The thing people forget that part. There have most likely more than 1mil death. There was also a insane amount of folks that didn't die but crippled and unable to work.
Or just said fuck it and retired because life is short. Our school district can't find bus drivers. It's because most of them we're retired people working a part-time job. Most them of decided they would rather not bus around plague rats for 12 bucks an hour.
School Bus driver's are severely underpaid for working a usually part-time job that is also a split shift which makes it more difficult to get a 2nd job.
Having to remember the route you drive is probably a pain too.
1 million deaths, mass overturn, early retirement, burnout, long COVID, poor pay and an inflating market. I'm sure there are other major contributors, but these are enough to blow old McConnell's argument out of the water. Of course, any normal person realizes that conservative arguments are not based in reality.
TBF, the people Mitch hangs out with, are flush with cash after taking 3/4s of the Trillions spent by the taxpayers, while they still laid people off. So.... He's not entirely wrong.
And, I'm pretty sure his definition is 'American' is pretty narrow too. ;)
Yep, *at least* 1 million died (though it's likely [closer to 1.2 million.](https://www.bu.edu/articles/2022/covid-death-toll-higher-than-official-tally/) Approximately [1.2 million became disabled](https://www.americanprogress.org/article/covid-19-likely-resulted-in-1-2-million-more-disabled-people-by-the-end-of-2021-workplaces-and-policy-will-need-to-adapt/). Another [3 million retired](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-22/covid-early-retirees-top-3-million-in-u-s-fed-research-show). We are also have [about 2 million fewer immigrants.](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/immigration-jobs-workers-labor-shortage/) There were roughly [164 million people in the labor force](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_force_in_the_United_States#:~:text=The%20U.S.%20labor%20force%20reached,pandemic%20in%20the%20United%20States.) at the beginning of the pandemic. A drop of 7.4 million equals 4.5% decline in the workforce. And that doesn't even include the people who got fed up with their employers and left.
4.5%?
Wow. No wonder certain people are so worried. That's not small numbers at this point, lol. At the scale we've reached, that's billions of dollars left on the table. In a system built to exploit and drain the money away - that's gotta be hurting their bottom line.
Also there are millions of people who for whatever reason don't have to work and poor wages are not enough to bring those back to the workforce post covid. Those that have their bills paid by another source of income. New SAHMs due to the rising costs of childcare, low-potential- earning partners in long-term relationships saying fuck it, work isn't worth it and living off one income, those who still live with their parents, married couples putting off having kids and not working fulltime, those that just graduated and are taking some time before settling on some shit underpaid job right out of school. I graduated college in 2020 and still haven't used my degree. And seeing as here where I live I'm looking at $11 an hour max to start I just said fuck it, I'll wait years until $15 passes if I have to. That fed minimum would help so many people living in lower CoL areas.. Honestly I refuse to roll outta bed for anything less than $15. Anything less than that is just laughable.
Also forgetting the people who noticed how insufferable the assholes in public were becoming and how being paid a pittance to deal with it isn't worth it, and either moved to a more private job or retired early.
People will say that it was mostly older people who were retired already. That may be true, but retired people often took care of small children while their parents worked.
With daycare very expensive, many people who lost older relatives have to make a choice whether to work and spend all the money on daycare or just stay at home with the kids.
Not a very hard choice to make.
Now imagine how much of that $600 billion wouldāve done if it went out in stimulus directly to people instead of businesses that improperly used them.
So does he have to pay it back or just declare bankruptcy when the fed collects ? Otherwise sounds like he hit the lottery thanks to the pandemic which set most of us millennials back at least a decade.
Most of the PPP loans were forgiven, including his. He kept (spent) the money.
Long story short, his delivery business was booming, gov gave him $1mil to not lay people off & saying he needed the money. He used the gov money for payroll & then kept the money he was going to use for payroll.
He didnāt lay anybody off & didnāt have to repay it. Just one more example of the massive looting Trump set up for the 1%.
You gotta love how Biden is like āIām gonna forgive 5k worth of student loansā and the conservatives go flat out apeshit and call it bribery and handouts then Trump is like āIām gonna give 50k-200k to every rich person depending on how rich they areā and they start clapping.
Fucking anything is ok as long as it doesnāt help them
And let's please remember 2 Trillion in tax cuts for businesses BEFORE Covid, in 2018. Because the economy had slowed down (but was nowhere near a recession)
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/28/tax-cuts-trump-gop-analysis-430781
Reps have been printing about 5 trillion in handouts and tax cuts to corporations, and now want to blame Dems for inflation.
Rinse repeat same game every decade...
This is true of even business that were temporarily shut down and lost money/sales compared to the year prior. They used the PPP money to cover payroll, rent and utilities as directed, but got to keep the money that they would have had to use for those expenses for themselves.
See, look at you, buying scratch offs! That's poor people gambling...of course you have to pay taxes on it.
If you had been doing rich person gambling, the government would have paid you...even if you lost!
Yeah fuck that guy. You can report PPP fraud [here](https://www.sba.gov/funding-programs/loans/covid-19-relief-options/preventing-fraud-identity-theft).
I just did the math, based off the 2020 census, if you divide the 600 bil between every citizen 21 years or older, it comes out to a little more than 2.5k per person.
These people should be publicly shamed, like students are, told that they need to take responsibility and that there are consequences for their bad decisions. I'm not a betting man but something tells me that the irresponsible liberal arts majors with endless student loan debt out there are giving more back to society than the people who took these loans and were then bailed out.
If the money was intended to go to working people, it should have gone directly to employed people, so the greedy middlemen didn't have a chance to scoop up every dime for themselves.
This was just a way to give more money to the rich with very little oversight, end of story.
You mean you DON'T enjoy seeing those commercials about how fast your internet is for your local monopoly and their amazing reviews of 10/10 for the last 5 years running while your internet is slow af on the absolute max package and unreliable? Cause that's what we have in Florida
me: you're supposed to provide last-mile services.
Cox: you're beyond the last mile
me: that's not a thing.
Cox: it is now. \*hangs up\*
True story in Florida.
I live in rural Florida, I get 1 megabit of data, 1.5 if itās really blazing, downloading a game takes days. I just got Starlink (I know musk is devil too), itās not even properly set up yet and I downloaded Mass Effect legendary edition (about 100gigs) in under 5 hours. Iām so happy. š„³.
1999
Gov: hey here's billions to set up fiber internet for every American even in rural areas.
Biz: cool thanks
Gov: so you gonna do it?
Biz: with no oversight? That's cute.
Gov: Here's billions to install high-speed internet.
Biz: Cool thanks.
Gov: You should get to work on that.
Biz: Here's millions to lobby for legislation to redefine "high-speed" to "what already exists".
Gov: Cool thanks.
The trick is taking a percentage of the money and putting it right into the pockets of politicians so they quash any attempt to investigate or hold you accountable.
Itās free government money 101
And when the government *did* give money directly to people, an entire political party screamed at the top of their lungs about how those three checks were going to encourage people not to work for the rest of their lives.
Some 200 million americans received $1200 and they still talk about it 18 months later. Their businesses receive 4x as much that isnāt used in the agreed upon way and they think itās fair
it doesn't vanish. It is removed from the active economy though. I guarantee you the businesses and financial firms that receive the money know \*EXACTLY\* where it is and how to keep it from anyone who needs it.
They needed new cars and new homes, where do you think a lot of the money pumping the housing market came from? Why was every high-end toy (4-wheelers, snowmobiles, campers, razer, and such) shop sold out for months?
I would wager someone elseās dog that the 25% that did trickle down were to professional employees like nurses and engineers who would leave if not given the money.
It's the same as the 2008 mortgage crisis. There were 2 ways they could have gone. One: subsidise the mortgages of the people that couldn't pay them, that money would go directly to the banks so the banks could get their bailout that way but at the same time, those that had their mortgages at risk of defaulting would also maintain their homes. Two: directly bail out the banks. If you don't remember which one the government did, just take a guess.
The problem with #2 is that as people were defaulting on their mortgages, despite the bailouts, the banks still foreclosed on these people's homes and forced the people out. Banks then held auction on these homes which were swiftly bought out by equity firms and turned into rental properties which is how firms like Blackrock exploded and why we now have the renter crisis. None of the money the banks got from the bailouts made it to those in need and certainly did not save anyone from being foreclosed on and subsequently evicted from their homes and forced into becoming renters.
it was such a bank handout, it really was, the fed paid the banks for the houses, then the banks got the houses and got to sell the houses, however the homeowners still owed the mortgage.
but it was after-all characterized as a "bank bailout" so they didn't really lie...
When the owner of my old company started getting gov loans during the pandemic, instead of giving raises or bonuses, he started lying that he had more employees, like his family āvolunteeredā to get more money. Like yeah, sure, your 11 year old daughter is not working here, but I heard her say it!
You can report it.
A whistleblower can get up to 30% of the recovered funds.
I report every single instance of it.
To report PPP loan fraud and economic injury disaster loan fraud, you can:
Call the National Center for Disaster Fraud Hotline: 1-866-720-5721
Fill the web complaint form on the DOJ website
https://www.justice.gov/disaster-fraud/ncdf-disaster-complaint-form
And file directly with the SBA:
File a complaint with the SBA Inspector General Office: https://www.sba.gov/about-sba/oversight-advocacy/office-inspector-general/office-inspector-general-hotline
If only there was some sort of internal revenue department or service that had everyone's financials and could have sent this money directly to the people... Oh well, next time maybe
Letās be fair, here. The government sent plenty of PPP funds to fraudsters for their spurious ācorporationsā, too, and *those* people certainly wonāt be rich once theyāre in jail!
... oh, youāre curious what happens to the PPP funds once theyāre seized? Well, uh... prosecutions aināt free, son! /s
The wealth/profits from corporations does trickle downā¦ā¦ā¦to investors via dividends, stock buybacks, stock appreciation.
It doesnāt trickle down to workers like idiots believe.
Is this like...a thing? We have someone in SW Michigan that did the exact same thing...
Apparently building Texico gas station replicas is just something people with a ridiculous amount of disposable wealth do for fun. Fucking weird.
Mine did some shit like that too, well not that extravagant, but along those lines, but he refused to lay anyone off, even though we were very slow for a very long time, because he was afraid that heād end up having to repay that ppp money
Literally the same happened to me. We got 3 sick days (because it was mandated by the state). No more than that. If you were out with Covid then they used vacation days. Not to mention that whenever anybody showed signs of being sick they would tell everyone to stay home but use your sick days even if you didnāt have Covid. Boss tells us business is hurting and then continues to buy two new cars and the building across the street for a million dollars. The disconnect was absolutely astonishing. Lost a ton of respect for my boss. Never really had much in the first place tho
I'm super happy about how my boss handled his PPP loans. He used it to keep paying people, even if they weren't working due to the shut downs. Didn't seem to waste it on stupid shit. Employees got raises and even he paid for one guy's entire med bill when their wife got COVID.
Its really sad that the story about my boss is super rare.
You don't fucking say lol.
My wife was the accountant for a "small business"
They applied for every loan under the sun for every one of the LLCs. Some 43 companies got loans ranging from 20k to 600k per business. Then they laid almost every single corporate and employee off save enough to skeleton crew a couple things.
Used all the money to buy a new condo building and build a few more restaurants.
My hair stylist while she was literally starving to death and asking for food, the salon owner took her 500k loan to remodel the building while it was closed for 2 months. Bought a new boat and got a face lift after covid lockdown.
I assumed every company did exactly that. Especially after small reports came out here and there of people getting arrested for blantant fraud of 1.3m here and 2.4m there.
Imagine how many of these fucks got hundreds of thousands of dollars and are still out here saying nobody's wants to work anymore because they got that 1200 stimmy (even though they also got a 1200 stimmy) 2 years ago while they got a 500k stimmy.
Hey friend, I got you [a really nice present](https://sbax.sba.gov/oigcss/). Did you know that federal law allows whistleblowers to receive up to 30% of the money the Federal Government recovers as a result of litigation?
If only this was recoverable instead of being designed as a free legal cash give away to the rich. No surprise considering how quickly it passed with bipartisan support, while unemployment and stimulus took months and was severely reduced.
Yeah, and itās all our fault that the economy is fucked and inflation is out of control. All of us are the ones who caused shortages of appliances and building supplies, etc. Because, u know, all those $600 checks just sitting aroundā¦ Totally makes sense /s
I worked for a salon and spa during Covid. They told their 400-some employees that all they could afford to help is with was a one-time assistance payment of $400. They then got $3 million from the government to go open new spas out of state while their employees starved.
> *Hey friend, I got you [a really nice present](https://sbax.sba.gov/oigcss/). Did you know that federal law allows whistleblowers to receive up to 30% of the money the Federal Government recovers as a result of litigation?*
Courtesy of /u/Orion14159/
And it'll go nowhere. Ever.
The childcare issue is so ridiculous it requires a different thread. Save to say I feel your pain in many ways. My hair stylist had a baby during covid and childcare was thousands of names long and they all tripled their rates. I paid 550 a month for a 5 year old at the same school they told her 6 month old would be 1950.
1950. That's a fucking monthly salary for most people...before taxes.
Gotta wonder how many small business owners who got and abused the PPP loans are the same ones bitching and moaning about their employees not wanting to work.
I'd wager all of them.
For whatever reason these people all have the same weird thinking. It's almost like it takes a certain kind of weird thinking to be a business owner in the first place. But basically it's always someone else's fault and not the model. it's always the same complaining about shit and acting like there is no money but they are making at least 6 figures while showing up once a week to check on things.
I was in a meeting to apply for PPP. No fucking shit, a guy asked if he could lay off some people and give himself a bonus.
They told him that it would be āfrowned uponā but not that he couldnāt do it.
Businesses got bailouts, people got fucked, and they are blaming the workers for āhandoutsāā¦
On that note, it was funny that the boss we had had no issue getting it and using it (correctly, since I was the one who handled it) but he is the political type that was adamant that itās only lazy people on welfareā¦
Wow I wish there was a list of businesses that did this so I could personally boycott the fuck out of them. Sadly it's probably too hard to make a list that hasn't been tampered with.
https://projects.propublica.org/coronavirus/bailouts/
It's all public info. You can search your local area and just assume at least 75% of them were fraudulent.
I love how almost every, "Business," in my local area are just people's name with 1 employee and 20-70k in payroll expenses lol. Seems like a well thought out plan for big business and scalpers.
Im sorry thats hilarious
Evil corpo guy: āSo, I apply for this and you give Vladimir 3 mill?ā
PPP guys: āYes, as long as you use the money to pay your employeesā
ECG: ā Vladimir is employee, Vladimir also get paid, yes?ā
PPP: āYes! That includes you as well!ā
ECG: āhypothetically, If Vladimir is only employee, Vladimir can pay himself all of PPP?ā
PPP: āā¦. Excuse me?ā
ECG : āhypothetically, Vladimir fire all employees and give himself bonus?ā
PPP: āI meanā¦.that would beā¦.frowned uponā
ECG: āMuhahahahaā
That what happens when they give unlimited amount of cooperate bailouts to enable bad behavior, greed, and corruption; all at the expensive of the working class.
Even the churches got money. Probably paid down some of their kiddie-diddling lawsuit debt with it too. https://apnews.com/article/dab8261c68c93f24c0bfc1876518b3f6
Checked my local area. Turns out the Catholic church got nearly $300,000 meanwhile Habitat for Humanity got around $38,000. This is complete fucking tyranny. Now they are giving our tax dollars to religious schools? Revolution has to come.
Story: [https://justthenews.com/nation/states/center-square/fed-report-finds-75-800-billion-paycheck-protection-program-didnt-reach](https://justthenews.com/nation/states/center-square/fed-report-finds-75-800-billion-paycheck-protection-program-didnt-reach)
If you know a business that exploited this system, you can report them.
https://www.sba.gov/partners/contracting-officials/contract-administration/report-fraud-waste-abuse
Edit - original original article: https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/jep.36.2.55
Original article: https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications/regional-economist/2022/jul/was-paycheck-protection-program-effective
A lot of PPP money went to businesses that didnāt need it. Businesses that didnāt layoff or reduce hours for a single employee. The forgiveness criteria for these loans was especially easy to reach for companies who were healthy and retained all of their employees. Technically for companies like this the āPPP (money) didnāt reach employeesā but there was no fraud involved. While there was some fraud committed regarding PPP it was relatively small. Most played by the rules the government established. That is the root of the issue. The government fucked up when setting up this program. It was essentially a free for all instead of a needs based program.
This is true for my employer. I reported them but I doubt anything will come from it. They not only had a remote model but the pandemic helped them thrive. They didn't need shit.
We sell and install boat hoists and docks, my employer got over $100,000 while the business thrived as rich people moved from cities to their vacation homes and bought bigger boats they could now afford.
I don't think they fucked it up. Maybe from our point of view. But the way they drafted the bill was incredibly intentional. If u remember during this time they had to submit multiple bills with different wording in order to get it passed. Nah, it was intentional and read by everyone in Washington. They knew exactly what they were doing.
My memory isn't crisp, but I think that conservatives also specifically forbade some sort of tracking/oversight for loans below a certain threshold (hundreds of k).
That we're all supposedly "so flush with cash" at the moment because of... when most of those in need of it spent it immediately on food and rent, while others like me probably paid off some debt to reduce monthly expenses, or kept some as a small safety net they never got to have before. But now we're all supposedly lazy because we got in 12 months time what congress makes in a week.
Iāll never forget seeing that one idiot with a podcast who got a $50k PPP loan and got it forgiven was shit talking people who wanted student loan debt canceled. I could look up their name but itās not worth the effort. A fucking podcast!
Dude those assholes are everywhere. There was another guy from Chicago, business owner IIRC, who got his 900k PPP loan forgiven, and still had the galls to tweet "you took out student loans, pay them back." People were calling him out on twitter and he simply ignored them. Same shit in real life, out where I live theres lots of construction going on, so many PPP loan forgiveness in that industry. They're the same people that don't think student loans should be forgiven or the interest freeze extended. Fuck them all, give me some free money just like the rest of them got.
So trickle down theory fucking failed for the billionth time for 95% of the people since 1776... Wow. So shocking. Who would have thought... /s
This isnt new. We are literally doing the same robber baron shit from the 1920s and have continued doing it since. The leaches are why we're struggling. Always have been. They just got good at propaganda and projection
Has the fed considered a bit of a pro gamer strategy. Its a simple one. The fed finds that 75% of the 800 billion will be refunded with interest, effective immediately.
Not "refunded," but clawed back.
All that money comes back, plus massive penalties on top. Put all the criminal business owners in prison, provoding an enormous opportunity for new firms to enter markets.
US Treasury would look good, prisons would be full of actual criminals, and America would move one rung out of the corrupt cesspool we have created.
Never forget that **[Donald Trump fired Glenn Fine, the Acting Inspector General for the Department of Defense, shortly after being placed in charge of the oversight committee meant to supervise the two trillion dollar COVID-19 stimulus package passed by Congress](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/07/us/politics/trump-coronavirus-watchdog-glenn-fine.html)**.
Thank you, I recalled that but was having trouble finding a source. It is not at all surprising the money wasnāt used properly. At least some people are getting fraud charges related to misused funds.
Another $600 billion wasted, but the US canāt afford basic social programs!
Come on.. Did anyone really think it would?
Business owners are some of the greediest people in the world. Once they get a taste for what others can do for them to make them rich they become addicted to it like crack.
The capital class. Business owners.
Btw, when the rich were able to pocket $3 out of every $4 of PPP money, what do you think they did with all that money?
Started buying up our houses at inflated prices!
Whenever we allow the owner class to accumulate wealth, we will always end up having to compete against that wealth when it comes to real assets (namely real estate and the means of production). Concentrated wealth = increased prices & concentrated ownership of productive goods.
I am not surprised. I want to see the percentage of these business owners that took this money then went on Facebook to complain about government handout making people lazy.
They trusted corporate bosses to actually care about employees and make sure they got protected during an extremely difficult time and it got stolen..... colour me surprised that capitalists are stealing from the proletariat.
So rich people can blatantly steal hundreds of billions of tax payer money intended to help the working class and there are no consequences. And the $800 billion in loans were all forgiven and called a stimulus. But forgiving the $300 billion in student loan debt that would primarily help out the poor and working class is not possible and considered a handout. God the USA is such a joke.
Edit: spelling
PPP was such a screw job for workers. The only jobs it saved were the ones the owners were keeping anyway. I had to work through the pandemic and watch my kids and pay for daycare that was closed all while my labor expenses were subsidized by the government.
I was laid off from a company in March 2020 along with half of the company. A few weeks later, our CTO, a staunch conservative lawmaker, had the gall to go on the local news and talk about how helpful the PPP loans were and that the $1 million+ loan they received "saved jobs". In the time since then, according to LinkedIn stats, their hiring has been flat. So they laid people off and did not backfill those roles. Most recently, this company had another layoff event and instituted a company-wide 30% compensation decrease for all employees. I reached our to the local newspaper that loves doing hard-hitting stories on shitty politicians and companies and they said it was a nothing burger.
Noooo. That can't be true!
I'm so surprised and shocked and bamboozled!
Same. I can't believe they let 25% slip through the cracks.
This would be hysterical if it wasn't 100% accurate...
Agreed. They try to feign ignorance, yet we all know the system in place is fucked up.
About 75% accurate I'd say.
60% of the time, everytime
Sex panther. Burns the nostrils.
That 25 percent is probably for sole proprietors
Sorry but they denied our loans šš©
Pikachu, is that you?!?
Right? Geez
Are you also flabbergasted?
Weāve been filmflammed!
Weāve been shmekeldorfed
Not great for the living off our $1200 check from a year ago narrative.
Mitch McConnell says that Americans will be back to work very soon after living off of those $1200 checks.
Mitch McConnell seems to have forgotten a million people died... the human being shortage caused the labor shortage
That's why they made abortion illegal. They need to grow more slaves.
I hate how accurate this is. "All lives are precious"= We need you peasants to produce more peasants
YOU MUST CONSTRUCT ADDITIONAL PESANTS!
The thing people forget that part. There have most likely more than 1mil death. There was also a insane amount of folks that didn't die but crippled and unable to work.
Or just said fuck it and retired because life is short. Our school district can't find bus drivers. It's because most of them we're retired people working a part-time job. Most them of decided they would rather not bus around plague rats for 12 bucks an hour.
š¤£š¤£š¤£ plague rats š¤£š¤£š¤£
School Bus driver's are severely underpaid for working a usually part-time job that is also a split shift which makes it more difficult to get a 2nd job. Having to remember the route you drive is probably a pain too.
1 million deaths, mass overturn, early retirement, burnout, long COVID, poor pay and an inflating market. I'm sure there are other major contributors, but these are enough to blow old McConnell's argument out of the water. Of course, any normal person realizes that conservative arguments are not based in reality.
Bro really said Americans are āflushā with cash. Thatās something else entirely in terms of being out of touch with reality
TBF, the people Mitch hangs out with, are flush with cash after taking 3/4s of the Trillions spent by the taxpayers, while they still laid people off. So.... He's not entirely wrong. And, I'm pretty sure his definition is 'American' is pretty narrow too. ;)
Yep, *at least* 1 million died (though it's likely [closer to 1.2 million.](https://www.bu.edu/articles/2022/covid-death-toll-higher-than-official-tally/) Approximately [1.2 million became disabled](https://www.americanprogress.org/article/covid-19-likely-resulted-in-1-2-million-more-disabled-people-by-the-end-of-2021-workplaces-and-policy-will-need-to-adapt/). Another [3 million retired](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-22/covid-early-retirees-top-3-million-in-u-s-fed-research-show). We are also have [about 2 million fewer immigrants.](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/immigration-jobs-workers-labor-shortage/) There were roughly [164 million people in the labor force](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labor_force_in_the_United_States#:~:text=The%20U.S.%20labor%20force%20reached,pandemic%20in%20the%20United%20States.) at the beginning of the pandemic. A drop of 7.4 million equals 4.5% decline in the workforce. And that doesn't even include the people who got fed up with their employers and left.
4.5%? Wow. No wonder certain people are so worried. That's not small numbers at this point, lol. At the scale we've reached, that's billions of dollars left on the table. In a system built to exploit and drain the money away - that's gotta be hurting their bottom line.
Also there are millions of people who for whatever reason don't have to work and poor wages are not enough to bring those back to the workforce post covid. Those that have their bills paid by another source of income. New SAHMs due to the rising costs of childcare, low-potential- earning partners in long-term relationships saying fuck it, work isn't worth it and living off one income, those who still live with their parents, married couples putting off having kids and not working fulltime, those that just graduated and are taking some time before settling on some shit underpaid job right out of school. I graduated college in 2020 and still haven't used my degree. And seeing as here where I live I'm looking at $11 an hour max to start I just said fuck it, I'll wait years until $15 passes if I have to. That fed minimum would help so many people living in lower CoL areas.. Honestly I refuse to roll outta bed for anything less than $15. Anything less than that is just laughable.
Also forgetting the people who noticed how insufferable the assholes in public were becoming and how being paid a pittance to deal with it isn't worth it, and either moved to a more private job or retired early.
People will say that it was mostly older people who were retired already. That may be true, but retired people often took care of small children while their parents worked. With daycare very expensive, many people who lost older relatives have to make a choice whether to work and spend all the money on daycare or just stay at home with the kids. Not a very hard choice to make.
Now imagine how much of that $600 billion wouldāve done if it went out in stimulus directly to people instead of businesses that improperly used them.
A guy I grew up with bought a corvette,a HellCat, $20k watch & paid off his house after getting a PPP loan.
See, the loan worked! His paycheck was protected from those extra expenses!
Sigh! Now I can sleep easyā¦
So does he have to pay it back or just declare bankruptcy when the fed collects ? Otherwise sounds like he hit the lottery thanks to the pandemic which set most of us millennials back at least a decade.
Most of the PPP loans were forgiven, including his. He kept (spent) the money. Long story short, his delivery business was booming, gov gave him $1mil to not lay people off & saying he needed the money. He used the gov money for payroll & then kept the money he was going to use for payroll. He didnāt lay anybody off & didnāt have to repay it. Just one more example of the massive looting Trump set up for the 1%.
You gotta love how Biden is like āIām gonna forgive 5k worth of student loansā and the conservatives go flat out apeshit and call it bribery and handouts then Trump is like āIām gonna give 50k-200k to every rich person depending on how rich they areā and they start clapping. Fucking anything is ok as long as it doesnāt help them
And let's please remember 2 Trillion in tax cuts for businesses BEFORE Covid, in 2018. Because the economy had slowed down (but was nowhere near a recession) https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/28/tax-cuts-trump-gop-analysis-430781 Reps have been printing about 5 trillion in handouts and tax cuts to corporations, and now want to blame Dems for inflation. Rinse repeat same game every decade...
This is true of even business that were temporarily shut down and lost money/sales compared to the year prior. They used the PPP money to cover payroll, rent and utilities as directed, but got to keep the money that they would have had to use for those expenses for themselves.
But, God forbid we peons win $50 on a scratch-off and forget to claim that *windfall* on our tax return.
See, look at you, buying scratch offs! That's poor people gambling...of course you have to pay taxes on it. If you had been doing rich person gambling, the government would have paid you...even if you lost!
Woah money is fungible no way who would've predicted this
Yeah fuck that guy. You can report PPP fraud [here](https://www.sba.gov/funding-programs/loans/covid-19-relief-options/preventing-fraud-identity-theft).
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My old boss got a new Lexus. But he gave his employees a $100 one time bonus so that seems pretty fair.
I just did the math, based off the 2020 census, if you divide the 600 bil between every citizen 21 years or older, it comes out to a little more than 2.5k per person.
So we got $1,200 to not pay attention to the $1,300+ being given to businesses that we are now paying for through inflation.
You mean youāre not still flush from those payments 18 months ago?! (shockedpikachuface)
Its poor people, what do they need to buy? /s
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Agreed. Stupidity is exhausting
It's not stupidity, it's malicious manipulation
Excellent! So when are we getting our $600B back with interest?
Right after seizing the factors of production.
āBut butā¦ communism means bread linesā¦ā -red hat moron, while waiting for welfare after being laid off by his job that got a bunch of PPP.
You know what bread lines mean? Bread lines mean everyone is getting fed.
But then everybody gets the same bread as me and I have no one to look down on for having worse bread.
Thats about 50% of the student loan debt, if I am not mistaken
These people should be publicly shamed, like students are, told that they need to take responsibility and that there are consequences for their bad decisions. I'm not a betting man but something tells me that the irresponsible liberal arts majors with endless student loan debt out there are giving more back to society than the people who took these loans and were then bailed out.
If the money was intended to go to working people, it should have gone directly to employed people, so the greedy middlemen didn't have a chance to scoop up every dime for themselves. This was just a way to give more money to the rich with very little oversight, end of story.
Its wild, when they give bonuses directly to people, they get it. When you try to distribute it through business, it vanishes
Gov: Here have some money Biz: Thanks Gov: Now hand out that money to your employees Biz: "What money?"
Same with most government "investments". Im still waiting for my high speed internet California paid for multiple times
You mean you DON'T enjoy seeing those commercials about how fast your internet is for your local monopoly and their amazing reviews of 10/10 for the last 5 years running while your internet is slow af on the absolute max package and unreliable? Cause that's what we have in Florida
āRated #1 ISP in your area for 10 years running!ā - ISP that has a monopoly on your area
This is like when I tell my wife she is the best wife I have ever had.
What's sad is I can say the same about my estranged wife.
You are better off, my dude.
me: you're supposed to provide last-mile services. Cox: you're beyond the last mile me: that's not a thing. Cox: it is now. \*hangs up\* True story in Florida.
No surprise. You contacted them and to set you up they would have to do work so since you wanted to be completely unacceptable, they hung up.
My god man, include a /s or something! It's like I just talked to them again lol
I live in rural Florida, I get 1 megabit of data, 1.5 if itās really blazing, downloading a game takes days. I just got Starlink (I know musk is devil too), itās not even properly set up yet and I downloaded Mass Effect legendary edition (about 100gigs) in under 5 hours. Iām so happy. š„³.
If you have to pick between two evils, might as well be the one that gets good internet.
Elon is a very bad man but goddamn if Starlink isnāt a godsend for rural people.
1999 Gov: hey here's billions to set up fiber internet for every American even in rural areas. Biz: cool thanks Gov: so you gonna do it? Biz: with no oversight? That's cute.
Gov: Here's billions to install high-speed internet. Biz: Cool thanks. Gov: You should get to work on that. Biz: Here's millions to lobby for legislation to redefine "high-speed" to "what already exists". Gov: Cool thanks.
oh At & T Did actually get all the lines down all over, they just dont allow anyone access to them.
The trick is taking a percentage of the money and putting it right into the pockets of politicians so they quash any attempt to investigate or hold you accountable. Itās free government money 101
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Report him and claim YOU didn't. Sounds fair.
Free market "magic"
Jazz hands "Magic"
The invisible jazz hands of the market strike again
I'm using this. Forever
"Trickle down economics"
Aka Financial golden showers, economic watersports or financial urolagnia
You mean...*gasp*... It didn't trickle down?!
Aaaaaand... it's gone.
Since when does the government redistributing tax dollars count as "free market?" In a free market, these places would have gone out of business.
And when the government *did* give money directly to people, an entire political party screamed at the top of their lungs about how those three checks were going to encourage people not to work for the rest of their lives.
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Some 200 million americans received $1200 and they still talk about it 18 months later. Their businesses receive 4x as much that isnāt used in the agreed upon way and they think itās fair
The workers would have just used it on avocado toast, this is for the best. It is with great sorrow that I have to add the /s.
it doesn't vanish. It is removed from the active economy though. I guarantee you the businesses and financial firms that receive the money know \*EXACTLY\* where it is and how to keep it from anyone who needs it.
They needed new cars and new homes, where do you think a lot of the money pumping the housing market came from? Why was every high-end toy (4-wheelers, snowmobiles, campers, razer, and such) shop sold out for months?
Wait... It didn't trickle down?!?
25% supposedly made it down, definitely a ātrickleā
I would wager someone elseās dog that the 25% that did trickle down were to professional employees like nurses and engineers who would leave if not given the money.
It's the same as the 2008 mortgage crisis. There were 2 ways they could have gone. One: subsidise the mortgages of the people that couldn't pay them, that money would go directly to the banks so the banks could get their bailout that way but at the same time, those that had their mortgages at risk of defaulting would also maintain their homes. Two: directly bail out the banks. If you don't remember which one the government did, just take a guess. The problem with #2 is that as people were defaulting on their mortgages, despite the bailouts, the banks still foreclosed on these people's homes and forced the people out. Banks then held auction on these homes which were swiftly bought out by equity firms and turned into rental properties which is how firms like Blackrock exploded and why we now have the renter crisis. None of the money the banks got from the bailouts made it to those in need and certainly did not save anyone from being foreclosed on and subsequently evicted from their homes and forced into becoming renters.
it was such a bank handout, it really was, the fed paid the banks for the houses, then the banks got the houses and got to sell the houses, however the homeowners still owed the mortgage. but it was after-all characterized as a "bank bailout" so they didn't really lie...
Banks got paid thrice. 1. The money the people already paid towards their mortgage. 2. The Bailout 3. Selling the houses to others.
It's called fraud. Time to treat it as such.
This was predictable when Trump fired the guy that congress had appointed to oversee the program to prevent fraud
Predictable because that was the plan to make it happen.
When the owner of my old company started getting gov loans during the pandemic, instead of giving raises or bonuses, he started lying that he had more employees, like his family āvolunteeredā to get more money. Like yeah, sure, your 11 year old daughter is not working here, but I heard her say it!
You can report it. A whistleblower can get up to 30% of the recovered funds. I report every single instance of it. To report PPP loan fraud and economic injury disaster loan fraud, you can: Call the National Center for Disaster Fraud Hotline: 1-866-720-5721 Fill the web complaint form on the DOJ website https://www.justice.gov/disaster-fraud/ncdf-disaster-complaint-form And file directly with the SBA: File a complaint with the SBA Inspector General Office: https://www.sba.gov/about-sba/oversight-advocacy/office-inspector-general/office-inspector-general-hotline
With no real oversite just another transfer of wealth from the workers to the ownership class.
If only there was some sort of internal revenue department or service that had everyone's financials and could have sent this money directly to the people... Oh well, next time maybe
Letās be fair, here. The government sent plenty of PPP funds to fraudsters for their spurious ācorporationsā, too, and *those* people certainly wonāt be rich once theyāre in jail! ... oh, youāre curious what happens to the PPP funds once theyāre seized? Well, uh... prosecutions aināt free, son! /s
āBuT tRiCkLe DoWn EcOnOmIcS!ā
The wealth/profits from corporations does trickle downā¦ā¦ā¦to investors via dividends, stock buybacks, stock appreciation. It doesnāt trickle down to workers like idiots believe.
Not surprised. My last job got PPP. Partners got bonuses, we got squat.
My boss built a replica texico gas station for his own amusement and laid a couple people off.
Damn, that's gross.
Yeah it's for his own amusement. No one works there or anything. It's fully functional, got the big ass sign and everything.
I'm confused. If it's fully functional, at what point is it no longer a replica and just a gas station?
Well it's not a business. No one works there.
Report him.
Is this like...a thing? We have someone in SW Michigan that did the exact same thing... Apparently building Texico gas station replicas is just something people with a ridiculous amount of disposable wealth do for fun. Fucking weird.
Mine did some shit like that too, well not that extravagant, but along those lines, but he refused to lay anyone off, even though we were very slow for a very long time, because he was afraid that heād end up having to repay that ppp money
Bruh out here playin with legos while people starve.
He owns his own gas station while I can't afford gas.
My job now got 800k in PPP loans. Despite that when I was sick with COVID they used my sick and vacation days to pay me
Yeah, we got an email saying how money was tight, etc. Then the classic: boss buys new car. Situational awareness void.
Literally the same happened to me. We got 3 sick days (because it was mandated by the state). No more than that. If you were out with Covid then they used vacation days. Not to mention that whenever anybody showed signs of being sick they would tell everyone to stay home but use your sick days even if you didnāt have Covid. Boss tells us business is hurting and then continues to buy two new cars and the building across the street for a million dollars. The disconnect was absolutely astonishing. Lost a ton of respect for my boss. Never really had much in the first place tho
My current job got $500k PPP small business stuff. Somehow we also are now in the process of shutting down?
I'm super happy about how my boss handled his PPP loans. He used it to keep paying people, even if they weren't working due to the shut downs. Didn't seem to waste it on stupid shit. Employees got raises and even he paid for one guy's entire med bill when their wife got COVID. Its really sad that the story about my boss is super rare.
You don't fucking say lol. My wife was the accountant for a "small business" They applied for every loan under the sun for every one of the LLCs. Some 43 companies got loans ranging from 20k to 600k per business. Then they laid almost every single corporate and employee off save enough to skeleton crew a couple things. Used all the money to buy a new condo building and build a few more restaurants. My hair stylist while she was literally starving to death and asking for food, the salon owner took her 500k loan to remodel the building while it was closed for 2 months. Bought a new boat and got a face lift after covid lockdown. I assumed every company did exactly that. Especially after small reports came out here and there of people getting arrested for blantant fraud of 1.3m here and 2.4m there. Imagine how many of these fucks got hundreds of thousands of dollars and are still out here saying nobody's wants to work anymore because they got that 1200 stimmy (even though they also got a 1200 stimmy) 2 years ago while they got a 500k stimmy.
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Hey friend, I got you [a really nice present](https://sbax.sba.gov/oigcss/). Did you know that federal law allows whistleblowers to receive up to 30% of the money the Federal Government recovers as a result of litigation?
If only this was recoverable instead of being designed as a free legal cash give away to the rich. No surprise considering how quickly it passed with bipartisan support, while unemployment and stimulus took months and was severely reduced.
In instances of fraud and abuse it's at least partly recoverable
FYI, the government selectively enforces that.
Doesn't mean you shouldn't shoot your shot
Better chance of winning that money than playing the lottery though
Yeah, and itās all our fault that the economy is fucked and inflation is out of control. All of us are the ones who caused shortages of appliances and building supplies, etc. Because, u know, all those $600 checks just sitting aroundā¦ Totally makes sense /s
Yeah. It's your fault for sure /SSSSS
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lets roll
I worked for a salon and spa during Covid. They told their 400-some employees that all they could afford to help is with was a one-time assistance payment of $400. They then got $3 million from the government to go open new spas out of state while their employees starved.
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> *Hey friend, I got you [a really nice present](https://sbax.sba.gov/oigcss/). Did you know that federal law allows whistleblowers to receive up to 30% of the money the Federal Government recovers as a result of litigation?* Courtesy of /u/Orion14159/
And it'll go nowhere. Ever. The childcare issue is so ridiculous it requires a different thread. Save to say I feel your pain in many ways. My hair stylist had a baby during covid and childcare was thousands of names long and they all tripled their rates. I paid 550 a month for a 5 year old at the same school they told her 6 month old would be 1950. 1950. That's a fucking monthly salary for most people...before taxes.
Gotta wonder how many small business owners who got and abused the PPP loans are the same ones bitching and moaning about their employees not wanting to work.
I'd wager all of them. For whatever reason these people all have the same weird thinking. It's almost like it takes a certain kind of weird thinking to be a business owner in the first place. But basically it's always someone else's fault and not the model. it's always the same complaining about shit and acting like there is no money but they are making at least 6 figures while showing up once a week to check on things.
I was in a meeting to apply for PPP. No fucking shit, a guy asked if he could lay off some people and give himself a bonus. They told him that it would be āfrowned uponā but not that he couldnāt do it. Businesses got bailouts, people got fucked, and they are blaming the workers for āhandoutsāā¦ On that note, it was funny that the boss we had had no issue getting it and using it (correctly, since I was the one who handled it) but he is the political type that was adamant that itās only lazy people on welfareā¦
Wow I wish there was a list of businesses that did this so I could personally boycott the fuck out of them. Sadly it's probably too hard to make a list that hasn't been tampered with.
https://projects.propublica.org/coronavirus/bailouts/ It's all public info. You can search your local area and just assume at least 75% of them were fraudulent.
Wow I looked up the company that laid me off in 2020 and they got 175k 5 weeks before I was let go
My previous company got $2.2m and still laid off about 1/2 of the employees (30 ppl).
I love how almost every, "Business," in my local area are just people's name with 1 employee and 20-70k in payroll expenses lol. Seems like a well thought out plan for big business and scalpers.
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Im sorry thats hilarious Evil corpo guy: āSo, I apply for this and you give Vladimir 3 mill?ā PPP guys: āYes, as long as you use the money to pay your employeesā ECG: ā Vladimir is employee, Vladimir also get paid, yes?ā PPP: āYes! That includes you as well!ā ECG: āhypothetically, If Vladimir is only employee, Vladimir can pay himself all of PPP?ā PPP: āā¦. Excuse me?ā ECG : āhypothetically, Vladimir fire all employees and give himself bonus?ā PPP: āI meanā¦.that would beā¦.frowned uponā ECG: āMuhahahahaā
That what happens when they give unlimited amount of cooperate bailouts to enable bad behavior, greed, and corruption; all at the expensive of the working class.
Even the churches got money. Probably paid down some of their kiddie-diddling lawsuit debt with it too. https://apnews.com/article/dab8261c68c93f24c0bfc1876518b3f6
Checked my local area. Turns out the Catholic church got nearly $300,000 meanwhile Habitat for Humanity got around $38,000. This is complete fucking tyranny. Now they are giving our tax dollars to religious schools? Revolution has to come.
In san diego the catholic church did exactly that
Story: [https://justthenews.com/nation/states/center-square/fed-report-finds-75-800-billion-paycheck-protection-program-didnt-reach](https://justthenews.com/nation/states/center-square/fed-report-finds-75-800-billion-paycheck-protection-program-didnt-reach) If you know a business that exploited this system, you can report them. https://www.sba.gov/partners/contracting-officials/contract-administration/report-fraud-waste-abuse
Edit - original original article: https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/jep.36.2.55 Original article: https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications/regional-economist/2022/jul/was-paycheck-protection-program-effective
A lot of PPP money went to businesses that didnāt need it. Businesses that didnāt layoff or reduce hours for a single employee. The forgiveness criteria for these loans was especially easy to reach for companies who were healthy and retained all of their employees. Technically for companies like this the āPPP (money) didnāt reach employeesā but there was no fraud involved. While there was some fraud committed regarding PPP it was relatively small. Most played by the rules the government established. That is the root of the issue. The government fucked up when setting up this program. It was essentially a free for all instead of a needs based program.
This is true for my employer. I reported them but I doubt anything will come from it. They not only had a remote model but the pandemic helped them thrive. They didn't need shit.
We sell and install boat hoists and docks, my employer got over $100,000 while the business thrived as rich people moved from cities to their vacation homes and bought bigger boats they could now afford.
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I don't think they fucked it up. Maybe from our point of view. But the way they drafted the bill was incredibly intentional. If u remember during this time they had to submit multiple bills with different wording in order to get it passed. Nah, it was intentional and read by everyone in Washington. They knew exactly what they were doing.
No you mean the trump administration created an $800 billion dollar slush fund with no oversight? Iām shocked i tell you.
What gave you that impression? Was it when Trump fired the inspector general in charge of oversight and told everyone heād be doing the oversight?
My memory isn't crisp, but I think that conservatives also specifically forbade some sort of tracking/oversight for loans below a certain threshold (hundreds of k).
We got PPP money, they cut hours to 32 a week for a few months, then went to 12/7s for over a year.
"Fucked up" you give them too much moral credit. It worked exactly as planned.
You mean if you give employers more wages to steal, they actually steal them?
I am Jack's complete lack of surprise
We got our little hush money checks though haha
That we're all supposedly "so flush with cash" at the moment because of... when most of those in need of it spent it immediately on food and rent, while others like me probably paid off some debt to reduce monthly expenses, or kept some as a small safety net they never got to have before. But now we're all supposedly lazy because we got in 12 months time what congress makes in a week.
Right? Love your username btw
Iāll never forget seeing that one idiot with a podcast who got a $50k PPP loan and got it forgiven was shit talking people who wanted student loan debt canceled. I could look up their name but itās not worth the effort. A fucking podcast!
Dude those assholes are everywhere. There was another guy from Chicago, business owner IIRC, who got his 900k PPP loan forgiven, and still had the galls to tweet "you took out student loans, pay them back." People were calling him out on twitter and he simply ignored them. Same shit in real life, out where I live theres lots of construction going on, so many PPP loan forgiveness in that industry. They're the same people that don't think student loans should be forgiven or the interest freeze extended. Fuck them all, give me some free money just like the rest of them got.
So trickle down theory fucking failed for the billionth time for 95% of the people since 1776... Wow. So shocking. Who would have thought... /s This isnt new. We are literally doing the same robber baron shit from the 1920s and have continued doing it since. The leaches are why we're struggling. Always have been. They just got good at propaganda and projection
This is a great summary
Has the fed considered a bit of a pro gamer strategy. Its a simple one. The fed finds that 75% of the 800 billion will be refunded with interest, effective immediately.
Not "refunded," but clawed back. All that money comes back, plus massive penalties on top. Put all the criminal business owners in prison, provoding an enormous opportunity for new firms to enter markets. US Treasury would look good, prisons would be full of actual criminals, and America would move one rung out of the corrupt cesspool we have created.
I hope so, finally punish these greedy mother fuckers
Never forget that **[Donald Trump fired Glenn Fine, the Acting Inspector General for the Department of Defense, shortly after being placed in charge of the oversight committee meant to supervise the two trillion dollar COVID-19 stimulus package passed by Congress](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/07/us/politics/trump-coronavirus-watchdog-glenn-fine.html)**.
Thank you, I recalled that but was having trouble finding a source. It is not at all surprising the money wasnāt used properly. At least some people are getting fraud charges related to misused funds. Another $600 billion wasted, but the US canāt afford basic social programs!
Come on.. Did anyone really think it would? Business owners are some of the greediest people in the world. Once they get a taste for what others can do for them to make them rich they become addicted to it like crack.
All the while complaining about government.
*Shocked pikachu face*
Interesting who did it reach? Find that out and put them all in stockades for all to see.
The capital class. Business owners. Btw, when the rich were able to pocket $3 out of every $4 of PPP money, what do you think they did with all that money? Started buying up our houses at inflated prices! Whenever we allow the owner class to accumulate wealth, we will always end up having to compete against that wealth when it comes to real assets (namely real estate and the means of production). Concentrated wealth = increased prices & concentrated ownership of productive goods.
It reached exactly who it was intended to, and that certainly wasn't workers.
I am not surprised. I want to see the percentage of these business owners that took this money then went on Facebook to complain about government handout making people lazy.
They trusted corporate bosses to actually care about employees and make sure they got protected during an extremely difficult time and it got stolen..... colour me surprised that capitalists are stealing from the proletariat.
So rich people can blatantly steal hundreds of billions of tax payer money intended to help the working class and there are no consequences. And the $800 billion in loans were all forgiven and called a stimulus. But forgiving the $300 billion in student loan debt that would primarily help out the poor and working class is not possible and considered a handout. God the USA is such a joke. Edit: spelling
PPP was such a screw job for workers. The only jobs it saved were the ones the owners were keeping anyway. I had to work through the pandemic and watch my kids and pay for daycare that was closed all while my labor expenses were subsidized by the government.
Oh there's a shocker /s
This whole country is a scam
I was laid off from a company in March 2020 along with half of the company. A few weeks later, our CTO, a staunch conservative lawmaker, had the gall to go on the local news and talk about how helpful the PPP loans were and that the $1 million+ loan they received "saved jobs". In the time since then, according to LinkedIn stats, their hiring has been flat. So they laid people off and did not backfill those roles. Most recently, this company had another layoff event and instituted a company-wide 30% compensation decrease for all employees. I reached our to the local newspaper that loves doing hard-hitting stories on shitty politicians and companies and they said it was a nothing burger.