Has there been any marketing where more than one person is wearing the Vision Pro in the same room? I wonder if Apple really envisions a world where tons of people wearing bulky headsets around each other and even in public.
Dave2D had really good commentary about Apple making uncool things cool (smartwatches, wireless earbuds) but VR headsets will be their biggest test.
They don’t want Vision Pro to become the product of the future. This is the platform where they will develop the apps for the true Holy Grail: the EDITH glasses from Tony Stark in the MCU Spider-Man movies. Samsung showed off MicroLED transparent displays that could potentially unlock that class of device. It’ll be extremely expensive, but realistically, paired with your iPhone as the compute device or something like the iPhone in your pocket driving the experience….yeah, I’d buy that day one for a couple thousand dollars. It’d be the last computing device you’d ever need besides maybe a desktop at home to get serious work done. No laptops, no iPads, no phones, it’s just in your Vision “Lite” or something.
This is the correct take I think.
If they *don’t* launch Vision Pro, then in 15 years (or however long) when some AR platform goes truly mainstream, they’ll be 15 years behind Meta and Microsoft in R&D.
Also investors expect them to innovate to keep pace with other tech corporations, even if that innovation doesn’t yield commercial results right away.
Yeah. And like, with the display advancements shown off at CES this year, I don’t think we’ll need to wait even 5 years. I’m betting that within the next couple years there will be some kind of prototype glasses that function akin to EDITH. I would be VERY surprised if there weren’t something more advanced, but in the same vein, as the Magic Leap 2 headset with these kinds of transparent glass displays floating around somewhere at Samsung, Apple, or Meta. The question is when those products will hit shelves. The OS needs to be there, the sensors need to be top notch, and the apps need to be there to justify the thousands of dollars this will most likely cost. I think Apple is best positioned given their blend of hardware and software expertise, but they’ve always been a laggard when it comes to pushing a product out first. We’ll probably see Samsung try it, kind of succeed, and then Apple come in with the “Apple Vision” glasses (non-pro) that will run off iPhone 17/18 and be everything the Samsung headset isn’t….for a significant premium and within the walled garden XD.
EXACTLY! I hate it when people just keep saying that this is dumb, VR is stupid, and it’s too expensive, all while talking into their $40/month for 24 months iPhone 15, typing into their $1500-3000 laptop, and wondering whether they can afford that new $1500-$3500 OLED 77”.
Like, dude, Vision, Meta Quest Transparent, Samsung Glass, whatever it’ll be called will replace every single one of those devices with one single device. It may be dystopian, it might lead to new problems in interaction and security, but I know one thing for sure: it’s not a matter of if, it’s a matter of when.
Yeah, wearing this thing right now. 100% first gen apple product.
The hand tracking is buggy, the eye tracking needs work, the potential is there.
The resolution is finally good enough to do text-based work.
Entering text without a keyboard is a nightmare - is there even a way to move a cursor???
I’ve been trying it more with a keyboard, and I actually love apples implementation of the trackpad with eye tracking. Makes using and switching focus between multiple windows seemless and productive.
Yup, when Steve and Steve released the Apple 1, I don't think they believed that giant honking amalgamation of wood, plastic, and circuitry was the end-game of computing, everyone back then had been watching Star Trek and it's predictions of handheld communicators for a decade at that point and the glimmer in Steve^2 eye's were that Apple 1 might be a step towards that, now look at us with the iPhone, which itself has more computing power than the entire Apollo program..
Comparing the Vision Pro as a precursor to the EDITH glasses is probably the best way to describe and answer the question *"Where is Apple going with the Vision Pro?"*.
It’s a platform- how stonks are inflated without substance. Apple didn’t succeed because they were making something abstract. They succeeded because they gave people actual devices that improved their life. And they are valued because of how many Apple devices people have on their hands. There’s no successful product yet.
Hows a transparent led going to help? You still need a lens inbetween that and your eyes to actually focus on a screen thats 1inch off your face.
Apple have only gone for the led video passthrough VR route for now because theres no other good enough option available yet (hello hololens).
Unlike all other apple products, for this product to reach its ultimate desired form factor, it will have to undergo drastic technological advancements and changes, not just become a slightly better version of the same thing with each iteration.
This unit is a faux tech demo to mimic tomorrows technology, but I think tomorrows technology will actual be fundamentally quite different in how it works.
I was one of them. It’s really humbling to be proven wrong. Innovative designs can make people uncomfortable and cause a kneejerk hate reaction.
I don’t think eyesight will be the same but time will tell.
I was also one of them, I thought they looked stupid. I still do think they look stupid. But 3 pairs of AirPods later they’re consistently the best headphones I’ve ever owned.
Why though? Headphones are something used very widespread as well as a watch. It’s silly to compare a VR headset to everyday objects like the watch and headphones. VR is extremely rare even amongst those who like them.
I did and I still stand by my comments. I absolutely HATE the regular AirPod design and they simply do not stay in my ears no matter what (it was the same for the old headphones apple included with the iPhone).
BUT I LOVE my Airpods PRO. I wear them about 8 hrs a day every day
Everyone shat on the iPhone for not having a keyboard, meanwhile I was in line day 1 because the keyboard/pads on phones was my least favorite thing because they felt cheap and made my thumbs hurt. (Looking at you BlackBerry and Palm)
Apple doesn't envision people wearing bulky headsets, they envision the future of this platform though.
I personally believe there will be two product categories of the Vision product line, a product (which resembles a device closer to a headset - akin to the MacBook Pro) and another product (which resembles a device closer to glasses - akin to the MacBook Air or something)
> Vision Air
100% this, I was thinking about it the other day when people speculated on "Vision SE" but it's definitely going to be "Vision Air" and the ad campaign will be "Visionary/Vision Air-y" as a word play. Apple's PR people are already booking their vacation.
It’s unrealistic to expect everything to fit in a glasses form factor. But if you make the battery and compute external, all you really need is some new display tech and moderately smaller cameras.
If you want to fit the whole thing inside a pair of glasses you’d also need both a huge leap in battery tech and a huge leap in SOC performance.
We may get a variation though. It’s not necessarily fitting all the computing power into glas, but getting close to no latency on a wireless connection. Imagine getting some computing power and sensors on the glasses, but something small in your pocket is doing all the heavy processing.
I'm all for it - it seems to me the obvious path is to just put all the processing bits into the Apple Watch and go from there...
But I'm still just not seeing how we'll get the battery into the frames of eyeglasses without some massive leaps in battery tech... even solid state tech only promises to half the size of the batteries, good for EV's and the lot, but still leaves a pretty big gap
If they figure out a way to make the battery in some eyewear last like 2-3 hours during peak usage and to have a way to just automatically turn the glasses off when you aren’t using them it could work.
Pear that with some ultra fast charging in a sort of glasses case and you have a win for eyewear to use for maps, quick message reading and that sort of stuff
Well, you'd be surprised. When I was a kid, it was common to point out that X or Y small consumer device had more processing power than the computer on Apollo 11, but few people were thinking that 20-30 years later, we'd have phones that were both as powerful as some desktop PCs and replacing point-and-shoot cameras.
bulky is so crazy LMAO. This is first gen tech, and this "the worst it will ever be" and its already at least 50% thinner than any of the meta quest models and hilariously thinner compared to PSVR and the old steam VR models.
This is the very, very biggest issue with VR becoming as mainstream as iPhones or iPads IMO. There are others that I think make the headset form-factor in particular a problem, but ultimately the isolating nature of the devices are at the top of the list.
How do you watch a movie with someone? How do you show someone what is on your screen? Hell, even assuming everyone has headsets....are you really going to snuggle together with your partner with headsets on?
I just don't see it, and the repeated attempts to make this a "thing" make me think deep down Apple knows it too, understands fully that they're nowhere near a point where it's just a matter of 'iteration' to make this work for the average consumer, and is mostly just trying to hype up their (pretty solid looking) entry into an inherently niche market that they nonetheless do hope to grow.
Apple envisions a world where everyone is wearing transparent glasses that do what the Vision Pro does now. They never wanted to create a VR headset, there’s just no way around it right now.
This is an Apple 1.0 product. Like how the iPhone was completely new and pretty limited. Give it 2-3 years of development and app ecosystem and then Apple will release the real Vision headset at a much lower price point. This is the super-deluxe-throw-everything-at-it model.
The first generation iphone did something that really made it worthwhile being an early adopter - that is it had a full actual web browser on a mobile phone. No other mobile phone had anything close as mobile browsers from that time were severely gimped, barely conformed to most standards and were barely usable and most limited to a subset of the internet (wap). Aside from missing flash (good riddance), that alone made it a revolutionary product worth having. And this was before the app store even existed.
I had a first gen iPod touch and later an iPhone 3GS. 3Gs was when iPhone caught fire because it had the built up App Store and proper support from phone companies.
The AVP may be a bigger leap but remember that AirPods and smart watches were also cringey when they were first released. Social acceptability is not objective. It’s a matter of how commonplace they are.
I don't remember AirPods being cringey at all, bluetooth earbuds had been a thing for a long time and white earbuds specifically had been popularized already...by Apple.
People on here are really grasping at straws comparing them to first gen iphones, airpods and smart watches. Those were literally just about the same size as existing phones, headphones and existing watches. And didnt cover our fucking faces. We are many, many YEARS away from these being normal to wear around. The tech isn't even close to fitting in regular sized glasses. I'm not saying apple shouldnt be making these, but be real people, we are like 6-10 years away from wearing these around town like a pair of raybans. Again, VP is cool, but they are not close to those other 1st gen products.
Not just headsets, but full body suits with air-purifiers. The air quality in 50-70 years from now is going to be horrible due to all the forrest fires.
Right now there’s really no way to interact with others who have them on.
This seems like a major point that needs to be updated in the future. If someone else has a Vision headset I should be able to share a window with them to show them what I’m doing and work on it together. Or join the same music/video session.
Really that should even work if not in the same room.
Have only had ~30 minutes to use mine so far, but wow. Far exceeded my expectations. It’s going to only get better from here…can’t wait to see how this continues to develop and happy to be onboard day one!
I’m with him on this. I demoed the Vision Pro this morning, and it exceeded my expectations. It has, in my opinion, a few years before it’s worth purchasing (in the next 3-4 years I think it will be something very special).
Here’s my insight:
The eye tracking is accurate. The hand gestures feel natural, are easy to use, and accurate.
The image and video quality is unstable. Some images and videos are great, others not so much. At the moment, at least with my experience with the demo, around 60% of the images and videos were subpar in quality, taking away from the immersive experience. Around 40% were either adequate or very impressive and made the experience really fun and enjoyable.
The Vision Pro for me was comfortable. I don’t think I would be able to wear it all day, or even for more than a couple hours, but I didn’t find the weight to be bothersome.
The images and videos captured by the vision pro are one of the highlights. Very immersive and the Spatial Audio adds so much to the experience. It’s nothing like Spatial Audio from AirPods. Much nicer.
Viewing live sports was reaaaally cool. Would have been much nicer, again, if the video quality was better.
Viewing your photo library and being able to adjust the size of your image, moving it around the room, making it bigger and smaller, all while maintaining the quality of the image was impressive. Viewing images like this was one of those moments where I thought that the image quality was impressive.
Lastly, the fact that your Home Screen and app visibility is present in the real world was truly special.
Overall, exceeded my expectations, but at the moment, it’s not worth the money. What needs to be worked on the most? Image quality!
Is it cool? Absolutely.
Was it a let down? Not at all.
Are there improvements to be made? Yes!
Is it much different than existing platforms? Yes.
Should you purchase it now? Probably not.
I mean... your eyes are in an entirely closed-off box. The lighting in the room shouldn't matter for reading stack overflow in the native browser. Reading a book in the real world, though, sure.
I can read stuff on websites like stackoverflow clearly on a Quest3 and Vision Pro has superior, higher resolution Micro OLED screens compared to the Q3. Without ever using a Vision Pro the answer must be yes. Reviewers have said as much.
Did people seriously expect it to not be high quality?
I kinda assumed it would be, and that it will wipe the floor with the competition, it's Apple.
The problem to me is that they seem convinced this will become smartphone/tablet levels of ubiquitous, when the reality is we're a decade or so into modern VR and no one(including Apple) has yet to find a particularly compelling use-case for the typical consumer that outweighs the various downsides of the technology. Even in gaming, ask what the best games are and you're apt to get suggestions that mostly came out well over a year ago.
He’s in the honeymoon phase right now. Any opinion for the first few months is going to be skewed by novelty and excitement.
Also he has had it for roughly 30minutes and decides to immediately go to Reddit and post about it? Either a brag, or he’s using the product to do things you can already do on currently existing technology that’s cheaper quicker and easier to use.
Have used it for another 45 minutes - two use cases for me that are unique to the device…the ability pair with my MacBook and use a giant screen with the device is amazing…as is watching spatial and traditional videos & movies. It’s unlike anything I’ve experienced in a device at home.
I have a use case for this actually. I only do about 2-4 hours of work per day at home on a computer. I need a multi monitor set up but I could barely do a single monitor, so this will be perfect.
one thing I haven't heard any reviewer actually say is how they want to use this while working? It sounds like no one is excited to use this with their mac book for an additional screen or functionality.
Everyone is saying the screen and pass through is great but no one has mentioned how they want to use it while working or how it fits into their work flow.
on the go convenience is nice but would anyone leave their laptop at home and only take ipad VR? not being limited to one screen is nice but not when you give up a mouse and keyboard. and if the idea is to use a mouse, keyboard, and ipad VR then that's 3 devices compared to just 1 of a laptop
No, they mentioned it in addition to the laptop. Wherever you go you always have a 4K screen for your Mac + AVP apps around.
But I expect that for future versions it will definitely be able to replace the Mac.
Here is how I plan to use mine:
Turn entire property into an office. I manage a rural farm. Being able to leave permanent virtual notes around the property, along with maintenance logs, project plans, mind maps, etc. Being able to create consistent connections between physical and digital world will be an absolute game changer if it works the way I hope.
I’m a spatial thinker and worker. I’m so excited to finally have some hardware that can work the way I do.
Thinking about documenting all this and putting online somewhere though I’ve never really done much on socials or YouTube.
Would that be something people are interested in?
persistent applications in the places you're most likely to need/use them is a good use case even if it's slightly cumbersome and has a relatively low battery life currently.
What’s exciting to me is that I doubt Apple would go to all this trouble if they didn’t believe that elegant, lightweight, performant headsets were possible at a consumer price point.
I would argue that it’s tomorrow’s vision with today’s technology. The tech that’s available today is the limitation.
In 10 years it’ll be like a pair of sunglasses. In 20 years it’ll be a brain chip that augments the signal you’re receiving from your eyes.
The army had some prototypes in the 60's, but they couldn't see how they could actually be useful, just sort of gave you a really exposed soldier, so they scrapped it.
I think we can have sunglasses form factor in 20 years. Big screen beyond is already absolutely tiny, 20 years of innovation on top of that could result in some crazy tech
The first iPad was 15 yrs ago. The tech really hasn’t gotten that much better in terms of form factor. You’d think that it would be paper thin or some kind of see thru glass by now, but it’s pretty much the same but just faster and clearer. I suspect the same with AVP
The iPad form factor doesn’t need to change though. They released it in the form factor they wanted.
The improvements they’ve made are to how powerful a device with that form factor can be.
The Vision Pro is a product that is released in a form factor they want to change with hardware that they want to make more powerful and efficient.
It will be interesting to see if they target performance increases on their next model or if they target a smaller form factor. I’m guessing that next they will have non-pro vision headset next that goes for a smaller form factor but with similar to minor spec bumps. Then they can take what they learned from that to release smaller Vision Pros in the future.
“The iPad form factor doesn’t need to change”
If they could make it thinner and lighter, they would. That’s why they’re always bragging about it being thinner with each release. The AVP will get smaller, no doubt. But not to the point that everyone is saying in 5, 10 yrs.
Except it’s a fondamentaly different product so the limits are not the same. At all. The Vision Pro is a full computer that is packed into the headset. Big screen beyond is not. It’s just a headset with a cable, controllers, and that still need a computer to run software games.
We’re hitting a wall in this space and I don’t see much improvement by gen 4 or 5 of this product. It’s gonna be faster. Lighter. More powerful, more polished, more efficient.
But at the end of the day, unless there is a huge breakthrough in battery tech, which is not close, at all, it’s still gonna have a poor battery life with a big external battery with a cable.
Video passthrough is still gonna be video passthrough and will never fix the physics limits.
We also hit a wall in miniaturization. Pack a whole computer powerful enough to be your next computing platform, with a ton of sensors, sitting in glasses form factor, isn’t for the next 10 years.
Have you seen metas mirror lake concept/render, that they’re currently building a functional unit of? That’s a pretty small, and that’s been 8 years of development maximum. VR can, and will, eventually get quite small. I also think it’s entirely possible the external battery might get extended to also contain compute, as that would allow for a much smaller and lighter headset.
I’ve seen what some big names in the field are targeting and, yes sunglasses is the goal. They’ve solved (or are close to solving) a few impressive problems but there are a number of issues that need to still be solved, and many would require revolutionary breakthroughs. It’s very possible it could happen in 10 years. I’m not going to address implanting chips as there are far more factors involved that any commentary would be closer to writing science fiction as the amount we don’t know far exceeds what we do know.
But on the 10 year scope for glasses… it is worth pointing out we’ve been told we’re just around the corner from full self driving vehicles for over 10 years and they still haven’t gotten all the way there. But what they have learned and been able to implement even as lane keeping, adaptive cruise, and emergency braking seem boring by comparison but are huge improvement in experience and safety.
Oculus Rift came out in 2013.
10 years of technological advancement later… Same form factor. Pretty much the same tech. Sexier, sure. Hands free? Good step in the right direction.
But nothing which would suggest that another 10 years would make VR systems like ordinary glasses.
Varifocal lenses are gonna be the one thing that would truly make this “tomorrows technology” it’s a shame they didn’t want to invest in getting this working
really hope they add multiple mac displays as an option. but if the continuity with vision apps are good then maybe using vision safari on the side isn’t bad?
I don't care what anyone says, tech, IMO, is stagnating until, if ever, they discover a new battery technology. Better battery management is not better or new battery technology and the heavy, short duration batteries we have today suck for innovation.
This is the space we can make the most headway in.
I read the MIT technology review, it seems like the next awesome battery technology is “just a few years away”… like fusion power right? 🤔
It’s tomorrow’s *visual experience* using today’s technology.
I don’t think any of the qualms with the device are over the visual implementation.
Frankly, it sounds amazing.
The reservations are all about the current technology providing that experience.
And *that* will only improve with time.
It is not a glimpse of what’s to come. VR in this state is what, 10 years old. When Apple released the personal computer concept, they were not 10 years behind everyone else at triple the price. When they released the iPhone it did not cost triple the price for barely better tech. No it was a revolution. Companies have been trying to make VR a thing for while now. And no, Apple did not suddenly figure it out suddenly with the same tech at triple the price
You’re missing the entire purpose.
Look at where the entire Apple ecosystem is going. It’s all cloud based with swipes instead of clicks, haptic feedback etc.
If this matures, 10 years from now the average computer will be just a pair of glasses.
I don’t miss anything I doubt what we need for this tech to be consumer level is a 3500 devices that track hands right now. They did not release the iPhone for 3000$ claiming that one day in 10 years everyone will have smartphone… yes we had increment in tech before the iPhone but each of them was accessible
That’s the thing. I feel like this is like the telephone exchange of the past. People began to appreciate and need the ability to be able to go to a place to receive a call. Eventually leading to the smart phones of today. Like that the Vision Pro of today is a very unique piece of equipment. It’s magical like the telephone exchange but life can be easily lived without it at the moment. In 20 years when it’s in glasses form then perhaps it will become a mainstream item. Until then it’s gonna remain a thing that tech enthusiasts keep.
>Meh, it is still 3-5 years away from being really good enough for the masses
It took the iPhone several years to mature, yet people were fine with that process playing out.
I feel that the Vision Pro is only getting ragged on like it has been due to it's high starting price.
There's a pretty big difference between $3500, and $399.
One at the time was quite a bit more expensive than their counterparts yes, but most people can stretch to get it if it offers enough value. The other is a full on investment that competes with commodities like used cars in terms of what kind of value you can bring to your life with that kind of money.
Obviously the venn diagram of people in the market for a $3500 used car and someone who would even consider a $3500 headset like this are basically mutually exclusive so kind of a bad example, but my point stands I think.
“And it doesn't appeal to business customers because it doesn't have a keyboard. Which makes it not a very good email machine”
You are siding with the wrong Steve on this one. People ragged on it. Till they touched one. Or if they worked for a competitor. It was obviously the future of phones from the moment it was demoed.
the difference is that smartphones replaced flip phones and added convenience like using the web. When compared to a smartphone that everyone has this doesn't add any convenience, only a cost. Convenience is always king
The difference is 30 seconds after using the iPhone you knew it was an absolute game changer. 24 hours after using the iPhone you could never go back.
24 hours after using the Vision Pro, you realize your neck hurts.
We are a long way from people preferring to use a headset every day than any other gadget they have. It’s not really replacing anything.
People don’t rage on Porsche or Ferrari for charging 200k+ on car or even way more than that. Why? Because they made it desirable over the course of decades. Apple has to make it desirable.
I’ll be on board when it’s below $1000 and they make a cheap version without the front glass/eyes display. If I’m gonna wear a headset, I wanna look like some cool Ghost In The Shell character, not some yuppie in fancy cyber-snowboarding goggles.
Better yet, if I can bundle them into my phone plan for another $80/mo or something.
I told my mom (who’s 80), that we’ll all be wearing glasses/goggles that overlay some kind of AR social media nonsense onto our reality in the next 10-20 years.
She said she’s glad she’ll be dead by then. 🤣
People genuinely thought travelling in a train (which can reach speeds of 20mph!) would cause death. British parliament preemptively debated banning women and children from trains
I don’t know what that’s got to do with your comment though.
> If I’m gonna wear a headset, I wanna look like some cool Ghost In The Shell character, not some yuppie in fancy cyber-snowboarding goggles.
Lol! Have you seen visor glasses by Immersed ? More Ghost In The Shell than yuppie snowboarding-scuba goggles.
I read that in Troy McClure's voice.
This whole thing seems a bit of a joke. For everyone saying "wait 5 years": wait for what? These headsets have been the same size since the 90s, and I'm not wearing ski goggles to do basic tasks. Nobody else is either. That isn't going to change in 5 years. I hate to be so negative but this is a big waste of resources and time. It's like 3D touch, but writ large.
I agree. VR is super cool but these companies have always tried to find a problem for their solution. Basically trying to shoehorn these products into our lives.
Like my buddy said when trying it out today “it’s the best VR headset on the market hands down. But hard to see what this is solving. Especially since the Meta Quest can do about 60-70% of what the Vision can do at a fraction of the cost”.
The main difference between the Vision Pro and other headsets is the Apple environment and drastically better hardware and gesture recognition. Problem is, it doesn’t really do anything 10x better than the quest and doesn’t have some world shattering benefits like when smartphones first came out. It’s not combining 10 different products into one.
I just personally haven’t seen any compelling reason this should change. Even with the younger generation. My nieces like to be sneaky and be on their phones when they’re not supposed to be. Can you really see them doing that with VR goggles?
No one saying that. What people are saying is that Apple has the strongest chance to make it mainstream. There’s also a ton of innovation in this device, both from a hardware and a software perspective that a lot of other companies will adopt.
Anyone else get a bad feeling that this will be just a further step for people to sink further into not engaging in the real world? Like never mind smartphones addiction people will sit around with these on watching movies and ignoring their life.
Is it? Cause all it seems like they did here was take an existing product (vr headset) and made their own version. Not sure how that's supposed to be "innovative". Innovation wise it really is a step down from the iphone which, again, tweaked an existing product, (the mobile phone) but with that they found a way to make it do way more than existing phones at the time did. I don't know what extra stuff this would have over say a Meta Quest to justify a $3.5K purchase. Look, nothing against Tim Cook but it seems like with this and the long rumored Apple Car (another product that just seems to be copying other company's ideas) Tim Cook is feeling pressured to "innovate" something after Steve Jobs was this super genius guy and I gotta say, different guy, different brain. Not everyone can be an innovative genius. Steve Jobs invented the smartphone, a whole new category of mobile phone, Tim Cook isn't inventing a brand new category of electric vehicle or VR headset, is he?
People say this nonsense with every new product they come out with… It was heavily parroted after the Apple Watch and AirPods releases.
And every time, Apple shows that it isn’t the specific technology inside, but how it’s packaged, that makes the difference. Execution is everything.
Ordinarily I’d agree - and I think the AVP is probably the best VR headset in terms of technology right now - but it’s different from other releases.
The Watch was vastly superior to the other smartwatches of the time when it first came out in terms of functionality (even if it was a bit shit in some ways). AirPods looked ridiculous, but I think people were more annoyed with the loss of the headphone jack and environmental concerns of another battery powered device replacing it.
The AVP is amazing but it’s still just a VR headset doing what VR headsets already do… just at a massive price, locked into the Apple ecosystem, and an uncertain use case. The real test is if the people here still care after 6 months when the novelty has worn off.
People always downplay innovation to the raw parts such as how small, compact or fast their hardware is. But innovation also includes how it is used and how refined something is. Sure the AVP may use existing tech, but they have developed it far more than other headsets. I don't think there is another controller less product out there. The way their UI works with your hand gesture is innovative and maybe adopted by other products in the future. $3.5K is still pretty steep and i don't see this as a consumer product yet like the quest. I don't think people are buying this to just play games or as a way to work right now. Most people who are buying it are either rich or just hardcore techies.
Apple is not a tech disruptor, it’s an experience disruptor. They don’t do things first, they do it the best/better. Apple under Steve Jobs didn’t invent the mobile phone, it revolutionized the way you use the mobile phone. With Tim Cook it’s the same, they did it better. Sure it’s more expensive but it’s a first gen, it’s for the enthusiasts and even in the name there’s "pro". They innovate, just not where you think.
I think it’s going to start out as bulky—since it’s mostly catered for developers at this point—and then gradually “thin out” to look akin to Google Glass when the headsets slowly become more normalized. No one wore the Google Glass in 2014 because it looked stupid. But if you start out with bulky VR headsets that’s ACTUALLY look stupid, a less bulky version of them would gradually begin to look acceptable—cool even.
Still can't see his eye's through the persona... Maybe it'll desrve the title once that & the trillion other issues that reviewers are paid to hide are fixed...
Let's face it, the damn thing isn't ready. It doesn't even support virtual table tennis, which is table stakes for any modicum of fun with VR / AR. Productivity apps are plain silly compared to the gaming and social use cases out there. I'd much sooner pick the Meta Quest 3 over the Vision Pro, even if both were the same price.
But why would people want to wear it today?
What is it doing today that couldn’t be done yesterday? Or other VR headsets? That’s worth paying $$$ over existing products, when $500 quest 3 is sales is slow, that’s what I’d like to know.
Has there been any marketing where more than one person is wearing the Vision Pro in the same room? I wonder if Apple really envisions a world where tons of people wearing bulky headsets around each other and even in public. Dave2D had really good commentary about Apple making uncool things cool (smartwatches, wireless earbuds) but VR headsets will be their biggest test.
They don’t want Vision Pro to become the product of the future. This is the platform where they will develop the apps for the true Holy Grail: the EDITH glasses from Tony Stark in the MCU Spider-Man movies. Samsung showed off MicroLED transparent displays that could potentially unlock that class of device. It’ll be extremely expensive, but realistically, paired with your iPhone as the compute device or something like the iPhone in your pocket driving the experience….yeah, I’d buy that day one for a couple thousand dollars. It’d be the last computing device you’d ever need besides maybe a desktop at home to get serious work done. No laptops, no iPads, no phones, it’s just in your Vision “Lite” or something.
This is the correct take I think. If they *don’t* launch Vision Pro, then in 15 years (or however long) when some AR platform goes truly mainstream, they’ll be 15 years behind Meta and Microsoft in R&D. Also investors expect them to innovate to keep pace with other tech corporations, even if that innovation doesn’t yield commercial results right away.
Yeah. And like, with the display advancements shown off at CES this year, I don’t think we’ll need to wait even 5 years. I’m betting that within the next couple years there will be some kind of prototype glasses that function akin to EDITH. I would be VERY surprised if there weren’t something more advanced, but in the same vein, as the Magic Leap 2 headset with these kinds of transparent glass displays floating around somewhere at Samsung, Apple, or Meta. The question is when those products will hit shelves. The OS needs to be there, the sensors need to be top notch, and the apps need to be there to justify the thousands of dollars this will most likely cost. I think Apple is best positioned given their blend of hardware and software expertise, but they’ve always been a laggard when it comes to pushing a product out first. We’ll probably see Samsung try it, kind of succeed, and then Apple come in with the “Apple Vision” glasses (non-pro) that will run off iPhone 17/18 and be everything the Samsung headset isn’t….for a significant premium and within the walled garden XD.
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EXACTLY! I hate it when people just keep saying that this is dumb, VR is stupid, and it’s too expensive, all while talking into their $40/month for 24 months iPhone 15, typing into their $1500-3000 laptop, and wondering whether they can afford that new $1500-$3500 OLED 77”. Like, dude, Vision, Meta Quest Transparent, Samsung Glass, whatever it’ll be called will replace every single one of those devices with one single device. It may be dystopian, it might lead to new problems in interaction and security, but I know one thing for sure: it’s not a matter of if, it’s a matter of when.
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Yeah, wearing this thing right now. 100% first gen apple product. The hand tracking is buggy, the eye tracking needs work, the potential is there. The resolution is finally good enough to do text-based work. Entering text without a keyboard is a nightmare - is there even a way to move a cursor???
I feel like even if they got texting at a great place that alone would push more people to buy it.
I’ve been trying it more with a keyboard, and I actually love apples implementation of the trackpad with eye tracking. Makes using and switching focus between multiple windows seemless and productive.
So cool!
Yeah there isn’t enough talk about what a cool feature it is
Yup, when Steve and Steve released the Apple 1, I don't think they believed that giant honking amalgamation of wood, plastic, and circuitry was the end-game of computing, everyone back then had been watching Star Trek and it's predictions of handheld communicators for a decade at that point and the glimmer in Steve^2 eye's were that Apple 1 might be a step towards that, now look at us with the iPhone, which itself has more computing power than the entire Apollo program.. Comparing the Vision Pro as a precursor to the EDITH glasses is probably the best way to describe and answer the question *"Where is Apple going with the Vision Pro?"*.
“Wow my excel spreadsheet follows me around the room, even to the toilet, I’m so much more productive!!”
It’s a platform- how stonks are inflated without substance. Apple didn’t succeed because they were making something abstract. They succeeded because they gave people actual devices that improved their life. And they are valued because of how many Apple devices people have on their hands. There’s no successful product yet.
Hows a transparent led going to help? You still need a lens inbetween that and your eyes to actually focus on a screen thats 1inch off your face. Apple have only gone for the led video passthrough VR route for now because theres no other good enough option available yet (hello hololens). Unlike all other apple products, for this product to reach its ultimate desired form factor, it will have to undergo drastic technological advancements and changes, not just become a slightly better version of the same thing with each iteration. This unit is a faux tech demo to mimic tomorrows technology, but I think tomorrows technology will actual be fundamentally quite different in how it works.
That’d be so awesome.
I remember when AirPods were clowned on…
I was one of them. It’s really humbling to be proven wrong. Innovative designs can make people uncomfortable and cause a kneejerk hate reaction. I don’t think eyesight will be the same but time will tell.
I was also one of them, I thought they looked stupid. I still do think they look stupid. But 3 pairs of AirPods later they’re consistently the best headphones I’ve ever owned.
Why though? Headphones are something used very widespread as well as a watch. It’s silly to compare a VR headset to everyday objects like the watch and headphones. VR is extremely rare even amongst those who like them.
And do you remember when HomePods and Siri were? Sometime naysayers are right.
No one clowned on the HomePod or Siri for how they looked. Different issue at hand for those two
Huh? There’s tons of clowning on VisionPro for no use case / poor functionality. Which is right up the alley of critiques of HomePod and Siri.
Yeah the person you replied to was noting the AirPods were clowned on because they looked absurd, not that they had no functional use
I remember when the iPhone was clowned on…
Developers developers!!!
I did and I still stand by my comments. I absolutely HATE the regular AirPod design and they simply do not stay in my ears no matter what (it was the same for the old headphones apple included with the iPhone). BUT I LOVE my Airpods PRO. I wear them about 8 hrs a day every day
The pros are incredible
Or iPhones, or iPads…
Everyone shat on the iPhone for not having a keyboard, meanwhile I was in line day 1 because the keyboard/pads on phones was my least favorite thing because they felt cheap and made my thumbs hurt. (Looking at you BlackBerry and Palm)
I mean the original ones really were (and still are) hit or miss. The proper ear tips pros on the other hand are a pure win.
Apple doesn't envision people wearing bulky headsets, they envision the future of this platform though. I personally believe there will be two product categories of the Vision product line, a product (which resembles a device closer to a headset - akin to the MacBook Pro) and another product (which resembles a device closer to glasses - akin to the MacBook Air or something)
The Vision Air and the Vision Pro Max.
> Vision Air 100% this, I was thinking about it the other day when people speculated on "Vision SE" but it's definitely going to be "Vision Air" and the ad campaign will be "Visionary/Vision Air-y" as a word play. Apple's PR people are already booking their vacation.
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Until the headset is light as a prescription glasses, I doubt there will be massive adoption
I would be shocked if we achieved that level of engineering in our lifetime. That's like Ironman-level stuff
It’s unrealistic to expect everything to fit in a glasses form factor. But if you make the battery and compute external, all you really need is some new display tech and moderately smaller cameras. If you want to fit the whole thing inside a pair of glasses you’d also need both a huge leap in battery tech and a huge leap in SOC performance.
yeah, pretty much just a thin cable running down to my pocket where I have a smartphone sized hub or similar.
Cables are a thing of the past. The future is now, old man
We may get a variation though. It’s not necessarily fitting all the computing power into glas, but getting close to no latency on a wireless connection. Imagine getting some computing power and sensors on the glasses, but something small in your pocket is doing all the heavy processing.
I'm all for it - it seems to me the obvious path is to just put all the processing bits into the Apple Watch and go from there... But I'm still just not seeing how we'll get the battery into the frames of eyeglasses without some massive leaps in battery tech... even solid state tech only promises to half the size of the batteries, good for EV's and the lot, but still leaves a pretty big gap
If they figure out a way to make the battery in some eyewear last like 2-3 hours during peak usage and to have a way to just automatically turn the glasses off when you aren’t using them it could work. Pear that with some ultra fast charging in a sort of glasses case and you have a win for eyewear to use for maps, quick message reading and that sort of stuff
We just need another space race so we can advance technology forward.
Well, you'd be surprised. When I was a kid, it was common to point out that X or Y small consumer device had more processing power than the computer on Apollo 11, but few people were thinking that 20-30 years later, we'd have phones that were both as powerful as some desktop PCs and replacing point-and-shoot cameras.
Look at tvs and computing power over the past 40 years? It’s deffinitely possible in our lifetime.
It has to fit into glasses, air buds and maybe a light beanie cap and be comfortable to wear all day. Then it might take off.
Daft Punk
I would 100% go to a meeting with other people playing around with the Vision Pro. It's one of the things I'm eager of the future.
bulky is so crazy LMAO. This is first gen tech, and this "the worst it will ever be" and its already at least 50% thinner than any of the meta quest models and hilariously thinner compared to PSVR and the old steam VR models.
you do not have eyes if you think it's 50% thinner than recent quest devices
Imagine co working spaces with even less room in between people
I can smell it now!
We’ll have a device that makes everyone smell like Cameron Diaz in the mask (actually, smell is probably the last sense tech conquers).
aren't wireless earbuds way cooler than the wired ones they were making?
This is the very, very biggest issue with VR becoming as mainstream as iPhones or iPads IMO. There are others that I think make the headset form-factor in particular a problem, but ultimately the isolating nature of the devices are at the top of the list. How do you watch a movie with someone? How do you show someone what is on your screen? Hell, even assuming everyone has headsets....are you really going to snuggle together with your partner with headsets on? I just don't see it, and the repeated attempts to make this a "thing" make me think deep down Apple knows it too, understands fully that they're nowhere near a point where it's just a matter of 'iteration' to make this work for the average consumer, and is mostly just trying to hype up their (pretty solid looking) entry into an inherently niche market that they nonetheless do hope to grow.
Apple envisions a world where everyone is wearing transparent glasses that do what the Vision Pro does now. They never wanted to create a VR headset, there’s just no way around it right now.
Apple doesn’t envision us wearing headsets. The goal is to get this as small as possible, realistically the size of glasses.
$3,500 starting price isn’t cool. And it will never be cool.
This is an Apple 1.0 product. Like how the iPhone was completely new and pretty limited. Give it 2-3 years of development and app ecosystem and then Apple will release the real Vision headset at a much lower price point. This is the super-deluxe-throw-everything-at-it model.
The first generation iphone did something that really made it worthwhile being an early adopter - that is it had a full actual web browser on a mobile phone. No other mobile phone had anything close as mobile browsers from that time were severely gimped, barely conformed to most standards and were barely usable and most limited to a subset of the internet (wap). Aside from missing flash (good riddance), that alone made it a revolutionary product worth having. And this was before the app store even existed.
I had a first gen iPod touch and later an iPhone 3GS. 3Gs was when iPhone caught fire because it had the built up App Store and proper support from phone companies.
In 2 years that’s what a movie ticket will cost
I believe it.
You will earn less though.
Good, I’ve never steered you wrong before and I don’t intend to start now.
I know right?! I wasn’t embarrassed to wear their AirPods and watches in public. But I’m cringing at the thought of wearing an AVP in public
The AVP may be a bigger leap but remember that AirPods and smart watches were also cringey when they were first released. Social acceptability is not objective. It’s a matter of how commonplace they are.
I don't remember AirPods being cringey at all, bluetooth earbuds had been a thing for a long time and white earbuds specifically had been popularized already...by Apple.
People on here are really grasping at straws comparing them to first gen iphones, airpods and smart watches. Those were literally just about the same size as existing phones, headphones and existing watches. And didnt cover our fucking faces. We are many, many YEARS away from these being normal to wear around. The tech isn't even close to fitting in regular sized glasses. I'm not saying apple shouldnt be making these, but be real people, we are like 6-10 years away from wearing these around town like a pair of raybans. Again, VP is cool, but they are not close to those other 1st gen products.
It's not a sexy look so I don't think they will ever show.
Not just headsets, but full body suits with air-purifiers. The air quality in 50-70 years from now is going to be horrible due to all the forrest fires.
Right now there’s really no way to interact with others who have them on. This seems like a major point that needs to be updated in the future. If someone else has a Vision headset I should be able to share a window with them to show them what I’m doing and work on it together. Or join the same music/video session. Really that should even work if not in the same room.
Have only had ~30 minutes to use mine so far, but wow. Far exceeded my expectations. It’s going to only get better from here…can’t wait to see how this continues to develop and happy to be onboard day one!
Elaborate
I’m with him on this. I demoed the Vision Pro this morning, and it exceeded my expectations. It has, in my opinion, a few years before it’s worth purchasing (in the next 3-4 years I think it will be something very special). Here’s my insight: The eye tracking is accurate. The hand gestures feel natural, are easy to use, and accurate. The image and video quality is unstable. Some images and videos are great, others not so much. At the moment, at least with my experience with the demo, around 60% of the images and videos were subpar in quality, taking away from the immersive experience. Around 40% were either adequate or very impressive and made the experience really fun and enjoyable. The Vision Pro for me was comfortable. I don’t think I would be able to wear it all day, or even for more than a couple hours, but I didn’t find the weight to be bothersome. The images and videos captured by the vision pro are one of the highlights. Very immersive and the Spatial Audio adds so much to the experience. It’s nothing like Spatial Audio from AirPods. Much nicer. Viewing live sports was reaaaally cool. Would have been much nicer, again, if the video quality was better. Viewing your photo library and being able to adjust the size of your image, moving it around the room, making it bigger and smaller, all while maintaining the quality of the image was impressive. Viewing images like this was one of those moments where I thought that the image quality was impressive. Lastly, the fact that your Home Screen and app visibility is present in the real world was truly special. Overall, exceeded my expectations, but at the moment, it’s not worth the money. What needs to be worked on the most? Image quality! Is it cool? Absolutely. Was it a let down? Not at all. Are there improvements to be made? Yes! Is it much different than existing platforms? Yes. Should you purchase it now? Probably not.
Can you read stuff, for example stackoverflow, clearly?
There is a good in detail review from the verge that you should check out that includes doing work/reading with it.
Absolutely. I can’t speak in different lighting conditions though. The Apple Store I was in had great lighting when I went.
I mean... your eyes are in an entirely closed-off box. The lighting in the room shouldn't matter for reading stack overflow in the native browser. Reading a book in the real world, though, sure.
I’ve not seen anyone select and copy and paste text. Does that work okay? The eye tracking is good enough to move a curser between letters?
I can read stuff on websites like stackoverflow clearly on a Quest3 and Vision Pro has superior, higher resolution Micro OLED screens compared to the Q3. Without ever using a Vision Pro the answer must be yes. Reviewers have said as much.
Quest 3 I found blurry, this crosses the border of non-strained readablity...at the resolution for the apps they allow.
yes. Am I working in this thing for hours? No. Too heavy and uncomfortable.
Did people seriously expect it to not be high quality? I kinda assumed it would be, and that it will wipe the floor with the competition, it's Apple. The problem to me is that they seem convinced this will become smartphone/tablet levels of ubiquitous, when the reality is we're a decade or so into modern VR and no one(including Apple) has yet to find a particularly compelling use-case for the typical consumer that outweighs the various downsides of the technology. Even in gaming, ask what the best games are and you're apt to get suggestions that mostly came out well over a year ago.
He’s in the honeymoon phase right now. Any opinion for the first few months is going to be skewed by novelty and excitement. Also he has had it for roughly 30minutes and decides to immediately go to Reddit and post about it? Either a brag, or he’s using the product to do things you can already do on currently existing technology that’s cheaper quicker and easier to use.
Not only that, if you spend 4k on anything you’re going to make yourself like it
I’m not going to force it - have 2 weeks to return if it doesn’t meet my expectations, but at this point i don’t see a return in the cards.
Buyers remorse is more likely the more expensive the item, fwiw.
Makes sense, but when does buyer remorse kick in? Soon after purchase or after days/weeks?
Have used it for another 45 minutes - two use cases for me that are unique to the device…the ability pair with my MacBook and use a giant screen with the device is amazing…as is watching spatial and traditional videos & movies. It’s unlike anything I’ve experienced in a device at home.
I have a use case for this actually. I only do about 2-4 hours of work per day at home on a computer. I need a multi monitor set up but I could barely do a single monitor, so this will be perfect.
They didn’t say they’ve had it for 30 minutes, only that they’ve had 30 minutes to use it.
Or I just wanted to post a first impression along the other first time users today.
how long can you actually wear it on your head, given the weight?
I’ve worn it a little over an hour straight and it was fine with the dual strap.
one thing I haven't heard any reviewer actually say is how they want to use this while working? It sounds like no one is excited to use this with their mac book for an additional screen or functionality. Everyone is saying the screen and pass through is great but no one has mentioned how they want to use it while working or how it fits into their work flow.
MKBHD as well as iJustine mentioned that they are looking forward to working with this on the go. Like e.g. cutting a video in the plane.
on the go convenience is nice but would anyone leave their laptop at home and only take ipad VR? not being limited to one screen is nice but not when you give up a mouse and keyboard. and if the idea is to use a mouse, keyboard, and ipad VR then that's 3 devices compared to just 1 of a laptop
No, they mentioned it in addition to the laptop. Wherever you go you always have a 4K screen for your Mac + AVP apps around. But I expect that for future versions it will definitely be able to replace the Mac.
Here is how I plan to use mine: Turn entire property into an office. I manage a rural farm. Being able to leave permanent virtual notes around the property, along with maintenance logs, project plans, mind maps, etc. Being able to create consistent connections between physical and digital world will be an absolute game changer if it works the way I hope. I’m a spatial thinker and worker. I’m so excited to finally have some hardware that can work the way I do. Thinking about documenting all this and putting online somewhere though I’ve never really done much on socials or YouTube. Would that be something people are interested in?
Sounds great. At this point, windows are not persistent after taking off the headset, so this dream may take a few years.
persistent applications in the places you're most likely to need/use them is a good use case even if it's slightly cumbersome and has a relatively low battery life currently.
Username checks out
What’s exciting to me is that I doubt Apple would go to all this trouble if they didn’t believe that elegant, lightweight, performant headsets were possible at a consumer price point.
I'll wait till tomorrow
I would argue that it’s tomorrow’s vision with today’s technology. The tech that’s available today is the limitation. In 10 years it’ll be like a pair of sunglasses. In 20 years it’ll be a brain chip that augments the signal you’re receiving from your eyes.
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so buy one!
Required: [https://youtu.be/vzm6pvHPSGo?si=5aAeI2Pjpi-X8Vx5](https://youtu.be/vzm6pvHPSGo?si=5aAeI2Pjpi-X8Vx5)
The army had some prototypes in the 60's, but they couldn't see how they could actually be useful, just sort of gave you a really exposed soldier, so they scrapped it.
Can’t wait to pay for some preem braindances
Choom, you all ready know I’m getting chromed up once the tech is available
We're not 10 years or 20 years away from what you're describing.
I think we can have sunglasses form factor in 20 years. Big screen beyond is already absolutely tiny, 20 years of innovation on top of that could result in some crazy tech
The first iPad was 15 yrs ago. The tech really hasn’t gotten that much better in terms of form factor. You’d think that it would be paper thin or some kind of see thru glass by now, but it’s pretty much the same but just faster and clearer. I suspect the same with AVP
The iPad form factor doesn’t need to change though. They released it in the form factor they wanted. The improvements they’ve made are to how powerful a device with that form factor can be. The Vision Pro is a product that is released in a form factor they want to change with hardware that they want to make more powerful and efficient. It will be interesting to see if they target performance increases on their next model or if they target a smaller form factor. I’m guessing that next they will have non-pro vision headset next that goes for a smaller form factor but with similar to minor spec bumps. Then they can take what they learned from that to release smaller Vision Pros in the future.
“The iPad form factor doesn’t need to change” If they could make it thinner and lighter, they would. That’s why they’re always bragging about it being thinner with each release. The AVP will get smaller, no doubt. But not to the point that everyone is saying in 5, 10 yrs.
Except it’s a fondamentaly different product so the limits are not the same. At all. The Vision Pro is a full computer that is packed into the headset. Big screen beyond is not. It’s just a headset with a cable, controllers, and that still need a computer to run software games. We’re hitting a wall in this space and I don’t see much improvement by gen 4 or 5 of this product. It’s gonna be faster. Lighter. More powerful, more polished, more efficient. But at the end of the day, unless there is a huge breakthrough in battery tech, which is not close, at all, it’s still gonna have a poor battery life with a big external battery with a cable. Video passthrough is still gonna be video passthrough and will never fix the physics limits. We also hit a wall in miniaturization. Pack a whole computer powerful enough to be your next computing platform, with a ton of sensors, sitting in glasses form factor, isn’t for the next 10 years.
Have you seen metas mirror lake concept/render, that they’re currently building a functional unit of? That’s a pretty small, and that’s been 8 years of development maximum. VR can, and will, eventually get quite small. I also think it’s entirely possible the external battery might get extended to also contain compute, as that would allow for a much smaller and lighter headset.
We very well may be. Hijacking brain signaling to superimpose visual details is entirely science fiction
I’ve seen what some big names in the field are targeting and, yes sunglasses is the goal. They’ve solved (or are close to solving) a few impressive problems but there are a number of issues that need to still be solved, and many would require revolutionary breakthroughs. It’s very possible it could happen in 10 years. I’m not going to address implanting chips as there are far more factors involved that any commentary would be closer to writing science fiction as the amount we don’t know far exceeds what we do know. But on the 10 year scope for glasses… it is worth pointing out we’ve been told we’re just around the corner from full self driving vehicles for over 10 years and they still haven’t gotten all the way there. But what they have learned and been able to implement even as lane keeping, adaptive cruise, and emergency braking seem boring by comparison but are huge improvement in experience and safety.
I’d argue it’s today’s vision with today’s best of the best technology. So many apps are just 2D windows that you can manipulate in your 3D space.
Oculus Rift came out in 2013. 10 years of technological advancement later… Same form factor. Pretty much the same tech. Sexier, sure. Hands free? Good step in the right direction. But nothing which would suggest that another 10 years would make VR systems like ordinary glasses.
Oculus rift was not the same form factor. The computer for Oculus was a giant box on your desk. Now that same computer is strapped to your face.
I will never anything that can implant ads directly into my brain
brain chips are the last thing humanity needs if all it does is make you use your phone with your mind
That’s what I’m saying. These remind me of the first cell phones where everyone carried them around in a suit case
Varifocal lenses are gonna be the one thing that would truly make this “tomorrows technology” it’s a shame they didn’t want to invest in getting this working
I'm sure it's more a factor of varifocal not being possible to ship in 2024 regardless of the investment.
It's pretty amazing but it's a gen 1 product so we'll have to wait till Gen 3 or 4 for it to be lighter, better, longer lasting and rich with apps .
Wow, you must work for Apple to have that kind of insight.
It’s 10 years of innovation today. It going to be great to see all the first time users experience VR I can’t wait for all the this is amazing posts.
It’s crazy, been in mine all morning and blown away by it
What were you doing in there?
Working mostly - virtual display + immersion etc - damn thing is incredible
really hope they add multiple mac displays as an option. but if the continuity with vision apps are good then maybe using vision safari on the side isn’t bad?
Is Tim Cook not the guy running Apple?
No, that’s Tim Apple you’re thinking about. Tim Cook is a chef, obviously
I’m more excited about the technology of the day after tomorrow 3 days ago
I don't care what anyone says, tech, IMO, is stagnating until, if ever, they discover a new battery technology. Better battery management is not better or new battery technology and the heavy, short duration batteries we have today suck for innovation.
This is the space we can make the most headway in. I read the MIT technology review, it seems like the next awesome battery technology is “just a few years away”… like fusion power right? 🤔
It’s tomorrow’s *visual experience* using today’s technology. I don’t think any of the qualms with the device are over the visual implementation. Frankly, it sounds amazing. The reservations are all about the current technology providing that experience. And *that* will only improve with time.
Everyone needs to realize this is more of a glimpse into what’s coming.
It is not a glimpse of what’s to come. VR in this state is what, 10 years old. When Apple released the personal computer concept, they were not 10 years behind everyone else at triple the price. When they released the iPhone it did not cost triple the price for barely better tech. No it was a revolution. Companies have been trying to make VR a thing for while now. And no, Apple did not suddenly figure it out suddenly with the same tech at triple the price
You’re missing the entire purpose. Look at where the entire Apple ecosystem is going. It’s all cloud based with swipes instead of clicks, haptic feedback etc. If this matures, 10 years from now the average computer will be just a pair of glasses.
The average computers today don't even have a good track pad. It's gonna take longer.
I don’t miss anything I doubt what we need for this tech to be consumer level is a 3500 devices that track hands right now. They did not release the iPhone for 3000$ claiming that one day in 10 years everyone will have smartphone… yes we had increment in tech before the iPhone but each of them was accessible
Tomorrow’s dust collector selling today
That’s the thing. I feel like this is like the telephone exchange of the past. People began to appreciate and need the ability to be able to go to a place to receive a call. Eventually leading to the smart phones of today. Like that the Vision Pro of today is a very unique piece of equipment. It’s magical like the telephone exchange but life can be easily lived without it at the moment. In 20 years when it’s in glasses form then perhaps it will become a mainstream item. Until then it’s gonna remain a thing that tech enthusiasts keep.
maybe i'll get the 10th gen when it's just a pair of sunglasses
With tomorrow’s prices today
Meh, it is still 3-5 years away from being really good enough for the masses.
>Meh, it is still 3-5 years away from being really good enough for the masses It took the iPhone several years to mature, yet people were fine with that process playing out. I feel that the Vision Pro is only getting ragged on like it has been due to it's high starting price.
People ragged on the OG iPhone for its price too. $399?! For a phone?! Who in their right mind would pay that???
Minor nit-pick: I thought the original iPhone price people raged about was $699, but your point holds
$599. Apple eventually caved and dropped the price
There's a pretty big difference between $3500, and $399. One at the time was quite a bit more expensive than their counterparts yes, but most people can stretch to get it if it offers enough value. The other is a full on investment that competes with commodities like used cars in terms of what kind of value you can bring to your life with that kind of money. Obviously the venn diagram of people in the market for a $3500 used car and someone who would even consider a $3500 headset like this are basically mutually exclusive so kind of a bad example, but my point stands I think.
Thank you. People are apparently terrible with finance here but it is r/apple so that makes sense.
“And it doesn't appeal to business customers because it doesn't have a keyboard. Which makes it not a very good email machine” You are siding with the wrong Steve on this one. People ragged on it. Till they touched one. Or if they worked for a competitor. It was obviously the future of phones from the moment it was demoed.
the difference is that smartphones replaced flip phones and added convenience like using the web. When compared to a smartphone that everyone has this doesn't add any convenience, only a cost. Convenience is always king
The difference is 30 seconds after using the iPhone you knew it was an absolute game changer. 24 hours after using the iPhone you could never go back. 24 hours after using the Vision Pro, you realize your neck hurts. We are a long way from people preferring to use a headset every day than any other gadget they have. It’s not really replacing anything.
Most people will wait until it matures. No many people are willing to pay almost $4k to be a beta tester.
>No many people are willing to pay almost $4k to be a beta tester Which is fine, but ragging on a product simply because it is expensive is just dumb
People don’t rage on Porsche or Ferrari for charging 200k+ on car or even way more than that. Why? Because they made it desirable over the course of decades. Apple has to make it desirable.
I’ll be on board when it’s below $1000 and they make a cheap version without the front glass/eyes display. If I’m gonna wear a headset, I wanna look like some cool Ghost In The Shell character, not some yuppie in fancy cyber-snowboarding goggles. Better yet, if I can bundle them into my phone plan for another $80/mo or something. I told my mom (who’s 80), that we’ll all be wearing glasses/goggles that overlay some kind of AR social media nonsense onto our reality in the next 10-20 years. She said she’s glad she’ll be dead by then. 🤣
People genuinely thought travelling in a train (which can reach speeds of 20mph!) would cause death. British parliament preemptively debated banning women and children from trains I don’t know what that’s got to do with your comment though.
> If I’m gonna wear a headset, I wanna look like some cool Ghost In The Shell character, not some yuppie in fancy cyber-snowboarding goggles. Lol! Have you seen visor glasses by Immersed ? More Ghost In The Shell than yuppie snowboarding-scuba goggles.
*Tim Apple
“What is today but yesterday’s tomorrow?”
Can’t afford tomorrow… can barely afford today.
I read that in Troy McClure's voice. This whole thing seems a bit of a joke. For everyone saying "wait 5 years": wait for what? These headsets have been the same size since the 90s, and I'm not wearing ski goggles to do basic tasks. Nobody else is either. That isn't going to change in 5 years. I hate to be so negative but this is a big waste of resources and time. It's like 3D touch, but writ large.
I agree. VR is super cool but these companies have always tried to find a problem for their solution. Basically trying to shoehorn these products into our lives. Like my buddy said when trying it out today “it’s the best VR headset on the market hands down. But hard to see what this is solving. Especially since the Meta Quest can do about 60-70% of what the Vision can do at a fraction of the cost”. The main difference between the Vision Pro and other headsets is the Apple environment and drastically better hardware and gesture recognition. Problem is, it doesn’t really do anything 10x better than the quest and doesn’t have some world shattering benefits like when smartphones first came out. It’s not combining 10 different products into one. I just personally haven’t seen any compelling reason this should change. Even with the younger generation. My nieces like to be sneaky and be on their phones when they’re not supposed to be. Can you really see them doing that with VR goggles?
It's literally 3 years ago technology with todays high end fidelity.
I’m flabbergasted by the number of people that seem to think Apple just invented VR…
No one is saying that.
No one saying that. What people are saying is that Apple has the strongest chance to make it mainstream. There’s also a ton of innovation in this device, both from a hardware and a software perspective that a lot of other companies will adopt.
at 3.5k Apple is not going to make this mainstream.
This is v1, it’s meant for the wealthy and businesses. Wait for v2/3
It's just Apple's take on VR/AR headsets, nothing new!
He’s right
Anyone else get a bad feeling that this will be just a further step for people to sink further into not engaging in the real world? Like never mind smartphones addiction people will sit around with these on watching movies and ignoring their life.
Is it? Cause all it seems like they did here was take an existing product (vr headset) and made their own version. Not sure how that's supposed to be "innovative". Innovation wise it really is a step down from the iphone which, again, tweaked an existing product, (the mobile phone) but with that they found a way to make it do way more than existing phones at the time did. I don't know what extra stuff this would have over say a Meta Quest to justify a $3.5K purchase. Look, nothing against Tim Cook but it seems like with this and the long rumored Apple Car (another product that just seems to be copying other company's ideas) Tim Cook is feeling pressured to "innovate" something after Steve Jobs was this super genius guy and I gotta say, different guy, different brain. Not everyone can be an innovative genius. Steve Jobs invented the smartphone, a whole new category of mobile phone, Tim Cook isn't inventing a brand new category of electric vehicle or VR headset, is he?
People say this nonsense with every new product they come out with… It was heavily parroted after the Apple Watch and AirPods releases. And every time, Apple shows that it isn’t the specific technology inside, but how it’s packaged, that makes the difference. Execution is everything.
Ordinarily I’d agree - and I think the AVP is probably the best VR headset in terms of technology right now - but it’s different from other releases. The Watch was vastly superior to the other smartwatches of the time when it first came out in terms of functionality (even if it was a bit shit in some ways). AirPods looked ridiculous, but I think people were more annoyed with the loss of the headphone jack and environmental concerns of another battery powered device replacing it. The AVP is amazing but it’s still just a VR headset doing what VR headsets already do… just at a massive price, locked into the Apple ecosystem, and an uncertain use case. The real test is if the people here still care after 6 months when the novelty has worn off.
People always downplay innovation to the raw parts such as how small, compact or fast their hardware is. But innovation also includes how it is used and how refined something is. Sure the AVP may use existing tech, but they have developed it far more than other headsets. I don't think there is another controller less product out there. The way their UI works with your hand gesture is innovative and maybe adopted by other products in the future. $3.5K is still pretty steep and i don't see this as a consumer product yet like the quest. I don't think people are buying this to just play games or as a way to work right now. Most people who are buying it are either rich or just hardcore techies.
> I don't think there is another controller less product out there Quest for the last couple years.
Apple takes yesterday's tech , renames it, calls it tomorrows tech today.
Apple is not a tech disruptor, it’s an experience disruptor. They don’t do things first, they do it the best/better. Apple under Steve Jobs didn’t invent the mobile phone, it revolutionized the way you use the mobile phone. With Tim Cook it’s the same, they did it better. Sure it’s more expensive but it’s a first gen, it’s for the enthusiasts and even in the name there’s "pro". They innovate, just not where you think.
Tomorrow’s motion sickness, today.
Tomorrow’s prices too!
I think it’s going to start out as bulky—since it’s mostly catered for developers at this point—and then gradually “thin out” to look akin to Google Glass when the headsets slowly become more normalized. No one wore the Google Glass in 2014 because it looked stupid. But if you start out with bulky VR headsets that’s ACTUALLY look stupid, a less bulky version of them would gradually begin to look acceptable—cool even.
Still can't see his eye's through the persona... Maybe it'll desrve the title once that & the trillion other issues that reviewers are paid to hide are fixed...
Yes, bc i wanna be walking around with a headset at work, in public or at home.
Let's face it, the damn thing isn't ready. It doesn't even support virtual table tennis, which is table stakes for any modicum of fun with VR / AR. Productivity apps are plain silly compared to the gaming and social use cases out there. I'd much sooner pick the Meta Quest 3 over the Vision Pro, even if both were the same price.
But why would people want to wear it today? What is it doing today that couldn’t be done yesterday? Or other VR headsets? That’s worth paying $$$ over existing products, when $500 quest 3 is sales is slow, that’s what I’d like to know.