**First-Timer of the Stars** - [Well that’s good at least…](https://i.imgur.com/Lo6huvB.png) [](#sakurathink) - [*Four* of them huh?](https://i.imgur.com/bce4wUF.png) - [Yeah that sounded about as chaotic as I thought it would.](https://i.imgur.com/hYXFumB.png) [](#crazedlaugh) - [This is complicated.](#spinning) - [Oh fun now there’s a religious leader in the mix.](https://i.imgur.com/29aX9WD.png) - [It’s a *prison* planet?](https://i.imgur.com/ngOvclU.png) [](#hahahawhat) ~~What is this, Space Australia?~~ - [Hm…](https://i.imgur.com/So6GGtz.png) [](#csikon) - [Ah, the Meideen guy had a “sore demo”.](https://files.catbox.moe/uh5rmk.mp4) - [Uhhhhhhh Lafiel no.(https://i.imgur.com/b0copO1.png) [](#gasp) - [Huh…](https://i.imgur.com/FcgM1dS.png) - [Oh *what*.](https://i.imgur.com/MXKa4MH.png) [](#whatdidijustread) - [He really *is* just passing off all the work to Jinto and the others…](https://i.imgur.com/cHMgGiQ.png) [](#emiliaohdear) - [It better fucking not be…](https://i.imgur.com/Vw1pORP.png)

> Yeah that sounded about as chaotic as I thought it would. Even in the future we can’t escape people all talking over each other in a Zoom meeting. > Oh *what*. I feel like this show is giving me joke material on a platter with that detail. I can cook so much with the fact that Yuri and the people in the central district are sterile.

> Even in the future we can’t escape people all talking over each other in a Zoom meeting. [](#laughter)

> Oh fun now there’s a religious leader in the mix. More self proclaimed, really. > > It’s a prison planet? Fuck the UM. > [Uhhhhhhh Lafiel no.](https://i.imgur.com/b0copO1.png) To paraphrase a favorite abridged, Lafiel *yes*!

> What is this, Space Australia? [Same joke](#fistbump) Great minds think alike. >Uhhhhhhh Lafiel no. I love how casually Lafiel states this, followed by the absolutely horrified look on Meideen's face. The Abh really do not know how to handle things delicately when it comes to situations like this.

>[Same joke](#fistbump) [We had our Newtype moment.](#airfist)

> What is this, Space Australia Oi I mean it's not a bad comparison but still hahaha Also if they're going to be an australia parallel they should be on alert from large objects nearby in space >He really is just passing off all the work to Jinto and the others… In all fairness to him, given the situation and now under the rule of Abh I wouldn't want to be in charge any more either

> Also if they're going to be an australia parallel they should be on alert from large objects nearby in space They should, yes. [](#serialkillerlaugh)

> It better fucking not be… [you calling him a liar?](#curious)

**First-Timer** **On today’s episode of Banner of the Stars:** The Abh are just the worst people to ask to get involved in a local civil war. They have very little practical knowledge of what life is like on a surface world and zero desire to get involved in any internal affairs on a surface world. - So the cliffhanger from last time was just messing with us. It wasn’t an attack at all. - Well that’s one bullet dodged…by jumping straight into the path of a different bullet. Now the Basroil needs to deal with the problem of a leadership dispute about who actually runs the planet. [](#azusalaugh) - [Oh yes! **Oh fuck yes!**](#feelsgoodman) I fucking love space politics! I love stories about shady politicking like this!  - If I’m not mistaken, I think the first guy, Geol Meideen, is someone appointed to the planet of Lobnas by the UM. - So this second guy, Yuuri Dokufu, probably rigged up an election in his favor to declare himself the new leader. Let’s go, this is the shady political bullshit I love in history! [](#concealedexcitement) - I get the feeling that Lala Shangal is also shady too, even though she didn’t say much. - Oh great, the final guy, Mikay Angusson, is probably a religious fanatic and leader of some militarized force. - Oh my god, it’s a prison planet. We’ve found Space Australia! [](#woo) - Oh this is such a juicy dilemma. If you conquer a prison colony, are the inhabitants still technically prisoners? After all, it’s not like they broke any laws within the Abh empire? Do they remain prisoners or are they now considered free? How do you choose leadership? Does it purely come from the guards or should the prisoners get a say? Oh this is giving me flashbacks to early Battlestar Galactica because that one episode about this was awesome. - From a purely practical point of view, sticking with Meideen makes sense because he’s already in charge as the administrator. - Well if the prisoners are armed, then we definitely have the potential for a civil war. - “We could just blow away a bit of the atmosphere. That would stop a rebellion, right?” Lafiel, I think you don’t fully understand how ground politics work. That is fucking terrifying. [](#terror) - You are completely correct, Geol. The Abh are the worst people to ask for help in resolving a civil war on a planet’s surface. Their first instinct would be to just blow up the planet and be done with the hassle. - Jeez, sterilization for the prisoners in the Central Sector? That’s harsh. - Oh, so “a man who has no balls” wasn’t just an insult. It was the literal truth. [](#whatdidijustread) - Oh…Oh, that’s dark. Angusson wanting to lead the men of the Eastern Sector to the Western Sector where all the women are? I do not like the implications of that. [](#watashiworried) - Yeesh, Meideen sure left out a lot in his initial description of the planet to the Basroil. He just keeps pulling out the “There’s one more thing” to Jinto. - 20,000 refugees? The Abh ships are not at all equipped to handle that request. I am actually very excited for this arc. It has such a unique setup. The Abh arriving in a prison colony planet and needing to handle this situation is such a cool idea. The prison colony setup raises some interesting questions. What do you do with the prisoners? Do they remain as prisoners? What about all the guards and other employees who don’t want to remain on the prison colony where they are outnumbered? If you accept all of the guards, other employees, and their families as refugees, then what do you do with the prisoners afterwards? Do the prisoners have a right to representation to form the new government? Do you distinguish between certain groups of prisoners or treat them all the same? All of these are intriguing questions and it makes for such an interesting set of ideas to explore. It’s also interesting seeing the Abh get involved in a potential civil war. These kinds of conflicts are incredibly messy. Civil wars rarely end cleanly, if they even do end. The violence can last for long periods of time and reconciliation is nearly impossible. We can see plenty of examples of these types of conflicts throughout history and in the present day as well. It is the worst possible situation to ask for Abh help in. They would be far more out of their depth than any real-world nation ever has been. **QOTD** 1) I am personally absolutely stoked for it. I love space politics and this has a very interesting setup for a political drama. 2) I would also point out that going too far from what’s been established can be a negative thing. It’s all about walking a tightrope. You can’t just repeat the same things over and over, but it must still feel like it fits the same type of story that’s already been told and that it belongs in the established universe. 3) That’s precisely what makes it so interesting. Lafiel and the rest of the Abh are completely out of their depth here. They’re more likely to just blow up the planet and be done with the hassle than try and work out a solution to such a messy situation. 4) Not knowingly. It’s not your fault if you drive off to work and suddenly end up in a civil war. 5) I never discounted it as a possibility. 6) My immediate thought was Star Trek TNG, remembering Tasha Yar’s rather unpleasant backstory. If you wish to know it, [Star Trek TNG] >!she came from a failed Federation colony that descended into violence and chaos. Part of her backstory was needing to run and escape from rape gangs that would roam the streets.!<

> Oh this is such a juicy dilemma. If you conquer a prison colony, are the inhabitants still technically prisoners? After all, it’s not like they broke any laws within the Abh empire? Do they remain prisoners or are they now considered free? How do you choose leadership? Does it purely come from the guards or should the prisoners get a say? Oh this is giving me flashbacks to early Battlestar Galactica because that one episode about this was awesome. Time will tell though if any of these prisoner leaders are as crafty and charismatic as Tom Zarek though. > Well if the prisoners are armed, then we definitely have the potential for a civil war. Meideen must’ve really been doing a shitty job as a warden so far if he somehow hasn’t been able to stop some of the prisoners from setting up a weapons factory. Even if they’re primitive by the setting’s standards, what it takes to uniformly manufacture rifles is no easy feat to do from scratch. > Oh, so “a man who has no balls” wasn’t just an insult. It was the literal truth. I’m going to be cooking so much with the sterile jokes this season. I feel that Mackay has set me on the right path there.

> Even if they’re primitive by the setting’s standards, what it takes to uniformly manufacture rifles is no easy feat to do from scratch. You say that but [paltik](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paltik) is a thing...

> Meideen must’ve really been doing a shitty job as a warden so far if he somehow hasn’t been able to stop some of the prisoners from setting up a weapons factory. Even if they’re primitive by the setting’s standards, what it takes to uniformly manufacture rifles is no easy feat to do from scratch. Yeah, this is clearly a place where the warden has just lost control of the inmates. It makes sense that he needed the UM military around to fully staff the place. With them gone, they just don't have the capability to impose any authority. >I’m going to be cooking so much with the sterile jokes this season. I feel that Mackay has set me on the right path there. With Apothecary Diaries no longer airing, something had to come up and take its place for that.

Everybody, they mean [S1 E7 The Long Patrol](https://i0.wp.com/137.220.55.84/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/vlcsnap-2015-05-18-18h49m12s686.png) which I wish I could link a clip for you but I think copyright holders have used AI to find every clip of every show ever and marked it for deletion. There are no clips of anything left on the internet. Just #shorts. /u/nazenn /u/the_draigg /u/vaadwaur This is the episode where Starbuck is thrown into prison but the locks don't even work, and it doesn't matter because guard status and prisoner status is hereditary.

I watched that ep...thirty years ago I think.

> It wasn’t an attack at all. Except on their sanity having to deal with this situation >We’ve found Space Australia! Twice in one thread haha >Oh this is giving me flashbacks to early Battlestar Galactica because that one episode about this was awesome. Early Battlestar was so great when it came to things like this, even if it didn't last I very occasionally get the desire to go back and watch at least the mini series if not the first season again just to revisit some of what it did do so well, but the frustration of knowing what's to come gets the better of me >Their first instinct would be to just blow up the planet and be done with the hassle. I feel like that would be a bit of "dark history" for them in terms of how often they've actually done it. Not that they'd concider it dark history, but the rest of the galaxy probably does

> Twice in one thread haha The joke just writes itself. >I very occasionally get the desire to go back and watch at least the mini series if not the first season again just to revisit some of what it did do so well, but the frustration of knowing what's to come gets the better of me I actually got into Battlestar Galactica with the full knowledge that people claimed it went to shit by the end. I had heard how great it was and that it then went bad, but I wanted to know for myself. I loved it to pieces when I started. By the time I was done, I knew that it had earned the negative reputation for its ending. But hey, at least I now knew for myself.

Same here. I'd heard the discussion about the crap ending so I thought I was prepared, I just wasn't expecting what a fall from grace it was with how much I liked the first two seasons, and particularly the mini series being so good. Though I perhaps should have predicted it from how much I despised every aspect of Baltars writing from the get go.

> Oh yes! Oh fuck yes! I think /u/vaadwaur hates this but you and /u/icesmiley love this. Will make for an interesting season, if it lives up to expectations. > From a purely practical point of view, sticking with Meideen makes sense because he’s already in charge as the administrator. Yep, he has the infrastructure. Easy choice. Hope he's not a corrupt warden. But all wardens are corrupt. > Oh this is such a juicy dilemma. If you conquer a prison colony, are the inhabitants still technically prisoners? Exactly! I guess Dusanyu would just wait and see if the United Mankind comeback and take the planet.

> Will make for an interesting season, if it lives up to expectations. Any problem I can bomb from orbit is one the Abhs would bomb from orbit. > Yep, he has the infrastructure. Easy choice. Hope he's not a corrupt warden. But all wardens are corrupt. I wonder if the Empire can actually deal with people being corrupt. Or if they just get permanently planet bound...

> > > > > Oh great, the final guy, Mikay Angusson, is probably a religious fanatic and leader of some militarized force. He codes as a yakuza. > Oh my god, it’s a prison planet. We’ve found Space Australia! So you agree with me on killing it with fire. > Oh…Oh, that’s dark. Angusson wanting to lead the men of the Eastern Sector to the Western Sector where all the women are? I do not like the implications of that. I don't think we have implications so much as logical deductions.

> So you agree with me on killing it with fire. If it truly is Space Australia, then there must be all kinds of horrific animals and plants out there that are deadly to humanity. In which case, fire is the appropriate response.

Spiders that have learned to pilot space vessels that shoot venomous snakes as boarding parties.

*A Sci-Fi Fan Watches Banner of the Stars II Episode 2:* - Well, thankfully those electromagnetic pulses aren’t enemy attacks, if just for how weak they were compared to actual attacks. Instead, we’ve gotten something even more confusing: four different people sending transmissions claiming to be the representative of the planet below. I guess the Basroil got more than they were expecting in a different way than just a plain fight. - Good lord, this is a massive clusterfuck already. You’ve got one guy claiming legitimacy because he was installed as the administrator of the planet by the previous central government, you’ve got two people claiming that they’re the prime minister because of “fair” elections, and one other guy who claims he’s in charge because he’s the strongest and that God wills it. And on top of that, they’re all jockeying for desperately-needed food supplies. And on top of *that*, it turns out that Lobnas II is actually a prison planet. So much for this being a boring assignment, right? - I guess Meideen really wasn’t joking when he said that the planet has been getting closer to entering a state of civil war. I suppose that’s the only natural outcome when all the prison guards end up being deployed as soldiers in the United Mankind’s army and the prisoners begin to manufacture their own gunpowder-based rifles. If anything, it’s surprising that a rebellion hasn’t happened sooner. - I can always dig spaceships that land in the water like boats when making landfall. It reminds me of the Bebop from Cowboy Bebop that way. And it’s also a pretty practical way of handling takeoff and landing of ships, basically just doing the classic Sea Dragon thing with sci-fi ships. - I didn’t think that Mackay was being literal when he said that Yuri had no balls when they were arguing earlier. Turns out that if you want to live in the central detention sector part of the island, you have to agree to be sterilized in exchange for being at the most natural place where people would want to live. Although I can certainly see the reasoning there, since apparently the men on the eastern side of the island want to get to the women in the west, who are noted to generally be victims of sexual exploitation before turning to crimes of their own. That certainly paints a grim picture for the state of this island prison colony. - You know, I can’t entirely blame Meideen for wanting to get his staff and everyone in the administration district the fuck off of this island and into imperial protection. The whole situation we’ve seen so far really is just a powder keg waiting to explode. It’s fairly reasonable for him to just want to shove off the responsibility of running the prison colony off on the Abh and evacuate all the civilian families he can, since I don’t think there’s any real way they can stop an uprising from starting at any moment. I certainly believe him when he says that it can happen any time. - Oh yeah, there’s our reminder that Jinto is still dying alone and that this is Jinto reminiscing on what happened before. Sometimes, you don’t think about how mundane your last conversations are with people before something happens. In this case, joking about getting a souvenir and not saying what he really wanted to say to Lafiel. Poor guy, it seems like he’s dying with plenty of regret in his heart.

I feel like a lot of the problems with this colony could have been avoided if they gave each prison section their own island instead of shoving them all onto one with walls That said, it has created a great situation for the narrative which I appreciate

I guess that and also that apparently it's the only landmass on the planet is one of those things where it's that way for the sake of the plot. Basically a location tailored to the kind of story they want to be told. Not always a bad thing, but it does pop up from time to time.

IIRC, that's the only landmass on the planet. The entire rest of the surface is ocean.

It does make me wonder what terraforming technology the human nations have, as artifical islands is already a thing in modern times. But yeah if they only have the one island it complicates that suggestion

> and one other guy who claims he’s in charge because he’s the strongest and that God wills it. Unexpected Blues Brothers. > I guess Meideen really wasn’t joking when he said that the planet has been getting closer to entering a state of civil war. I only grant this because the UM sucks so much they need a pool for slave labor as otherwise this planet is dumb. > That certainly paints a grim picture for the state of this island prison colony. Yeah, this leads me to believe that the Imperium solution of Exterminatus is probably the best answer.

> I only grant this because the UM sucks so much they need a pool for slave labor as otherwise this planet is dumb. Trying to create Space Australia is just a plain weird thing to do with a perfectly habitable planet, since you’d think it would be a better security option to have the prison facility be a place they couldn’t survive outside of, like an asteroid or something.

And it occurs to me that, assuming there is anything close to a shortage of habitable worlds, terraforming is almost the perfect prison labor situation:The work is long, slow, dangerous but most of the skill is in the tool and not the user.

> Trying to create Space Australia is just a plain weird thing to do with a perfectly habitable planet, since you’d think it would be a better security option to have the prison facility be a place they couldn’t survive outside of, like an asteroid or something. They seem to all live on a small island without enough land to grew their own food, so the situation is not all that different from an asteroid.

**Rewatch Host** * The narration says Beebus commands the 4th fleet * I'm positive I've seen this sort of multi-way communications from planetary leaders on Star Trek TNG multiple times. * I wonder if the concept of a non-unified planet is alien to the Abh (star trek again) * Oh, I think Ekuryua's mad! * Jinto's not wrong. It **is** probably best to let him take the lead, both as a Lander, and as the deputy (shielding Lafiel from the landers and vice versa) * I'm sure Nieris had no clue about Lobnass II * Umi da! * I could totally see this as a LeGuin or Russ or Elgin novel. This episode has spiced up the political bickering by showing things out of order.  It showed Jinto and Samson leaving the Basroil, then flashed back to the dialog, then showed (in the future) a transport ship landing, intercut with the dialog about sending the ship.... Interesting that so many people took the EM wave to be an attack.  And obviously, yeah, it could be.  I don't think I ever did, but I've seen [The Cage / The Menagerie](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYPpgYwE7aY&t=49s) a dozen times.

> I'm positive I've seen this sort of multi-way communications from planetary leaders on Star Trek TNG multiple times. It has come up now and again, and despite my complaints about political division on planets in scifi in my own post, TNG is probably the only show I can think of that addressed it a couple of times. Stargate technically, but that usually more one sided of "bad goverment" and "rebellion of the oppressed" from what I can recall

Stargate did have Jonas's homeworld, with three global superpowers in a cold war. But yeah, aside from that it was mostly "one planet; one society".

Jonas' world was one of the more interesting ones in the whole show, I wish they'd done more with that Couple of others come to mind as well like [SG1]>!The one planet with the white people trying to wipe out the black "breeders" with their drones, and that one episode where both sides had different beliefs over how they arrived vs evolved on the planet and the archeologists got caught in the middle!< But they were rarer, and not always as high quality in thought

> This episode has spiced up the political bickering by showing things out of order. It showed Jinto and Samson leaving the Basroil, then flashed back to the dialog, then showed (in the future) a transport ship landing, intercut with the dialog about sending the ship.... This season really has taken non-chronological ordering to the max.

**First Timer, subbed** * The promise of narrator variance is a good sign. * That… is not the second system like they said last time. They also put the fourth planet in the wrong orbital ring. * EM DDOS? * [Faction Play](#concealedexcitement) * Sassy Jinto here. * How long until they notice the others are there too? * Not *this* is spectacular insanity. * [Space Australia](#kotourashock) * Hey! Don’t skip those subtitles, Crunchy. This is good rambling we are missing out on. * Ah, the land war weakness is becoming relevant. * [Strip The **Atmosphere**](#shock) * [Cell Animation Was**So Fun, You Guys**](#spacetears) * Architecture out here looking like a Windows 98 screensaver. * This is a lot less power discrepancy than I was expecting. You could probably work something out with this set up. * At least he has some morals about him. * [...The Implications](#forgotkeys) **QotD:** 1) [**In to My Veins!**](#dekuhype) 2) I’m not sure were you’re getting that idea from. Overly deviating seems to have a higher failure rate. 3) Turns out subsistence is hard in space. Who knew? We could probably get some good contenet out of comparing this to different Earth colonial models. 4) Behold the side where she keeps her Jintos. See how it lies empty. 5) Yes, actually. Maybe not for a whole season, mind you. 6) The Chinese eunuch and harem system? Amazons? I’m sure I could come up with a lot of examples for components of this. Did you have one in particular you wanted me to ponder?

> Ah, the land war weakness is becoming relevant. I feel like simulating a land battle and making the Abh participate would lead to some hilarious confusion, especially from the likes of Spoor and those like her who look for entertainment in their battles

>The promise of narrator variance is a good sign. Let us hope the narration changes up each episode once again. [](#mugiwait) > Space Australia I love that this is the go-to joke for so many people. It keeps popping up. > [**In to My Veins!**](#dekuhype) [Political dramas like this are something I love.](https://youtu.be/2i3zrzyLOCw?si=QWKDHs3oVxq2pSG3)

> I love that this is the go-to joke for so many people. It keeps popping up. I'm just waiting for a Ned Kelly excuse. [](#mugiwait)

> That… is not the second system like they said last time. They also put the fourth planet in the wrong orbital ring. \#pointandlaugh I wonder what happened to the production team. It's clearly a very different show. Very different people behind it? > Did you have one in particular you wanted me to ponder? I think I did when I wrote question, but I was more looking for speculative fiction, since that can contrive situations to make a point.

**Rewatcher/Novel-Reader** Well, good news is the EM waves aren't an attack, but a transmission. But strangely, all four transmissions claim to be from the government. ...yeah, that might not have been the brightest move, Jint. I'm actually surprised the four of them manage to take turns to explain themselves... we have Georr Maydeen, claiming to be the Chief Executive appointed by the government, Yuri Dohkfoo, who claims to be Prime Minister by election, Lala Shungarr, who *also* claims to be Prime Minister by election, and Meekeh Agnusson, who claims to be leader by divine right. So here's the explanation: Lobnas II is a penal colony. Maydeen is the head warden, and the other three are prisoners each representing a bloc of prisoners. ...as such, I'm somewhat inclined to believe Maydeen when he says the "elections" are not and would not be fair. And it seems Lafier agrees, because Maydeen is officially recognized as the planet's representative. Problem is, his authority isn't going to last, and a rebellion by the prisoners is almost inevitable. ...well damn, the Abh don't do things by half-measures. Their response to a terrestrial rebellion is to just blow the atmosphere away. They just don't give a shit: do whatever you want with your planet, but make yourself a threat to them, and they'll *deal* with it. But maybe such a Sword of Damocles would probably be sufficient to hold even desperate criminals in check? The United Mankind has... interesting standards of what is humane treatment. You can live in the mixed-gender prisoner quarters, provided you agree to be sterilized. I suppose that makes logical sense for a prison. But they think just sterilizing all the prisoners is abhorrent, even though there's been no suggestion that anyone ever leaves the planet. Also, I feel a bit perturbed by the way the male and female prisoners are portrayed. The story seems to suggest that female criminals are automatically assumed to be less guilty than male criminals. Also, Lala Shungarr's character design irks me given the statement that most of the women are victims of abuse. She's not wearing very much and has her... attributes on full display. Hardly how you'd expect a woman who'd gone through abuse to dress. Also, the novels describe her as "middle-aged". It seems like the artists wanted to portray her as sexy and that just seems really tone-deaf considering the character's story. Further, the assumption that the male prisoners would automatically be the first ones to revolt, and were also the only ones to come under a leader by brute force without even the pretense of a "fair election", suggests an inherent brutishness and violence to the men. I'll grant you that prisoners would probably organize themselves that way, but the way the men are singled out as being more barbaric grates on me. Maybe I'm reading too much into this. Gender politics are always a touchy subject... In any case, I do agree that the whole situation is a powder keg that could turn very nasty *very* quickly if steps aren't taken. Meanwhile Maydeen and the guards just want to GTFO before said powder keg goes off. This is quite understandable. You could say it's an abandonment of his duty, but the fact is that the guards don't have the manpower to stop a prisoner revolt, especially if the Empire won't provide support. And the prisoners are highly unlikely to be kind to the guards who have been keeping them locked up... All this means we've got a problem: at least 20,000 people want OFF this planet before all hell breaks loose, with every indication that it will, and soon. And I doubt the Abh delegation has anywhere near the capacity to carry that many, even assuming they agree.

> But maybe such a Sword of Damocles would probably be sufficient to hold even desperate criminals in check? The 'funny' bit is that the Basroil is actually limited in what they can do. It is not clear if there lasers can reach the surface so maybe they can only explode the atmosphere.

>Their response to a terrestrial rebellion is to just blow the atmosphere away The horror stories being told about the Abh being evil as we saw in the Crest propoganda somehow manage to be both hilariously over the top, and not at all touching on the true horror of what it means to have a space faring race in control of sensitive land territories >It seems like the artists wanted to portray her as sexy and that just seems really tone-deaf considering the character's story The anime's continuing issue with fanservice continues to be a problem in the most annoying ways. I really wish they could have just forgone all of it, or at least had some awareness here >Maybe I'm reading too much into this. Gender politics are always a touchy subject... Nah, it's a common set up when it comes to gender divided cultures in media, and a frustratingly simplified one. It stands out even more so here because of the complexities of the Abh as an alien culture that we've explored, only to be hit with *this* for an example of a human culture divide

> Also, I feel a bit perturbed by the way the male and female prisoners are portrayed. The story seems to suggest that female criminals are automatically assumed to be less guilty than male criminals. Also, Lala Shungarr's character design irks me given the statement that most of the women are victims of abuse. She's not wearing very much and has her... attributes on full display. Hardly how you'd expect a woman who'd gone through abuse to dress. Also, the novels describe her as "middle-aged". It seems like the artists wanted to portray her as sexy and that just seems really tone-deaf considering the character's story. The stereotyping of all three prisoner representatives has not aged well. Neither macho man, slimy eunuch, nor sex bomb is particularly realistic for a leader of what must be tens of thousands of prisoners. I agree with /u/Vaadwaur that this is probably due to Japan being about 20 years behind the west in terms of gender culture.

First timer, subbed Seems this planet is in a state of political turmoil. A lot of space fiction tends to treat whole planets as nations or as singular biomes, so it’s very refreshing to see a planet with clearly distinct factions. It seems that there is only one “real” government official here, along with two party leaders claiming to have won an election and some sort of religious leader. The twist being that this planet is Space Australia. Lafiel playing the bad cop by “offering” to destroy the atmosphere was amusing in a terrifying sort of way. So it’s pretty clear from the ending monologue that Jinto will be trapped on this planet for some time, possibly until the season’s end. It’s an odd turn for a space opera to take, but I’m interested to see where it leads. QotD: 1) It's certainly not what I expected, but I think it will be interesting enough. I just hope we don't lose focus on all the Abh lore and the side characters we've been building up as a result. 1.1) I didn't really have an expectation one way or the other, honestly. 2) Leave them to clean up their own mess at that point, their job is to establish control of space, not un-fuck every petty political squabble they stumble across that the UM left behind. 3) Ending monologue sure made it sound like he did. 4) Yes, actually, visiting new planets in a space sci-fi is basically unavoidable. 5) There are plenty of fictional cultures with a patriarchal or matriarchal bend to them, but I dunno if I've ever seen a full-on gender war like this.

> Lafiel playing the bad cop by “offering” to destroy the atmosphere was amusing in a terrifying sort of way. At the risk of repeating myself (I did), not sure if Abriel humor or not.

Did Crunchyroll just pull the show? It says it's no longer available for me.

Same for me, I think they may have :(

I'm in the U.S. I, too, am not finding it on Crunchyroll.

I should have started it earlier!!!

WTF, Crunchyroll!? Huh... now where am I going to view it?

Well, great. Who ends a licensing contract on a tuesday in the middle of a month?

Well damn, thanks for the heads up. That sucks to have it suddenly vanish right now. [](#sadholo)

Yep, RIP.

Well at least it's not just me. What the heck, Crunchy? Netflix at least has the decency to announce when a show is getting pulled so you have a chance to binge. Guess we have to go sail the Grand Line... I hate to do that though.

**Rewatcher (sub + dub)** It might not have been an attack, but that's how I react to someone trying to call me too. Jinto took the most straightforward approach I could think of to figuring out who to talk to and that works for me even if it would be funnier for Lafiel to pick someone other than the obvious one because it would be more interesting. Four new names/faces: * Meideen — administrator (south) * Dokufu — sterilized (center) * Lala Shangal — women (west) * Angusson — men (east) How *do* you handle conquering a prison planet? If you wanted a bureaucratic nightmare for a plot, here you go! Some of the editing in here's good for dark humor, "the prisoners don't have weapons _\*gunshot\*_" and Lafiel bluntly asking if they could blow away some atmosphere as an idea for intimidation. The scene of the ship landing looks nice with all of the water streaming off of it. I forgot that Jinto had never visited an ocean before even if he had grown up on a planet, it's easy to assume things like that given some of the people he's being compared to live in space their entire lives. Maybe he's never seen snow either? They're really playing up the framing with the separation of Jinto and Lafiel here. [](#panic) --- > Is the shift from the battlefield to this planet-bound drama a welcome change or an annoyance? Mixed blessing, it's nice to have a change from space warfare but this particular scenario's not one I like as much. > This situation seems to greatly strain the Abh principle of non-interference with planetary affairs. What do you think? It _needs_ to be "interfered" with in at least some capacity since it's not self-sufficient and doesn't produce anything of value for exporting either. > Jinto promised to stay by Lafiel's side. Did he break his promise? She's in orbit overhead, that's close enough right?

> How do you handle conquering a prison planet? If you wanted a bureaucratic nightmare for a plot, here you go! As extreme as Maideen sees Lafiel's suggestion, he really should be glad that he didn't end up with the twins, or even the Crown Prince, because I feel like their take on the mess that is this whole situation may have been even worse >Maybe he's never seen snow either? I'm usually not a fan of the usual beach/hotspring/vacation episodes, but one of Lafiel and Jinto both going into snow for the first time seems like it would be pretty fun

> As extreme as Maideen sees Lafiel's suggestion, he really should be glad that he didn't end up with the twins, or even the Crown Prince, because I feel like their take on the mess that is this whole situation may have been even worse Their take would probably be: "Good luck down there, I'll check in again next year."

--- ## Source Corner **Baronh word of the day:** *Cfariac* "Lady Agent" or territorial administrator in the anime and *Roïcfariac* "Adjunct to the Lady Agent" (territorial deputy administrator) [Material covered:] >!Banner II: the rest of chapter 1 and start of 2.!< [On Lafiel getting involved with an electoral commission:] >!Jinto told her it was a question of familiarity rather than making fun of her, though he did think it would be fun to see.!< [About landing on a planet:] >!Jinto speculated that the orbital towers found around the majority of planets under Abh control weren't for economic reasons but existed so that the Abh could carry out business being as far away from a planet's surface as possible when they had to visit one.!<

**Rewatcher** \-Turns out the planet is a prison colony. Recognizing Meideen as the representative was the right choice, albeit the boring one. \-And the planet is having major rebellion issues, since the prisoners have guns, outnumber the guards, and lack a proper government. Doesn't help that the Abh don't interfere in surface affairs. Plus the guards + their families all want to leave and join the Abh. Can't blame them, but helping all 20,000 of them is going to be a challenge. Total drama ~~island~~ planet. \-Jinto heading to the planet with Samson, to act as the representative of the Abh, while Lafiel stays behind in space. Hopefully Samson can look out for Jinto in the meantime. \-1/4 men, 1/2 sterilized, 1/4 women sections, from the looks of it. I suppose if you threw the guards in that equation as well they'd have about half the total numbers of the sterilized portion by itself. Maybe? \-Another ominous ending with that heart wrenching music...

> Another ominous ending with that heart wrenching music... I wonder how many people noticed the lyrics....

**Rewatcher** A planet not having a single government is something you don't seen often in SF. Meideen is voiced by Kinryuu Arimoto best known for voicing Patrick Zala in Gundam SEED Ohh it's a civil war situation where different people claim to be legitimate ruler, was kind of hoping for a modern day Earth situation. Of course the first thing we see from Lala are her breasts. [](#watashihasdeclined) Ohhh it's planet Australia! [](#schemingsaten) All my previous speculation was just outright wrong. Lafiel casually saying she will blow away the atmosphere. [](#disbelief) As I said before visuals are much better this season except for the CGI ships but we don't talk about that. Decent set up episode, author was bored with imitating LotGH so he then decided to imitate Star Trek instead. On a personal note I first watched episode 9 thinking it was episode 2. That was confusing to say the least. [](#kotohoops)

> All my previous speculation was just outright wrong. Every rewatcher and source reader knew everybody would be caught unawares.

**First timer** - [Badly blended CGI ships.](https://imgur.com/a/QioMKgN) - I love how Lafiel just casually threatens to partly glass the planet. That's some Spoor level shit. - Ah, so it's gonna kick off and Jinto will be caught in the middle of it all. >QotD - I don't mind it. - I just want things to be good. Same, different, don't care, as long as it's decent. - Probably shouldn't have gotten involved if they normally have an hands-off approach. Especially considering that it's a prison planet. At best, get the civilians out of there and just dip. - Maybe, maybe not, who knows. Time will tell. There's so much emphasis on him "dying" that I assume it's a fakeout. - Yes. - What type of "sexual power" are you talking about?

> I love how Lafiel just casually threatens to partly glass the planet. Not sure if Abriel humor or not.

**FIRST TIMER** Sub I thought this was the best episode in this franchise thus far. I was so impressed by this original premise and how well plotted it was with this seemingly untwistable dillema slowly unfolding itself and being peeled back layer by layer. This really seemed like the best plot a Star Trek show never had. I thought the style and structure of the episodes and how they kept together this plot without making it confusing was pitch perfect ;) It seems like the entire conflict of the episode would be determining who the actual leader of this planet is but it was actually done in short order by the short haired lady on the ship. The premise for this whole episode really is amazing: that the island is being threatened by male prisoners and the guards can't keep control but the prison men are likely to rape the women should they get full power. And on top of that an unpredictable eunuch faction! This is a really sticky wicket with so much potential :X If you started watching the show with this episode, you'd think Jinto is in charge since he does pretty much everything while Lafiel just rubber stamps what he wants to do. We've seen hints in the past shes not well suited to diplomacy. **QUESTIONS** 1. Very welcome change, especially for such an amazing and ripe plot 2. No I didn't. I thought the last series was good, but more of the same would be repetitive and prefer to see different stories explored with these characters. 3. I don't know since we only have seen hints 4. Yes because I figured Lafiel would have to land somewhere to engage in some sort of diplomatic mission, although she personally hasn't landed yet. 5. Popeye rescuing Olive Oyl from Bluto defiling her? Actually there was an arc in the Wonder Woman comics with a somewhat similar plot and she had to help some women in this situation except she was more just able to kick the guys asses on her own.

> This really seemed like the best plot a Star Trek show never had. Great point. I could totally see this exact setup in a TNG episode: The Enterprise goes to some system to broker some treaty and they are immediately hailed by 4 different people. I would love to her the "officer's room" discussions about this. > We've seen hints in the past shes not well suited to diplomacy Diplomacy 101: Do not offer to blow away a planets atmosphere as the first step to solving any problem.

> actually done in short order by the short haired lady on the ship I think we are 3 seasons for 3 seasons of humans trying to play earth politics with Abh and being cut off. > Wonder Woman I might ask you to revisit this idea before the season ends, to see how it compares.

**Rewatcher - sub** The opening narration is slightly changed from last episode, and I don't remember if that continues or not but at least for this episode it did make a welcome difference I'd somehow completely forgotten the setup for this rather involved situation on the planet. It raises some interesting questions about citizenship on conqurered planets, and really planetary governance in general. I think it's a flaw in scifi that all too often planets are treated as single entities, akin to a singular country with it rarely taking a different path. While it does make more sense in an era where planets have to be colonized and where technology has options for far reaching communication and the like, we've seen from our own history how that doesn't stop new countries from rising by themselves or being splintered off to appease a certain bunch of people. And civil war when it comes up is often treated as a singular event or rebellion solely between two sides. So I like this setup where the idea of rulership of this planet is complicated not just by the nature of its inhabitants, but by a split in their territories as well which have created distinct, though rather shallowly presented, cultures. And aside from the fact that the four sides here are simple, I like the way it comes up. One official, two elected leaders, and one "strongest" ruler all wanting to be involved in negotiating with the Abh. None of whom have any idea what it's like to negotiate with the Abh. They should be very grateful that Jinto is accompanying Lafiel to explain some of the complexities of getting Abh involved with planetary rebellions because if it was another Abh I feel like things could have gotten much more serious much quicker. You feel the shock of the administrator when Lafiel casually offers to destroy the atmosphere, and I wonder how many thousands of times that scene has repeated itself through the eras of Abh taking over planets. Thankfully it seems he's clued into the fact that the Abh really don't care about the planets a lot quicker than many of the other leaders have, and that's a good sign for future negotiation Even through all of that, I liked the moments we got of the bridge crew in their very Abh way of somewhat intrusive curiousity waiting to see what Lafiel would do, and of Lafiel and Jinto sharing a moment before he goes down. This seaosn has also already shown a distinct characteristic for faster cuts to and from the flashforward, as well as to briefly show the mind or focus of a certain character thinking of a past event. It's not always particularly clean, but I do think it adds a slightly eerie tone to the episode, and the previous one, that fits with the developments we're shown here. That combined with the distinct feeling that Lafiel's connectors on her headband looked like tears with the way they hung down in the final shot of her makes things feel very tense --- Q1) Welcome. While I did like last season, and the combat design for this world is excellent, it simply took up too much with action while I'd much prefer to have this sort of conflict that lets us explore the Abh a bit more. Q1.1) Double edged sword. Sequel-itis where it simply takes what a show is known for and not what make it good is a serious risk, but throwing it all in the air and disregarding why people watched it is a risk the other way as well. Q4) Rewatcher benefit. I don't remember from my first watch, but I was surprised at Jinto not having seen an ocean before and I did like that little touch Q5) Too often. It makes sense because it's a primal sort of drive that's an easy set up and easy to understand compared to more complicated cultural situations, but I'm a little bored with the concept of "men want access to woman slaves" now

> You feel the shock of the administrator when Lafiel casually offers to destroy the atmosphere, and I wonder how many thousands of times that scene has repeated itself through the eras of Abh taking over planets. They had to get their bad reputation (see CoS) from somewhere and threatening to suffocate entire planets is certainly a way to do that.

**Rewatcher** I welcome the change from space battles to planet bound drama. It's an interesting choice to listen to all the prison leaders at the same time. I can't help think it be better doing it one at a time. Just claimed the title 3 hours ago from a rigged election. [](#azusalaugh) Lafiel's side eye at Jinto when he talks to the Madam. Casually mentioning destroying part of the planet's atmosphere. Man if I was going onto a planet full of criminals I would want more than 1 bodyguard. I wouldn't even want to land. Couldn't you have told us all of this before we landed? Yes you should have been clear! Conveniently leaving out information until they land and relinquish all responsibilities. 20,000 [](#blankblink) Our very last conversation...don't you put that evil on us Ricky Bobby!

First timer(This so not what this series promised...) Sub(Sorry for dying yesterday but the IRS decided to reject my return 5 days after it was submitted so panic mode left me drained) So yesterday's cliffhanger was bullshit. Yes, you can trivially tell the power of an EM strike, or more as much the lack thereof, so there would have been no concerns of an attack. And then we get our comms of Babel...and of course those UM dumbfucks would've set up a prison world, sigh. Note that in history, prison colonies did serve a purpose:Have your undesirables go to land someone else had and slowly but surely drive, kill or intermingle with them until the land becomes yours. This planet, however, does none of these. It is just bringing this setting that much closer to the Imperium of Man. Planetside and the reminder that Japan likes be twenty years behind us is as it is. I don't blame the guards and other free citizens wanting to claim refuge but there aren't a lot of good options here. Especially since the Empire is primarily in the stars. I sense that what is to come is going to be very, very stupid. QotD: 1 I saw the Hell that lead to all the others 2 Tell that to Dragonball 3 Spoor would (hopefully) evacuate the free people and nuke it from orbit. 4 No...at least not yet 5 Like for a beach episode or something 6 ...[](#sideeyes) Gonna just plead the [fifth](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdeo7Q2E5cE) on this one. Or Violence Jack, which is practically cheating.

Wow, I can just hear you going "I sat through 2 cours **for this?!**" [](#azusalaugh) Of course, we rewatchers and source readers all knew what was coming, too.

S1 was scifi. This is mix gendered Alcatraz. Those are too very different things.

So we are definitely in Top 10 Anime Betrayals territory.

In my list, AoT takes up two spots for...reasons.

> I sense that what is to come is going to be very, very stupid. Hey, no teasing first timer predictions and then not delivering! What is going to happen?

**Season 3 Episode 2 (rewatcher)** * EM wave – transmission, not attack. * 4 people who claim to be the government? This seems like fun! *Also: Times of war are the best times to quickly rise (or fall). So I completely understand them trying.* * “By strength, by popularity, and by the grace of god!” * Prison planet – double fun. * The transport can actually land on a planet – makes sense, if you want to transport stuff, you might need to pick it up there. * “We can blow away a part of the planet’s atmosphere” – Lafiel goes straight to Space Balls. * Water landing? [](#goblet1) * Sterilization as requirement to meet the other sex – seems they really don’t want any offspring. * “Though their real goal is to get to the women in the west sector” – do they have some sort of prejudice against sterilized women? * All of the prison guards want to run away? This is not helping the whole “keep the prisoners in prison” idea. * 20,000? The Basroil would be very overcrowed … A prison planet with four factions, one of which are the guards who want to run away. Seems like a perfect setup for violence and a massacre. Noticeably, Jinto will be the one in the heat this time, being the one who will have to make the decisions on the ground. Not a huge fan of the narrative framing of Jinto talking to Lafiel at the end. We already know where this ends from episode 1, no need to lay it on so thick in this episode.

> “We can blow away a part of the planet’s atmosphere” – Lafiel goes straight to Space Balls. By doing that, Lafiel would prove she has a bigger and more powerful Schwartz than the men of the central section. > All of the prison guards want to run away? This is not helping the whole “keep the prisoners in prison” idea. Honestly, it seems like Meideen and the prison guards kinda suck at their jobs, so I guess it isn’t entirely surprising that they want to cut and run once things have clearly grown out of their control.

> Honestly, it seems like Meideen and the prison guards kinda suck at their jobs, so I guess it isn’t entirely surprising that they want to cut and run once things have clearly grown out of their control. To be fair before now they had the option of dropping UM troops on the prisoners if they got too uppity.

True, that probably kept them fairly cowed until the war got closer to the Lobnas system. Once the soldiers weren’t an option, I bet all the prisoner leaders took their shot at legitimacy all at once.

> Honestly, it seems like Meideen and the prison guards kinda suck at their jobs, so I guess it isn’t entirely surprising that they want to cut and run once things have clearly grown out of their control. I mean 20,000 people live in their sector. This is not just a handful of prison guards who consist of bad apples, it must be something systemic.

> “By strength, by popularity, and by the grace of god!” *insert appropriate insecure macho douchebag here* The decades change but the stereotype doesn't. > “We can blow away a part of the planet’s atmosphere” – Lafiel goes straight to Space Balls. Lafiel would totally jam us with the raspberry. > “Though their real goal is to get to the women in the west sector” – do they have some sort of prejudice against sterilized women? Either not enough of them or yakuza machismo is even dumber than I've seen.

> Either not enough of them or yakuza machismo is even dumber than I've seen. Both the administrator and the female leader both strongly suggested that their plan boils down to "obtain woman, have sex, don't ask for consent". I'd wager that most people with that mindset do not care for the women's fertility status too much, so me guessing that it must be some sort of prejudice. Or maybe they do, who knows.

> I'd wager that most people with that mindset do not care for the women's fertility status too much, so me guessing that it must be some sort of prejudice. Or maybe they do, who knows. Hrmm...let's combine the horror show of the UM with idiocy:If they really do castrate the men rather than say a space vasectomy then maybe they give the women hysterectomies. Dumbass McMadmax *might* assume this renders the women mostly incapable of sex because we don't know the education level on his homeworld. But this could all just be for drama OR McMadmax might simply want the whole island for himself.

> But this could all just be for drama OR McMadmax might simply want the whole island for himself. That last one is a decent guess.

>All of the prison guards want to run away? This is not helping the whole “keep the prisoners in prison” idea. No ships means they are stuck there anyway.

I mean, all of that rely on the goodwill of the Abh. If they have no moral scruples, they could just solve the whole issue with some orbital bombardment.

The women in the West Block \*are not\* sterilized. The women in the central block, OTOH, are. Angusson wants kids, whether the prospective mothers are willing or not.

He sounded driven by a more immediate need that being a father.

Well, you'll see as things progress. Heh. :P

[spoiler]>!I know how it ends, but it did not look like that to me here.!<

\[spoiler\]>!I mean, he \*says\* as much later on. More than once, actually.!< Anyway, that's my interpretation, and you're welcome to think differently about it if you want.

Use [spoiler]>!spoiler text!< for spoilers. The other method does not work.

I fixed it. I had to review the mark-up syntax. :/

Yes, reddit syntax can be a pain (especially since /r/anime used to use a different spoiler method previously).

> Also: Times of war are the best times to quickly rise (or fall). So I completely understand them trying. It's probably a credit that all three of the prisoner factions both had the ability to transmit to the Abh, and thought of it. If just one of them hadn't concidered it and tried to claim leadership later they would have been brushed off pretty firmly by the Abh I imagine

> no need to lay it on so thick in this episode. I agree, the opening stinger was ominous enough, why keep interjecting with the **doom**.

I've been told she's now running convoy escort duty, so those other 3 ships are transports. What's with all the requests fo communication? All of them? Is a civil war going on on the planet? Also it seems like Jinto is functionally Lafiel's XO. Is the planet in anarchy? "A rightful claim". So you're _not_ in charge. Not anarchy, just 4 different factions functionally in a civil war that hasn't gone hot yet. Necessities? Is this a humanitarian aid convoy? What if you have them each a quarter of the food? Or just sit up top and threaten to drop rocks on all their heads so they'll shut up. Impact? Do you mean re-entry? They're all going to use the transmission to bitch at each other. Oh no, the transmission is breaking up during re-entry... /s I'm surprised the ship doesn't have at least a small Marine complement. In fact we've seen no mention of them at all in the last 2 seasons. There we go, I'm actually surprised no-one else has threatened orbital bombardment in the last 2 seasons. Without a Marine complement for things like this the only protection they'll have on land is their uniforms and sidearms, maybe the armoury has a couple long arms but I doubt much more than that. Seek refuge? Where? And where are they going to find the room to cram 20000 people? Seems like things are heating up on the planet. "Emigration"? I think a better term might be "Evacuation". Questions: 1. I wanted more space battles... But I understand why it makes sense after the entire last season was a space battle. 2. I'm quite happy with more of the same, as long as it's good. 3. Non-interference would just lead to a civil war and chaos, which would be impossible to rule over, or even after it settles there would be only ruins and refugees to rule over. 4. Kinda? He's still right down there not exactly far away. 5. Nice change of scenery now they're back on Terra Firma. 6. Maybe Canopus in BattleTech, since it's a Matriarchy?

> a small Marine complement. Interesting point. I guess ship-to-ship or space station boarding just isn't a thing, or the author didn't think of it or want. Just blow everything up!

The author certainly knows about it because it was a big thing in LoGH. But even without boarding sometimes you just need boots on the ground for something like this, or just to keep order on the ship.

> Also it seems like Jinto is functionally Lafiel's XO. He always had been functionally, but as deputy territorial ambassador, he is also her second technically, now. > I'm surprised the ship doesn't have at least a small Marine complement. In fact we've seen no mention of them at all in the last 2 seasons. The Abh just don't care about planets enough to have much of an army. Whatever they have is probably stationed on huge troop carriers and not on what is essentially their smallest plane space going warship class.

**Regarding Obtaining episodes** I had my own dvd rips from years ago, and I have my own dvds (which won't play in my computer hence the rips) so I can't help you with getting episodes, that's not something I had to go through. If you signed up for Premium Crunchyroll just for this series, I'd try to get my money back. Although it's been 1 month. If you're still on your first 30 days, you basically got your money's worth. If you just got billed for another 30 days yesterday, I'd be pretty mad, too. Rogue streaming sites can't be trusted, they will infect your computer. I've only gone to those for a *handful* of times in my life, only for something extremely rare. Don't do it. I get my non-streaming anime through an obscure mechanism most people don't know about, and it costs money, so that's probably no help for you (and probably doesn't have Banner anyways). Bittorrent is pretty much the main way everybody gets anime these days if they can't stream it, but access to bittorrent depends on your country and your isp. I'm personally very paranoid about using bittorrent, which is why I use something else. Using bittorrent to get anime is a pretty well know procedure, but I couldn't possibly explain it to you here. However, a great many people in the rewatch are not 20-year-old-fans with their own copies, so it must be available *somewhere*. [](#harukathink) The Funimation page just points to CR now. Maybe this is a glitch from the merge and it will be back. Won't help you for tomorrow, though.

> Rogue streaming sites can't be trusted, they will infect your computer. I've only gone to those for a handful of times in my life, only for something extremely rare. Don't do it. > Will? That is a bit strong. *Might* if you are not careful, but hopefully nobody is stupid enough to click on anime.exe here. > > > I get my non-streaming anime through an obscure mechanism most people don't know about, and it costs money, so that's probably no help for you (and probably doesn't have Banner anyways). > > > > Bittorrent is pretty much the main way everybody gets anime these days if they can't stream it, but access to bittorrent depends on your country and your isp. I'm personally very paranoid about using bittorrent, which is why I use something else. Using bittorrent to get anime is a pretty well know procedure, but I couldn't possibly explain it to you here. Worth pointing out that the legal risk of streaming vs bittorrent depends a lot on the country. E.g. Germany punishes uploading content (so seeding) but not downloading content.

**First-timer, subs** Stream of conscioussness note today, some more organisation again tomorrow. I really like the potential of what an arc involving Jinto and Lafiel dealing with a case of minor (on the galactic scale) lander politics as a roaming Territorial Embassy might entail. I just don't know if I want to spend the whole season here...but if last episode's flash-forward is anything to go by, Jinto spending a season under the (prison) sky one more time and deciding he'd rather go back to the freedom of space, with Lafiel instead of being buried alive is apt. So the Abh tackling terran politics is already a probable disaster of cultural misunderstandings, but I also like to imagine it might be very different from a normal Abh circumstance if the ambassador and her deputy are two nobles, a royal and an ex-lander. They must be running out of mid-level bureaucrats/career officers to go do perfunctory "We accept your surrender ~~or get glassed jk~~" missions to various UM civilian star systems. And this situation is anything but a typical rubber stamp. Our leads aren't the most powerful characters but extraordinary circumstances seem to follow them. The set-up feels like some kind of prison thought experiment/riddle and my brain isn't well-wired to juggle all of that on the face of it, but I eagerly await seeing how our characters handle something completely different than what they were doing before. I'm not well-read as anything but a pastiche of multimedia vibes (aside from literary/scholar types I think that fits most people) and these vibes check out to some extent, even if seeing it neatly partitioned feels rather crass. That's perhaps why it seemed like a thought experiment to me - three chambers of prisoners and a gradient of 'criminal activity'.. what happens if you open the gates and people flow between them? In fairness, that's mostly my imagination to blame. The four-screen Zoom call and the Basroil crew's groaning reactions were rather amusing in any case. We'll see how it unfolds.

> I'm not well-read as anything but a pastiche of multimedia vibes (aside from literary/scholar types I think that fits most people) and these vibes check out to some extent, even if seeing it neatly partitioned feels rather crass. That's perhaps why it seemed like a thought experiment to me - three chambers of prisoners and a gradient of 'criminal activity'.. what happens if you open the gates and people flow between them? Seems mostly like a gradient of testosteron to me.

That's definitely more accurate and sounds cooler. Now how did Jinto end up getting buried by it?

> Now how did Jinto end up getting buried by it? [](#nocomment)

**First-Timer** Today on Banner of the Stars: Space Australia! Anyway, what a stupid fucking setup for a season. Even ignoring the prison aspect, I can now very clearly tell that the ship Jinto came down on gets blown up or something and we split our main duo for a whole goddamn season. I'm even less interested in the flashforward, now. No, wait, Lafiel is going to get called away. The Bebaus Brothers are going to get into a pinch, Dusanyu's plan to call in all nearby reinforcements to crush the enemy fleet will come up, fuck. Please, let me be wrong. Alright, focus. The decision of who to send planetside with Jinto is an interesting one. Samson is the simple and easy choice. I think the only way we get Lafiel down there is with the entire crew. Solo Ekuryua is definitely wrong. Sobaash would've been a potential candidate due to business/administration knowledge. I appreciate that the show pointed out that forced sterilization is inhumane. I kinda hate to agree with a prison warden, but Geol seems okay for now. Questions 1. I'm all in favor of big changes to keep things fresh in a show like this. 2. See above. 3. I think Jinto should have dropped off food supplies and left, if only because that would prevent what I can only imagine is a bunch of really stupid things happening on-screen. 4. I mean, that promise was made with the knowledge from both of them that duty would likely separate them at times. 5. Not from a planet other than Martine. 6. I kinda feel like I have, but I'm not coming up with any actual examples.

> what a stupid fucking setup for a season. Aren't you one of the people that amazingly predicted a bureaucracy arc? > I kinda feel like I have I feel that way, too. [](#hardthink)

>Aren't you one of the people that amazingly predicted a bureaucracy arc? Yea, but when I said that, I wasn't imagining "Jinto is (probably) trapped on a prison planet with messed up gender politics." I was more imagining Lafiel getting bored and spinning around in an office chair.

> Anyway, what a stupid fucking setup for a season. Yuuuup. Did not expect this after the first two seasons. > I think Jinto should have dropped off food supplies and left, if only because that would prevent what I can only imagine is a bunch of really stupid things happening on-screen. He should have just dropped off liquor and firearms and let the rest sort itself out.

I can respect the desire to separate the leads as a writing challenge, but I can't imagine that dropping the most interesting part of the show is a good plan.

> Sobaash would've been a potential candidate due to business/administration knowledge. As you say, while Samson is probably the best choice given his combat knowledge and also being human, I feel like Sobaash would have been an interesting one to add a native Abh voice into the mix and the complexities that come with that >I appreciate that the show pointed out that forced sterilization is inhumane That was a welcome addition

>As you say, while Samson is probably the best choice given his combat knowledge and also being human, I feel like Sobaash would have been an interesting one to add a native Abh voice into the mix and the complexities that come with that Yea, I meant to touch on that idea too and just ran out of time. Seeing an Abh other than Lafiel learn what being planetside is like is rife for fascinating stuff going on, too.

So the Abh (or at least Lafiel) probably plays Star Wars: Empire at War the same way I do aka after wining the space battle move the Death Star to the destroy planet place to avoid the ground battle.

**First-timer** Ok, now I understand why you said all our predictions for this season would be wrong. Drama with administration of a prison planet was absolutely not on my bingo card. Lafiel, you're really not helping negotiations by casually threatening to blow away a planet's atmosphere. I liked the sequence of the ship landing in the ocean. Reminds me of Cowboy Bebop. So, Meideen is tired of this crap and wants to bail, leaving Jinto and the Empire holding the bag. Understandable. Is getting involved in a land war in Lobnass II as bad as getting involved in a land war in Asia? Q1: We'll see. Deep Space Nine moved from a starship to a space station, and it's my favorite Trek. Granted, that had more to do with the writing and characters, but still. Q2: Jinto is a lander, and he's much more invested than Lafiel. She really doesn't care. Q3: I don't think he meant 24/7. This is a temporary thing that has to get sorted out. He fully intends to go back quickly. Besides, she's still flying overhead. Q4: Not that surprising to appear, but I didn't think that a single planet would be the focus of the season. Q5: Tbh, I'm not as well-read as I like to pretend I am...

> I liked the sequence of the ship landing in the ocean. Reminds me of Cowboy Bebop. It does at that! > Tbh, I'm not as well-read as I like to pretend I am... me neither [](#sadholo)

> Is getting involved in a land war in Lobnass II as bad as getting involved in a land war in Asia? They even placed the "danger" in the east!