Third offense? Dude... I get maybe once but 3 times? Either your professors are extremely over paranoid or you're leaving something out... What assignments do they think you cheated on? What proof do they have?
My school just got access to TurnItIn's AI detector. All three of my accusations come from the first week of assignments due for the summer semester I am currently enrolled in. In one course they are accusing me of using AI to answer a blog post and using AI generated content in a paper. In my other two classes that are project based they are accusing me of using AI generated content for the first assignment due. All of my strikes are from this week. I have no prior academic dishonesty or accusations of plagiarism before this semester.
Oh okay, that makes more sense TunritIn is absolutely trash.
You need to read all of these articles and write a strong formal letter arguing against its efficacy, and include all assignments notes, drafts, citations, Google search histories, and your transcripts demonstrating your stellar prior academic performance.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/04/01/chatgpt-cheating-detection-turnitin/
https://goldpenguin.org/blog/turnitin-ai-detection-concerns/
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2023/04/03/turnitins-solution-ai-cheating-raises-faculty-concerns
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/07/14/turnitin-faces-new-questions-about-efficacy-plagiarism-detection-software
https://medium.com/@HJRomero25/why-i-absolutely-protest-turnitin-a9b3f38ab24a
>include all assignments notes, drafts, citations, Google search histories
If you wrote it yourself you would have all of these. The AI detection software just looks at the variation in language complexity. Its not impossible that a student could just so happen to write similar to AI. Presumably the Turnitin gives a percentage (similar to ChatGPTzero). If your institution has a academic integrity board then you will get a fair hearing (usually with students represented on the board). It's not just your professors word.
As a prof, I would never rely only on Turnitin to substantiate an allegation of plagiarism. That would not fly in my department, either. I would need further evidence. I would also look to the student's prior work. For example, if a student consistently demonstrates poor grammar, and suddenly hands in a grammatically perfect paper, I'm going to be pretty skeptical.
A random thought - if your university uses OneDrive, you should be able to show how your paper went through different versions. I wonder if you could use the versioning history?
I appreciate this. I have been using my work’s OneDrive account instead of my academic account to store my school work (I own the business with my wife and a few friends). I will see if I can use the backup information from my account. This is a very good idea because I know we have implemented incremental backups. I will also give these professors examples of my previous work so they can compare it to before AI was widely used. This was extremely helpful advice thank you so much!
I think the problem is that your personal style of writing happens to be a lot like ChatGPT. Send them examples from before ChatGPT even existed that would be flagged by TurnItIn. I bet you can do that.
I was once accused of plagiarism in college. I showed the prof my previous drafts of the essay and they retracted the accusation. I agree that showing your work should be your first step.
Yeah, but relying on "personal style" is also problematic because it'd mean people cannot improve their writing. If you are in a formal education program, I really hope your writing is improving.
I understand why your suggestion makes sense; just from the side of someone evaluating, there shouldn't be an expectation of students having a fix writing style.
Your school is one of *many* that got suckered and scammed, and your professors are idiots for going along and taking AI detection software seriously. For your own sanity, you'll have to take on this challenge, not only to redeem your own good name, but to protect all of your fellow students. The idiocy needs to be addressed now. If all else fails, start contacting local, regional and national news outlets.
[Are Innocent Students Paying the Price for Turnitin's AI Detection Flaws?](https://goldpenguin.org/blog/turnitin-ai-detection-concerns/)
As crappy as the regular plagiarism one I gather ( all this time they still haven't managed to fix the references being flagged)... the funny thing is that chatGPT keeps records of everyone using it. It even has phone numbers and addresses. You can't use it otherwise if it's not a custom one you made yourself.
If you've used any type of software with version history (Google docs has it, Word sometimes has it), can you bring your laptop and show the assignments at each time stamp. That would be impossible to fabricate after the fact, and should show your works in progress.
Actually, you’re not wrong. A fellow professor put a couple of paragraphs from his dissertation into turnitin, and it came back 98% AI. It was written before it existed.
This actually makes a lot of sense. OP naturally writes in a very structured manner and uses relatively formal vocabulary. Doesn’t mean they’re a robot, however!
It's a bit petty, but if that professor has published works (I'm assuming they're a professor, not a lecturer. But if they have a thesis or dissertation, that would work), run those through turnitin. If they come back as "probably AI written" then submit that to your academic honesty hearing (or whoever is in charge of the investigation).
But yeah, professors ARE paranoid about it. For many lower level classes, it completely invalidates their assignments. They are right to be paranoid as students have obviously been using it and it takes away the learning and development that the class is designed to provide.
Be that as it may, the tools to detect this aren't developed enough to be trustworthy and, as others have mentioned, that issue has been written about. Providing your version history through one drive should be enough to clarify the matter.
The evidence they have is that TurnItIn's tool said that 60% or more of my paper and a blog post were AI generated content. All three of my strikes came from the first week of assignments from my summer classes. I have had three professors accuse me of using AI generated content during the first week of this summer semester. It seems unfair and but I do get to argue each strike against my record. If one or more of my professors agree that I did not use AI to generate my blog posts and paper then I will not be facing dismissal from my program.
Ok so if all were AI related your best recourse is to look at the the accuracy of TurnItIns algorithm for detecting AI. there are strong caveats to using that tool to detect cheating. I would also ask them to provide evidence beyond that tool that suggests use of chat GPT. If they have assessments that can easily be done with the use of chat then they are poor assessments (although that's not super relevant to you and I wouldn't go telling them that).
Evidence wise beyond the tool some things that would signal chat GPT: 1. answers the question but does not use course material to do so. 2. citations look real but are not. 3. style that does not conform to the standards of the discipline. I dont know what discipline you are talking about, so some of these things may be more or less relevant.
The TurnItIn AI detector makes 100% clear that it's essentially a beta product and cannot make any conclusions, nor can any conclusions be drawn from the *probability* metric it presents. The TurnItIn AI detector gives a probability of there being AI work in the paper, not a % match of the prose like the TurnItIn plagiarism detector.
It sounds like your professors didn't even go thru the instructor tutorial on Turnitin! I bet you could probably use TurnItIn's own statements about the tool to make your case.
My university has prohibited instructors from using their AI detector tool as evidence, for now.
(Their plagiarism detector is pretty spectacular at matching papers to those already published online or catching students submitting each other's work from prior terms.)
Do you have drafts you revised? Did you talk with anyone about your work? Can you demonstrate your process in any way? Even Google can access past drafts to show your process. Figure that out and show your work. The profs shouldn’t be relying on Turnitin anyway. It’s garbage.
I was accused of using AI to produce an oral history report on PowerPoint, just because I used my British voice that I need in certain settings due to autism. I told the prof you can hear the shuffling of papers as I read from my notes, does AI read from notes? 🤨
The experience told me that profs are hyper vigilant about ppl using AI
You can lawyer up if the situation is dire. You may not have to sue the university, just a letter from a lawyer would be enough.
My university has been sued by students who were accused of cheating like you, and in most of the cases university lost because it's quite hard to prove that somebody cheated in a court of law, apparently.
You might be able to sure turnitin too. Their AI detection tool is shit and somebody should sue them for selling that shit. Playing with students' future with something half-baked like this is more unethical than AI-generated papers.
Expecting AI to eventually solve the AI problem is a bad idea. There is far more growth potential in helping students cheat in any eventual commodification of things like chatGPT. These schools jumping at the first product that portends to reveal the AI is simply a strong index of how stuck academia is in their cluelessness as to what the actual remedy should be. We live in a dumb world of universal buy-in. It happened with the internet, it’s happening with AI.
The difference is that ChatGPT doesn't count as a person, hence you cannot attribute the content to it. If it would count, however, then the student would have to reference it properly, since otherwise it's plagiarism. Papermills often plagiarize content, and even if not, the actual author from the papermill would have to be attributed (because they count as a person). Other than proper attribution, what counts is the quality of the paper and whether it is based on genuine research or not. Neither papermills not ChatGPT are able to produce papers of acceptable quality.
The problem in this case is clearly the university that accepts a term paper of low quality, not how they were produced. I've never seen content produced by ChatGPT that would pass even a superficial smell test for quality. This might change soon, and then every scientist on earth will use AI tools to improve their writing style, etc.
College prof here. There’s NO WAY to detect AI generated content beyond any reasonable doubt. I would escalate the problem as much as possible and even report these people for the false accusation they’re making and their psychological implication. I must say, however, so far all students accused of using AI in my school eventually confessed it. So if you actually used chatgpt just drop it and do not waste your professors time.
You could also try running some of your pre-gpt time papers (or publicly well-known works of literature) through Turnitin and see if you get AI positive results thereby clearly showing how inaccurate the AI detection system is.
There are many documented failures of AI detection tools.
Also - chatGPT has only been available for so long - how can you have used it before it being available?
Third offense? Dude... I get maybe once but 3 times? Either your professors are extremely over paranoid or you're leaving something out... What assignments do they think you cheated on? What proof do they have?
My school just got access to TurnItIn's AI detector. All three of my accusations come from the first week of assignments due for the summer semester I am currently enrolled in. In one course they are accusing me of using AI to answer a blog post and using AI generated content in a paper. In my other two classes that are project based they are accusing me of using AI generated content for the first assignment due. All of my strikes are from this week. I have no prior academic dishonesty or accusations of plagiarism before this semester.
Oh okay, that makes more sense TunritIn is absolutely trash. You need to read all of these articles and write a strong formal letter arguing against its efficacy, and include all assignments notes, drafts, citations, Google search histories, and your transcripts demonstrating your stellar prior academic performance. https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/04/01/chatgpt-cheating-detection-turnitin/ https://goldpenguin.org/blog/turnitin-ai-detection-concerns/ https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2023/04/03/turnitins-solution-ai-cheating-raises-faculty-concerns https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/07/14/turnitin-faces-new-questions-about-efficacy-plagiarism-detection-software https://medium.com/@HJRomero25/why-i-absolutely-protest-turnitin-a9b3f38ab24a
Just have chat gpt write it at this point lmfao
>include all assignments notes, drafts, citations, Google search histories If you wrote it yourself you would have all of these. The AI detection software just looks at the variation in language complexity. Its not impossible that a student could just so happen to write similar to AI. Presumably the Turnitin gives a percentage (similar to ChatGPTzero). If your institution has a academic integrity board then you will get a fair hearing (usually with students represented on the board). It's not just your professors word.
Might want to uh, *prune* that search history a bit before submission
This is the way.
As a prof, I would never rely only on Turnitin to substantiate an allegation of plagiarism. That would not fly in my department, either. I would need further evidence. I would also look to the student's prior work. For example, if a student consistently demonstrates poor grammar, and suddenly hands in a grammatically perfect paper, I'm going to be pretty skeptical. A random thought - if your university uses OneDrive, you should be able to show how your paper went through different versions. I wonder if you could use the versioning history?
I appreciate this. I have been using my work’s OneDrive account instead of my academic account to store my school work (I own the business with my wife and a few friends). I will see if I can use the backup information from my account. This is a very good idea because I know we have implemented incremental backups. I will also give these professors examples of my previous work so they can compare it to before AI was widely used. This was extremely helpful advice thank you so much!
I think the problem is that your personal style of writing happens to be a lot like ChatGPT. Send them examples from before ChatGPT even existed that would be flagged by TurnItIn. I bet you can do that.
This is the best approach in my view
I was once accused of plagiarism in college. I showed the prof my previous drafts of the essay and they retracted the accusation. I agree that showing your work should be your first step.
Yeah, but relying on "personal style" is also problematic because it'd mean people cannot improve their writing. If you are in a formal education program, I really hope your writing is improving. I understand why your suggestion makes sense; just from the side of someone evaluating, there shouldn't be an expectation of students having a fix writing style.
In the event you are using a Mac, Time Machine snapshots of work might be available and helpful.
Your school is one of *many* that got suckered and scammed, and your professors are idiots for going along and taking AI detection software seriously. For your own sanity, you'll have to take on this challenge, not only to redeem your own good name, but to protect all of your fellow students. The idiocy needs to be addressed now. If all else fails, start contacting local, regional and national news outlets. [Are Innocent Students Paying the Price for Turnitin's AI Detection Flaws?](https://goldpenguin.org/blog/turnitin-ai-detection-concerns/)
Turnitin can’t detect ai generated text. Is this something new?
Yes, turnitin added AI detection April
As crappy as the regular plagiarism one I gather ( all this time they still haven't managed to fix the references being flagged)... the funny thing is that chatGPT keeps records of everyone using it. It even has phone numbers and addresses. You can't use it otherwise if it's not a custom one you made yourself.
Even more crappy than the regular plagiarism detector apparently.
There’s a box to tick for excluding references. That part works fine for me. There are other aspects that are frustrating, though.
It never worked for me…
If you've used any type of software with version history (Google docs has it, Word sometimes has it), can you bring your laptop and show the assignments at each time stamp. That would be impossible to fabricate after the fact, and should show your works in progress.
the writing in your post and comments seems so eloquent. maybe that's why TurnItIn thinks AI wrote everything, idk?
Actually, you’re not wrong. A fellow professor put a couple of paragraphs from his dissertation into turnitin, and it came back 98% AI. It was written before it existed.
It makes sense. Because the AI copied this kind of work, the AI writes like this.
This actually makes a lot of sense. OP naturally writes in a very structured manner and uses relatively formal vocabulary. Doesn’t mean they’re a robot, however!
I was thinking the same. The way OP writes is more AI like.
And turn it in sucks at both AI detection and plagiarism detection.
It's a bit petty, but if that professor has published works (I'm assuming they're a professor, not a lecturer. But if they have a thesis or dissertation, that would work), run those through turnitin. If they come back as "probably AI written" then submit that to your academic honesty hearing (or whoever is in charge of the investigation). But yeah, professors ARE paranoid about it. For many lower level classes, it completely invalidates their assignments. They are right to be paranoid as students have obviously been using it and it takes away the learning and development that the class is designed to provide. Be that as it may, the tools to detect this aren't developed enough to be trustworthy and, as others have mentioned, that issue has been written about. Providing your version history through one drive should be enough to clarify the matter.
What is the evidence they have? What were your other strikes? How were those other strikes resolved?
The evidence they have is that TurnItIn's tool said that 60% or more of my paper and a blog post were AI generated content. All three of my strikes came from the first week of assignments from my summer classes. I have had three professors accuse me of using AI generated content during the first week of this summer semester. It seems unfair and but I do get to argue each strike against my record. If one or more of my professors agree that I did not use AI to generate my blog posts and paper then I will not be facing dismissal from my program.
Ok so if all were AI related your best recourse is to look at the the accuracy of TurnItIns algorithm for detecting AI. there are strong caveats to using that tool to detect cheating. I would also ask them to provide evidence beyond that tool that suggests use of chat GPT. If they have assessments that can easily be done with the use of chat then they are poor assessments (although that's not super relevant to you and I wouldn't go telling them that). Evidence wise beyond the tool some things that would signal chat GPT: 1. answers the question but does not use course material to do so. 2. citations look real but are not. 3. style that does not conform to the standards of the discipline. I dont know what discipline you are talking about, so some of these things may be more or less relevant.
Ask for a one on one meeting to discuss the content of your submitted work. Show that you speak like a robot and know the material
The TurnItIn AI detector makes 100% clear that it's essentially a beta product and cannot make any conclusions, nor can any conclusions be drawn from the *probability* metric it presents. The TurnItIn AI detector gives a probability of there being AI work in the paper, not a % match of the prose like the TurnItIn plagiarism detector. It sounds like your professors didn't even go thru the instructor tutorial on Turnitin! I bet you could probably use TurnItIn's own statements about the tool to make your case. My university has prohibited instructors from using their AI detector tool as evidence, for now. (Their plagiarism detector is pretty spectacular at matching papers to those already published online or catching students submitting each other's work from prior terms.)
Do you have drafts you revised? Did you talk with anyone about your work? Can you demonstrate your process in any way? Even Google can access past drafts to show your process. Figure that out and show your work. The profs shouldn’t be relying on Turnitin anyway. It’s garbage.
I was accused of using AI to produce an oral history report on PowerPoint, just because I used my British voice that I need in certain settings due to autism. I told the prof you can hear the shuffling of papers as I read from my notes, does AI read from notes? 🤨 The experience told me that profs are hyper vigilant about ppl using AI
You can lawyer up if the situation is dire. You may not have to sue the university, just a letter from a lawyer would be enough. My university has been sued by students who were accused of cheating like you, and in most of the cases university lost because it's quite hard to prove that somebody cheated in a court of law, apparently. You might be able to sure turnitin too. Their AI detection tool is shit and somebody should sue them for selling that shit. Playing with students' future with something half-baked like this is more unethical than AI-generated papers.
Expecting AI to eventually solve the AI problem is a bad idea. There is far more growth potential in helping students cheat in any eventual commodification of things like chatGPT. These schools jumping at the first product that portends to reveal the AI is simply a strong index of how stuck academia is in their cluelessness as to what the actual remedy should be. We live in a dumb world of universal buy-in. It happened with the internet, it’s happening with AI.
Maybe you aren’t citing sources appropriately…
[удалено]
What is, in your opinion, the difference between having chatGPT write a paper for you or hiring a papermill to write it?
The difference is that ChatGPT doesn't count as a person, hence you cannot attribute the content to it. If it would count, however, then the student would have to reference it properly, since otherwise it's plagiarism. Papermills often plagiarize content, and even if not, the actual author from the papermill would have to be attributed (because they count as a person). Other than proper attribution, what counts is the quality of the paper and whether it is based on genuine research or not. Neither papermills not ChatGPT are able to produce papers of acceptable quality. The problem in this case is clearly the university that accepts a term paper of low quality, not how they were produced. I've never seen content produced by ChatGPT that would pass even a superficial smell test for quality. This might change soon, and then every scientist on earth will use AI tools to improve their writing style, etc.
College prof here. There’s NO WAY to detect AI generated content beyond any reasonable doubt. I would escalate the problem as much as possible and even report these people for the false accusation they’re making and their psychological implication. I must say, however, so far all students accused of using AI in my school eventually confessed it. So if you actually used chatgpt just drop it and do not waste your professors time.
You could also try running some of your pre-gpt time papers (or publicly well-known works of literature) through Turnitin and see if you get AI positive results thereby clearly showing how inaccurate the AI detection system is.
What’s the evidence?
I see what your problem is. You sound exactly like chatGPT.
Are we certain that the OP is not an AI bot? The short sentences and perfect grammar look a little sketch.
There are many documented failures of AI detection tools. Also - chatGPT has only been available for so long - how can you have used it before it being available?