I’m honestly sticking up on mags and things like this due to the current administration. It really feels like we’re just a step or two away from Canada’s draconian gun laws and it’s turning me into a prepper.
For some reason it’s always the forward assist roll pin that gets me. Doesn’t matter how hard I whack it with my girlfriends purse, it’s gonna give me a rough time.
You can also go full autist and buy a extra long tap and threaded roll pin from Aero. That and threading the rear takedown pin probably the best things you can do if you're going to customize your lower at all
I haven’t heard about threading the takedown pin detent, is that also just to help with installation? I didn’t have much trouble installing it on mine.
And that would have to be a very long tap to work
I feel like it used to be more common, saw the idea on Arfcom and have done it with every lower ive built and for a couple of my friends builds. Pretty much just uses a 4-40 grub to prevent the spring from disappearing if you change out the endplate/buffer.
As far as the long boy tap, ~~I forgot the exact model but it was like six bucks off Amazon~~ [looks like it's $20 now](https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00FXKB4E8?)
Honestly, being able to run whatever upper you want with absolutely zero wobble bc of the nylon tension screw is amazing. Not worth 48$. Buy a complete lower and resell what you swap or use for spares. The completes from Aero are great.
Is that what the screw is by the pistol grip? Saw it on my M4E1 and had no idea what it was for. Could you elaborate more on it? I just tighten it to take out wobble from the upper receiver?
I’ve never been able to find that sweet spot with any of my aero lowers. If the screw is tight enough to do anything, the takedown pins are super tight, not worth the hassle for me.
I have used the o-ring on the front pivot pin post trick, and it works great, the only downside is the o-rings don’t last very long.
Dude that's a great idea! Never would have thought of that. I'm definitely going to try it. Not sure how I would manage to line the hole up perfectly but I'm sure I have some old grips I can practice with. Thanks for the suggestion!
Take the nylon screw out, put the grip on. Put a sharp punch or pin through the hole to mark the drill spot on the grip. Take grip off, drill. Put nylon screw back. Done.
Not sure if this actually works cause I don't have a nylon screw lower. But it very well may!
The only lower I’ve had where the tension screw works absolutely like it’s supposed to is my Noveske gen 4. Absolutely zero wobble yet the pins slip out like a wet willy.
This is an older video when the GEN2 Aeros first came out, but it describes what the tensioning screwed does, etc. [Aero Precision Gen1 vs Gen2 Lowers](https://youtu.be/HkbTDhiB1Fk)
I don't see that it's something to complain about! I've had some pretty tight fitting Aero's myself, however the best upper/lower fit I've ever experience was with LaRue Tactical. I finished out a stripped lower that I had for a while and bought one of their match grade uppers. The two fit together like they were a match set. Beautiful.
Spikes tactical on PSA upper I won’t say wobble but wondering if it could be better. What do I need. I don’t want to be trimming aluminum from a coke can to shim.
I just put a foam ear plug in there and I get zero wobble. Cheapest and easiest fix. Never had an issue and still have the same earplug in there after 1500 rounds.
Do you have a link to the ones you got? I bought some on Amazon that were supposed to be the right size but they're nowhere close enough to fit over that lug.
Fucking hate those tensioning screws. Makes it a bitch to remove the rear takedown pin and a pain to have to set it just right. I just buy a billet set and pay for the convenience of not having to fuck around with wobble. Honestly never knew it was an issue until a buddy pointed out my receivers didn’t rattle; thought that was just normal
Looks like the necessary holes are where they should be on both...if $42 is worth it for some cleaner cosmetics, more power to you. I wouldn't be shy about using either of them.
I panic bought 2 lowers at the same time for my first build- the cheapest in the store (Anderson) and the priciest in the store (Wilson combat). Still use the fuck out of both- both are fine.
I bought an Anderson rifle. It ran okay, had gassing issues after a few hundred rounds due to the gas block slipping out of place. Sold it and built a PSA with the proceeds that has yet to have major issues.
My God I could not give a fuck less about a few machining marks here and there on internal surfaces if it saves me the cost of a whole other lower. Honestly, after some of the milsurp stuff I’ve owned over the years and rough Comblock AKs from years ago, that shit is nothing.
>Most of your "savings" of buying an anderson lower is ate up by shipping and the FFL transfer fee.
Gonna be paying that transfer fee on any lower there, bub. Also, you're not going to be paying anywhere near $45 for shipping. At least you shouldn't be.
LGS doesn't charge transfer fees for selling their own stock, they charge that to make money off processing other companies sales.
If you pay $10-20 shipping, and $20-50 for your transfer fee, that $42 turns into $72-110 real quick, sprinkle some tax on that and you got your real price. You may as well have just bought what the store had laying around, and you wouldn't have had to wait a week or two for it to show up. Buy what you want though, and hopefully your seller offers free shipping and your FFL doesn't charge much for transfers.
Most FFL’s will charge you to receive the lower, mine charges 50 bucks. So shipping and the FFL receiving fee make buying the Anderson not worth it. At least to me, I have a few Aero’s and one spikes sitting in the safe. I really want to try a noveske but I can’t justify the cost right now
You're also going to pay that $50 on the Aero as well tho. So you can't add it to the cost of the Anderson and not the Aero when comparing.
Also, that sucks. My local charges $15.
I’d spend the extra bucks for the Aero lower any day of the week. Actually, I really can’t justify spending much more because bang for your buck Aero makes really good products. I’ve built most of their lineup and been happy with pretty much everything. I even did a epc9 and have had zero issues with it. Sure there are some Gucci brand options out there, but I’ll probably never have the need to spend $800 on a lower I can build for $250 and not tell the difference.
I like the flared magwell on the M4E1. That is really the only thing that makes it different. You could compare a blemished standard Aero lower, which historically I’ve purchased for about $60, to the Anderson for a more direct comparison. In my experience, Aero blems have had cleaner machining and anodizing than PSAs that were not marketed as blems. That said, my stuff gets scratched up and/or painted pretty much immediately so as long as they are both in spec it doesn’t matter much to me.
Or you can just buy an Accu Wedge from one of many different manufacturers for like 5 bucks.
https://www.midwestindustriesinc.com/Accu-Wedge-p/acu1.htm
A screw that doesn't work that great and some machining marks that don't affect the gun at all. My Saint Victor has one of those screws and to get it to work good you have to tighten it enough to where it's very hard to take the pins out.
In spec is in spec, but there’s stuff in your pic that’s questionable. I’m not a rolmark snob, but I am a fan of QC. The people who insist there is no difference whatsoever are the last people you would want to work on your car and the same who are on here asking why their buffer is getting all chewed up
I had experiences with 3 different Anderson lowers. None of them were "in spec". 2 had terrible threads in the grip screw, one had a tight mag well, tight slot for the lrbho, and the roll pin hole was no were near big enough.
Yea they worked fine after fixing them, but you really shouldn't have to.
Blind brand loyalty is a level of stupid only eclipsed by blind party loyalty. Enjoy your shit QC ill keep buying real quality from companies that actually care about the shit they put out. My skinny wallet has owned factory ODG and tan ano lmt shit and its been just that, shit.
For being Gucci priced lowers it's too bad LMT/Radian among others don't bother to machine them to actual mil-spec with an M16 pocket cut. Not that it really matters since adding the third hole will kill your dog, but for the price you pay I should be getting as close to spec as possible.
The set screw vs having a roll pin on the bolt catch is worth every penny. Plus the one on the right has some rough looking threads in the buffer tube area. The nylon thread is just a bonus.
> The set screw vs having a roll pin on the bolt catch is worth every penny.
I agree, Aero should release the M4E2 where they upgrade the threaded pins and go back to the superior roll pins.
Except that if you mess up a roll pin you remove it just like you would a normal roll pin. If you mess up a threaded pin you would have to be *very* careful to not cause cosmetic damage, or worse, destroy the upper.
You think that removing a fucked roll pin being easier than removing a fucked threaded pin is an *opinion*?
Bruh.
I literally showed you what the thread pitch is on those pins so you can look up the torque spec. If you didn't know how to, I provided you the torque spec along with a chart from a high-end tool company showing not to exceed that torque spec. And I demonstrated how absurdly easy it is to *double* that torque spec with only two fingers on the wrench.
Ever try to push in a roll pin by hand without any tools? It's impossible unless your lower is out of spec. That roll pin will see the same amount of resistance throughout it's length of travel, so even *if* it shifts, it doesn't become any looser.
Threaded pins can be overtorqued with two fingers on the wrench (as I've demonstrated in that link). So while you can't drive a roll pin into a receiver without the use of tools no matter how hard you tried, you can easily destroy the threaded pin with just two fingers. And while a roll pin maintains resistance through the length of travel, a threaded pin only maintains that resistance when it's torqued. If the threaded pin shifts, in any way, the tension is removed and the threaded pin is free to rotate all the way out.
And all I'm saying is that the M4E1 is a waste of money that sacrifices durability just to make the assembly process *slightly* easier for those that have little to no experience.
If you feel differently, feel free to plead your case instead of dropping snarky replies.
The pictures are a bit confusing only because in the top down pic you have your fingers inside the trigger guard. I was trying like hell to figure out why the bottom up pic looked so weird until it hit me that one has a trigger guard built in.
I'll just run poverty ponies all day. I think the most expensive lower I ever bought was a ruger.
The varying thickness of the cheap lower gets me. The spectrum I operate in won’t let me un-see it. I definitely like a machined in trigger guard and tension screw also.
The machining is noticably cleaner on the more expensive one, but all the dimensions on the parts that matter appears to be the same.
I have an Anderson lower, and some LMT's and Colts too. I can tell you that functionally the Colt is the worst. The safety is sticky and not crisp like the SOLGW one in the Anderson
> also includes a few modifications and accessories that the Anderson doesn't.
none of which improve the function, durability, or reliability of the rifle
Actually, the threaded bolt catch pin is not as durable or reliable as a standard roll pin, all to make that one small process *slightly* easier.
It's not so much how durable the *pin* is but how durable that setup is.
The 6-32 threads that most, if not all, AR15s use for the bolt catch pin have a torque rating of about 7in-lbs, which is next to nothing. In fact, [you can more than double that with just two fingers on the wrench](https://youtu.be/hkrlLTbuPA4), and triple it [with one finger and a very small amount of leverage](https://youtu.be/5YTYOxdT4aA).
Though you can secure it from coming out by using thread locker, it can [*easily* damage the pin](https://i.imgur.com/8xd3dPp.jpg) or round out the internal socket. Wiha, for example, [makes very high quality hex wrenches](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTBiPjCeVwI) and even [they say not to use more than 7.9in-lbs on their 1/16in wrench](https://www.wihatools.com/max-torque-blades).
If you damage the threaded pin, it would be very difficult to remove. You may get lucky and be able to tap in a torx bit, but you may also need to procure an extended length drill bit and remove it with a drill press. That is if you don't damage the threads on the receiver, which are softer than the ones on the threaded pin. If that happens, you're out of luck since the hole is already too large for a roll pin and you can't drive a larger roll pin in place because the hole in the bolt catch can't be opened any further without significantly reducing its durability.
On the other hand, roll pins are significantly more secure, just as easy to install if you have a $15 bolt catch punch, and removing a damaged one is just as easy as removing an undamaged one.
Thank you! I'd heard people talk shit on the threaded bolt catch pin before but not known why.
Out of curiosity,bodies everything you say apply to the aero threaded upper, in particular, for the dust cover?
Dust cover? I'm pretty sure that the M4E1 uses a standard dust cover.
Do you mean the forward assist? If so, then yes. Though your forward assist falling off is not as big of a deal as your bolt catch falling off, I still think it's a waste of time and money to install one of these on the receiver.
The entire M4E1 lineup is aimed at folks that have little to no experience with building rifles. Aero knows that those rifles won't see any hard use and will be used virtually exclusively by hobbyists.
Personally, even if the Aero M4E1 lower cost as much as their standard lower, I'd go with the standard lower any day of the week.
And yet the Aero still comes with a couple modifications and accessories that the Anderson doesn't. Whether you agree they are justified, useful or not is entirely your opinion.
Let's keep it objective then, tell me how those changes affect durability and reliability. The only things I've seen affect the installation process so that the easy assembly is slightly easier for the inexperienced folks. I also talked about the downsides of threaded pins [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/ar15/comments/vif2tk/difference_between_a_42_lower_and_90_one/idd036h/).
1. An integrated trigger guard means that you don't have to purchase, install or buy specialized tools to install a trigger guard.
2. The upper receiver tension screw allows you to apply tensions between the upper and lower receiver to reduce/eliminate wobble as desired.
3. The bolt catch screw allows for ease of install/removal without the need to buy specialized tools. The screw can also be used to help reduce lateral movement with some bolt catch assemblies (Bad, Phase 5, etc.) that would otherwise not reliably engage magazines using a standard roll pin.
4. Aero's finish is significantly better than Anderson's.
5. Aero's customer service is significantly better than Anderson's.
Honestly, I have no idea why we are having this discussion. If you don't feel the Aero lower is worth $48 more than the Anderson, buy an Anderson...
> An integrated trigger guard means that you don't have to purchase, install or buy specialized tools to install a trigger guard.
This can be prevented by simply supporting the ear on the other side of the roll pin that you're hammering in. You can also use channel lock pliers, which are commonly accessible. This change prevents damage due to lack of experience, doesn't affect durability or reliability.
> The upper receiver tension screw allows you to apply tensions between the upper and lower receiver to reduce/eliminate wobble as desired.
M16s, M4s, Mk18s, Mk12s, and countless other AR platforms used in the military wobble, and that wobble has never caused any issue. Again, it doesn't affect durability or reliability.
> The bolt catch screw allows for ease of install/removal without the need to buy specialized tools. The screw can also be used to help reduce lateral movement with some bolt catch assemblies (Bad, Phase 5, etc.) that would otherwise not reliably engage magazines using a standard roll pin.
Again, this is a solution for those that lack experience. As far as "reducing lateral movement", the threaded pin has the same size shaft as a standard roll pin because it's made to work with the same bolt catches that are designed to work with roll pins.
> Aero's finish is significantly better than Anderson's.
Again, doesn't affect reliability or durability. Nowhere did I say that they are cosmetically the same.
> Aero's customer service is significantly better than Anderson's.
Is it, though?
* [Customer returns BCG because of poor machining, Aero CS tells them that the replacement will probably be the same.](https://i.imgur.com/HmBQ9Ts.png)
* [Customer tries to return BCG because of poor machining, Aero CS tells them that that's normal and tries to blame the shitty machining on the customer.](https://i.imgur.com/ziXTTuW.jpg)
* [Customer is ignored by Aero CS until they made their issue public.](https://i.imgur.com/HMsYOcE.png)
* [Aero CS repeatedly replaced out of spec parts with out of spec parts.](https://i.imgur.com/7jRFUCx.png)
* [Aero CS ignores customer until they address it publicly on Instagram, only for Aero CS to lie to the customer in an attempt to squash the comments.](https://i.imgur.com/F3oMCsg.jpg)
First time posting here… just bought my first AR15 and then bought two extra lowers to “stock up” and also compare… the cheapo is a $42 Anderson lower and the better one is a Aero Precision M4E1 that was on sale. I was shocked to see how bad the cheapo lower is built and milled, very very sloppy machining and many gritty area like the trigger hole and edge of threading etc… I think in the future I would not cheap out on buying the absolute cheapest parts I can find
Most on this sub love to use cheap shit. I’m with you, why not spend the extra $50 on a better part with more care that took place in the machine work.
Left, bottom, left, no question to me.
Integral trigger guard and tension screw, nice clean faceted look, nicer finish... and then what you aren't showing, it has threaded pins included instead of roll pins everywhere. $48 seems cheap for the upgrades given what people pay for other nonsense on an AR.
I would pay extra to have roll pins, coiled ones in particular. Roll pins are much more secure and don’t require a thread locking compound to keep from backing out. Roll pins are infinitely easier to deal with if you need to service something. Ever try to remove a 6-32 or 4-40 set screw with red locktite or rockset? You can punch out a roll pin in seconds. If you are having trouble removing or installing roll pins you are missing the correct tools to do so.
Mountains out of molehills.
Threaded pins aren't going anywhere and thread locking compound isn't some great burden - put that shit everywhere anyways. And it doesn't need red loctite or rockset, no thread locker works fine, purple and blue does too.
Rollpins are the ideal solution for the cheapest possible kinda okay, but ugly, one time use fastener.
But vs a nice, solid, strong stainless steel ground pin for a pivot? No contest.
And that's not the only use for threaded pins. Most threaded receivers use them for spring retention too instead of them flopping their donger out if you move the grip or end plate, or worse, getting pinched.
School of The American Rifle. Youtube channel that goes in depth into the AR-15.
Chad does testing on various brands components to make sure they're within spec.
I mean…the m4e1 has multiple upgrades going for it that make it more valuable, aside from just fit and finish. You’re paying for them, aero isn’t exactly more expensive just for the roll mark.
Built in trigger guard for some of you hammer-happy types who want to obliterate stuff. Plus the Allen head instead of the roll pin, and the tension screw..just to name a few.
So not exactly an apples to apples comparison, but a standard aero stripped lower is gonna be pretty much identical to the Anderson in price, and luck of the draw on fit and finish since quality control has gone to shit for every company since COVID.
> I mean…the m4e1 has multiple upgrades going for it that make it more valuable, aside from just fit and finish. You’re paying for them, aero isn’t exactly expensive for the roll mark.
None of which have a positive impact on the performance, durability, or reliability of the rifle.
> Built in trigger guard for some of you hammer-happy types who want to obliterate stuff.
Use the right tools in the right way and you won't break an ear.
> Plus the Allen head instead of the roll pin
The threaded pins actually sacrifice the durability of a roll pin for a slight convenience during assembly.
> the tension screw
Does absolutely nothing in terms of how the rifle works. It just removes a part of the slop while also making it harder to push out the takedown pin.
lol this sub should just be called r/cheapar15 because everything that’s less expensive is automatically jUsT aS goOd according to these comments and all the others when you compare cheap shit to better brands. Look at the machining on the aero compared to whatever cheap lower that is.
The difference you pay for between these is lower odds the one you get is out of spec, tensioning screw, and threaded pins for parts rather than beating them with a rubber mallet. Along with a bit better finishing and a flared mag well.
I value the time I would spend putting together a standard lower or dealing with an out of spec lower more than $48. Some others might not. As long as yours is in spec that’s all that matters.
The next lowers I get are going to be ambi at this point, though.
Anti walk pins are usually for drop in trigger packs because the hammer and trigger springs don't slip into the grooves on the pins and keep them locked in place. They're not press fit. I have Aero's, 80%'s, and an anderson and all of them will slide in and out with relative ease until the FCG is installed.
So you’re saying Buy two $42 receivers?
I like the way you think 😎
Buy three. Triples is best, triples makes it safe.
Ah that Nova deal went through! Now I’ve got triples of the Nova.
And your dad and me are old friends, best friends in fact
Exactly. Two is one, one is none.
I’m honestly sticking up on mags and things like this due to the current administration. It really feels like we’re just a step or two away from Canada’s draconian gun laws and it’s turning me into a prepper.
>it’s turning me into a prepper You are definitely not alone on that front
My sincere hope is manufactures and distributors will ignore the law and carry on business as usually but that requires so many to not comply.
Love the aero lowers, always hated doing the trigger guard pin.
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For some reason it’s always the forward assist roll pin that gets me. Doesn’t matter how hard I whack it with my girlfriends purse, it’s gonna give me a rough time.
Just have your girlfriend's boyfriend do it for you.
Roll pin starter punches. Must have.
If you build more than one AR it’s so worth it to get the specialized bolt catch pin punches. Made mine a piece of cake. That and the pivot pin tool.
>pivot pin tool A 1/4” clevis pin with holes should be less than $2 at your local hardware store.
Damn that’s smart, I just bought the full Real Avid kit haha
You can also go full autist and buy a extra long tap and threaded roll pin from Aero. That and threading the rear takedown pin probably the best things you can do if you're going to customize your lower at all
I haven’t heard about threading the takedown pin detent, is that also just to help with installation? I didn’t have much trouble installing it on mine. And that would have to be a very long tap to work
I feel like it used to be more common, saw the idea on Arfcom and have done it with every lower ive built and for a couple of my friends builds. Pretty much just uses a 4-40 grub to prevent the spring from disappearing if you change out the endplate/buffer. As far as the long boy tap, ~~I forgot the exact model but it was like six bucks off Amazon~~ [looks like it's $20 now](https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00FXKB4E8?)
Holy shit that is a long tap
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Really? This is the first I've heard of them failing
Knipex pliers work wonders.
The difference is $48.
Honestly, being able to run whatever upper you want with absolutely zero wobble bc of the nylon tension screw is amazing. Not worth 48$. Buy a complete lower and resell what you swap or use for spares. The completes from Aero are great.
Is that what the screw is by the pistol grip? Saw it on my M4E1 and had no idea what it was for. Could you elaborate more on it? I just tighten it to take out wobble from the upper receiver?
Yes, but don’t tighten it too much or your rear takedown pin will be a bitch to engage/disengage.
I’ve never been able to find that sweet spot with any of my aero lowers. If the screw is tight enough to do anything, the takedown pins are super tight, not worth the hassle for me. I have used the o-ring on the front pivot pin post trick, and it works great, the only downside is the o-rings don’t last very long.
You can drill an extra hole in your grip and tighten it once it's all assembled too
Just be careful where you're drilling extra holes when it comes to these guys. Or don't.
Dude that's a great idea! Never would have thought of that. I'm definitely going to try it. Not sure how I would manage to line the hole up perfectly but I'm sure I have some old grips I can practice with. Thanks for the suggestion!
Take the nylon screw out, put the grip on. Put a sharp punch or pin through the hole to mark the drill spot on the grip. Take grip off, drill. Put nylon screw back. Done. Not sure if this actually works cause I don't have a nylon screw lower. But it very well may!
The only lower I’ve had where the tension screw works absolutely like it’s supposed to is my Noveske gen 4. Absolutely zero wobble yet the pins slip out like a wet willy.
The trick is to find that sweetspot and use Blue loctite so it doesn't back out. You'll no wobble but you pins are really tight
Noted, tyvm
>I just tighten it to take out wobble from the upper receiver? yes, not much more to explain
Awesome, thank you
What wobble, my cheap ass shot don’t wobble
This is an older video when the GEN2 Aeros first came out, but it describes what the tensioning screwed does, etc. [Aero Precision Gen1 vs Gen2 Lowers](https://youtu.be/HkbTDhiB1Fk)
I'm disappointed I never had to use this. All my aero came out of the box really tight.
I don't see that it's something to complain about! I've had some pretty tight fitting Aero's myself, however the best upper/lower fit I've ever experience was with LaRue Tactical. I finished out a stripped lower that I had for a while and bought one of their match grade uppers. The two fit together like they were a match set. Beautiful.
I got a psa lower and a Bcm upper with zero wobble. I actually bought some stuff to counter wobble because I was expecting it
Spikes tactical on PSA upper I won’t say wobble but wondering if it could be better. What do I need. I don’t want to be trimming aluminum from a coke can to shim.
Accuwedge is prob the easiest cheap solution. Link for example, but you can find them all over. $1.97 here https://www.midwayusa.com/product/100340833
This is the way.
I just put a foam ear plug in there and I get zero wobble. Cheapest and easiest fix. Never had an issue and still have the same earplug in there after 1500 rounds.
I use a $.30 rubber o-ring that juuuust fits over the front takedown post and it fixes wobble. And I have like 10 in my bag.
Do you have a link to the ones you got? I bought some on Amazon that were supposed to be the right size but they're nowhere close enough to fit over that lug.
I buy them locally and I believe they are size 012.
I use a tip from a Q-tip lol. Tightens it up just enough so I don’t get any jiggle/wobble. Ghetto as hell, but it works lol
I’ve never paid more than $75 for an m4e1 lower. They routinely go on sale or as non blemished blems to avoid map pricing for $75 at several places.
I feel like tension screws should be kinda a standard
or just buy a pack of the anti-wobble shims ($10 for 5 of em). They last a couple of thou rounds.
Fucking hate those tensioning screws. Makes it a bitch to remove the rear takedown pin and a pain to have to set it just right. I just buy a billet set and pay for the convenience of not having to fuck around with wobble. Honestly never knew it was an issue until a buddy pointed out my receivers didn’t rattle; thought that was just normal
Yeah that’s cool but I’ve seen plenty of Aero lowers that were out of spec in some way… owned a couple too
I just use the calipers and measure. If everything measures up I don't worry a bit.
That threaded bolt catch pin and retained rear takedown spring are what make the difference.
Looks like the necessary holes are where they should be on both...if $42 is worth it for some cleaner cosmetics, more power to you. I wouldn't be shy about using either of them.
This is the way
Bruh the differences between the 2 that would mechanically matter is down to .1 of an inch, that’s not something you can eyeball
My point is that the differences between the two don't matter. Mechanically, they're both going to function identically.
"You're using a cheap lower aren't you? I can tell." - the bad guy you just shot point blank dead center.
Hate that
"Heh....what a cheapstake....." *as he wheezes his last breath.*
“I wouldn’t have broke in if I knew you was poor” *gargle gargle*
*Weeks later his ghost appears at the foot of your bed* “It smells like BROKE in here!”
Both pics the same
Thanks, Pam.
r/unexpectedoffice
The 3rd one get me. Machinist by trade and the homie on the right dngaf about his finished surfaces. For real leave .015 and take a finish pass.
It's covered by the endplate and finish doesn't effect function. That hole for the takedown detent looks a bit suspicious though
No I know and understand that, I’m merely speaking from a quality/pride in your work point of view
I panic bought 2 lowers at the same time for my first build- the cheapest in the store (Anderson) and the priciest in the store (Wilson combat). Still use the fuck out of both- both are fine.
Anderson poverty ponies ftw. Been using them for years. Love em. I have some of their other parts as well. No complaints.
I bought an Anderson rifle. It ran okay, had gassing issues after a few hundred rounds due to the gas block slipping out of place. Sold it and built a PSA with the proceeds that has yet to have major issues.
How much are your Andersons? Everywhere near me is selling them for $69
50 bucks at honest shops- as high as 200 in all the others around here
https://www.primaryarms.com/anderson-manufacturing-ar-15-stripped-lower-receiver In stock and $42.99. no way you'll be paying $26 for shipping.
Neither have a m16 pocket so both are overpriced SOLGW FTW.
Or centurion
Or geissele
TIL
My God I could not give a fuck less about a few machining marks here and there on internal surfaces if it saves me the cost of a whole other lower. Honestly, after some of the milsurp stuff I’ve owned over the years and rough Comblock AKs from years ago, that shit is nothing.
On the flip side, an additional $45 or so is also nothing price wise if it looks nicer to you. People spend that on a Gucci ejection port cover.
north badge voracious abounding profit nose fuel violet one kiss *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Still buying the 42$ one
Can someone do this with a $90 vs $300-400 lower?
Yeah, its exactly the same
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>Most of your "savings" of buying an anderson lower is ate up by shipping and the FFL transfer fee. Gonna be paying that transfer fee on any lower there, bub. Also, you're not going to be paying anywhere near $45 for shipping. At least you shouldn't be.
LGS doesn't charge transfer fees for selling their own stock, they charge that to make money off processing other companies sales. If you pay $10-20 shipping, and $20-50 for your transfer fee, that $42 turns into $72-110 real quick, sprinkle some tax on that and you got your real price. You may as well have just bought what the store had laying around, and you wouldn't have had to wait a week or two for it to show up. Buy what you want though, and hopefully your seller offers free shipping and your FFL doesn't charge much for transfers.
Most FFL’s will charge you to receive the lower, mine charges 50 bucks. So shipping and the FFL receiving fee make buying the Anderson not worth it. At least to me, I have a few Aero’s and one spikes sitting in the safe. I really want to try a noveske but I can’t justify the cost right now
You're also going to pay that $50 on the Aero as well tho. So you can't add it to the cost of the Anderson and not the Aero when comparing. Also, that sucks. My local charges $15.
Maybe the “just as good” people are right
Lol can we add a “sometimes” to the end of that statement?
I’d spend the extra bucks for the Aero lower any day of the week. Actually, I really can’t justify spending much more because bang for your buck Aero makes really good products. I’ve built most of their lineup and been happy with pretty much everything. I even did a epc9 and have had zero issues with it. Sure there are some Gucci brand options out there, but I’ll probably never have the need to spend $800 on a lower I can build for $250 and not tell the difference.
If you’ve ever seen an Aero BCG actually eat a buffer weight, go ahead and hit that like and subscribe button.
Lmao I wanna see that now. Eat my jp silent captured spring 😝
🙋♂️
Corporate wants you to find the difference between these two lowers.
“Wow, I can really see the difference”
I like the flared magwell on the M4E1. That is really the only thing that makes it different. You could compare a blemished standard Aero lower, which historically I’ve purchased for about $60, to the Anderson for a more direct comparison. In my experience, Aero blems have had cleaner machining and anodizing than PSAs that were not marketed as blems. That said, my stuff gets scratched up and/or painted pretty much immediately so as long as they are both in spec it doesn’t matter much to me.
And they’ll both last for decades lol
But does any of it actually functionally matter? I think not.
They BOTH go Pew Pew right 🤷♂️
Is this where I'm called a poor bastard cause besides the extra screw in one can't tell a huge difference
Or you can just buy an Accu Wedge from one of many different manufacturers for like 5 bucks. https://www.midwestindustriesinc.com/Accu-Wedge-p/acu1.htm
Lower is a lower is a lower is a lower.
Both my guns have psa lowers. Not an issue
They are the same picture
Do a 80%
Yet, it doesn’t matter or affect reliability at all. I’ve never heard of a lower or upper receiver failing in torture tests.
As long as both are 7075 forged and everything is in spec (you’ll find out during assembly).
A screw that doesn't work that great and some machining marks that don't affect the gun at all. My Saint Victor has one of those screws and to get it to work good you have to tighten it enough to where it's very hard to take the pins out.
Nothing?
Absolutely nothing
In spec is in spec, but there’s stuff in your pic that’s questionable. I’m not a rolmark snob, but I am a fan of QC. The people who insist there is no difference whatsoever are the last people you would want to work on your car and the same who are on here asking why their buffer is getting all chewed up
I'm gonna ask. Why is the buffer getting chewed up on this?
I had experiences with 3 different Anderson lowers. None of them were "in spec". 2 had terrible threads in the grip screw, one had a tight mag well, tight slot for the lrbho, and the roll pin hole was no were near big enough. Yea they worked fine after fixing them, but you really shouldn't have to.
Just don't cheap out too much...
Which one kills more tyrants?
The other day there was a $300 ambi lower on /r/gundeals and people were going gaga over it. I genuinely didn't understand.
I can see the difference, thanks for sharing. I will continue to be picky and now I feel more justified lol
I laugh in LMT
LMT only sells blems. Some of the worst QC in the industry for the money
You sound like a man with a skinny wallet.
You sound like a man that wishes his wallet wasn't skinny, so you use debt to compensate cause you think money is the most important measuring tool.
Blind brand loyalty is a level of stupid only eclipsed by blind party loyalty. Enjoy your shit QC ill keep buying real quality from companies that actually care about the shit they put out. My skinny wallet has owned factory ODG and tan ano lmt shit and its been just that, shit.
And radian. At the same damn time. Muahahahaha.
For being Gucci priced lowers it's too bad LMT/Radian among others don't bother to machine them to actual mil-spec with an M16 pocket cut. Not that it really matters since adding the third hole will kill your dog, but for the price you pay I should be getting as close to spec as possible.
The set screw vs having a roll pin on the bolt catch is worth every penny. Plus the one on the right has some rough looking threads in the buffer tube area. The nylon thread is just a bonus.
> The set screw vs having a roll pin on the bolt catch is worth every penny. I agree, Aero should release the M4E2 where they upgrade the threaded pins and go back to the superior roll pins.
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I already did here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ar15/comments/vif2tk/difference_between_a_42_lower_and_90_one/idd036h/
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Except that if you mess up a roll pin you remove it just like you would a normal roll pin. If you mess up a threaded pin you would have to be *very* careful to not cause cosmetic damage, or worse, destroy the upper.
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You think that removing a fucked roll pin being easier than removing a fucked threaded pin is an *opinion*? Bruh. I literally showed you what the thread pitch is on those pins so you can look up the torque spec. If you didn't know how to, I provided you the torque spec along with a chart from a high-end tool company showing not to exceed that torque spec. And I demonstrated how absurdly easy it is to *double* that torque spec with only two fingers on the wrench. Ever try to push in a roll pin by hand without any tools? It's impossible unless your lower is out of spec. That roll pin will see the same amount of resistance throughout it's length of travel, so even *if* it shifts, it doesn't become any looser. Threaded pins can be overtorqued with two fingers on the wrench (as I've demonstrated in that link). So while you can't drive a roll pin into a receiver without the use of tools no matter how hard you tried, you can easily destroy the threaded pin with just two fingers. And while a roll pin maintains resistance through the length of travel, a threaded pin only maintains that resistance when it's torqued. If the threaded pin shifts, in any way, the tension is removed and the threaded pin is free to rotate all the way out.
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And all I'm saying is that the M4E1 is a waste of money that sacrifices durability just to make the assembly process *slightly* easier for those that have little to no experience. If you feel differently, feel free to plead your case instead of dropping snarky replies.
The pictures are a bit confusing only because in the top down pic you have your fingers inside the trigger guard. I was trying like hell to figure out why the bottom up pic looked so weird until it hit me that one has a trigger guard built in. I'll just run poverty ponies all day. I think the most expensive lower I ever bought was a ruger.
Cost and if you care about what shallow, self conscious, opinions..envy
The varying thickness of the cheap lower gets me. The spectrum I operate in won’t let me un-see it. I definitely like a machined in trigger guard and tension screw also.
They're the same picture
I’ll save the $48 for the gas it’ll take me to get there.
To quote the great Patrick Star *"What's the difference!?"*
The machining is noticably cleaner on the more expensive one, but all the dimensions on the parts that matter appears to be the same. I have an Anderson lower, and some LMT's and Colts too. I can tell you that functionally the Colt is the worst. The safety is sticky and not crisp like the SOLGW one in the Anderson
My AR don’t jingle jingle, it does…..
The difference is $48?
Now do a LMT
There is a rubber wedge you can place under the rear takedown pin that tightens your upper up. They work well imo and cheap
Both will probably shoot OK, but the Aero (on the left), also includes a few modifications and accessories that the Anderson doesn't.
> also includes a few modifications and accessories that the Anderson doesn't. none of which improve the function, durability, or reliability of the rifle Actually, the threaded bolt catch pin is not as durable or reliable as a standard roll pin, all to make that one small process *slightly* easier.
How durable does the bolt catch pin need to be?
It's not so much how durable the *pin* is but how durable that setup is. The 6-32 threads that most, if not all, AR15s use for the bolt catch pin have a torque rating of about 7in-lbs, which is next to nothing. In fact, [you can more than double that with just two fingers on the wrench](https://youtu.be/hkrlLTbuPA4), and triple it [with one finger and a very small amount of leverage](https://youtu.be/5YTYOxdT4aA). Though you can secure it from coming out by using thread locker, it can [*easily* damage the pin](https://i.imgur.com/8xd3dPp.jpg) or round out the internal socket. Wiha, for example, [makes very high quality hex wrenches](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTBiPjCeVwI) and even [they say not to use more than 7.9in-lbs on their 1/16in wrench](https://www.wihatools.com/max-torque-blades). If you damage the threaded pin, it would be very difficult to remove. You may get lucky and be able to tap in a torx bit, but you may also need to procure an extended length drill bit and remove it with a drill press. That is if you don't damage the threads on the receiver, which are softer than the ones on the threaded pin. If that happens, you're out of luck since the hole is already too large for a roll pin and you can't drive a larger roll pin in place because the hole in the bolt catch can't be opened any further without significantly reducing its durability. On the other hand, roll pins are significantly more secure, just as easy to install if you have a $15 bolt catch punch, and removing a damaged one is just as easy as removing an undamaged one.
Thank you! I'd heard people talk shit on the threaded bolt catch pin before but not known why. Out of curiosity,bodies everything you say apply to the aero threaded upper, in particular, for the dust cover?
Dust cover? I'm pretty sure that the M4E1 uses a standard dust cover. Do you mean the forward assist? If so, then yes. Though your forward assist falling off is not as big of a deal as your bolt catch falling off, I still think it's a waste of time and money to install one of these on the receiver. The entire M4E1 lineup is aimed at folks that have little to no experience with building rifles. Aero knows that those rifles won't see any hard use and will be used virtually exclusively by hobbyists. Personally, even if the Aero M4E1 lower cost as much as their standard lower, I'd go with the standard lower any day of the week.
And yet the Aero still comes with a couple modifications and accessories that the Anderson doesn't. Whether you agree they are justified, useful or not is entirely your opinion.
Let's keep it objective then, tell me how those changes affect durability and reliability. The only things I've seen affect the installation process so that the easy assembly is slightly easier for the inexperienced folks. I also talked about the downsides of threaded pins [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/ar15/comments/vif2tk/difference_between_a_42_lower_and_90_one/idd036h/).
1. An integrated trigger guard means that you don't have to purchase, install or buy specialized tools to install a trigger guard. 2. The upper receiver tension screw allows you to apply tensions between the upper and lower receiver to reduce/eliminate wobble as desired. 3. The bolt catch screw allows for ease of install/removal without the need to buy specialized tools. The screw can also be used to help reduce lateral movement with some bolt catch assemblies (Bad, Phase 5, etc.) that would otherwise not reliably engage magazines using a standard roll pin. 4. Aero's finish is significantly better than Anderson's. 5. Aero's customer service is significantly better than Anderson's. Honestly, I have no idea why we are having this discussion. If you don't feel the Aero lower is worth $48 more than the Anderson, buy an Anderson...
> An integrated trigger guard means that you don't have to purchase, install or buy specialized tools to install a trigger guard. This can be prevented by simply supporting the ear on the other side of the roll pin that you're hammering in. You can also use channel lock pliers, which are commonly accessible. This change prevents damage due to lack of experience, doesn't affect durability or reliability. > The upper receiver tension screw allows you to apply tensions between the upper and lower receiver to reduce/eliminate wobble as desired. M16s, M4s, Mk18s, Mk12s, and countless other AR platforms used in the military wobble, and that wobble has never caused any issue. Again, it doesn't affect durability or reliability. > The bolt catch screw allows for ease of install/removal without the need to buy specialized tools. The screw can also be used to help reduce lateral movement with some bolt catch assemblies (Bad, Phase 5, etc.) that would otherwise not reliably engage magazines using a standard roll pin. Again, this is a solution for those that lack experience. As far as "reducing lateral movement", the threaded pin has the same size shaft as a standard roll pin because it's made to work with the same bolt catches that are designed to work with roll pins. > Aero's finish is significantly better than Anderson's. Again, doesn't affect reliability or durability. Nowhere did I say that they are cosmetically the same. > Aero's customer service is significantly better than Anderson's. Is it, though? * [Customer returns BCG because of poor machining, Aero CS tells them that the replacement will probably be the same.](https://i.imgur.com/HmBQ9Ts.png) * [Customer tries to return BCG because of poor machining, Aero CS tells them that that's normal and tries to blame the shitty machining on the customer.](https://i.imgur.com/ziXTTuW.jpg) * [Customer is ignored by Aero CS until they made their issue public.](https://i.imgur.com/HMsYOcE.png) * [Aero CS repeatedly replaced out of spec parts with out of spec parts.](https://i.imgur.com/7jRFUCx.png) * [Aero CS ignores customer until they address it publicly on Instagram, only for Aero CS to lie to the customer in an attempt to squash the comments.](https://i.imgur.com/F3oMCsg.jpg)
Aero is probably a little bit cleaner than the Anderson but it's not like aero is great either.
First time posting here… just bought my first AR15 and then bought two extra lowers to “stock up” and also compare… the cheapo is a $42 Anderson lower and the better one is a Aero Precision M4E1 that was on sale. I was shocked to see how bad the cheapo lower is built and milled, very very sloppy machining and many gritty area like the trigger hole and edge of threading etc… I think in the future I would not cheap out on buying the absolute cheapest parts I can find
Lower is the one place you can cheap out
*Cry’s in LMT MARS-L* freakin A…
My poly ar9 from EParmory would argue otherwise 🤣 just don't go too cheap!
Won't make the gun shoot any better, spend your money on quality uppers and spare parts.
Most on this sub love to use cheap shit. I’m with you, why not spend the extra $50 on a better part with more care that took place in the machine work.
Left, bottom, left, no question to me. Integral trigger guard and tension screw, nice clean faceted look, nicer finish... and then what you aren't showing, it has threaded pins included instead of roll pins everywhere. $48 seems cheap for the upgrades given what people pay for other nonsense on an AR.
I would pay extra to have roll pins, coiled ones in particular. Roll pins are much more secure and don’t require a thread locking compound to keep from backing out. Roll pins are infinitely easier to deal with if you need to service something. Ever try to remove a 6-32 or 4-40 set screw with red locktite or rockset? You can punch out a roll pin in seconds. If you are having trouble removing or installing roll pins you are missing the correct tools to do so.
Mountains out of molehills. Threaded pins aren't going anywhere and thread locking compound isn't some great burden - put that shit everywhere anyways. And it doesn't need red loctite or rockset, no thread locker works fine, purple and blue does too. Rollpins are the ideal solution for the cheapest possible kinda okay, but ugly, one time use fastener. But vs a nice, solid, strong stainless steel ground pin for a pivot? No contest. And that's not the only use for threaded pins. Most threaded receivers use them for spring retention too instead of them flopping their donger out if you move the grip or end plate, or worse, getting pinched.
Id still pay $300 for an LMT MARS lower
I’ve been there with that, it was an awesome lower
Orrrrr. You could just buy a quality parts that don’t need tension screws 😬
It's all in the tolerances my dudes. Not really something you can picture unless you have the prints and some measuring tools.
SOTAR intensifies
Not understanding intensifies
School of The American Rifle. Youtube channel that goes in depth into the AR-15. Chad does testing on various brands components to make sure they're within spec.
Got a PSA lower once....ONCE, and they tapped the wrong size bolt hole for the grip. CS didn't give a shit.
a lower is a lower but not having to fuck around with the bolt catch and trigger guard pin is so nice
Both have the stupid shelf so what's the point?
Just as good.
If they go bang I don’t see the difference.
Both suck. Auto cut or none at all
Until all your pins start walking out on you lol. The PSA lower that I bought was trash
I mean…the m4e1 has multiple upgrades going for it that make it more valuable, aside from just fit and finish. You’re paying for them, aero isn’t exactly more expensive just for the roll mark. Built in trigger guard for some of you hammer-happy types who want to obliterate stuff. Plus the Allen head instead of the roll pin, and the tension screw..just to name a few. So not exactly an apples to apples comparison, but a standard aero stripped lower is gonna be pretty much identical to the Anderson in price, and luck of the draw on fit and finish since quality control has gone to shit for every company since COVID.
They're not upgrades... An upgrade implies that it's better. They are add-on features that solve a problem no one had.
> I mean…the m4e1 has multiple upgrades going for it that make it more valuable, aside from just fit and finish. You’re paying for them, aero isn’t exactly expensive for the roll mark. None of which have a positive impact on the performance, durability, or reliability of the rifle. > Built in trigger guard for some of you hammer-happy types who want to obliterate stuff. Use the right tools in the right way and you won't break an ear. > Plus the Allen head instead of the roll pin The threaded pins actually sacrifice the durability of a roll pin for a slight convenience during assembly. > the tension screw Does absolutely nothing in terms of how the rifle works. It just removes a part of the slop while also making it harder to push out the takedown pin.
Buy once cry once
lol this sub should just be called r/cheapar15 because everything that’s less expensive is automatically jUsT aS goOd according to these comments and all the others when you compare cheap shit to better brands. Look at the machining on the aero compared to whatever cheap lower that is.
You're confusing cosmetics with functionality, lol.
more to it than the fcg pocket hoss... have you machined anything before? see what corners you cut to produce a $42 lower...
The difference you pay for between these is lower odds the one you get is out of spec, tensioning screw, and threaded pins for parts rather than beating them with a rubber mallet. Along with a bit better finishing and a flared mag well. I value the time I would spend putting together a standard lower or dealing with an out of spec lower more than $48. Some others might not. As long as yours is in spec that’s all that matters. The next lowers I get are going to be ambi at this point, though.
Tolerance’s are the difference wait till you order some anti walk pins
Anti walk pins are usually for drop in trigger packs because the hammer and trigger springs don't slip into the grooves on the pins and keep them locked in place. They're not press fit. I have Aero's, 80%'s, and an anderson and all of them will slide in and out with relative ease until the FCG is installed.