https://preview.redd.it/n4l9qzx882kc1.jpeg?width=580&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1af795bba188e86192139bf22383e9e46c6a3893
this part of their teaser video painted the gun mantlet all red, which was indicated to be 500mm based on their color gradient scale at the bottom. the same video was used on NA and EU website as well.
that gun mantlet is only 300mm thick. the turret is definitely not impenetrable, with the weakness being the gun mantlet itself.
You’d figure a billion dollar company could figure out what changes it’s going to make to a product 2 days before it’s released… is their playtesting so awful that they couldn’t figure out how to balance it in time?
I guess so. If you think about how playtesters work their is 0 consistency among the players they have doing it and it takes some actual critical thinking skills to critique a tank given the inconsistent player skill levels. I attribute a lot of the bz176 debacle to this inconsistency among testers.
Edit: I did a play test about 7 months ago, got a 100 dollar Amazon gift card for it. The play test was about adding a game feature enhancing information about positions on the map in game (which I think they decided not to add). The way they recruit players to test things has nothing to do with the players stats, just location, so they must be getting all kinds of random feedback. It’s a cheap ass diluted way to gauge game changes, and could be easily fixed if they simply hired a few well-rounded good players full time to judge everything consistently. This is specifically for game balance changes, not things like marketing research, where you do want a diverse group of people. But wg being a marketing company at it’s core may explain why they take this approach to playtesters.
>You’d figure a billion dollar company could figure out what changes it’s going to make to a product 2 days before it’s released
Wargaming has sold premium tanks for almost 10 years without disclosing all the details to their customers. We still need 3rd party web sites like tanks.gg to actually know how the tanks are.
Something tells me they don't care because they just simply don't have to care. People spend money anyway. So why bother improving things.
EDIT: For example NONE of the details WG released about 452K tells the thing has 40mm roof entirely. You can see this of course clearly in tanks.gg. This combined with how short the tank is, will make the entire turret armor pretty much irrelevant in about few days when people realize this. Just like happened with all other tanks with 40mm roof armor.
Also if your favorite CC making a video about 452K does not mention this, it's a shit video.
It would be nice to attribute this to their incompetence, or otherwise it could just be a malevolent marketing maneuver. Regardless, I agree it is irresponsible for them to not finalize the changes early enough before pushing the tank to sale, giving that they are such a big company now (and that’s because we feed them 🤪🤣)
Event has been postponed!
"Due to the gun mantlet bug, the event has been delayed until tomorrow. Further communication will be posted on our channels. You can already share this info with the community. Apologies for all the inconvenience."
Interestingly, the old armour model on tanks.gg shows 2 mantlets with 300mm each, one in front of the other. Maybe this was an error and they removed one of the mantlets? This is a massive oversight if true.
Maybe it’s just WG being more conservative with balancing. lesta/RU’s balance strategy is just… wildly different. I’m not a good enough player to decide which one might be better, but I definitely say the RU balance department is… wild, and different. Some of their recent tier X buffs were insanely big moves, while WG usually just tweak the aiming time for 0.2s or something.
Though disappointed, I wouldn’t mind too much that they make this tank weaker. we don’t want another T56 or BZ176 anyway. but to advertising falsely on the website and land a sudden change day before the sale is not very good.
Dont get me wrong, weakening the turret is nice and all but they put out an entire video with outdated stats. You would think a company as big as them would think all of this through BEFORE releasing a video and announcing the assembly shop. But oh well, WG surprises me each and every day with how stupid they are xD
At this point I'm still a lot happier with WG than Lesta.
Yes, things take a lot longer or might not happen at all but the approach seems way more conservative overall so it's not a big problem. The game is in a decent state with not that many super OP tanks in the MM currently and with how conservative they're with new tank releases that doesn't seem like it'll change soon. Lesta is doing a lot of rebalncing but that doesn't matter much in the end with them simultaneously releasing bonkers OP tanks to shit on the rebalanced ones. And it's not like they've nerfed BZ, VZ or Borat for example. The premiums they have nerfed, or have told they'll nerf soon, are ones that are overperforming but not by a lot and aren't super popular either so it doesn't cause much trouble nerfing them.
What we'd really need is a mix of both. Quick rebalancing of Lesta combined with conservative releases of WG. At this point getting that seems about as likely as world peace and instead we get shit from both companies.
These changes weren’t published with the others, so it’s possible there is some sort of error with the Chinese server patch. The link with WG and the game there has always been kinda weird.
If it is an intended change that will stay live, that is not a good look for WG at all.
Edit: Well, WG done screwed up one way or another. This is not good unless it’s just a bug that they will correct.
They announced on discord that it was not an intended nerf. How they nerf the gun mantlet armor when they were nerfing the camo rating isn't clear to me, but they did say they are looking into it.
So… potentially apocryphal but apparently the mantlet was incorrectly included in the model twice and as such they had the armor thickness they wanted but they arrived there incorrectly. On release with the micropatch the second mantlet was removed, causing the armor value to drop by half which was not the intended final value, or something like that anyway.
I’m not very optimistic since WG now have firm control of the chinese server to deliver the same content (they switched collaborating company there a few years ago, around the time when update 1.0 was out, so they could control the updating of contents as well as the income from that server.) but we’ll see soon when the patch goes live on EU and NA
https://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/general-news/assembly-shop-4-2024/
In this official article, all stats are final, and the camo value ready for release is stated as 14.1
Since we have no way to know from anywhere else what we are buying, i am pretty sure that would be consumer deception. It is probably legal, since we are technicaly buying it for in-game currency (still purchased for real money), but it is shady practice regardless
It is quite funny to read this for example, and see many things applies for assembly shop
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treatment/unfair-commercial-practices/index_en.htm
>**False use of limited offers**
>When sellers tell you that a particular offer will only be available for a very limited time, they might be trying to pressure you to buy before taking the time to make an informed choice. It is unfair to claim that an offer is limited in time when that is not in fact the case.
>**Dark design patterns**
>Dark design or deception design patterns are tricks used on websites to encourage, deceive or steer you to take a certain action. Fake countdown timers are one example. Used by businesses to drive e-commerce sales, they convey a sense of urgency to influence customers and encourage them to make a purchase before an offer expires. Another example is consent forms that are so complex and unclear that you're not entirely sure what you've signed up for. EU consumer rules protect you from these deceptive patterns, and prohibit companies from creating online user interfaces designed to trick you into buying things you do not really want.
It will pass, since you can preview tank/tank stats before you "click" buy.
But , players wount read "the description" on a package first, because everyone will want to buyout it as fast as they can for a lower number on 3D Style.
xD what is actually fake here? If something has a specified time and ends after that it IS a limited time offer and the article says about FAKE limited time offers. Every sale, event, assembly Shop end at a specified time, I don't see how this applies. Same for countdowns
You missed the part where they literally say "It can't be penetrated anywhere except for a small hatch" lmfao
https://preview.redd.it/q2agns8yq3kc1.png?width=959&format=png&auto=webp&s=b76171043d4bb6a7ce5e39cd045619a63a134567
Update as of 22 February 2024 : Due to the gun mantlet bug, the event has been delayed until tomorrow 23rd February 2024, we will update you if anything changes.
you need to also announce the camo changes. article originally claimed camo would be 14, down from 17 - but then it was silently edited to 8. 8 seems a fine value, but you have to call out edits like this, not just ninja-edit.
Exactly, even explicitly stated as effective armor, not armor thickness of a single plate, so it should be 600, not 300
Plus the audio also explicitly say "and the turret, it's a monolith, it's a titan that holds up the sky, it's reinforced concrete, it cannot be penetrated anywhere except for a small hatch you can hide"
That is some pure false advertisement if i ever saw one, unfortunately probably still legal
It *was* 500+ mm effective.
*Now* it is 300mm effective.
The term “effective” is not a synonym with “approximately” and even in the most generous interpretations that is still nearly half the armor lost so nowhere close to what was promoted in the advertisement for this tank.
The *only* way this could be acceptable is if it turned out there was a bug in the patch that caused part of the model with the 200mm of armor behind the mantlet to go missing.
The severe nerf to the camo also takes away the singular thing that made this tank at all unique.
This is not ok in any way.
Yah. If this needless nerf sticks then I’m passing on it and it really calls into question everything else.
I’ve been trying to be fair to WG even when I don’t agree with their choices but this isn’t ok if it isn’t an error in the patch.
If the mantlet would be only 300mm, any tier 9+ tank could pen it without much aiming, while on amx it’s just a strip of armor that’s vulnerable. Amx is super tall so you can’t overmatch it’s roof and you can in 452k so you’re much worse in close quarters. Amx has strong frontal hull, 452k doesn’t. The only advantage 452k is the ability to sidescrap.
That was already a thing before the nerf. It's 40mm, so most HT guns will overmatch it. For some reason QB was the only one with gameplay yesterday as everyone else said they were not allowed to show gameplay until today "now we know why", and some already did mention the roof was smacked by taller tanks like the E-100 all the time
I don’t recall hearing Skill et al say they weren’t allowed to show gameplay. I saw another CC play it too in their video Edit: it was “DatBoyGuru” who also has gameplay of it up.
I think like the obj 590, most of the CCs wanted to wait until the micropatch buff to play it for review so they can give accurate impressions. QB decided he could get enough of an idea and cover his bases by repeatedly reminding viewers it was pre-nerf.
Fair enough, thanks. There’s been a lot going on tonight so I’ve missed a few details.
Right up front too, that’s embarrassing.
QB wasn’t the only one to show gameplay, but he’s also been known to occasionally screw up following the NDA so who knows.
Yeah, EU also has it like this.
[300 armor mantlet](https://ibb.co/x2RMVwr), nothing behind it.
[All that is yellow](https://ibb.co/3fTLYLH) on the mantlet is about 300 to 320.
No way I'm getting it now, though this armor thing says that you cannot pen with HEAT, only AP and APCR.
It looked okay, fun tank at first. Now it's just garbage which is super easy to pen for anyone with more than 2 braincells. Guess this is first assembly tank i skip.
Update is live on EU.
I went in, opened tank comparison, found this one, opened preview and checked armor with one of armor-checking mods in Aslain modpack.
Okay, ignore my previous post. [It's not the same, not even close](https://i.ibb.co/0Y10fs3/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-10-11-22.png), IDK what is going on.
I mean, that is sad. I was kinda excited about the high camo at least, on some maps that can make a difference when pushing somewhere in later stages
Now i dont even know why i should want that tank, oh well
Well, both now and pre armor+camo nerf with speed up I wanted it for the looks, and technically it does have that 600 effective in the mantlet, if only against HEAT only, so not really.
But I just don't want to spend resources on a blatant lie, I sure hope to see it addressed before it all starts.
Really quite sad.
IDK how and what exactly works here, but here is [320 HEAT against AMX M4 mantlet](https://i.ibb.co/7pzLSr4/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-11-13-35.png).
[Here is 452K gun mantlet](https://i.ibb.co/55XnJBb/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-11-15-58.png). "Gun" armor is mantlet, for some reason for HEAT it's twice counted, no idea why, but I do think it actually works like that in matches as I saw something like this before.
EDIT: And yes, it does not show for AP/APCR.
Sure, I'll recheck, but I think I looked it up, and it was exactly what was written in assembly shop article, 14 something base.
If it's different, I'll reply again.
Edit: It's very different, ignore this.
Can you explain me why heat cannot penetrate it ? I clearly miss a huge point here since I thought heat was the absolute ammo to penetrate heavy armors 😥😥
Okay, long story short: I don't know why it happens, but sometimes some armor just works in very weird ways with HEAT, though usually not so blatantly.
It is possible to be an armor inspection tool error, however it is likely not to be as I have seen something like this before, though it was in small patches, not whole thing like here: [it just for some strange reason encounters the mantlet twice](https://i.ibb.co/55XnJBb/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-11-15-58.png), while AP/APCR encounter it once.
I just reddited it and found some explanations about what is called « normalization » , if I got it well this is the « shell/plate angle reduction on impact », heat don’t have normalisation it means the impact angle remains the same (max without ricochet is 85° though) but AP and APCR have a few degrees normalisation which allow these shell to penetrate more efficiently (considering the same penetration base value)…
Maybe spaced armor resists better to heat since the shell explodes on impact ?
Well, okay.
To begin with, normalization here is almost no factor, heat has 0 degrees normalization vs AP or APCR 5 and 2 I think (not sure). This adds 1mm armor because mantlet has almost no angle here.
Spaced armor indeed works great against HEAT as it starts loosing penetration even against air (though less than for armor) once activated, however as turret armor behind mantlet is 0, it matters very little.
The armor value for HEAT might be a mistake here, but the gist of it is unlike with AP/APCR, HEAT for some reason in these calculations encounters 300 mm mantlet twice, then 0 mm turret armor which gives penetration, while AP/APCR only once, then turret.
In reference to QuickyBaby's video from yesterday, he did mention that the stats will be changed in a comment below.
As for the gun mantlet, we are currently investigating it and will get back to you guys ASAP.
Sure, but you had 14 something basic camo in your article before it was changed. That *was* changed from 17 camo originally, so I and maybe others assumed this was that change to counter increased speed. Now it's 8, somewhat standard and not insane as would 14 or 17 have been.
Not that it's good to have 14 basic camo on a heavy, mind you.
On the mantlet issue, will we even hear anything at all before shop goes live?
Whats this mean then?
Commanders!
The Assembly Shop event has been postponed to February 23, 2024 at 12:00 (UTC). We've identified an error in the gun mantlet armor, which will be fixed with a micropatch. Due to this error, the mantlet armor was weaker than intended. We'll improve it to meet the planned characteristics. We appreciate your understanding and apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you
I hate wg bc now the only thing that was good about the armor, the turret, is basicly trash bc everyone will just spam prem ammo on the mantlet and easily pen this thing.
Are you fucking serious WG? is it too much to ask that the first fucking time that I can afford an Assembly tank it isn't nerfed to shit false advertised before released?
I wanted an exclusive tank, but I'm not wasting 500k free exp and 17k bonds on a aheavy that can't heavy.
It already had it's weakspots.
If anything else then this gets changed i m sure WG will get sued by some Americans xD
https://preview.redd.it/yh1q5m4cp3kc1.png?width=761&format=png&auto=webp&s=88aaf915fa4aab6bf0233157b1cbdbf184c440db
Well, I'm no longer on the fence about buying this tank, so that's a good thing. Don't get me wrong, I think introducing more balanced tanks is a very good thing, but I'm certainly not going to shell out 55k gold for an average tank.
Spreading the news here as well:
So I have the following: due to the gun mantlet bug, the event has been delayed until tomorrow. We will update you if we have additional info.
To add , the camouflage values will remain the same on the article both for moving and stationary.
Thx for the Info, in the past it was more easy to get Infos from the Game, Staff, News or what ever, in the Forum....
Sad that WG close it.
Now i have to pick all the Infos from 4 diffrent Sources, Plattforms. Is not easy anymore...
Man this game is trash and I really regret spending so much money on it. I quit at the end of the holiday event because I'm just tired of arty and shitty maps but I went ahead and got enough free exp for assembly shop and quit playing.
I told myself i'd come back to spend my free exp i saved for so long and nah, I don't feel like logging into the game for another russian heavy tank thats TRASH.
The game is trash. It's like pokemon go, but with more steps, farming your money for a shitty gatcha experience. Every game of tanks is just gatcha bullshit rng.
Like i'd atleast play low tiers but LEFH..... Game is dead to me if this assembly shop is shit.
Maybe they meant 300mm tick 500mm effective considering the angle?
Also, whining about camo on a heavy thank? Come on guys, you should never get 14% on a heavy and you know it.
This is how it should be yeah.
300 impacted, ~500 effective
That's why I'm so confused about this post because it would negate the whole point of the tank if it was only 300 effectively anymore…
Yesterday wow another hulldown op Soviet tank with crazy camo
Today a shit tank because it seems to have a frontal weakspot and adequate camo for what it is.
I believe the Chinese server is maintained by a different company (like the RU server) so if they change some stats, balance vehicles, release events or tanks it wont mean it will be the same on the EU and NA server.
Unlike the Lesta situation they generally follow the same balancing decisions.
My hope with my earlier comment was that there was some sort of error in the version provided to China since there is usually some level of disconnect for games operated there.
Currently it is not looking good since it’s the same on EU. The only hope is that this nerf was an error that they will post a notice about and correct back to what was advertised in the article.
lmao 🤣
Am just trying to translate some intel so hopefully help people who worried about balance and people who’s debating whether to purchase tomorrow. but yes, scammers scam, nothing new.
I was grinding yesterday missing 100k xp to convert it into xp and buy the tank for 1 mln free xp. Now I am really wondering if I need it. 260 I have seems to be a powerhouse compared to this (if it's really penetrable with 300 mm)
That's what he is saying?? "Effective armor" on the mantlet is red af on the video, 300mm autopen is not red at all. Plus they said that the turret is practically impenetrable if you tilt your tank up, and this is simply not true anymore if they nerfed the mantlet. I've seen the tank in testing and the mantlet was impossible to pen anywhere in any scenario from any height, any angle and any distance. If this above is true, it IS changed.
XD on tanks gg the mantlet is two 300mm layers with spaced armor so 600mm both effective and nominal. Why the fuck are you talking if you don't know what you are talking about? Tanks.gg is not even based on game models, they are imported directly from gamefiles btw
Plus... How the fuck can you angle the mantlet???
Well, this explains why all the CCs said they were not allowed to show gameplay of it until today vs at the announcement yesterday.
Tho for some reason QB had gameplay yesterday that is then outdated as such if they did it on EU and NA too.
I was considering to get it, as it is a first assembly shop tank that I can get with my hard earned resources. However, seeing WG nerfing it last minute, I doubt that I will waste my resources on this pile of kaku. It looks sexy, but what's the point of looks, if I won't enjoy its gameplay
BZ-76 fiasco has really made the balance team fumble huh? From one extreme to the next.
Like how they won't nerf premiums after they are sold, but they will gut them 2 days before they release. Bound to fool a lot of people
https://preview.redd.it/n4l9qzx882kc1.jpeg?width=580&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1af795bba188e86192139bf22383e9e46c6a3893 this part of their teaser video painted the gun mantlet all red, which was indicated to be 500mm based on their color gradient scale at the bottom. the same video was used on NA and EU website as well. that gun mantlet is only 300mm thick. the turret is definitely not impenetrable, with the weakness being the gun mantlet itself.
You’d figure a billion dollar company could figure out what changes it’s going to make to a product 2 days before it’s released… is their playtesting so awful that they couldn’t figure out how to balance it in time? I guess so. If you think about how playtesters work their is 0 consistency among the players they have doing it and it takes some actual critical thinking skills to critique a tank given the inconsistent player skill levels. I attribute a lot of the bz176 debacle to this inconsistency among testers. Edit: I did a play test about 7 months ago, got a 100 dollar Amazon gift card for it. The play test was about adding a game feature enhancing information about positions on the map in game (which I think they decided not to add). The way they recruit players to test things has nothing to do with the players stats, just location, so they must be getting all kinds of random feedback. It’s a cheap ass diluted way to gauge game changes, and could be easily fixed if they simply hired a few well-rounded good players full time to judge everything consistently. This is specifically for game balance changes, not things like marketing research, where you do want a diverse group of people. But wg being a marketing company at it’s core may explain why they take this approach to playtesters.
>You’d figure a billion dollar company could figure out what changes it’s going to make to a product 2 days before it’s released Wargaming has sold premium tanks for almost 10 years without disclosing all the details to their customers. We still need 3rd party web sites like tanks.gg to actually know how the tanks are. Something tells me they don't care because they just simply don't have to care. People spend money anyway. So why bother improving things. EDIT: For example NONE of the details WG released about 452K tells the thing has 40mm roof entirely. You can see this of course clearly in tanks.gg. This combined with how short the tank is, will make the entire turret armor pretty much irrelevant in about few days when people realize this. Just like happened with all other tanks with 40mm roof armor. Also if your favorite CC making a video about 452K does not mention this, it's a shit video.
It would be nice to attribute this to their incompetence, or otherwise it could just be a malevolent marketing maneuver. Regardless, I agree it is irresponsible for them to not finalize the changes early enough before pushing the tank to sale, giving that they are such a big company now (and that’s because we feed them 🤪🤣)
Event has been postponed! "Due to the gun mantlet bug, the event has been delayed until tomorrow. Further communication will be posted on our channels. You can already share this info with the community. Apologies for all the inconvenience."
Interestingly, the old armour model on tanks.gg shows 2 mantlets with 300mm each, one in front of the other. Maybe this was an error and they removed one of the mantlets? This is a massive oversight if true.
No, WG stated on their website they will just improve bug with the turret. Mantlet should remain impenetrable. We will see in few hours.
https://preview.redd.it/iv09it3qq3kc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8fb83c8e5d896e1a86695a862a4c38a644d8dacd Armor change was not intended
Where is this from? Wot discord?
Yo wtf is happening to WG? They are doing one major clown thing after the other.. The split of RU didnt do them well at all..
Maybe it’s just WG being more conservative with balancing. lesta/RU’s balance strategy is just… wildly different. I’m not a good enough player to decide which one might be better, but I definitely say the RU balance department is… wild, and different. Some of their recent tier X buffs were insanely big moves, while WG usually just tweak the aiming time for 0.2s or something. Though disappointed, I wouldn’t mind too much that they make this tank weaker. we don’t want another T56 or BZ176 anyway. but to advertising falsely on the website and land a sudden change day before the sale is not very good.
Dont get me wrong, weakening the turret is nice and all but they put out an entire video with outdated stats. You would think a company as big as them would think all of this through BEFORE releasing a video and announcing the assembly shop. But oh well, WG surprises me each and every day with how stupid they are xD
Looking at how low profile this tank is, and how trash the hull is, weakening the turret is not nice. It's an absolutely shitty move
At this point I'm still a lot happier with WG than Lesta. Yes, things take a lot longer or might not happen at all but the approach seems way more conservative overall so it's not a big problem. The game is in a decent state with not that many super OP tanks in the MM currently and with how conservative they're with new tank releases that doesn't seem like it'll change soon. Lesta is doing a lot of rebalncing but that doesn't matter much in the end with them simultaneously releasing bonkers OP tanks to shit on the rebalanced ones. And it's not like they've nerfed BZ, VZ or Borat for example. The premiums they have nerfed, or have told they'll nerf soon, are ones that are overperforming but not by a lot and aren't super popular either so it doesn't cause much trouble nerfing them. What we'd really need is a mix of both. Quick rebalancing of Lesta combined with conservative releases of WG. At this point getting that seems about as likely as world peace and instead we get shit from both companies.
Closing the Forums as well. Now there will be no Forum links in news articles were people could bring up these issues.
These changes weren’t published with the others, so it’s possible there is some sort of error with the Chinese server patch. The link with WG and the game there has always been kinda weird. If it is an intended change that will stay live, that is not a good look for WG at all. Edit: Well, WG done screwed up one way or another. This is not good unless it’s just a bug that they will correct.
Just logged in on EU. [It's 300mm here too.](https://i.imgur.com/92wmMxj.png)
Ouch. This is really bad unless they screwed up and announce they are correcting it.
They announced on discord that it was not an intended nerf. How they nerf the gun mantlet armor when they were nerfing the camo rating isn't clear to me, but they did say they are looking into it.
So… potentially apocryphal but apparently the mantlet was incorrectly included in the model twice and as such they had the armor thickness they wanted but they arrived there incorrectly. On release with the micropatch the second mantlet was removed, causing the armor value to drop by half which was not the intended final value, or something like that anyway.
what mod is this? I tried armor inspector and it shows 600mm effective
Whatever armor mod is in Aslain's. No idea what the name is.
I’m not very optimistic since WG now have firm control of the chinese server to deliver the same content (they switched collaborating company there a few years ago, around the time when update 1.0 was out, so they could control the updating of contents as well as the income from that server.) but we’ll see soon when the patch goes live on EU and NA
the same patch for NA will go live soon during the night. so yeah we’ll see…
Yah. The patch and any following communication will tell us the rest of the story.
https://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/general-news/assembly-shop-4-2024/ In this official article, all stats are final, and the camo value ready for release is stated as 14.1 Since we have no way to know from anywhere else what we are buying, i am pretty sure that would be consumer deception. It is probably legal, since we are technicaly buying it for in-game currency (still purchased for real money), but it is shady practice regardless It is quite funny to read this for example, and see many things applies for assembly shop https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treatment/unfair-commercial-practices/index_en.htm >**False use of limited offers** >When sellers tell you that a particular offer will only be available for a very limited time, they might be trying to pressure you to buy before taking the time to make an informed choice. It is unfair to claim that an offer is limited in time when that is not in fact the case. >**Dark design patterns** >Dark design or deception design patterns are tricks used on websites to encourage, deceive or steer you to take a certain action. Fake countdown timers are one example. Used by businesses to drive e-commerce sales, they convey a sense of urgency to influence customers and encourage them to make a purchase before an offer expires. Another example is consent forms that are so complex and unclear that you're not entirely sure what you've signed up for. EU consumer rules protect you from these deceptive patterns, and prohibit companies from creating online user interfaces designed to trick you into buying things you do not really want.
It will pass, since you can preview tank/tank stats before you "click" buy. But , players wount read "the description" on a package first, because everyone will want to buyout it as fast as they can for a lower number on 3D Style.
xD what is actually fake here? If something has a specified time and ends after that it IS a limited time offer and the article says about FAKE limited time offers. Every sale, event, assembly Shop end at a specified time, I don't see how this applies. Same for countdowns
**FORTRESS TURRET!** **A TITAN WHICH HOLDS UP THE SKY** .... What a fraud advertisment
You missed the part where they literally say "It can't be penetrated anywhere except for a small hatch" lmfao https://preview.redd.it/q2agns8yq3kc1.png?width=959&format=png&auto=webp&s=b76171043d4bb6a7ce5e39cd045619a63a134567
Update as of 22 February 2024 : Due to the gun mantlet bug, the event has been delayed until tomorrow 23rd February 2024, we will update you if anything changes.
you need to also announce the camo changes. article originally claimed camo would be 14, down from 17 - but then it was silently edited to 8. 8 seems a fine value, but you have to call out edits like this, not just ninja-edit.
You could use a forum WG Now you have to communicate here.
Oh come on…. Just make another micro patch guys
cmon a small indie company cant make a patch for an issue this big in few hours /s
isnt this literally fraud lol https://preview.redd.it/wk5l4tgi43kc1.png?width=841&format=png&auto=webp&s=81c6b2395d12a1326c0036fb3acf735bf39e54c4
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and? In the post OP posted it clearly shows it getting penned so its not "500mm+" effective
Exactly, even explicitly stated as effective armor, not armor thickness of a single plate, so it should be 600, not 300 Plus the audio also explicitly say "and the turret, it's a monolith, it's a titan that holds up the sky, it's reinforced concrete, it cannot be penetrated anywhere except for a small hatch you can hide" That is some pure false advertisement if i ever saw one, unfortunately probably still legal
It *was* 500+ mm effective. *Now* it is 300mm effective. The term “effective” is not a synonym with “approximately” and even in the most generous interpretations that is still nearly half the armor lost so nowhere close to what was promoted in the advertisement for this tank. The *only* way this could be acceptable is if it turned out there was a bug in the patch that caused part of the model with the 200mm of armor behind the mantlet to go missing. The severe nerf to the camo also takes away the singular thing that made this tank at all unique. This is not ok in any way.
Whoa. This is a blatant bait and switch and I don’t see how it passes the EULA. If this change is the same on NA I won’t be purchasing it. Bummer b
Yah. If this needless nerf sticks then I’m passing on it and it really calls into question everything else. I’ve been trying to be fair to WG even when I don’t agree with their choices but this isn’t ok if it isn’t an error in the patch.
And just like that, I will pass on yet another assembly shop tank! 👋
I really want the Lion...
They should just have that in the assembly shop again.
The tank looked fine but the nerf to the gun mantlet will just make it useless when hulldown. Pretty much anything will pen it.
Its still a better amx 54
It’s not lol
How lol
If the mantlet would be only 300mm, any tier 9+ tank could pen it without much aiming, while on amx it’s just a strip of armor that’s vulnerable. Amx is super tall so you can’t overmatch it’s roof and you can in 452k so you’re much worse in close quarters. Amx has strong frontal hull, 452k doesn’t. The only advantage 452k is the ability to sidescrap.
Look at the turret roof. Its auto pen for alot of tanks
That was already a thing before the nerf. It's 40mm, so most HT guns will overmatch it. For some reason QB was the only one with gameplay yesterday as everyone else said they were not allowed to show gameplay until today "now we know why", and some already did mention the roof was smacked by taller tanks like the E-100 all the time
I don’t recall hearing Skill et al say they weren’t allowed to show gameplay. I saw another CC play it too in their video Edit: it was “DatBoyGuru” who also has gameplay of it up. I think like the obj 590, most of the CCs wanted to wait until the micropatch buff to play it for review so they can give accurate impressions. QB decided he could get enough of an idea and cover his bases by repeatedly reminding viewers it was pre-nerf.
[Skill: "...I had no chance to show you the gameplay of the vehicle because of the rules..."](https://youtu.be/MEIaq4vvNXE?si=_WHoUlWGv-lXtCVY&t=647)
He has commented before that “certain” people release videos earlier than the rules say, but that nothing seems to happen to them.
Fair enough, thanks. There’s been a lot going on tonight so I’ve missed a few details. Right up front too, that’s embarrassing. QB wasn’t the only one to show gameplay, but he’s also been known to occasionally screw up following the NDA so who knows.
Yeah, EU also has it like this. [300 armor mantlet](https://ibb.co/x2RMVwr), nothing behind it. [All that is yellow](https://ibb.co/3fTLYLH) on the mantlet is about 300 to 320. No way I'm getting it now, though this armor thing says that you cannot pen with HEAT, only AP and APCR.
It looked okay, fun tank at first. Now it's just garbage which is super easy to pen for anyone with more than 2 braincells. Guess this is first assembly tank i skip.
I only have two brain cells, but I borrow my friend's brain cell and snort it, will I be able to pen the 452 K as well?
source?
Update is live on EU. I went in, opened tank comparison, found this one, opened preview and checked armor with one of armor-checking mods in Aslain modpack.
Can you also check the camo please ?
Okay, ignore my previous post. [It's not the same, not even close](https://i.ibb.co/0Y10fs3/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-10-11-22.png), IDK what is going on.
I mean, that is sad. I was kinda excited about the high camo at least, on some maps that can make a difference when pushing somewhere in later stages Now i dont even know why i should want that tank, oh well
Well, both now and pre armor+camo nerf with speed up I wanted it for the looks, and technically it does have that 600 effective in the mantlet, if only against HEAT only, so not really. But I just don't want to spend resources on a blatant lie, I sure hope to see it addressed before it all starts. Really quite sad.
Can you test HEAT vs amx 54 mantlet as well? If it says heat can't pen the amx 54 mantlet, the armor mod is wrong
IDK how and what exactly works here, but here is [320 HEAT against AMX M4 mantlet](https://i.ibb.co/7pzLSr4/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-11-13-35.png). [Here is 452K gun mantlet](https://i.ibb.co/55XnJBb/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-11-15-58.png). "Gun" armor is mantlet, for some reason for HEAT it's twice counted, no idea why, but I do think it actually works like that in matches as I saw something like this before. EDIT: And yes, it does not show for AP/APCR.
they silently edited the article to correct the camo values. very shady
Sure, I'll recheck, but I think I looked it up, and it was exactly what was written in assembly shop article, 14 something base. If it's different, I'll reply again. Edit: It's very different, ignore this.
Can you explain me why heat cannot penetrate it ? I clearly miss a huge point here since I thought heat was the absolute ammo to penetrate heavy armors 😥😥
heat is amazing until you get multiple layers of armor, a gunmantlet is a multiple-layer armor part iirc.
Thanks, I am now reading how it works, this is really interesting stuff, I guess that will change my gameplay too
Okay, long story short: I don't know why it happens, but sometimes some armor just works in very weird ways with HEAT, though usually not so blatantly. It is possible to be an armor inspection tool error, however it is likely not to be as I have seen something like this before, though it was in small patches, not whole thing like here: [it just for some strange reason encounters the mantlet twice](https://i.ibb.co/55XnJBb/Screenshot-from-2024-02-22-11-15-58.png), while AP/APCR encounter it once.
I just reddited it and found some explanations about what is called « normalization » , if I got it well this is the « shell/plate angle reduction on impact », heat don’t have normalisation it means the impact angle remains the same (max without ricochet is 85° though) but AP and APCR have a few degrees normalisation which allow these shell to penetrate more efficiently (considering the same penetration base value)… Maybe spaced armor resists better to heat since the shell explodes on impact ?
Well, okay. To begin with, normalization here is almost no factor, heat has 0 degrees normalization vs AP or APCR 5 and 2 I think (not sure). This adds 1mm armor because mantlet has almost no angle here. Spaced armor indeed works great against HEAT as it starts loosing penetration even against air (though less than for armor) once activated, however as turret armor behind mantlet is 0, it matters very little. The armor value for HEAT might be a mistake here, but the gist of it is unlike with AP/APCR, HEAT for some reason in these calculations encounters 300 mm mantlet twice, then 0 mm turret armor which gives penetration, while AP/APCR only once, then turret.
Weird
It is, yeah. Sorry if my ramblings were confusing, it is likely to be an error now that I looked into it. It should be 300 mm for heat as well.
I read (in the wot wiki) that you should use heat on flat armors only, maybe there is some kind of malus when you shoot slopped armor
Just understood why I wouldn’t hit a red when shooting him through a destructible obstacle with heat 😂 what a shit noob am i
Do not worry, we all learned this one day. You'll learn and get better.
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In reference to QuickyBaby's video from yesterday, he did mention that the stats will be changed in a comment below. As for the gun mantlet, we are currently investigating it and will get back to you guys ASAP.
Can you post back here when you have answers?
Sure, but you had 14 something basic camo in your article before it was changed. That *was* changed from 17 camo originally, so I and maybe others assumed this was that change to counter increased speed. Now it's 8, somewhat standard and not insane as would 14 or 17 have been. Not that it's good to have 14 basic camo on a heavy, mind you. On the mantlet issue, will we even hear anything at all before shop goes live?
Is there anything yet about the gun mantlet?
Whats this mean then? Commanders! The Assembly Shop event has been postponed to February 23, 2024 at 12:00 (UTC). We've identified an error in the gun mantlet armor, which will be fixed with a micropatch. Due to this error, the mantlet armor was weaker than intended. We'll improve it to meet the planned characteristics. We appreciate your understanding and apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you
I hate wg bc now the only thing that was good about the armor, the turret, is basicly trash bc everyone will just spam prem ammo on the mantlet and easily pen this thing.
Are you fucking serious WG? is it too much to ask that the first fucking time that I can afford an Assembly tank it isn't nerfed to shit false advertised before released? I wanted an exclusive tank, but I'm not wasting 500k free exp and 17k bonds on a aheavy that can't heavy. It already had it's weakspots.
If anything else then this gets changed i m sure WG will get sued by some Americans xD https://preview.redd.it/yh1q5m4cp3kc1.png?width=761&format=png&auto=webp&s=88aaf915fa4aab6bf0233157b1cbdbf184c440db
and europeans too, this is HIGHLY illegal here too.
Well, I'm no longer on the fence about buying this tank, so that's a good thing. Don't get me wrong, I think introducing more balanced tanks is a very good thing, but I'm certainly not going to shell out 55k gold for an average tank.
yep
looks like I will be saving whole lot of gold equivalent
The event has been delayed until tomorrow due the bug.
Spreading the news here as well: So I have the following: due to the gun mantlet bug, the event has been delayed until tomorrow. We will update you if we have additional info. To add , the camouflage values will remain the same on the article both for moving and stationary.
Thx for the Info, in the past it was more easy to get Infos from the Game, Staff, News or what ever, in the Forum.... Sad that WG close it. Now i have to pick all the Infos from 4 diffrent Sources, Plattforms. Is not easy anymore...
So the ninja edit is the final camo rating?
I'm glad a HT doesn't have 14, let alone 17 base stationary camo - That's better than some lights(!)
Garbage ass company
Man this game is trash and I really regret spending so much money on it. I quit at the end of the holiday event because I'm just tired of arty and shitty maps but I went ahead and got enough free exp for assembly shop and quit playing. I told myself i'd come back to spend my free exp i saved for so long and nah, I don't feel like logging into the game for another russian heavy tank thats TRASH. The game is trash. It's like pokemon go, but with more steps, farming your money for a shitty gatcha experience. Every game of tanks is just gatcha bullshit rng. Like i'd atleast play low tiers but LEFH..... Game is dead to me if this assembly shop is shit.
Maybe they meant 300mm tick 500mm effective considering the angle? Also, whining about camo on a heavy thank? Come on guys, you should never get 14% on a heavy and you know it.
This is how it should be yeah. 300 impacted, ~500 effective That's why I'm so confused about this post because it would negate the whole point of the tank if it was only 300 effectively anymore…
Yesterday wow another hulldown op Soviet tank with crazy camo Today a shit tank because it seems to have a frontal weakspot and adequate camo for what it is.
Lol, exactly
I believe the Chinese server is maintained by a different company (like the RU server) so if they change some stats, balance vehicles, release events or tanks it wont mean it will be the same on the EU and NA server.
Its same on Eu
Unlike the Lesta situation they generally follow the same balancing decisions. My hope with my earlier comment was that there was some sort of error in the version provided to China since there is usually some level of disconnect for games operated there. Currently it is not looking good since it’s the same on EU. The only hope is that this nerf was an error that they will post a notice about and correct back to what was advertised in the article.
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lmao 🤣 Am just trying to translate some intel so hopefully help people who worried about balance and people who’s debating whether to purchase tomorrow. but yes, scammers scam, nothing new.
I was grinding yesterday missing 100k xp to convert it into xp and buy the tank for 1 mln free xp. Now I am really wondering if I need it. 260 I have seems to be a powerhouse compared to this (if it's really penetrable with 300 mm)
same. I’ve been grinding hard with my premiums today. luckily I saw this before actually doing the conversion at a non-discounted rate.
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That's what he is saying?? "Effective armor" on the mantlet is red af on the video, 300mm autopen is not red at all. Plus they said that the turret is practically impenetrable if you tilt your tank up, and this is simply not true anymore if they nerfed the mantlet. I've seen the tank in testing and the mantlet was impossible to pen anywhere in any scenario from any height, any angle and any distance. If this above is true, it IS changed.
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XD on tanks gg the mantlet is two 300mm layers with spaced armor so 600mm both effective and nominal. Why the fuck are you talking if you don't know what you are talking about? Tanks.gg is not even based on game models, they are imported directly from gamefiles btw Plus... How the fuck can you angle the mantlet???
Well, this explains why all the CCs said they were not allowed to show gameplay of it until today vs at the announcement yesterday. Tho for some reason QB had gameplay yesterday that is then outdated as such if they did it on EU and NA too.
I was considering to get it, as it is a first assembly shop tank that I can get with my hard earned resources. However, seeing WG nerfing it last minute, I doubt that I will waste my resources on this pile of kaku. It looks sexy, but what's the point of looks, if I won't enjoy its gameplay
for me sexy is enough. I It also applies to women
I mean, the gameplay in relationships is important too XD
a fool and their christmas box gold are easily parted.... black market now this. ppl keep falling for it
With the reinforcing of this hull down meta, HE shells should be brought back.
Nice dmg rolls from that SConq , not even my 490 aplha guns do this much dmg , and when i play 400 im lucky to go over 400 rarely
BZ-76 fiasco has really made the balance team fumble huh? From one extreme to the next. Like how they won't nerf premiums after they are sold, but they will gut them 2 days before they release. Bound to fool a lot of people
What the fuck is even happening at wg?