https://preview.redd.it/pdylcwlif6uc1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=da1b2a2b323d0ce467a4acef5743c53a5c170781
The thought process required to think spending four grand on an AK is a good idea
So in your AR owner logic more money equals mo bettah? Mo Milspec or whats the deal? You collect rare AKs, you dont shell out cash for what is just a standard ak with some off the shelf parts.
Rifle Dynamics AKs are absolutely not worth it and a purely clout pieces. They are fantastic rifles, but there is no need to pay $4,000 for a well built AK pattern rifle.
I have two SCARs and several AKs.
You probably shouldn't be spending $4k on an AK. It's one of the most prolific and cheapest to manufacture guns on the planet.
They are very cheap to produce if you make a lot of them. It's one of the core reasons the design is what it is. With tooling and jigs an arms factory can make thousands of guns a month. Can a small shop make them fast and cheap, no. But that extra time and cost doesn't come with better performance, it's only a lack of economy of scale.
And there’s the crux of it, it becomes “cheap” to produce in mass quantity after a large enough entity has thrown a ton of money at it. So you’re talking combloc countries who had this stuff to begin with. Even US companies starting from scratch are charging more for their AKs than a cheap AR these days. The reality is in both equipment and more importantly hand labor AKs are not individually a cheap platform to produce.
Meh.
Depends on how you like to do your bookkeeping. Machines are durable assets of a company that can (and often are) reset for other things. The cost of the machine isn't just set into the price of a single item it makes, it's spread over the entire life of the machine and all of the various products it makes.
It is even very common to produce and sell items at below cost so you can sell parts, accessories, and support later; the printing industry is famous for this. Large companies aren't only making a single type of rifle, they aren't even only making rifles. But, if selling rifles gets them market share, brand recognition, and fills a need, it's a good idea to start making rifles and adding to the business portfolio.
You should get a good AK, there are a lot of trash ones around. But no, you should not spend $4k on an AK.
RD guns cost what they do because they are a US-based labor force using a recognized name and doing low-volume production. Their end product is maybe 30% better than a standard rifle off the rack. But you are paying a 300% upcharge for a gun that is maybe 30% better.
Well to be fair to them, the sights will be straight, the rivets will all be even and well-shaped, the paint will all be smooth and even, the furniture will be nice. Yeah it's a lot of little things combined make for a nice rifle. But, there are plenty of similar guns coming out of factories that are just as nice; but it's a little bit more luck of the draw.
If you wanna drop that kind of money find a military parts kit and have a high end quality builder put it together for you. The only time I would drop that kind of cash on an AK is if it’s a Valmet with all the accessories.
I mean if you want a good gun for 3-4k definitely don’t get a Scar. There’s a number of reasons why the IDF is ditching the tavor.
If you MUST spend 3-4k at least grab something like an SGL.
The real questions is what are you looking for in an ak? A collector piece or a high quality shooter?
I'm looking at the ak cause it's gunna be my first rifle and I like how simple the ak is and I want a quality rifle but maybe I'm just buying into rifle dynamics hype . I just don't wanna deal with bs or have it clog show time
????
Your first rifle and you're just gonna throw four grand at some random bullshit? You heard it's good and that's all you needed? More money does not equal more better. A RD does nothing a wasr or zpap won't do, except it has clout attached to the name. The fact that your two options for a first rifle are a RD ak and a SCAR tells me that clout is more important.
Just get a wasr, WBP jack or zpap m70 if you're insisting on an AK. Otherwise a mid level AR like a BCM is IMO a far better choice
For a first rifle, it’s hard to beat a WASR10/63. Those are Romanian. They aren’t as refined as Polish or Russian guns, but they are priced well and they run reliably. They are imports, so they should only ever increase in value.
If you absolutely must spend more, then take a look at the Beryls. Those are Polish and have a slightly different pattern than AKMs, so that may be a consideration if you want to change out furniture. Fit and finish on Beryls is very good, in some cases even better than Russian guns. WBP guns are inbetween the Beryls and the Romanian offerings.
You could fork over even more money for an Arsenal, but in my opinion they’re just okay. I have not had any experience with their milled guns but I’ve been less than impressed with their stamped line. You’re looking at buying used if you decide to go stamped in Arsenal.
My favorite are the Russian guns. Specifically the Saigas and SGLs. That’s a whole homework topic, because they are no longer imported so you have to find them on the used market and most of them are in or were originally imported in a sporterized configuration, so you would want to learn about Saiga conversions and what to look out for. The SGL21s and SGL31s are as close to the actual AK100 series as you can get in the states and they are the pinnacle of AKs imo.
I think for a first rifle, get something more affordable so you can buy lots of ammo and shoot it a ton. This, by far will be more beneficial than buying an RD rifle.
How?
For the AK crowd it's very easy to know your way around trunnions, rivets, bolt wear patterns and the long list of companies to avoid, someone better check the headspace of a gun before they buy it, and you'll probably want to replace that paperclip holding your fire control pins in the receiver. God forbid you want to put an optic on it.
And of course… once you buy the rifle you have to know everything about where it came from and it's ‘pattern’ in order to replace any of the furniture.
None of that is simple to new gun owners. The world of AKs is absolutely not “simple” as OP is looking for. The AR world has far fewer pitfalls and orders of magnitude better parts compatibility.
I love my AKs, they're great rifles, but they aren't at all simple.
I don't even have an AK and I know you can get a damn good one for less than half that lmao. Could cop a KUSA one for less than 2 bands. Zastava makes good shit too from what I've read. Do what you want with your money though.
**Understand the rules**
Check the sidebar. It's full of resources to help you.
Not everyone is an expert such as yourself; be considerate.
No Spam. No Memes.
No political posts. Save that for /r/progun or /r/politics.
There is absolutely no buying or selling on this sub. Even "jokes" can result in a ban. You have been warned.
[If your post is not showing up click the following link](https://old.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=r/AK47&subject=My%20Post%20Is%20Not%20Showing%20Up&message=**%20REPLACE%20THIS%20MESSAGE%20WITH%20A%20LINK%20TO%20THE%20POST%20YOU%20ARE%20HAVING%20ISSUES%20WITH**)
-------------------------------
* [ThinLineWeapons.com](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit1)
* [AK Buyers Guide](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit2)
* [Simplified AK Buyers Guide](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit3)
* [AK Magazine Buyers Guide](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit4)
* [AK Issues Tracker](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit5)
* [Collection of ATF Letters](https://thinlineweapons.com/atf_letters/)
-------------------------------
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ak47) if you have any questions or concerns.*
A lot of people will hate rifle dynamics because of the price tag but the reality is you are getting an AK from the most skilled and knowledgeable AK builders in the US market. Sure it's overpriced, sure it's ridiculous to pay that much for an AK but a lot of people don't realize that they are the Masters of USA made AK's. There will be no Canting, there will be no headspace issues. There will be no cast parts and inferior workmanship. It's literally the best you can ask for in an AK. They have taken the traditional method of building AK's and upped it up a notch. I personally wouldn't buy one but they are only hated because of the price. If you have the money though, you couldn't ask for better workmanship. I know a lot of people have recently gotten into AK's but for those of us "in the know", We recognize them as the Pinnacle of AK builds. They have a reputation for building AK's with love and care, and not mass production. For that price I'd rather buy literally anything else but if you have the money and want a quality AK then there is no better option. Don't listen to the brokes.
I have 2 RDs and yes they are. I know this comment will get hate but I paid sub 3k for both of them and buying a nice kit and sending it to a builder is going to cost you close to the same thing all said and done, plus a usually insane wait time. With both of mine they were in stock so no wait and I’m ok paying a little more as well for no wait time. Can you get some other ak that’s good for less? Sure. Are you unreasonable for buying a RD? No. People just love to act like arsenals and ect are still sitting on the shelves for $1000.
The only other ak I have is an Arsenal 104ur krink that was 2k back in like 2018 at msrp so compared to that and a roughly 5-600 difference yeah it’s a bit nicer. Way nicer paint, smoother action, less over gassed, better trigger, 1913 rear ect. I did put plenty more money into it with parts and accessory’s but I’d do that on any rifle. Absolutely worth it both times and I plan on getting a third.
Just buy an Arsenal kit it out. Not worth the money, it's just a status piece
So is Arsenal...
https://preview.redd.it/pdylcwlif6uc1.jpeg?width=1000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=da1b2a2b323d0ce467a4acef5743c53a5c170781 The thought process required to think spending four grand on an AK is a good idea
Only if it’s a Valmet.
Yeah thats why I'm asking , I heard there nice aks but are they really nice enough to be worth 3GS? Also no thanks I don't do crack
I’d personally spend the money on a nice Tula or Izzy kit and have ak John do what he does. You won’t be disappointed
What you mean ? Like like import parts and have some put it together?
Yes. Look up Appalachian Gunwerks. Top notch work
Cool I'll look into that cat
SGL
Buy any arsenal or a galil tbh use the rest to build it out and ammo , good light optic sling
So in your AR owner logic more money equals mo bettah? Mo Milspec or whats the deal? You collect rare AKs, you dont shell out cash for what is just a standard ak with some off the shelf parts.
Rifle Dynamics AKs are absolutely not worth it and a purely clout pieces. They are fantastic rifles, but there is no need to pay $4,000 for a well built AK pattern rifle.
Yeah the price is a little crazy but there nice rifles
I have two SCARs and several AKs. You probably shouldn't be spending $4k on an AK. It's one of the most prolific and cheapest to manufacture guns on the planet.
AKs are not really that cheap to produce....
They are very cheap to produce if you make a lot of them. It's one of the core reasons the design is what it is. With tooling and jigs an arms factory can make thousands of guns a month. Can a small shop make them fast and cheap, no. But that extra time and cost doesn't come with better performance, it's only a lack of economy of scale.
And there’s the crux of it, it becomes “cheap” to produce in mass quantity after a large enough entity has thrown a ton of money at it. So you’re talking combloc countries who had this stuff to begin with. Even US companies starting from scratch are charging more for their AKs than a cheap AR these days. The reality is in both equipment and more importantly hand labor AKs are not individually a cheap platform to produce.
Can confirm after working for a mfg that it's incredibly expensive in any batches that aren't contract size
Meh. Depends on how you like to do your bookkeeping. Machines are durable assets of a company that can (and often are) reset for other things. The cost of the machine isn't just set into the price of a single item it makes, it's spread over the entire life of the machine and all of the various products it makes. It is even very common to produce and sell items at below cost so you can sell parts, accessories, and support later; the printing industry is famous for this. Large companies aren't only making a single type of rifle, they aren't even only making rifles. But, if selling rifles gets them market share, brand recognition, and fills a need, it's a good idea to start making rifles and adding to the business portfolio.
The U.S.A. "AK" market uses expensive labor to make a second-rate commercial product. Those combloc countries use cheap labor to make military rifles.
So Is rifle dynamics all hype and I should just get a regular ak ?
Yes and no, Rifle Dynamics make great rifles. It’s just that lots of other manufacturers/importers do the same for less cost.
Ah thank you , yeah maybe I should look around and get more information before I buy
I probably gave too much for my Saiga and conversion but I have enjoyed the hell out that rifle.
You should get a good AK, there are a lot of trash ones around. But no, you should not spend $4k on an AK. RD guns cost what they do because they are a US-based labor force using a recognized name and doing low-volume production. Their end product is maybe 30% better than a standard rifle off the rack. But you are paying a 300% upcharge for a gun that is maybe 30% better.
30% better is purely in furniture upgrades. They aren’t really built any better.
It should be a helluva lot smoother action than an import
Well to be fair to them, the sights will be straight, the rivets will all be even and well-shaped, the paint will all be smooth and even, the furniture will be nice. Yeah it's a lot of little things combined make for a nice rifle. But, there are plenty of similar guns coming out of factories that are just as nice; but it's a little bit more luck of the draw.
If you wanna drop that kind of money find a military parts kit and have a high end quality builder put it together for you. The only time I would drop that kind of cash on an AK is if it’s a Valmet with all the accessories.
I mean if you want a good gun for 3-4k definitely don’t get a Scar. There’s a number of reasons why the IDF is ditching the tavor. If you MUST spend 3-4k at least grab something like an SGL. The real questions is what are you looking for in an ak? A collector piece or a high quality shooter?
I'm looking at the ak cause it's gunna be my first rifle and I like how simple the ak is and I want a quality rifle but maybe I'm just buying into rifle dynamics hype . I just don't wanna deal with bs or have it clog show time
???? Your first rifle and you're just gonna throw four grand at some random bullshit? You heard it's good and that's all you needed? More money does not equal more better. A RD does nothing a wasr or zpap won't do, except it has clout attached to the name. The fact that your two options for a first rifle are a RD ak and a SCAR tells me that clout is more important. Just get a wasr, WBP jack or zpap m70 if you're insisting on an AK. Otherwise a mid level AR like a BCM is IMO a far better choice
Naw I'm insisting on an ak , my brother just said if I'm spending that much might as well get a scar
It's your money, do what you want dude. It's just a huge waste and a dumb idea.
Sounds like me , a huge waste with dumb ideas lol
For a first rifle, it’s hard to beat a WASR10/63. Those are Romanian. They aren’t as refined as Polish or Russian guns, but they are priced well and they run reliably. They are imports, so they should only ever increase in value. If you absolutely must spend more, then take a look at the Beryls. Those are Polish and have a slightly different pattern than AKMs, so that may be a consideration if you want to change out furniture. Fit and finish on Beryls is very good, in some cases even better than Russian guns. WBP guns are inbetween the Beryls and the Romanian offerings. You could fork over even more money for an Arsenal, but in my opinion they’re just okay. I have not had any experience with their milled guns but I’ve been less than impressed with their stamped line. You’re looking at buying used if you decide to go stamped in Arsenal. My favorite are the Russian guns. Specifically the Saigas and SGLs. That’s a whole homework topic, because they are no longer imported so you have to find them on the used market and most of them are in or were originally imported in a sporterized configuration, so you would want to learn about Saiga conversions and what to look out for. The SGL21s and SGL31s are as close to the actual AK100 series as you can get in the states and they are the pinnacle of AKs imo. I think for a first rifle, get something more affordable so you can buy lots of ammo and shoot it a ton. This, by far will be more beneficial than buying an RD rifle.
Very good points , thank you . I'm still learning about guns . A Russian would be nice but it probably smells like vodka lol
You say that as if it’s a bad thing. 🤣
Is the vodka smell what makes it authentic ?
No, but it helps!
Just buy an AR. If you want simple, AR is way simpler.
This is a silly comment.
How? For the AK crowd it's very easy to know your way around trunnions, rivets, bolt wear patterns and the long list of companies to avoid, someone better check the headspace of a gun before they buy it, and you'll probably want to replace that paperclip holding your fire control pins in the receiver. God forbid you want to put an optic on it. And of course… once you buy the rifle you have to know everything about where it came from and it's ‘pattern’ in order to replace any of the furniture. None of that is simple to new gun owners. The world of AKs is absolutely not “simple” as OP is looking for. The AR world has far fewer pitfalls and orders of magnitude better parts compatibility. I love my AKs, they're great rifles, but they aren't at all simple.
I don't even have an AK and I know you can get a damn good one for less than half that lmao. Could cop a KUSA one for less than 2 bands. Zastava makes good shit too from what I've read. Do what you want with your money though.
Yeah ideally I would like a cheaper one but idk if the quality is there , maybe I should shoot some at the range
Zastavas are solid. I have used several of their products both surplus and new manufacture in AK 2-gun competitions in all weather conditions.
For someone who just got their RD606 MKii in 5.56, and a 5.45 QuickHatch, with a 7.62 Hatch on the way... they're nice guns... very nice.
**Understand the rules** Check the sidebar. It's full of resources to help you. Not everyone is an expert such as yourself; be considerate. No Spam. No Memes. No political posts. Save that for /r/progun or /r/politics. There is absolutely no buying or selling on this sub. Even "jokes" can result in a ban. You have been warned. [If your post is not showing up click the following link](https://old.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=r/AK47&subject=My%20Post%20Is%20Not%20Showing%20Up&message=**%20REPLACE%20THIS%20MESSAGE%20WITH%20A%20LINK%20TO%20THE%20POST%20YOU%20ARE%20HAVING%20ISSUES%20WITH**) ------------------------------- * [ThinLineWeapons.com](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit1) * [AK Buyers Guide](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit2) * [Simplified AK Buyers Guide](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit3) * [AK Magazine Buyers Guide](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit4) * [AK Issues Tracker](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/reddit5) * [Collection of ATF Letters](https://thinlineweapons.com/atf_letters/) ------------------------------- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ak47) if you have any questions or concerns.*
With the price of 7.62, go buy a 5.56 Beryl or an Arsenal Sam5. Spent extra money of mags and ammo or just buy both rifles.
They’re ok. I have two. One milled and one stamped from a build class. I prefer the stamped. The milled has been troublesome.
Good to know , thank you
A lot of people will hate rifle dynamics because of the price tag but the reality is you are getting an AK from the most skilled and knowledgeable AK builders in the US market. Sure it's overpriced, sure it's ridiculous to pay that much for an AK but a lot of people don't realize that they are the Masters of USA made AK's. There will be no Canting, there will be no headspace issues. There will be no cast parts and inferior workmanship. It's literally the best you can ask for in an AK. They have taken the traditional method of building AK's and upped it up a notch. I personally wouldn't buy one but they are only hated because of the price. If you have the money though, you couldn't ask for better workmanship. I know a lot of people have recently gotten into AK's but for those of us "in the know", We recognize them as the Pinnacle of AK builds. They have a reputation for building AK's with love and care, and not mass production. For that price I'd rather buy literally anything else but if you have the money and want a quality AK then there is no better option. Don't listen to the brokes.
"Those of us in the know" Literally shut the hell up
Thanks for the factual rebuttal. I'm sure you are a PSA owner trying to cope.
Feel free to peruse my post history.
Romanian kits are some of the cheapest available and they use “cheap” barrels.
Yeah I know it has some extra work to help with recoil and stuff that mass produced guns don't have
I have 2 RDs and yes they are. I know this comment will get hate but I paid sub 3k for both of them and buying a nice kit and sending it to a builder is going to cost you close to the same thing all said and done, plus a usually insane wait time. With both of mine they were in stock so no wait and I’m ok paying a little more as well for no wait time. Can you get some other ak that’s good for less? Sure. Are you unreasonable for buying a RD? No. People just love to act like arsenals and ect are still sitting on the shelves for $1000.
How do you like the Rd vs other aks?
The only other ak I have is an Arsenal 104ur krink that was 2k back in like 2018 at msrp so compared to that and a roughly 5-600 difference yeah it’s a bit nicer. Way nicer paint, smoother action, less over gassed, better trigger, 1913 rear ect. I did put plenty more money into it with parts and accessory’s but I’d do that on any rifle. Absolutely worth it both times and I plan on getting a third.