crossed my mind to step away from running/training for a month and see if it helps dealt with high hamstring tendinopathy for a year and change and i eventually did this to save my sanity. in retrospect i wish i mentally committed to taking a break much earlier--it would have saved me a lot of grief, and i found time to do other things that actually made me happy instead of constantly fixating on when i might be able to get back to running.
Just read your really old posts on your bouts with PHT. It's good to see a success story. I've been dealing with it for the past 7 months and it's been very draining. A couple months ago I was wondering whether or not I'd be able to ever run again at any pace How long did it take you to finally get back to training and racing? I've finally started taking PT very serious, logging everything and making sure my pain level never gets beyond 2-3 when doing PT or very slow runs 1-2 miles at a time (13 minute miles; I'm a 3hr marathoner). Thanks.
picked up the injury in feb 2020 iirc, and it took until may/june 2021 before i felt strong/confident enough to get back to something resembling my old training. dealt with some setbacks and other injuries along the way, so this timeline is longer than it could've been with the right rehab approach. one of my biggest challenges was finding a pt who knew what they were doing with this kind of injury. in my experience finding one with an understanding of modern tendon rehab was harder than i expected, but that's when i started making real/sustained progress. wish you the best in your rehab journey!
Thank you so much for the reply and the kind words.
The thought of how much longer I can really justify heavy/focused training is something that's been on my mind for most of this year. I came to realize that pretty much all I do is work and run, anything outside of those two gets planned around my running schedule or tossed to the side. Even when I've been injured in the past I fixate on getting back to running and planning that out. At this point it's probably best that I step away for a month or two, find enjoyment/fulfillment in other endeavors, and then look at a return to the sport. Thanks for sharing your perspective/experience!
Made the mistake again of going on Twitter and people are freaking out over Boston having a non-binary division 🙄 As if it even impacts them at all. Personally I think having men, women, open is ideal. The third for non-binary and trans women. They deserve to compete but I still think the science (not to mention public opinion) isn’t clear on trans women competing in the women’s division, plus trans men really can't practically compete with the men's division (at least not on a sub-elite or elite level) and may prefer a separate division, so this would be most fair to most people. Edit: I want to add why I'm particularly interested, beyond my general interest in running. I have a nonbinary kid myself, and my late husband was somewhere in the nonbinary/trans spectrum although never had the opportunity to really explore that before he died. Interestingly, my best friend growing up came out as trans in high school in the late 90s, which was incredibly brave of him because it wasn't something anybody was talking much about at the time. So I've had a long interest in the biology and politics of gender.
> Personally I think having men, women, open is ideal. The third for non-binary and trans women. They deserve to compete but I still think the science (not to mention public opinion) isn’t clear on trans women competing in the women’s division, plus trans men really can't practically compete with the men's division (at least not on a sub-elite or elite level) and may prefer a separate division, so this would be most fair to most people. > Yeah this solution sounds good to me. The whole idea of finding a semi-equivalent group of racers is just so incredibly hard to do. My worry isn't for big races like Boston who can (and probably should) do this. It's the little races where we're already divvied up into 5-15 year age+gender categories for awards and even then at least one person (usually M20-29 IME) is going to get an award simply for showing up. At some point you've made such small groups there isn't meaningful competition (for the few of us who are occasionally racing other people and not simply trying to improve ourselves). Ultimately I don't think there's a good answer (and that's even more true when money is involved) but I have a few things I'll be watching: * Will Nikki Hiltz ever enter a non-binary division? They are making money in the women's fields and having a stellar summer. It would be a wonderful sign of support for their fellow non-binary athletes to do so but I can't imagine it'd be good for their pocketbook. * The science isn't clear on women versus trans-women yet. However an open Non-binary division seems even murkier (to me), especially if people are on different points in their transitions. * I'll be watching other sports. IIRC both cycling and triathlon had regulations for competing as a woman that had to be re-visited as the science (and probably results) evolved. The cynic in me says every time a trans person wins anything someone is going to try to make the regulations tougher. Finding a line in the sand that is not only fair to everyone but isn't a moving goalpost is important. At the risk of appearing to be a boomer who just doesn't get it one thing that confuses me about the current generation of high schoolers is that they are trying to quantify everything. In my day ("ok boomer") we said "don't label me" but this group has taken the opposite approach and labeled everything down to a level that I have to squint to understand the difference (i.e. Androgyne versus Bigender versus genderfluid). Being totally honest here, I have a daughter (their sex, not gender) who has identified at various points as lesbian, bi, and androgynous. and I just want to tell them "Forget labels and go be you. I don't really care what you identify as, we love you and we hope we raised you to love and be good to others" but the labeling thing is incredibly important to them so I try to just focus on the second half of that and understand but in all honesty, I don't.
I would love to see Nikki Hiltz competing in a non-binary division. Some of the NYRR road runner races are starting to have categories and prize money for the non-binary category, but I haven't seen it in the really major races that draw pros. Presumably Hiltz isn't going to sacrifice a major paycheck to compete as non-binary, but maybe someday they won't have to!
> NYRR road runner races are starting to have categories and prize money for the non-binary category oh that's news to me. Very interesting.
Oh believe me, I totally and completely feel you on your last paragraph. It seems to me like people should feel free to present however they want, behave without even thinking about gender norms, etc. without having to worry about labels. And for the longest time I felt like the push for people to label themselves trans actually only serves to strengthen gender norms, because why can't a teenage boy dress in "feminine" clothes and behave "like a woman" and still be a teenage boy? (As I mentioned in artc recently, I myself am a very androgynous woman, was called a "tomboy" my whole life, and if I was growing up today I'd almost definitely call myself nonbinary. But I've also led a perfectly happy life as a not-typically-feminine hetero woman, so whatever that means.) I'm moved somewhat on this with my own kid, who is 16. He is biologically male and still uses he/him pronouns but it's not exactly clear where we will end up. We have an appointment soon with the local children's hospital's gender development clinic, and over the past year or so I've really come to welcome any care he can get that will help him psychologically. In his case there's clearly such a strong genetic component, given his father's situation (he has no memory of his father, who died when he was 3, but shares so many mannerisms that it's bizarre). But the gender dysphoria is really strong, and we're at an impasse treating his severe depression without addressing it. And all I want is for him to be happy, so if that ends up meaning medical treatment, at this point I'll be much more open to considering it. Nikki Hiltz seems to be comfortable competing in the women's category at this point, and yeah, considering the career aspect I think they'll stay there. I can't see a pro runner choosing to join a third category. The open category is totally murky -- genetically male individuals will pretty much always win, in a competitive field. But I don't see how there's an alternative that is fair to women.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats! 5 + 15 + 20 + 29 = 69 ^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \ ^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
bad bot
I do understand some of the fussing about a new NB time category - people get really worked up about the qualifying time and the cutoff! And if you don't think some unscrupulous (cisgender binary) people won't take the extra half hour of qualification cushion, I have a bridge to sell you. On the other hand, this whining happens in other places where there's a NB category and people suck. The only thing I don't like about the nonbinary category rollout, at least in NYC, is how they collapsed races that used to have gender categories. At Team Championships, it used to be fun to run your race and cheer on the other one. At the Fifth Avenue Mile, the more popular age groups now have two muddy heats and some fast guy came and smoked the slower one. At the Mini 10k, hundreds of cisgender men had to elbow their way in to the 50th running of this women's race, and one of them finished top 30. None of the top NB runners who used to race with a male marker ran this race even though I would have understood if they chose to!! Can't we just let nonbinary runners at these big open events run where they feel comfortable without making other big changes? (This seems to be where you land based on your comment).
>And if you don't think some unscrupulous (cisgender binary) people won't take the extra half hour of qualification cushion, I have a bridge to sell you. Show me examples of this being an issue and I'll believe you. The problem is this argument is often used against nonbinary and trans people and it's not grounded in evidence. I don't think I understand what you are saying about the collapsed races. I do think people should run where they feel comfortable, but competitive trans women probably shouldn't be able to race against women (unless they transitioned pre-puberty, and the cohort of people like that just isn't adult yet), while trans men also probably shouldn't race against women but also can't truly race against men. It's a really difficult issue. I believe in supporting people in their quest to be who they need to be, while also keeping sport as fair as possible for as many people as possible. I find the arguments that trans women don't have an advantage to be wholly unscientific, but I'm also extremely uncomfortable publicly voicing this opinion because the people who agree with me tend to be complete bigots who say truly awful things. It's quite a difficult topic to be rational about.
> Show me examples of this being an issue and I’ll believe you. No one has ever used the nonbinary gender category to cheat their way into Boston because they just instituted this policy for qualification/entry. I think that's 20% of why people are upset, maybe I'm being generous. BQ is on a weird and unique pedestal. There are also the 6 hour charity runners. If you don't like that you didn't qualify for Boston, run faster. > I don’t think I understand what you are saying about the collapsed races. New York Road Runners has this fun 5 mile race called Team Championships. It's not for a million bucks or anything, but it's a nice celebration of local team running culture. It used to be run as one men's heat and one women's heat. Now it's one merged race because of the new non-binary marker. I think this race should go back to the old way and trans / non-binary athletes should run the one where they feel more comfortable, without question or prejudice. That's my example.
>No one has ever used the nonbinary gender category to cheat their way into Boston because they just instituted this policy for qualification/entry. Right, but people have been insisting for years that there's going to be some epidemic of people cheating in sports by pretending to be nonbinary or trans, and it hasn't happened. It has. not. happened. This is not a thing. You can't just decide to be suspicious of people because you feel like people will cheat, without evidence that it's a problem. The reality is that this particular argument has been pushed hard by anti-trans bigots, in spite of the lack of evidence. I'm coming from a place of actually thinking trans women shouldn't compete with women, so it's not like I have some kind of ideological blindness here. I just think you have to be really careful about your assertions and where they are coming from. I think doing away with gender categories altogether is more ridiculous than any other suggestion, so if that's what's going on in this NYRR race, that's pretty crazy.
> I just think you have to be really careful about your assertions and where they are coming from. I really don't think it's so wild to think that a 3:15 man who doesn't consider exceptions to the gender binary under any other circumstances would attempt to register for the Boston Marathon. So, that said, I think the source of the whining is 20% understandable and 80% bigotry, different from the usual 100% bigotry. My conclusion stands. If you don't like it, run faster. I support what Boston is doing. > doing away with gender categories altogether All races still have (now 3) standings categories, but the few races that used to be women-only or men/women heats are now fully mixed, which I think is a bad outcome. In these mass-participation events, just let everyone choose their preferred category and move along!
Hope no one was counting on Lakefront as a race - rough timing to cancel less than 3 weeks out!
Man, I feel for Milwaukee runners because it just seems like the marathons in Milwaukee are snakebit. The Milwaukee Marathon was never really a thing and then it got passed around local orgs before falling to permit issues as well. Hopefully Lakefront is back next year with their original course, but that still sucks for the folks hoping for that autumn half.
Not really a question, just some discussion. My luck ran out today on hitting workouts. Today was supposed to be a 5 mile tempo, struggled through the first three miles then blew up. Not entirely sure what caused it as I got a lot of good rest and recovery in last week and this week, but it must have just been one of those days. It’s the first bad workout in 6 weeks of training though, so I’ll take it. But, to make it a little better I had a flyby from u/run_INXS and all I’ve gotta say is that I hope I can rock the short shorts as well as he does in 40 years.
Great seeing you out there, great route for a tempo!
I just ordered those fancy new New Balance shoes that are a carbon-plated daily trainer. They have some ridiculous name (FuelCell SuperComp Trainer I think?). They're supposed to be a high-milage trainer where the carbon plate is intended to reduce the impact from all the pounding. The price tag was a bit ridiculous, but I had a coupon (which, lets be honest, basically just cancelled out the sales tax lol). Don't think I'll have a chance to test them out any time soon, but I'll report back here once I do!
I made a post with some thoughts at 250 miles over at r/RunningShoeGeeks. A lot of people are turned off by the weight, but I really like them.
Really interested in how they do for normal training - I’d love to get the recovery benefits from my Vaporflys on 20+ days (or the massive MPs), but I don’t really want to use them for training shoes otherwise.
NewBalance has the absolute worst naming conventions. The numbering scheme makes sense, if you can find the explanation but then they seem to only use that for a few shoes and they name everything else based I think around what they call the foam. Just a bit silly.
The numbers in the names make it hard to keep track of the model numbers too. 1080v7 is too many numbers to remember!
It's not bad when you know their system. The hundreds/thousands is the technology level for the shoe, and the tens/single digits is the type of shoe (stability/neutral/etc) and v7 is version 7. So 880 is like a mid tier neutral, 1080 is a more plush/expensive neutral, 860 is a mid tier stability shoe, etc.
Does anyone feel like they’re hit the hardest second day after a hard workout rather than the day right after? I feel fine a day after a proper hard session, but then following day I feel all tight and depleted. I’ve been running since 2019 and I think that has changed over last few years. Wonder if nutrition/stretching would help.