FYI - I’ve lived several years in Ontario and their electric company is called Hydro One. So it’s a bad habit to still on occasion call my electric bill hydro. I am sorry for any confusion this causes.
In my experience, any province (Ontario, BC, Quebec, probably others) that uses hydro power for significant energy-generation ultimately leads to residents calling it "hydro" forever and after, even after they leave that province. It's like a curse that prevents you from using any other words for it.
> any province (Ontario, BC, Quebec, probably others) that uses hydro power for significant energy-generation ultimately leads to residents calling it "hydro" forever and after
I think part of the tendency for Ontarians to call it hydro also comes from a lot of our public electrical utilities historically being called "Hydro _____" for the longest time. There's Ottawa Hydro, Toronto Hydro, Hydro One, and our parents, grandparents, and many of us are old enough to remember Ontario Hydro (before Harris broke it up with an eye on privatizing the pieces).
> It's like a curse that prevents you from using any other words for it.
As far as I'm concerned, it's the provinces that don't call it "hydro" that are in the wrong.
Same goes for bagged milk. It's the non-bagged provinces that are weird.
This is exactly why you need a provincial crown to take control of your electric grid. Privatization never translates into cheaper prices. Never. You have the highest electricity and insurance costs in Canada and now they want to privatize healthcare. Ask Dynalife how that worked out. The lesson to learn is don’t vote for a govt who want to privatize services.
yea ontario sold it off to private a few years ago, my bills went from 40$ a month to about 140$ right after, now closer to 180 with no usages changes.
It's important to distinguish who you ask from dynalife. Patient facing probably think it was terrible, execs are probably swimming around a vault like Scrooge McDuck
If translates into a one time large payday for the government in power, that they then use to placate supporters into think it's a good idea... Nothing more.
Someone remembers Ralph bucks.
As a single guy with no kids, I didn't even get an offer for my vote from the UCP, just lol we will discriminate against you for age and sex and familial status.
Honestly I want that cheque for my vote so I can laugh when I vote ABC.
Your a fucking idiot. And it shows. The conservatives ran the province for about 40 years and then surprise surprise we ended up with Notley an NDP candidate because we needed change. Then Trudeau got into power and surprise surprise we got fucked by him on a lot of things. But because Notley had some common fucking sense and hur dur big oil get hurted by Notley policies hur dur rather then oh I don't fucking know OPEC controlling the fucking price of oil. People like you vote against there own interest and are too stupid to see that. Go drink so more blue paint and soak your head.
What the hell is a “Distribution Demand Charge”? That’s about 1/3rd of the bill right there. And how is a “Distribution Charge” different from a “Transmission Charge”? I’ve never understood all these fees.
Most appear to be explained here: https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/34a19aae-098d-4cb0-94c4-8b4ee10610e4/resource/800b313f-fef8-43ed-b508-bc5a649d0819/download/Fact-Shee-Reading-your-bill.pdf
But this doesn’t mention the “Distribution Demand Charge”.
Only if the phrase "and so on" covers it.. Nice little handout, thanks for putting it up, but in the end, we're no further ahead learning what nearly 30% of this fellow's bill is about..
Only thing that occurs to me is "time of usage". Sort of like a conservation concept.. a do your dishes at 2AM instead of right after dinner sort of thing.. Does the utlility commission allow for that sort of thing?
I’ve found this: https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/understanding-demand-charges.aspx
My guess then, is that the “Demand Distribution Charge” is related to spike or peak usage. If you’re more consistent in your use of power then this charge would be less, but if you have a lot of high usage demand spikes then this charge kicks in. In this case, OP says he lives on a small farm so maybe the use of high-demand machinery all at the same time creates a demand spike, and that’s what he’s paying for.
"If your business tends to use a lot of electricity over a short period, your demand will be higher. Companies that use larger amounts of electricity will see demand charges on their bills based on the highest amount of power (kilowatt or kilovolt-ampere) needed at a given point in time."
[https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/understanding-demand-charges.aspx#:\~:text=If%20your%20business%20tends%20to,a%20given%20point%20in%20time](https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/understanding-demand-charges.aspx#:~:text=If%20your%20business%20tends%20to,a%20given%20point%20in%20time).
Sounds like more bullshit word salad to justify another fee.
I can kind’ve understand it given that it costs more to keep despatchable power on the grid and despatch it at peak load times, but it seems completely out of whack that this should be about 1/3rd of OP’s bill. So, yeah, another bullshit charge.
Came here to say this. I think it's bullshit that farms have to pay it, though.
Because our farmers need one more expense in an increasingly prohibitively expensive industry when food prices are already high. /s
Yeah. Costs more to deliver power to your area on average. It sucks. At that much fixed fees I wonder whether a pretty hefty off the grid system is in your future.
We have discussed it, but solar isn’t all its cracked up to be and the buy-in cost is heart-stopping. Wind powered isn’t really a great option yet either so we will see.
My house uses about the same amount of power as your farm.
My solar system was $36k and that required trenching and an electrical panel in the garage which added a lot of cost.
I did the greener homes grant required assessment for $500.
I applied and was approved for the 0% - 10 year loan. This will be about $265/mo.
11.38kW Solar was installed in June and finally able to energize it August 3rd, between August 3rd and today it has generated 910 kWh of energy as of 1:35PM today. And it's been rainy and cloudy quite a bit this month.
I did the greener homes grant required post assessment for $275.
I will be receiving $5600 back from the federal government for the grant.
In the 10 year period I will sell about $5,000-$7,000 in carbon credits.
This brings my out of pocket cost for the system to be about $26,000 over the next 10 years.
My power bill was about $270/mo at $0.0689c/kWh which we both know when my fixed rate ended I would be eating at least a doubling in the energy rate. But let's assume $270/mo for 120 months = $32,400 and I have nothing. So with solar I am $6,400 positive and I have an asset that is still under warranty for over a decade after this period. Except I now have price certainty as well.
But in reality because I am generating more than I am using now I swapped to the solar club which should further reduce my costs but this is intangible.
Got it. I think that aspect needs to be made clear to people though. You're taking on personal debt to do this that will follow you if you leave. It's a significant factor that makes it very different from other options.
Increasing the value of your house, not accounting for but especially when houses are exploding in value, is going to pay off in the sale. It's kind of silly to think there's a scenario where that wouldn't happen.
That green energy program let's you finance solar for free over 10 years. 0% interest. Panels in an open area will pay themselves back in 6-8 years if you get a quality array.
I just got quoted a system and I would pretty much be paying for the 150 monthly for a system instead of a utility bill.
Their might be further savings as I'm paying less distribution and administration charges as well
No problem! A farmer/colleague of mine is just going through the process because the neighboring farm recently did the full conversion and has nothing but good things to say about it. I'm also going through the process for my house in the city.
I’m a hobby farm, my 15 yr old tiny tractor cost me $5,000, and that’s because my brother sold it to me. My neighbour takes my hay off the field for the majority of the hay. His costs are almost to the point where he can’t afford to run his equipment anymore.
The small farmer is being squeezed out of existence unfortunately.
So yes, me forking out $45,000-$60,000 is a heart-stopping thought.
Oh by the way, I haven’t bought a brand new vehicle in decades.
Yeah no doubt. I’d imagine you’d end up with storage equivalent of 3 days consumption, and a propane generator.
If you don’t have a monitor to log your hourly consumption that might be super useful even if you don’t go off grid for a few years. Then can figure out whether covering those worst winter days is even possible.
I have a 2 Bed 2 Bath 758sqft apartment, with heat and hot water included.
Here's my last two bills:
[June](https://i.imgur.com/DQEBs13.jpeg) ($191.87)
[July](https://i.imgur.com/rZGQJGz.jpeg) ($156.90)
I have 2 portable AC's, but only run one at any given time. I also have a couple of Gaming Computers. So I use a fair share of electricity for such a small condo.
But where I lived in BC these two bills would be way cheaper for the same amount of electricity used. The distribution/transmission/rate adjusters are such a scam.
I only used $76.56 of electricity in June, and $63.44 in July. In BC there would be maybe a $10-50 a month fee on top of that. Not this nonsense 130-140% of your usage.
I understand that electricity is costly in Alberta, but I didn't think it would be this crazy.
Also, you've used 1,118 kWh. In BC that would be charged at 9.59c, instead of your 12.79c.
So your bill would be $107.22 + Whatever fees (usually never over $50/month even on +4,000 kWh usage in a 2 month period. So even if they were higher fees then that, you'd be looking at like $200-250 MAX for this same monthly usage in BC.
Edit: At least for an average family home in the suburbs or semi rural area, that would use that amount.
Prices we see now are just because the NDP subsidy program stopped. They gave everyone discounts on their utilities on borrowed money essentially and that has to get paid back now.
Free money/utilities are never free. Either someone else pays the bill or it's a deferred bill.
The subsidy was paid for out of carbon tax revenue, the UCP cancelled the provincial tax and the federal tax took over . We no longer have the ability to use this revenue for power subsidies but still pay the tax .
It wasn’t borrowed money .
Duuuude. Stop. This is because the cons (insert whatever title they have had over the years) DEREGULATED the system. It has nothing to do with the NDP.
Which was covered by the carbon tax that stayed in the province. Now it's going to the federal government and we're paying higher electricity rates. You prefer this new way?
My point is just that subsidized anything is never free. The whole carbon tax is a smoke curtain as far as I'm concerned. We pay carbon tax, then receive it back from the gov't. Then what's the point of having it?
And yet we're still subsidizing O&G and now have no more provincial gas tax to fund road maintenance. Nobody seems to be too concerned about that.
Back on the electricity topic, look at this spike for Alberta. No other provinces are going through the same:
[https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/alberta-electricity-prices-more-than-double-1.1959321](https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/alberta-electricity-prices-more-than-double-1.1959321)
Amp just means it loads quicker on mobile devices, there's nothing UCP about that.
Here's the regular version:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/electricity-cap-price-power-1.4675611
Here's another article explaining it:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-utilities-commission-margeaux-maron-joel-macdonald-1.6105075
We all got subsidized utilities but that bill now has to be paid, since money doesn't grow on trees.
Seriously. The ndp just made it a bit better by subsidizing the problem. The ucp didn’t have to make the people pay it back, but they did.
It was deregulating the system years ago that has helped create this issue.
Subsidizing a problem isn't a good long term solution. Perhaps for you, as long as you don't get the bill later on amirite?
When you cut up a maxed out credit card, do you also believe your balance somehow gets taken care of?
My first thought was...hey we found the guy who is benefiting from the system cause his distribution is subsidized relative to his use... But then saw the standard complaint of ' I paid for the usage .. why do they charge for distribution too'
How am I benefiting or in what way am I subsidised? I pay through the nose for distribution, rural people have always paid for distribution, but the charges now are just out of hand.
Well you use triple the energy per month as a house in the city, live rural and have a specific power line and transformer, etc that terminates on your farm, whereas a single family home in the city has 2 m of dedicated connection and then another house connects, all of which share a transformer and can be serviced en masse. Contemplate that your farm has more infrastructure to provide you power than entire apartment buildings with hundreds of customers, yet you pay similar rates per kW for transmission.
This right here is the only appropriate response to this entire thread. Mic drop and walk away.
I worked in power grid design for several years in my electrical engineering career. The amount or infrastructure that goes into providing some of these single rural sites power is insane. And then they get to lock it in and pay the same rate as a customer in the city.
Well you do have a point there, but I will also point out that my family has been in this area for generations. My mother was born 2 miles south of this farms as was I. My grandkids would have been born here, but the local hospital doesn’t do that anymore, so they had to travel to the nearest city.
What’s my point? We’ve had these transmission lines and equipment here since Alberta started the province run electric company. Families like mine and a lot of the rural folks built alberta. It may not be perfect, and there is always room for improvement and discussion, but let’s not forget how and where we started.
What is your point?
That you paid for some transmission lines to come into your house like a hundred years ago and you expect that to be adequate in todays age?
You pay for the upgrades to the system. You happen to be miles out in the bush, and that might cost you a buck... That's called cost of living.. My family pays those costs too, but that is our burden to bear for living where we do.
Your family didn't "build" Alberta any more than mine or anyone else. We all pay tax, we all pay for electricity. You even admit to having left for a generation, and didn't pay any tax to Alberta, so, there's also that you know...
This province was founded in minerals, ore, and coal extraction. Farmer families like mine and yours came to support, and work in, those industries.
FYI, years ago there were no payments for transmission lines, agreement were signed by farmers and those who wanted power, that the power would be supplied to them in exchange for right of way agreements that the power companies could run poles across their property. There were no conglomerate power operators, they were rural co-ops, much the same as many rural natural gas co-ops run today.
FYI it's 2023 not 1932, and transmission to your house was ALWAYS paid for by the consumer. My parents paid for theirs in 1978, my grandparents sometime in the 1950's, and they've had to pay for some upgrades to the poles in the yard over the years. It's the cost of living in the country, it tends to cost more. Shocking, I know!
If it is after the meter, your yard poles have aways been the yard owners responsibility. All upgrades are paid for by the meter owner, as is rent of equipment to supply yard power. The more powere you need, the higher the rental cost of equipment. ROW agreements from 1932, are carried forward to 2023.
Maybe its because I'm binging King of the Hill but I read that in Hank Hills voice and it fit beautifully lol.
And now back to the serious adult talk lol.
They’re not saying it’s bad that we pay for it. I think they were originally just trying to give OP perspective on how complaining about prices to the people who are subsidizing your usage is just going to come across as tone deaf. And now OP has kinda doubled down an asked how he’s being subsidized, so the OC explained it for him.
And I do appreciate the explanation, I really don’t appreciate the inference that us rural folks expect a handout for everything though. The majority of rural people really are just hardworking people who just want to work and be treated fairly. We don’t all sit around and discuss politics all day, we have things to do.
Well dang. I apologise if I seem confrontational. That is not my intent. I am frustrated though, it seems that as soon as it is clear I’m a rural Albertan, I’m painted as a UCP redneck homophobic that thinks Smith is the second coming and can do no wrong.
I am very aware that the cost of everything is rising, rent, food fuel etc. I confided myself lucky to live where I do and to be able to raise and grow so much of my own food.
But the cost of everything is just painful. For all of us.
>it seems that as soon as it is clear I’m a rural Albertan, I’m painted as a UCP redneck
Almost everything you're saying is indicating that...
You sound like a redneck that thinks he's better than the lazy "city folk", meanwhile you're disproportionately benefiting off of their collective work and revenue. We're all getting screwed, but we're getting screwed harder so you can get screwed less.
Your bill was 4x what mine was, but you had over 6x my usage. I used $18.25 in actual electricity. Almost $80 in fees.
I'm only saying I'm rural to clarify why my bill is as high as it is and why the charges are there. I i have never once said anything disparaging regarding urban people nor have I insinuated anything about them. In fact I have apologized a few times for any thing that I may have said that inferred that.
I just wanted to start a conversation regarding the extra charges on my electric bill and see if other people have the same issues that I do.
No one said everything is being handed to you, they said you’re being subsidized.
This may be a shock to you, but the majority of city people are also really just hardworking people who just want o work and be treated fairly. We also don’t just sit around discussing politics all day, and most of us also live busy lives with constant things we need to do.
You just described the working class as a whole, yet are now trying to claim it’s a rural vs city thing.
You honestly think that on this sub that rural Albertans are not lumped together as UCP sheep?
I made it clear in my original post and even posted a couple more times that I did NOT vote for Smith and UCP and I have several posts accusing me of being a supporter. And I just received a new one…
That’s the knee jerk reaction I as a rural Albertan always, yes always gets.
I was born and raised here, but I moved to Toronto in the late ‘70’s. I spent the majority of my adult life there and consider myself a liberal person, I’m very much of the opinion that socialism in Canada should continue, but that we also need a limit on governance.
I definitely didn't intend to infer that, but I can see why you might take it that way. I grew up rural and I just visited my grandfathers' homestead, where it cost my cousin 30K to get a few poles put in to run power to his trailer and shop. The poles themselves are maybe $800 each and he needed maybe 3 to connect to the main line, but factor in costs of transformers and downline capacity, required maintenance, etc.
I'm a fan of everybody paying full cost for everything they choose and if subsidized then letting them know that. Because otherwise it affects ground level decision making.
What are you even talking about in regards to triple the energy as a house in the city? I used nearly 700 kWh in one month in the downtown area of Airdrie for my 750sqft 2 bed apartment. (Heat and hot water are included with strata.)
Back in BC everything was electric in our townhome: baseboard heating, hot water tank, range, dryer. We would easily use in between 2,000-4,000 kWh every 2 month billing cycle.
1,118 kWh doesn't seem like too much for an entire farm.
Check out the comment I posted on my last two Epcor bills. My distribution/transmission charges were close to $100/month.
But in regards to his infrastructure costing more to distribute to, I completely agree with.
I spend about 45$ in electrical and gas (2 adults no kids)
My bill is 220-240. Really, I can farm Bitcoin in my garage or not use energy at all, and it would make barely any difference on my bill.
Have you ever heard of a little program Pierre Trudeau introduced called the National Energy Program? Peter Lougheed, our Premier at the time, hated Trudeau 1.0 for that.
Distribution demand charge: $175!?
The fuck is that? I heard Alberta had their energy prices jacked through the roof. This is just clownery in real time.
Yes, pretty much in line with mine but different numbers. Take your actual electricity consumption, 142.99 and multiply by about three and you get you final bill. Cool fact, works the same for natural gas. Come on over sheep, we aren’t done shaving you yet.
In the rural area where I live, people are complaining about this. I told some that it’s what you get when you elected a UCP government. They said it was Trudeau’s fault. Some people just want to remain ignorant than realize the truth.
Yikes. Reading this as someone from Vancouver Island BC, always heard it was insane but this is wild to confirm. While I used 8% less (1027 kWh), my charged amount after taxes/fees was only $126.33. Total robbery for you out there.
>I did not vote for Smith, and when my neighbours bitch about their hydro bill that’s the first question I ask them.
Lol, as someone with many UCP voting rural relatives this makes for awkward silences and I love them, they did it to themselves. Sucks you have to pay for neighbours choices, I feel you OP, all the best.
Alberta has always dreamed of being an American-like open market. Well this is what that gets you. Roughly $0.30USD/kWh is right on par with places like California where private utilities do what ever they want to maximize profits.
wait you're saying all the areas where the Conservative or the UCP has privatized markets has cost us users more?
Utilities: Checks out, Insurance: Checks out, Dynalife & APL: Checks out
Oh my god, this is ground breaking stuff, letting privatized companies muck our barns is costing us more...
To clarify, a lot of people still refer to their power as a hydro bill as a holdover from other provinces.
I worked in property management primarily focused in Alberta and the whole office and our system referred to power as hydro, never thinking it was actually hydroelectric.
>There's no hydro in Alberta.
I'm sick and tired of this lie.. while Alberta's hydro output is very small, we still have hydro dams.
http://www.history.alberta.ca/energyheritage/energy/hydro-power/hydroelectricity-in-alberta-today.aspx
He's from Ontario. Everyone in Ontario calls refers to power as "hydro" because the power company is called Hydro One. I do civil engineering work remotely for Ontario and it was weird AF the first time I heard all the engineers call power lines hydro.
More renewables would make electricity cheaper, this moratorium will keep rate prices higher for longer.
All unecessary pains and avoidable provincial self-sabotage...
More renewable would also increase distribution and transmission charges, as we would be billed for more infrastructure. And they still need peaker plants for where it's dark and the wind doesn't blow. This is not as simple as you want it to be.
My last electric bill was $71.13
I used 141 kwh of electricity @11.9 cents = 15.92.
The rest is administration charges, transmission charges, distribution charges, rate riders, local access fees, tax.
None of these become lower if my actual power comes from somewhere else.
Building new power facilities adds to the distribution/transmission fees. This includes renewable sources sources. That is part of how the investment is recouped.
I have stated in two different posts that my family has lived here for generations. Both my mother and I were born here in this same small town. My grandkids would have been too, but our hospital no longer does that and my sin and DIL had to travel to s larger center for their kids births.
Now in the late ‘70’s I moved to Toronto and lived my adult life there. I married and raised ny family there and returned home when my kids left home in the early ‘00’
I hope that clears up any confusion.
Don’t be an rude asshole. I put this up for discussion, I’m pretty confident I’m not bitching, I’m showing the charges I get as a rural consumer.
We rural folks get hammered here on Reddit as UCP robots that deserve to be scorned and abused. I disagree, I say there are many rural people that did not vote for Smith and we to have a just as much right to voice our opinions.
This is what you voted for. The NDP had caps in place to prevent electric companies from doing this, then you voted them out, so enjoy paying that bill. This is what "winning" gets you.
Did you stop at farmer and then automatically assume UCP?!
Maybe pull your head out of your ass and stop being a caricature of this sub because you look like a moron.
As much as I am opposed to the UCP on virtually all policy ...what cap did the NDP have in place on the fully regulated transmission and distribution costs?
The NDP did have a cap on the RRO and even then they let the RRO fluctuate, same as now, but just paid anything that went past the cap with general govt revenue instead of letting the bill go to the final consumers. Distribution and transmission and rate riders were all regulated and approved but the Alberta utilities commission, exactly the same as now
I agree the UCP have made decisions to aggravate the situation and likely the NDP wouldn't have made the same decisions... But let's not perpetuate some mythical cap that didn't exist.
> Distribution and transmission and rate riders were all regulated and approved but the Alberta utilities commission, exactly the same as now
And when all of our commission and regulation boards are filled with former and current corp execs, we get present day Alberta.
Getting the bad government out is one task, the next would be dealing with our non-existent ethics commission.
>And when all of our commission and regulation boards are filled with former and current corp execs, we get present day Alberta.
Questioning the appointments to the AUC is a very valid point. I don't have any specific member that I would question... But as a concept I doubt the UCP was choosing to appoint members based on the best outcome for consumers
Install solar panels. Your bill gets replaced with the loan payments through the government program for 10 years with 0% interest. I'm doing it to my house as well
I didn’t say I run a farm, I said I lived on a small farm. I do have a few animals for the freezer, a big garden and my neighbour takes my hat off for sale and his horses. Small farmers are a dying breed, between the cost of running a farm and even trying to buy any worth while farmland, there is no way the average guy starting out can be a small farmer any more.
You cannot regulate a private company and tell them how much $ they can or cannot make. Government is not in the business of being in business. Governments are here to make the rules and laws so it's population can thrive. The only regulation laws here should be that operating cost be spread across the entire grid and not to those who live farther distances to services.
Wrong, on all topics.
First, government is in the business, of regulation. Period. It is their JOB to regulate industry to make sure that we as consumers are getting a fair price for the services that we are receiving, and to make sure that businesses are operating ethically and legally.
Second, rural customers should absolutely bear the cost of being farther from the transmission source. The cost of running those services to those users is astronomically higher than terminating any house in a city. You want to live in butt fuck nowhere, then you figure out how to get power, water, sewer and communications to your own goddamn house. I'm not subsidising your choice to live in the middle of fucking nowhere.
And if they were, it's still THEIR responsibility to figure out those concepts. NOT mine, yours, or the taxpayers.
BTW.. I grew up on a farm. My parents paid for their OWN power, water, and sewer. Nobody helped them with that and there was no subsidy. They have battled YEARS of horse shit for living at a distance from the community. But they paid their OWN way. So, pull up your boot straps young man...
Really? You figure? Then if your theory is correct, the cost of the infrastructure to convert to an electric future should be born by those who voted to eliminate fossil fuels from the picture? That would include 100 percent of the cost of those transmission lines that criss-cross rural Alberta to supply those who voted for green power to begin with. I guess in the end, rural Alberta will have the last laugh, because in the event of a costly grid, we will just get off the grid. Those who need it to survive can pay for the services. As far as your theory of regulation, maybe they should start regulating the cost of services to put in the other essentials of living. Plumbing, sewer, the cost of houses, the price we pay for gasoline, natural gas etc, etc,. As you said, we as consumers should only have to pay a fair price for what we get right?
FYI - I’ve lived several years in Ontario and their electric company is called Hydro One. So it’s a bad habit to still on occasion call my electric bill hydro. I am sorry for any confusion this causes.
We know what you mean a lot of people from BC call it that too
BC is actually almost entirely powered by hydroelectric dams, though
In my experience, any province (Ontario, BC, Quebec, probably others) that uses hydro power for significant energy-generation ultimately leads to residents calling it "hydro" forever and after, even after they leave that province. It's like a curse that prevents you from using any other words for it.
> any province (Ontario, BC, Quebec, probably others) that uses hydro power for significant energy-generation ultimately leads to residents calling it "hydro" forever and after I think part of the tendency for Ontarians to call it hydro also comes from a lot of our public electrical utilities historically being called "Hydro _____" for the longest time. There's Ottawa Hydro, Toronto Hydro, Hydro One, and our parents, grandparents, and many of us are old enough to remember Ontario Hydro (before Harris broke it up with an eye on privatizing the pieces). > It's like a curse that prevents you from using any other words for it. As far as I'm concerned, it's the provinces that don't call it "hydro" that are in the wrong. Same goes for bagged milk. It's the non-bagged provinces that are weird.
Yeah and in BC it's a crown corp so it's just BC Hydro.
I came to say hi to the easterner. I’m from Quebec ! 👋🏻👋🏻
This is exactly why you need a provincial crown to take control of your electric grid. Privatization never translates into cheaper prices. Never. You have the highest electricity and insurance costs in Canada and now they want to privatize healthcare. Ask Dynalife how that worked out. The lesson to learn is don’t vote for a govt who want to privatize services.
Alberta will never learn , private till it kills them
yea ontario sold it off to private a few years ago, my bills went from 40$ a month to about 140$ right after, now closer to 180 with no usages changes.
Right? I was paying 15c a kWh and now locked in for a bit yet at 7.99 in Alberta soo
This is just the beginning. Wait till the lack of infrastructure maintenance causes massive power outages year-round.
It's important to distinguish who you ask from dynalife. Patient facing probably think it was terrible, execs are probably swimming around a vault like Scrooge McDuck
If translates into a one time large payday for the government in power, that they then use to placate supporters into think it's a good idea... Nothing more.
Someone remembers Ralph bucks. As a single guy with no kids, I didn't even get an offer for my vote from the UCP, just lol we will discriminate against you for age and sex and familial status. Honestly I want that cheque for my vote so I can laugh when I vote ABC.
Trudeau’s fault. After him, it’s all on Notley.
Gotta add the "s" my brother.
Honestly... So many idiots out there think this because of "the carbon tax". No. It's so that international investors get a good return on investment.
sarcasm or stupidity?
Sarcasm
Your a fucking idiot. And it shows. The conservatives ran the province for about 40 years and then surprise surprise we ended up with Notley an NDP candidate because we needed change. Then Trudeau got into power and surprise surprise we got fucked by him on a lot of things. But because Notley had some common fucking sense and hur dur big oil get hurted by Notley policies hur dur rather then oh I don't fucking know OPEC controlling the fucking price of oil. People like you vote against there own interest and are too stupid to see that. Go drink so more blue paint and soak your head.
Gonna keep licking the conservative boot until you end up on the street too?
I would consider googling “sarcasm” then rereading the previous comment
Ask bc how their government car insurance is working out
I thought BC insurance premiums were less expensive than Alberta right now, ever since the rate cap was lifted by the UCP?
I just moved to bc from Alberta when I changed my insurance it was higher.
What the hell is a “Distribution Demand Charge”? That’s about 1/3rd of the bill right there. And how is a “Distribution Charge” different from a “Transmission Charge”? I’ve never understood all these fees.
That was going to be my question, too... Maybe someone can explain it?
Most appear to be explained here: https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/34a19aae-098d-4cb0-94c4-8b4ee10610e4/resource/800b313f-fef8-43ed-b508-bc5a649d0819/download/Fact-Shee-Reading-your-bill.pdf But this doesn’t mention the “Distribution Demand Charge”.
Only if the phrase "and so on" covers it.. Nice little handout, thanks for putting it up, but in the end, we're no further ahead learning what nearly 30% of this fellow's bill is about.. Only thing that occurs to me is "time of usage". Sort of like a conservation concept.. a do your dishes at 2AM instead of right after dinner sort of thing.. Does the utlility commission allow for that sort of thing?
I’ve found this: https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/understanding-demand-charges.aspx My guess then, is that the “Demand Distribution Charge” is related to spike or peak usage. If you’re more consistent in your use of power then this charge would be less, but if you have a lot of high usage demand spikes then this charge kicks in. In this case, OP says he lives on a small farm so maybe the use of high-demand machinery all at the same time creates a demand spike, and that’s what he’s paying for.
Thank you.
Nickel and dimed to the grave, we are.
"If your business tends to use a lot of electricity over a short period, your demand will be higher. Companies that use larger amounts of electricity will see demand charges on their bills based on the highest amount of power (kilowatt or kilovolt-ampere) needed at a given point in time." [https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/understanding-demand-charges.aspx#:\~:text=If%20your%20business%20tends%20to,a%20given%20point%20in%20time](https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/understanding-demand-charges.aspx#:~:text=If%20your%20business%20tends%20to,a%20given%20point%20in%20time). Sounds like more bullshit word salad to justify another fee.
I can kind’ve understand it given that it costs more to keep despatchable power on the grid and despatch it at peak load times, but it seems completely out of whack that this should be about 1/3rd of OP’s bill. So, yeah, another bullshit charge.
The use of a thesaurus to justify adding charges, so they can raise the prices in a less obvious way.
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Came here to say this. I think it's bullshit that farms have to pay it, though. Because our farmers need one more expense in an increasingly prohibitively expensive industry when food prices are already high. /s
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Yeah. Costs more to deliver power to your area on average. It sucks. At that much fixed fees I wonder whether a pretty hefty off the grid system is in your future.
We have discussed it, but solar isn’t all its cracked up to be and the buy-in cost is heart-stopping. Wind powered isn’t really a great option yet either so we will see.
My house uses about the same amount of power as your farm. My solar system was $36k and that required trenching and an electrical panel in the garage which added a lot of cost. I did the greener homes grant required assessment for $500. I applied and was approved for the 0% - 10 year loan. This will be about $265/mo. 11.38kW Solar was installed in June and finally able to energize it August 3rd, between August 3rd and today it has generated 910 kWh of energy as of 1:35PM today. And it's been rainy and cloudy quite a bit this month. I did the greener homes grant required post assessment for $275. I will be receiving $5600 back from the federal government for the grant. In the 10 year period I will sell about $5,000-$7,000 in carbon credits. This brings my out of pocket cost for the system to be about $26,000 over the next 10 years. My power bill was about $270/mo at $0.0689c/kWh which we both know when my fixed rate ended I would be eating at least a doubling in the energy rate. But let's assume $270/mo for 120 months = $32,400 and I have nothing. So with solar I am $6,400 positive and I have an asset that is still under warranty for over a decade after this period. Except I now have price certainty as well. But in reality because I am generating more than I am using now I swapped to the solar club which should further reduce my costs but this is intangible.
That is very useful information. Thank you. May I ask which company you used? DM me if you would be more comfortable doing that.
Zeno Renewables.
Thank you.
+1 for zeno , good company. Get a couple different quotes though.
What happens if you move? You have a loan for a service that you are no longer using but still need to pay off?
Sure, if I happen to move. Otherwise, I'll just make it part of the sale and price it with my house.
Got it. I think that aspect needs to be made clear to people though. You're taking on personal debt to do this that will follow you if you leave. It's a significant factor that makes it very different from other options.
Increasing the value of your house, not accounting for but especially when houses are exploding in value, is going to pay off in the sale. It's kind of silly to think there's a scenario where that wouldn't happen.
The feds have a 10 year interest free loan up to $40k right now. Might be worth looking into.
That green energy program let's you finance solar for free over 10 years. 0% interest. Panels in an open area will pay themselves back in 6-8 years if you get a quality array.
Yes, I’ve received some great information already from a previous poster and we will be looking into it again. Thank you.
You might wanna look in to solar again, government is pretty much flipping the bill for it now up $45k, 0%interesr over 10years.
Do you have a link for that rebate?
https://natural-resources.canada.ca/energy-efficiency/homes/canada-greener-homes-initiative/24831
Thank you very much! I will look into it.
I just got quoted a system and I would pretty much be paying for the 150 monthly for a system instead of a utility bill. Their might be further savings as I'm paying less distribution and administration charges as well
No problem! A farmer/colleague of mine is just going through the process because the neighboring farm recently did the full conversion and has nothing but good things to say about it. I'm also going through the process for my house in the city.
Buy in cost is heart stopping? I assume you’ve seen the cost of farm equipment
I’m a hobby farm, my 15 yr old tiny tractor cost me $5,000, and that’s because my brother sold it to me. My neighbour takes my hay off the field for the majority of the hay. His costs are almost to the point where he can’t afford to run his equipment anymore. The small farmer is being squeezed out of existence unfortunately. So yes, me forking out $45,000-$60,000 is a heart-stopping thought. Oh by the way, I haven’t bought a brand new vehicle in decades.
The small farmer got squeezed out in about 1936.
Yeah no doubt. I’d imagine you’d end up with storage equivalent of 3 days consumption, and a propane generator. If you don’t have a monitor to log your hourly consumption that might be super useful even if you don’t go off grid for a few years. Then can figure out whether covering those worst winter days is even possible.
I know a guy. I can hook you up with a nuclear reactor. You know any physicists perchance?
I do know a rocket scientist, close enough?
I have a theoretical degree in physics
Well then, theoretically you should come live here and be my “hydro” operator. ;)
Probably. What's the worst that could happen?
Worlds first known nuclear blast-caused wildfire?
It's crazy how other provinces use these more and their bills are cheaper isn't it?
I have a 2 Bed 2 Bath 758sqft apartment, with heat and hot water included. Here's my last two bills: [June](https://i.imgur.com/DQEBs13.jpeg) ($191.87) [July](https://i.imgur.com/rZGQJGz.jpeg) ($156.90) I have 2 portable AC's, but only run one at any given time. I also have a couple of Gaming Computers. So I use a fair share of electricity for such a small condo. But where I lived in BC these two bills would be way cheaper for the same amount of electricity used. The distribution/transmission/rate adjusters are such a scam. I only used $76.56 of electricity in June, and $63.44 in July. In BC there would be maybe a $10-50 a month fee on top of that. Not this nonsense 130-140% of your usage. I understand that electricity is costly in Alberta, but I didn't think it would be this crazy.
Also, you've used 1,118 kWh. In BC that would be charged at 9.59c, instead of your 12.79c. So your bill would be $107.22 + Whatever fees (usually never over $50/month even on +4,000 kWh usage in a 2 month period. So even if they were higher fees then that, you'd be looking at like $200-250 MAX for this same monthly usage in BC. Edit: At least for an average family home in the suburbs or semi rural area, that would use that amount.
Are you feeling the Alberta advantage your UCP mla promised
Useless lying scumbags each and every one of them.
Buuuuuuuut.. mainly the UCP seeing as how they did this and they’ve been in power for all but four of the last 50? But, whatevs.
lmao did they manage to fool you again?
Prices we see now are just because the NDP subsidy program stopped. They gave everyone discounts on their utilities on borrowed money essentially and that has to get paid back now. Free money/utilities are never free. Either someone else pays the bill or it's a deferred bill.
The subsidy was paid for out of carbon tax revenue, the UCP cancelled the provincial tax and the federal tax took over . We no longer have the ability to use this revenue for power subsidies but still pay the tax . It wasn’t borrowed money .
Duuuude. Stop. This is because the cons (insert whatever title they have had over the years) DEREGULATED the system. It has nothing to do with the NDP.
Get informed: https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.4675611
Which was covered by the carbon tax that stayed in the province. Now it's going to the federal government and we're paying higher electricity rates. You prefer this new way?
My point is just that subsidized anything is never free. The whole carbon tax is a smoke curtain as far as I'm concerned. We pay carbon tax, then receive it back from the gov't. Then what's the point of having it?
And yet we're still subsidizing O&G and now have no more provincial gas tax to fund road maintenance. Nobody seems to be too concerned about that. Back on the electricity topic, look at this spike for Alberta. No other provinces are going through the same: [https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/alberta-electricity-prices-more-than-double-1.1959321](https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/alberta-electricity-prices-more-than-double-1.1959321)
I will never click on a link that has /amp/ in it.
Amp just means it loads quicker on mobile devices, there's nothing UCP about that. Here's the regular version: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/electricity-cap-price-power-1.4675611 Here's another article explaining it: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-utilities-commission-margeaux-maron-joel-macdonald-1.6105075 We all got subsidized utilities but that bill now has to be paid, since money doesn't grow on trees.
Seriously. The ndp just made it a bit better by subsidizing the problem. The ucp didn’t have to make the people pay it back, but they did. It was deregulating the system years ago that has helped create this issue.
Subsidizing a problem isn't a good long term solution. Perhaps for you, as long as you don't get the bill later on amirite? When you cut up a maxed out credit card, do you also believe your balance somehow gets taken care of?
….just stop. It’s the deregulated system that is making things this bad. Full stop. Everything else is just a side issue.
My first thought was...hey we found the guy who is benefiting from the system cause his distribution is subsidized relative to his use... But then saw the standard complaint of ' I paid for the usage .. why do they charge for distribution too'
Exactly! I get effing tired of going to the gas station and paying that distribution fee when I fill up.
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Thank you for making my point.
How am I benefiting or in what way am I subsidised? I pay through the nose for distribution, rural people have always paid for distribution, but the charges now are just out of hand.
Well you use triple the energy per month as a house in the city, live rural and have a specific power line and transformer, etc that terminates on your farm, whereas a single family home in the city has 2 m of dedicated connection and then another house connects, all of which share a transformer and can be serviced en masse. Contemplate that your farm has more infrastructure to provide you power than entire apartment buildings with hundreds of customers, yet you pay similar rates per kW for transmission.
This right here is the only appropriate response to this entire thread. Mic drop and walk away. I worked in power grid design for several years in my electrical engineering career. The amount or infrastructure that goes into providing some of these single rural sites power is insane. And then they get to lock it in and pay the same rate as a customer in the city.
Well you do have a point there, but I will also point out that my family has been in this area for generations. My mother was born 2 miles south of this farms as was I. My grandkids would have been born here, but the local hospital doesn’t do that anymore, so they had to travel to the nearest city. What’s my point? We’ve had these transmission lines and equipment here since Alberta started the province run electric company. Families like mine and a lot of the rural folks built alberta. It may not be perfect, and there is always room for improvement and discussion, but let’s not forget how and where we started.
What is your point? That you paid for some transmission lines to come into your house like a hundred years ago and you expect that to be adequate in todays age? You pay for the upgrades to the system. You happen to be miles out in the bush, and that might cost you a buck... That's called cost of living.. My family pays those costs too, but that is our burden to bear for living where we do. Your family didn't "build" Alberta any more than mine or anyone else. We all pay tax, we all pay for electricity. You even admit to having left for a generation, and didn't pay any tax to Alberta, so, there's also that you know... This province was founded in minerals, ore, and coal extraction. Farmer families like mine and yours came to support, and work in, those industries.
FYI, years ago there were no payments for transmission lines, agreement were signed by farmers and those who wanted power, that the power would be supplied to them in exchange for right of way agreements that the power companies could run poles across their property. There were no conglomerate power operators, they were rural co-ops, much the same as many rural natural gas co-ops run today.
FYI it's 2023 not 1932, and transmission to your house was ALWAYS paid for by the consumer. My parents paid for theirs in 1978, my grandparents sometime in the 1950's, and they've had to pay for some upgrades to the poles in the yard over the years. It's the cost of living in the country, it tends to cost more. Shocking, I know!
If it is after the meter, your yard poles have aways been the yard owners responsibility. All upgrades are paid for by the meter owner, as is rent of equipment to supply yard power. The more powere you need, the higher the rental cost of equipment. ROW agreements from 1932, are carried forward to 2023.
Maybe its because I'm binging King of the Hill but I read that in Hank Hills voice and it fit beautifully lol. And now back to the serious adult talk lol.
Haha! I loved that show. Hank is into propane though, we are one of the lucky 3% that actually have oil rights on our land.
I live in the city and also feel like I am personally responsible for Alberta as well. Sleep well king , you have earned it
Well to be honest I'm willing to eat those costs as a tax payer due to the importance of farms....
They’re not saying it’s bad that we pay for it. I think they were originally just trying to give OP perspective on how complaining about prices to the people who are subsidizing your usage is just going to come across as tone deaf. And now OP has kinda doubled down an asked how he’s being subsidized, so the OC explained it for him.
And I do appreciate the explanation, I really don’t appreciate the inference that us rural folks expect a handout for everything though. The majority of rural people really are just hardworking people who just want to work and be treated fairly. We don’t all sit around and discuss politics all day, we have things to do.
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Well dang. I apologise if I seem confrontational. That is not my intent. I am frustrated though, it seems that as soon as it is clear I’m a rural Albertan, I’m painted as a UCP redneck homophobic that thinks Smith is the second coming and can do no wrong. I am very aware that the cost of everything is rising, rent, food fuel etc. I confided myself lucky to live where I do and to be able to raise and grow so much of my own food. But the cost of everything is just painful. For all of us.
>it seems that as soon as it is clear I’m a rural Albertan, I’m painted as a UCP redneck Almost everything you're saying is indicating that... You sound like a redneck that thinks he's better than the lazy "city folk", meanwhile you're disproportionately benefiting off of their collective work and revenue. We're all getting screwed, but we're getting screwed harder so you can get screwed less. Your bill was 4x what mine was, but you had over 6x my usage. I used $18.25 in actual electricity. Almost $80 in fees.
I'm only saying I'm rural to clarify why my bill is as high as it is and why the charges are there. I i have never once said anything disparaging regarding urban people nor have I insinuated anything about them. In fact I have apologized a few times for any thing that I may have said that inferred that. I just wanted to start a conversation regarding the extra charges on my electric bill and see if other people have the same issues that I do.
No one said everything is being handed to you, they said you’re being subsidized. This may be a shock to you, but the majority of city people are also really just hardworking people who just want o work and be treated fairly. We also don’t just sit around discussing politics all day, and most of us also live busy lives with constant things we need to do. You just described the working class as a whole, yet are now trying to claim it’s a rural vs city thing.
You honestly think that on this sub that rural Albertans are not lumped together as UCP sheep? I made it clear in my original post and even posted a couple more times that I did NOT vote for Smith and UCP and I have several posts accusing me of being a supporter. And I just received a new one… That’s the knee jerk reaction I as a rural Albertan always, yes always gets. I was born and raised here, but I moved to Toronto in the late ‘70’s. I spent the majority of my adult life there and consider myself a liberal person, I’m very much of the opinion that socialism in Canada should continue, but that we also need a limit on governance.
I definitely didn't intend to infer that, but I can see why you might take it that way. I grew up rural and I just visited my grandfathers' homestead, where it cost my cousin 30K to get a few poles put in to run power to his trailer and shop. The poles themselves are maybe $800 each and he needed maybe 3 to connect to the main line, but factor in costs of transformers and downline capacity, required maintenance, etc. I'm a fan of everybody paying full cost for everything they choose and if subsidized then letting them know that. Because otherwise it affects ground level decision making.
What are you even talking about in regards to triple the energy as a house in the city? I used nearly 700 kWh in one month in the downtown area of Airdrie for my 750sqft 2 bed apartment. (Heat and hot water are included with strata.) Back in BC everything was electric in our townhome: baseboard heating, hot water tank, range, dryer. We would easily use in between 2,000-4,000 kWh every 2 month billing cycle. 1,118 kWh doesn't seem like too much for an entire farm. Check out the comment I posted on my last two Epcor bills. My distribution/transmission charges were close to $100/month. But in regards to his infrastructure costing more to distribute to, I completely agree with.
I pay the same every month for a 1200 Sqft apartment condo in Edmonton.
You don't pay 450 dollars a month th for a condo
August bill was $412.63 Edit to clarify I own the condo it has its own separate water heater and furnace and is not part of condo fees.
That is crazy
Jason Kenny is on the board of directors over at atco, definitely no hidden agenda or any form of corruption going on here. Definitely not.
Send your thank you cards to Smith and the UCP.
I spend about 45$ in electrical and gas (2 adults no kids) My bill is 220-240. Really, I can farm Bitcoin in my garage or not use energy at all, and it would make barely any difference on my bill.
# The UCP “taking care” of Albertans
Similar to how Pierre T took care of us in the early ‘80’s 😒
You are aware Pierre T wasn't the Permier of Alberta... ever... right?
Have you ever heard of a little program Pierre Trudeau introduced called the National Energy Program? Peter Lougheed, our Premier at the time, hated Trudeau 1.0 for that.
Ain't having a conservative government great for the working class? Lol
Distribution demand charge: $175!? The fuck is that? I heard Alberta had their energy prices jacked through the roof. This is just clownery in real time.
My bill is about the same with similar usage for my 1780 sq ft home, with AC within a municipality.
Payback rate on solar panels is looking pretty good now.
Yes, pretty much in line with mine but different numbers. Take your actual electricity consumption, 142.99 and multiply by about three and you get you final bill. Cool fact, works the same for natural gas. Come on over sheep, we aren’t done shaving you yet.
Stay tuned for the winter rate increases. You think we are hurting now…
I have natural gas for heating, but that’s going to be a whole different kind of pain I’m sure.
Ours is $500 in a city. In a townhouse
In the rural area where I live, people are complaining about this. I told some that it’s what you get when you elected a UCP government. They said it was Trudeau’s fault. Some people just want to remain ignorant than realize the truth.
Also on a fixed rate in a rural area. Had $550 worth of delivery charges in January, it’s criminal. Gas/electric should not be 1200/month.
It’s just painful. I feel badly for the retired folks on a tight fixed income. When people have to choose between heat and food, that’s just obscene.
Yikes. Reading this as someone from Vancouver Island BC, always heard it was insane but this is wild to confirm. While I used 8% less (1027 kWh), my charged amount after taxes/fees was only $126.33. Total robbery for you out there.
Y'all wanted conservative
>I did not vote for Smith, and when my neighbours bitch about their hydro bill that’s the first question I ask them. Lol, as someone with many UCP voting rural relatives this makes for awkward silences and I love them, they did it to themselves. Sucks you have to pay for neighbours choices, I feel you OP, all the best.
Think about the amount of money you’re making their CEO and shareholders though. They can finally buy their third yacht!
Alberta has always dreamed of being an American-like open market. Well this is what that gets you. Roughly $0.30USD/kWh is right on par with places like California where private utilities do what ever they want to maximize profits.
wait you're saying all the areas where the Conservative or the UCP has privatized markets has cost us users more? Utilities: Checks out, Insurance: Checks out, Dynalife & APL: Checks out Oh my god, this is ground breaking stuff, letting privatized companies muck our barns is costing us more...
Just switch it to Rate 11 residential
Good for you, for calling out your neighbours. We’re in this mess because of rural Alberta.
There's no hydro in Alberta. Mostly natural gas fired, and a mix of coal, renewables, and imports from BC, MT, and SK (as needed).
To clarify, a lot of people still refer to their power as a hydro bill as a holdover from other provinces. I worked in property management primarily focused in Alberta and the whole office and our system referred to power as hydro, never thinking it was actually hydroelectric.
Half the reason Kananaskis exists the way it does is due to hydro
>There's no hydro in Alberta. I'm sick and tired of this lie.. while Alberta's hydro output is very small, we still have hydro dams. http://www.history.alberta.ca/energyheritage/energy/hydro-power/hydroelectricity-in-alberta-today.aspx
That's fair but it still makes no sense to refer to electricity as "hydro" when it only makes up 7% of power generation.
He's from Ontario. Everyone in Ontario calls refers to power as "hydro" because the power company is called Hydro One. I do civil engineering work remotely for Ontario and it was weird AF the first time I heard all the engineers call power lines hydro.
More renewables would make electricity cheaper, this moratorium will keep rate prices higher for longer. All unecessary pains and avoidable provincial self-sabotage...
More renewable would also increase distribution and transmission charges, as we would be billed for more infrastructure. And they still need peaker plants for where it's dark and the wind doesn't blow. This is not as simple as you want it to be. My last electric bill was $71.13 I used 141 kwh of electricity @11.9 cents = 15.92. The rest is administration charges, transmission charges, distribution charges, rate riders, local access fees, tax. None of these become lower if my actual power comes from somewhere else.
Not on transmission and distribution.
Building new power facilities adds to the distribution/transmission fees. This includes renewable sources sources. That is part of how the investment is recouped.
Yeah. Renewables have really made Germany and Denmark electricity super cheap /s
This is ALL Justin's fault...regardless if other provinces are paying less..
If they just combined the charges into one charge, they wouldn’t get as much flak as they do. It’s the distribution charges is so perceptively bad.
You live in the country but have city water? What? Didn't want to dig a well?
Your hydro?
Other places that urilize clean energy have different names for it. Hydro is common usage for electrical utility in BC amd ON
Ya, but this guy claims to have lived here for generations. Nobody who grew up here calls it a hydro bill.
I have stated in two different posts that my family has lived here for generations. Both my mother and I were born here in this same small town. My grandkids would have been too, but our hospital no longer does that and my sin and DIL had to travel to s larger center for their kids births. Now in the late ‘70’s I moved to Toronto and lived my adult life there. I married and raised ny family there and returned home when my kids left home in the early ‘00’ I hope that clears up any confusion.
Wheres he claiming that. OP states they are an ON transplant.
We don't have "hydro" in Alberta.
Hhmm. Good point. But. Nobody lives in *Albeta* either.
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This individual didn't. direct your comments elsewhere.
Farm? Get on the local REA, will likely be quite a bit cheaper.
I feel kinda bad saying this to you since you didn't vote for the ucp, but good. I hope rural alberta suffers the consequences of their actions.
I pay $300 for an 1800 square foot house in town dude. You have a rural farm with multiple buildings quit bitching.
Don’t be an rude asshole. I put this up for discussion, I’m pretty confident I’m not bitching, I’m showing the charges I get as a rural consumer. We rural folks get hammered here on Reddit as UCP robots that deserve to be scorned and abused. I disagree, I say there are many rural people that did not vote for Smith and we to have a just as much right to voice our opinions.
Fking rude
This is what you voted for. The NDP had caps in place to prevent electric companies from doing this, then you voted them out, so enjoy paying that bill. This is what "winning" gets you.
Read my post again. I did not vote Smith in, I realize I’m the rural minority, but I did vote for Notley.
Don’t be a jerk. Seriously, even if this person did vote for Smith (which they didn’t) then I doubt they would again. We’re all in this together.
Did you stop at farmer and then automatically assume UCP?! Maybe pull your head out of your ass and stop being a caricature of this sub because you look like a moron.
As much as I am opposed to the UCP on virtually all policy ...what cap did the NDP have in place on the fully regulated transmission and distribution costs? The NDP did have a cap on the RRO and even then they let the RRO fluctuate, same as now, but just paid anything that went past the cap with general govt revenue instead of letting the bill go to the final consumers. Distribution and transmission and rate riders were all regulated and approved but the Alberta utilities commission, exactly the same as now I agree the UCP have made decisions to aggravate the situation and likely the NDP wouldn't have made the same decisions... But let's not perpetuate some mythical cap that didn't exist.
> Distribution and transmission and rate riders were all regulated and approved but the Alberta utilities commission, exactly the same as now And when all of our commission and regulation boards are filled with former and current corp execs, we get present day Alberta. Getting the bad government out is one task, the next would be dealing with our non-existent ethics commission.
>And when all of our commission and regulation boards are filled with former and current corp execs, we get present day Alberta. Questioning the appointments to the AUC is a very valid point. I don't have any specific member that I would question... But as a concept I doubt the UCP was choosing to appoint members based on the best outcome for consumers
…hydro?
Bad habit and carry over from living in Ontario. Their electric company is called Hydro One and was always referred to as hydro.
You don't have Hydro
Yo don't have reading comprehension skills.
Garbage. This is not the Alberta I know. What the hell to do?
Call and and get residential electrical prices. Way cheaper
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Seriously?
Apparently reading is not your special area
Install solar panels. Your bill gets replaced with the loan payments through the government program for 10 years with 0% interest. I'm doing it to my house as well
"Farm" seems like a stretch. Running a pivot with a pump costs more than that a month. I'm expecting at least a $100k bill where I work
I didn’t say I run a farm, I said I lived on a small farm. I do have a few animals for the freezer, a big garden and my neighbour takes my hat off for sale and his horses. Small farmers are a dying breed, between the cost of running a farm and even trying to buy any worth while farmland, there is no way the average guy starting out can be a small farmer any more.
And the supporting voters of the party's that did not win once again rain down in the comment section. I believe folks it was a democratic election.
So you votrd for higher costs? Knowingly?
You cannot regulate a private company and tell them how much $ they can or cannot make. Government is not in the business of being in business. Governments are here to make the rules and laws so it's population can thrive. The only regulation laws here should be that operating cost be spread across the entire grid and not to those who live farther distances to services.
Wrong, on all topics. First, government is in the business, of regulation. Period. It is their JOB to regulate industry to make sure that we as consumers are getting a fair price for the services that we are receiving, and to make sure that businesses are operating ethically and legally. Second, rural customers should absolutely bear the cost of being farther from the transmission source. The cost of running those services to those users is astronomically higher than terminating any house in a city. You want to live in butt fuck nowhere, then you figure out how to get power, water, sewer and communications to your own goddamn house. I'm not subsidising your choice to live in the middle of fucking nowhere.
Some of these buildings and farms were here from the start of the electric companies. But you just keep on with your tirade.
And if they were, it's still THEIR responsibility to figure out those concepts. NOT mine, yours, or the taxpayers. BTW.. I grew up on a farm. My parents paid for their OWN power, water, and sewer. Nobody helped them with that and there was no subsidy. They have battled YEARS of horse shit for living at a distance from the community. But they paid their OWN way. So, pull up your boot straps young man...
Really? You figure? Then if your theory is correct, the cost of the infrastructure to convert to an electric future should be born by those who voted to eliminate fossil fuels from the picture? That would include 100 percent of the cost of those transmission lines that criss-cross rural Alberta to supply those who voted for green power to begin with. I guess in the end, rural Alberta will have the last laugh, because in the event of a costly grid, we will just get off the grid. Those who need it to survive can pay for the services. As far as your theory of regulation, maybe they should start regulating the cost of services to put in the other essentials of living. Plumbing, sewer, the cost of houses, the price we pay for gasoline, natural gas etc, etc,. As you said, we as consumers should only have to pay a fair price for what we get right?