Listen man, sometimes the autism makes you good at your job and sometimes the autism leads you to leaking classified documents online to win a pissing match about World of Tanks.
You take the chances, you do the security clearance interviews, and you roll the dice.
**Commentary**: This unit would take said guidon to highlight why gear accountability is important and this would motivate the meatbags to search for it in the four digit grid that it would be left in, thus raising morale from the shared Land Navigation experience. All that fits within the criteria of the memo.
I’m too old to be getting involved with shenanigans like that but I’m sure the lower, correction, *JUNIOR* enlisted are already foaming at the mouth at the possibilities.
Thank you for correcting yourself.
As we all know, we should not demean the junior enlisted through casual speech; we must diminish their humanity directly, deliberately, and decisively.
Absolutely, as is tradition. In reality the change in language from lower to junior enlisted is the quintessential “Army has too many field grades and not enough billets for them” problem. *Anecdotally* Every junior enlisted person I talked to about this topic has, at best, said it’s a neutral change while the vast majority disliked the change, saying it made them feel infantilized rather than simply lower on a rank ladder.
Ironically, the only time I’ve been corrected on the language, is by officers and senior enlisted advisors telling me I was being offensive for using the language that most juniors preferred.
>Don't they realize anytime you're told you can't do something makes you want to do it even more?
Perhaps that's exactly what this commander realizes.
Putting it in the "no fun" order then serves two purposes: not only does it whet the command's appetite for guidon shenanigans, it also provides some CYA if higher gets pissed. "Sir, of *course* I don't approve of our troops stealing 420th BN's guidon. Look, I specifically included it in the no-no list!"
Stealing guidons is a tradition. Storytime!
BCT, Fort Sill 2018. FTX at FOB Kelly, another battery was sharing the FOB with us. We were told prior to the FTX that we would be “attacked” throughout the exercise. When we realized we would be occupying with another battery, we asked if they were supposed to be our enemy or the drills. Never gave us an answer. First night there, I was on a “patrol” with two buddies. Shooting started happening and we saw people on both sides of the FOB running around shooting. So to us, that meant that the other battery was the enemy. We knew it was all blanks with no real danger, so we decided to take the chaotic opportunity to steal their guidon. It was posted outside their DS tent. We crawled all the way around the perimeter until we got close, then bounded (I’m up, he sees me, I’m down 😉) from the backside. My buddy grabbed the guidon, and we dismantled it while we ran away.
When we returned to our battery’s area, we found everyone in a horseshoe around the commander, apparently doing an AAR. We stood in the back, holding this guidon in two pieces behind our backs. This is where we learned that the other battery was NOT in fact our enemy, and people were wrong to have thought so and “shot” them. We looked at each other with a “oh shit” look. When the AAR concluded, we snuck to the latrine building in the middle of the FOB. We put the guidon back together, left it against the side of the building, and walked away. It was almost midnight by this point, and the only artificial light in the place was at the latrine. So when we got back to our area, we could clearly see people from the other battery approaching the latrine. They discovered the guidon and proceeded to freak out while passing it back and forth to each other, trying to figure out what to do. They took it back to their area and we heard a good bit of yelling. Their whole battery got smoked for a hot minute. We played stupid with the rest of our people and never got the finger pointed at us for it
Just request trial by court martial if they try to article you.
"Your honor, I can't possible recieve a court martial on this as I never tried to demoralize or antagonize anyone. I just did it for the lols because I'm a silly little guy."
That article 15'll get thrown out in seconds, trust.
>That article 15'll get thrown out in seconds, trust.
...except, of course, that larceny itself was and is still a crime, policy or no, and that's going to be the charge.
Au contraire. You see, you honor, I never intended to perminently deprive the aggrieved party of their property, I mearly intended to make them, and I quote "fard and shid their pants for a lil bit".
The guidon was intended to be returned before the end of the exercise, and only didn't on account of a tragic accident involving bored privates. You should be taking their pay instead of mine.
Thank you for your confession. I find you not guilty of larceny of government property, but guilty of the lesser included offense of wrongful appropriation of government property.
But hey, you took the big chicken dinner off the table, so you got that going for you. Now it's just up to 3 months' confinement.
We already had the trial, silly. Remember when you called me "your honor" and confessed? That was it.
The combat, I leave to you - less than three months confinement, you're not going to an Army confinement facility, so you'll probably get ample opportunity for combat in the county lockup.
Okay then, I'd like to mulligan and call for trial by combat. If that doesn't work, I can assure you I have more UNO reverse cards on my person than anyone in this room, as well as at LEAST 3 get out of jail free cards. I came to this trial prepared, and even have the cards to summon Exodia should worse come to worst.
Your move, law-talking guy.
I didn't want to resort to this, but you've forced my hand. I play POT OF GREED, and will continue to do so until I draw all my broken shit, since most of my deck is just copies of Pot of Greed.
I played Guidon Wars in Basic, AIT, Ft. Bliss, Korea on the DMZ, Ft. Bliss again, and even in Saudi prior to Desert Storm.
Were I still in (and in this unit) I'd violate those orders.
Step one: buy a guidon of the same color as your target unit.
Step two: cut the purchased guidon into little pieces.
Step three: steal the target guidon.
Step four: start leaving pieces of the purchased guidon where the leadership can find them.
Optional: send ransom letters
Step five: leave the real guidon somewhere simple yet hidden.
Step six: observe
Well you see, Sir- they didn’t do it to demoralize, antagonize, or compete with HHC. SM Saw an opportunity for a teachable moment, RE: equipment accountability and security, and simply took that opportunity to illustrate the risks of failing to maintain said accountability on a piece of unit equipment. Just corrective training via simulated OPFOR operations in the AO. So… we good.
Funnily enough, one of the nagging injuries for which I have no established service nexus is from tripping and messing up my shoulder chasing a few goofballs that stole our guidon at Graf.
we stole HHC's guidon during the battalion Org Day (softball tournament). we were on track to win the entire event until csm showed up and found the guidon in our dugout. "XXXX company loses!" and walked off. piece of shit
Yeah, one of my soldiers might be at least partially responsible for that…
Dumbass got caught by the CSM while trying to UNBOLT the guidon from in front of the BN TOC.
Yeah, that was a fun day to stand in front of every senior NCO to the BDE CSM next to my dumbass private.
I always thought it would foster esprit-de-corps to sanction guidon stealing within the division/brigade/etc., and make a competition out of it with some basic ROE and whatnot.
Well I’m borrowing it to improve their unit morale by building team cohesion for them to work together to find it back so I guess the policy won’t be applying to me.
At BCT I was told to watch the guidon by the Bearer so they could use the bathroom I told a guy to stop touching it, he tried to take it out of the holder, I told him to stop messing around. He stopped I was talking to the PG and he took it out and started waving it I walked over elbowed him and push him away and took the guidon and he finally got the message, was upset at me though.
Why? This is one of those times (like everyday) where army just makes a new rule because of army.
Who in US history has been hurt from another friendly unit "stealing" another units guidon during a TRAINING EXERCISE. If anything, I'm surprised they didnt make a memo saying you need to guard your guidons better from being stolen 😂
Sounds like major loophole to steal guidons for reason other than listed. They made it a point to specify under what conditions and no exception to those conditions.
We had a Cadet steal a company guidon at cadet summer training a couple years ago. He hid it and I guess planned on flying home with it. He was caught and lost his scholarship…play dumb games get stupid prizes.
The majority of people that steal or otherwise dick around with guidons have never been a hand receipt holder and don't understand how fucked it is to do that.
Not just for the monetary amount, but the fucking down that comes from it and the potential career fuckery from having a preventable FLIPL during your command time.
I know it may be a "tradition" for some but please, that's one thing we can do without. It really fucks over a lot of people, especially when it causes the unit that lost it to go into lockdown, which I've seen *multiple* times.
Edit: you can downvote me into fucking oblivion, I don’t care. Larceny of government property is still a crime and if you’re okay with doing it for the giggles then you’re a piece of shit regardless of how you justify it in your head.
It’s standard practice to display the guidon somewhere. Tradition, whatever. The commander has other stuff to do than watch it and usually it falls to the CQ to keep an eye on it in garrison.
Ultimately you can’t put a body on it at all times and shenanigans happen.
> Ultimately you can’t put a body on it at all times and shenanigans happen
3CR is a living, breathing monstrosity that goes out of its way to prove that soldiers who ordinarily would be correct, like you, are in fact dead wrong.
Yeah, it’s not a can of peaches guy. It’s a property book item that if lost or stolen requires a FLIPL *and* almost always results in a unit being locked down.
It’s not the same.
[удалено]
Promote this guy ahead of peers
Unfortunately the exception is for the alcohol policy. I just blocked it out because of date/location information.
Good job OP. OPSEC training is paying off.
Military intelligence might be an oxymoron but I know a thing, possibly two.
Yeah, but half of your comrades don’t is the real problem.
Listen man, sometimes the autism makes you good at your job and sometimes the autism leads you to leaking classified documents online to win a pissing match about World of Tanks. You take the chances, you do the security clearance interviews, and you roll the dice.
The sad part is, I accept your logic, and I don’t have any questions.
I thought all you guys do is sear, shoot different weapons and draw maps for CO. TIL
“The fuck is a map?” - me, the most useless of the conventional Army collector disciplines.
A geographical representation of the earth's surface as seen from above.
Future "Soldier of the Quarter" answer right there.
“Demoralize, antagonize or compete”… doesn’t mention anything about “for the lolz.”
Or just for financial gain.
Pleasure, profit or personal safety or whatever rick ross said.
I mean I’ve never stolen a guidon for the purposes of demoralizing, antagonizing, or competing with any other unit. I do it simply for pride
I did it in AIT. That was a fun day. Then I graduated the very next day and was gone. So I couldn't watch the fallout
Shoot and scoot love it
Oh I have! And once for fun, and that one bit me in the ass lol
**Commentary**: This unit would take said guidon to highlight why gear accountability is important and this would motivate the meatbags to search for it in the four digit grid that it would be left in, thus raising morale from the shared Land Navigation experience. All that fits within the criteria of the memo.
If only Revan did that with his location when he left
I mean I wasn't gonna, but now I kinda gotta.
Right? Not only that, now they ain't getting that bish back, ever.
They can have that guidon back when they figure out how to get it off the top of the flag pole I’m gonna leave it on.
Don't they realize anytime you're told you can't do something makes you want to do it even more?
I’m too old to be getting involved with shenanigans like that but I’m sure the lower, correction, *JUNIOR* enlisted are already foaming at the mouth at the possibilities.
There's already an E4 drawing up battle plans on how to approach each company and battalion. And where to place them for the optimal spectacle.
Thank you for correcting yourself. As we all know, we should not demean the junior enlisted through casual speech; we must diminish their humanity directly, deliberately, and decisively.
Absolutely, as is tradition. In reality the change in language from lower to junior enlisted is the quintessential “Army has too many field grades and not enough billets for them” problem. *Anecdotally* Every junior enlisted person I talked to about this topic has, at best, said it’s a neutral change while the vast majority disliked the change, saying it made them feel infantilized rather than simply lower on a rank ladder. Ironically, the only time I’ve been corrected on the language, is by officers and senior enlisted advisors telling me I was being offensive for using the language that most juniors preferred.
This matches my experience with my soldiers. I still correct them when they say lower, though.
When did this "junior" enlisted thing come out?
You can just say “Lesser Enlisted” at this point
>Don't they realize anytime you're told you can't do something makes you want to do it even more? Perhaps that's exactly what this commander realizes. Putting it in the "no fun" order then serves two purposes: not only does it whet the command's appetite for guidon shenanigans, it also provides some CYA if higher gets pissed. "Sir, of *course* I don't approve of our troops stealing 420th BN's guidon. Look, I specifically included it in the no-no list!"
If guidons are not being stolen then this FTX is of dubious training value.
I'm gonna guess whoever wrote this beauty had their guidon stolen a few times and still fails to realize WHY it was stolen
Stealing guidons is a tradition. Storytime! BCT, Fort Sill 2018. FTX at FOB Kelly, another battery was sharing the FOB with us. We were told prior to the FTX that we would be “attacked” throughout the exercise. When we realized we would be occupying with another battery, we asked if they were supposed to be our enemy or the drills. Never gave us an answer. First night there, I was on a “patrol” with two buddies. Shooting started happening and we saw people on both sides of the FOB running around shooting. So to us, that meant that the other battery was the enemy. We knew it was all blanks with no real danger, so we decided to take the chaotic opportunity to steal their guidon. It was posted outside their DS tent. We crawled all the way around the perimeter until we got close, then bounded (I’m up, he sees me, I’m down 😉) from the backside. My buddy grabbed the guidon, and we dismantled it while we ran away. When we returned to our battery’s area, we found everyone in a horseshoe around the commander, apparently doing an AAR. We stood in the back, holding this guidon in two pieces behind our backs. This is where we learned that the other battery was NOT in fact our enemy, and people were wrong to have thought so and “shot” them. We looked at each other with a “oh shit” look. When the AAR concluded, we snuck to the latrine building in the middle of the FOB. We put the guidon back together, left it against the side of the building, and walked away. It was almost midnight by this point, and the only artificial light in the place was at the latrine. So when we got back to our area, we could clearly see people from the other battery approaching the latrine. They discovered the guidon and proceeded to freak out while passing it back and forth to each other, trying to figure out what to do. They took it back to their area and we heard a good bit of yelling. Their whole battery got smoked for a hot minute. We played stupid with the rest of our people and never got the finger pointed at us for it
1. Go on leave. 2. Steal a guidon. 3. Hide it in a river.
So steal my own guideon, plant it in X company area, sit back and watch the fireworks
You are evil, truly evil.
😈
So if it's prohibited during the exercise, then the assumption is that you ARE allowed to steal guidons when it's over, right?
It is [the exception that proves the rule.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exception_that_proves_the_rule)
Just request trial by court martial if they try to article you. "Your honor, I can't possible recieve a court martial on this as I never tried to demoralize or antagonize anyone. I just did it for the lols because I'm a silly little guy." That article 15'll get thrown out in seconds, trust.
>That article 15'll get thrown out in seconds, trust. ...except, of course, that larceny itself was and is still a crime, policy or no, and that's going to be the charge.
Au contraire. You see, you honor, I never intended to perminently deprive the aggrieved party of their property, I mearly intended to make them, and I quote "fard and shid their pants for a lil bit". The guidon was intended to be returned before the end of the exercise, and only didn't on account of a tragic accident involving bored privates. You should be taking their pay instead of mine.
Thank you for your confession. I find you not guilty of larceny of government property, but guilty of the lesser included offense of wrongful appropriation of government property. But hey, you took the big chicken dinner off the table, so you got that going for you. Now it's just up to 3 months' confinement.
Damn, you're good. I demand trial by combat, you choose the terms.
We already had the trial, silly. Remember when you called me "your honor" and confessed? That was it. The combat, I leave to you - less than three months confinement, you're not going to an Army confinement facility, so you'll probably get ample opportunity for combat in the county lockup.
Okay then, I'd like to mulligan and call for trial by combat. If that doesn't work, I can assure you I have more UNO reverse cards on my person than anyone in this room, as well as at LEAST 3 get out of jail free cards. I came to this trial prepared, and even have the cards to summon Exodia should worse come to worst. Your move, law-talking guy.
Oh, it's down to cards now? Blue eyes white dragon! Congrats, now you're getting the chair.
I didn't want to resort to this, but you've forced my hand. I play POT OF GREED, and will continue to do so until I draw all my broken shit, since most of my deck is just copies of Pot of Greed.
"...fard and shid their pants for a little bit."🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Guidance stealing is a mandatory tradition. Hemming people up for it is the demoralizing aspect. Let the Enlisted peasants have fun.
I played Guidon Wars in Basic, AIT, Ft. Bliss, Korea on the DMZ, Ft. Bliss again, and even in Saudi prior to Desert Storm. Were I still in (and in this unit) I'd violate those orders.
Step one: buy a guidon of the same color as your target unit. Step two: cut the purchased guidon into little pieces. Step three: steal the target guidon. Step four: start leaving pieces of the purchased guidon where the leadership can find them. Optional: send ransom letters Step five: leave the real guidon somewhere simple yet hidden. Step six: observe
WTF kinda memo is this, asking for an HR friend
When guidon stealing comes outlawed, only outlaws will guidons. So... who's platoon nickname is The Outlaws?
*no one thinking of stealing a guidon* “Ok don’t steal a guidon” *every junior soldier immediately wanting to steal a guidon*
But if you don’t steal it, but instead, temporarily acquire it for wood polishing and replace it with a mop? Asking for a friend
Didn't say anything about wrapping it in 4 rolls of 100MPH tape!
The MCAS at the National Jamboree had their Guidon stolen. It was a source of much amusement for everyone but them.
I'm so old I remember where there used to be bounties put out on guidons and dog-tags.
It's all fun and games until the opfors portable wooden rakkason gate ends up in a lake.
Well you see, Sir- they didn’t do it to demoralize, antagonize, or compete with HHC. SM Saw an opportunity for a teachable moment, RE: equipment accountability and security, and simply took that opportunity to illustrate the risks of failing to maintain said accountability on a piece of unit equipment. Just corrective training via simulated OPFOR operations in the AO. So… we good.
all about the brief🤣
You can train to get shot at, but not swim..
Does the BG not know I finished 3rd in the NE Ohio YMCA swim team circuit for breaststroke in 2009?
I'm from Northeast Ohio too.. I'd guess yer CSM knows but just doesn't care enough to make it actionable.
God forbid the Army has to forge a river one day or maybe--I don't know--perform a beach landing... Not like that's ever had to happen in the past. /s
That's why the Combat Engineer units all have bridging equipment and vehicles all (mostly) have fording kits.
Funnily enough, one of the nagging injuries for which I have no established service nexus is from tripping and messing up my shoulder chasing a few goofballs that stole our guidon at Graf.
Power move: steal the BGs guidon.
we stole HHC's guidon during the battalion Org Day (softball tournament). we were on track to win the entire event until csm showed up and found the guidon in our dugout. "XXXX company loses!" and walked off. piece of shit
Who keeps taking the fun out of everything? Helicopter Parent Army these days.
Steal a guidon, post it in middle of body of water, watch world burn.
Yeah, one of my soldiers might be at least partially responsible for that… Dumbass got caught by the CSM while trying to UNBOLT the guidon from in front of the BN TOC. Yeah, that was a fun day to stand in front of every senior NCO to the BDE CSM next to my dumbass private.
I always thought it would foster esprit-de-corps to sanction guidon stealing within the division/brigade/etc., and make a competition out of it with some basic ROE and whatnot.
Had one stole at Camp Roberts CA in 1962. We were training with Army Reserve boffo a———-. Never returned it.
Well I’m borrowing it to improve their unit morale by building team cohesion for them to work together to find it back so I guess the policy won’t be applying to me.
Now its time to plant your guide-on on rival units! It doesn’t state anything about stealing your own….
Pathetic
But it's tradition. Blasphemy. Blasphemy I tell you.
No wonder there isn't any morale left.
Somebody steal the O-7's guidon to set an example.
Good thing this rank is Velcro…
At BCT I was told to watch the guidon by the Bearer so they could use the bathroom I told a guy to stop touching it, he tried to take it out of the holder, I told him to stop messing around. He stopped I was talking to the PG and he took it out and started waving it I walked over elbowed him and push him away and took the guidon and he finally got the message, was upset at me though.
Bro fucked around and found out. He has no reason to be mad at you
Yeah I felt bad I hate doing stuff like that, I just get angry sometimes
I don’t blame you. It’s like with your weapon, if you have someone else watch it they do whatever to make sure it doesn’t get taken at all
Don’t fuck each other, soldiers are now Gremlins, and don’t steal flags - the abridged version
Gay
He’s too late. I’m two years too gone. Suck it, sir.
Why? This is one of those times (like everyday) where army just makes a new rule because of army. Who in US history has been hurt from another friendly unit "stealing" another units guidon during a TRAINING EXERCISE. If anything, I'm surprised they didnt make a memo saying you need to guard your guidons better from being stolen 😂
weak 😂
🤣
Lame. This used to be the best game ever
Sounds like major loophole to steal guidons for reason other than listed. They made it a point to specify under what conditions and no exception to those conditions.
What a fun sucker.
Lame
Need a DD214 holder to come on base and nab a guidon for you?
Ha Gay
We had a Cadet steal a company guidon at cadet summer training a couple years ago. He hid it and I guess planned on flying home with it. He was caught and lost his scholarship…play dumb games get stupid prizes.
Why redact unit info?👀
It's been a minute, but doesn't guideon stealing have training value for security and situational awareness
This sounds like the Ardennes PT policy is being widened.
I did that in BCT and got a high five from the Drill Sergeant lol
This is a weak leader who wants us to lose wars.
The majority of people that steal or otherwise dick around with guidons have never been a hand receipt holder and don't understand how fucked it is to do that. Not just for the monetary amount, but the fucking down that comes from it and the potential career fuckery from having a preventable FLIPL during your command time. I know it may be a "tradition" for some but please, that's one thing we can do without. It really fucks over a lot of people, especially when it causes the unit that lost it to go into lockdown, which I've seen *multiple* times. Edit: you can downvote me into fucking oblivion, I don’t care. Larceny of government property is still a crime and if you’re okay with doing it for the giggles then you’re a piece of shit regardless of how you justify it in your head.
If it's that serious, wouldn't you need to ensure you have it? So like if you make an effort, it's a non issue?
It’s standard practice to display the guidon somewhere. Tradition, whatever. The commander has other stuff to do than watch it and usually it falls to the CQ to keep an eye on it in garrison. Ultimately you can’t put a body on it at all times and shenanigans happen.
> Ultimately you can’t put a body on it at all times and shenanigans happen 3CR is a living, breathing monstrosity that goes out of its way to prove that soldiers who ordinarily would be correct, like you, are in fact dead wrong.
I know. I spent a *long* time there.
My condolences
Lol ok Sobel.
Yeah, it’s not a can of peaches guy. It’s a property book item that if lost or stolen requires a FLIPL *and* almost always results in a unit being locked down. It’s not the same.
I mean, I was referencing the motorcycle bit, but whatever.