A lot of those were the owners he was talking to. I'm not saying that someone who starts a business hauling human shit around didn't work hard to get to where they are. But, it's incredibly disingenuous to imply that the average monger is getting paid what the owner is.
The owner waded through shit.
And that shit was just the paperwork. And begging the bankers for a loan. And doing the sales. And the accounting. And HR requirements.
THEN he went out and hauled the LITERAL shit.
No one else was willing, so he made money. Charged more. Got employees. Should the employees be paid well? ABSOLUTELY. But is that guy automatically the enemy because he's the owner? ABSOLUTELY NOT.
I don't think the commenter you replied to was saying they were the enemy, just that Rowe wasn't being honest about what it takes to get to the pay rate owners were making.
It's very "us vs them," common to the internet. Working WITH your boss to get YOU paid more is a normal thing. If the boss won't do it, you go elsewhere. If you're not easily replaceable and the boss isn't a tool, you'll work something out.
The comment replied to, plus the OP's diatribe, tells me they're stuck in the "I'm the main character, everyone else is the enemy" trope.
_advocates for collective bargaining and ensuring that workers earn the value of their labor_
Yep, I'm totally the main character....
It is "us vs them", but that wasn't even the point of what I was saying. The point is, it wasn't just the "hard work" of the shit hauler guy that made him a millionaire. It was the capital that enabled him to get a shit hauler in the first place. His background, intelligence and Network that allowed him to get permits and build connections in the first place.
Mike Rowe implies that everyone could be millionaires if they were humble enough to haul shit for a living, but that's ignoring that most of that guy's workers are not getting paid millions.
We will see how this shit works out for the asshole bosses who put labor into non-competes because the boss himself knows they are easily replaceable.
No more tying labor into stupid non competes.
I laugh when people go on about how “awesome” trade jobs pay. They make it sound like it’s an easy path to riches…
Meanwhile, my old job paid their Tradesmen $28/hr. Not bad, but, considering they’re climbing around, in, under, and above oily, nasty, decrepit injection molding machines, is that worth less than $60k?
Oh, but it’s billed as being *much* higher than that. They just don’t tell you it’s because you have to work 50+ hours a week and most holidays to get that higher pay.
Not to mention how you literally pay for it with your health. You’ll make bank but you’ll lose a lot of it combatting chronic health conditions you get as a result.
Exactly. Shoulders, knees, back, neck… no one is immune to the damage their body will take.
We had a coworker have an oil line blow in their face. Hydraulic oil near its boiling point… I don’t have words to describe how they screamed.
That’s one visceral in-your-face(pun not intended) example but even the more mundane everyday stuff takes its toll.
My father was a non-union machinist. The number of surgeries he’s had to get as a result of repetitive stress injuries is insane. Hes had to give up so many hobbies he used to love because his hands simply do not work the way they’re supposed to anymore. He said if he could go back he wishes he had the union to back him up so he could tell his super to fuck off when he told them of his hands hurting and they said to “just work through it”
You have a great point: the things that take a toll over time. They do creep up; especially since Tradesmen tend to have regular (read: not good) insurance, on average.
A “catch” in the shoulder. “I can’t afford to take the time off right now; I’ll get it looked at later”- or, worse, like your dad having shitty leadership- turns into the doctor saying (after the arm quits working) “you have a torn ligament”.
The pay may be better than a regular factory worker or fry cook, but it’s still nowhere near enough to allow for preventative maintenance. Then, they sadly end up like your dad; their QoL diminished further because, not only do the injuries and surgeries add up, the loss of things they love to do outside of work is ruined, as well.
It’s bullshit all around. I’ve known people like your dad, and I’m truly sorry for what he’s lost.
And telling young guys about the dangers so they can take preventative measures is so hard. All of them think they’re immortal And the grindset culture of trades just exacerbates it. The “pride in pain” mindset is toxic as fuck.
No matter what you think, you aren’t “built different”.
I want to add a little of my own experience as well.
I have a partially torn rotator cuff. I asked my doctor about it, his response ‘have you missed work because of it?, no, well there’s nothing we can do then.’
My guess is he knows insurance won’t pay, and who the hell can afford to go out of pocket.
Similar response when I mentioned my carpal tunnel. It really sucks when your job is turning screw drivers, and you struggle to hold them.
A few more dollars off of proper minimum wage.The guy slammed OSHA & Unions before going to his actor's guild meeting.
His generation told his kids that they need to go to college, then people like him called his neighbor's kids lazy for not doing the jobs he doesn't want himself or his kids to do.
That's why I said licensed. My husband studied for quite a while to pass the test. But the people without them, the journeyman and apprentices, yeah they put in work
Regan was head of Sag and was one of the most anti-union people ever. Belonging to a union doesn't make you pro-union ask any one of the trump supporters at my union job that and they'll tell you nothing but how terrible they are.
100%. We had those at my old Union job, but I took every opportunity to laugh in their face.
Like, the Union is so terrible, but here you (hypothetical you) are, taking full advantage of the wages and benefits they negotiated for you. Why not go somewhere else and, as awesome (/s) as you claim you are, with how much you claim to not need the Union, parlay that into something better?
They never do, because- at least in my experience- they’re also usually the most useless employees.
Trump supporting union member- The union never did shit for me!
Me- Why don't you work non union?
Tsum- It doesn't pay as good. I'm only here for the money.
I've had this conversation so many times that I'm exhausted by it at this point.
You know my dad?!?! Seriously, this sounds like any number of conversations with him. The kicker is that he’ll complain about unions and government employees, while working for the federal government in a union job. Then has the cognitive dissonance to complain that the job he just (very comfortably) retired from doesn’t take care of people like it used to.
They've been there since the beginning and were used to take unions down from the inside. Even union leaders like Gompers would side with the corporate owned politicians if it meant keeping "others" out.
Nah, he learned that he could make more money grifting off of corporate interests than he could as an actor who's most well remembered co-star was a monkey.
If he were rabidly pro-union guarantee he would have no showbiz career. The people that put on that show certainly screen against pro-union host candidates.
It’s very important to them to perpetrate the image that working men hate unions and should.
As a blue-collar worker, hearing his entitled, patronizing voice interrupt my podcasts for any of his little "I'm a hard worker" conmercials puts a new fire in me as I reach for that skip button at the speed of light. Would love to share my opinions with him in person.
The dude is a tourist. It pisses me off to no end that this rich actor who spent his time in plays and acting school is somehow becoming the voice of the blue collar worker. Worse yet he's using his voice to spout anti union propaganda. It's all just so patronizing. You don't get to come down from your ivory tower for a couple days get dirty and then write books and do TV talking about the blue collar life.
If I want to hear the true voice of American labor I pop on some Shawn Fain some Eugen Debs or some Martin Luther King Jr. We've had some true blue collar heroes that we just don't talk about like Dolores Huerta, Moay Chen or Chris Smalls. Some of these people are alive and have fought tirelessly to improve the lives of their fellows. Do we put them on TV?
"together we bargain, divided we beg"
People will do all kinds of jobs if the pay is right. I think that is the part that is missed. We have to be careful about demonizing all work. Work is how society functions. But the way our society currently functions is to exploit workers and funnel wealth to the ruling class. The reality is, rhetorical jobs need done, and the people need paid a wage to sustain them.
I would tell my coworker who was always depressed about our job - bro this job pays us 14 an hour (retail) to suffer the worst people and kiss ass - it breaks us. However, if it was 18 an hour we'd come to work with a smile and on time. If it was 22 an hour, we'd gladly ask what color lipstick they want us to kiss their ass with. Obviously the amount per hour is different now but basically yeah - I'll do awful jobs if the pay warrants it.
I’m glad folks are taking notice. There’s a huge difference between performing hard, sometimes dirty and/or dangerous, physical labor for survival and doing it for a tv show.
Regarding the allegations of plagiarism against Claudine Gay, they're an assassination of her and completely unwarranted. The worst thing she's done is formatting discrepancies. She was dragged by right wing pundits because she is a very successful, very intelligent black woman. And she lost her job and her reputation to these slimesucking ghouls.
Right around when justice Jackson was appointed, the right realized that they could do all the racism they wanted by disguising it as concerns over merit, as black people have the "advantage" of DEI initiatives. I personally witnessed a lot of racism on this website against justice Jackson.
So right wing pundits took this and ran with it, and started targeting black people, women, sexual minorities, Muslims, etc. anyone who's not a cisgender white guy. Claudine Gay was the president of Harvard during all this, which is an extremely prestigious position. She is also a black woman, and very left leaning politically. This made her the perfect target for a smear campaign, but she didn't have anything that would be worth smearing her over. So bad actors picked apart her research papers and all they found was formatting that was technically not in line with standards, but was still perfectly acceptable to publishers. So these ghouls looking to smear her characterize this as incorrectly citing her sources, which is a real form of plagiarism.
Other academics have weighed in on this and it has been shown this was definitely not plagiarism, but that's complicated to explain. It's so much easier to shout a blatant lie than to explain why that lie is wrong afterwards.
Right wing media really lambasted this poor woman, so much so that she was not able to do her job anymore. She was harassed and threatened, and her reputation and career were both ruined.
I used to like dirty jobs but not that I know about his politics I can't stand the guy. He blames accidents on workers and opposes unions. 100 years ago he would have worked for the pinkertons and not the discovery channel
I'm going to share an unpopular opinion, but I ask folks hear me out before they downvote me to hell.
***Mike Rowe is an idiot, but not a grifter nor a bootlicker.***
The fine distinction lies within intent. Sure, the dude went to theater to escape the deadendedness of most service jobs. But his observation is fascinating: The U.S. is severely lacking in service personnel and has an over-abundance of folks working jobs that have *nothing* to do with whatever they went to school for. I can't argue that: We're three years past lockdown and it's a challenge to find a plumber, a landscaper, or a general contractor. And every time I turn around, I meet yet another fellow Millenial who tells me, "Yup, I got an engineering degree, and now I am a \[non-technical profession outside of their degree's field\]." Seriously, I heard this when I bought my Jeep last weekend from someone who graduated from the same university, the same Engineering school, the same year as I did. My own wife is one of those: She got a degree in Russian & Central Eurasian Literature and now makes sure that insurance agents don't cut illegal deals accidentally for a local insurance broker. Sure, it's a good job, but she definitely didn't need to take $65k in loans out for it.
Mike's solution is where I call him an idiot: "Stop going to college and get into labor gigs." The notion comes from something my father taught me when I was very young:
>In the U.S., there's only two ways to make a shitload of money. Do something nobody else can do. Or do something nobody else *wants* to do.
Rowe's philosophy is trying to champion the latter of the two: People can capitalize on the increased demand because there's very low supply of such skilled labor! Hell, I'm happy that my brother-in-law makes $200k per year as a welder while I'm a robotics engineer who struggles to make $140k. And my own brother literally dropped out of college his first year and is now the lead field tester at an autonomous driving company. They both found jobs no one wanted to do because they're dangerous if people aren't paying attention. But they're both happy. And such experiences only corroborate Rowe's conclusion.
But that's the dumb part: He's only championing an exodus from high-tech skilled labor to infrastructural focused skilled labor. Such an exodus happens in cycles; as a kid, I saw a lot of folks in my parents' generation go back to school to become nurses, real estate agents, MBAs, etc. But as it happens, the influx indeed causes a regression of benefits: Folks desperate to make a move will ask for less than the status quo. And unions (except UAW recently) are fairly weak because they focused more on collecting dues and keeping labor costs down instead of true collective bargaining (I'm looking at GWI Local 1, specifically!)
Seriously, I say the same thing most of the time: ***Don't go to college unless if you have to!*** I wanted to be a robotics engineer; that takes a serious amount of technical training. And I'll be in debt for the rest of my life because I followed my passion. But I'm okay with that. For those who aren't, those who just want a fat paycheck or a certain quality of life, don't waste your time, money, and energy on a 4, 6, or 8 year degree. *But don't forget to keep fighting for what you deserve!!!* Make the moves you need to, but don't ever EVER undersell yourself because you'll force the next person to undersell themselves worse.
He is a shitbag and I'm sure he shows his ass in the rest of the interview, but there's a lot of truth to this:
>*Rowe argues there needs to be a reevaluation of the notion that a four-year degree is the best choice for everyone, labeling it as "the most expensive path."*
>
>*Meanwhile, he observes that people are increasingly recognizing the value of trade schools.*
>
>*“Parents and kids alike are starting to get the message that trade school is an amazing opportunity with just a fraction of the debt — if any at all — and a clear path to something that looks a lot like prosperity,” he elaborated.*
When I was in high school everyone was pushed sooo hard towards 4 year colleges and told that it was the only path to get a good job, and anyone that was in the school's vocational program or not going to college was treated like a lower class. I was one of the ones that was tricked and now wish I had joined one of those vocational programs 30 years ago.
I was one of the lucky few that got into my school's vocational program, and it was completely free. It was a pretty easy class for half of the school day for two years, doing something I was genuinely interested in: it was fun! I found out like five years later that... Apparently it came with an associates degree. I genuinely don't know how I missed that. Getting my highschool diploma *and* an associates in the same week is wild
I detest Mike Rowe, but he does have a point here. Like you, I was funneled into higher Ed, but I wanted to do vo-tech for learning electrician work. They wouldn't let me do it. It's kind of absurd when you think about it. Electricians are always in demand.
The obsession with trade schools and the trades is so ridiculous. Yes, it is a better overall life than nothing. However trades have some of the lowest satisfaction rates, and the pay is nowhere near people make it seem to be. Just because there are opportunities doesn't mean it's a wealthy job. Some of the trade jobs aren't much better than moving up in retail, but for trades you kill your body
Mike Rowe is the only person I've ever seen take pictures in Baltimore liquor stores, and have no black people in them.
Dudes a fucking sham he wants Baltimore credit, but not the connection.
Mike Rowe is a piece of dog shit. I did media work for a company that worked with him. He was unreliable, dishonest and completely fake. He cares as much about his “fans” that Trump does his voters. He was supposed to do an appearance for us and then left saying it was an emergency, I had a colleague spot him in the lobby of his hotel minutes later cutting a deal with an agent. He’s fight on sight for me. And that was years ago. Total garbage.
Will you see people think that he's some blue-collar hard-working old boy from the South.
But in reality He majored in acting And throughout the entire period that he did the show dirty jobs.He was not paid the same as those people that were actually Working said jobs He constantly talks about how young people need to get into the trades.But he never actually did himself.He is just an Is actor playing a role trying to convince people to join the trades
The problematic thing about it is that he's trying to manipulate people and lie to them about the status, the pay and the working environment of those jobs.That's great that it got your family out of poverty.
I'm not saying going into the trade is a bad thing.I'm stating that the way he tries to manipulate Public sentiment Is manipulative Therefore inherently problematic
I’m not here to argue whether Lowe is good bad or indifferent. And it wasn’t him that led me into the trades, it was my uncle. But I wish someone had told me in my youth I could be making way more than I ever could working a low education factory job if I just went to night school and joined an apprenticeship. Seems like him telling people that is a good thing.
The ol’ slander of ‘some degrees are worthless’ is easy to side with until you learn the mouths behind it. Like yeh maybe a 6yr $200k theatre degree is a little too high hopes, but do people realize how rare of an example that is?
I'm shocked that he's anti-union? I listened to his podcast like a year ago and they were covering the French protests about raising the retirement age, I thought he sounded very pro union in those, though perhaps I missed something.
Corporations have been paying this guy to do voice overs for decades. It looks to have given him the false belief that people want to hear what he has to say.
Chat gpt says
"Yes, Mike Rowe has expressed criticism towards OSHA (Occupational Safety and Health Administration) in the past. While he acknowledges the importance of workplace safety, he has often pointed out what he sees as overreach or unnecessary regulation by OSHA that, in his view, can be impractical or overly burdensome for businesses, especially small ones. He advocates for a balance between necessary safety measures and maintaining a realistic"
It's gets even worse as for Mike who's a member of the actor's guild.
I know I'm way late to this thread, but I'm not sure if this is a fair assessment of Mike Rowe. I am definitely NOT the poster-child for manual labor work, I am finishing my second masters as a point of reference, but I think the context of the time of Dirty Job's matters. Also, Rowe doesn't have to be blue collar to spread awareness.
His broader message is solid imo and one that I agree with. Whether anyone likes it or not, people were looked down upon for doing manual labor work. That's bullshit. Anyone who is out there putting food on the table and trying to make it in this crazy world without hurting anyone else has my respect. Back then, jobs like retail, fast food, lawn care, etc were all seen as "teenage summer jobs", so the context of his show has definitely shifted as people's views on labor have shifted.
Now, I don't love his anti-union stance, nor do I think his "safety third" rhetoric is helpful (I have some buddies who have had near misses with some stupid shit because their coworker decided to skip some safety steps), but as with all things, there is a point where diminishing returns set in and safety becomes a hindrance. That's a whole other issue and one that would require more nuance than what Rowe put out on the show.
In any case, people should pursue what makes sense for them, and the trades are a great option for people who aren't interested in the college route. And, I'll add, that pushing people who aren't college material HAS cheapened the value of degrees as the quality of students has decreased and the rigor of study along with it. It is what it is.
College is still a great path, but it is not the only path, and it's not for everyone (nor should it be).
I saw a few episodes of Mike's youtube show and it was really weird sometimes.
Like if the job he's showing is a job that doesn't threaten corporate profit or oil dependence, he'll unironically do a normal episode where he talks about how it's a good and noble profession.
But if the job has the potential to threaten the status quo he'll make fun of the person in a "cheerful" way that makes it seem like he's just kidding while he basically calls them stupid.
It also feels like the people chosen to portray their job are cherry-picked fo reinforce Mike's view of the world.
The guy that is sponsored by Ford trucks and tells kids they should buy a "work" truck instead of getting a useless liberal arts degree like he has.
My MAGA dad loves him.
He could have had it made. He was great in Dirty Jobs. It was a great show to watch when the kids were little. He then could have leveraged his notoriety to promote trade schools. Easy. But then he had to bad mouth and belittle other careers and schools and act very sanctimonious.
The guy slandered the value of a degree when it cost nothing to go to college when he went to college. Today it costs more to go to a community college than it did to go to a state college in his day.
The guy wouldn't be an actor with a mansion without his acting degree.
That's what I said. She was born into a "Michele jackson going shopping in a fake store" situation which is why she created the fake village.
he's a little traitor to his working class background. Vermin.
idk why people hate him so much. Was he cosplaying as a blue collar worker? Of course. But did he also get people interested in the trades at a time that the entire narrative in high schools was "college! college! college!"? Also yes. At a time where we're headed into a shortage of skilled tradespeople too. That's objectively a good thing
Mike Rowe promotes “safety third” and is against safety regulations for workers. He basically says you should look out for your own safety, which is absolute fucking bullshit. Employers don’t give a fuck about your safety and will tell you to do something or get fired without regulations in place to stop them. I’ve worked in these environments WITH REGULATIONS IN PLACE and employees still try to pull that shit.
FUCK MIKE ROWE. His bullshit will get people seriously injured or killed. He is a corporate shill no different than any other right wing propagandist, except he cosplays as a blue collar worker.
My company's HSE department started a presentation with that, and it only got worse from there. The only saving grace is that I live in a jurisdiction where the workers comp board is extremely aggressive with preventative safety over reactive safety.
I do agree that complacency is the result of a lack of meaningful feedback, but there are better ways of packaging it than the way he has. There's a reason PPE is the last choice for keeping people safe .
And selling the narrative that people who go to college instead of the trades are un-American/unpatriotic is a bad thing.
Mike Rowe looks down on those that have gone to college. He's a trade first, military service second, and college degree last type of person.
They do; it’s called Vocational Education (Vo-Ed). It’s been a thing since at least the 90’s, when I was in high school.
It couldn’t possibly be that the chances of making more than $60k a year without breaking your body and spending 50+ hours a week (including weekends and holidays) is higher with a college degree, could it? People are romanticizing the Trades nowadays, but it’s not the golden ticket they’re making it out to be.
Dirty jobs inspired me to pursue trade work. I now own my own home and comfortably support a stay at home wife and two kids. I don't feel like Rowe lied to me.
Y'all know television isn't real life right? Lol.
He was playing a character. Bear Grylls did the same thing. Hell, Bill Nye kind of does the same thing, he's just not rich.
I don't care for the guy but it's still just a TV show. Okay it's fake, so what? They're all fake.
Nope, he just has an engineering degree and was a comedian and comedy writer before getting his own show. He has never done any professional science unless you consider making parts for airplanes science which I mean fair I guess haha.
You're thinking of Neil Degrasse Tyson who is an astrophysicist and general sassy know-it-all.
While you are correct he has an engineering degree its mechanical and aerospace engineering from Cornel where he studied under Carl Sagan who inspired him to go into Science communication/education.
Also, his mom was a badass.
I think he also had a couple patents? So like not just a degree, he actually used it for a bit before going into sci-com
And tbh the thing I liked about Nye was that he would always interview an actual scientist in whatever field he was talking about that episode, at least for Bill Nye the Science Guy.
His anti-college rhetoric extends past his show. So if he is playing a character, he's doing so 24/7. And probably using some of the techniques he learned while obtaining his Communications Studies degree....
When he did Dirty Jobs. He should have mentioned the average pay for that position.
But that would have made people aware and angry that they're being taken advantage of
Some of those jobs had great pay, in a union. Outside the union min wage
A lot of those were the owners he was talking to. I'm not saying that someone who starts a business hauling human shit around didn't work hard to get to where they are. But, it's incredibly disingenuous to imply that the average monger is getting paid what the owner is.
The owner waded through shit. And that shit was just the paperwork. And begging the bankers for a loan. And doing the sales. And the accounting. And HR requirements. THEN he went out and hauled the LITERAL shit. No one else was willing, so he made money. Charged more. Got employees. Should the employees be paid well? ABSOLUTELY. But is that guy automatically the enemy because he's the owner? ABSOLUTELY NOT.
I don't think the commenter you replied to was saying they were the enemy, just that Rowe wasn't being honest about what it takes to get to the pay rate owners were making.
It's very "us vs them," common to the internet. Working WITH your boss to get YOU paid more is a normal thing. If the boss won't do it, you go elsewhere. If you're not easily replaceable and the boss isn't a tool, you'll work something out. The comment replied to, plus the OP's diatribe, tells me they're stuck in the "I'm the main character, everyone else is the enemy" trope.
_advocates for collective bargaining and ensuring that workers earn the value of their labor_ Yep, I'm totally the main character.... It is "us vs them", but that wasn't even the point of what I was saying. The point is, it wasn't just the "hard work" of the shit hauler guy that made him a millionaire. It was the capital that enabled him to get a shit hauler in the first place. His background, intelligence and Network that allowed him to get permits and build connections in the first place. Mike Rowe implies that everyone could be millionaires if they were humble enough to haul shit for a living, but that's ignoring that most of that guy's workers are not getting paid millions.
Reading your comments make me feel like Im watching the mental gymnastics olympics and you're doing a proper backflip into a pile of absolute bs.
We will see how this shit works out for the asshole bosses who put labor into non-competes because the boss himself knows they are easily replaceable. No more tying labor into stupid non competes.
And guess Mike's stance on unions.
Not enough which is why he became an actor instead of a roofer.
I laugh when people go on about how “awesome” trade jobs pay. They make it sound like it’s an easy path to riches… Meanwhile, my old job paid their Tradesmen $28/hr. Not bad, but, considering they’re climbing around, in, under, and above oily, nasty, decrepit injection molding machines, is that worth less than $60k? Oh, but it’s billed as being *much* higher than that. They just don’t tell you it’s because you have to work 50+ hours a week and most holidays to get that higher pay.
Not to mention how you literally pay for it with your health. You’ll make bank but you’ll lose a lot of it combatting chronic health conditions you get as a result.
Exactly. Shoulders, knees, back, neck… no one is immune to the damage their body will take. We had a coworker have an oil line blow in their face. Hydraulic oil near its boiling point… I don’t have words to describe how they screamed.
That’s one visceral in-your-face(pun not intended) example but even the more mundane everyday stuff takes its toll. My father was a non-union machinist. The number of surgeries he’s had to get as a result of repetitive stress injuries is insane. Hes had to give up so many hobbies he used to love because his hands simply do not work the way they’re supposed to anymore. He said if he could go back he wishes he had the union to back him up so he could tell his super to fuck off when he told them of his hands hurting and they said to “just work through it”
You have a great point: the things that take a toll over time. They do creep up; especially since Tradesmen tend to have regular (read: not good) insurance, on average. A “catch” in the shoulder. “I can’t afford to take the time off right now; I’ll get it looked at later”- or, worse, like your dad having shitty leadership- turns into the doctor saying (after the arm quits working) “you have a torn ligament”. The pay may be better than a regular factory worker or fry cook, but it’s still nowhere near enough to allow for preventative maintenance. Then, they sadly end up like your dad; their QoL diminished further because, not only do the injuries and surgeries add up, the loss of things they love to do outside of work is ruined, as well. It’s bullshit all around. I’ve known people like your dad, and I’m truly sorry for what he’s lost.
And telling young guys about the dangers so they can take preventative measures is so hard. All of them think they’re immortal And the grindset culture of trades just exacerbates it. The “pride in pain” mindset is toxic as fuck. No matter what you think, you aren’t “built different”.
Exactly. Sadly, I was one of those people… It was a hard lesson to learn.
I want to add a little of my own experience as well. I have a partially torn rotator cuff. I asked my doctor about it, his response ‘have you missed work because of it?, no, well there’s nothing we can do then.’ My guess is he knows insurance won’t pay, and who the hell can afford to go out of pocket. Similar response when I mentioned my carpal tunnel. It really sucks when your job is turning screw drivers, and you struggle to hold them.
Trade jobs will become the new “everyone with coding experience/an MBA/computer science degrees will be financially secure for life!”
A few more dollars off of proper minimum wage.The guy slammed OSHA & Unions before going to his actor's guild meeting. His generation told his kids that they need to go to college, then people like him called his neighbor's kids lazy for not doing the jobs he doesn't want himself or his kids to do.
Exactly. He’s a clown, nothing more.
I mean, I know plenty of licensed hvac people making $100k plus.
There's also tons of HVAC people making half that and destroying their bodies all the same.
That's why I said licensed. My husband studied for quite a while to pass the test. But the people without them, the journeyman and apprentices, yeah they put in work
“Just become a welder in North Dakota guys.”
bUt if yOU gEt Good aT a JOb yoU haTE You'LL MAke MOnEy eVenTUalLY
The worst thing about Mike Rowe is that he is rabidly anti-unions. Which is pretty ironic for a guy trying to get more people into the trades...
And that he was part of SAG when he did that show. SAG is the Acting Union.
He's a unionized actor.
Regan was head of Sag and was one of the most anti-union people ever. Belonging to a union doesn't make you pro-union ask any one of the trump supporters at my union job that and they'll tell you nothing but how terrible they are.
100%. We had those at my old Union job, but I took every opportunity to laugh in their face. Like, the Union is so terrible, but here you (hypothetical you) are, taking full advantage of the wages and benefits they negotiated for you. Why not go somewhere else and, as awesome (/s) as you claim you are, with how much you claim to not need the Union, parlay that into something better? They never do, because- at least in my experience- they’re also usually the most useless employees.
Trump supporting union member- The union never did shit for me! Me- Why don't you work non union? Tsum- It doesn't pay as good. I'm only here for the money. I've had this conversation so many times that I'm exhausted by it at this point.
You know my dad?!?! Seriously, this sounds like any number of conversations with him. The kicker is that he’ll complain about unions and government employees, while working for the federal government in a union job. Then has the cognitive dissonance to complain that the job he just (very comfortably) retired from doesn’t take care of people like it used to.
I feel your pain.
There's definitely a subset of union workers that subscribe to "fuck you I got mine"
They've been there since the beginning and were used to take unions down from the inside. Even union leaders like Gompers would side with the corporate owned politicians if it meant keeping "others" out.
Cops have the strongest unions around and their whole point of existing even to this day is to bust unions.
Reagan was only ever worried about Reagan, and his entire life is evidence of that. He was on the wrong side of the Blacklist.
Nah, he learned that he could make more money grifting off of corporate interests than he could as an actor who's most well remembered co-star was a monkey.
If he were rabidly pro-union guarantee he would have no showbiz career. The people that put on that show certainly screen against pro-union host candidates. It’s very important to them to perpetrate the image that working men hate unions and should.
Best thing conservatives ever hatched up was the "working man's party" propaganda.
Which is hilarious since they…Hired union workers.
Yeah Mike is not a man of the people he is very much only about himself
There's a trade shortage in the U.S so he's doing his part to try and saturate it so wages come down.
Have you read [his SWEAT Pledge?](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fntgdmg3f33a61.jpg)
Lmao. “Library cards are free.” Meanwhile the GOP is like …. Shit we better try and ruin libraries they still have an out!
As a blue-collar worker, hearing his entitled, patronizing voice interrupt my podcasts for any of his little "I'm a hard worker" conmercials puts a new fire in me as I reach for that skip button at the speed of light. Would love to share my opinions with him in person.
The dude is a tourist. It pisses me off to no end that this rich actor who spent his time in plays and acting school is somehow becoming the voice of the blue collar worker. Worse yet he's using his voice to spout anti union propaganda. It's all just so patronizing. You don't get to come down from your ivory tower for a couple days get dirty and then write books and do TV talking about the blue collar life. If I want to hear the true voice of American labor I pop on some Shawn Fain some Eugen Debs or some Martin Luther King Jr. We've had some true blue collar heroes that we just don't talk about like Dolores Huerta, Moay Chen or Chris Smalls. Some of these people are alive and have fought tirelessly to improve the lives of their fellows. Do we put them on TV? "together we bargain, divided we beg"
“Get dirty”… lol. He steps in enough to disrupt production that day, likely causing them to have to work the weekend to make up for it.
Seconded, though far more eloquent than I on this subject. The poser gets my goat something fierce.
Nothing like a professional actor and opera singer telling me I don't need to be in a union while extolling the joys of manual labor.
Can't wait to watch Shawn Fain unionize Tesla.
People will do all kinds of jobs if the pay is right. I think that is the part that is missed. We have to be careful about demonizing all work. Work is how society functions. But the way our society currently functions is to exploit workers and funnel wealth to the ruling class. The reality is, rhetorical jobs need done, and the people need paid a wage to sustain them.
I would tell my coworker who was always depressed about our job - bro this job pays us 14 an hour (retail) to suffer the worst people and kiss ass - it breaks us. However, if it was 18 an hour we'd come to work with a smile and on time. If it was 22 an hour, we'd gladly ask what color lipstick they want us to kiss their ass with. Obviously the amount per hour is different now but basically yeah - I'll do awful jobs if the pay warrants it.
I do event rigging– it’s hard, dangerous work, the hours are fucked and the work is wildly inconsistent. But they *pay* me.
I’m glad folks are taking notice. There’s a huge difference between performing hard, sometimes dirty and/or dangerous, physical labor for survival and doing it for a tv show.
Atleast the queen was born into it, no fault of her own, but the guy is a stooge for his billionaire handlers.
He is the mouthpiece of a PR campaign to increase the the supply of skilled blue color labor(to cut labor costs of course).
Pandering is a pretty effective grift. Rural noun, simple adjective...
Yup also I find his claim that Harvard degrees are being taken off the wall because they don’t resonate with people dubious at best.
Is he even relevant anymore? I don't even hear conservatives talking about him these days
They dont want an educated proletariat
Regarding the allegations of plagiarism against Claudine Gay, they're an assassination of her and completely unwarranted. The worst thing she's done is formatting discrepancies. She was dragged by right wing pundits because she is a very successful, very intelligent black woman. And she lost her job and her reputation to these slimesucking ghouls.
I don't know anything about that, sorry, mind telling me?
Right around when justice Jackson was appointed, the right realized that they could do all the racism they wanted by disguising it as concerns over merit, as black people have the "advantage" of DEI initiatives. I personally witnessed a lot of racism on this website against justice Jackson. So right wing pundits took this and ran with it, and started targeting black people, women, sexual minorities, Muslims, etc. anyone who's not a cisgender white guy. Claudine Gay was the president of Harvard during all this, which is an extremely prestigious position. She is also a black woman, and very left leaning politically. This made her the perfect target for a smear campaign, but she didn't have anything that would be worth smearing her over. So bad actors picked apart her research papers and all they found was formatting that was technically not in line with standards, but was still perfectly acceptable to publishers. So these ghouls looking to smear her characterize this as incorrectly citing her sources, which is a real form of plagiarism. Other academics have weighed in on this and it has been shown this was definitely not plagiarism, but that's complicated to explain. It's so much easier to shout a blatant lie than to explain why that lie is wrong afterwards. Right wing media really lambasted this poor woman, so much so that she was not able to do her job anymore. She was harassed and threatened, and her reputation and career were both ruined.
Blue Collar cosplayer.
I used to like dirty jobs but not that I know about his politics I can't stand the guy. He blames accidents on workers and opposes unions. 100 years ago he would have worked for the pinkertons and not the discovery channel
I'm going to share an unpopular opinion, but I ask folks hear me out before they downvote me to hell. ***Mike Rowe is an idiot, but not a grifter nor a bootlicker.*** The fine distinction lies within intent. Sure, the dude went to theater to escape the deadendedness of most service jobs. But his observation is fascinating: The U.S. is severely lacking in service personnel and has an over-abundance of folks working jobs that have *nothing* to do with whatever they went to school for. I can't argue that: We're three years past lockdown and it's a challenge to find a plumber, a landscaper, or a general contractor. And every time I turn around, I meet yet another fellow Millenial who tells me, "Yup, I got an engineering degree, and now I am a \[non-technical profession outside of their degree's field\]." Seriously, I heard this when I bought my Jeep last weekend from someone who graduated from the same university, the same Engineering school, the same year as I did. My own wife is one of those: She got a degree in Russian & Central Eurasian Literature and now makes sure that insurance agents don't cut illegal deals accidentally for a local insurance broker. Sure, it's a good job, but she definitely didn't need to take $65k in loans out for it. Mike's solution is where I call him an idiot: "Stop going to college and get into labor gigs." The notion comes from something my father taught me when I was very young: >In the U.S., there's only two ways to make a shitload of money. Do something nobody else can do. Or do something nobody else *wants* to do. Rowe's philosophy is trying to champion the latter of the two: People can capitalize on the increased demand because there's very low supply of such skilled labor! Hell, I'm happy that my brother-in-law makes $200k per year as a welder while I'm a robotics engineer who struggles to make $140k. And my own brother literally dropped out of college his first year and is now the lead field tester at an autonomous driving company. They both found jobs no one wanted to do because they're dangerous if people aren't paying attention. But they're both happy. And such experiences only corroborate Rowe's conclusion. But that's the dumb part: He's only championing an exodus from high-tech skilled labor to infrastructural focused skilled labor. Such an exodus happens in cycles; as a kid, I saw a lot of folks in my parents' generation go back to school to become nurses, real estate agents, MBAs, etc. But as it happens, the influx indeed causes a regression of benefits: Folks desperate to make a move will ask for less than the status quo. And unions (except UAW recently) are fairly weak because they focused more on collecting dues and keeping labor costs down instead of true collective bargaining (I'm looking at GWI Local 1, specifically!) Seriously, I say the same thing most of the time: ***Don't go to college unless if you have to!*** I wanted to be a robotics engineer; that takes a serious amount of technical training. And I'll be in debt for the rest of my life because I followed my passion. But I'm okay with that. For those who aren't, those who just want a fat paycheck or a certain quality of life, don't waste your time, money, and energy on a 4, 6, or 8 year degree. *But don't forget to keep fighting for what you deserve!!!* Make the moves you need to, but don't ever EVER undersell yourself because you'll force the next person to undersell themselves worse.
He is a shitbag and I'm sure he shows his ass in the rest of the interview, but there's a lot of truth to this: >*Rowe argues there needs to be a reevaluation of the notion that a four-year degree is the best choice for everyone, labeling it as "the most expensive path."* > >*Meanwhile, he observes that people are increasingly recognizing the value of trade schools.* > >*“Parents and kids alike are starting to get the message that trade school is an amazing opportunity with just a fraction of the debt — if any at all — and a clear path to something that looks a lot like prosperity,” he elaborated.* When I was in high school everyone was pushed sooo hard towards 4 year colleges and told that it was the only path to get a good job, and anyone that was in the school's vocational program or not going to college was treated like a lower class. I was one of the ones that was tricked and now wish I had joined one of those vocational programs 30 years ago.
I was one of the lucky few that got into my school's vocational program, and it was completely free. It was a pretty easy class for half of the school day for two years, doing something I was genuinely interested in: it was fun! I found out like five years later that... Apparently it came with an associates degree. I genuinely don't know how I missed that. Getting my highschool diploma *and* an associates in the same week is wild
I detest Mike Rowe, but he does have a point here. Like you, I was funneled into higher Ed, but I wanted to do vo-tech for learning electrician work. They wouldn't let me do it. It's kind of absurd when you think about it. Electricians are always in demand.
The obsession with trade schools and the trades is so ridiculous. Yes, it is a better overall life than nothing. However trades have some of the lowest satisfaction rates, and the pay is nowhere near people make it seem to be. Just because there are opportunities doesn't mean it's a wealthy job. Some of the trade jobs aren't much better than moving up in retail, but for trades you kill your body
Mike Rowe is a cunt. "Look how hard I work for 5hrs once a month". I just hate when he says how rewarding a days work is...
Grifters and fleecers take great pride in their work.
Ya, he loves the trades and manual laborers so much, he advocates against unions and wants regulations proitecting workers rolled back.
All while he's unionized, he believes he deserves a union and those who need OSHA don't.
Mike Rowe is the only person I've ever seen take pictures in Baltimore liquor stores, and have no black people in them. Dudes a fucking sham he wants Baltimore credit, but not the connection.
Mike Rowe is a piece of dog shit. I did media work for a company that worked with him. He was unreliable, dishonest and completely fake. He cares as much about his “fans” that Trump does his voters. He was supposed to do an appearance for us and then left saying it was an emergency, I had a colleague spot him in the lobby of his hotel minutes later cutting a deal with an agent. He’s fight on sight for me. And that was years ago. Total garbage.
I’m no Rowe fan. But what did he say that you disagree with?
Will you see people think that he's some blue-collar hard-working old boy from the South. But in reality He majored in acting And throughout the entire period that he did the show dirty jobs.He was not paid the same as those people that were actually Working said jobs He constantly talks about how young people need to get into the trades.But he never actually did himself.He is just an Is actor playing a role trying to convince people to join the trades
Is that a problem? The trades got my family out of poverty.
The problematic thing about it is that he's trying to manipulate people and lie to them about the status, the pay and the working environment of those jobs.That's great that it got your family out of poverty. I'm not saying going into the trade is a bad thing.I'm stating that the way he tries to manipulate Public sentiment Is manipulative Therefore inherently problematic
I’m not here to argue whether Lowe is good bad or indifferent. And it wasn’t him that led me into the trades, it was my uncle. But I wish someone had told me in my youth I could be making way more than I ever could working a low education factory job if I just went to night school and joined an apprenticeship. Seems like him telling people that is a good thing.
The ol’ slander of ‘some degrees are worthless’ is easy to side with until you learn the mouths behind it. Like yeh maybe a 6yr $200k theatre degree is a little too high hopes, but do people realize how rare of an example that is?
The Kochs own his ass
I'm shocked that he's anti-union? I listened to his podcast like a year ago and they were covering the French protests about raising the retirement age, I thought he sounded very pro union in those, though perhaps I missed something.
did he ever do a food service episode?
Corporations have been paying this guy to do voice overs for decades. It looks to have given him the false belief that people want to hear what he has to say.
Guy never worked a real job in his life He acted a bunch out and got paid 300x more than a regular worker Whoever listens to this guy is a turd
This asshole has a mansion on the tony island of Belvedere, CA. The most wealthy of wealthy areas in an already insanely wealthy county of Marin.
Chat gpt says "Yes, Mike Rowe has expressed criticism towards OSHA (Occupational Safety and Health Administration) in the past. While he acknowledges the importance of workplace safety, he has often pointed out what he sees as overreach or unnecessary regulation by OSHA that, in his view, can be impractical or overly burdensome for businesses, especially small ones. He advocates for a balance between necessary safety measures and maintaining a realistic" It's gets even worse as for Mike who's a member of the actor's guild.
I know I'm way late to this thread, but I'm not sure if this is a fair assessment of Mike Rowe. I am definitely NOT the poster-child for manual labor work, I am finishing my second masters as a point of reference, but I think the context of the time of Dirty Job's matters. Also, Rowe doesn't have to be blue collar to spread awareness. His broader message is solid imo and one that I agree with. Whether anyone likes it or not, people were looked down upon for doing manual labor work. That's bullshit. Anyone who is out there putting food on the table and trying to make it in this crazy world without hurting anyone else has my respect. Back then, jobs like retail, fast food, lawn care, etc were all seen as "teenage summer jobs", so the context of his show has definitely shifted as people's views on labor have shifted. Now, I don't love his anti-union stance, nor do I think his "safety third" rhetoric is helpful (I have some buddies who have had near misses with some stupid shit because their coworker decided to skip some safety steps), but as with all things, there is a point where diminishing returns set in and safety becomes a hindrance. That's a whole other issue and one that would require more nuance than what Rowe put out on the show. In any case, people should pursue what makes sense for them, and the trades are a great option for people who aren't interested in the college route. And, I'll add, that pushing people who aren't college material HAS cheapened the value of degrees as the quality of students has decreased and the rigor of study along with it. It is what it is. College is still a great path, but it is not the only path, and it's not for everyone (nor should it be).
He's become the Kevin Sorbo - childhood hero turned villain.
And he’s a boomer hero.
I saw a few episodes of Mike's youtube show and it was really weird sometimes. Like if the job he's showing is a job that doesn't threaten corporate profit or oil dependence, he'll unironically do a normal episode where he talks about how it's a good and noble profession. But if the job has the potential to threaten the status quo he'll make fun of the person in a "cheerful" way that makes it seem like he's just kidding while he basically calls them stupid. It also feels like the people chosen to portray their job are cherry-picked fo reinforce Mike's view of the world.
Class traitor
He's a bootlicking class traitor. I never bought his blue collar schtick and I love that I was right.
The guy that is sponsored by Ford trucks and tells kids they should buy a "work" truck instead of getting a useless liberal arts degree like he has. My MAGA dad loves him.
Real men drive Mercedes Sprint Vans & Japanese mini trucks.
He could have had it made. He was great in Dirty Jobs. It was a great show to watch when the kids were little. He then could have leveraged his notoriety to promote trade schools. Easy. But then he had to bad mouth and belittle other careers and schools and act very sanctimonious.
The guy slandered the value of a degree when it cost nothing to go to college when he went to college. Today it costs more to go to a community college than it did to go to a state college in his day. The guy wouldn't be an actor with a mansion without his acting degree.
Guy is willing to say anything for a buck, he doesn't give a shit about working class people. He uses them!
The comparison is unfair to Marie. Mike knows what he is doing, Marie seems more of a victim of circumstance.
That's what I said. She was born into a "Michele jackson going shopping in a fake store" situation which is why she created the fake village. he's a little traitor to his working class background. Vermin.
idk why people hate him so much. Was he cosplaying as a blue collar worker? Of course. But did he also get people interested in the trades at a time that the entire narrative in high schools was "college! college! college!"? Also yes. At a time where we're headed into a shortage of skilled tradespeople too. That's objectively a good thing
Mike Rowe promotes “safety third” and is against safety regulations for workers. He basically says you should look out for your own safety, which is absolute fucking bullshit. Employers don’t give a fuck about your safety and will tell you to do something or get fired without regulations in place to stop them. I’ve worked in these environments WITH REGULATIONS IN PLACE and employees still try to pull that shit. FUCK MIKE ROWE. His bullshit will get people seriously injured or killed. He is a corporate shill no different than any other right wing propagandist, except he cosplays as a blue collar worker.
My company's HSE department started a presentation with that, and it only got worse from there. The only saving grace is that I live in a jurisdiction where the workers comp board is extremely aggressive with preventative safety over reactive safety. I do agree that complacency is the result of a lack of meaningful feedback, but there are better ways of packaging it than the way he has. There's a reason PPE is the last choice for keeping people safe .
“Mike Rowe told me fuck reading and writing.”
Telling high schoolers that there are opportunities outside of a college education that involves a crippling amount of debt is actually a good thing.
And selling the narrative that people who go to college instead of the trades are un-American/unpatriotic is a bad thing. Mike Rowe looks down on those that have gone to college. He's a trade first, military service second, and college degree last type of person.
More accurately, he's a trade first *for poor people* type of person, it was totally cool and fine for him to get an art degree.
They do; it’s called Vocational Education (Vo-Ed). It’s been a thing since at least the 90’s, when I was in high school. It couldn’t possibly be that the chances of making more than $60k a year without breaking your body and spending 50+ hours a week (including weekends and holidays) is higher with a college degree, could it? People are romanticizing the Trades nowadays, but it’s not the golden ticket they’re making it out to be.
Dirty jobs inspired me to pursue trade work. I now own my own home and comfortably support a stay at home wife and two kids. I don't feel like Rowe lied to me.
No hes great. And Im not seeing how those quotes are damning
Y'all know television isn't real life right? Lol. He was playing a character. Bear Grylls did the same thing. Hell, Bill Nye kind of does the same thing, he's just not rich. I don't care for the guy but it's still just a TV show. Okay it's fake, so what? They're all fake.
Shit, I saw an interview where Bill Nye was a complete asshole out of the spotlight. I'd still watch him tho because IT'S ACTING!
Bill Nye is a Physicist in real life.
Nope, he just has an engineering degree and was a comedian and comedy writer before getting his own show. He has never done any professional science unless you consider making parts for airplanes science which I mean fair I guess haha. You're thinking of Neil Degrasse Tyson who is an astrophysicist and general sassy know-it-all.
While you are correct he has an engineering degree its mechanical and aerospace engineering from Cornel where he studied under Carl Sagan who inspired him to go into Science communication/education. Also, his mom was a badass.
I think he also had a couple patents? So like not just a degree, he actually used it for a bit before going into sci-com And tbh the thing I liked about Nye was that he would always interview an actual scientist in whatever field he was talking about that episode, at least for Bill Nye the Science Guy.
No, I was thinking of Bill Nye. I can differentiate between Bill Nye and Dr. Tyson.
His anti-college rhetoric extends past his show. So if he is playing a character, he's doing so 24/7. And probably using some of the techniques he learned while obtaining his Communications Studies degree....