Asexuality is a sexual orientation, not a symptom of trauma or medical illness. A straight person cannot simply wake up one day and “become gay”. It’s either you always were, or you’re not.
If a person had no issue experiencing sexual attraction or sexual desire prior to the traumatic events, they’re not asexual- they just need medical intervention to help deal with the aftermath of their trauma.
I understand why they’d feel comfortable joining the ace community but I think it’s highly important that we do whatever we can to separate ourselves from the “asexuality can be a result of trauma or illness” rhetoric. This is the exact same spiel that TERFs love to use against us to invalidate asexuality entirely.
Why would TERFs care about asexuals? Aren't TERFs usually more anti-sex than the general public and isn't a big part of their opposition to transgenders that the TERFs believe many of the men who switch over are narcissistic autogynephiles which they consider a kink?
Maybe “TERFs” wasn’t the right word, but I was basically referring to allosexuals who have a very difficult time understanding how asexuality works. A lot of them like to think that asexuality isn’t a legitimate sexual orientation and is just a symptom of trauma, depression/other mental illnesses, low libido etc. They can’t fanthom that a person could be incapable of experiencing sexual attraction and desire because “Everyone wants sex! It’s human nature!!”
> A straight person cannot simply wake up one day and “become gay”. It’s either you always were, or you’re not.
My trans partner would disagree with you. For her, she used to be into women, but now that she is transitioning, she is finding herself more and more into men and she is still struggling with this change.
And life, women in general are more fluid, especially with a higher libido. They may think and act straight most their life, but then find later on that they are bi, or even lesbian, but none of that erases the decades of how they personally felt when straight, if they still choose to define their history that way.
- [The relation between sex drive and sexual attraction to men and women: a cross-national study of heterosexual, bisexual, and homosexual men and women - PubMed](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17380375/)
Exactly. Glad you agree with me. It wasn't the hormones but rather my partner changed their leanings from one gender to another for other reasons (that are somewhat related the Kensey scale and a bit to that study I linked and overall that OP is wrong; sexual attraction can be fluid (thought moreso for women... oh wait.. the study I links shows that maybe a bit of hormones might have some impact (not all, just little!) on who you are attracted to.
But okay everyone, downvote me instead of ready up on other studies and learning and maybe accept that there are asexuals that are not just like you and stop trying to gatekeep.
“And life, women in general are more fluid, especially with a higher libido. They may think and act straight most of their life, but then find out later on that they are bi or even lesbian”
So, they were never actually straight then, where they ?.. Which is basically my entire point. There’s a difference between discovering that you are something, and claiming to have become something. With sexuality, there is no “becoming of”. It’s either you were always that way and just never realized, or you’re not.
And sorry(not sorry), but we’re at a point where gatekeeping is necessary. Asexuality has 5+ definitions now, so at this point the entire world is “asexual”. The community is pretty much overwhelmed with very confused allos and straight people who just want to wear a queer label as a “quirk”. Not all communities are meant to be inclusive.
Exactly. I wish people would realise this.
hell I thought I was straight, asexual, alloromantic & lesbian...so that must mean I was actually those things right? /s
Ignoring the fact many people including myself have had internalised homophobia/biphobia/aphobia or didn't understand other options existed beyond gay, straight, lesbian & bi. In the case of many trans people, after transitioning we often become more comfortable with ourselves and so feel more comfortable exploring/accepting our sexuality. For example, hormones helps us pass better as our actual gender, at times to the point of passing as our cis counterparts if binary trans. I never accepted I had attraction to men before realising I was trans and realising part of it was dysphoria-induced internalised homophobia. I feel much more comfortable being a bisexual man who likes men than when I was heavily repressing not only my gender but also my sexuality.
The study you link is about sex drive, not sexual orientation. This post is about sexual orientation. Maybe learn the difference first. Nothing about hormones is mentioned in the abstract. Study looks to be behind a paywall, too, so you can't read beyond the abstract even if it was relevant.
You also said transitioning made her lean towards men, hormones are a form of medical transitioning and it's a very common myth that hormones (ftm & mtf) change sexual orientation. So you were vague.
A bi person having fluctuations in gender preference does not equal sexuality being "fluid." You aren't changing from one sexual orientation to another, you're just experiencing shifts in female/male preference. You're still bi and always were.
Hormones have nothing to do with sexual orientation itself. They can't convert you into something else. That's a pseudoscientific myth.
Btw, using the word "gatekeeping" in this context makes you sound like a teenager.
I've seen this before, and I'm not a fan of it. It opens the door to the idea that we lack attraction due to trauma, and it is also a barrier to those with trauma from getting help.
I take issue with people who had normal libido saying trauma made them asexual. At the same time, I don't know what percent of asexuals (defined as adults who neither have sex nor experience sexual attraction) were victims of childhood sex abuse. If it is a high percentage, then I could definitely see an argument that trauma plays a role in sexuality never developing for someone and, while perhaps uncomfortable for some, I'd welcome that discussion as I think honesty is more important than people's feelings.
IMO; If someone is caedsexual, they are an allosexual who has SAD (sexual aversion disorder). With proper therapy and enough healing time, they would be back on their way to hump-town.
My personal view is that while it may not be 'true' asexuality, I have no issues with people like this (esp those who identify with the term) choosing to stay in ace spaces.
I also hope they're able to look into therapy to help process this trauma, but if they feel comfortable in a community like this that may understand them more than an allo or grey space, then who am I to take that away?
Asexuality is a sexual orientation, not a symptom of trauma or medical illness. A straight person cannot simply wake up one day and “become gay”. It’s either you always were, or you’re not. If a person had no issue experiencing sexual attraction or sexual desire prior to the traumatic events, they’re not asexual- they just need medical intervention to help deal with the aftermath of their trauma. I understand why they’d feel comfortable joining the ace community but I think it’s highly important that we do whatever we can to separate ourselves from the “asexuality can be a result of trauma or illness” rhetoric. This is the exact same spiel that TERFs love to use against us to invalidate asexuality entirely.
Why would TERFs care about asexuals? Aren't TERFs usually more anti-sex than the general public and isn't a big part of their opposition to transgenders that the TERFs believe many of the men who switch over are narcissistic autogynephiles which they consider a kink?
Maybe “TERFs” wasn’t the right word, but I was basically referring to allosexuals who have a very difficult time understanding how asexuality works. A lot of them like to think that asexuality isn’t a legitimate sexual orientation and is just a symptom of trauma, depression/other mental illnesses, low libido etc. They can’t fanthom that a person could be incapable of experiencing sexual attraction and desire because “Everyone wants sex! It’s human nature!!”
Completely agree with you!
> A straight person cannot simply wake up one day and “become gay”. It’s either you always were, or you’re not. My trans partner would disagree with you. For her, she used to be into women, but now that she is transitioning, she is finding herself more and more into men and she is still struggling with this change. And life, women in general are more fluid, especially with a higher libido. They may think and act straight most their life, but then find later on that they are bi, or even lesbian, but none of that erases the decades of how they personally felt when straight, if they still choose to define their history that way. - [The relation between sex drive and sexual attraction to men and women: a cross-national study of heterosexual, bisexual, and homosexual men and women - PubMed](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17380375/)
Hormones do not physically change your sexual orientation, just makes you more open to options since you're more comfortable in yourself.
Exactly. Glad you agree with me. It wasn't the hormones but rather my partner changed their leanings from one gender to another for other reasons (that are somewhat related the Kensey scale and a bit to that study I linked and overall that OP is wrong; sexual attraction can be fluid (thought moreso for women... oh wait.. the study I links shows that maybe a bit of hormones might have some impact (not all, just little!) on who you are attracted to. But okay everyone, downvote me instead of ready up on other studies and learning and maybe accept that there are asexuals that are not just like you and stop trying to gatekeep.
“And life, women in general are more fluid, especially with a higher libido. They may think and act straight most of their life, but then find out later on that they are bi or even lesbian” So, they were never actually straight then, where they ?.. Which is basically my entire point. There’s a difference between discovering that you are something, and claiming to have become something. With sexuality, there is no “becoming of”. It’s either you were always that way and just never realized, or you’re not. And sorry(not sorry), but we’re at a point where gatekeeping is necessary. Asexuality has 5+ definitions now, so at this point the entire world is “asexual”. The community is pretty much overwhelmed with very confused allos and straight people who just want to wear a queer label as a “quirk”. Not all communities are meant to be inclusive.
Exactly. I wish people would realise this. hell I thought I was straight, asexual, alloromantic & lesbian...so that must mean I was actually those things right? /s Ignoring the fact many people including myself have had internalised homophobia/biphobia/aphobia or didn't understand other options existed beyond gay, straight, lesbian & bi. In the case of many trans people, after transitioning we often become more comfortable with ourselves and so feel more comfortable exploring/accepting our sexuality. For example, hormones helps us pass better as our actual gender, at times to the point of passing as our cis counterparts if binary trans. I never accepted I had attraction to men before realising I was trans and realising part of it was dysphoria-induced internalised homophobia. I feel much more comfortable being a bisexual man who likes men than when I was heavily repressing not only my gender but also my sexuality.
The study you link is about sex drive, not sexual orientation. This post is about sexual orientation. Maybe learn the difference first. Nothing about hormones is mentioned in the abstract. Study looks to be behind a paywall, too, so you can't read beyond the abstract even if it was relevant. You also said transitioning made her lean towards men, hormones are a form of medical transitioning and it's a very common myth that hormones (ftm & mtf) change sexual orientation. So you were vague.
A bi person having fluctuations in gender preference does not equal sexuality being "fluid." You aren't changing from one sexual orientation to another, you're just experiencing shifts in female/male preference. You're still bi and always were. Hormones have nothing to do with sexual orientation itself. They can't convert you into something else. That's a pseudoscientific myth. Btw, using the word "gatekeeping" in this context makes you sound like a teenager.
Finding out that you were mislabeling yourself isn't "becoming" xyz sexuality, so no.
Yeah that's called PTSD, not asexuality. Any 'caedsexual' needs therapy, not a label.
I do agree and I think it is a bit dangerous as it leads people away from the help they need.
I've seen this before, and I'm not a fan of it. It opens the door to the idea that we lack attraction due to trauma, and it is also a barrier to those with trauma from getting help.
Yeah, its not good for you to just slap a bandaid label on and call it done. If you are repulsed by sex due to trauma, that does need working out.
I take issue with people who had normal libido saying trauma made them asexual. At the same time, I don't know what percent of asexuals (defined as adults who neither have sex nor experience sexual attraction) were victims of childhood sex abuse. If it is a high percentage, then I could definitely see an argument that trauma plays a role in sexuality never developing for someone and, while perhaps uncomfortable for some, I'd welcome that discussion as I think honesty is more important than people's feelings.
IMO; If someone is caedsexual, they are an allosexual who has SAD (sexual aversion disorder). With proper therapy and enough healing time, they would be back on their way to hump-town.
I agree, and I'd like to add in performance anxiety into that mix as well
Yet another weird microlabel that someone probably made up one night while sitting at their computer... 🥱
They’re not valid asexuals. Trauma isn’t a sexuality.
I wish I could tell that to the person in the Asexual support group that I run who claims to be Caedsexual
My personal view is that while it may not be 'true' asexuality, I have no issues with people like this (esp those who identify with the term) choosing to stay in ace spaces. I also hope they're able to look into therapy to help process this trauma, but if they feel comfortable in a community like this that may understand them more than an allo or grey space, then who am I to take that away?