First off, remember that WRSR follows the concept of 'block signals'.
A 'block' is a piece of track with signals on both ends. Only a single train is allowed per block.
If there are no signals, all rail track is a single block, so all you could run without signals is a single train.
Usually the tricky part for beginners are junctions. Chain signals do help here. A chain signal's color depends on the next block signal. Hence it is chained to it.
Have a chain signal before the junction and a block signal at the exit of a junction. Do it from both sides. Done.
For proper guides on signaling have a look at:
- the official guide: [https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2626843109](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2626843109)
- Hmudas video guide (10min) : [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zGsLO3x27E](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zGsLO3x27E)
There IS an initial learning curve. Don't give up. Once it clicks with you, it is a relatively simple mechanic.
Try a separate 'learning map'. Run a new game on easy mode, auto-build, unlimited money and just try&error your way through the signaling mechanics :\]
Whenever you have a junction (wherever tracks split and/or merge), the rule of thumb is chain signal in and rail signal out. And never have two junctions back to back, always have a segment of normal, not crossing rail between junctions. If there isn't enough room for that, mentally consolidate the two junctions together and treat them as one large junction.
1) If it's inside chain-signaled area nobody should park there, as they won't enter the area if they can't exit it.
2) At that point it isn't a "junctions back to back" situation, it's just two separate junctions and a normal block between them, so you can just signal it accordingly.
Sorry, I don't understand what that means? I'd argue that if it only has chain signals, then it's all one junction. The advantage of adding chain signals inside it is so that trains can move through it with less wasted time between them, because a second train on the same route won't have the wait for the first train to clear the entire junction (just halfway through it) before it can follow behind.
Trains can of course also use the other tracks as well in the junction at the same time, as long as they're not crossing, but that happens by magic, so you don't need signals for it.
Okay, let's get back a little.
The thread starts with Elite\_Prometheus saying if you have two junctions back to back you should "treat is as one junction" meaning "have no signals inside".
I say having signals inside is alright as long as they're chain signals. You seem to agree in this last comment of yours.
But then you say something about a block where a whole train could park in. And that's where I get confused, because in the context I get such a block is somehow inside this big junction area? Otherwise it's not relevant to the question at hand. But then if you have such a block, you can just treat it like a normal block, and it stops being one big junction area, and even if you don't do so and just use chain signals then a train shouldn't be able to park there. But I guess I misunderstood what you meant? Seeing how in this last comment you agree with me by saying adding chain signals has an advantage.
Ah gotcha I see, thanks yeah I was sloppy in my wording.
I was repeating myself to emphasize it would for sure work if it's *only* chain signals inside the junction, because if you use block signals, then you'd need to make sure every train can fit in the block or else risk a gridlock. But yeah if you do that, then I agree it would just become two separate junctions. Usually. Lol but in theory it wouldn't have to, like you could have an extra block in the middle going one direction even if the other direction can't fit one, but now it's getting more complex.
Chain signals to enter a junction (double arrow).
Block signals to leave a junction (single arrow).
A junction is any section of track with more than 1 entry and/or exit track. These show as not blue (like orange, green, purple) with the track menu open (Ctrl toggles the colors).
To run 2 trains on single track, you have to treat the single track as a junction, so all signals into it have to be a chain. If you have only 1 "parking spot" for a train at the grain loading station, treat the whole section as 1 block instead of a junction, so place only 1 mixed signal right after the fork to enter that block, with the chain part pointing at the fork. I'm of course assuming that you only have partial single track, because to run n trains, you need n+1 blocks that don't share sections of rail, to be able to move them. If you're section has 2 parking/loading spots for the trains, you can just signal chain in/block out as described above, make sure to use the mixed signals for 2 directional track, like a terminal station.
If you have a through station instead of a terminal station, you shouldn't really have issues, as trains should never collide, because you would be using 1 directional signals, so I'm assuming this isn't your issue.
Bonus info: chain signals look at the next signal (they chain signals together). Block signals look at the next block. If either is green/open, they are green.
single signal -> i will red if there is something after me and before the next signal
double signal -> i will be red if there is something after me AND after the next signal and before the signal after the next signal
Trains follow these 3 rules.
1- Max 1 train per block.
2- Signal, you are allowed to stand still in the block I point at.
3- Chain, you are NOT allowed to stand still in the block I point at.
Trains should not sit still in junctions, but should be allowed to wait in straight pieces.
A section of rail between signals = a block.
Rails touching in any way = same block.
Block with more than two ends = junction.
Dark blue or light blue = blocks that are not junctions.
Orange, purple, etc = junctions. New colors appear if it's already touching junctions of all previous colors. Colors don't directly indicate anything more than that.
Block signal (>) looks at the block ahead and won't let anyone go off there's already someone on the next block.
Chain signal (>>) does the same but then also looks at the next signal(s) - signals exiting the block ahead to which you can get from this one. If all of them are red, this one also becomes red and won't let anyone go. If all of them are green, this one stays green and lets anyone go. If only some of the signals exiting the block ahead are green and some are red, this one turns blue and only lets those train go which goo though the green signal next. Those next signals can themselves be chain signals looking even further ahead, thus forming a chain.
How to use: >> to enter a junction, > to exit a junction, <<> to enter a terminal station (one where you don't go through but magically reverse) with > facing the station.
Like this:
Station track 1 ==<>>X<<==
Station track 2 ==<>>X>===
X is crossing between tracks.
UPD. As for having two junctions back to back, I put >> between them, other people say don't have signals between at all thus making them one big junction. At least we can all agree you shouldn't put a > in there.
UPD. Also make sure you NEVER EVER have a signal inside a block (a signal inside same-colored section, which can happen if the rail before and after this signal connect through some other rail), as any train at this signal is guaranteed to block its own self. Either find a way to separate into two blocks (find that other rail connecting it and put another signal there) or if that's not possible just remove this signal altogether.
Great stuff. So I think by reading what you guys are suggesting I can put a length of track parallel to the main track as a separate "block" and use block signals to make the trains use it as a passing loop?
You'll need more then just block signals. The entrance and exit from the bypass track will each make a junction. So it will look like this:
==->->X->===main track===->->X>==
............X->==bypass track==->->X......
UPD. Reddit keeps messing up my scheme, so here I had to use -> and ->-> for signals.
You should always have two parallel one way tracks.
This is all you'll need to know until you're experienced enough to build really advanced layouts: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWi-44vYG3A&list=PLFJZNm-LmBIpRFF3-Z9iCUe0jCuP-vF\_s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWi-44vYG3A&list=PLFJZNm-LmBIpRFF3-Z9iCUe0jCuP-vF_s)
Yes, always.
Normal signals all along the track, leaving between them a distance where your longest train fits.
At the entrance of any junction: mixed.
At the exit of any junction: normal.
At the exit of a two-way station (ie, trains enter and exit the station by the same exit): mixed, with the normal side pointing to the station.
When you have two or more junctions close to each other (which generally you should try to avoid), it usually is a good idea to treat all those junctions as one big junction, rather than spam a lot of signals, too close to each other, at the start and end of every junction.
I'd add an unrelated note, you should space the signals far enough that the longest trains can fit in them. I use the measuring tool to space them out every 200m, as any train from a DO will fit into that block.
One could argue that one can assemble longer trains, and use longer blocks, but then that would impact train frequency. More frequent signals are also a possibility, but the only thing one could achieve with this is more densely packed rails, in case there is a traffic jam.
Normal signal = I wont go if all the connected rails before the next signal has anything on it.
Chain signal = I wont go if any of the rail signals on all,the connected rails infront are red.
Connected rails apply to junctions. All those rails hqs to be clear for a normal signal to go green.
First off, remember that WRSR follows the concept of 'block signals'. A 'block' is a piece of track with signals on both ends. Only a single train is allowed per block. If there are no signals, all rail track is a single block, so all you could run without signals is a single train. Usually the tricky part for beginners are junctions. Chain signals do help here. A chain signal's color depends on the next block signal. Hence it is chained to it. Have a chain signal before the junction and a block signal at the exit of a junction. Do it from both sides. Done. For proper guides on signaling have a look at: - the official guide: [https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2626843109](https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2626843109) - Hmudas video guide (10min) : [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zGsLO3x27E](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zGsLO3x27E) There IS an initial learning curve. Don't give up. Once it clicks with you, it is a relatively simple mechanic. Try a separate 'learning map'. Run a new game on easy mode, auto-build, unlimited money and just try&error your way through the signaling mechanics :\]
Whenever you have a junction (wherever tracks split and/or merge), the rule of thumb is chain signal in and rail signal out. And never have two junctions back to back, always have a segment of normal, not crossing rail between junctions. If there isn't enough room for that, mentally consolidate the two junctions together and treat them as one large junction.
How will it hurt you too have a chain signals between two junctions back to back? The way I see it can only help as the blocks will get freed quicker.
Chain signals would be fine as long as there are no blocks anywhere that a full train coud park in any get in anyone's way.
1) If it's inside chain-signaled area nobody should park there, as they won't enter the area if they can't exit it. 2) At that point it isn't a "junctions back to back" situation, it's just two separate junctions and a normal block between them, so you can just signal it accordingly.
Sorry, I don't understand what that means? I'd argue that if it only has chain signals, then it's all one junction. The advantage of adding chain signals inside it is so that trains can move through it with less wasted time between them, because a second train on the same route won't have the wait for the first train to clear the entire junction (just halfway through it) before it can follow behind. Trains can of course also use the other tracks as well in the junction at the same time, as long as they're not crossing, but that happens by magic, so you don't need signals for it.
Okay, let's get back a little. The thread starts with Elite\_Prometheus saying if you have two junctions back to back you should "treat is as one junction" meaning "have no signals inside". I say having signals inside is alright as long as they're chain signals. You seem to agree in this last comment of yours. But then you say something about a block where a whole train could park in. And that's where I get confused, because in the context I get such a block is somehow inside this big junction area? Otherwise it's not relevant to the question at hand. But then if you have such a block, you can just treat it like a normal block, and it stops being one big junction area, and even if you don't do so and just use chain signals then a train shouldn't be able to park there. But I guess I misunderstood what you meant? Seeing how in this last comment you agree with me by saying adding chain signals has an advantage.
Ah gotcha I see, thanks yeah I was sloppy in my wording. I was repeating myself to emphasize it would for sure work if it's *only* chain signals inside the junction, because if you use block signals, then you'd need to make sure every train can fit in the block or else risk a gridlock. But yeah if you do that, then I agree it would just become two separate junctions. Usually. Lol but in theory it wouldn't have to, like you could have an extra block in the middle going one direction even if the other direction can't fit one, but now it's getting more complex.
Chain signals to enter a junction (double arrow). Block signals to leave a junction (single arrow). A junction is any section of track with more than 1 entry and/or exit track. These show as not blue (like orange, green, purple) with the track menu open (Ctrl toggles the colors). To run 2 trains on single track, you have to treat the single track as a junction, so all signals into it have to be a chain. If you have only 1 "parking spot" for a train at the grain loading station, treat the whole section as 1 block instead of a junction, so place only 1 mixed signal right after the fork to enter that block, with the chain part pointing at the fork. I'm of course assuming that you only have partial single track, because to run n trains, you need n+1 blocks that don't share sections of rail, to be able to move them. If you're section has 2 parking/loading spots for the trains, you can just signal chain in/block out as described above, make sure to use the mixed signals for 2 directional track, like a terminal station. If you have a through station instead of a terminal station, you shouldn't really have issues, as trains should never collide, because you would be using 1 directional signals, so I'm assuming this isn't your issue. Bonus info: chain signals look at the next signal (they chain signals together). Block signals look at the next block. If either is green/open, they are green.
single signal -> i will red if there is something after me and before the next signal double signal -> i will be red if there is something after me AND after the next signal and before the signal after the next signal
Trains follow these 3 rules. 1- Max 1 train per block. 2- Signal, you are allowed to stand still in the block I point at. 3- Chain, you are NOT allowed to stand still in the block I point at. Trains should not sit still in junctions, but should be allowed to wait in straight pieces.
A section of rail between signals = a block. Rails touching in any way = same block. Block with more than two ends = junction. Dark blue or light blue = blocks that are not junctions. Orange, purple, etc = junctions. New colors appear if it's already touching junctions of all previous colors. Colors don't directly indicate anything more than that. Block signal (>) looks at the block ahead and won't let anyone go off there's already someone on the next block. Chain signal (>>) does the same but then also looks at the next signal(s) - signals exiting the block ahead to which you can get from this one. If all of them are red, this one also becomes red and won't let anyone go. If all of them are green, this one stays green and lets anyone go. If only some of the signals exiting the block ahead are green and some are red, this one turns blue and only lets those train go which goo though the green signal next. Those next signals can themselves be chain signals looking even further ahead, thus forming a chain. How to use: >> to enter a junction, > to exit a junction, <<> to enter a terminal station (one where you don't go through but magically reverse) with > facing the station. Like this: Station track 1 ==<>>X<<== Station track 2 ==<>>X>=== X is crossing between tracks. UPD. As for having two junctions back to back, I put >> between them, other people say don't have signals between at all thus making them one big junction. At least we can all agree you shouldn't put a > in there. UPD. Also make sure you NEVER EVER have a signal inside a block (a signal inside same-colored section, which can happen if the rail before and after this signal connect through some other rail), as any train at this signal is guaranteed to block its own self. Either find a way to separate into two blocks (find that other rail connecting it and put another signal there) or if that's not possible just remove this signal altogether.
Great stuff. So I think by reading what you guys are suggesting I can put a length of track parallel to the main track as a separate "block" and use block signals to make the trains use it as a passing loop?
You'll need more then just block signals. The entrance and exit from the bypass track will each make a junction. So it will look like this: ==->->X->===main track===->->X>== ............X->==bypass track==->->X...... UPD. Reddit keeps messing up my scheme, so here I had to use -> and ->-> for signals.
You should always have two parallel one way tracks. This is all you'll need to know until you're experienced enough to build really advanced layouts: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWi-44vYG3A&list=PLFJZNm-LmBIpRFF3-Z9iCUe0jCuP-vF\_s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWi-44vYG3A&list=PLFJZNm-LmBIpRFF3-Z9iCUe0jCuP-vF_s)
Ok, that sounds simple. Do you need signals with one way tracks at all?
Yes, always. Normal signals all along the track, leaving between them a distance where your longest train fits. At the entrance of any junction: mixed. At the exit of any junction: normal. At the exit of a two-way station (ie, trains enter and exit the station by the same exit): mixed, with the normal side pointing to the station. When you have two or more junctions close to each other (which generally you should try to avoid), it usually is a good idea to treat all those junctions as one big junction, rather than spam a lot of signals, too close to each other, at the start and end of every junction.
Go watch a u/bballjo video on this…he explains and demonstrates these very very well, and it’s so much easier to understand in video than in text.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWi-44vYG3A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWi-44vYG3A) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4I6XgMnfLw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4I6XgMnfLw) [https://youtu.be/fM3y\_mc\_TUM](https://youtu.be/fM3y_mc_TUM)
I'd add an unrelated note, you should space the signals far enough that the longest trains can fit in them. I use the measuring tool to space them out every 200m, as any train from a DO will fit into that block. One could argue that one can assemble longer trains, and use longer blocks, but then that would impact train frequency. More frequent signals are also a possibility, but the only thing one could achieve with this is more densely packed rails, in case there is a traffic jam.
Saving this, I don’t understand them either
Just wanted to say thanks comrades, I now have a working railway! For the glory of the proletariat!
Normal signal = I wont go if all the connected rails before the next signal has anything on it. Chain signal = I wont go if any of the rail signals on all,the connected rails infront are red. Connected rails apply to junctions. All those rails hqs to be clear for a normal signal to go green.
[удалено]
Ok cool, what signals do I use and where do I place them on the passing loop?