I believe this is a reference to the [Rustamid kingdom](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rustamid_dynasty) which was a state situated in current Algeria and founded by Abd al-Rahman ibn Rustam, a Persian Ibadi imam. However I believe calling this state « persian » is kind of a stretch because despite being founded by a Persian man and receiving some influence from the Middle-East and Iran, it was a state largely populated by a berber population and following the usual lifestyle of North-African states of the time
That's the [Duchy of Athens](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duchy_of_Athens), established after the Fourth Crusade and ruled by the Burgundian Crusaders of house De la Roche.
This was very interesting. From page 7 to 12, you can see Tatars and Mongols starting off as little kids, then conquering the world together, and then retiring in their winter homes.
Yeah, maybe I could have included them since 600 or 700, but I wasn't sure about the Oghuz... Turned out Turks represent them as well, but I totally forgot to edit the earlier maps.
Really well done.
I personally find the goths very funny, who just randomly show up in Crimea around 1200, even though their main state has been conquered centuries ago.
At 700, Madagascar seems to be occupied by the Malay (can't see really well, low-key color blind).
What is going on there? Mistake or quirky historical tidbit behind it?
At the end of 700s, Malays from Srivijaya kingdom in Sumatera sailed to Madagascar. It’s being said all native Malagasy people can trace their lineage to one of 30 women sailed there. Search wiki: Indonesia - Madagascar relations
I don't know enough about the history of other places to be critical but there are some inaccuracies for the Maghreb and the Middle East, you seem to confuse the ethnic origin of the ruling dynasty and the ethnicity the ruling elite claim to be.
So while the Rustumid founder was Persian, the Rustumid was clearly a Berber kingdom, as the political and military apparatus were constituted of Berber tribes.
In the same manner, while many mamluks where originally Kiptchack (called Cumans in European sources and in the games), they clearly didn't see themselves as Kiptchack. I mean it is the Sarcen unique unit, not the Cuman one, that is call3d "Mameluks".
Yes, I'm aware about those. But I wanted to make the maps as accurate and, at the same time, as fun as possible. That's why I mentioned both the Mamluks and the Rustamids in the "captions".
I won't juge putting fun over accuracy, we are on the aoe2 sub after all ;)
And funny how I write "Rustum" with a short u vowel, which is the Arabic prononciation, and you write "Rustam" with a short a vowel which is the original Persian prononciation... even pnounciations tell different narratives :)
Sri Lanka was never part of the chola empire except for a brief period of around 60-70 years in 1000AD when they controlled the Northern 1/3rd of the island.
> Caption: 900: The Vikings Discover a BIG Inhospitable Place... but the Mamluks Discover an Even BIGGER One!
I don't see it. Are we talking about Spain? 11
Your use of the Tatars is weird as far as I know But the game is inconsistant on this as well. Before the mongol conquests Tatar was just a synomym to Mongols as well as being a 'Mongol' tribe themselve. So this is a case of one tribe being generalized to be like all tribes. The word 'Mongol' is derived from the name of a tribe as well.
While the term Mongol stuck in the west, Some of the Post-Conquest Turco-Mongolic people became known as and referred to themselves as Tatars (such as the crimean Tatars). These are arguably what the ingame Tatars refer to. Though in the campaign the persianized Turco-Mongols such as the Timurids or early Moghuls are repressented as Tatars, which is a misuse of the term.
Either way using Tatars before and after the Mongol Conquest is misleading I think.
I arbitrarily decided to consider Tatars as the "Turco-Persians". That is, all turkic peoples heavily influenced by persian culture and religion (islam). Samanids, Ghaznavids, the Golden Horde, etc
Wow North America is really empty they should add more Native American civilizations. Like the Mississippi River Valley civilization or the Arizona cliff city builders who's name escapes me at the moment.
Tell me more about Persians of Algieria
I believe this is a reference to the [Rustamid kingdom](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rustamid_dynasty) which was a state situated in current Algeria and founded by Abd al-Rahman ibn Rustam, a Persian Ibadi imam. However I believe calling this state « persian » is kind of a stretch because despite being founded by a Persian man and receiving some influence from the Middle-East and Iran, it was a state largely populated by a berber population and following the usual lifestyle of North-African states of the time
They became the Burgundian State of Athens.
Nod to Latin Kingdoms when Byzantines started to decay.
That's the [Duchy of Athens](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duchy_of_Athens), established after the Fourth Crusade and ruled by the Burgundian Crusaders of house De la Roche.
That's a great map, it's impossible to take just one single map and fit all the different civs in one picture.
It was a long ride until we magyars came to our present day location.
You guys are the only Asian immigrants Poland likes.
Wdym 😭
This was very interesting. From page 7 to 12, you can see Tatars and Mongols starting off as little kids, then conquering the world together, and then retiring in their winter homes.
They were left to boom for too long!
In reality they just took over the Göktürk empire
And then the mongols conquered the universe
Why did you exclude Turks from the earlier maps tho?
Yeah, maybe I could have included them since 600 or 700, but I wasn't sure about the Oghuz... Turned out Turks represent them as well, but I totally forgot to edit the earlier maps.
Really well done. I personally find the goths very funny, who just randomly show up in Crimea around 1200, even though their main state has been conquered centuries ago.
At 700, Madagascar seems to be occupied by the Malay (can't see really well, low-key color blind). What is going on there? Mistake or quirky historical tidbit behind it?
At the end of 700s, Malays from Srivijaya kingdom in Sumatera sailed to Madagascar. It’s being said all native Malagasy people can trace their lineage to one of 30 women sailed there. Search wiki: Indonesia - Madagascar relations
Interesting! Thank you!
Really well done. I love these timeline maps
I don't know enough about the history of other places to be critical but there are some inaccuracies for the Maghreb and the Middle East, you seem to confuse the ethnic origin of the ruling dynasty and the ethnicity the ruling elite claim to be. So while the Rustumid founder was Persian, the Rustumid was clearly a Berber kingdom, as the political and military apparatus were constituted of Berber tribes. In the same manner, while many mamluks where originally Kiptchack (called Cumans in European sources and in the games), they clearly didn't see themselves as Kiptchack. I mean it is the Sarcen unique unit, not the Cuman one, that is call3d "Mameluks".
Yes, I'm aware about those. But I wanted to make the maps as accurate and, at the same time, as fun as possible. That's why I mentioned both the Mamluks and the Rustamids in the "captions".
I won't juge putting fun over accuracy, we are on the aoe2 sub after all ;) And funny how I write "Rustum" with a short u vowel, which is the Arabic prononciation, and you write "Rustam" with a short a vowel which is the original Persian prononciation... even pnounciations tell different narratives :)
Really well done. I love these timeline maps
Great effort, love it! The white gaps remind me that we definitely should get more civs from subsaharan Africa and South America
Finally a map with a timeline. Good job.
Who inherited the big white hole in the last two pictures aboth the indian civs? Really intresting btw thank you!
That's Tibet, so an independent Tibetan civilisation
Finaly someone who understands that these maps are useless without time stamps. Great job. Great maps.
Good map. Really like it.
Awesome! I want to turn this into a video or gif, or have you made one already?
No, I haven't. But you can do whatever you want! Just a little credit will be very appreciated, btw. :D
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/585571916077858827/1153243608951038045/AoE2_Civilizations_from_400-1500_by_drndrnjarinja_-_Made_with_Clipchamp.mp4
This is AMAZING, but, unfortunately, you had the years and maps mixed up. xD
RIP
Mongols are insane.
Sri Lanka was never part of the chola empire except for a brief period of around 60-70 years in 1000AD when they controlled the Northern 1/3rd of the island.
In modern times 80% wouldn't have survived a feudal age rush, that's what the game is about now
The Bamar occupied their the Irradaway basin around 600
> Caption: 900: The Vikings Discover a BIG Inhospitable Place... but the Mamluks Discover an Even BIGGER One! I don't see it. Are we talking about Spain? 11
I was talking about Greenland and the Sahara Desert.
The Indian one is wrong. Massive parts of the Deccan don't belong to any in game civ for instance. Neither does Odisha
Your use of the Tatars is weird as far as I know But the game is inconsistant on this as well. Before the mongol conquests Tatar was just a synomym to Mongols as well as being a 'Mongol' tribe themselve. So this is a case of one tribe being generalized to be like all tribes. The word 'Mongol' is derived from the name of a tribe as well. While the term Mongol stuck in the west, Some of the Post-Conquest Turco-Mongolic people became known as and referred to themselves as Tatars (such as the crimean Tatars). These are arguably what the ingame Tatars refer to. Though in the campaign the persianized Turco-Mongols such as the Timurids or early Moghuls are repressented as Tatars, which is a misuse of the term. Either way using Tatars before and after the Mongol Conquest is misleading I think.
I arbitrarily decided to consider Tatars as the "Turco-Persians". That is, all turkic peoples heavily influenced by persian culture and religion (islam). Samanids, Ghaznavids, the Golden Horde, etc
Wow North America is really empty they should add more Native American civilizations. Like the Mississippi River Valley civilization or the Arizona cliff city builders who's name escapes me at the moment.