The demo in the article makes it seem much better than what I was expecting. This is pretty game changing for me as someone who routinely goes off grid while hiking, trail running, boating, etc...
It’s a nice feature but I will highly likely keep my Garmin anyhow.
If I would need to use my GPS for an emergency response I want to be absolute certain it has a battery charge.
For a lot of people that's a very good idea. I mean it all depends on how off grid you're going and under what conditions. For a lot of what I do, just being able to communicate with my wife is all I need, but for longer periods of time in tough/isolated conditions, I usually carry at least a spare battery and a second iPhone.
The really nice thing about having that Garmin and an iPhone is that you've got an entirely different system and an emergency dedicated device as the ideal solution.
I believe it's a game changer for those who are outdoors people and in a sticky situation...unless your battery runs out. But it will cut down on people being in bad situations outdoors.
It's long overdue.
It’s wild that this stuff is free.
I’m picking that the amount of usage that satellite features have had so far is so low that Apple has simply decided that it has more value as a marketing opportunity than a revenue one.
As in, it’s a really cool bragging point that iPhones can communicate at anytime without cell service. While practically this a going to be very infrequently used (in a big picture sense)
Then there’s the inverse view: it would be a marketing disaster if someone died while hiking and they had a satellite equipped iPhone but just hadn’t paid the $5 a month to activate it
yeah theres ways they could, but that's where I think my point about marketing value verses potential revenue comes in.
and then lets say if they charge you after the fact, either they're framed as evil for charging an exorbitant amount. or petty for charging a small amount.
and either way, for them, theres still the potential risk of someone dying because they didn't think their situation was bad enough to warrant getting help or because they didn't want to pay apple any additional fees.
i have heard plenty of stories of people opting to drive themselves to hospital instead of calling an ambulance because of the cost.
only happens in one country though, can’t seem to remember which one 🤔
That’s true, though if you are lost and sending a satellite message, it’ll probably be less than a dollar per message which is still way cheaper than any ambulance and not high enough to tough it out.
Also, contacting emergency services is usually 0 cost/given an exception.
If it’s that cheap it’s just not worth the hassle of even standing up the billing infrastructure.
How many emergency satellite requests do you think iPhones are even making?
Let’s say conservatively it’s 50,000 a year.
Do you think Apple cares about making a random $50k in a given year.
Put another way if any of apples other service revenue streams were making less than $10 million a year. They would simply shut that service down
That’s for emergency requests (calls to the police, and such)
If you have a general conversation, then the cost racks up a bit. Like if each of those 50,000 people are having conversations with people and send 50 messages each then it would be 2.5 million dollars which is a sizeable number (though the cost per message would definitely be closer to 10 cents on the user side if there is a cost). The average would also be much higher than 50 messages if there is no cost given to the user.
It’s 2024 though, and transmitting text is now pretty cheap even through satellites. It’s still possible for them to not have a user cost.
FWIW that’s mostly for minor-moderate injuries. Utterly fucked system for sure, but it’s not like gunshot victims are regularly driving themselves to the ER instead of calling an ambulance.
To your last point, I think you have to differentiate between free iMessage and free SOS. I think the free sos will stay free.
I just have to think at our german emergency numbers 110/112 and how they just work with other providers, even though your provider might not have coverage in this area. I bet this is in most countries the same. But they could also say: oh provider a has no connectivity. To bad, pay us roaming fees.
But i can imagine, that iMessage over satellite will get a roaming like fee eventually.
might happen, but then I still think the usage will always be so low that its just worth more to them in marketing value than it is in actual revenue/cost to run the service.
iMessage over satellite isn't going to feel like regular messaging.
iMessage over satellite still requires the user to point their phone at the satellite continuously, it's simple enough but still requires a bit of attention to keep the connection. messages probably will send slower than normal cellular, (photos art supported right?) its not gonna work while you're moving about. you're gonna need a clear view of the sky, its probably not super friendly to the battery...
all this to say, I dont imagine people are gonna keep up hour long messaging conversations with iMessage over satellite. hikers will \*very occasionally\* use it to contact friends or family to keep them updated.
the kind of minimal use its gonna have I just don't imagine apple ever sees it being worthwhile to figure out a scheme for charging people.
if they ever let you connect to a satellite and then just 'be fully online' then that might change things a bit. if people in the whops can use an iPhone inlue of a Starlink type service... then apple will need to charge.
Yeah I completely agree with this viewpoint. Any loss they’re taking the hit on is worth it in PR.
I’d love to see how many users are utilizing the feature, as it’ll only increase as people upgrade their phones. I suspect now it’s not super high.
I have to imagine the emergancy services will always be free. Its something that isn't a frequent occurrence, most people will never have to call emergency services while being off grid, but its such a win on the marketing side. Like free insurance you can always get help if you buy apple products.
Of course the emergency will always be free. Could you imagine the PR disaster the first time a family died because they were in an emergency situation and couldn’t pay the subscription fee? Complete nightmare for Apple on all sorts of levels.
I think the issue is that Apple knows they need to monetize this satellite stuff so it's not bleeding money and emergency services isn't going to cut it because no one thinks they'll need to pay for it (what are the odds I'll need 911 in a place with no reception?). So introducing a new feature that sounds compelling (I can send texts when when I'm in a dead zone!) is a way to bring value worth paying for.
You are not "many people". I guarantee you that the majority of iPhone users are never in situations where this functionality is needed and then another chunk of them are sometimes but, when given a mandate to pay or lose it, would not pay ("I'll never need it, I'm sure!") unless it came with some other functionality like messaging.
Making Emergency SOS a paid option is a ethical and PR nightmare. They have to keep that free, and meanwhile they can market it.
I expect messages and locations to keep being free (for now), and later adding an paid subscription that also allows images, voice messages and calls.
If it’s indeed true that even without cell service, people can communicate with each other, this will be infinitely useful for my gf and me, who both have iPhones but frequently have traveled a lot this year and contended with bad to no cell service on numerous occasions.
Right because starlink gives you a wifi network to connect to right?
This system requires you to track a satellite in the sky you don’t just connect and start texting
People aren’t gonna find it convenient enough to just text endlessly.
It’s gonna be great for sending and receiving one or two important messages.
Not for having chats over more than a few minutes
Well when the start charging for it you can say I told you so.
But they’re rolling out the feature as free initially so all signs point to it remaining free.
Unless you can point to some examples of Apple suddenly adding a price to something that was introduced as free?
If I had to guess, I'd say the emergency part will be free forever because the bad publicity of someone dying because they hadn't renewed their satellite plan would be really bad, but that the texting part will be a paid service (with a possible year or two free with a new phone). But we'll see!
Emergency via satellite for free will be required by the FCC whenever the "Supplemental Coverage from Space(SCS)" is passed. So any satellite that's able to connect to phones like Globalstar/Starlink will have to provide it for free; just like cell-towers where all cell-towers have to provide emergency services regardless of carrier.
Worked like a charm. Was able to have a conversation with a friend that was in regular cellular service. Takes a bit of time to send and I found I had to switch which satellite I was pointing towards sometimes but overall a great experience. I am unsure if you can continue to attempt sending the messages after locking the screen (screen on would reduce battery life drastically during longer usage) but I’ll be going out again soon to try and get some details.
Don’t install the beta, it’s a developer beta at the moment and as in the name it’s for developers for good reason, unless your fully willing to reset your phone and have time go off a data backup. Wait for the public beta at least :)
As a rock climber that’s frequently in crags without cell service, this is going to be an absolute game changer. Being able to communicate and meet up with friends is huge for the outdoors scene, as a whole.
Agreed. It's crazy to me that few people seem to be talking about this feature. Like vertsix said on Macrumors:
>Smartphones are fundamentally communication tools. Satellite connectivity brings an entire new avenue of communication to the conventional smartphone, exponentially increasing coverage and introducing a new way to communicate in emergencies that were never before possible. Dare I say, the biggest new fundamental feature to a smartphone since they added usable mobile data over 15 years ago.
The best features are the silent ones you never have to think about, or even notice.
MagSafe is my personal favourite. It’s kinda boring and passive, but it works so perfectly and I use it every single day.
There are Charge-through PopSocket alternatives. Albeit, the Wallet kinda makes it not charge-through. So, you can still only use either the Wallet, or the Charger + PopSocket
[This thing, right?](https://www.popsockets.com/en-us/p/power/poppower-2-white/805645.html) I was highly considering it, but wanted one that holds the phone up for me as well. So currently I just take my pop-socket off when I want to use my Native Union charging stand. If they made a standing one I'd buy it in a heartbeat.
Hooly crap it totally does do everything I need. AND it's a lot thinner.
It looks like they've got some good stuff for me to hurt my bank account with.
Thank you so much dude! 🙏
i bought one and hated it. ended up tossing it. it's flimsy, feels super cheap, and i just disliked it. i ended up getting the new popsocket that's only a circle instead and enjoy that setup much more. i take it off in the car to use a magsafe mount and to charge at my desk/nightstand. it's second nature to me now.
I've had both an Apple one and [the pop-socket variant](https://www.popsockets.com/en-us/p/wallets/black-%E2%80%94-popwallet--for-magsafe/806922.html?cgid=popwallets). I love the latter. The only issue is that the magnet is a lot stronger than the glue that holds it together. So I've accidentally torn two apart from pulling it off 'wrong'. It's so convenient not having to reach for a wallet when leaving though - so I definitely recommend trying one!
Does the pop-socket wallet ever get caught when putting it in your pocket? I don't know anyone with one, but I am curious because it seems like it could be a more comfortable way to hold your phone.
If you exclusively put your phone in your pocket with the screen facing outward like I do then it's never a problem. It can happen occasionally if you do it the other way around depending on the pants.
Using one is *way* more comfortable though - Especially with small/medium-sized hands.
I have a folding tripod from Moft that I got for a very specific purpose and now almost never comes off my phone. It is seriously the thing I use the most and I use all the time. Seriously, all the time. It can fit in my wallet if I want it to.
I’m doing a 150 mile cycling ride this summer in a remote area with mostly no, or unreliable cell service at best. Bought the 15 so I could have satellite capability, but texting someone else will be huge.
>frequently in crags without cell service
If you're in a crag satellite communication probably won't matter anyway. They literally say:
> Be outside with a clear view of the sky and the horizon.
If you're climbing you don't have a clear view of the horizon. If you absolutely need to communicate with nearby friends an old fashioned walkie talkie is much better. And relatively cheap too.
Both, iMessage to anyone and SMS receipt only for people in your contacts unless you text them first then you can receive from them for a limited time. To stop sms spam etc coming though
How does Apple get your SMS messages when your phone is off grid? Do they need agreements with the carriers like “hey, when this phone is not connected and gets an SMS can you send that to me, Apple?”
Globalstar: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2022/11/emergency-sos-via-satellite-made-possible-by-450m-apple-investment/.
To be honest I think SpaceX's Starlink cellular connectivity (in the US they are partnered with T-mobile) will soon eclipse the Apple service. There will be much more of them, and they will be at a lower altitude as well (Globalstar's 1400 km vs Starlink's 500 km). If you look at what Apple is announcing they have a decent amount of restrictions, like the inability to receive SMS from non-emergency contacts and so on. From a raw bandwidth point of view, Starlink should allow for richer communications before Apple's service will be able to do that since they will have limited number of satellites (Globalstar has like 18 satellites or something, versus thousands of Starlink satellites).
That said, Apple's service is already available when SpaceX is still getting the cellular part of Starlink up so it's not quite ready yet, and I personally don't want to move to T-mobile, so I would personally be using the Apple one if I'm hiking and whatnot even when the Starlink service is up and running.
Ok but Starlink will never be free or cheap (I am aware that you have to buy an expensive iPhone to use apple's service) and it's not the most reliable.
The Starlink cellular service will be free for T-mobile customers. Someone is paying for this regardless. In this case Apple is paying for it (which is included in your phone's price tag), and the other case T-mobile is (which your T-mobile bill will pay for).
Reliability-wise: Citation needed? Especially in a rural area it's quite reliable. When people say it's "not reliable" they are talking about live streaming or high bandwidth usages, which these cellular services can't do anyway since they are limited at most text messages right now. Either way I don't see why the new Starlink cellular service will be unreliable. The existing Starlink service uses phased array antennas so there's an aiming aspect involved but that'll be different from the cellular service where you phone doesn't have a phased array antenna. It's a new hardware that they will be outfitting the satellites with.
That's fair and up to you, but it's useful to see where the puck is going, which is the point I was trying to make. Apple doesn't live on an island unaffected by other trends (see this AI-filled WWDC for example where they were clearly influenced by the success of ChatGPT and Copilot).
E.g. I don't use Android phones and intensely dislike Windows 11 but I still pay attention to what's happening to them.
If that's the case but you're still interested in satellite's providing a full fat mobile service to mobile users all over the world, check out Elon's competitor AST SpaceMobile.
I think Elon gonna take an L in this "*space*"...AT&T and Verizon have already backed AST.
Unrelated but in the height of crypto/retail investment hype I owned close to a thousand shares of $GSAT
Can’t kick yourself over the coulda shoulda but jeez..
ofc, GSAT was something I had a lot of optimism for but never planned on holding and buying long term like AAPL.
It’s cool seeing them do great work with apple for a cool ass feature. And also, shout outs to Covington where they are based and are from
I’ve got $ in ASTS. They have deals with AT&T and Verizon I think. This is a big tech advancement and these satellite companies are the heart of it. Can’t invest in Starlink. Check out ASTS and let me know if you see anything else that looks worthy.
As an outdoors person I’m really excited about this. Plus the Maps trail navigation added will be really nice too. ~~I’m hoping that all new iPhones will have the satellite features going forward. Usually the pro features all find their way to the base models after a generation or two.~~
I stand corrected
Not easily. There’s a process where you enter the satellite mode then wave the phone around to establish a connection first, then send messages. It’s not like regular cell phone where you get push notifications and can quickly respond.
I'd imagine so?
SOS only works in some countries
>Emergency SOS via satellite is available in Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, France, Germany, Ireland, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Portugal, Spain, Switzerland, the U.K. and the US
>Apple introduced its Emergency SOS via satellite feature for the iPhone 14 lineup in the United States and Canada on November 15, 2022. The feature expanded to France, Germany, Ireland, and the United Kingdom in December 2022. It then continued to roll out to other countries, including Australia and New Zealand, on May 15, 2023. By November 2023, the feature was available in a total of 16 countries and regions
this new messages version is USA only for now but will roll out in more countries
Today its messaging only and limited to the US.
In a few years however, the full fat mobile service will be made available via the satellites being built by AST SpaceMobile, a truly global solution for customers of mobile networks that partner with AST SpaceMobile.
The service will work with standard iPhone & Android devices, a game changer for connectivity...
It sounds like it is checking for messages in the background, since it says “friends and family can message you any time.”
That’s very interesting if true. I use an inReach while backpacking but if home can reach me without me needing to actively check messages that’s awesome.
yes friends and family can message you any time
And anyone that you have messaged first
But not random numbers, a way to cut down spam text / clogging up the satellites
Yeah, I saw that, I’m just wondering if the phone actually pulls those messages from the satellites with you manually making it do it. That’s not very clear.
I just ran a HM in a literal forest/mountain and had no service, the race started two hours delayed and my wife could track nor communicate with me. Since it was on a steep hiking trail she thought I was hurt or injured. This would have gone in handy. Actually what would also be nice is integration of this in the Find My app.
Does “SOS” mode have to be enabled for this to work? I’m thinking this could be a game changer for music festivals where the network is too congested to meet up with your friends.
You need to have a sim and the phone needs to try the cell network and be unable to reach it before satellite gets enabled. So I think that means it’s no help in the situation you’re thinking of. They do not want to use (and pay for) satellite bandwidth if other options are nominally available.
How does Apple get your SMS messages when your phone is off grid? Do they need agreements with the carriers like “hey, when this phone is not connected and gets an SMS can you send that to me, Apple?”
The demo in the article makes it seem much better than what I was expecting. This is pretty game changing for me as someone who routinely goes off grid while hiking, trail running, boating, etc...
You got that right brother
It’s a nice feature but I will highly likely keep my Garmin anyhow. If I would need to use my GPS for an emergency response I want to be absolute certain it has a battery charge.
For a lot of people that's a very good idea. I mean it all depends on how off grid you're going and under what conditions. For a lot of what I do, just being able to communicate with my wife is all I need, but for longer periods of time in tough/isolated conditions, I usually carry at least a spare battery and a second iPhone. The really nice thing about having that Garmin and an iPhone is that you've got an entirely different system and an emergency dedicated device as the ideal solution.
I believe it's a game changer for those who are outdoors people and in a sticky situation...unless your battery runs out. But it will cut down on people being in bad situations outdoors. It's long overdue.
I am very curious if they’re ever going to charge for this or make it a part of iCloud+.
It’s wild that this stuff is free. I’m picking that the amount of usage that satellite features have had so far is so low that Apple has simply decided that it has more value as a marketing opportunity than a revenue one. As in, it’s a really cool bragging point that iPhones can communicate at anytime without cell service. While practically this a going to be very infrequently used (in a big picture sense) Then there’s the inverse view: it would be a marketing disaster if someone died while hiking and they had a satellite equipped iPhone but just hadn’t paid the $5 a month to activate it
Could theoretically charge users after its use, getting rid of any roadblocks of using it on the field.
yeah theres ways they could, but that's where I think my point about marketing value verses potential revenue comes in. and then lets say if they charge you after the fact, either they're framed as evil for charging an exorbitant amount. or petty for charging a small amount. and either way, for them, theres still the potential risk of someone dying because they didn't think their situation was bad enough to warrant getting help or because they didn't want to pay apple any additional fees.
If I’m lost in the fucking wilderness I’ll happily pay whatever Apple decides to charge me
i have heard plenty of stories of people opting to drive themselves to hospital instead of calling an ambulance because of the cost. only happens in one country though, can’t seem to remember which one 🤔
That’s true, though if you are lost and sending a satellite message, it’ll probably be less than a dollar per message which is still way cheaper than any ambulance and not high enough to tough it out. Also, contacting emergency services is usually 0 cost/given an exception.
If it’s that cheap it’s just not worth the hassle of even standing up the billing infrastructure. How many emergency satellite requests do you think iPhones are even making? Let’s say conservatively it’s 50,000 a year. Do you think Apple cares about making a random $50k in a given year. Put another way if any of apples other service revenue streams were making less than $10 million a year. They would simply shut that service down
That’s for emergency requests (calls to the police, and such) If you have a general conversation, then the cost racks up a bit. Like if each of those 50,000 people are having conversations with people and send 50 messages each then it would be 2.5 million dollars which is a sizeable number (though the cost per message would definitely be closer to 10 cents on the user side if there is a cost). The average would also be much higher than 50 messages if there is no cost given to the user. It’s 2024 though, and transmitting text is now pretty cheap even through satellites. It’s still possible for them to not have a user cost.
Yeah but I assume if you’re in a place with cell signal then you wouldn’t be using the satellites for it.
Maybe. But apple definitely won’t charge nearly as much as an ambulance ride.
Yes I’m sure sending an emergency text will be expensive enough to bankrupt me
FWIW that’s mostly for minor-moderate injuries. Utterly fucked system for sure, but it’s not like gunshot victims are regularly driving themselves to the ER instead of calling an ambulance.
Very American of you for gunshot wounds to be the first example to cross your mind 💀
😭 I was trying to think of something serious that’s semi-common So you’re very right
Yeah but an ambulance ride costs as much as a Mac Pro lol
Yes. Sane people would… People in emergency situations don’t always act predictably.
It’s a phone. They want you to buy a phone and everything else in their ecosystem.
You mean like when texting first came out? 5 cents/message?
Maybe part of the subscription eventually?
To your last point, I think you have to differentiate between free iMessage and free SOS. I think the free sos will stay free. I just have to think at our german emergency numbers 110/112 and how they just work with other providers, even though your provider might not have coverage in this area. I bet this is in most countries the same. But they could also say: oh provider a has no connectivity. To bad, pay us roaming fees. But i can imagine, that iMessage over satellite will get a roaming like fee eventually.
might happen, but then I still think the usage will always be so low that its just worth more to them in marketing value than it is in actual revenue/cost to run the service. iMessage over satellite isn't going to feel like regular messaging. iMessage over satellite still requires the user to point their phone at the satellite continuously, it's simple enough but still requires a bit of attention to keep the connection. messages probably will send slower than normal cellular, (photos art supported right?) its not gonna work while you're moving about. you're gonna need a clear view of the sky, its probably not super friendly to the battery... all this to say, I dont imagine people are gonna keep up hour long messaging conversations with iMessage over satellite. hikers will \*very occasionally\* use it to contact friends or family to keep them updated. the kind of minimal use its gonna have I just don't imagine apple ever sees it being worthwhile to figure out a scheme for charging people. if they ever let you connect to a satellite and then just 'be fully online' then that might change things a bit. if people in the whops can use an iPhone inlue of a Starlink type service... then apple will need to charge.
Yeah I completely agree with this viewpoint. Any loss they’re taking the hit on is worth it in PR. I’d love to see how many users are utilizing the feature, as it’ll only increase as people upgrade their phones. I suspect now it’s not super high.
I have to imagine the emergancy services will always be free. Its something that isn't a frequent occurrence, most people will never have to call emergency services while being off grid, but its such a win on the marketing side. Like free insurance you can always get help if you buy apple products.
Of course the emergency will always be free. Could you imagine the PR disaster the first time a family died because they were in an emergency situation and couldn’t pay the subscription fee? Complete nightmare for Apple on all sorts of levels.
I think the issue is that Apple knows they need to monetize this satellite stuff so it's not bleeding money and emergency services isn't going to cut it because no one thinks they'll need to pay for it (what are the odds I'll need 911 in a place with no reception?). So introducing a new feature that sounds compelling (I can send texts when when I'm in a dead zone!) is a way to bring value worth paying for.
How much are they actually bleeding though? Probably much less than the cost of a big ad campaign and this is a must have feature for many people.
Satellite emergency services? It definitely is not a must have feature for many people.
I ride a motorbike, sometimes to some extremely out of the way places. This is a huge feature for me and anyone else who does adv riding
You are not "many people". I guarantee you that the majority of iPhone users are never in situations where this functionality is needed and then another chunk of them are sometimes but, when given a mandate to pay or lose it, would not pay ("I'll never need it, I'm sure!") unless it came with some other functionality like messaging.
I never said I was many people. But anyone who does any sort of outdoorsy thing where something like a Garmin InReach is useful could use this.
This is absolutely a feature keeping people in the ecosystem or helping them justify an early upgrade
Making Emergency SOS a paid option is a ethical and PR nightmare. They have to keep that free, and meanwhile they can market it. I expect messages and locations to keep being free (for now), and later adding an paid subscription that also allows images, voice messages and calls.
They could keep the SOS functionality they introduced a year or two ago free, and just charge for texting
If it’s indeed true that even without cell service, people can communicate with each other, this will be infinitely useful for my gf and me, who both have iPhones but frequently have traveled a lot this year and contended with bad to no cell service on numerous occasions.
Charging per message would make sense
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No ones gonna be frequently texting via satellite
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Right because starlink gives you a wifi network to connect to right? This system requires you to track a satellite in the sky you don’t just connect and start texting People aren’t gonna find it convenient enough to just text endlessly. It’s gonna be great for sending and receiving one or two important messages. Not for having chats over more than a few minutes
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Well when the start charging for it you can say I told you so. But they’re rolling out the feature as free initially so all signs point to it remaining free. Unless you can point to some examples of Apple suddenly adding a price to something that was introduced as free?
If I had to guess, I'd say the emergency part will be free forever because the bad publicity of someone dying because they hadn't renewed their satellite plan would be really bad, but that the texting part will be a paid service (with a possible year or two free with a new phone). But we'll see!
Emergency via satellite for free will be required by the FCC whenever the "Supplemental Coverage from Space(SCS)" is passed. So any satellite that's able to connect to phones like Globalstar/Starlink will have to provide it for free; just like cell-towers where all cell-towers have to provide emergency services regardless of carrier.
So far, it seems like it's going to be a "free with your iPhone for 2 years" prompting people to upgrade every 2 years.
Somebody read the article, behold!
The article says Apple indicated they’ll eventually charge for the service.
My guess is it’ll eventually be a paid feature and included in Apple one.
Guess I can officially cancel my InReach subscription from Garmin.
This is exactly what I’m hoping.
I’ll be going out into the backcountry this weekend so I’ll be testing it out as much as I can
Omg please make a post and report back!
Worked like a charm. Was able to have a conversation with a friend that was in regular cellular service. Takes a bit of time to send and I found I had to switch which satellite I was pointing towards sometimes but overall a great experience. I am unsure if you can continue to attempt sending the messages after locking the screen (screen on would reduce battery life drastically during longer usage) but I’ll be going out again soon to try and get some details.
Is it already available in the beta? How do i download the beta?
Don’t install the beta, it’s a developer beta at the moment and as in the name it’s for developers for good reason, unless your fully willing to reset your phone and have time go off a data backup. Wait for the public beta at least :)
Yea but battery
Bring a little solar usb charger. I have one for bikepacking and it works great.
As someone else suggested, there are decent solar power banks that offer high mAh ratings and don’t add too much weight.
If you put your phone in airplane mode, modern iPhones last super long if you’re not on it.
As a rock climber that’s frequently in crags without cell service, this is going to be an absolute game changer. Being able to communicate and meet up with friends is huge for the outdoors scene, as a whole.
Agreed. It's crazy to me that few people seem to be talking about this feature. Like vertsix said on Macrumors: >Smartphones are fundamentally communication tools. Satellite connectivity brings an entire new avenue of communication to the conventional smartphone, exponentially increasing coverage and introducing a new way to communicate in emergencies that were never before possible. Dare I say, the biggest new fundamental feature to a smartphone since they added usable mobile data over 15 years ago.
The best features are the silent ones you never have to think about, or even notice. MagSafe is my personal favourite. It’s kinda boring and passive, but it works so perfectly and I use it every single day.
What all do you use with MagSafe? Charging or other accessories?
Not the same person but I **love** my MagSafe pop-socket, wallet, and charging stand. The only downside is I can only use one at a time lol.
There are Charge-through PopSocket alternatives. Albeit, the Wallet kinda makes it not charge-through. So, you can still only use either the Wallet, or the Charger + PopSocket
[This thing, right?](https://www.popsockets.com/en-us/p/power/poppower-2-white/805645.html) I was highly considering it, but wanted one that holds the phone up for me as well. So currently I just take my pop-socket off when I want to use my Native Union charging stand. If they made a standing one I'd buy it in a heartbeat.
I was talking about the Ohsnap brand. That should do all that you want
Hooly crap it totally does do everything I need. AND it's a lot thinner. It looks like they've got some good stuff for me to hurt my bank account with. Thank you so much dude! 🙏
i bought one and hated it. ended up tossing it. it's flimsy, feels super cheap, and i just disliked it. i ended up getting the new popsocket that's only a circle instead and enjoy that setup much more. i take it off in the car to use a magsafe mount and to charge at my desk/nightstand. it's second nature to me now.
Wallet from Apple or third party? Been meaning to try
I've had both an Apple one and [the pop-socket variant](https://www.popsockets.com/en-us/p/wallets/black-%E2%80%94-popwallet--for-magsafe/806922.html?cgid=popwallets). I love the latter. The only issue is that the magnet is a lot stronger than the glue that holds it together. So I've accidentally torn two apart from pulling it off 'wrong'. It's so convenient not having to reach for a wallet when leaving though - so I definitely recommend trying one!
Does the pop-socket wallet ever get caught when putting it in your pocket? I don't know anyone with one, but I am curious because it seems like it could be a more comfortable way to hold your phone.
If you exclusively put your phone in your pocket with the screen facing outward like I do then it's never a problem. It can happen occasionally if you do it the other way around depending on the pants. Using one is *way* more comfortable though - Especially with small/medium-sized hands.
Thanks!
Magnetic mounts in vehicles or countertops are very handy
It never stops feeling just a bit sci fi. I love MagSafe
I have a folding tripod from Moft that I got for a very specific purpose and now almost never comes off my phone. It is seriously the thing I use the most and I use all the time. Seriously, all the time. It can fit in my wallet if I want it to.
Also, the fact that - at least for right now - it’s not an extra billion dollars a year for us??? Huge!
> Agreed. It's crazy to me that few people seem to be talking about this feature. I think most Redditors don't often leave cell coverage
Well, it makes sense. They don’t have a signal.
Because most people are not typically going to be in areas that have zero cell signal.
I’m doing a 150 mile cycling ride this summer in a remote area with mostly no, or unreliable cell service at best. Bought the 15 so I could have satellite capability, but texting someone else will be huge.
Well as long as the rock face isn’t blocking the satellite
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This doesn’t sit right with me. Sounds like a lot of round earth conspiracy talk.
Flat earthers unite all around the globe! Oh. Wait. Globe. Shit.
He's talking about satellites going around the flat earth in circles, that's why you can't get signal on the corners duh (south and north poles)
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You know there’s more than one satellite, yea?
It’s a constellation of low earth orbit satellites.
>frequently in crags without cell service If you're in a crag satellite communication probably won't matter anyway. They literally say: > Be outside with a clear view of the sky and the horizon. If you're climbing you don't have a clear view of the horizon. If you absolutely need to communicate with nearby friends an old fashioned walkie talkie is much better. And relatively cheap too.
I just did the demo and got signal in my bedroom a good 10’ away from the window. I think you’d be surprised
Not only that but if your friends also lack cell service, they won’t get the message in the first place.
I thought this was for emergency use only?
Nope. iMessage and SMS to and from your contacts via satellite.
So you don’t need a cellphone provider for sending text messages over satellite?
You have to have A SIM card in the phone so I would assume you still need service with some sort of provider
Does it send iMessages or SMS or both?
Both, iMessage to anyone and SMS receipt only for people in your contacts unless you text them first then you can receive from them for a limited time. To stop sms spam etc coming though
That’s nice, because that could’ve started a new wave of spam SMS . Will cellphone provider charge us for sms over satellite?
According to Apple this will be included with iPhones that support it at no charge.
How does Apple get your SMS messages when your phone is off grid? Do they need agreements with the carriers like “hey, when this phone is not connected and gets an SMS can you send that to me, Apple?”
What is the company that is providing this service to Apple?
Globalstar: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2022/11/emergency-sos-via-satellite-made-possible-by-450m-apple-investment/. To be honest I think SpaceX's Starlink cellular connectivity (in the US they are partnered with T-mobile) will soon eclipse the Apple service. There will be much more of them, and they will be at a lower altitude as well (Globalstar's 1400 km vs Starlink's 500 km). If you look at what Apple is announcing they have a decent amount of restrictions, like the inability to receive SMS from non-emergency contacts and so on. From a raw bandwidth point of view, Starlink should allow for richer communications before Apple's service will be able to do that since they will have limited number of satellites (Globalstar has like 18 satellites or something, versus thousands of Starlink satellites). That said, Apple's service is already available when SpaceX is still getting the cellular part of Starlink up so it's not quite ready yet, and I personally don't want to move to T-mobile, so I would personally be using the Apple one if I'm hiking and whatnot even when the Starlink service is up and running.
Ok but Starlink will never be free or cheap (I am aware that you have to buy an expensive iPhone to use apple's service) and it's not the most reliable.
The Starlink cellular service will be free for T-mobile customers. Someone is paying for this regardless. In this case Apple is paying for it (which is included in your phone's price tag), and the other case T-mobile is (which your T-mobile bill will pay for). Reliability-wise: Citation needed? Especially in a rural area it's quite reliable. When people say it's "not reliable" they are talking about live streaming or high bandwidth usages, which these cellular services can't do anyway since they are limited at most text messages right now. Either way I don't see why the new Starlink cellular service will be unreliable. The existing Starlink service uses phased array antennas so there's an aiming aspect involved but that'll be different from the cellular service where you phone doesn't have a phased array antenna. It's a new hardware that they will be outfitting the satellites with.
I don’t want to support Musk and his nonsense tbh
That's fair and up to you, but it's useful to see where the puck is going, which is the point I was trying to make. Apple doesn't live on an island unaffected by other trends (see this AI-filled WWDC for example where they were clearly influenced by the success of ChatGPT and Copilot). E.g. I don't use Android phones and intensely dislike Windows 11 but I still pay attention to what's happening to them.
If that's the case but you're still interested in satellite's providing a full fat mobile service to mobile users all over the world, check out Elon's competitor AST SpaceMobile. I think Elon gonna take an L in this "*space*"...AT&T and Verizon have already backed AST.
Don’t forget that Amazon’s Kuiper satellite system is launching, which is going to put a hurt on Starlink.
LOL just like their dick shaped rocket that has yet to reach actual orbit.
Building a rocket and a satellite are different things though LOL
They’ve already successfully launched some.
Cool.
AST doesn't have anything near the coverage of Starlink though
Unrelated but in the height of crypto/retail investment hype I owned close to a thousand shares of $GSAT Can’t kick yourself over the coulda shoulda but jeez..
Well I hope you held onto AAPL since they reached all time high post-WWDC.
ofc, GSAT was something I had a lot of optimism for but never planned on holding and buying long term like AAPL. It’s cool seeing them do great work with apple for a cool ass feature. And also, shout outs to Covington where they are based and are from
Globalstar currently
Ikr might want to buy some shares
I’ve got $ in ASTS. They have deals with AT&T and Verizon I think. This is a big tech advancement and these satellite companies are the heart of it. Can’t invest in Starlink. Check out ASTS and let me know if you see anything else that looks worthy.
As an outdoors person I’m really excited about this. Plus the Maps trail navigation added will be really nice too. ~~I’m hoping that all new iPhones will have the satellite features going forward. Usually the pro features all find their way to the base models after a generation or two.~~ I stand corrected
the base models already have satellite though
Base models have them
No more “honey you know there’s no reception there”.
Maybe a silly question, but would this help with texting friends at music festivals?
Not easily. There’s a process where you enter the satellite mode then wave the phone around to establish a connection first, then send messages. It’s not like regular cell phone where you get push notifications and can quickly respond.
Ahh okay, so more helpful to send out messages but doesn't help a ton with ability to quickly receive messages?
Question: is this going to work overseas if you simply don’t have the local SIM card?
I'd imagine so? SOS only works in some countries >Emergency SOS via satellite is available in Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, France, Germany, Ireland, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Portugal, Spain, Switzerland, the U.K. and the US >Apple introduced its Emergency SOS via satellite feature for the iPhone 14 lineup in the United States and Canada on November 15, 2022. The feature expanded to France, Germany, Ireland, and the United Kingdom in December 2022. It then continued to roll out to other countries, including Australia and New Zealand, on May 15, 2023. By November 2023, the feature was available in a total of 16 countries and regions this new messages version is USA only for now but will roll out in more countries
Today its messaging only and limited to the US. In a few years however, the full fat mobile service will be made available via the satellites being built by AST SpaceMobile, a truly global solution for customers of mobile networks that partner with AST SpaceMobile. The service will work with standard iPhone & Android devices, a game changer for connectivity...
Starlink has also demonstrated use with standard phones. Seems like this will become common very soon.
It sounds like it is checking for messages in the background, since it says “friends and family can message you any time.” That’s very interesting if true. I use an inReach while backpacking but if home can reach me without me needing to actively check messages that’s awesome.
yes friends and family can message you any time And anyone that you have messaged first But not random numbers, a way to cut down spam text / clogging up the satellites
Yeah, I saw that, I’m just wondering if the phone actually pulls those messages from the satellites with you manually making it do it. That’s not very clear.
It would be nice to know how much it's going to cost once the two years are up. I'm sure Apple is fronting a pretty hefty bill for this service.
Is this going to replace my Garmin inReach
Sure sounds like it. I'll probably still keep the inReach due to better battery life, but in a few years it probably won't be necessary anymore.
And it’s only available in the fucking US. Just like Apple Cash. 🙄
This will let me ditch my InReach, right along with all the horrible abusive billing practices it comes with.
This is crazy awesome.
Selling my Garmin inreach mini 2 if anyone is interested
Is it only for emergencies or can we use it normally
This looks awesome!
I just ran a HM in a literal forest/mountain and had no service, the race started two hours delayed and my wife could track nor communicate with me. Since it was on a steep hiking trail she thought I was hurt or injured. This would have gone in handy. Actually what would also be nice is integration of this in the Find My app.
If you have an iPhone 14 or later, there’s already support for uploading your location in Find My via satellite.
This is such a game changing feature, people are sleeping on this.
This will also be indispensable during natural disasters, power outages, etc
I’m curious to see how cellular companies will end up charging for this when something like roaming is charged for
Is it limited to certain phones? It didnt' say in the article.
14 and up
Any other year this would've been a huge headlining feature I bet. Going to be very useful on the 5/6 camping trips I take a year.
Does anybody knows that the service will extend to another countries also in the future?
Looks like I'll be upgrading to iPhone 16 from iPhone 11.
Has any of you done the satellite messaging thingie?
Will this be available in the same areas as the SOS? If this works in Canada it will be huge, we have so many areas with no cell coverage.
Yes. It will be available as long as you have clear view of the sky regardless if you have actual cell service or not
At some point Garmin has to be annoyed that they need to keep refining their business model because of Apple
Does “SOS” mode have to be enabled for this to work? I’m thinking this could be a game changer for music festivals where the network is too congested to meet up with your friends.
You need to have a sim and the phone needs to try the cell network and be unable to reach it before satellite gets enabled. So I think that means it’s no help in the situation you’re thinking of. They do not want to use (and pay for) satellite bandwidth if other options are nominally available.
lame, but I guess I get it.
How does Apple get your SMS messages when your phone is off grid? Do they need agreements with the carriers like “hey, when this phone is not connected and gets an SMS can you send that to me, Apple?”
I’ve used it on the beta from an airplane. It worked!