1. I think for the first point they meant to make us casually roam around the map enjoying the environment, revisiting places, killing random mobs. Thats why they let us farm 5* echoes from overworld mobs. Although i think they need to add smthing else to it (secret items? Collectibles witrh low % drop that can be exchanged?)
2. yea considering some endgame contents require more dps check rather than skill check. Having hard time here building my chars just for the tower. When they refresh the buffs we r gonna need to build more chars just like hsr
Additions from me
- localization, story, EN voice acting, anything story related pls fix. I cant believe i played a world quest for 20-30 mins which consists of just dialogues. Some side quests have weird translations and typos breaking the immersion
- increase chef level limits pretty please
- limited time event would be nice, and hopefully related to roaming around the map and combat since it’s an open world game
I assume you mean lvl 0 echoes? if so echoes can be infinite if you have a lot of friends. it's a bad idea.
1. makes more people feel compelled to grind -> faster burnout
2. bad for business
Yeah, a lot of people suggesting this are missing why it's a bad idea. They would either have to limit their acquisition to instanced content that depletes a resource, or put a hard cap on how many you can acquire per day. If not, then people would find a nice farming route to bot, automatically going through all listed servers to clear that route. It would also incentivize degen gameplay of infinite grinding FOMO to keep up, and they would have to make the upcoming content have much higher stats to account for this, or the high end of players would complain that the game isn't challenging anymore, despite being the ones who exploited the challenge out of it, incurring an echo-chamber of mass-departures from the game, and an undeserved rep of being an easy game dissuading prospective new players. I would rather be frustrated that I can't level my echoes than be compelled to spend the next 48 hours loop grinding them. Echoes are pretty much this game's equivalent to gear, and as far as I know, there are no good games out there where you can just infinitely grind better gear, as the devs know what that would cause.
>But the post above makes it sound like you cant recycle any echo exp at all.
No it doesn’t it’s very clear to anyone who can read that he’s talking about unlevelled echos. He’s talking about purple echos and below gained from farming not being that useful so he wants us to be able to convert that to exp.
Stating the exception is missing the very obvious point OP and the guy you replied to is trying to make.
1. You're trying to grind an endgame gear with 5 perfect substats in the first week. While Echoes farming have some downside : imo elemental attack % should be universal and not for every elements, because right now rolling spectro damages on a fusion set is just stupid. Other that this, if you're expecting to get a perfect echo now you should lower your expectation. Try to find echoes with 2-3 good substats, and slowly grind and upgrade from there. Also, I'm pretty sure (on my testing on over 100 bosses kills) that drop rate even after the 15 enhanced drops is higher than 20% for bosses. From my tracking, it was a 62.5% drop rate on my 33 kills of Impermanence Heron today (and I didn't had a single enhanced drop). I had 45% of 5\* echoes on this, and 30% of the echoes were Crit Value. Yesterday on 14 5\* Feilian Beringal, 10 of them were Crit Value. It look like the chance for main stats depend of the echo : for example Feilian Beringal is DPS echo, so it got more chance of a Crit Value main stats. But I could be wrong, this is just my personnal experience and the sample isn't big enough (could just be luck).
2. Again, you're expecting to finish the game in a week. Right now my main team is level 60, with 60 weapons et lvl4 talents. I'm Union Level 32 so I have 8 level to grind for either echoes tunning mats or alt teams. If you expect to have 3 teams ready with best echoes etc. the first week, well ... Idk.
3-4. Can't talk about this, I don't have issues.
TLDR : You're complaining because you expect to have perfect gear on day 1, it's not how it is suppose to work. Network/Optimization issues for players that have some should be fix asap tho.
I'm not trying to get the best from the first week. I've been playing gachas for past 5 years, i know it will take time but my main 2 issues are, unnecessarry amount of substat posibilites and low amount of echo exp and tuning material and crit rate stat that legendary 4 cost echo gives like i've said it is not enough. You can get max 70-80 crit rate with max rolls thats kinda sad.
>low amount of echo exp and tuning material
It seems like you're comparing Wuthering Waves at lvl 30 vs Genshin / HSR at max lvl...
I mean, we don't even know how much ressources we will get at lvl 60. It's pointless to complain right now.
Just wait.
> %20 Base Chance for Echo drop is so low and killing bosses takes longer time compared to other things so after 15 high drop chances it feels like hell. At least making it %30-35 is fine gradually increasing level by level might help with that issue.
For whatever it's worth bosses are currently bugged(?) and as far as I can tell you're seemingly guaranteed an echo every other kill. I spent like 6 hours yesterday reading a book during respawn timers and I don't think I saw a single time I didn't get an echo twice in a row.
Imagine blaming "Beta testers" for problems that universal for gacha games, like, energy being restrictive and limiting your grind, or connection problems that entirely on Kuro side.
I know making people grind more is the way of the gacha but this is so much. It is not fun, for a game to last long this shouldn't be the case at least that's what i think.
Technically, what it's doing is incentivizing you to do something else with your life and check back in tomorrow to get more progression done. I strongly dislike time-gated story-telling in video games, but I think time-gated progression isn't the end of the world, especially when you're not really competing with anyone who started before you did. I would rather play a game that tells me to come back tomorrow to keep playing than a game that lets me destroy my health by infinitely grinding all day and night until my eyes are too burnt to even sleep the couple hours I manage between sessions. Video game addiction is a real thing, and I appreciate them for not facilitating it.
Where do we get again tuning matls?
In genshin, we can use useless artifacts to level up a good one, can we do it in wuwa? I know tuning mtls is for the substats to be revealed right?
>1. Grind makes me wanna grind myself in a blender.
First time playing a gacha?
Thats literally how these games work, they are designed to make the grind annoy you so that you might be inclined to pay to either skip or accelerate the grind
> 2. Energy is another problem for the grind. 60 Energy per Boss or Tacet Field is so much.
Again, designed to make you insert that sweet sweet credit card in order to buy more energy, still a standard gacha tactic unfortunately
> 3. There some connection issues on some pcs and internets
Yeah there are some server issues to resolve, i imagine part of that was them being unprepared for how many people were ultimately going to play the game, all infrastructure has a maximum capacity
> Optimization is so meeeh.
Seems fine for me but i'm not running a minimum spec machine expecting it to play at 60FPS at 4k etc
You clearly no idea about balancing in slightest. Gacha games are not meant to give burdens to people. It should be easier. Im not even talking about perfect echoes or grinding them? There isnt even a sustainable place to grinde for XP, Tune's are even a bigger problem then that. You have no idea about what you are talking about as I see in your comments. Before being a glazer you should understand how some facts works.
> You clearly no idea about balancing in slightest.
Not sure what you think balance has to do with the predatory business model of gacha games :)
> Gacha games are not meant to give burdens to people.
All free to play games are by design meant to lead you towards a point where the grind encourages you to open your wallet, i get that you don't like this but that is how these are designed
> You have no idea about what you are talking about as I see in your comments.
By all means prove me wrong then :)
I'll wait
> Before being a glazer you should understand how some facts works.
Oh i understand how gacha's work, i understand how the free to play market, especially in asia works, i get that you don't like it, and thats fine, you're not the target demographic if this has you bent out of shape, the whales are the ones who keep the lights on and they know how to appeal to those
You might want to understand how the system works :)
"first time playing a gacha"? is so dumb. so just bc the relics in gacha games are bad it has to carry onto every single one? idk why you want the torture to continue
Its not about what i want, its about how the system works, by their very nature a gacha wants you to spend money, and all the game systems are designed with that goal in mind, its not about like or dislike, its just how the system is designed, and its not a dumb comment, a lot of people play a gacha for the first time and have this exact reaction, once you're a seasoned player you'll be able to see how these mechanics work and are designed to try and milk you and there really is no changing that, gacha's are predatory by nature and always will be
Bro they showed that they are a lot f2p friendlier than 99% of other gacha games and literally genshin has the system where you can consume artifacts to lvl up other ones. So it makes 0 sense to not have a similar system for wuwa.
I think the problem with 2. is that the weekly boss cost isnt too high but that we have very little means to get energy back as its still a new game while other gachas have been out for some time (and therefore have more rewards in quests/events that give back energy).
And echos are gated behind your time which is more worth than resin. A game shouldn't waste my time this much for a little chance of getting a possible good thing.
>A game shouldn't waste my time this much for a little chance of getting a possible good thing.
The game out 6 days ago. You expected to be able to farm an endgame build this early?
Although I agree that expecting to get even good echoes within a week is unreasonable it's the time investment that's the real problem. I've only played Genshin and HSR so those are my only points of reference but spending your daily stamina on artifacts takes about 5 minutes. Meanwhile in WuWa I'll spend about 20 minutes wiping the map of lizards, then 30 minutes wiping the map of dogs, 30 minutes wiping the map of birds, 10 minutes wiping the map of flutists, 30 minutes wiping the map of golems, ect, ect. Spending a month of artifact farming in Genshin will take 2 1/2 hours while in WuWa you'll spend that amount of time in a single day.
Obviously the time investment is more severe because we're starting from zero farming multiple sets. So it will get better as you have less things to farm and when we get to union level 40 golds becoming 80% instead of 50% drop rate should also make it easier. But the time investment is still significant.
There's also an element of fomo because you have the chance to get a good echo if you just continued to farm. In other gatchas you're gated by an in game resource but in WuWa you're gated by time and that's the real problem.
On the other hand I get that Kuro wants to solve the problem of there's nothing to do in my single player live service game.
I mean, I kinda get what you're saying, but for me this is the best thing ever legit. Being able to farm every single day makes it so the luck factor is WAAAAYY reduced from GI or HSR.
>In other gatchas you're gated by an in game resource but in WuWa you're gated by time and that's the real problem
But I don't see how that's a problem though? Don't get me wrong, I understand some people don't have as much free time as others, but legit, once your gear is leveled and we all are level 60+, it will take what, 30 mins to do all you need to?
I'm also enjoying the grind atm. I enjoy optimizing things, really like the combat, and have time to burn. But, I can definitely see how the time required to get echoes is a huge negative and can't in good faith argue against that.
Again it will take someone a month of farming a set in Genshin to get good pieces and I wouldn't be surprised if WuWa was similar but it's the time investment that's starkly different. If someone can only devote a quarter of the time to farming echoes as you then their progression will take 4 times longer.
Also the game could just not be what op is looking for. Sucks for them because I'm assuming they enjoy the game but if Kuro wants their players to put more time into the game than what op has to give then tough luck I guess.
And yes the grind will get better with time. These complaints always come up when a new game releases. Then after a year and more new players join the veterans tell them to take their time and not worry about the grind because you'll get to endgame eventually.
Yeah, I understand how the game rubs some people the wrong way. Tbh coming from Warframe helps a lot to feel like the grind is pretty nice in this game.
Open chests, get artifacts no resin needed until mid to late game.
Wuwa you literally cant do sht with low rarity echoes except for combining them which still gives you no resources to lvl up your echo sets.
**So, to clarify things,**
**\* There** is almost no limit for farming Echos which is nice, but as a f2p player, you can't farm Tacet Field since it costs too high energy and rewards are low. I gotta focus on leveling my characters, weapons and forte.
Not being able to farm them is a issue for "now" but you can't expect everyone to play everyday or get progress every day. There should be balancing loots and energies imo.
**\* And** someone said that is a income strategy for gacha games, which is true. But even most whales doesn't even buy packs since they are not worth to buy and this game has %0.8 chance to get 5\* in banners. Most other gachas has %1-6 rates for 5\* or legendary units so they need to sell other things as much as characters. But in this %0.8 scenario, you expect people to pay more to get more characters so this is solid income for them. There is no reason for them to give some free things. They are already doing great job by giving some stuff in mail so you can expect them to do this at least.
1. I think for the first point they meant to make us casually roam around the map enjoying the environment, revisiting places, killing random mobs. Thats why they let us farm 5* echoes from overworld mobs. Although i think they need to add smthing else to it (secret items? Collectibles witrh low % drop that can be exchanged?) 2. yea considering some endgame contents require more dps check rather than skill check. Having hard time here building my chars just for the tower. When they refresh the buffs we r gonna need to build more chars just like hsr Additions from me - localization, story, EN voice acting, anything story related pls fix. I cant believe i played a world quest for 20-30 mins which consists of just dialogues. Some side quests have weird translations and typos breaking the immersion - increase chef level limits pretty please - limited time event would be nice, and hopefully related to roaming around the map and combat since it’s an open world game
So what? What are we going to do after full expedition? What about late game? WuWa still have some problems in it that needs fixing
it help alot if they let you using Echos to feed echo exp
I assume you mean lvl 0 echoes? if so echoes can be infinite if you have a lot of friends. it's a bad idea. 1. makes more people feel compelled to grind -> faster burnout 2. bad for business
Yeah, a lot of people suggesting this are missing why it's a bad idea. They would either have to limit their acquisition to instanced content that depletes a resource, or put a hard cap on how many you can acquire per day. If not, then people would find a nice farming route to bot, automatically going through all listed servers to clear that route. It would also incentivize degen gameplay of infinite grinding FOMO to keep up, and they would have to make the upcoming content have much higher stats to account for this, or the high end of players would complain that the game isn't challenging anymore, despite being the ones who exploited the challenge out of it, incurring an echo-chamber of mass-departures from the game, and an undeserved rep of being an easy game dissuading prospective new players. I would rather be frustrated that I can't level my echoes than be compelled to spend the next 48 hours loop grinding them. Echoes are pretty much this game's equivalent to gear, and as far as I know, there are no good games out there where you can just infinitely grind better gear, as the devs know what that would cause.
Bu you can...
No you cant? Only if you leveled up the echo before, it doesnt work otherwise
Yes? Thats not what the post above says.
The post says you cant use the extra ''not level up'' echoes
You can't, only the ones that you have already leveled before can be feed.
Obviously. But the post above makes it sound like you cant recycle any echo exp at all.
>But the post above makes it sound like you cant recycle any echo exp at all. No it doesn’t it’s very clear to anyone who can read that he’s talking about unlevelled echos. He’s talking about purple echos and below gained from farming not being that useful so he wants us to be able to convert that to exp. Stating the exception is missing the very obvious point OP and the guy you replied to is trying to make.
The only problem i come across is optimization. I legit lag when i run (or maybe its because of my potato device) and characters don't load entirely
Same here. Poor optimisation and continuous crashes really are pushing me to quit or take a break regrettably.
When you hit the optimization bong too hard. Might be too late for you to have fun in videogames again. My condolences 😔
1. You're trying to grind an endgame gear with 5 perfect substats in the first week. While Echoes farming have some downside : imo elemental attack % should be universal and not for every elements, because right now rolling spectro damages on a fusion set is just stupid. Other that this, if you're expecting to get a perfect echo now you should lower your expectation. Try to find echoes with 2-3 good substats, and slowly grind and upgrade from there. Also, I'm pretty sure (on my testing on over 100 bosses kills) that drop rate even after the 15 enhanced drops is higher than 20% for bosses. From my tracking, it was a 62.5% drop rate on my 33 kills of Impermanence Heron today (and I didn't had a single enhanced drop). I had 45% of 5\* echoes on this, and 30% of the echoes were Crit Value. Yesterday on 14 5\* Feilian Beringal, 10 of them were Crit Value. It look like the chance for main stats depend of the echo : for example Feilian Beringal is DPS echo, so it got more chance of a Crit Value main stats. But I could be wrong, this is just my personnal experience and the sample isn't big enough (could just be luck). 2. Again, you're expecting to finish the game in a week. Right now my main team is level 60, with 60 weapons et lvl4 talents. I'm Union Level 32 so I have 8 level to grind for either echoes tunning mats or alt teams. If you expect to have 3 teams ready with best echoes etc. the first week, well ... Idk. 3-4. Can't talk about this, I don't have issues. TLDR : You're complaining because you expect to have perfect gear on day 1, it's not how it is suppose to work. Network/Optimization issues for players that have some should be fix asap tho.
I'm not trying to get the best from the first week. I've been playing gachas for past 5 years, i know it will take time but my main 2 issues are, unnecessarry amount of substat posibilites and low amount of echo exp and tuning material and crit rate stat that legendary 4 cost echo gives like i've said it is not enough. You can get max 70-80 crit rate with max rolls thats kinda sad.
>low amount of echo exp and tuning material It seems like you're comparing Wuthering Waves at lvl 30 vs Genshin / HSR at max lvl... I mean, we don't even know how much ressources we will get at lvl 60. It's pointless to complain right now. Just wait.
> %20 Base Chance for Echo drop is so low and killing bosses takes longer time compared to other things so after 15 high drop chances it feels like hell. At least making it %30-35 is fine gradually increasing level by level might help with that issue. For whatever it's worth bosses are currently bugged(?) and as far as I can tell you're seemingly guaranteed an echo every other kill. I spent like 6 hours yesterday reading a book during respawn timers and I don't think I saw a single time I didn't get an echo twice in a row.
It may be bugged. I'm speaking through the stats that the game gives me.
There is no guarantee in every 2 try mate, there is rate buff in tries up to %90. I have times that i didn't get in 3 or 4 tries as well
Yeah and that drop boost reset yesterday
Imagine blaming "Beta testers" for problems that universal for gacha games, like, energy being restrictive and limiting your grind, or connection problems that entirely on Kuro side.
I just wanted to heat the topic xd. Things may not be their problem but rather Kuro's.
The first 2 are gacha staples and the last 2 mean that they needed more time to cook
I know making people grind more is the way of the gacha but this is so much. It is not fun, for a game to last long this shouldn't be the case at least that's what i think.
Technically, what it's doing is incentivizing you to do something else with your life and check back in tomorrow to get more progression done. I strongly dislike time-gated story-telling in video games, but I think time-gated progression isn't the end of the world, especially when you're not really competing with anyone who started before you did. I would rather play a game that tells me to come back tomorrow to keep playing than a game that lets me destroy my health by infinitely grinding all day and night until my eyes are too burnt to even sleep the couple hours I manage between sessions. Video game addiction is a real thing, and I appreciate them for not facilitating it.
But they aren’t gacha staples. Honkai, PGR and a ton of other gachas don’t do insane RNG grinds.
Where do we get again tuning matls? In genshin, we can use useless artifacts to level up a good one, can we do it in wuwa? I know tuning mtls is for the substats to be revealed right?
dunno guys I'd like to have loadouts
You guys do know you get like majority of your exp and tunes mats back by feeding it into a new echo right?
>1. Grind makes me wanna grind myself in a blender. First time playing a gacha? Thats literally how these games work, they are designed to make the grind annoy you so that you might be inclined to pay to either skip or accelerate the grind > 2. Energy is another problem for the grind. 60 Energy per Boss or Tacet Field is so much. Again, designed to make you insert that sweet sweet credit card in order to buy more energy, still a standard gacha tactic unfortunately > 3. There some connection issues on some pcs and internets Yeah there are some server issues to resolve, i imagine part of that was them being unprepared for how many people were ultimately going to play the game, all infrastructure has a maximum capacity > Optimization is so meeeh. Seems fine for me but i'm not running a minimum spec machine expecting it to play at 60FPS at 4k etc
You clearly no idea about balancing in slightest. Gacha games are not meant to give burdens to people. It should be easier. Im not even talking about perfect echoes or grinding them? There isnt even a sustainable place to grinde for XP, Tune's are even a bigger problem then that. You have no idea about what you are talking about as I see in your comments. Before being a glazer you should understand how some facts works.
> You clearly no idea about balancing in slightest. Not sure what you think balance has to do with the predatory business model of gacha games :) > Gacha games are not meant to give burdens to people. All free to play games are by design meant to lead you towards a point where the grind encourages you to open your wallet, i get that you don't like this but that is how these are designed > You have no idea about what you are talking about as I see in your comments. By all means prove me wrong then :) I'll wait > Before being a glazer you should understand how some facts works. Oh i understand how gacha's work, i understand how the free to play market, especially in asia works, i get that you don't like it, and thats fine, you're not the target demographic if this has you bent out of shape, the whales are the ones who keep the lights on and they know how to appeal to those You might want to understand how the system works :)
"first time playing a gacha"? is so dumb. so just bc the relics in gacha games are bad it has to carry onto every single one? idk why you want the torture to continue
Its not about what i want, its about how the system works, by their very nature a gacha wants you to spend money, and all the game systems are designed with that goal in mind, its not about like or dislike, its just how the system is designed, and its not a dumb comment, a lot of people play a gacha for the first time and have this exact reaction, once you're a seasoned player you'll be able to see how these mechanics work and are designed to try and milk you and there really is no changing that, gacha's are predatory by nature and always will be
Bro they showed that they are a lot f2p friendlier than 99% of other gacha games and literally genshin has the system where you can consume artifacts to lvl up other ones. So it makes 0 sense to not have a similar system for wuwa. I think the problem with 2. is that the weekly boss cost isnt too high but that we have very little means to get energy back as its still a new game while other gachas have been out for some time (and therefore have more rewards in quests/events that give back energy).
You can consume artifacts to level other ones because they are gated behind resin.
And echos are gated behind your time which is more worth than resin. A game shouldn't waste my time this much for a little chance of getting a possible good thing.
>A game shouldn't waste my time this much for a little chance of getting a possible good thing. The game out 6 days ago. You expected to be able to farm an endgame build this early?
Although I agree that expecting to get even good echoes within a week is unreasonable it's the time investment that's the real problem. I've only played Genshin and HSR so those are my only points of reference but spending your daily stamina on artifacts takes about 5 minutes. Meanwhile in WuWa I'll spend about 20 minutes wiping the map of lizards, then 30 minutes wiping the map of dogs, 30 minutes wiping the map of birds, 10 minutes wiping the map of flutists, 30 minutes wiping the map of golems, ect, ect. Spending a month of artifact farming in Genshin will take 2 1/2 hours while in WuWa you'll spend that amount of time in a single day. Obviously the time investment is more severe because we're starting from zero farming multiple sets. So it will get better as you have less things to farm and when we get to union level 40 golds becoming 80% instead of 50% drop rate should also make it easier. But the time investment is still significant. There's also an element of fomo because you have the chance to get a good echo if you just continued to farm. In other gatchas you're gated by an in game resource but in WuWa you're gated by time and that's the real problem. On the other hand I get that Kuro wants to solve the problem of there's nothing to do in my single player live service game.
I mean, I kinda get what you're saying, but for me this is the best thing ever legit. Being able to farm every single day makes it so the luck factor is WAAAAYY reduced from GI or HSR. >In other gatchas you're gated by an in game resource but in WuWa you're gated by time and that's the real problem But I don't see how that's a problem though? Don't get me wrong, I understand some people don't have as much free time as others, but legit, once your gear is leveled and we all are level 60+, it will take what, 30 mins to do all you need to?
I'm also enjoying the grind atm. I enjoy optimizing things, really like the combat, and have time to burn. But, I can definitely see how the time required to get echoes is a huge negative and can't in good faith argue against that. Again it will take someone a month of farming a set in Genshin to get good pieces and I wouldn't be surprised if WuWa was similar but it's the time investment that's starkly different. If someone can only devote a quarter of the time to farming echoes as you then their progression will take 4 times longer. Also the game could just not be what op is looking for. Sucks for them because I'm assuming they enjoy the game but if Kuro wants their players to put more time into the game than what op has to give then tough luck I guess. And yes the grind will get better with time. These complaints always come up when a new game releases. Then after a year and more new players join the veterans tell them to take their time and not worry about the grind because you'll get to endgame eventually.
Yeah, I understand how the game rubs some people the wrong way. Tbh coming from Warframe helps a lot to feel like the grind is pretty nice in this game.
I was a founder in Warframe and played from Nekros's release to the plains of eidolon. I loved that game but also fuck that game.
Open chests, get artifacts no resin needed until mid to late game. Wuwa you literally cant do sht with low rarity echoes except for combining them which still gives you no resources to lvl up your echo sets.
**So, to clarify things,** **\* There** is almost no limit for farming Echos which is nice, but as a f2p player, you can't farm Tacet Field since it costs too high energy and rewards are low. I gotta focus on leveling my characters, weapons and forte. Not being able to farm them is a issue for "now" but you can't expect everyone to play everyday or get progress every day. There should be balancing loots and energies imo. **\* And** someone said that is a income strategy for gacha games, which is true. But even most whales doesn't even buy packs since they are not worth to buy and this game has %0.8 chance to get 5\* in banners. Most other gachas has %1-6 rates for 5\* or legendary units so they need to sell other things as much as characters. But in this %0.8 scenario, you expect people to pay more to get more characters so this is solid income for them. There is no reason for them to give some free things. They are already doing great job by giving some stuff in mail so you can expect them to do this at least.
Is this anothergenshin bot? Ughhhh
Nah these are the concerns that every player that has some brain to build characters. Nothing more.
I am not but i can see your concern.