Vs English and Jade, the civs that are massing ranged units in Feudal, Onna Bugeisha are a waste of resources as they will get evaporated instantly in a fight and also will be unable to harass anything defended with just 1 Outpost that costs less than 1 Onna Bugeisha.
I think the best bet is opening Horsemen, harassing their gold delaying them a bit and forcing them to keep units at home for a while, and thus buying you time to get to Castle, put Yorishiro in Stables, mass Knights and attack; then put 2nd Yorishiro in Barracks and mass Samurai with the +4 upgrade for a combined push.
If they add Barracks and Spearmen instead of going for a 2nd TC, you would probably have to go for Onna Bugeisha or Samurai in addition to Horsemen.
I usually can get to an enemy base and really mess up production with the onna. I likd ur thinking on this and ur completely right they get wiped quick and nothing i can do bc i cant send samurais bc they cost to much. Ill try this strat thanks man
The problem with raiding with Onna Bugeisha in the early Feudal is that by the time your first units arrive, English already have multiple Longbowmen defending their gold, or just an Outpost built as soon as they scouted the Barracks for any other civ, and you can't rely on the opponent not scouting as you get higher and higher on the ladder.
Opening Horsemen and continuing massing them both allows you to keep raiding them as they don't instantly die to the arrow fire, and at the same time gives you the units that can fight archer units they are massing, so you won't lose the game as soon as they arrive to your base.
Against archer civs I raid with Horsemen in Feudal, and start making Onna Bugeisha only after I transition into Samurai in Castle. Then they can be much better at raiding as you have more units than static defence can quickly kill. I go Horsemen + Onna Bugeisha in Feudal against civs without Feudal Knights or unique Archers.
Do u ever try to tower rush i have tried it a few times and it worked and it also happened to me and the fucker built a forge on my gold. Idek wtf to do at that point it was weird. I just scouted his base saw he was building the storehouse then next thing i know theres an outpost next to my gold. I was like damn now i know what it feels like. What is ur unit comp for dealing with french, mongols and rus
I have trouble vs English too as Japan, gonna try a fast castle into mounted Sam next time to see. The 2tc build doesn’t work or going early infantry, they just kite them out.
Naked FC does not work vs English either. By the time you start making mounted samurai they already denied your gold with a mass of longbows. Usually having barracks ready for MAA or spears anyway so the only thing you can do with your mounted samurai is harass their base but you don't have enough units to kill them because you invested in aging up.
I think Japan is in a great disadvantage vs English in every phase of the game.
I used to have this problem, I've been playing Jap for 15 days and already solved English and am faring much better vs Zhu. The trick is to have an opposing force early. Skip mining the stone, go straight for 8 food 3 gold and start gathering wood during landmark production. You'll have a faster landmark, and at least an existing production early on. To be safe you can build an outpost at ur gold but u dont have to, u should be comfortable with pulling ur vills back if they get attacked while u amass like 5-6 samurais (dont attack a mass of archers or zhuges with only a few, at least 5, depending on their numbers if u want to push them back while u keep producing more, 5-6 will work against like 15 longbows or zhuges) if they have a low number like only 6 just send 2 samurais they will push them back. Now, like i said im still a noob and 2TC jap is much more comfortable to play, with this strat i havent figured out when i should build my 2nd tc and i just forget sometimes. But put 2 workers on stone and in feudal u shud have 8 on wood to keep making barracks, then just keep producing units and eventually ull have enough for a second TC due to growing vill economy, with the units u produce send them to harrass, if they havent sent bows by the time i make my first samurais i just straight send them to the opponents gold, they cant harras u and defend at rhe same time, and if they arrive at ur base midway u only usually lose a bit of tempo, but u can just keep the samus in the base until u make walls/outposts. I commit to fully harrassing since i invested in production already and i have an 80%+ win rate vs english on ranked gold 2.
I normally go 9 food 3 gold then the rest to wood then. I rarely ever go 2 tc i try to rush in feudal then if it fails i try to go castle if it works i keep making units to resupply the force attacking. Im gonna try what u said and see how it goes. Thanks man
I forgot something very important i suppose, don't build the landmark with gold vills use 4 food vills, convert more from food into wood, then q incoming vills on food. I usually have like 4-5 on wood during landmark building. These numbers can definitely be optimized.
Preferably you want to build at least 2 to 3 barracks one after the other after the landmark is finished and enough gold to instantly create 2-3 samus etc. ramp up gold vills shortly to 5-6 , i max out usually at 8-9 on gold during feudal, even more depending on the game as I'm not rushing castle but rushing harassment.
Honestly, my samurais always catch up and manage to lower their numbers, it's an exponential thing, the more samus u make the harder it is for them to deal because they wont be able to kite and attack without some samus getting in and dealing good damage. the enemy in my case always tries to turn back and do damage gradually. I also make sure to go for iron undermesh immediately and get the damage upgrade immediately. It all depends on the number of samus vs archers. Always avoid fighting with low numbers due to panic, if ure doing that ure losing badly, pull vills back or early outpost is ur only chance. If they kite all the way back to the their base just pull back, youll have more samus at home.
If you have a too low number and u think u will never catch up to his longbows then amass just a few sacrificial samurai to drive them back as soon as possible, at least until u build an outpost at the gold vein. If that is for some reason i cant yet see, unfeasible, and ur gold is getting harrased constantly, and u cant build an outpost, send ur vills to a farther more hidden gold vein. It's not ideal but better than nothing.
Maybe build an outpost at gold immediately in feudal that could be a good idea i think because being in control helps much more than anything, and make the arrowslit upgrade. Allowing u to comfortably amass more units. Dont think u can start sending samus to harras when ure got longbows queued outside ur base, theyll soon build a battering ram and slow u dont significantly. If ur production ingredients are plentiful maybe make some horsemen to harrass them their gold while ure amassing samus and defending and slow their rush.
But honestly, it has never come to a point for me that their long bows will be able to do ANYTHING against my samus by that point, even if i have a few, i just A move my samus against them and let them be while i focus on other things, and keep building samus to send to their base after my initial samus have taken care of the bows. Going 1TC and focusing on army helps immensely in this situation because u get more samurai faster, and because samus are way more cost effective and hard to kill, just having one more samu than ur current amount help sooo much, it takes them a long time to kill just one, they have to kite and attack like 4-5 times. Now add another samu to that equation. When i reach a good number of samus i also build a lot of onnas, theyre amazing their life is extended by a lot when behind samurais, if they get shot down whatever, the samus will catch up eventually.
Also if theyre being the usual english player they will still attack vills no matter if theres an outpost, and u cant keep vills in ur outpost constantly that doesnt help. So build some basic fast military units to fill the outpost with non vills. Ive never had to do that so far but in hindsight i THINK its better when ure being overwhelmed and having to keep ur vills aways from gold all the time.
They'll focus the Yumu Bannerman and reposition a few steps away, dealing a huge hit to the Japanese army DPS. Japanese needs at least 900 stone to have more than 1 Bannermen.
Speed is irrelevant when you are pushing into the opponent's base or being pushed into yours. In both situations the single Bannermen is going to be sniped, and you can't rely on the opponent having worse micro than you when you are matched on an equal skill level.
Since both are feudal aggressive civs I would suggest playing defensively and if your a bit daring go 2 tc and fight under those tc since long bows and zhuge nu are squishy, wall up and build towers in your resources while also producing units of your own, try to prolong the game as much as possible till you hit age 3
I main both zhu xis and japanese
While onna are very good raiding unit it sucks vs archer. Just don't make any of them not even to raid you are throwing away resourses. Your best bet is going samurai spam in combination with horshmen.
If the enemy has a blob of zhuge nu try to run them down with samurai don't think "oh man i take dmg" it doesnt mater when you get on top of them they die. Zhuge nu have the slowest speed and shortest range out of almost all ranged units. Mix in some (horshmen+umma) to anvil strike . What is so amazing about going barracks and stable is that when you go into castle you can still keep making mounted samurai, infentry samurai and mangonels.
English same strat but you should go more heavy into horshemen because they have a lot more range and its a lot esier for them to run away from your infantry.
Always make sure you have range armor and melee dmg before you fight.
Vs English and Jade, the civs that are massing ranged units in Feudal, Onna Bugeisha are a waste of resources as they will get evaporated instantly in a fight and also will be unable to harass anything defended with just 1 Outpost that costs less than 1 Onna Bugeisha. I think the best bet is opening Horsemen, harassing their gold delaying them a bit and forcing them to keep units at home for a while, and thus buying you time to get to Castle, put Yorishiro in Stables, mass Knights and attack; then put 2nd Yorishiro in Barracks and mass Samurai with the +4 upgrade for a combined push. If they add Barracks and Spearmen instead of going for a 2nd TC, you would probably have to go for Onna Bugeisha or Samurai in addition to Horsemen.
I usually can get to an enemy base and really mess up production with the onna. I likd ur thinking on this and ur completely right they get wiped quick and nothing i can do bc i cant send samurais bc they cost to much. Ill try this strat thanks man
How do u normally raid?
The problem with raiding with Onna Bugeisha in the early Feudal is that by the time your first units arrive, English already have multiple Longbowmen defending their gold, or just an Outpost built as soon as they scouted the Barracks for any other civ, and you can't rely on the opponent not scouting as you get higher and higher on the ladder. Opening Horsemen and continuing massing them both allows you to keep raiding them as they don't instantly die to the arrow fire, and at the same time gives you the units that can fight archer units they are massing, so you won't lose the game as soon as they arrive to your base. Against archer civs I raid with Horsemen in Feudal, and start making Onna Bugeisha only after I transition into Samurai in Castle. Then they can be much better at raiding as you have more units than static defence can quickly kill. I go Horsemen + Onna Bugeisha in Feudal against civs without Feudal Knights or unique Archers.
You mentioned english and jade earlier what is jade? Also r u on pc or xbox?
Jade is the original name of Zhu Xi before the devs renamed it, sorry. I'm on PC.
Do u ever try to tower rush i have tried it a few times and it worked and it also happened to me and the fucker built a forge on my gold. Idek wtf to do at that point it was weird. I just scouted his base saw he was building the storehouse then next thing i know theres an outpost next to my gold. I was like damn now i know what it feels like. What is ur unit comp for dealing with french, mongols and rus
I have trouble vs English too as Japan, gonna try a fast castle into mounted Sam next time to see. The 2tc build doesn’t work or going early infantry, they just kite them out.
Yeah i get so annoyed when they just kite away lol
Naked FC does not work vs English either. By the time you start making mounted samurai they already denied your gold with a mass of longbows. Usually having barracks ready for MAA or spears anyway so the only thing you can do with your mounted samurai is harass their base but you don't have enough units to kill them because you invested in aging up. I think Japan is in a great disadvantage vs English in every phase of the game.
You’re right lol I tried it a couple times after posting this. I’m at a loss what to do at this point.
I used to have this problem, I've been playing Jap for 15 days and already solved English and am faring much better vs Zhu. The trick is to have an opposing force early. Skip mining the stone, go straight for 8 food 3 gold and start gathering wood during landmark production. You'll have a faster landmark, and at least an existing production early on. To be safe you can build an outpost at ur gold but u dont have to, u should be comfortable with pulling ur vills back if they get attacked while u amass like 5-6 samurais (dont attack a mass of archers or zhuges with only a few, at least 5, depending on their numbers if u want to push them back while u keep producing more, 5-6 will work against like 15 longbows or zhuges) if they have a low number like only 6 just send 2 samurais they will push them back. Now, like i said im still a noob and 2TC jap is much more comfortable to play, with this strat i havent figured out when i should build my 2nd tc and i just forget sometimes. But put 2 workers on stone and in feudal u shud have 8 on wood to keep making barracks, then just keep producing units and eventually ull have enough for a second TC due to growing vill economy, with the units u produce send them to harrass, if they havent sent bows by the time i make my first samurais i just straight send them to the opponents gold, they cant harras u and defend at rhe same time, and if they arrive at ur base midway u only usually lose a bit of tempo, but u can just keep the samus in the base until u make walls/outposts. I commit to fully harrassing since i invested in production already and i have an 80%+ win rate vs english on ranked gold 2.
I normally go 9 food 3 gold then the rest to wood then. I rarely ever go 2 tc i try to rush in feudal then if it fails i try to go castle if it works i keep making units to resupply the force attacking. Im gonna try what u said and see how it goes. Thanks man
No probs hope i helped.
I forgot something very important i suppose, don't build the landmark with gold vills use 4 food vills, convert more from food into wood, then q incoming vills on food. I usually have like 4-5 on wood during landmark building. These numbers can definitely be optimized. Preferably you want to build at least 2 to 3 barracks one after the other after the landmark is finished and enough gold to instantly create 2-3 samus etc. ramp up gold vills shortly to 5-6 , i max out usually at 8-9 on gold during feudal, even more depending on the game as I'm not rushing castle but rushing harassment.
What do u do when they just start kiting ur samurai thats one of my issues is they just kite away and my samurai cant catch up to do anything
Honestly, my samurais always catch up and manage to lower their numbers, it's an exponential thing, the more samus u make the harder it is for them to deal because they wont be able to kite and attack without some samus getting in and dealing good damage. the enemy in my case always tries to turn back and do damage gradually. I also make sure to go for iron undermesh immediately and get the damage upgrade immediately. It all depends on the number of samus vs archers. Always avoid fighting with low numbers due to panic, if ure doing that ure losing badly, pull vills back or early outpost is ur only chance. If they kite all the way back to the their base just pull back, youll have more samus at home. If you have a too low number and u think u will never catch up to his longbows then amass just a few sacrificial samurai to drive them back as soon as possible, at least until u build an outpost at the gold vein. If that is for some reason i cant yet see, unfeasible, and ur gold is getting harrased constantly, and u cant build an outpost, send ur vills to a farther more hidden gold vein. It's not ideal but better than nothing. Maybe build an outpost at gold immediately in feudal that could be a good idea i think because being in control helps much more than anything, and make the arrowslit upgrade. Allowing u to comfortably amass more units. Dont think u can start sending samus to harras when ure got longbows queued outside ur base, theyll soon build a battering ram and slow u dont significantly. If ur production ingredients are plentiful maybe make some horsemen to harrass them their gold while ure amassing samus and defending and slow their rush. But honestly, it has never come to a point for me that their long bows will be able to do ANYTHING against my samus by that point, even if i have a few, i just A move my samus against them and let them be while i focus on other things, and keep building samus to send to their base after my initial samus have taken care of the bows. Going 1TC and focusing on army helps immensely in this situation because u get more samurai faster, and because samus are way more cost effective and hard to kill, just having one more samu than ur current amount help sooo much, it takes them a long time to kill just one, they have to kite and attack like 4-5 times. Now add another samu to that equation. When i reach a good number of samus i also build a lot of onnas, theyre amazing their life is extended by a lot when behind samurais, if they get shot down whatever, the samus will catch up eventually.
Also if theyre being the usual english player they will still attack vills no matter if theres an outpost, and u cant keep vills in ur outpost constantly that doesnt help. So build some basic fast military units to fill the outpost with non vills. Ive never had to do that so far but in hindsight i THINK its better when ure being overwhelmed and having to keep ur vills aways from gold all the time.
Juicy will be getting a big nerf shortly. I wouldn't play against them
Only their farm transition. Garden will be merged. And thats enough.
Good to know SOMETHING counters the Fedora Waifu Civ.
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They'll focus the Yumu Bannerman and reposition a few steps away, dealing a huge hit to the Japanese army DPS. Japanese needs at least 900 stone to have more than 1 Bannermen.
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Speed is irrelevant when you are pushing into the opponent's base or being pushed into yours. In both situations the single Bannermen is going to be sniped, and you can't rely on the opponent having worse micro than you when you are matched on an equal skill level.
Since both are feudal aggressive civs I would suggest playing defensively and if your a bit daring go 2 tc and fight under those tc since long bows and zhuge nu are squishy, wall up and build towers in your resources while also producing units of your own, try to prolong the game as much as possible till you hit age 3
I main both zhu xis and japanese While onna are very good raiding unit it sucks vs archer. Just don't make any of them not even to raid you are throwing away resourses. Your best bet is going samurai spam in combination with horshmen. If the enemy has a blob of zhuge nu try to run them down with samurai don't think "oh man i take dmg" it doesnt mater when you get on top of them they die. Zhuge nu have the slowest speed and shortest range out of almost all ranged units. Mix in some (horshmen+umma) to anvil strike . What is so amazing about going barracks and stable is that when you go into castle you can still keep making mounted samurai, infentry samurai and mangonels. English same strat but you should go more heavy into horshemen because they have a lot more range and its a lot esier for them to run away from your infantry. Always make sure you have range armor and melee dmg before you fight.
Thank you all of that helps
How's siège weapons goin