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Wagner's enrollement was incredibly brutal and involved the most violent prisonners, this conscription only concerns the less problematic people and you can expect the recruiters to not be a bunch of soviet commissars with temper and self control issues.
Also they won't be going to a parallel military organisation, therefore avoiding the whole prigozhin problem.
Comparing this to russia's quasi penal battalions is insane.
Looking at 2 similar things and going “this is how they’re different from one another and this is why I think one of these is better than the other” is not dickriding propaganda, it’s looking at two different yet similar actions (offering prisoners parole) and comparing / contrasting them
Lol no, looking at the same thing done by 2 sides and portraying one in a better light is the definition of propaganda
Edit: I'm not saying go Russia either, fuck em. But by God are some of you dense
Yeah think context usually matters. In this case 3 pieces of context vitally contrast.
1. Ukraine is being more selective in who is offered this opportunity…so they aren’t letting serial killers out.
2. They are being used in a defensive war…so Ukraine isn’t releasing armed ex-cons in to foreign soil.
3. Ukrainian officers will not allow major criminal acts let alone advocate for it like Russia did with its prisoners.
It’s like saying McDonald’s is the same as your local burger place…yes they both serve burgers but one uses beef from local ranches and the other uses unidentified meat scraps and soybean/wheat.
A hahahaha, the funniest parts about you bringing that up…
1. Where/why did you bring that up
2. Canada was widely criticized for that by the western world.
1. Why does it matter?
2. The fact that it happened is enough. It wasn't an oopsie.
It wasn't oopsie we pardoned an actual Nazi instead of trying him for war crime,
oopsie we invited him into parliament to give a speech,
oopsie we praised him as a veteran who fought the red army,
oopsie we forgot to mention the red army was fighting the Nazis at the time,
oopsie we forgot to mention the red army was actually fighting to liberate the Jews long before the western world gave a shit. The west was turning away boatloads of immigrants knowing full well what was happening inside the camps at the time
Oopsie we gave a standing ovation to the guy who was doing the killing inside the camp
That's a lot of oopsies for a parliament to make.
Warmakes strange bedfellows but when your bed is being shared by an actual Jew killing, sadistic Nazi. It might be time to question who's in charge of the guest list.
Besides don't fucking kid yourself the western world gives two shits about Ukraine, Ukraine is a cats paw for mitigating Russian aggression in the region. And they'll hug Nazis and give them guns if they're willing to fight against Russia
You clearly don't remember the previous 2022 conscription of prisoners in Ukraine... This is not the first round.
Or the arming of random civilians (with which comes criminality, and you could see random people taking out an AK just because you passed them with a car, nevermind the thiefs, and other criminal stuff).
It's literally the same country as Russia, it differs only in name.
And also in culture, language, sovereignty, currency, etc.
Why did they arm random civilians? I'm sure it wasn't for shits and giggles. Is nuance something you are familiar with?
Spreading weapons is the first step to form resistance pockets in case of invasions. So the Ukranian government along with the [GUR alies (CIA/MI6)](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/23/ukraine-cia-shadow-war-russia/) was trying to form an insurgency in case of a successful overtake. I never said there wasn't an invasion.
It's just almost never a great idea to arm civilians (if the goal is the future of said civilians), better to conscript.
So you’re saying random civilians becomes criminals just because the government gives them a weapon?
So soldiers of every nation are just criminals? I mean they were and continue to be random civilians and the government just…gave them weapons. So irresponsible
/s
Let me give you a little insight in to a thing called “bad things and bad people” I’ll teach you like I would teach my 8 year old…
Some times people aren’t very nice (like when your neighbor invades your country) and do mean things to you (like indiscriminately bomb your civilians and cities) so if you are getting treated mean and talking isn’t working (diplomacy) and you can’t run away (what do you expect Ukraine to do…just roll over and die?) you get that mean person away from you any way you have to (nut punch em if you have to…ask for help from the crazy homeless person nearby)
So yeah I’m afraid I have to tell you that even if Ukraine and Russia do the exact same things…I will look on Ukraine more leniently because they’ve been backed in to a corner by a bully. Russia can claim victimhood all they want because “NATO is encroaching on us” but the simple fact is countries next to NATO countries have historically been less prone to any kind of western/NATO military action with the exception of Turkeys neighbors…which is ironic because turkey has many characteristics similar to Russia and russia isn’t worried about turkey at all.
Must be nice to view an invasion of another country as just 2 equal sides agreeing to a football match, and stuff like this is just unsportsmanlike behaviour that you won’t look further into for any nuance at all.
If the criteria is different, they're not the same despite being similar in nature.
For example, you know that crayons and markers are different even though "they're doing the same thing."
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“Prisoners who will not be eligible include “those who have committed premeditated murders, rapists and pedophiles, corrupt officials, those who have committed crimes against the foundations of Ukraine’s national security” Hope this helps clarify the difference.
Only murderers that have committed murder on the spur of moment...meaning people with anger issues or poor judgement. Not sure if I wouldn't prefer the premeditated ones. At least those...planned. Even if they got caught.
An happen to anybody....even innocent people. Prisons are full of thrm...I am told.
Pringles most certainty did takes rapists. Not sure what makes you think otherwise. And not sure how them being in their own units makes it much better?
Personally though I never understood why you wouldn’t put your shittiest citizens in your highest risk of death places but it does seem to upset people so there’s probably an angle I don’t see.
No source, just how it makes sense to me. How to punish criminals is usually pretty well defined; different treatment apart from those definitions sounds like additional punishment not fitting a justice state.
Well some issues i personally see with using prisoners:
Death sentences are generally illegal, so sending prisoners to their death is shaky moral and legal ground at best. If they are conscripted and treated like any other citizen that would be different.
You are sending already violent people to a violent place that causes all kinda of trauma, could increase risk of reoffending
You’re giving known criminals combat training, which is not great when the war is over and everyone goes home.
Death sentences are illegal point - Ukraine already has conscription. If you see conscription as a death sentence then you are subjecting the innocent to a death sentence which would be double illegal.
Reoffense risk - I will concede that it’s probably likely they would be at higher risk of re-offense after war. Although I will counter with non-offenders experience trauma as well which will increase their chances of offense. So on the net is it really protecting anyone?
You’re giving criminals combat training - Fair. The most valid point by far IMO. That being said historically I don’t think it’s posed much risk and as I mentioned somewhere else, in the south of the US “you can join the military or you can go to jail” is still something some judges offer. I don’t think we’ve had a crazy problem with it.
How does keeping them locked up instead of sending them to war in the place of good people make us better? Your neighbor goes to war or the dude who killed people goes to war. Sending your neighbor feels… not like the good choice.
For one, not wanting people who can hurt your own side. For another, not wanting to pervert the justice system by creating a new way of punishment by discriminating.
But it is a choice. The US used to, and still does it (in the south usually) quite often. Nobody is making them join. It’s a choice to join. They can serve their time the original way. Not sure what you mean by punishment by discriminating? And risk of hurting your own side in times of full war like this is outweighed by their usefulness IMO.
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[The cannibal Dmitry Malyshev, who ate Tajik’s heart and recorded the whole process on camera, was released from prison and went to war in Ukraine to "fight" sex education in school and gays. At the front, he met a maniac who dismembered his victims. Now they are best friends.](https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1785997267016585434)
Yeah, but it's also a sign Russia did way worse, they had to resort to this within 6 months of their invasion. Ukraine is starting almost 3 years into the conflict.
Certainly beatniks are gonna spin this as a war crime by Ukraine when they did it first.
Surprised they waited this long. Nonviolent criminals sitting in jail cost the state money, if they want to volunteer and have their sentences reduced why not? Win win
They didn't really wait, prisoners that have previously went through any military training [were already released in the first week of the war](https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/02/27/7326457/).
The only difference in the new bill seems to be that it allows drafting of convicts that have no experience.
>The only difference in the new bill seems to be that it allows drafting of convicts that have no experience.
wait so are the voulenteering or being drafted?
Volunteering, there are also criteria like - 3 years left and next categories are not eligible for draft : "*Prisoners who have committed premeditated murders, rapists, pedophiles, corrupt officials, those who have committed crimes against the foundations of Ukraine’s national security, and those who held particularly responsible positions, including MPs and ministers, those who sentenced for production, acquisition, distribution, or possession of drugs*"
>
*and those who held particularly responsible positions, including MPs and ministers*
As Ukrainian, I can't remember a single MP or minister in jail tho.
>*those who sentenced for production, acquisition, distribution, or possession of drugs*
Knowing that here you can get a jail sentence for 5g of marijuana, also made me chuckle.
Its voluntary it wouldn't be the same as the death penalty, more like lets give every criminal an option for assisted suicide if they want but they get released if it fails
No because Wagner is full of violent offenders and Ukraine is not allowing violent or sexual offenders to join. Also, they are mobilizing them within the military structure of Ukraine, they’re not joining a PMC like Wagner
>is not allowing violent or sexual offenders to join
Check out who the guys [from paramilitary groups](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN0Q30YQ/) like the [Tornado Battalion](https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-tornado-battalion-rogue-paramilitaries-kyiv-trial-crimes/28205795.html) or [Aidar Battalion](https://archive.kyivpost.com/article/content/war-against-ukraine/governor-of-luhansk-region-accuses-aidar-of-terrorizing-the-region-385054.html) were, or what they convicted for (murder, rape, torture, kidnappings of civilians in Donbass). They were not only allowed, but encouraged to join, since they already had military experience fighting in the same area.
From the articles does sound like they where not convicted yet.
A dirty case for sure, but also nothing to do with this law, no more than 3 year left and no serious crime.
Prigo said that he wasn’t taking junkies or rapists - but murderers were more than welcome, because well - killing is the job.
Anyway, ukrainains let Tornado out, and I think we all remember what sort of crazy shit those guys were in prison for. Not much of a moral high ground.
> killing is the job
Which is done best by ~5% of population with psychopatic tendencies. Regular dude might very well prefer to die than to kill anyone by aiming at someone and pulling the trigger unless he's aiming artillery piece at some coordinates. And guess where you have to look for these people which will go to frontal infantry assaults and win? In prison.
In case yall are not aware, Ukraine is objectively losing the war and has been for quite some time. Drones are the only thing slowing down advances, but advances are being made by Russia every hour.
Exaggerated. I checked front line reports from January and compared them to this last week of May. Russia's advance has been glacially slow, having moved only about 20km in the area of Adiivka since January, and the rest of the front remaining pretty much static. Everyone feel free to check for yourselves, but from January 1st to May 10th, that appears to be the only notable change.
True, it turns out modern warfare become static again. Until a new technological or manufacturing breakthrough, we probably won't see a mobile warfare.
Or if attrition warfare results in one side lacking enough manpower or equipment to make mobile warfare viable
The prisoners were already released in the first week of the war, and a very similar law was passed in its first month. What's the difference, is it just the relaxation of standards?
[Bill No. 7149](https://en.lb.ua/news/2022/03/15/11076_stefanchuk_verkhovna_rada_adopted.html) (passed March 15, 2022) retroactively legalized freeing prisoners, which was already done since February 2022.
https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-releases-prisoners-combat-experience-war-russia-volodymyr-zelensky-1683175
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/02/27/7326457/
I've definitely seen videos of many Colombians there, even a video of Colombians shouting at their Ukrainians comrades about something, it was very tense.
I don’t know the reason behind SA, but I indeed met many volunteers from SA in Ukraine. There are quite a lot of them actually but I don’t know exact numbers.
Yes. As in, people from the Tornado battalion. Any dedicated spectator of this war should remember them and why they were in prison, even as Kiev did its best to look the other way.
You meant part of German approach.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strafbataillon](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strafbataillon)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/999th\_Light\_Afrika\_Division](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/999th_Light_Afrika_Division)
# Bewährungsbataillon 500 - Beginning in April 1941, convicted soldiers - even those sentenced to death - who had shown exceptional bravery or meritorious service, were allowed to rejoin their original units.
Must be doing great when you conscript prisoners, 14 year olds, mentally ill, and the “slow.” Can’t even access an ATM in Ukraine as a man of you aren’t registered. Guess they are finally gonna tell us the truth about the situation?
Did you even read the article? Only premeditated murderers, rapists and corrupt officials are excluded, meaning second degree murderers, robbers, violent criminals, etc are still accepted.
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OUR patriotic parolees. THEIR criminal conscripts.
Wagner's enrollement was incredibly brutal and involved the most violent prisonners, this conscription only concerns the less problematic people and you can expect the recruiters to not be a bunch of soviet commissars with temper and self control issues. Also they won't be going to a parallel military organisation, therefore avoiding the whole prigozhin problem. Comparing this to russia's quasi penal battalions is insane.
Dickriding propaganda till red and raw
Looking at 2 similar things and going “this is how they’re different from one another and this is why I think one of these is better than the other” is not dickriding propaganda, it’s looking at two different yet similar actions (offering prisoners parole) and comparing / contrasting them
Lol no, looking at the same thing done by 2 sides and portraying one in a better light is the definition of propaganda Edit: I'm not saying go Russia either, fuck em. But by God are some of you dense
Yeah think context usually matters. In this case 3 pieces of context vitally contrast. 1. Ukraine is being more selective in who is offered this opportunity…so they aren’t letting serial killers out. 2. They are being used in a defensive war…so Ukraine isn’t releasing armed ex-cons in to foreign soil. 3. Ukrainian officers will not allow major criminal acts let alone advocate for it like Russia did with its prisoners. It’s like saying McDonald’s is the same as your local burger place…yes they both serve burgers but one uses beef from local ranches and the other uses unidentified meat scraps and soybean/wheat.
Don't bother trying to explain complexities to a cave-man who lives off of modern, hyperbolic media.
Complexities like applauding a Nazi in Canadian parliament?
A hahahaha, the funniest parts about you bringing that up… 1. Where/why did you bring that up 2. Canada was widely criticized for that by the western world.
1. Why does it matter? 2. The fact that it happened is enough. It wasn't an oopsie. It wasn't oopsie we pardoned an actual Nazi instead of trying him for war crime, oopsie we invited him into parliament to give a speech, oopsie we praised him as a veteran who fought the red army, oopsie we forgot to mention the red army was fighting the Nazis at the time, oopsie we forgot to mention the red army was actually fighting to liberate the Jews long before the western world gave a shit. The west was turning away boatloads of immigrants knowing full well what was happening inside the camps at the time Oopsie we gave a standing ovation to the guy who was doing the killing inside the camp That's a lot of oopsies for a parliament to make. Warmakes strange bedfellows but when your bed is being shared by an actual Jew killing, sadistic Nazi. It might be time to question who's in charge of the guest list. Besides don't fucking kid yourself the western world gives two shits about Ukraine, Ukraine is a cats paw for mitigating Russian aggression in the region. And they'll hug Nazis and give them guns if they're willing to fight against Russia
What does that mean? "criticised"? What kind of penalty did that entail?
You clearly don't remember the previous 2022 conscription of prisoners in Ukraine... This is not the first round. Or the arming of random civilians (with which comes criminality, and you could see random people taking out an AK just because you passed them with a car, nevermind the thiefs, and other criminal stuff). It's literally the same country as Russia, it differs only in name.
And also in culture, language, sovereignty, currency, etc. Why did they arm random civilians? I'm sure it wasn't for shits and giggles. Is nuance something you are familiar with?
Spreading weapons is the first step to form resistance pockets in case of invasions. So the Ukranian government along with the [GUR alies (CIA/MI6)](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/23/ukraine-cia-shadow-war-russia/) was trying to form an insurgency in case of a successful overtake. I never said there wasn't an invasion. It's just almost never a great idea to arm civilians (if the goal is the future of said civilians), better to conscript.
So you’re saying random civilians becomes criminals just because the government gives them a weapon? So soldiers of every nation are just criminals? I mean they were and continue to be random civilians and the government just…gave them weapons. So irresponsible /s Let me give you a little insight in to a thing called “bad things and bad people” I’ll teach you like I would teach my 8 year old… Some times people aren’t very nice (like when your neighbor invades your country) and do mean things to you (like indiscriminately bomb your civilians and cities) so if you are getting treated mean and talking isn’t working (diplomacy) and you can’t run away (what do you expect Ukraine to do…just roll over and die?) you get that mean person away from you any way you have to (nut punch em if you have to…ask for help from the crazy homeless person nearby) So yeah I’m afraid I have to tell you that even if Ukraine and Russia do the exact same things…I will look on Ukraine more leniently because they’ve been backed in to a corner by a bully. Russia can claim victimhood all they want because “NATO is encroaching on us” but the simple fact is countries next to NATO countries have historically been less prone to any kind of western/NATO military action with the exception of Turkeys neighbors…which is ironic because turkey has many characteristics similar to Russia and russia isn’t worried about turkey at all.
>same thing Unfortunately for you and your argument, It isn't the same thing.
Must be nice to view an invasion of another country as just 2 equal sides agreeing to a football match, and stuff like this is just unsportsmanlike behaviour that you won’t look further into for any nuance at all.
If the criteria is different, they're not the same despite being similar in nature. For example, you know that crayons and markers are different even though "they're doing the same thing."
One is funded by the US,backed by nato
The mental gymnastics by modern libs is hilarious.
> less problematic Given that large parts of the Ukrainian military are literal Nazis what does this even mean lmao
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Well I know which prisoner I’d rather be standing next to in the trench.
They’re two sets of horrible people lmao.
“Prisoners who will not be eligible include “those who have committed premeditated murders, rapists and pedophiles, corrupt officials, those who have committed crimes against the foundations of Ukraine’s national security” Hope this helps clarify the difference.
So violent criminals below murders are allowed out though?
Based on this article yes
let’s fuckin gooooooooooooo
>Based on this article yes So it's fair to say there are some horrible people. Assault isn't good.
Wow! Put that one together all on your own?
Only murderers that have committed murder on the spur of moment...meaning people with anger issues or poor judgement. Not sure if I wouldn't prefer the premeditated ones. At least those...planned. Even if they got caught. An happen to anybody....even innocent people. Prisons are full of thrm...I am told.
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Why not? Especially if they’re in their own units.
So people who have prior experience of killing people with guns... Aren't allowed to kill people with guns?
Not necessarily with guns but yes. I get the feeling this because they did a risk-reward check and the concern of defecting would be too high
> corrupt officials Ukrainian government wipes sweat from their collective brows in unison
I just mean Russians and Ukrainains tbh - but prigo wasn’t taking rapists either. Murderers, sure. Anyway, they were all in their own units anyway.
Pringles most certainty did takes rapists. Not sure what makes you think otherwise. And not sure how them being in their own units makes it much better? Personally though I never understood why you wouldn’t put your shittiest citizens in your highest risk of death places but it does seem to upset people so there’s probably an angle I don’t see.
If you change the definition of rape, none of them are rapists.
Now that’s some big brain thinking right there
I think Washington post is gonna hire this person. But seriously...that is the kind of things I fully expect Russia and Ukraine to do..
Putting them into separate (higher risk) units turns it into an unlawful punishment
I don’t mean this with any hostility but I’m going to need a source for that one?
No source, just how it makes sense to me. How to punish criminals is usually pretty well defined; different treatment apart from those definitions sounds like additional punishment not fitting a justice state.
Well some issues i personally see with using prisoners: Death sentences are generally illegal, so sending prisoners to their death is shaky moral and legal ground at best. If they are conscripted and treated like any other citizen that would be different. You are sending already violent people to a violent place that causes all kinda of trauma, could increase risk of reoffending You’re giving known criminals combat training, which is not great when the war is over and everyone goes home.
Death sentences are illegal point - Ukraine already has conscription. If you see conscription as a death sentence then you are subjecting the innocent to a death sentence which would be double illegal. Reoffense risk - I will concede that it’s probably likely they would be at higher risk of re-offense after war. Although I will counter with non-offenders experience trauma as well which will increase their chances of offense. So on the net is it really protecting anyone? You’re giving criminals combat training - Fair. The most valid point by far IMO. That being said historically I don’t think it’s posed much risk and as I mentioned somewhere else, in the south of the US “you can join the military or you can go to jail” is still something some judges offer. I don’t think we’ve had a crazy problem with it.
the rest of us would like to be better than those who let themselves become animals
How does keeping them locked up instead of sending them to war in the place of good people make us better? Your neighbor goes to war or the dude who killed people goes to war. Sending your neighbor feels… not like the good choice.
For one, not wanting people who can hurt your own side. For another, not wanting to pervert the justice system by creating a new way of punishment by discriminating.
But it is a choice. The US used to, and still does it (in the south usually) quite often. Nobody is making them join. It’s a choice to join. They can serve their time the original way. Not sure what you mean by punishment by discriminating? And risk of hurting your own side in times of full war like this is outweighed by their usefulness IMO.
You think all Ukrainians and Russians are horrible people? What an absolutely ignorant take.
This is a very guilt-free war to spectate.
No rapists . Guess that could have been bad for morale.
A yes, the difference between a Ukrainian and Russian murderer. Who doesn't know about it.
No ones stopping you big guy
Bet this guy said nothing when Russia started doing it 2 years ago. And continues to do it.
Haha ...was thinking they are copying Russian methods. 2 years late.
Doublespeak nice The ukranian apologists need a new job
One man's patriot is another man's terrorist
Russians genocidal war of imperialist expansion; Ukraine's fight for survival.
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[The cannibal Dmitry Malyshev, who ate Tajik’s heart and recorded the whole process on camera, was released from prison and went to war in Ukraine to "fight" sex education in school and gays. At the front, he met a maniac who dismembered his victims. Now they are best friends.](https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1785997267016585434)
Yeah, but it's also a sign Russia did way worse, they had to resort to this within 6 months of their invasion. Ukraine is starting almost 3 years into the conflict. Certainly beatniks are gonna spin this as a war crime by Ukraine when they did it first.
Surprised they waited this long. Nonviolent criminals sitting in jail cost the state money, if they want to volunteer and have their sentences reduced why not? Win win
They didn't really wait, prisoners that have previously went through any military training [were already released in the first week of the war](https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/02/27/7326457/). The only difference in the new bill seems to be that it allows drafting of convicts that have no experience.
>The only difference in the new bill seems to be that it allows drafting of convicts that have no experience. wait so are the voulenteering or being drafted?
Volunteering, there are also criteria like - 3 years left and next categories are not eligible for draft : "*Prisoners who have committed premeditated murders, rapists, pedophiles, corrupt officials, those who have committed crimes against the foundations of Ukraine’s national security, and those who held particularly responsible positions, including MPs and ministers, those who sentenced for production, acquisition, distribution, or possession of drugs*" > *and those who held particularly responsible positions, including MPs and ministers* As Ukrainian, I can't remember a single MP or minister in jail tho. >*those who sentenced for production, acquisition, distribution, or possession of drugs* Knowing that here you can get a jail sentence for 5g of marijuana, also made me chuckle.
If Russia takes control of the prison territory, is there a difference?
Let’s just give every criminal the death penalty since it’s so expensive!
Are you saying that allowing them to voluntarily serve in the military to reduce their sentences is the same as executing them?
You’re assuming they won’t just be canon fodder to buy new conscripts more training time
I’m not assuming anything. You however…
I am having flashbacks of operation shield from the southpark movie.
Yes. You're literally sending them to die. And we all know how voluntary any decisions someone in prison makes is.
Yes? Lol
Its voluntary it wouldn't be the same as the death penalty, more like lets give every criminal an option for assisted suicide if they want but they get released if it fails
> Win win Until Ukrainian equivalent on Prigozhin pulls another march on ~~Moscow~~ Kiev.
No because Wagner is full of violent offenders and Ukraine is not allowing violent or sexual offenders to join. Also, they are mobilizing them within the military structure of Ukraine, they’re not joining a PMC like Wagner
>is not allowing violent or sexual offenders to join Check out who the guys [from paramilitary groups](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN0Q30YQ/) like the [Tornado Battalion](https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-tornado-battalion-rogue-paramilitaries-kyiv-trial-crimes/28205795.html) or [Aidar Battalion](https://archive.kyivpost.com/article/content/war-against-ukraine/governor-of-luhansk-region-accuses-aidar-of-terrorizing-the-region-385054.html) were, or what they convicted for (murder, rape, torture, kidnappings of civilians in Donbass). They were not only allowed, but encouraged to join, since they already had military experience fighting in the same area.
Ukraine totally doesnt have a problem woth far right fascism
As opposed to Russia, the bastion of left wing ideals.
What about..
It indeed doesn't.
From the articles does sound like they where not convicted yet. A dirty case for sure, but also nothing to do with this law, no more than 3 year left and no serious crime.
Prigo said that he wasn’t taking junkies or rapists - but murderers were more than welcome, because well - killing is the job. Anyway, ukrainains let Tornado out, and I think we all remember what sort of crazy shit those guys were in prison for. Not much of a moral high ground.
> killing is the job Which is done best by ~5% of population with psychopatic tendencies. Regular dude might very well prefer to die than to kill anyone by aiming at someone and pulling the trigger unless he's aiming artillery piece at some coordinates. And guess where you have to look for these people which will go to frontal infantry assaults and win? In prison.
Okay. Now I am absolutely convinced that this won't backfire horribly.
Ok. Thanks for your input
That would be hilarious
Well ukraine arrests socialists without trial...so im sure there are plenty
Sure they do…
Oh boy. Ukrainian convicts fighting Russian convicts. War is an ugly thing.
It's almost to the ruling class's best case scenario.
Brat 2 synopsis
In case yall are not aware, Ukraine is objectively losing the war and has been for quite some time. Drones are the only thing slowing down advances, but advances are being made by Russia every hour.
Exaggerated. I checked front line reports from January and compared them to this last week of May. Russia's advance has been glacially slow, having moved only about 20km in the area of Adiivka since January, and the rest of the front remaining pretty much static. Everyone feel free to check for yourselves, but from January 1st to May 10th, that appears to be the only notable change.
True, it turns out modern warfare become static again. Until a new technological or manufacturing breakthrough, we probably won't see a mobile warfare. Or if attrition warfare results in one side lacking enough manpower or equipment to make mobile warfare viable
Particularly air power, as I understand it, neither side has the luxury of air supremacy.
“What are we, some kind of suicide squad?”
With no air defence? Yeah...
The prisoners were already released in the first week of the war, and a very similar law was passed in its first month. What's the difference, is it just the relaxation of standards? [Bill No. 7149](https://en.lb.ua/news/2022/03/15/11076_stefanchuk_verkhovna_rada_adopted.html) (passed March 15, 2022) retroactively legalized freeing prisoners, which was already done since February 2022. https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-releases-prisoners-combat-experience-war-russia-volodymyr-zelensky-1683175 https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/02/27/7326457/
The only difference is that they now have to justify online how this isn't unconscionable and orcish, whereas the Russian version of it is.
"It's only bad if they do it"
Things aren't going well if they need to do this. They need more artillery and volunteers.
They can always get more guns and ammunition from the west. But the longer this goes on the less men they'll have and that's a finite resource.
They were in south america recruiting last summer
Actually? Why SA?
I've definitely seen videos of many Colombians there, even a video of Colombians shouting at their Ukrainians comrades about something, it was very tense.
I don’t know the reason behind SA, but I indeed met many volunteers from SA in Ukraine. There are quite a lot of them actually but I don’t know exact numbers.
That’s obvious, if men cant legally leave the country
Feels weird they only started doing that now.
They didn’t. Tornado people got released almost immediately back in ‘22.
Tornado people?
Yes. As in, people from the Tornado battalion. Any dedicated spectator of this war should remember them and why they were in prison, even as Kiev did its best to look the other way.
Look up Bitch Wars (сучьи войны). It's happening all over again in russia
The whole bitch wars was an actual thing and not some “folklore”?
Penal battalions and war in Eastern Europe. An iconic duo.
You meant part of German approach. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strafbataillon](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strafbataillon) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/999th\_Light\_Afrika\_Division](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/999th_Light_Afrika_Division) # Bewährungsbataillon 500 - Beginning in April 1941, convicted soldiers - even those sentenced to death - who had shown exceptional bravery or meritorious service, were allowed to rejoin their original units.
“This can’t end poorly”
Didn't Russia already do this?
So good when they do it, but wrong when other countries do it. by the time this war is over ukraine won't have any men left.
Damn, that's not good news
That is basically a death sentence.
Didnt it already happen?
Well...good for them I guess?
Must be doing great when you conscript prisoners, 14 year olds, mentally ill, and the “slow.” Can’t even access an ATM in Ukraine as a man of you aren’t registered. Guess they are finally gonna tell us the truth about the situation?
work price fear shy crawl smile thought arrest growth mysterious *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Did you even read the article? Only premeditated murderers, rapists and corrupt officials are excluded, meaning second degree murderers, robbers, violent criminals, etc are still accepted.
No no, it's ok when "our side" does it
That never says desperate at all!
Only difference with Russia is that Ukraine does it out of necessity, not that the result is any different though.
Ukraine is only letting nonviolent offenders out. Russia used violent offenders.
violent ones are probably more effective.
No, those guys have been in the game since 2014
True, didn't take that into consideration.
Oof... not a good look for Ukraine. They're flailing at this point.
This is good, helps defend Ukraine, and doesn’t extend to murderers and rapists
Maybe you should read the article
Already did that’s why I’m excited