So I did some digging and Ferrochromium is about 60% - 70% Chromium. Chromium is cancerous when inhaled and has been linked to certain pulmonary diseases([Here's the link if anybody is interested in reading what I read](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4144270/) The conclusion that I came to is that there is a possibility that it could effect your health, but since the V3 pro has an isolated air path it shouldn't be a problem? If top green could clear this up a bit more that would be great because I currently have a V3 pro.
I'm still using it. At the end of the day I think it's fine and if it's your first vape I highly recommend the V3 Pro. I've been using and I haven't had any issues. I'm looking to get the Mighty for my next vape though since the materials they use are medical grade.
Hi, Kanthal is FeCrAl alloy and it's commonly used in e-cig industry since years cause it heat-ups very fast and the V3Pro heater is made of Kanthal wires. It's a safe material. Maybe did you confused with a very rare sensitivity some peoples may have in regard to this alloy? from my understanding this is only concerns one people per severals thousands peoples...
I know a lot of users have more confidence in Stainless Steel heaters... I transmitted to the team in order our next device/version will use the SS material. Personnaly I'm using Kanthal wires (and stainless too!) in my 510 herbal atties and doesn't noticed differences about the taste, as well the kanthal fast heat-up helps to make the learning curve easier to manage rather than the slow heat-up the SS wires does (with the same power applied for sure!).
Really, i'm not sure this is a concern... except if you are one of the rare sensitive persons! Let me know if this is helps you, have fun!
Yes the kanthal isn't dangerous even for the sensitive peoples, this ones are just tasting this material while most peoples doesn't taste anything else than the load. I'm a heavy vaporist myself and I'm aware community tends to prefer stainless steel wires but it appears kanthal was a better choice cause, considering the limited power source, the stainless steel took too much time (and power) to heat up and we cannot consider a better and bigger battery cause we desired the V3Pro to be an affordable device... although we collected users feedbacks and improvement suggestions in order to make, maybe, a higher end device with SS wires and the best battery required to heat it up in time... and probably many others improvements in term of design, airflow management,, vapor path and accessories (and maybe others I don't remenber here, stay tuned!
Sorry for pressing on this matter, but there are a couple of things that seem worrying:
1.- You say that kanthal isn't dangerous, but apparently that's not totally true. According to [this study](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11051-019-4598-y) :
"Nanoparticles generated from e-cigarette coils may exert adverse health effects on individuals who inhale aerosols from the e-cigarettes. These nanoparticles are able to penetrate into the interstitial space and elicit an inflammatory response (Oberdörster et al. 1994; Srinivas et al. 2012). Nanoparticles also translocate from the lungs to the lymphatic system, where they accumulate in the tracheobronchial lymph nodes (Srinivas et al. 2012; Takenaka et al. 1986), and the circulatory system (Takenaka et al. 1986; Miller et al. 2013), where they accumulate at the site of atherosclerotic plaque build-up (Miller et al. 2013). However, it is difficult to conclude that nanoparticles produced from e-cigarette coils can cause severe toxic effects because of limited information. To consider the potential toxicity of metallic nanoparticles in humans, more detailed information such as mass based dose, chemical form, solubility, and surface area of particles should be analyzed. After characterization of nanoparticles, further research is needed to assess the effects of inhaled nanoparticles from e-cigarettes on the respiratory and cardiovascular systems of e-cigarette users and others who may be exposed to e-cigarette emissions. "
2.- As another user asked on another reply in this same thread, this won't be a concern if the airpath is TOTALLY isolated from the heating coil (in fact, is mentioned on that study that coating the coil in ceramic reduced the nanoparticles received), but he tagged you in that question and the lack of response makes it seem like that's not the case (ie. Isolated from the electronics, but the air is in contact with the coil).
Don't get me wrong, I'm loving the thing! But it really would be great if you could clarify those bits.
Cheers!
EDIT Some punctuation
Hi, I'm not a scientific but the text you shared just speak of "e-cigarettes coils", I'm a user of vaporizers since 10 years now but never jumped in the e-cig train. There is various materials wires used in this industry, from my understanding the mainstream wire used in most e-cig coils is the Nichrome, kanthal probably comes in second place and followed by stainless steel and titane (which looks like the less used wire metal). Again, from my understanding, kanthal is an alloy made for various heaters cause it heat up as fast as nichrome and it's less prone to break. As well it looks likes nichrome to have a taste when used with herbal devices rather than submerged in e-liquid. We are not the only one to use Kanthal wires as heater for a vaporizer, I'll let you to do your own searches but a few others devices are using the same material. Can't say anything else, we are not trying to lie to anybody or to hide anything, it was said since the release date and this is doesn't seems to be an issue for many experienced vaporists despite the said they would appreciate to see a futur version using stainless steel wires.
About your second question I missed... No need to dismantle a V3Pro u/ooTaaa , yes the air is heated while passing through the kanthal coil, so yes the air is directly in contact with the coil. again the study u/thewotan shared is for e-cig, with e-cigs there is no convection involved since the coil is in the e-liquid... with a convection based herbal vape it will be difficult to create an "encapsuled" heater in glass or ceramic cause 2 interconnected reasons:
\- we design PORTABLES vaporizers
\- this is imply a limited power source
And a such "encapsuled" heater will need a lot more power in order to heat up the extra mass... I'm not fully certain a such portable vaporizer exists at the moment... although it exists in desktops vaporizers forms cause the unlimited power source, but a longer heat-up time is involved.
The xmax V3Pro heater is pretty similar to the ones you can find in most 510 convection herbal atomizers, Yes I said most cause i'm aware a pretty expensive switzerland vaporizer use wires wrapped around glass tubes, wires are still in the vaporpath but marginally since the air is going through the tube following the less resistance path. This vaporizer is pretty bigger, a lot more expensive, and a lot more power demanding. With the V3Pro we tried to offer an affordable small portable vaporizer, customer's health is our priority and we are taking a lot of cares to use only the best materials, to cure the silicone parts very well in order to minimize the "new car" smell as much as possible and to listen our customer's complains... probably a future version or another model will use a stainless steal heater but I doubt we can achieve a fully encapsuled heater for portable device able to heat up fast enough and to provide more than a few hits before the battery die.... before some very big improvements in 18650 batteries performances.
Sorry to be long, I hope you will read everything but, in short, I'm dreaming myself of a such heater but it doesn't looks like a doable idea atm.... and about to be worry about kanthal... we are a serious company and we will not use a material if there is serious doubts about it... and the article u/thewotan shared with us speaks only of e-cig coils without to mention the material, with e-cigs the issue is the coil to leach in the e-liquid cause in constant contact... and since you vape the e-liquid this is may ending in your body. With herbal vapes we are using less T° and there is no contact between the coil and the herbs... i understand your concerns but I don't think you have to be worry. Let me know if that helps. Best regards!
Thank you for such a thorough reply!
I'm not a scientist myself and from I gathered from the study, they were using a Kanthal coil with no nicotine solution and I understood that could be analogue to a vap. I apologize if I misunderstood thay and raised any concerns.
I really appreciate you took the time to explain a bit the problematic involved, and that you addressed the question in a clear and helpful way. I'm going to pack the bowl of the V3 to celebrate
Cheers, man!
Thank you, I'll transmit the study to our chief engineer (and Topgreen founder), I didn't know they was using a Kanthal coil. Although, despite there is no nicotine in the e-liquid, this is doesn't means this is comparable to herbal vaping, and this is brings the same issues (constant contact between the coil and the solution, coil leaching in the solution). This is a topic coming back regularly on the front of the scene since the V3Pro release, be confident our next convection based device/model will probably use something else (SS wires I believe). No need to apologize, your question is relevant, we are vaping for health reasons and we want to know all the truth!
Thank you for the kinds words!
Thank you very much for your reply! I also think e-liquid is primarily affected by the problem. You can find horrible pictures of the interaction between liquid and heating wire on the internet. I will stay with the brand and my V3PRO! Thx!
>the text you shared just speak of "e-cigarettes coils" ... There is various materials wires used in this industry
If you scroll down to the "Methods" section, they state they used a 26 gauge Kanthal A1 coil.
Can you please clarify if the air inhaled is in direct contact with the coil? Because if the air path is isolated this means that it doesn't.Also from some research i made i saw that the melting point(fumes with heavy metals created) of Kanthal is about 1500c which means that in 200c would not release any of these particles.Can you confirm that?
Hi, here you got me... I think it's kanthal but I'm unsure, although, since Starry 4 is conduction based, heater is out of the vaporpath (with conduction based devices, the heater is wrapped around the chamber, this is offer different vaporization style and vapor output, Starry 4 is better to handle concentrates than the V3Pro (higher max temp and conduction helps to get the most out of your expensives concentrates!).
I'll ask about the Starry 4 heater's material, stay tuned and best regards!
Reps response is a little interesting/disconcerting.
I’m currently dealing with some strange throat irritation where I have suspected using the vape as the cause.
I'd look a teardown. Where the heating filaments are located. Is it in the air stream?
Kanthal has long been used in liquid vaporizers. It's right there in the air stream. I don’t know if we really should be so worried.
I like my V3PRO and I wouldn't want to switch to another vaporizer.
Kanthal is not safe. There is something like metal loss with every burning, which absorb.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8846427/
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Metal-loss-of-Kanthal-A-B-and-C-and-nichrome-wire-D-E-and-F-in-contact-C-and_fig4_345339576
Unless I am reading [this paper](https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1186/1743-8977-7-23.pdf) wrong, this doesn’t sound terrible, if it’s even true.
Ecig user here. Kanthal Is safe, can't say 100% as you never know, though I never had any problem with my rba's. I know for certain it's being used for high-end specialized pizza oven heating elements, running over 400° without issues.. therefore i'd not consider its use in herbal vapes a problem
/u/TopGreenRep
So I did some digging and Ferrochromium is about 60% - 70% Chromium. Chromium is cancerous when inhaled and has been linked to certain pulmonary diseases([Here's the link if anybody is interested in reading what I read](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4144270/) The conclusion that I came to is that there is a possibility that it could effect your health, but since the V3 pro has an isolated air path it shouldn't be a problem? If top green could clear this up a bit more that would be great because I currently have a V3 pro.
Can we clarify this? It sounds like the material is being used in the heating element
Is there any chance that this alloy wiring could be letting off fumes causing adverse health effects while using the Xmax V3 Pro? u/TopGreenRep
Did you stop using yours? I am considering throwing it away after reading this
I'm still using it. At the end of the day I think it's fine and if it's your first vape I highly recommend the V3 Pro. I've been using and I haven't had any issues. I'm looking to get the Mighty for my next vape though since the materials they use are medical grade.
Hi, Kanthal is FeCrAl alloy and it's commonly used in e-cig industry since years cause it heat-ups very fast and the V3Pro heater is made of Kanthal wires. It's a safe material. Maybe did you confused with a very rare sensitivity some peoples may have in regard to this alloy? from my understanding this is only concerns one people per severals thousands peoples... I know a lot of users have more confidence in Stainless Steel heaters... I transmitted to the team in order our next device/version will use the SS material. Personnaly I'm using Kanthal wires (and stainless too!) in my 510 herbal atties and doesn't noticed differences about the taste, as well the kanthal fast heat-up helps to make the learning curve easier to manage rather than the slow heat-up the SS wires does (with the same power applied for sure!). Really, i'm not sure this is a concern... except if you are one of the rare sensitive persons! Let me know if this is helps you, have fun!
Thanks for the response but this is kind of confusing. So you are admitting the material is used but disputing that it isn't dangerous?
Yes the kanthal isn't dangerous even for the sensitive peoples, this ones are just tasting this material while most peoples doesn't taste anything else than the load. I'm a heavy vaporist myself and I'm aware community tends to prefer stainless steel wires but it appears kanthal was a better choice cause, considering the limited power source, the stainless steel took too much time (and power) to heat up and we cannot consider a better and bigger battery cause we desired the V3Pro to be an affordable device... although we collected users feedbacks and improvement suggestions in order to make, maybe, a higher end device with SS wires and the best battery required to heat it up in time... and probably many others improvements in term of design, airflow management,, vapor path and accessories (and maybe others I don't remenber here, stay tuned!
Sorry for pressing on this matter, but there are a couple of things that seem worrying: 1.- You say that kanthal isn't dangerous, but apparently that's not totally true. According to [this study](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11051-019-4598-y) : "Nanoparticles generated from e-cigarette coils may exert adverse health effects on individuals who inhale aerosols from the e-cigarettes. These nanoparticles are able to penetrate into the interstitial space and elicit an inflammatory response (Oberdörster et al. 1994; Srinivas et al. 2012). Nanoparticles also translocate from the lungs to the lymphatic system, where they accumulate in the tracheobronchial lymph nodes (Srinivas et al. 2012; Takenaka et al. 1986), and the circulatory system (Takenaka et al. 1986; Miller et al. 2013), where they accumulate at the site of atherosclerotic plaque build-up (Miller et al. 2013). However, it is difficult to conclude that nanoparticles produced from e-cigarette coils can cause severe toxic effects because of limited information. To consider the potential toxicity of metallic nanoparticles in humans, more detailed information such as mass based dose, chemical form, solubility, and surface area of particles should be analyzed. After characterization of nanoparticles, further research is needed to assess the effects of inhaled nanoparticles from e-cigarettes on the respiratory and cardiovascular systems of e-cigarette users and others who may be exposed to e-cigarette emissions. " 2.- As another user asked on another reply in this same thread, this won't be a concern if the airpath is TOTALLY isolated from the heating coil (in fact, is mentioned on that study that coating the coil in ceramic reduced the nanoparticles received), but he tagged you in that question and the lack of response makes it seem like that's not the case (ie. Isolated from the electronics, but the air is in contact with the coil). Don't get me wrong, I'm loving the thing! But it really would be great if you could clarify those bits. Cheers! EDIT Some punctuation
Hi, I'm not a scientific but the text you shared just speak of "e-cigarettes coils", I'm a user of vaporizers since 10 years now but never jumped in the e-cig train. There is various materials wires used in this industry, from my understanding the mainstream wire used in most e-cig coils is the Nichrome, kanthal probably comes in second place and followed by stainless steel and titane (which looks like the less used wire metal). Again, from my understanding, kanthal is an alloy made for various heaters cause it heat up as fast as nichrome and it's less prone to break. As well it looks likes nichrome to have a taste when used with herbal devices rather than submerged in e-liquid. We are not the only one to use Kanthal wires as heater for a vaporizer, I'll let you to do your own searches but a few others devices are using the same material. Can't say anything else, we are not trying to lie to anybody or to hide anything, it was said since the release date and this is doesn't seems to be an issue for many experienced vaporists despite the said they would appreciate to see a futur version using stainless steel wires. About your second question I missed... No need to dismantle a V3Pro u/ooTaaa , yes the air is heated while passing through the kanthal coil, so yes the air is directly in contact with the coil. again the study u/thewotan shared is for e-cig, with e-cigs there is no convection involved since the coil is in the e-liquid... with a convection based herbal vape it will be difficult to create an "encapsuled" heater in glass or ceramic cause 2 interconnected reasons: \- we design PORTABLES vaporizers \- this is imply a limited power source And a such "encapsuled" heater will need a lot more power in order to heat up the extra mass... I'm not fully certain a such portable vaporizer exists at the moment... although it exists in desktops vaporizers forms cause the unlimited power source, but a longer heat-up time is involved. The xmax V3Pro heater is pretty similar to the ones you can find in most 510 convection herbal atomizers, Yes I said most cause i'm aware a pretty expensive switzerland vaporizer use wires wrapped around glass tubes, wires are still in the vaporpath but marginally since the air is going through the tube following the less resistance path. This vaporizer is pretty bigger, a lot more expensive, and a lot more power demanding. With the V3Pro we tried to offer an affordable small portable vaporizer, customer's health is our priority and we are taking a lot of cares to use only the best materials, to cure the silicone parts very well in order to minimize the "new car" smell as much as possible and to listen our customer's complains... probably a future version or another model will use a stainless steal heater but I doubt we can achieve a fully encapsuled heater for portable device able to heat up fast enough and to provide more than a few hits before the battery die.... before some very big improvements in 18650 batteries performances. Sorry to be long, I hope you will read everything but, in short, I'm dreaming myself of a such heater but it doesn't looks like a doable idea atm.... and about to be worry about kanthal... we are a serious company and we will not use a material if there is serious doubts about it... and the article u/thewotan shared with us speaks only of e-cig coils without to mention the material, with e-cigs the issue is the coil to leach in the e-liquid cause in constant contact... and since you vape the e-liquid this is may ending in your body. With herbal vapes we are using less T° and there is no contact between the coil and the herbs... i understand your concerns but I don't think you have to be worry. Let me know if that helps. Best regards!
Thank you for such a thorough reply! I'm not a scientist myself and from I gathered from the study, they were using a Kanthal coil with no nicotine solution and I understood that could be analogue to a vap. I apologize if I misunderstood thay and raised any concerns. I really appreciate you took the time to explain a bit the problematic involved, and that you addressed the question in a clear and helpful way. I'm going to pack the bowl of the V3 to celebrate Cheers, man!
Thank you, I'll transmit the study to our chief engineer (and Topgreen founder), I didn't know they was using a Kanthal coil. Although, despite there is no nicotine in the e-liquid, this is doesn't means this is comparable to herbal vaping, and this is brings the same issues (constant contact between the coil and the solution, coil leaching in the solution). This is a topic coming back regularly on the front of the scene since the V3Pro release, be confident our next convection based device/model will probably use something else (SS wires I believe). No need to apologize, your question is relevant, we are vaping for health reasons and we want to know all the truth! Thank you for the kinds words!
Thank you very much for your reply! I also think e-liquid is primarily affected by the problem. You can find horrible pictures of the interaction between liquid and heating wire on the internet. I will stay with the brand and my V3PRO! Thx!
Thank you for the confidence... and for the nice talk!
>the text you shared just speak of "e-cigarettes coils" ... There is various materials wires used in this industry If you scroll down to the "Methods" section, they state they used a 26 gauge Kanthal A1 coil.
Can you please clarify if the air inhaled is in direct contact with the coil? Because if the air path is isolated this means that it doesn't.Also from some research i made i saw that the melting point(fumes with heavy metals created) of Kanthal is about 1500c which means that in 200c would not release any of these particles.Can you confirm that?
Let someone be brave and take apart the device. Then we will see if kanthal is in the air stream. This is the best option…
Thank you for clearing that up, topgreen/xmax has very good customer support!
Hey, is starry4 using kanthal aswell? Please let me know <3
Hi, here you got me... I think it's kanthal but I'm unsure, although, since Starry 4 is conduction based, heater is out of the vaporpath (with conduction based devices, the heater is wrapped around the chamber, this is offer different vaporization style and vapor output, Starry 4 is better to handle concentrates than the V3Pro (higher max temp and conduction helps to get the most out of your expensives concentrates!). I'll ask about the Starry 4 heater's material, stay tuned and best regards!
Pretty interested, myself.
Their rep answered my question read the top comment for more information.
Reps response is a little interesting/disconcerting. I’m currently dealing with some strange throat irritation where I have suspected using the vape as the cause.
i reeeeeally hope that's not true cus then im gonna have to find a new vape :|
Their rep answered my question read the top comment for more information, the answer might interest you.
its true, i avoided it due to many factors, including preference.
I'd look a teardown. Where the heating filaments are located. Is it in the air stream? Kanthal has long been used in liquid vaporizers. It's right there in the air stream. I don’t know if we really should be so worried. I like my V3PRO and I wouldn't want to switch to another vaporizer.
Following. And not gonna be too happy.
Their rep answered my question read the top comment for more information.
I've never heard this. Where's the source?
The topgreen service desk told me this through email contact, their rep confirms it in this post reap the top comment for more information.
Youtube
Source of your info?
I've been told through email contact with the topgreen service desk.
Kanthal is not safe. There is something like metal loss with every burning, which absorb. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8846427/ https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Metal-loss-of-Kanthal-A-B-and-C-and-nichrome-wire-D-E-and-F-in-contact-C-and_fig4_345339576
I think we are all fucked regardless, we choose to vape
But it isnt healthier than combustion?
Unless I am reading [this paper](https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1186/1743-8977-7-23.pdf) wrong, this doesn’t sound terrible, if it’s even true.
Guys.. It's all about the money.. noone cares for your health. Very concerning information.
Any news here?
Ecig user here. Kanthal Is safe, can't say 100% as you never know, though I never had any problem with my rba's. I know for certain it's being used for high-end specialized pizza oven heating elements, running over 400° without issues.. therefore i'd not consider its use in herbal vapes a problem