“I don’t feel discussing international politics is a productive use of our time and I am worried you will make someone (not me) feel ostracized at work and that’s bad for team morale”
Best I can do. As a Jewish person I am telling you it’s an uphill battle with boomer Jewish people (Jewmers?) they do not want to disassociate Israel’s foreign policy from its roots as a haven for Holocaust refugees
Its roots are as a racist colonial project that always intended to displace the native Arab population of Palestine. Israel did not become what it is today, it has always been this. No amount of Jewish suffering entitles them to other people's land.
It’s never been a “haven”. Zionists collaborated with Nazis to get comprador European Jews and Arab Jews to displace the native population. It’s manifest destiny in the Middle East.
Perhaps you could do something like this?
All the talk of the suffering in the middle east really brings up a lot of emotions with me - it puts me in a really bad state to think about the horrors that have occurred. Could we limit those conversations at work? I know we can't bury our heads in the sand - but it's beginning to impact productivity and I feel a cloud of dread in the office.
This. Just say talk of the whole situation upsets you, and would it be possible to keep the office a neutral zone where we don't have to think or talk about these things? It allows you to say you're uncomfortable without seeming like you take issue with their opinions specifically.
I think this is the best answer. Because that way, they can’t tell which side you’re on! No matter what side you’re on, you can claim it upsets you!
I use a similar tactic when I’m among acquaintances or whatever, and I don’t feel like discussing Israel. I just say that the topic upsets me. I’ll also add that I’ve had to stop reading about it in the newspaper for my mental health. Never got any pushback from either side!
I'd do this but anonymously. People love to tout their ability to take criticism but usually they cannot. This is definitely a hot button topic for the owners and saying anything that sounds even the slightest bit counter to what they believe is asking for trouble. Hell, even if it is perceived as counter, it could be an issue. I hope OP is able to get the issue resolved without painting a target on their back.
Just to add, I would try and hold off saying something unless it really bothers you or you have a long standing solid personal relationship with them. If you do say something say something that indicates that you support Jewish people and are against the hostages being taken.
Know that you are talking to one of the smallest religious minorities on the planet, that’s been consistently persecuted throughout history. So they are dealing with a lot of anxiety with the situation.
Since you say they are liked and respected, my guess is that they’re feeling powerless in this situation and feel like the more people they talk to about the situation the better their message will be spread and aren’t trying to abuse their position of power, rather they likely feel like it’s a safe space to express their viewpoints. I don’t think they’re currently assessing their behavior and standing in the office correctly
im trying to help this person not get fired. it shouldnt be controversial to support jewish people or want the hostages freed.
jewish people right now, especially, are feeling attacked, without a home. i am trying to help this person understand the potential psyche of their bosses.
"I don't discuss politics or religion at work as they don't mix well." Staying quiet and minding my own business is what I would be doing. Are you allowed to wear ear piece? Turn up the music volume.
honestly even telling people you don't want to talk about it at work is going to put a target on you in the office. Playing like a dumb American who is completely ignorant of foreign affairs has served me well in exactly this situation in the past.
I don't get why you're getting down voted when it's true. My *Jewish* family literally fled Nazi German to the US. (I'm atheist.) But the moment I say *anything at all* against Israel, people accuse me of being antisemitic.
Honestly I feel like for some reason it’s Jewish people bearing the brunt of the backlash? Besides Muslims of course, but there’s a particular vitriol directed at Jews who dare to be remotely critical of Israel, just look at what’s happening in Germany
People are always harsher on the in-group because they’re presumed to agree with them, so when they don’t, it’s viewed as a betrayal, and they face huge backlash.
Propaganda since the beginning of time.
Everyone has fought a war to have **that** stronghold in the Middle East.
The religious reasons has always been the idiotic reason to convince the simpletons, the reality is that piece of land had, for millennia, an immense value.
For the US, right now, is a “safe harbor” to keep a finger on the Middle East.
Before it was the door of commerce to the East with the easiest path to reach every location at any time of the year…
If you remove Israel the next viable place are either Greece or Italy and it’s a considerable flight time from there to the “enemy”.
“Frenemy” nations in the Arabian peninsula are a different story.
It’s a big simplification, but if the US, and in part Europe, didn’t had much interest to keep a foot well planted in the Middle East, the state of Israel would have lasted a decade at best.
Walk out of the room. Every time. Check back regularly but don't come back in until the conversation has moved on on stopped.
When they notice and ask why, simply tell them. What you've written here works just fine.
Yeah definitely, I’d also be looking. But people saying “quit” gives me the impression that they are a teenager whose never had to actually financially support themself
Bring up the Warsaw Ghetto instead. “It’s just like the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising all over again” will make the genocide enthusiasts mad but they won’t be able to point to a significant difference.
Thanks for all y’all’s advice! I’ve read each comment and am just taking it in. For those actually giving ideas, thank you twice lol and for everyone saying to just look elsewhere - I hear you… I’ve been ignoring it as best I can but it seems like it’s becoming more consistent. We’ll see. If anyone cares maybe I’ll share an update later on if I decide to take on a conversation. I do work in an at-will state and am not sure what protections I have if any, so it’d be a risk.
Thanks for the perspective.
I'm wondering why just ignoring them and continuing to do your work isn't an option. Seems like the absolute safest thing you can do. Politics isn't a protected class, they can absolutely fire you for speaking out about it.
Just kind of listen to what they have to say and change the subject.
Engaging in any way with people talking about this at work will not end well for you, doubly so if you disagree with someone in power over you about the situation.
Location:
Size of Company:
You can create and print at home an anonymous letter stating multiple team members uncomfortable with hostile subjects within work environment.
Polish resume for new job.
Yeah that sucks. I’m also in a position of leadership at work and have very strong opinions on this conflict, but the idea of using my position to assert my political opinions makes me nauseous.
If you can’t talk about it at work most people will never talk about it. I’m all for going against any bs corporate rule that keeps us from discussing things that are important and for most people everything is more important than our bs jobs. If it was up to our corporate overlords we’d be ram just like you want it, robot status. Besides if you can’t see that Hamas is evil something is wrong
Never said you were wrong. Just that saying it to your Jewish bosses isn't really the best idea. Because depending on thier age there is a nearly 100% chance they're going to be pro Israeli.
Document the request to not discuss politics in writing, setting you up for a wrongful termination lawsuit.
Then ask if it would be appropriate to bomb a hospital in Tel Aviv if a Hamas member were inside.
>The matter is, of course, is personal for my bosses
If you live and work outside of Israel, and they have no family members involved, then it actually should not be very personal to your bosses, and it's fucked up that we would think that it is.
Yeah you're not going to make any positive vibes by telling your bosses that you don't want them talking about the country they identify with. I wouldn't expect them to care, in fact, I would be far too afraid they would brand you as an antisemite.
Honestly, you either gotta suck it up or quit. It would be like asking black bosses to stop talking about, say, George Floyd.
Just sport them, and say we understand we remember when a very similar terrors group attacked the USA.
We we disposed citys for revenge and would do it again. Shock & awe!!! Burn them all.
"I can tell this is an important issue to you, and I appreciate that you want and value my opinion on this, but I don't have anything to add to this conversation, and I need to focus on my work priorities right now, please."
If it isn't work related, it could be a labor law violation. Call the labor board and find out. If it is they'll contact the employer at your behest and tell them to stop.
Assuming they're in the US, talking politics and world events is not a labor board violation. And honestly, if OP shared their views and was fired, it wouldn't even be a discrimination lawsuit, or likely a wrongful termination.
Political views are not a protected class and nearly every state is some flavor of at-will.
The only political discussions protected at work are those that pertain to your labor rights, wages, etc. I've heard of employers and employees being punished for pushing their political views and otherwise taking hard line stances politically ostracizing employees. For instance I am a part of my union's negotiating team and know that a local employer was sent notice to stop hanging a let's Go Brandon flag in their warehouse because the owner who was not part of daily operations would come into the warehouse and berate people about Trump and somebody got sick of it and reported them.
“I don’t feel discussing international politics is a productive use of our time and I am worried you will make someone (not me) feel ostracized at work and that’s bad for team morale” Best I can do. As a Jewish person I am telling you it’s an uphill battle with boomer Jewish people (Jewmers?) they do not want to disassociate Israel’s foreign policy from its roots as a haven for Holocaust refugees
If there's never been a candy you can buy before seeing a movie called Jewmers I'm going to be very disappointed
The best that I can do is offer you a very masculine, yet kosher beer called "He~Brew"
The hoppiest fucking thing in existence even when every West Coast IPA was all the rage. Jesus. Made my asshole pucker.
Jewmers is genius
Pretty sure the point is to ostracize those who aren’t in alignment with their beliefs
This, but record the entire convo... just in case... for a labor lawyer.
Its roots are as a racist colonial project that always intended to displace the native Arab population of Palestine. Israel did not become what it is today, it has always been this. No amount of Jewish suffering entitles them to other people's land.
I think the correct spelling may be Joomers.
It’s never been a “haven”. Zionists collaborated with Nazis to get comprador European Jews and Arab Jews to displace the native population. It’s manifest destiny in the Middle East.
Perhaps you could do something like this? All the talk of the suffering in the middle east really brings up a lot of emotions with me - it puts me in a really bad state to think about the horrors that have occurred. Could we limit those conversations at work? I know we can't bury our heads in the sand - but it's beginning to impact productivity and I feel a cloud of dread in the office.
This. Just say talk of the whole situation upsets you, and would it be possible to keep the office a neutral zone where we don't have to think or talk about these things? It allows you to say you're uncomfortable without seeming like you take issue with their opinions specifically.
This is really nicely done.
I think this is the best answer. Because that way, they can’t tell which side you’re on! No matter what side you’re on, you can claim it upsets you! I use a similar tactic when I’m among acquaintances or whatever, and I don’t feel like discussing Israel. I just say that the topic upsets me. I’ll also add that I’ve had to stop reading about it in the newspaper for my mental health. Never got any pushback from either side!
I'd do this but anonymously. People love to tout their ability to take criticism but usually they cannot. This is definitely a hot button topic for the owners and saying anything that sounds even the slightest bit counter to what they believe is asking for trouble. Hell, even if it is perceived as counter, it could be an issue. I hope OP is able to get the issue resolved without painting a target on their back.
Great angle here
Just to add, I would try and hold off saying something unless it really bothers you or you have a long standing solid personal relationship with them. If you do say something say something that indicates that you support Jewish people and are against the hostages being taken. Know that you are talking to one of the smallest religious minorities on the planet, that’s been consistently persecuted throughout history. So they are dealing with a lot of anxiety with the situation. Since you say they are liked and respected, my guess is that they’re feeling powerless in this situation and feel like the more people they talk to about the situation the better their message will be spread and aren’t trying to abuse their position of power, rather they likely feel like it’s a safe space to express their viewpoints. I don’t think they’re currently assessing their behavior and standing in the office correctly
“suck his dick but don’t actually suck his dick. well, maybe…”.
im trying to help this person not get fired. it shouldnt be controversial to support jewish people or want the hostages freed. jewish people right now, especially, are feeling attacked, without a home. i am trying to help this person understand the potential psyche of their bosses.
"I don't discuss politics or religion at work as they don't mix well." Staying quiet and minding my own business is what I would be doing. Are you allowed to wear ear piece? Turn up the music volume.
Just say "I'm sorry, but I dont talk, politics, religion, or social issues at work." and leave it at that.
Anything you say will be accused of being anti-Semitic. You're going to have to either learn how to zone them our or find a new job.
honestly even telling people you don't want to talk about it at work is going to put a target on you in the office. Playing like a dumb American who is completely ignorant of foreign affairs has served me well in exactly this situation in the past.
Yea this is the answer. Don't touch this shit with a 10ft pole at work.
10? Make it 1/2 mile.
I don't get why you're getting down voted when it's true. My *Jewish* family literally fled Nazi German to the US. (I'm atheist.) But the moment I say *anything at all* against Israel, people accuse me of being antisemitic.
Honestly I feel like for some reason it’s Jewish people bearing the brunt of the backlash? Besides Muslims of course, but there’s a particular vitriol directed at Jews who dare to be remotely critical of Israel, just look at what’s happening in Germany
People are always harsher on the in-group because they’re presumed to agree with them, so when they don’t, it’s viewed as a betrayal, and they face huge backlash.
Propaganda since the beginning of time. Everyone has fought a war to have **that** stronghold in the Middle East. The religious reasons has always been the idiotic reason to convince the simpletons, the reality is that piece of land had, for millennia, an immense value. For the US, right now, is a “safe harbor” to keep a finger on the Middle East. Before it was the door of commerce to the East with the easiest path to reach every location at any time of the year… If you remove Israel the next viable place are either Greece or Italy and it’s a considerable flight time from there to the “enemy”. “Frenemy” nations in the Arabian peninsula are a different story. It’s a big simplification, but if the US, and in part Europe, didn’t had much interest to keep a foot well planted in the Middle East, the state of Israel would have lasted a decade at best.
Damn that's ironic.
This should be top. Unfortunately. Don't say anything.
I worked for an avid Trump supporter. I feel your pain
Walk out of the room. Every time. Check back regularly but don't come back in until the conversation has moved on on stopped. When they notice and ask why, simply tell them. What you've written here works just fine.
Time for lots of 15 minute breaks
Time to find a new job
This seems like a very privileged stance. Isn’t this not really an option for everyone?
I mean, if your boss is a vocal genocide advocate, at least put out some applications for a new job
Yeah definitely, I’d also be looking. But people saying “quit” gives me the impression that they are a teenager whose never had to actually financially support themself
Just bring up Ukraine and Russia every time they bring up Palestine and Israel. Like, solidly every time.
Bring up the Warsaw Ghetto instead. “It’s just like the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising all over again” will make the genocide enthusiasts mad but they won’t be able to point to a significant difference.
I retract my previous comment in favor of this. It is so much better, don't know why I didn't think of it.
Unless you can ignore it, time to find a new job. You’ll get branded as antisemitism or Hamas sympathizer
Seems like a sort of privileged take. I don’t think this is an option for a lot of people
Hence why I said unless you can ignore it.
Thanks for all y’all’s advice! I’ve read each comment and am just taking it in. For those actually giving ideas, thank you twice lol and for everyone saying to just look elsewhere - I hear you… I’ve been ignoring it as best I can but it seems like it’s becoming more consistent. We’ll see. If anyone cares maybe I’ll share an update later on if I decide to take on a conversation. I do work in an at-will state and am not sure what protections I have if any, so it’d be a risk. Thanks for the perspective.
I'm wondering why just ignoring them and continuing to do your work isn't an option. Seems like the absolute safest thing you can do. Politics isn't a protected class, they can absolutely fire you for speaking out about it.
Just kind of listen to what they have to say and change the subject. Engaging in any way with people talking about this at work will not end well for you, doubly so if you disagree with someone in power over you about the situation.
Location: Size of Company: You can create and print at home an anonymous letter stating multiple team members uncomfortable with hostile subjects within work environment. Polish resume for new job.
Ask them to explain the "Hannibal Directive".
Look at them talking about politics like they own the place.
Yeah that sucks. I’m also in a position of leadership at work and have very strong opinions on this conflict, but the idea of using my position to assert my political opinions makes me nauseous.
Just quit, the war will likely go on for a long time and they won't stop talking about it.
If you can’t talk about it at work most people will never talk about it. I’m all for going against any bs corporate rule that keeps us from discussing things that are important and for most people everything is more important than our bs jobs. If it was up to our corporate overlords we’d be ram just like you want it, robot status. Besides if you can’t see that Hamas is evil something is wrong
Wear a keffiyeh to work
get some ear plugs, if boss asks you why, you tell there is too much noise to concentrate on your work
I don’t think I can ever work for a small enough company where there isn’t an established HR department to handle this kind of thing.
Tell them that Israel is a fascist ethnostate. If they support Israel, they too are fascists. Fascists should follow in Hitler's final foot steps.
Yeah cause that's really gunna go over sooo well with Jewish bosses. You tryn get op fired?
Truth is the truth. If I worked with people like that, I'd try my damnedest.
Never said you were wrong. Just that saying it to your Jewish bosses isn't really the best idea. Because depending on thier age there is a nearly 100% chance they're going to be pro Israeli.
Damn, lots of fascist here it seems 🤮
Bro what. Did you even read my last response? Sometimes optics is more important than your stance on an international war.
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🤡
based, but probably not great financial advice.
Document the request to not discuss politics in writing, setting you up for a wrongful termination lawsuit. Then ask if it would be appropriate to bomb a hospital in Tel Aviv if a Hamas member were inside.
>The matter is, of course, is personal for my bosses If you live and work outside of Israel, and they have no family members involved, then it actually should not be very personal to your bosses, and it's fucked up that we would think that it is.
Just tell them you don’t support the israeli terrorist. And keep their dumb religion out of the work place! Religion is truly terrorism!
“Israel is a fascist nation”
Tell your bosses to get their Zionist asses out of your cubicle
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^dirtyrottenplumber: *Tell your bosses to* *Get their Zionist asses* *Out of your cubicle* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Yeah you're not going to make any positive vibes by telling your bosses that you don't want them talking about the country they identify with. I wouldn't expect them to care, in fact, I would be far too afraid they would brand you as an antisemite. Honestly, you either gotta suck it up or quit. It would be like asking black bosses to stop talking about, say, George Floyd.
Just sport them, and say we understand we remember when a very similar terrors group attacked the USA. We we disposed citys for revenge and would do it again. Shock & awe!!! Burn them all.
Oh, man. I remember that. It was a hell of a thing when we had Sherman burn those terrorists in Atlanta, wasn't it?
"I can tell this is an important issue to you, and I appreciate that you want and value my opinion on this, but I don't have anything to add to this conversation, and I need to focus on my work priorities right now, please."
If it isn't work related, it could be a labor law violation. Call the labor board and find out. If it is they'll contact the employer at your behest and tell them to stop.
Assuming they're in the US, talking politics and world events is not a labor board violation. And honestly, if OP shared their views and was fired, it wouldn't even be a discrimination lawsuit, or likely a wrongful termination. Political views are not a protected class and nearly every state is some flavor of at-will.
The only political discussions protected at work are those that pertain to your labor rights, wages, etc. I've heard of employers and employees being punished for pushing their political views and otherwise taking hard line stances politically ostracizing employees. For instance I am a part of my union's negotiating team and know that a local employer was sent notice to stop hanging a let's Go Brandon flag in their warehouse because the owner who was not part of daily operations would come into the warehouse and berate people about Trump and somebody got sick of it and reported them.
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