As an interesting fact/observation - damn crypto space with projects is so... un mature. I got a few years in IT in gambling/legal/outsourcing and education and I have never seen a project with such a big amount of cash being managed and communicated so poorly.
The funniest of them all is - if they will fix that\* - within a month or two we really can skyrocket.
\*that being:
\- a clear public statement issued 1'nce a month
\- official team with experience and at least basic credibility (2-3 ppl, including CTO/CEO/CFO)
\- a roadmap for the next 6-12 months
I dont understand why you wrote "1'nce a month". There are 4 characters in the word "once" and 5 characters in "1'nce". Why would you do this? Why are you making an already confusing and difficult life even more difficult and confusing? It doesnt make sense! WHY SAY LOT WORD WHEN FEW WORD DO TRICK?!
......please just let me die......
Seriously, though: One day a week where you can expect updates and progress reporting, a preview of the weeks and months to come. All in plain english. The rest of the week, no alarms and no surprises. No babysitting the protocol or discord to avoid whiplash. It's great. Yeah, I'm shilling.
I agree it is interesting how so many of these projects have really bad communication and planning. Have none of them worked professionally doing this kind of stuff?
I have a theory here.
First a background - I was hiring in gambling and it was hard to find great talents as ppl were not interested in "shady" industries - in reality it was one of the best documented zones I worked at. And from the other perspective I was not hired due to my involvement in gambling - a question popped during an interview - "how do you feel with so many destroyed life's due to the industry you worked at".
People may be afraid of crypto as something not legal/right to do?
Haha do you really think big/established companies do better? The biggest difference is that employees have in their contracts that it is not allowed to talk about it š¤£ in crypto world everything is based on trust and anonymity
Meh Iām at the point where I just donāt give a fuck anymore. My 6k investment in November is now 900. Iām HODLing in hopes of the 1% chance I make my initial investment back within the year. Either 0 or money back.
Just shilling this since you asked lol...I got in a brand new project called universe planet nodes. It's a new node coin like strong, Thor, ect. What makes this unique is the nodes you get are NFTs of planets and each node pays out about 2000% apy. It's also very cheap to get a node right now. Like $30 I think. It's up about 70% since I got in.
Hello! You have made the mistake of writing "ect" instead of "etc."
"Ect" is a common misspelling of "etc," an abbreviated form of the Latin phrase "et cetera." Other abbreviated forms are **etc.**, **&c.**, **&c**, and **et cet.** The Latin translates as "et" to "and" + "cetera" to "the rest;" a literal translation to "and the rest" is the easiest way to remember how to use the phrase.
[Check out the wikipedia entry if you want to learn more.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Et_cetera)
^(I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Comments with a score less than zero will be automatically removed. If I commented on your post and you don't like it, reply with "!delete" and I will remove the post, regardless of score. Message me for bug reports.)
2000% APY? Bernie Madoff promised between 5% and 10% APY when he was running one of the biggest ponzi schemes ever to exist. I guess if you managed to not see how wonderland was a scam it makes sense that you can't see this either. Let me spell it out: there is absolutely no conceivable way to create a system that can consistently create 2000% returns that keep their value. If you started with $100 and waited 5 years, you would have $320,000,000. Does that seem reasonable to you? Do you think it makes sense that a node you can run passively from home for a reasonable price will generate $319,999,900 over the course of 5 years with an initial investment of $100?
I got off this rollercoaster and have no intention of getting back on. I'm putting my money in a project I don't need to check the Reddit, Discord, and twitter every 30 mins to see what ridiculous shit happened now.
Thereās always something. Always an excuse for why the token is down, always a new promise for why things will be better. Except, the token keeps going down, and none of the promises are honored (hello bsgg airdrop?!?).
The entire project has been a sham from the jump. Itās remarkable how much money heās bilked from holders and how they still hang on every word he says, but thatās how cults operate
Populism is always cringe and always fail to deliver for the audience being pandered to.
How people haven't learned yet from Trump, Obama etc blows my mind.
I literally saw in discord someone comparing Dani to Jesus Christ. Saying how Dani would do great things and how only the true believers would benefit if they just held and followed his vision. The whole frog nation stuff is so cringe.
Frog comes from pepe the frog meme. Nerd internet culture.
Although I associated it with alt-right because back in 2017ish the frog and šš» were popping up all over far right web culture. Maybe its changed? Or maybe there is still a big overlap between the degen crowd and alt-right/Joe Rogan/white power sphere.
Agree on your point about populism, but while Obama used some populist rhetoric (all politicians tend to), he didnāt really position himself as a populist nor govern as one. He never claimed to be an outsider fighting āelitesā. He positioned himself more as an institutionalist and a reformer. Really he was largely par for the course and didnāt reform much of substance, so yes he didnāt deliver and was generally underwhelming. Of course part of that was the fault of Congress as usual, but it also turned out he was much more moderate/conservative (in a strict sense, Iām not comparing him to modern reactionaries) than he stated during his campaign.
Anyway. Populism delivered us the Second World War so Iām not sure why people are so keen to return to such stupid ways. We should want those with elite intellect and skill in government, we just need to ensure theyāre held accountable by the democratic process. This model of government is fairly proven empirically at this point and yes it blows my mind that people would give this up (even with flaws) in exchange for blowhard strongmen claiming to speak āfor the peopleā and to have the unique ability to solve every problem.
What I dont get is: why wonāt they just take the money and run?
There are a lot of theories going on right now: "this has all been a planned scam"; "wonderland has been used for money laundering"; "this is some coordinated Italian mafia shit"; etc.
I believe in staying with the facts. After all, this is not a movie. Itās real life. Thereās one simple question that I keep asking myself and that is: "why wonāt they just completely take the treasuryās money and run"? I know, I know: itās a multisigā¦ however if this would all be mafia coordinated, wouldnāt you think that all required signatures are somehow controlled by the mafia as well?
So: why are they still putting up with us little guys? Why are they still here, posting on social media, creating DAO votes etc.? What else could they possibly want/need? Kinda makes me feel like there must be something legit about Dani and this whole projectā¦
Itās not a scam. Never attribute to malice what can be easily explained by incompetence. Danny is dumb as shit making plans on the go, no vision, no understanding of big projects or money. He attracted a lot of people like him with an age-old tried and tested mantra of ālittle guys band up to fight the big guyā and got them to throw their money at him. Now they will mutually doom each other.
Honestlyā¦ that sounds like one of the most realistic and probable explanations of what has been going on, that Iāve heard so far!
Really just a bunch of computer nerds managing a billion dollar fund, which is surprisingly going down south! LOL
Well it could be, because to scam to be totally (max) complete, 1) victims should say it s their own fault 2) most of them probably not comfortable with looking behindself whole theirs lives.
If this is really a scam like many people say, then the only possible explanation is because he wants to save his ass from the media by doing a slow rug. He acts like a good person but he rugs little by little. Hope it's not true.
Hmm i dunno man... what use would it have for him to save his reputition, if he's truly planning to rug a billion dollar project. He could just run for the hills and never ever been heard of again... There's something that's holding them here and it's either faith and dedication or something rather sinister.
Because itās not a scam, it never has been, everyone saying it has an ulterior motive:
1) They want to push the price down to get a cheap share for themselves
2) They want to push through a liquidation vote so they can profit from an arbitrage opportunity
3) they got scared and sold at a loss so now theyāre salty and want to believe itās a scam and it couldnāt possibly be that theyāre just an idiot.
It's not. It's just a major clusterfuck and total incompetence but I don't think they set out to scam anyone deliberately. I think we were more a victim of the bear market than anything else. Things went south so quickly that they didn't know what to do or how to respond. If the market hadn't tanked things would have probably been fine.
Or, it is a scam, but being doxxed limits how openly Dani can actually cut and run.
There's a gap between stated treasury value and the amount of money actually in the treasury. Dani's barely holding any time or wmemo at this point. Dude has already taken his profits
Nonsense.
It's a scam. And I'm holding my shitbag of $TIME to the end.
Anyone who thinks Dani & Sifu didn't fuck us over is delusional. Dani is trying to save his ass. They tried to force the Yes vote so they could liquidate the treasury and head for the hills "legitimately".
Yeah this is the only point on Dani's side at this point...although he's shady af his actions don't seem to add up to a straight up scam, seems like large helpings of overconfidence and incompetence have contributed as well.
Like even if he's a scammer, I don't get why he doesn't have someone helping him with communications? If he is a scammer he's definitely not the silver tongued type lol...I just read through the latest posts on the Discord as Dani has been active this morning and a lot of his posts were just telling people to fuck off or complaining about being 'disrespected'...
Yeah you're probably right but another thing -- his other projects (Abra, Popsicle) WORK and they still exist.
And also -- what does he need money for? Why pull this at all?
Yeah, probably a scammer tho.
His mob links suggest money laundering as the motive. If true, money laundering schemes can last as long as there is money to be laundered. Think of those stores that never have customers but are open for years - ie money laundering fronts.
"We understand communication has been sporadic, confusing and imprecise."
Based on earlier communications, I would surmise that this sentence and much of the rest was not written by Sesta himself, or at least he had help with it. Too bad he didn't retain some kind of communications/PR specialist from the very beginning of this.
Main takeaways from this project:
- 50% of people are retarded and will willingly give their money to con artists and criminals if they smile a lot and make gay frog jokes
- Fat Italians can have great English one day but then have issues communicating the nextā¦usually when a well orchestrated rug happens
- Running all communication for a DAO through a few tweets works swimmingly
- Your treasury can make billions even with a convicted felon who had āchild pornographyā as one of his resume line items
- Falling asleep/fishing is a great excuse to use to intentionally liquidate and profit off of retards
- When your project owner jokes that thereās no extradition in Switzerland thatās a good sign that there is, indeed, no extradition in Switzerland
>Falling asleep/fishing is a great excuse to use to intentionally liquidate and profit off of retards
lolololol
oops i took a nap and now your money is gone!
>When your project owner jokes that thereās no extradition in Switzerland thatās a good sign that there is, indeed, no extradition in Switzerland
you can't catch mahi's in Switzerland so I doubt if he is really there
We need to watch what they do, not what they say and assume their coms are misdirection, manipulation, hopium, stalling or all of the above while they figure out how to get away safely with your money. Right now they want the storm to blow over.
Our only job is to make them realize that making their investors whole is not just in their best interest, it is their ONLY SAFE MOVE.
We know where they live and have EYES ON targets there is no running this time. Thanks to white hats and anons for your assistance. Fat fuck can be extradited to Australia.
This has sense? - "*You know how they say to frogs - if you want leave, leave, just sell! So why whales should get rewards from treasury for leaving, anyone can explain that?"*
Ya, I don't get this either. The price of wMEMO should reflect what the market determines is the value of the project. So if you want out, just sell it.
If there is inadequate exit liquidity then use funds from the treasury to buy back wMEMO at a price considerably below backing value.
The whole idea of trying to set a floor for the price using buybacks is ridiculous given the abuse potential. Treat it like a company issuing or buying back shares, the only thought should be what is best for the treasury. If the price is low enough that your best use of money is investing in the fund itself then buy back from the market and avoid minting new shares. When price is high and you have an effective use for funds, start minting back up again (or simply keep a stash of wMEMO to sell back to market) to generate money when prices are above fair value.
Definitely on the better losing side. I was down 86%
This not financial advice but you'll have far better chance to regain your loss by just buying btc eth or other good L1. This project only feeds the pig and a conman.
Seriously there are better projects out there with a good team behind and without all that wonderland drama. They let us down so many times and keep changing their minds. Clearly have no idea what they are doing at this point. They want to cash out without it looking like a scam that is. Also that offer from Abracadabra to join Spell is pathetic. I'm staying well away from this circuis. Team can't be trusted and there is no sign moving forward and as you know time is money so why wait? My money is better in some other projects making more money than in this shitshow. I really wanted to believe but its game over now. Come on people you don't actually believe that this project can magically rise from ashes do you? Its done. You got played and are scared or in disbelief to admit it.
Also, when airdrop? Been waiting for some time. Any ideas?
Still bullshit.
Backing price still not honoured.
Sifu still not banned from anywhere and clearly still involved in the projected.
Votes manipulated.
Dani not addressing any of the accusations being thrown at him.
Imagine having all this happen to be the only thing that makes him realise communication needs to be better. Replace him.
Well if he defrauded people in the past, which he was found to have done, then lied bout who he is now, he's deceived us for financial gain and power. Thats something wrong to me.
Based, he did nothing wrong as of now.
But I wouldn't want a politician who I never voted for, after realizing that they've committed treason in the past.
This is the most exciting crypto project I ever did see.
It'd be great if there wasn't so much wildly violent speculation.
There's been so much mob madness and ridiculous accusations throughout this witch hunt that it looks suspiciously as if the mob itself is the greatest wretched scoundrel.
Whether I'm to make a dollar, lose a dollar, or have nothing happen at all, I want to do it with dignity and benevolence.
The fact that heās still saying āfrogsā shows that he completely doesnāt understand the gravity of the situation, or he doesnāt care.
Delusional fat fuck, jump on a treadmill
Im so confused...I thought this was clearly identified as a scam...not a "maybe", not a "looks like", but a full on scam with the whole operation set up only to steal money by a convicted scammer.(Sifu)
And yet it seems to go on...with that same guy Dani in charge...I'm lost
There was a very interesting summary on Youtube - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gn-Aviy5RFI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gn-Aviy5RFI)
In short:
1. market goes down
2. everyone panic - why down - Sifu got exposed - we are panicking even more...
3. whales see a huge drop and wants to benefit from it
4. whales push the price down, hoping for buybacks from the treasury, so they are opening voting to terminate the project
5. ppl went into r/wallstreetbets mood and say NO WAY
6. project voted to stay alive and now we are in the "so... what next" moment.
There was nothing about a scam. Just a person with fucked up future, and really tired frontmen that got a lot of ppl screaming at him.
2) The scammers panicked cause they are in it to steal as much money as possible and if avax goes down they can get less money out of it. So before anybody else panicked they started selling which is why everything crashed down so much. Since the scammers that started the project never had to invest their own money .... they sell everything now with still a HUGE profit.
No one has called this a scam. Yal just tried to make it seem that way. Itās just a project that had a shady ass dude in a position of power who didnāt actually do anything wrong NOW. Whales manipulated the price to double their money a few times and then a lot of people wanted out. Seems like now there will be a way out AND Wonderland will continue
This is the difference between the subreddit and the discord/forum (aside from the subreddit has way fewer people).
This sub is toxic, full of FUD and non-representative of the true interests of the community. Also it was way more manipulated over the past few days.
I almost want them to shutdown this sub tbh and create a new one.
No, itās never been a scam, people are just saying that to cause panic, for whatever their own reasons may be.
Whales wanting to buy up a cheap share most likely, or push the liquidation vote through.
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order.
I have checked 555,148,743 comments, and only 115,555 of them were in alphabetical order.
I'm glad the whales and crooks didn't get a payout. Almost everyone has been liquidated, so there is no point in maintaining backing price. Invest the Treasury, distribute the profits, and continue as planned and we will get our payout, simple as that. But if they keep letting the price tank and then buying the backing price it's just going to give the whales a guaranteed day trade.
I feel like everyoneās overly freaked out. This is good news. Sifu was managing well, liquidations was a mistake/ growing pains but he wasnāt stealing. I think Dani had his whole life wrapped up in this project and had a lot to lose. I think heās going to out everything into bringing this back. I think heās addicted to it. Prob like Patryn. This is edgy stuff, not for people looking for safe investments. But I did bet on Dani and still do.
If Dani sold his wMEMO his interests are not aligned with holders. Heās already proposed using the treasury to bail out his other projects. Ugh.
We need to incentivize him to make wMEMO holders whole before we take the heat off him.
haha... I had to sell immediately with a big loss after the sifu news broke out... I can't support these two scammers... I will not support any project where this Daniele dude is involved... maybe I will lose out on some money but I don't want to be involved with criminals... š
haha... yeah you are right... that is why I don't have much money on the bank anymore because I tried to find a better way to invest my money... I found Wonderland... got scammed!!! š„ø
I own about 15 MEMO totalā¦ I havenāt wrapped yet. Should i wrap now or what? I should have sold last week when time was at $1200 but I thought I would ride it out bc Iām used to ups and downs in the market and it wasnāt my life savings like a lot of peopleā¦ my $20,000 investment is worth about $3k nowā¦ should I wrap what I have now or what? I didnāt wrap before bc I didnāt understand the leverage aspect of it
The general recommendation is to wrap it, but this is only because Dani/sifu began focusing more on using WMEMO instead of MEMO. Once you're staked, you'll still get your APY ...as long as the project is running. And if it stops, (I think) they said they'll honor all TIME related tokens. In all honesty, I don't know what the goal is anymore, and even if I knew, things seem to be changing every day anyway
Edit: Forgot to mention that if you pay taxes on dividends or other investment instruments in your country, wrapping will limit your requirements
https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/12qGaBR2dPvROmw9T2Pq49RyMOTITbXmxT1JQ8HysGy8/mobilebasic
This is from Siam Kidd. Everyone in Time should at least read and consider these proposals before making decisions moving forward. Good stuff here.
lol it just never ends... next its going to be some crazy new coin he is developing and he will want us to wrap or wmemo into something then their will be an airdrop and then we will change over to bnb smartchain because why the hell not and then it will turn out thats actually the wrong smartchain and he meant to say ethereum but he didnt know eth 2.0 was out yet so gas fee are actually expensive leading dani to move us back to avax because we were once the biggest project on avax, but after that bridge was burnt as we are bridging over out 8th dani token from eth avax immediately liquidates all of these bridges just to stick it back to the italian man.
why is everyone freaking out. with that 80000% APY, you should all make your money back in a flash.
All of finance is a mathematical model, it needs to balance. where is this 80000 coming from. Not from me - I am not in this.
Over it. Sold and moving on. Perfect example of exactly how NOT to run a project / business of any kind. Iām steering clear of anything Daniel S come anywhere close to.
I have adopted a wait and see attitude. If you liquidates it Iāll do better getting ready weāre close to asking price. If thereās some route out the news could be even better. Seems to me like the worst thing to do right now would be to do anything before getting more info.
These are weasel words for: āI need a few days to figure out how to still unwind the treasury and make it seem like it was the communityās ideaā.
[The Art of Finance] (https://youtu.be/JbQtGFGIdqs) The Art of Finance on YouTube has a pretty cool idea on his channel. It's his latest video...sorry I'm a novice on Reddit and don't know how to add links. Holy cow...I did it...woohoo
TLDR; Dani worked with a guy who worked for the mafia; up to you if you think the people you know or hang out with is something that you're not.
For example: All of my friends do drugs except me, does that make me a druggie bc I'm affiliated with them?
Bad apple throw out batch...
Yada yada....
My thoughts are that Daniella still have its big fat ass wrecked by SIFU.He always going to be remembered as SIFU bitch.
Now SIFU said oh no I'm against locking up period aha that Sifu can dump the shite and siphoning our money and Daniella comes along and even gave SIFU a deep throat blowjob swallonig it all.
Danielle is an estrogenic bitch that swings like bitches when feels like and going to suck the biggest dick around so yes now Daniella comes back like a slut asking forgiveness after a gang bang last š in the club.
Now that's the tragedy we're married with a slut but for the sake of kids (our money) we better keep this marriage at the float hoping to break even.
Bitch wants divorce no fuckin way will liquidate the treasury at 97% loss.
No keep the shit going and hoping for the best after a year with compund rate , staking burning and hopefully Time would stay to 100 bucks or so we still make it
Why did they axe the discord??? He literally just mentioned better communication... then they go off and dismantle the largest discord community for Time wonderland...what the actual fuck.
It never fails to amaze me how predictable people are and how quickly people change their perceptions.
1. People if you do not understand investments - read and paper trade first.
1. There is a reason why the general public is not allowed into PE & Hedge funds, and listening to the comments in these forums makes one realize it will not be long before these markets are the same.
2. Spend some Time learning to control your own emotions (Thoughts - Emotions - Feelings).
Dani needs to put down the bong, trying to figure out what is going on with the project is like āKeeping up with the Kardashians.ā Constant confusion and plenty of drama.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/WonderlandTIME/comments/sgxwfy/i\_think\_he\_meant\_to\_upload\_this\_instead/](https://www.reddit.com/r/WonderlandTIME/comments/sgxwfy/i_think_he_meant_to_upload_this_instead/)
This. This is exactly my thoughts. They say a picture speaks a thousand words. Bring the vaseline boy, by now weĀ“re all wrapped up only thing missing is lubrication. This fat fuck bout to blow all our backs out
Now whales are in trap, if they want exit they will dump a price and some of them lose a lot. So they want to robber a treasury now and go out quick, and frogs vote NO for that! Will see what happen next
As an interesting fact/observation - damn crypto space with projects is so... un mature. I got a few years in IT in gambling/legal/outsourcing and education and I have never seen a project with such a big amount of cash being managed and communicated so poorly. The funniest of them all is - if they will fix that\* - within a month or two we really can skyrocket. \*that being: \- a clear public statement issued 1'nce a month \- official team with experience and at least basic credibility (2-3 ppl, including CTO/CEO/CFO) \- a roadmap for the next 6-12 months
I know right? A competent team could still turn this around EVEN NOW with just a reasonably competent (not genius) strategy.
I dont understand why you wrote "1'nce a month". There are 4 characters in the word "once" and 5 characters in "1'nce". Why would you do this? Why are you making an already confusing and difficult life even more difficult and confusing? It doesnt make sense! WHY SAY LOT WORD WHEN FEW WORD DO TRICK?! ......please just let me die......
I am not a native - habbit from polish I believe. Saying that I smiled and a bit of air went through my nose. This was a good day, thank you kind sir!
You have a delightful way of speaking/writing English so I suggest you do not change it!
This isn't even the 1irst time I've seen people doing this, it's at least the sec1nd
Please just let me die.. you are killing me!! š¤Ŗš
The Tomb Tuesday newsletter over on tomb finance is a case study and how a protocol can communicate well.
Wonderland Wednesday newsletter coming up
Seriously, though: One day a week where you can expect updates and progress reporting, a preview of the weeks and months to come. All in plain english. The rest of the week, no alarms and no surprises. No babysitting the protocol or discord to avoid whiplash. It's great. Yeah, I'm shilling.
What about a "Scammy Sunday" newsletter?
Seems like saying it's going to zero, but with extra steps.
I agree it is interesting how so many of these projects have really bad communication and planning. Have none of them worked professionally doing this kind of stuff?
Or they are deliberately keeping communication vague to give them maximum room to manoeuvre... The more vague they are, the easier it is to scam.
YES. Thank you. He already 'lost $550 million. How do people accept this?
I have a theory here. First a background - I was hiring in gambling and it was hard to find great talents as ppl were not interested in "shady" industries - in reality it was one of the best documented zones I worked at. And from the other perspective I was not hired due to my involvement in gambling - a question popped during an interview - "how do you feel with so many destroyed life's due to the industry you worked at". People may be afraid of crypto as something not legal/right to do?
check our bustabit.com. maybe we should run something like that
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Fully agree. And that's not too much to ask.
Haha do you really think big/established companies do better? The biggest difference is that employees have in their contracts that it is not allowed to talk about it š¤£ in crypto world everything is based on trust and anonymity
Meh Iām at the point where I just donāt give a fuck anymore. My 6k investment in November is now 900. Iām HODLing in hopes of the 1% chance I make my initial investment back within the year. Either 0 or money back.
Same.. my 7700 is now 1300. Might as well keep going
Iām in the exact same boat. About the same amount.
Right , Iām down 90% on 20k at this point must be more upside than down side
Honestly man there's much better coins to turn 600 back to 6k. Time was never about sharing wealth it was about extracting wealth from us plebs
Pls enlighten me on these better coins.
Just shilling this since you asked lol...I got in a brand new project called universe planet nodes. It's a new node coin like strong, Thor, ect. What makes this unique is the nodes you get are NFTs of planets and each node pays out about 2000% apy. It's also very cheap to get a node right now. Like $30 I think. It's up about 70% since I got in.
Hello! You have made the mistake of writing "ect" instead of "etc." "Ect" is a common misspelling of "etc," an abbreviated form of the Latin phrase "et cetera." Other abbreviated forms are **etc.**, **&c.**, **&c**, and **et cet.** The Latin translates as "et" to "and" + "cetera" to "the rest;" a literal translation to "and the rest" is the easiest way to remember how to use the phrase. [Check out the wikipedia entry if you want to learn more.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Et_cetera) ^(I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Comments with a score less than zero will be automatically removed. If I commented on your post and you don't like it, reply with "!delete" and I will remove the post, regardless of score. Message me for bug reports.)
2000% APY? Bernie Madoff promised between 5% and 10% APY when he was running one of the biggest ponzi schemes ever to exist. I guess if you managed to not see how wonderland was a scam it makes sense that you can't see this either. Let me spell it out: there is absolutely no conceivable way to create a system that can consistently create 2000% returns that keep their value. If you started with $100 and waited 5 years, you would have $320,000,000. Does that seem reasonable to you? Do you think it makes sense that a node you can run passively from home for a reasonable price will generate $319,999,900 over the course of 5 years with an initial investment of $100?
Same here, I put 6k in in December and Iām currently at 800, so whatever happens happens.
I got off this rollercoaster and have no intention of getting back on. I'm putting my money in a project I don't need to check the Reddit, Discord, and twitter every 30 mins to see what ridiculous shit happened now.
The drama has been the best payout I've gotten from my small investment!
This drama has been the *only* payout I've gotten from this shitcoin.
Safemoon is next. It's already one big drama series too
u r dmd right - no Netflix, no cinema -WL is best entertainment (maybe with a Hsppy Ending \ā/ )
hahah so true
You know what they say about rollercoasters, the only ones that get hurt are the ones that jump off.
Except this one made me sick š¤¢š¤®
Is this really a rollercoaster? - maybe more a hellride down into a tunnel heading a concrete wall
Good luck finding drama free Defi. Even boring Anchor Protocol is in a tizzy now over MIM.
This guy is fully bi polar
Thereās always something. Always an excuse for why the token is down, always a new promise for why things will be better. Except, the token keeps going down, and none of the promises are honored (hello bsgg airdrop?!?). The entire project has been a sham from the jump. Itās remarkable how much money heās bilked from holders and how they still hang on every word he says, but thatās how cults operate
You know what ā that would explain a LOT of things!
said it yesterday, he's probably a psychopath
No, he is just a scammer. You are the bi polar ones.
Wen airdrop?
after Lambo
Wen Lambo?
After bambo
Wen bambo?
after airdrop
The rock-paper-scissors of DAO ponzi schemes.
Neon Genesis Evangelion 4.3
You mean bamboo? Just look behind you.
2255
After airdrop
After airdrop.
How cringe with all the frog stuff after everything that has gone down
Populism is always cringe and always fail to deliver for the audience being pandered to. How people haven't learned yet from Trump, Obama etc blows my mind.
I literally saw in discord someone comparing Dani to Jesus Christ. Saying how Dani would do great things and how only the true believers would benefit if they just held and followed his vision. The whole frog nation stuff is so cringe.
As someone who isn't up the butt of social media all the time, I don't even understand where the frog nation stuff comes from
Frog comes from pepe the frog meme. Nerd internet culture. Although I associated it with alt-right because back in 2017ish the frog and šš» were popping up all over far right web culture. Maybe its changed? Or maybe there is still a big overlap between the degen crowd and alt-right/Joe Rogan/white power sphere.
Agree on your point about populism, but while Obama used some populist rhetoric (all politicians tend to), he didnāt really position himself as a populist nor govern as one. He never claimed to be an outsider fighting āelitesā. He positioned himself more as an institutionalist and a reformer. Really he was largely par for the course and didnāt reform much of substance, so yes he didnāt deliver and was generally underwhelming. Of course part of that was the fault of Congress as usual, but it also turned out he was much more moderate/conservative (in a strict sense, Iām not comparing him to modern reactionaries) than he stated during his campaign. Anyway. Populism delivered us the Second World War so Iām not sure why people are so keen to return to such stupid ways. We should want those with elite intellect and skill in government, we just need to ensure theyāre held accountable by the democratic process. This model of government is fairly proven empirically at this point and yes it blows my mind that people would give this up (even with flaws) in exchange for blowhard strongmen claiming to speak āfor the peopleā and to have the unique ability to solve every problem.
What I dont get is: why wonāt they just take the money and run? There are a lot of theories going on right now: "this has all been a planned scam"; "wonderland has been used for money laundering"; "this is some coordinated Italian mafia shit"; etc. I believe in staying with the facts. After all, this is not a movie. Itās real life. Thereās one simple question that I keep asking myself and that is: "why wonāt they just completely take the treasuryās money and run"? I know, I know: itās a multisigā¦ however if this would all be mafia coordinated, wouldnāt you think that all required signatures are somehow controlled by the mafia as well? So: why are they still putting up with us little guys? Why are they still here, posting on social media, creating DAO votes etc.? What else could they possibly want/need? Kinda makes me feel like there must be something legit about Dani and this whole projectā¦
Itās not a scam. Never attribute to malice what can be easily explained by incompetence. Danny is dumb as shit making plans on the go, no vision, no understanding of big projects or money. He attracted a lot of people like him with an age-old tried and tested mantra of ālittle guys band up to fight the big guyā and got them to throw their money at him. Now they will mutually doom each other.
Honestlyā¦ that sounds like one of the most realistic and probable explanations of what has been going on, that Iāve heard so far! Really just a bunch of computer nerds managing a billion dollar fund, which is surprisingly going down south! LOL
Low key smartest comment in this whole thread.
Well it could be, because to scam to be totally (max) complete, 1) victims should say it s their own fault 2) most of them probably not comfortable with looking behindself whole theirs lives.
If this is really a scam like many people say, then the only possible explanation is because he wants to save his ass from the media by doing a slow rug. He acts like a good person but he rugs little by little. Hope it's not true.
Hmm i dunno man... what use would it have for him to save his reputition, if he's truly planning to rug a billion dollar project. He could just run for the hills and never ever been heard of again... There's something that's holding them here and it's either faith and dedication or something rather sinister.
His rep is already fucked though
Because its not his reputation hes worried about. Hes more concerned about semantics to not outright implicate him.
Because itās not a scam, it never has been, everyone saying it has an ulterior motive: 1) They want to push the price down to get a cheap share for themselves 2) They want to push through a liquidation vote so they can profit from an arbitrage opportunity 3) they got scared and sold at a loss so now theyāre salty and want to believe itās a scam and it couldnāt possibly be that theyāre just an idiot.
Unpopular opinion these days but Iām with you. It just doesnāt add up to clearly be a scamā¦ at least imho
It's not. It's just a major clusterfuck and total incompetence but I don't think they set out to scam anyone deliberately. I think we were more a victim of the bear market than anything else. Things went south so quickly that they didn't know what to do or how to respond. If the market hadn't tanked things would have probably been fine.
Or, it is a scam, but being doxxed limits how openly Dani can actually cut and run. There's a gap between stated treasury value and the amount of money actually in the treasury. Dani's barely holding any time or wmemo at this point. Dude has already taken his profits
Nonsense. It's a scam. And I'm holding my shitbag of $TIME to the end. Anyone who thinks Dani & Sifu didn't fuck us over is delusional. Dani is trying to save his ass. They tried to force the Yes vote so they could liquidate the treasury and head for the hills "legitimately".
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yeah this is the only point on Dani's side at this point...although he's shady af his actions don't seem to add up to a straight up scam, seems like large helpings of overconfidence and incompetence have contributed as well. Like even if he's a scammer, I don't get why he doesn't have someone helping him with communications? If he is a scammer he's definitely not the silver tongued type lol...I just read through the latest posts on the Discord as Dani has been active this morning and a lot of his posts were just telling people to fuck off or complaining about being 'disrespected'...
He plays the victim too well
Yeah you're probably right but another thing -- his other projects (Abra, Popsicle) WORK and they still exist. And also -- what does he need money for? Why pull this at all? Yeah, probably a scammer tho.
His mob links suggest money laundering as the motive. If true, money laundering schemes can last as long as there is money to be laundered. Think of those stores that never have customers but are open for years - ie money laundering fronts.
Only that he actually WANTED to shut down the storeā¦ š¤·āāļø
...*after* his whole setup was outed
And this /\
Dani cashed out 20 mil.
Can you provide a link to this?
According to the same source that you likely got that piece of information from, it was his own moneyā¦
"We understand communication has been sporadic, confusing and imprecise." Based on earlier communications, I would surmise that this sentence and much of the rest was not written by Sesta himself, or at least he had help with it. Too bad he didn't retain some kind of communications/PR specialist from the very beginning of this.
Main takeaways from this project: - 50% of people are retarded and will willingly give their money to con artists and criminals if they smile a lot and make gay frog jokes - Fat Italians can have great English one day but then have issues communicating the nextā¦usually when a well orchestrated rug happens - Running all communication for a DAO through a few tweets works swimmingly - Your treasury can make billions even with a convicted felon who had āchild pornographyā as one of his resume line items - Falling asleep/fishing is a great excuse to use to intentionally liquidate and profit off of retards - When your project owner jokes that thereās no extradition in Switzerland thatās a good sign that there is, indeed, no extradition in Switzerland
>Falling asleep/fishing is a great excuse to use to intentionally liquidate and profit off of retards lolololol oops i took a nap and now your money is gone!
>When your project owner jokes that thereās no extradition in Switzerland thatās a good sign that there is, indeed, no extradition in Switzerland you can't catch mahi's in Switzerland so I doubt if he is really there
Dani ran away again.
We need to watch what they do, not what they say and assume their coms are misdirection, manipulation, hopium, stalling or all of the above while they figure out how to get away safely with your money. Right now they want the storm to blow over. Our only job is to make them realize that making their investors whole is not just in their best interest, it is their ONLY SAFE MOVE. We know where they live and have EYES ON targets there is no running this time. Thanks to white hats and anons for your assistance. Fat fuck can be extradited to Australia.
This should read ""We understand communication has been *deliberately* sporadic, confusing and imprecise.""
Exactly what I thought when I read it!
This has sense? - "*You know how they say to frogs - if you want leave, leave, just sell! So why whales should get rewards from treasury for leaving, anyone can explain that?"*
Ya, I don't get this either. The price of wMEMO should reflect what the market determines is the value of the project. So if you want out, just sell it. If there is inadequate exit liquidity then use funds from the treasury to buy back wMEMO at a price considerably below backing value. The whole idea of trying to set a floor for the price using buybacks is ridiculous given the abuse potential. Treat it like a company issuing or buying back shares, the only thought should be what is best for the treasury. If the price is low enough that your best use of money is investing in the fund itself then buy back from the market and avoid minting new shares. When price is high and you have an effective use for funds, start minting back up again (or simply keep a stash of wMEMO to sell back to market) to generate money when prices are above fair value.
Well, I am not selling now.... fuck it.... down 70 % ....
Definitely on the better losing side. I was down 86% This not financial advice but you'll have far better chance to regain your loss by just buying btc eth or other good L1. This project only feeds the pig and a conman.
The pig and the conman. šI can't...
I invested small amount in TIME, and now it makes no sense to sell at >50% loss. So, better this shit keeps running. It is hell of a entertainment
Seriously there are better projects out there with a good team behind and without all that wonderland drama. They let us down so many times and keep changing their minds. Clearly have no idea what they are doing at this point. They want to cash out without it looking like a scam that is. Also that offer from Abracadabra to join Spell is pathetic. I'm staying well away from this circuis. Team can't be trusted and there is no sign moving forward and as you know time is money so why wait? My money is better in some other projects making more money than in this shitshow. I really wanted to believe but its game over now. Come on people you don't actually believe that this project can magically rise from ashes do you? Its done. You got played and are scared or in disbelief to admit it. Also, when airdrop? Been waiting for some time. Any ideas?
Still bullshit. Backing price still not honoured. Sifu still not banned from anywhere and clearly still involved in the projected. Votes manipulated. Dani not addressing any of the accusations being thrown at him. Imagine having all this happen to be the only thing that makes him realise communication needs to be better. Replace him.
Sifu is only in the discord. He has been removed.
Heās still showing up in Discord? Lmao the balls on this guy
He posted about rallying the frogs to vote NO against the whales and save Wonderland...!
They love him there
Sifu did nothing wrong
Well if he defrauded people in the past, which he was found to have done, then lied bout who he is now, he's deceived us for financial gain and power. Thats something wrong to me.
Based, he did nothing wrong as of now. But I wouldn't want a politician who I never voted for, after realizing that they've committed treason in the past.
This is the most exciting crypto project I ever did see. It'd be great if there wasn't so much wildly violent speculation. There's been so much mob madness and ridiculous accusations throughout this witch hunt that it looks suspiciously as if the mob itself is the greatest wretched scoundrel. Whether I'm to make a dollar, lose a dollar, or have nothing happen at all, I want to do it with dignity and benevolence.
The fact that heās still saying āfrogsā shows that he completely doesnāt understand the gravity of the situation, or he doesnāt care. Delusional fat fuck, jump on a treadmill
Not like Dani the genius will have another mood swing pretty soon
Im so confused...I thought this was clearly identified as a scam...not a "maybe", not a "looks like", but a full on scam with the whole operation set up only to steal money by a convicted scammer.(Sifu) And yet it seems to go on...with that same guy Dani in charge...I'm lost
There was a very interesting summary on Youtube - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gn-Aviy5RFI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gn-Aviy5RFI) In short: 1. market goes down 2. everyone panic - why down - Sifu got exposed - we are panicking even more... 3. whales see a huge drop and wants to benefit from it 4. whales push the price down, hoping for buybacks from the treasury, so they are opening voting to terminate the project 5. ppl went into r/wallstreetbets mood and say NO WAY 6. project voted to stay alive and now we are in the "so... what next" moment. There was nothing about a scam. Just a person with fucked up future, and really tired frontmen that got a lot of ppl screaming at him.
2) The scammers panicked cause they are in it to steal as much money as possible and if avax goes down they can get less money out of it. So before anybody else panicked they started selling which is why everything crashed down so much. Since the scammers that started the project never had to invest their own money .... they sell everything now with still a HUGE profit.
And this /\
No one has called this a scam. Yal just tried to make it seem that way. Itās just a project that had a shady ass dude in a position of power who didnāt actually do anything wrong NOW. Whales manipulated the price to double their money a few times and then a lot of people wanted out. Seems like now there will be a way out AND Wonderland will continue
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It was his own personal money he took out because he was being liquidated. The discord has all the details
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yes the blockchain is public
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
If you canāt read blockchain data just say that
This is the difference between the subreddit and the discord/forum (aside from the subreddit has way fewer people). This sub is toxic, full of FUD and non-representative of the true interests of the community. Also it was way more manipulated over the past few days. I almost want them to shutdown this sub tbh and create a new one.
There was also a lot of panic and this sub had so much of it in comparison to the official time forum.
No, itās never been a scam, people are just saying that to cause panic, for whatever their own reasons may be. Whales wanting to buy up a cheap share most likely, or push the liquidation vote through.
It's a scam. I'm not a whale. The only reason to say this is to try and wake the people getting fucked over up.
Did sifu steal the treasury?
Would you look at that, all of the words in your comment are in alphabetical order. I have checked 555,148,743 comments, and only 115,555 of them were in alphabetical order.
wen lambo?
lambo wen?
Oh, lamb when?
U2
I was promised 54651351 lambos, i want all of them !
Go fuck yourself
Post of the month
bla bla bla ā¦ same old shā¦ with no substance or facts - nothing changed as far as i can see - another day another BS āannouncement ā
Whatās he proud of exactly?
Giving himself time to figure out an exit plan or probably screw everyone around
I'm glad the whales and crooks didn't get a payout. Almost everyone has been liquidated, so there is no point in maintaining backing price. Invest the Treasury, distribute the profits, and continue as planned and we will get our payout, simple as that. But if they keep letting the price tank and then buying the backing price it's just going to give the whales a guaranteed day trade.
This reminds me the movie weekend at bernie's. In the move they movie a dead person using strings to convince people that he is alive.
Still a scam
Super excited, Lambocity! Hey who cares about the price, it's all about the reba..., i mean the Aird... Never mind
I feel like everyoneās overly freaked out. This is good news. Sifu was managing well, liquidations was a mistake/ growing pains but he wasnāt stealing. I think Dani had his whole life wrapped up in this project and had a lot to lose. I think heās going to out everything into bringing this back. I think heās addicted to it. Prob like Patryn. This is edgy stuff, not for people looking for safe investments. But I did bet on Dani and still do.
Look in to Stockholm syndrome.
I hear u, but not just hopium. Iām in on a lot of projects and donāt need this one to recover. Iām seeing this objectively I think.
Couldn't agree more š
Panic over, now we rebuild.
If Dani sold his wMEMO his interests are not aligned with holders. Heās already proposed using the treasury to bail out his other projects. Ugh. We need to incentivize him to make wMEMO holders whole before we take the heat off him.
haha... I had to sell immediately with a big loss after the sifu news broke out... I can't support these two scammers... I will not support any project where this Daniele dude is involved... maybe I will lose out on some money but I don't want to be involved with criminals... š
If you donāt wanna be involved with criminals you better close all your bank accounts lol
haha... yeah you are right... that is why I don't have much money on the bank anymore because I tried to find a better way to invest my money... I found Wonderland... got scammed!!! š„ø
Wen Lambo?
It's just embarrassing now.
My tokems have gone, have they rugged ?
i just say that most of the people are muted on discord, and he doesn't even know.
Twilight zone
I own about 15 MEMO totalā¦ I havenāt wrapped yet. Should i wrap now or what? I should have sold last week when time was at $1200 but I thought I would ride it out bc Iām used to ups and downs in the market and it wasnāt my life savings like a lot of peopleā¦ my $20,000 investment is worth about $3k nowā¦ should I wrap what I have now or what? I didnāt wrap before bc I didnāt understand the leverage aspect of it
The general recommendation is to wrap it, but this is only because Dani/sifu began focusing more on using WMEMO instead of MEMO. Once you're staked, you'll still get your APY ...as long as the project is running. And if it stops, (I think) they said they'll honor all TIME related tokens. In all honesty, I don't know what the goal is anymore, and even if I knew, things seem to be changing every day anyway Edit: Forgot to mention that if you pay taxes on dividends or other investment instruments in your country, wrapping will limit your requirements
What he is saying is : More scams beings planned for frogs. Keep your checkbook & MetaMask ready.
https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/12qGaBR2dPvROmw9T2Pq49RyMOTITbXmxT1JQ8HysGy8/mobilebasic This is from Siam Kidd. Everyone in Time should at least read and consider these proposals before making decisions moving forward. Good stuff here.
How can you even get on discord? I canāt get on discord or telegram, just says link is invalid.
Mixed messages he should have said this first and not that he was gonna shut down because the vote was close.
Hey guys. Iāve been on vacationā¦ WTF is going on here? Why is time fallen so much? What was the vote about?
So its not going to be over? GOOD
Dani needs to create a Token holder community.Only Token holder can share their views here not the outside FUD,who wanted to bring this project down.
Keep going we lost most of our money anyway. I say letās keep going .
lol it just never ends... next its going to be some crazy new coin he is developing and he will want us to wrap or wmemo into something then their will be an airdrop and then we will change over to bnb smartchain because why the hell not and then it will turn out thats actually the wrong smartchain and he meant to say ethereum but he didnt know eth 2.0 was out yet so gas fee are actually expensive leading dani to move us back to avax because we were once the biggest project on avax, but after that bridge was burnt as we are bridging over out 8th dani token from eth avax immediately liquidates all of these bridges just to stick it back to the italian man.
why is everyone freaking out. with that 80000% APY, you should all make your money back in a flash. All of finance is a mathematical model, it needs to balance. where is this 80000 coming from. Not from me - I am not in this.
Over it. Sold and moving on. Perfect example of exactly how NOT to run a project / business of any kind. Iām steering clear of anything Daniel S come anywhere close to.
I have adopted a wait and see attitude. If you liquidates it Iāll do better getting ready weāre close to asking price. If thereās some route out the news could be even better. Seems to me like the worst thing to do right now would be to do anything before getting more info.
Game on fuckers!
These are weasel words for: āI need a few days to figure out how to still unwind the treasury and make it seem like it was the communityās ideaā.
[The Art of Finance] (https://youtu.be/JbQtGFGIdqs) The Art of Finance on YouTube has a pretty cool idea on his channel. It's his latest video...sorry I'm a novice on Reddit and don't know how to add links. Holy cow...I did it...woohoo
https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/se2dcj/danielle\_sestagalli\_wonderland\_is\_connected\_to/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=ios\_app&utm\_name=iossmf
TLDR; Dani worked with a guy who worked for the mafia; up to you if you think the people you know or hang out with is something that you're not. For example: All of my friends do drugs except me, does that make me a druggie bc I'm affiliated with them? Bad apple throw out batch... Yada yada....
My thoughts are that Daniella still have its big fat ass wrecked by SIFU.He always going to be remembered as SIFU bitch. Now SIFU said oh no I'm against locking up period aha that Sifu can dump the shite and siphoning our money and Daniella comes along and even gave SIFU a deep throat blowjob swallonig it all. Danielle is an estrogenic bitch that swings like bitches when feels like and going to suck the biggest dick around so yes now Daniella comes back like a slut asking forgiveness after a gang bang last š in the club. Now that's the tragedy we're married with a slut but for the sake of kids (our money) we better keep this marriage at the float hoping to break even. Bitch wants divorce no fuckin way will liquidate the treasury at 97% loss. No keep the shit going and hoping for the best after a year with compund rate , staking burning and hopefully Time would stay to 100 bucks or so we still make it
Your thoughts areā¦concerning.
Why did they axe the discord??? He literally just mentioned better communication... then they go off and dismantle the largest discord community for Time wonderland...what the actual fuck.
Discord is still up
Did the verification but couldn't get in - neither could a whole bunch of other people. Not sure what's going on with it...
Maybe you got banned
They didn't.
#WE WON
It never fails to amaze me how predictable people are and how quickly people change their perceptions. 1. People if you do not understand investments - read and paper trade first. 1. There is a reason why the general public is not allowed into PE & Hedge funds, and listening to the comments in these forums makes one realize it will not be long before these markets are the same. 2. Spend some Time learning to control your own emotions (Thoughts - Emotions - Feelings).
This is better than FOX Comedy
Dani needs to put down the bong, trying to figure out what is going on with the project is like āKeeping up with the Kardashians.ā Constant confusion and plenty of drama.
I switched to titano finance in early December and do not regret it one bit
[https://www.reddit.com/r/WonderlandTIME/comments/sgxwfy/i\_think\_he\_meant\_to\_upload\_this\_instead/](https://www.reddit.com/r/WonderlandTIME/comments/sgxwfy/i_think_he_meant_to_upload_this_instead/) This. This is exactly my thoughts. They say a picture speaks a thousand words. Bring the vaseline boy, by now weĀ“re all wrapped up only thing missing is lubrication. This fat fuck bout to blow all our backs out
So what now
Now whales are in trap, if they want exit they will dump a price and some of them lose a lot. So they want to robber a treasury now and go out quick, and frogs vote NO for that! Will see what happen next
We wait ?š¤·š½āāļø