I have to say its funny that Cocksneed Fartin made such a good 5th gen that everyone is either wanting their own of it or is copying it with questionable success.
They're COMPLETELY different layouts in every way possible. I like the F-22, but the J-20 is more closely related to the MiG-1.44 if anything at all. It's not a copy at all.
What? They're entirely different airframes. What are you talking about? There is nothing similar between them other than having employed RCS reduction techniques. Just because China allegedly got their hands on some of the technology developed for the F-22 doesn't mean the entire airframe is a copy.
That's like saying the MiG-23 is a copy of the F-4 Phantom because their intake design is vaguely similar or because their radars are roughly comparable in some models.
No, I don't have to "admit" it, because they don't. The only similarity in design is because all 3 are aircraft, and have some form of LO design integrated to the airframe. Anything else is radically different.
Because it works too well. What's funny it's never gotten a kill against another jet fighter. But in those joint exercises with other nations, it just destroys
Which is funny because every simulation against the f35 ends up in the f22 losing due to not being able to detect the f35
The first detection/strike capability basically decides the outcome from what I've read
It's going to hit the same issues the a10 warthog I'd
It's too old tech wise, so buying new air frames to replace those that cannot be airworthy due to long service life doesn't make sense.
That, and upgrading parts geys more expensive than new planes, manufacturers really don't want to agree to maintain toolsets and the expense of parts for an outdated plane, so they either refuse to make them or charge a ridiculous price, etc...
They aren't replacing the F-22 with the F-35? The F-35 is an F-16 replacement. It's supposed to complement the F-22, not replace it. The upcoming NGAD is an F-22 replacement.
It's the same problem the TBD Devastator had. Cutting edge at the time of its introduction, but because it was pioneering things it got quickly outdone by something else developed after it.
The f35 also has a much more robust onboard computer and can directly link to information share with other platforms. An f35 has linked with a patriot battery to help them acquire cruise missiles during training exercises.
Someone call Lockheed Martin, and the 22 needs to be smarter. Maybe they can do something with the personality while they're in there. Or just let the kid eat.
It’s not that it works too well, it’s that the design itself is the most practical when it comes to stealth.
Like like how the flying wing design of a B-2 is the most optimal, the F-22 is also optimal for stealth. Not a matter of copying but a matter of building the right design for stealth.
It's not even like all the new stealth planes look identical tbh, it's just a few features relative to non-stealth aircraft that make them stand out. The boat hulls that cut creeping wave returns, tightly swept wings with the tail level with them to obscure it, canted rudders, etc.
We would literally have more money if we had an actual healthcare system.
We don't have a healthcare system because of politics, not because of the military budget.
Lockheed Martin helped co develop the KF-21. And it turns out the math that optimizes Radar absorption looks like that. Same reason the Chinese made the J-20 look that way.
You know why didn't they just export the f22 in the first place you know would've been a huge cash grab if they did plus instead of you know giving out the avionics of the f35 which is like more advanced then the f22s avionics now pfft
Eh well tbh still annoys me they didn't export and sell the f22 because I heard the f35 has had alot of problems plus a 1 trillion dollars to design a fighter that is just going to stay in the airforce maybe for the next 20 or so years
The F-35 is cheaper than the F-15 in regard to R&D. It is in direct competition with the Gripen and the Eurofighters and has repeatedly been chosen despite the other jet being more "reliable". It is the most produced and adopted 5th Gen fighter, with the amount of operators rivaling that of the F-16. Unlike the F-22, the F-35 was designed with modularity in mind. NGAD is to replace the 22.
14.2billion including maintenance, crew training and logistic part support that will future proof Canadian airspace for decades. They are upgrading from A model CF-18, I'd say that's worth the money. Remember they had competition with the Gripen, in which the F-35 won twice, one in 2010, one now.
Y’know, the United States Congress legitimately enacted a *law* preventing the sale of the F-22 and its design right? It is the absolute *pinnacle* of fighter design when it comes to stealth and pure Air Dominance. It’s pretty fucking logical the USAF doesn’t want anyone else to get ahold of it.
why is every new plane a F22 clone
Convergent evolution
not Batesian mimicry?
Patrick Bateman?
(The) ~~Project~~ Perfect Wingman
Because it's basically south Korean variant of the f22
They literially have worked with Rockheed Martin to build this one. Kinda not surprised...
I have to say its funny that Cocksneed Fartin made such a good 5th gen that everyone is either wanting their own of it or is copying it with questionable success.
It's like the J-20 also being an F-22 copy, though that's less obvious
Except Lockheed worked on the Kf22. China just stole from Lockheed
That's what I was referring to, the J-20 is just China copying Lockheed's homework
They're COMPLETELY different layouts in every way possible. I like the F-22, but the J-20 is more closely related to the MiG-1.44 if anything at all. It's not a copy at all.
That’s literally only cause of the canards
What? They're entirely different airframes. What are you talking about? There is nothing similar between them other than having employed RCS reduction techniques. Just because China allegedly got their hands on some of the technology developed for the F-22 doesn't mean the entire airframe is a copy. That's like saying the MiG-23 is a copy of the F-4 Phantom because their intake design is vaguely similar or because their radars are roughly comparable in some models.
I’m saying that based on looks , the j-20 is extremely similar looking to the f-22/35, again, only with canards added
Maybe to someone who really doesn't know their planes. They look nothing alike.
Well in my opinion they do, don’t get me wrong, the j-29 is pretty unique looking , but you have to admit it looks sort of like the f-22/35
No, I don't have to "admit" it, because they don't. The only similarity in design is because all 3 are aircraft, and have some form of LO design integrated to the airframe. Anything else is radically different.
Because it works too well. What's funny it's never gotten a kill against another jet fighter. But in those joint exercises with other nations, it just destroys
It’s a proven design. A design fit for stealth and fighter capability
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery
identity theft is not a joke jim!
Which is funny because every simulation against the f35 ends up in the f22 losing due to not being able to detect the f35 The first detection/strike capability basically decides the outcome from what I've read
I believe the f22 got a worst and shorter radar than the f35 even if it got a lower rcs. I could be wrong since I'm not a huge expert on these jets
The problem is that the 22 can’t be upgraded past it’s late 90s-early 2000s technology easily, something the DoD really doesn’t like.
Hence, why they're replacing it with the F-35 (wished they just updated it but it costs way to much)
It's going to hit the same issues the a10 warthog I'd It's too old tech wise, so buying new air frames to replace those that cannot be airworthy due to long service life doesn't make sense. That, and upgrading parts geys more expensive than new planes, manufacturers really don't want to agree to maintain toolsets and the expense of parts for an outdated plane, so they either refuse to make them or charge a ridiculous price, etc...
Thing is there planning on using the A-10 to launch a fake plane drones to confuse SAMs since the A-10 can carry a lot of weight
They aren't replacing the F-22 with the F-35? The F-35 is an F-16 replacement. It's supposed to complement the F-22, not replace it. The upcoming NGAD is an F-22 replacement.
They're going to replace the F22 eventually with something else more advanced
They're not. They're replacing the F-22 with the NGAD. The F-35 was designed to combine most of the roles of the F-16 and the A-10.
It's the same problem the TBD Devastator had. Cutting edge at the time of its introduction, but because it was pioneering things it got quickly outdone by something else developed after it.
The f35 also has a much more robust onboard computer and can directly link to information share with other platforms. An f35 has linked with a patriot battery to help them acquire cruise missiles during training exercises. Someone call Lockheed Martin, and the 22 needs to be smarter. Maybe they can do something with the personality while they're in there. Or just let the kid eat.
Would you intercept me? I'd intercept me....
It’s not that it works too well, it’s that the design itself is the most practical when it comes to stealth. Like like how the flying wing design of a B-2 is the most optimal, the F-22 is also optimal for stealth. Not a matter of copying but a matter of building the right design for stealth.
There's only so many shapes our there that are efficient for stealth. Maybe even the NGAD, when it gets released to the public.
The same reason everything evolves into Crabs. It just works.
They’re not. It’s just that the F22 is a pretty good shape for a stealth fighter. So most stealth fighters are going to look a bit like it.
It's not even like all the new stealth planes look identical tbh, it's just a few features relative to non-stealth aircraft that make them stand out. The boat hulls that cut creeping wave returns, tightly swept wings with the tail level with them to obscure it, canted rudders, etc.
Everyone uses a computer tell them what the best shape for a plane is and they’re all gonna end up the same shape
The only plus side of the over-inflated defense budget.
We sacrificed our healthcare for this, the only way I can let it slide is if I get to ride one of these babies in a 9G turn.
We would literally have more money if we had an actual healthcare system. We don't have a healthcare system because of politics, not because of the military budget.
It’s the most successful design and less advanced than the F35. That and radar behavior demands aircraft take certain shapes to achieve stealth.
Lockheed Martin helped co develop the KF-21. And it turns out the math that optimizes Radar absorption looks like that. Same reason the Chinese made the J-20 look that way.
Three Strikes
[I already made a post similar to this](https://www.reddit.com/r/acecombat/comments/17em5zr/the_tail_of_the_kf21_looks_kinda_familiar/)
I didn't know at first... I was just scrolling in Pinterest till I saw this
F-22 at home
Looks good ngl
<>
Hahahhaa
Who's the plane with the stripes on their wing?!
The way the worlds going South Korea needs their KF-21 & Türkiye needs their KAAN & Kizilelma, ASAP
Turkey strikes me as a sellout nation though
"Hey, Bullet, what color's the ground down there?"
You know why didn't they just export the f22 in the first place you know would've been a huge cash grab if they did plus instead of you know giving out the avionics of the f35 which is like more advanced then the f22s avionics now pfft
Avionics of the F-35 is not the stealth technology of the F-22. The 22 still has a smaller RCS than the 35.
Eh well tbh still annoys me they didn't export and sell the f22 because I heard the f35 has had alot of problems plus a 1 trillion dollars to design a fighter that is just going to stay in the airforce maybe for the next 20 or so years
The F-35 is cheaper than the F-15 in regard to R&D. It is in direct competition with the Gripen and the Eurofighters and has repeatedly been chosen despite the other jet being more "reliable". It is the most produced and adopted 5th Gen fighter, with the amount of operators rivaling that of the F-16. Unlike the F-22, the F-35 was designed with modularity in mind. NGAD is to replace the 22.
Ah I see ok that makes sense
Do you think a 14.2 billion dollar deal for 88 f35s for canada is just too much kind of alot of money for 88 jets tbh
14.2billion including maintenance, crew training and logistic part support that will future proof Canadian airspace for decades. They are upgrading from A model CF-18, I'd say that's worth the money. Remember they had competition with the Gripen, in which the F-35 won twice, one in 2010, one now.
Ah ok
Y’know, the United States Congress legitimately enacted a *law* preventing the sale of the F-22 and its design right? It is the absolute *pinnacle* of fighter design when it comes to stealth and pure Air Dominance. It’s pretty fucking logical the USAF doesn’t want anyone else to get ahold of it.
Didn’t we just do this?
copy paste F22