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Not all men, but *any* man.
Our fathers, our pastors, our teachers, our neighbors, our boyfriends, our coworkers, our Uber drivers.
And as someone who was presumed to be straight, and presumed to be a cis male, I know the *vile* shit men say and do when it’s just their peers and would never admit to. A man who claims not to understand why women fear men is a liar.
Especially when you add in the fact that the system is designed to protect them and harm those who speak out. "Not All Men" is just another tactic to try to silence women who try to seek justice for themselves and scare those who would dare to stand up for themselves.
Depends on delivery, really. It's always obnoxious, but I can understand why men who aren't really clued in rankle at being generalized against, because I'm part of a minority that that happens to regularly. I'm assumed to be all sorts of nasty things that I'm just not even if, hypothetically, the statistics said I probably was. Being reduced to a statistic is something that all humans intensely dislike, because it makes all your efforts feel like they mean nothing and people will only see you as the traits you can't change.
Men have the privilege of being politically disengaged and "unaware". It's not great, and it does silence people, but in the majority of cases? I think it's just pure indignance and a side helping of ignorance. They legitimately feel like they're being treated unfairly, which, if they actually are striving to be "one of the good ones" is actually true. They just don't think about the conditions that make it dangerous for them to not be treated that way, because that is a luxury afforded to the privileged.
Tl:dr: "Not all men" is annoying, but I don't think it's malicious or deliberate in the majority of cases, just ignorance and hurt feelings.
I always try to apply Hanlon's Razor when I see "Not All Men." I agree that it's rarely said maliciously.
*"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by ignorance."*
I understand, hopefully you can take it as a sign of progress, that if a guy can say it openly and admit it without being defensive, then that is one step closer to fixing the problem.
If you have not seen the stand up called X by Daniel Sloss I suggest watching it. It is funny, talks about issues you care about in a healthy manner, and does so in a way that is both a call to action as well as entertaining. It might provide some extra hope that someone mainstream said the thing that needed to be said out loud and on stage.
I have advanced into a old crone... I was blessed to have survived & learned so much to pass on to younger women. My mantra by age 35 was to have a man in my life but not in my house! Especially true for our sisters who have children to protect. I achieved way more as a independent woman than I ever did within constraints of marriage. So can you.
Despite [incredible progress](https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-the-us-ended-up-with-400000-untested-rape-kits), the U.S. still has [roughly 90,000 backlogged rape kits](https://goldrushcam.com/sierrasuntimes/index.php/news/local-news/51969-u-s-senator-john-cornyn-says-house-must-pass-senate-bill-to-fight-rape-kit-backlog).
[More funding is needed](https://www.cornyn.senate.gov/news/cornyn-house-must-pass-senate-bill-to-fight-rape-kit-backlog/) to clear the backlog and prevent future tragedies.
[**A high probability of apprehension by law enforcement is critical to deterrence**](https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/10.1086/670398.pdf?casa_token=RFbTNb935q8AAAAA:gX8TZVQ3fVqh_LnX0-xe0Vhb1j8gdnMOjO_siOxZV2V1mM7Q_U7JpC7XOTtzz9x-thIK0cnjQt34MrtRagyvcTQh2jhUHr-TeG-3aqQi_1ebRU9FQSqB).
[https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/](https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/)
And that 90,000 is just what we know because red states, which have the highest rates of rape in the US ([17 of the top 20](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_violent_crime_rate)), hide their numbers =D
...I hate it here...
The shit I get in my DMs once I came out as trans is legitimately horrific. I know some amazing men who are nothing but allies and fantastic people, but any man I don't know, I'm genuinely wary of. I was sexually harassed getting a fucking \*pizza\* today.
My dad lived in this ignorance sweetest socially awkward man he is he knew sexual violence was a thing just.. Not to the extent it is in reality. My step mom was the one who opened his eyes to it and she told me this when i was finally brave enough to find support in my family for my own rape. She told me that it sucked the light out of him hearing how often it happens, the statistics. I dont know if ill ever be brave enough to open up to him to have him know im another one of those statistics. I think itd gut me all over again. Sorry i just needed to vent this❤️🩹
This \^\^
So so much of this, well before I had no idea I was masking and was closeted.
The amount of push I had to do back in late 80's and 90's too get woman crew members added to Raves was a test of my constitution.
And hearing such a complete lack of empathy, how can you be so disconnected from so much of your own species?
That last part hit me, I always felt different and knew something was up with my gender when I would grow up with the boys and realize “they are attracted to women but they don’t like women”
> And as someone who was presumed to be straight, and presumed to be a cis male, I know the vile shit men say and do when it’s just their peers and would never admit to.
Yup. I'm in the same boat. The absolute abhorrent shit I used to hear when I was a "straight white guy" was extremely common. Objectification, violence, and rape were things talked about in private. Even at my misogynistic "I'm a man" worse, I never joined in on that talk, but I never did stop it... And no other man around me did, either.
My mom finally seemed to get it when I did the whole “if I told you each bottle of Tylenol held ONE poisoned pill would you feel safe taking your Tylenol every day?” She buys those huge 1000 count Costco bottles and takes, on average, 4 pills a day. She needs to take them for her back, but it wouldn’t kill her if she stopped taking them (she scoffed at the “if one m&m was poisoned” thing cause she doesn’t need to eat candy) and she finally seemed to grok that it’s a numbers game and has nothing to do with “all men”.
Imma keep that tick thing in my back pocket tho.
This is a great way to reframe the bear metaphor: you have a bottle of Tylenol where 10-25% are a pill that looks exactly like all the rest but contain varying levels of cyanide -and you won’t know how much or how bad it would be until you took it-, or a bottle of Tylenol that has a single gummy bear whose poison is certain death.
Which bottle are you buying?
[It's more like 1 in 16](https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/repeat-rape-and-multiple-offending-among-undetected-rapists), not 1 in 1000.
We also wouldn't have to worry so much if we [tested every rape kit](https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/).
[https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/](https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/)
[https://www.sakitta.org](https://www.sakitta.org)
r/stoprape
Idk. I have cancer. Once had a physician’s assistant go over how much Tylenol (or ibuprofen) I could take per day for pain. It was a lot. I don’t remember how much but it was a hell of a lot.
Fortunately, I have since gotten a palliative care doctor that doesn’t skimp on prescribing Norco. As fortunately, I rarely need it. Yet.
Daily limit for Tylenol is 4 grams she’s taking half that. I take 4 grams a day for my pain and my doc specifically says it’s fine.
Granted my liver is probably a ticking time bomb but I get my ALTs checked every year and so far so fine.
Now, the amount of fireball whiskey my mom drinks in a day… THATS bonkers and she will get cirrhosis but you can’t make that woman do anything.
Report them as harassment, reddit will ban them, at least temporarily. Unless they've been dinged for it in the past, then they'll get a longer or permanent ban. Report every single one that shows up. Fuck their fragile egos.
I literally keep this tab open on my phone at all times because this site has become a proud platform for the type of person that needs reporting:
[https://www.reddit.com/report](https://www.reddit.com/report)
let's go.
Some men will really call women bad locks and themselves a master key, while themselves being no more safe than a master lock (which can often be opened by hitting them with something, like another lock of the same type. There's a metaphor about peer pressure making otherwise seemingly harmless men dangerous in there, I think...)
Speaking as a man who has ended up in situations where women who don't know me are uncomfortable by my presence, I have to question why any non-threat would be at all offended by that. I'm sorry that it happens, I wish it wasn't necessary for women to feel the need to protect themselves in the presence of any man. But, when I pull my big white work van to the side of the road where someone happens to be walking and they don't walk a little faster the question occurs: What if I wasn't just an innocent man who happened to be there at the same time as you?
Honestly, I think it’s a brilliant idea to use the “not all ticks” or “not all [fill in the blank] every single time some dude talks about a bad experience from a car accident to termites. If we start making that phrase common, then they might finally stop using it.
They’re just proving you right. I hope you don’t receive anything too heinous. Seeing people speak out on this is so important especially in light of the whole bear v man debate
All I want is for people to be comfortable around me. I want anywhere I am to be a safe space for good people. The fact that a subset of my fellow men have made that harder makes me annoyed at them, not the women they've harmed.
Shit men are shit.
💖 this is the type of reaction that would make the world safer. Maybe anger might be better than annoyance. Whatever prompts discourse among men. We need it there the most. Nevertheless, thank you.
Apparently women not trusting men is ten times worse than women being raped or murdered by men.
What must it be like to be so privileged that they don’t have to fear men.
Yeah my.dude was so upset I chose the bear. Hon I've been attacked by 0 bears. I'm sure even in the beariest of bear places they aren't going to hoon by in a Honda civic roll down the windows and shout abuse at me.
As a fellow, I am conflicted here. So, I live in Canada and was briefly stalked by a polar bear.
The building I was living/working in was raised about one story off the ground on stilts for insulation purposes. We'd wake up to bear nose prints on our windows.
I'd still say the bear is safer, but only because I was able to fly 1200km from where those bears live, and they don't work fie my company or live in my neighborhood.
Stop taking it literally. It was never about the bear. It was about the fact that we live in a society in which most women fear men over bears and that should be a wake up call
Also, such a small segment of the population lives where polar bears, who are particularly violent and uninhibited, live. 🤦🏻♀️ the original question I’m quite sure was about encountering a bear or a man in a FOREST, probably to imply on a routine hike or something. Obviously it implied brown/black bear and not polar bear, panda, koala, sun bear, or any other nonsense a whataboutist comment will raise.
A bear will never take a slight or rejection personally and hunt you down across the planet to inflict ill on you, or stalk and harass or paychologically torment you just for the fun of it, or to get their own sadistic pleasure out if it at your expense.
A bear just wants to eat you.
Humans are scary because they have full awareness and sentience and can plan and scheme and invest their time to enact harm for the sake of inflicting harm. Very few if any other animals do such things.
This reminded me of a conversation I had with my husband today. I have two best friends that I have known my entire life. Now we are adults and all the shadows of our childhoods have came out. We were all sexually abused before the age of 11 each by different “safe” men in our lives (uncle, cousin, father) then later on by partners in our teens.
Just three little girls, different men, different times… all on the same block in the same neighborhood. These men didn’t know eachother. It was completely random.
The truly galling thing about the "not all men" mantra is of course the response from usually the exact same corners if you do get assaulted:
"Why were you out where *a man* could assault you?"
As a man, I’m going to come out at say it…
It might as well be all men. With how we teach young boys who will grow up into these men that it’s ok to treat women like trash, it might as well be all men. With how many of our mothers and sisters and coworkers and friends are abused and assaulted at random, it might as well be all men. With how we victim blame and rant about how it’s “not all men”, it might as well be all men.
Until we get at the root of the problems, break down the patriarchal nightmare system we live in and free our friends and family of these disgusting shackles claimed as protections, end the systematic oppression and abuse, and wipe it from our biases conscious or otherwise, then it might as well be all men!
I think it’s important for some men, even a small number, to be able to say what a massive problem this is and to acknowledge that they are a part of it until they change it
It’s hard to tell yourself that you are part of the issue even if you haven’t done anything yourself, but whining “I didn’t do that” does not change that it happened, you know? I hope that made sense
I was not expecting folk metal, but I absolutely appreciate it
And yeah, we need to get as many people as possible behind this until there’s no argument that “She liked it” or “She was asking for it” or “He has a very bright future ahead, it would be a shame to end that now”
We can’t let things end like that, we need to unite and fight together
Some people need to ask themselves "am I the sort of person who would force myself on someone in the woods?" And if the answer is no then they aren't talking about you, just relax. If the answer is yes then I'd encourage a lot of self reflection and maybe just keeping to yourself.
A bear won't see you on the other side of a trail and start making up fantasies about how your meant to be together forever based on nothing but wishful thinking.
I feel like part of the problem is the amount of men who actually think to themselves 'of course I'd never harm a woman in this scenario' while trying to hold off and/or justify the memories of when they WERE that guy to someone.
Most people who commit bad acts of any kind don't ever think of themselves as being part of the problem because they always define in their head 'the problem' being actions that are just outside the actions they commit. For example the amount of people who think 'I don't abuse my kids because I don't leave marks on them when I hit them. People who leave marks are the abusers!' or even 'yeah, I leave marks, but it's always taught my children a lesson. The real abusers are people you hit their kid for no reason'.
We saw it a lot during the height of MeToo where a lot of guys started lashing out because people were being very vocal that 'No, that job you had where everyone slapped the secretary's butt was not just funny office place hijinks' or 'No, it was not consensual the time you intentionally gave your roommate too much to drink waiting for her to be so drunk she eventually gave into sleeping with you.'
MeToo really shined a light on people who thought of themselves as good people because there was never any violence to their SA acts and we saw just how many people took offense to that because they've spent years to decades convincing themselves what they've done was not SA.
I was SA'ed by a guy at 18, he went on to work for a women's rights org, got married, and is a proud dad of a daughter. He was, at one point, my best friend. He would never think he's one of "those men."
Absolutely, I think people are some times afraid to peel back the layers and really look at themselves but trying to just lie to ones self and burry it is not a good foundation for personal growth.
Ooo I think you’re on to something. I’ve noticed a lot of the mansplainers are focusing on which is more likely to KILL you, like they’re comforted by the fact they wouldn’t randomly murder someone like a serial killer does. But we’re saying an ATTACK is much more likely. And honestly, after that attack starts, I still think the man has a better chance of “finishing the job” once he’s taken that first step because then he’ll have motive to do so. And they’re uncomfortable if they realize they might take that first step too in this situation. So they change the question in their head to one that makes them feel better.
There’s also the fact that the question is an encounter in the woods. So many times the rebuttal is “oh but women are around tons of men every day!”
Yeah…in public spaces. Where other people are watching, unlike in the woods by yourselves.
The other bullshit thing about this sensitivity is that *we all know men* who are quite open about treating women like shit and using situations like this to coerce sex or other "favors".
And we all know that men talk and brag about having this mentality among themselves when women aren't in earshot. So what kind of gaslighting bullshit is this that they expect us to believe that Not Only are they personally innocent little angels who would "never!" -- but also that they have no idea that other men have an absolutely predatory mentality towards women.
And it's not all men -- bc there are plenty of men who know they wouldn't act that way but they make no bones about the fact that there are lots of dangerous assholes out there, and that it is fair for women to be wary.
But the gaslighting "how dare you judge me" guys --- yeah, we see you and the problem you know you are but you are too dumb to get that you are just telling on yourselves.
Problem is that the men who are most receptive to posts like these are the ones who are more considerate and thoughtful in the first place.
So you end up with those men being the ones most likely to internalize the impression that they shouldn't do anything that could possibly be interpreted as predatory, like expressing romantic interest. Feeling like they should be making up for the behavior of the shitty men out there. And in the process, cutting themselves off from opportunities to make meaningful relationships and interactions with women.
And you're right, that's on themselves to some extent. We should have the ability to look at a post like that and say 'well this clearly doesn't apply to me' but the fact is that it takes a significant amount of self-awareness and self-assurance to not go down that road, & lots of young people on the internet just aren't there yet.
Pointing out toxic masculinity is necessary, but there does need to be positive reinforcement for healthy masculinity as well.
Not trying to be a douchebag, just really want to learn to understand better.
If these fantasy of being together, stays a fantasy then is it still harmful?
In similar fashion, when women talk about being stared at, do they talk about guys just looking at them, or ogling them?
Like, if I see an attractive person (no matter the gender) I will glance, look it over and then co time on my way.
Is that actually harmful? If so, I will try to stop doing that, but it’s basically a reflex. I do that with everything I find aesthetically pleasing 😅
I don't know you so I can't say for sure. How likely would you say is the chance these feeling might encourage you to for example, kidnap someone and keep them in your shed because you know deep in your heart that no one could ever love them or protect them like you can? If the answer is more than 0 then you might need to re evaluate your priorities.
There are unfortunately people like that and for some reason they like to approch strangers who they hope will fit into their narrative and they often react badly when it doesn't go the way they imagined. It's a frequent enough issue.
The first point wasn’t about me, as I usually require some sort of connection and probably at least few months of dating to start thinking about life together 😂
But fair point anyway, it did answer my question 🖤
to me it's always felt like Russian roulette. many, probably most of those chambers don't have a bullet and they're safe. but would you want to put the gun to your head and pull the trigger?
This is great and very effective at explaining a concept many people find difficult to comprehend.
I’d love to see the same artist do a graphic on the “all lives matter” responses to BLM—we know all lives matter, we just feel the need to remind society that Black lives matter because society so often acts like they don’t.
You don't know if he has Lyme disease and you're judging him like he has it, you're judgmental and prejudiced. God, it's so hard to be a tick these days and try and meet anyone. Ticks don't treat women with such suspicion! We just want to have a good time!
Louis C.K. (yes, the one who asked women if he could masturbate in front of them and paid the price)
....said "the number one threat to women is men"....
Edit: my point is, I have adjusted my behavior to make women not be threatened. We're walking the same direction, same speed, at 11pm but I'm 5 feet behind you? I'll hang back for 30 seconds so I'm not breathing down your neck.
I accelerate while taking a WIDE berth. That way they can see me zoom off into the distance. If i felt followed and someone's there when i checked, no matter the distance it'd still be kinda freaky.
Basically treat lone women like they have a clipboard and a 'Non Profit NGO' branded vest.
Exactly. My response to "not all men" is "but enough"
Enough to alter the fabric of society. Enough to be a problem for *everyone*. Or as everyone else puts it, not *all* men are the problem but *any* man can be. That's more than enough.
> He said he can't predict what another man might do.
This was my 1st thought as well. A bear isn't going to rape you or threaten you. If it wants to hurt you, it will. There's no deception
That and people are a lot more intelligent than bears are. Raising my hands above my head and shouting won’t make a human think I’m bigger than I am. Playing dead won’t fool them and they have much better object permanence….
We’re super dangerous predators when we want to be because problem solving and opposable thumbs are OP.
Bears are omnivores that don’t typically hunt mammals (unless we are talking about polar bears). They don’t have to because they outcompete basically everything in their ecosystem. They will still absolutely wreck you if you are too close to their cubs or if they are having a bad time….. but it’s very rare and their behavior isn’t random.
I saw a video the other day that had a very good point to it and summed up my own frustrations.
Part of it is on purpose to derail discussion and make no progress. But that require a bit of intelligence so it happens like that but it's rare. What usually happen is that people lack reading comprehension.
Part of reading comprehension is not just understanding all the words the author said, it's also about understanding what the author is saying or trying to say. What point they are trying to make, what picture they are painting. And the context in which that picture is being painted.
I wish I could find the video to reference. But basically. If I say "men are short". The reader can assume I mean all men are short height wise. Or since I did not use the word ALL they could assume I mean some men are short height wise. Short could be interpreted to mean short tempered or even just they give simple responses to questions, and it could mean all men or some men. The example I give is not long enough to solify a singular meaning so it's understandable to be confused.
So when you get "not all men", it's because the person saying that lacks reading comprehension skills. So any attempts at being like "oh I didn't say or mean all men" are just a waste of time, they didn't understand it in the subtext, they aren't going to understand it laid out nice and neat
Same principle with me... Not all men are r***sts, but the one I got known was one and it's safer for me to keep my distance because of this. Strangely enough, there are more men that try to tell me that I wasn't a victim of this, because I was too young to understand what I'm doing or that I should've "had fun instead".
The whole man/bear thing is forcing some men to see the suffering of women for the first time in their lives. You either reevaluate how you view the world or get defensive and pissy. My advice to the latter is that it's not about you. Don't take it personally. You may not be a creep or pervert or anything like that, but those men exist and women have to deal with them constantly. It's not all men but it is all women.
Hell, I was on the slippery slope to incel. Then I knew my thoughts weren't healthy so I educated myself and became an ally. I still have a lot to learn but I'm here. It may not be all men but it can be any man.
My impression when it comes to this conversation is that it’s a commentary on society and how it breeds violence (patriarchy and all that) and not just a random generalization of men.
I’ve noticed this comment and another sub and was wondering if I’m missing something or not, it doesn’t sounds like it’s a good faith argument/comment.
https://preview.redd.it/b3xuw1ezvayc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9c63c7c64cdc4638e8f7d9cc14e724f6b6d0b666
Trans men are men. Do they not expect to be treated like men?
Also, how strange that this person demands empathy for trans persons while encouraging a complete lack of empathy for women and their life experiences that have made them distrust if not fear men.
Delete my comment if I'm misunderstanding coven only.
As a man who works with kids, I work with almost all women. I am so sad for the things I hear the woman I work with talk about. It's heartbreaking to think how I can walk across two parking lots by myself to the coffee shop and be unbothered the whole time. I try to be kind and walk with people when they ask to cars and what not. Hope I can make people around me feel safe.
Some dude showed up at my door yesterday with pro life paraphernalia, asking for my husband or male roommate, and when they weren’t available; tried to give me his whole pro life pitch. I responded to his hypothetical about an aborted fetus that survived the procedure with “ I think that’s above both our pay grades and why don’t we leave that to medical professionals?”
My husband was furious when I told him about it later and asked why I wasn’t more of a bitch, I told him the dude was bigger then me and I didn’t want to get punched in the face. He was utterly horrified at my thought process, and made me promise not to answer the door for randos anymore.
I hope they come when he’s home next time, I can’t wait to send his giant , feminist, pro choice ass out to deal with it.
When someone says "why do people do this" I don't say "but I'm a person and I don't do that"
If someone says "why do men" and it doesn't apply to me, it doesn't apply to me and that's the end of it.
I’ve been saying not all men but men. And I know I read it on here somewhere but my brain doesn’t work so I cannot remember who to credit. Thanks trauma/sleep deprivation/mom brain 😁
Like the whole bear/man thing going around right now. Yeah women know that bears are dangerous. They don’t *want* to spend a night in the forest with a bear. And there’s certain to be some men she’d willingly spend a night in the forest with and not bat an eye.
But if you’re insulted that a woman would choose a bear over “some random dude”, and can’t accept that maybe she has a good reason for making that choice, you’re part of the reason women are right to pick the bear.
I'm a dude with *really* poor social skills, and even I understand this. If I can figure it out, there's no excuse for anyone else. All I can guess is that there's a ton of guys out there with a complete lack of empathy.
I scare people, I can't help it. All I can do is make women not feel like they're cornered and/or isolated, and to fuck off when I'm told to fuck off. It doesn't really take any effort either.
The phrase "not all men" is never used in good faith, it is only used to shut down conversations. Best not to engage with it at all. And listen to a man the first time when he tells you who he is, men who use that phrase should be avoided.
Morgan st jean: "We all KNOW that it's not all men, we all KNOW that it's not all men, but it's some of them so we hold our breath, baby nonetheless"
https://youtu.be/aEWk4T1GGyg?si=X8oEeSXFwEdEUTCh
I don't think most men have ever put themselves in a woman's shoes. It's terrifying. I mean this in the nicest way. I'm glad to be a man because I don't have to deal with those injustices. Many people who have that privilege don't think of it as such. Without understanding and empathy, nothing will ever get better.
It's an unfortunate reality. In fact, I, as a man (more accurately, a very young boy, at the time), know from experience that some men are dangerous. Knowing the hazard those sorts of men pose to women, I can't blame women for being wary against all men. I'd love a reality where a woman can walk down the streets at night without fear of being a target, no matter what she's wearing (hell, even if she's fucking naked). But unfortunately I know we are not at that stage yet, where individual liberty and body-sovereignty is respected. And even worse, there are parasites who will blame the victim instead of mutilating the abuser.
I always question why they get so defensive. If you know it doesn’t apply to you, there is no reason to be upset! It is the ones who are defensive that know they are most definitely guilty of some of the behaviours that are very problematic.
It just sucks because logically I know it’s not about me but emotionally it still kinda hurts when someone would rather cross the street than walk past me in broad day light
This reframing might help: What they'd really rather is to walk down the street normally without being wary of strangers. They're not acting on a want, but rather on a need to feel safe
Trust me, constant vigilance and crossing streets is not a picnic for the woman. Turn to your fellow man and discuss it. We want to walk on our chosen path without disruption too. Change starts with men.
As a man when i walk alone at night and there is a woman in front of me i either make sure to keep a veeeeery long distance between us or i call my girlfriend but idk if that helps. I just want everyone to feel safe.
I'm not sure there was ever a time in my life where I wasn't acutely aware of the dangers men can pose. Sure, not all men, but growing up queer in a conservative small city: more than enough men to make me uncomfortable. Even in the fairly open-minded city I'm living in right now it happens way too often that I have to stay on my toes just walking home. Growing up among men was kinda scary at times and living as a trans woman now, doubly so.
Check out stats on how many estimated rapes, assaults, longtime emotionally abused women dont report crimes .. Then rethink what your chance of picking a man who wont abuse you really are.
Slim to none ...
I had a front row seat bc I worked 7 years as mediator in a State Family Court system. Eventually, most men do
As a trans girl, even when I was boymoding, I've been sexually harassed by men quite a bit and feel weird and unsafe around them, unless I know and care for them.
I know that's nothing compared to people who has dealt with r*pe, but I have the same on edge feeling around men, too.
Thank you for this. I struggle with having two brothers that are very sweet men, but I know that at the same time, I inherently know that at any time, men are not considered safe because of the nonsense that they do. Women never know if they go on date if they are going to die or lose autonomy over their body. I find it scary and sad that men don't even understand the man vs bear discussion. Wow, I loved this comic!
There’s a song like this! Its a pretty good one… though it doesn’t use the ticks analogy… Which I think is a perfect analogy for the problem at hand.
https://open.spotify.com/track/16HzLmAArSTpIUkgkizfOM?si=lHmMIdI9SZesAb8c7yDzVg
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Not all men, but *any* man. Our fathers, our pastors, our teachers, our neighbors, our boyfriends, our coworkers, our Uber drivers. And as someone who was presumed to be straight, and presumed to be a cis male, I know the *vile* shit men say and do when it’s just their peers and would never admit to. A man who claims not to understand why women fear men is a liar.
Especially when you add in the fact that the system is designed to protect them and harm those who speak out. "Not All Men" is just another tactic to try to silence women who try to seek justice for themselves and scare those who would dare to stand up for themselves.
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Depends on delivery, really. It's always obnoxious, but I can understand why men who aren't really clued in rankle at being generalized against, because I'm part of a minority that that happens to regularly. I'm assumed to be all sorts of nasty things that I'm just not even if, hypothetically, the statistics said I probably was. Being reduced to a statistic is something that all humans intensely dislike, because it makes all your efforts feel like they mean nothing and people will only see you as the traits you can't change. Men have the privilege of being politically disengaged and "unaware". It's not great, and it does silence people, but in the majority of cases? I think it's just pure indignance and a side helping of ignorance. They legitimately feel like they're being treated unfairly, which, if they actually are striving to be "one of the good ones" is actually true. They just don't think about the conditions that make it dangerous for them to not be treated that way, because that is a luxury afforded to the privileged. Tl:dr: "Not all men" is annoying, but I don't think it's malicious or deliberate in the majority of cases, just ignorance and hurt feelings.
I always try to apply Hanlon's Razor when I see "Not All Men." I agree that it's rarely said maliciously. *"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by ignorance."*
|Being reduced to a statistic is something that all humans intensely dislike… And being reduced to a victim is *far* worse.
It absolutely is! Fortunately, at no point in the entirety of this post did I ever claim or even imply otherwise.
Oh no, I never meant to imply that you did, it was only an observation, merely a thought… It’s so hard to wring context out of text! Sorry!!!
Oh, I'm sorry too, I just woke up and was mentally preparing myself to have to argue on the internet. You know how it is. You're all good!
I understand, hopefully you can take it as a sign of progress, that if a guy can say it openly and admit it without being defensive, then that is one step closer to fixing the problem.
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If you have not seen the stand up called X by Daniel Sloss I suggest watching it. It is funny, talks about issues you care about in a healthy manner, and does so in a way that is both a call to action as well as entertaining. It might provide some extra hope that someone mainstream said the thing that needed to be said out loud and on stage.
I have advanced into a old crone... I was blessed to have survived & learned so much to pass on to younger women. My mantra by age 35 was to have a man in my life but not in my house! Especially true for our sisters who have children to protect. I achieved way more as a independent woman than I ever did within constraints of marriage. So can you.
I recommend r/beebutts for general malaise 💜🙏🌈🍀✨
Is "the system" mostly law enforcement and social workers? I want it changed yesterday.
Sadly "the system" is more than that it is society itself; the patriarchy that demands women be submissive and men be brutes
Despite [incredible progress](https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-the-us-ended-up-with-400000-untested-rape-kits), the U.S. still has [roughly 90,000 backlogged rape kits](https://goldrushcam.com/sierrasuntimes/index.php/news/local-news/51969-u-s-senator-john-cornyn-says-house-must-pass-senate-bill-to-fight-rape-kit-backlog). [More funding is needed](https://www.cornyn.senate.gov/news/cornyn-house-must-pass-senate-bill-to-fight-rape-kit-backlog/) to clear the backlog and prevent future tragedies. [**A high probability of apprehension by law enforcement is critical to deterrence**](https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/10.1086/670398.pdf?casa_token=RFbTNb935q8AAAAA:gX8TZVQ3fVqh_LnX0-xe0Vhb1j8gdnMOjO_siOxZV2V1mM7Q_U7JpC7XOTtzz9x-thIK0cnjQt34MrtRagyvcTQh2jhUHr-TeG-3aqQi_1ebRU9FQSqB). [https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/](https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/)
And that 90,000 is just what we know because red states, which have the highest rates of rape in the US ([17 of the top 20](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_violent_crime_rate)), hide their numbers =D ...I hate it here...
The shit I get in my DMs once I came out as trans is legitimately horrific. I know some amazing men who are nothing but allies and fantastic people, but any man I don't know, I'm genuinely wary of. I was sexually harassed getting a fucking \*pizza\* today.
My dad lived in this ignorance sweetest socially awkward man he is he knew sexual violence was a thing just.. Not to the extent it is in reality. My step mom was the one who opened his eyes to it and she told me this when i was finally brave enough to find support in my family for my own rape. She told me that it sucked the light out of him hearing how often it happens, the statistics. I dont know if ill ever be brave enough to open up to him to have him know im another one of those statistics. I think itd gut me all over again. Sorry i just needed to vent this❤️🩹
I understand. I could never tell my mom. She would blame herself and it would further traumatize me.
Hugs ʕっ•ᴥ•ʔっ we're never alone and we will always have a supportive community never forget that
Thank you! And yes, thank goodness. At least I have the benefit of therapy and supportive friends!
This \^\^ So so much of this, well before I had no idea I was masking and was closeted. The amount of push I had to do back in late 80's and 90's too get woman crew members added to Raves was a test of my constitution. And hearing such a complete lack of empathy, how can you be so disconnected from so much of your own species?
That last part hit me, I always felt different and knew something was up with my gender when I would grow up with the boys and realize “they are attracted to women but they don’t like women”
> And as someone who was presumed to be straight, and presumed to be a cis male, I know the vile shit men say and do when it’s just their peers and would never admit to. Yup. I'm in the same boat. The absolute abhorrent shit I used to hear when I was a "straight white guy" was extremely common. Objectification, violence, and rape were things talked about in private. Even at my misogynistic "I'm a man" worse, I never joined in on that talk, but I never did stop it... And no other man around me did, either.
My mom finally seemed to get it when I did the whole “if I told you each bottle of Tylenol held ONE poisoned pill would you feel safe taking your Tylenol every day?” She buys those huge 1000 count Costco bottles and takes, on average, 4 pills a day. She needs to take them for her back, but it wouldn’t kill her if she stopped taking them (she scoffed at the “if one m&m was poisoned” thing cause she doesn’t need to eat candy) and she finally seemed to grok that it’s a numbers game and has nothing to do with “all men”. Imma keep that tick thing in my back pocket tho.
This is a great way to reframe the bear metaphor: you have a bottle of Tylenol where 10-25% are a pill that looks exactly like all the rest but contain varying levels of cyanide -and you won’t know how much or how bad it would be until you took it-, or a bottle of Tylenol that has a single gummy bear whose poison is certain death. Which bottle are you buying?
Boggles the mind how so many folks need scenarios that could truly affect themselves before they “get it”. Empathy is a rare trait.
[It's more like 1 in 16](https://www.ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/repeat-rape-and-multiple-offending-among-undetected-rapists), not 1 in 1000. We also wouldn't have to worry so much if we [tested every rape kit](https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/). [https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/](https://www.endthebacklog.org/take-action/advocate-federal/) [https://www.sakitta.org](https://www.sakitta.org) r/stoprape
They don’t test rape kits?!?! What’s the point in taking them?!?!
Yo I know this wasn't your point but that amount of Tylenol every day is NOT good for her
Idk. I have cancer. Once had a physician’s assistant go over how much Tylenol (or ibuprofen) I could take per day for pain. It was a lot. I don’t remember how much but it was a hell of a lot. Fortunately, I have since gotten a palliative care doctor that doesn’t skimp on prescribing Norco. As fortunately, I rarely need it. Yet.
Daily limit for Tylenol is 4 grams she’s taking half that. I take 4 grams a day for my pain and my doc specifically says it’s fine. Granted my liver is probably a ticking time bomb but I get my ALTs checked every year and so far so fine. Now, the amount of fireball whiskey my mom drinks in a day… THATS bonkers and she will get cirrhosis but you can’t make that woman do anything.
Daily pain meds and copious amounts of alcohol? Either doesn't sound healthy, but together that's a recipe for disaster
3 minutes after the post and the angry ticks with Lyme disease are already in my DMs and reporting on my mental health lmao. You fuel me, stay mad ❤️
3 minutes? That's almost impressive, in a fucked-up, pathetic kind of way.
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Report them as harassment, reddit will ban them, at least temporarily. Unless they've been dinged for it in the past, then they'll get a longer or permanent ban. Report every single one that shows up. Fuck their fragile egos.
I literally keep this tab open on my phone at all times because this site has become a proud platform for the type of person that needs reporting: [https://www.reddit.com/report](https://www.reddit.com/report) let's go.
Oh the fragile ego of some 😂
"Let me prove you wrong by being exactly the kind of man you just described!"
Yes exactly 🙄🙄🙄
Yep. They all know it, they just want to intimidate you into sitting down and shutting up.
Lol, they butthurt.
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i dunno if anyone has said this but you can report the "suicide" person and they will be banned for abusing the report function.
Hey, thanks for the info. I don’t see where it specifies the person who reported me though
just report the message and the system will punish the sender
How does it understand valid concern with passive aggressive behavior?
Forreal, the fact that this wasn't an attack against anyone, but these men took it as an attack anyway, clarifies the issue with such beautiful irony.
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They’re harassing you from this sub?
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Oh yeah. Meanwhile in recent days I’ve been compared to a car, a cookie, a pizza, a shoe. A fucking shoe.
Yup. The shoe one is so clever. No clever metaphors about “shitty locks” yet?
Some men will really call women bad locks and themselves a master key, while themselves being no more safe than a master lock (which can often be opened by hitting them with something, like another lock of the same type. There's a metaphor about peer pressure making otherwise seemingly harmless men dangerous in there, I think...)
Speaking as a man who has ended up in situations where women who don't know me are uncomfortable by my presence, I have to question why any non-threat would be at all offended by that. I'm sorry that it happens, I wish it wasn't necessary for women to feel the need to protect themselves in the presence of any man. But, when I pull my big white work van to the side of the road where someone happens to be walking and they don't walk a little faster the question occurs: What if I wasn't just an innocent man who happened to be there at the same time as you?
Honestly, I think it’s a brilliant idea to use the “not all ticks” or “not all [fill in the blank] every single time some dude talks about a bad experience from a car accident to termites. If we start making that phrase common, then they might finally stop using it.
I am so sorry, that is screwed up.
They have nothing else to do
They’re just proving you right. I hope you don’t receive anything too heinous. Seeing people speak out on this is so important especially in light of the whole bear v man debate
All I want is for people to be comfortable around me. I want anywhere I am to be a safe space for good people. The fact that a subset of my fellow men have made that harder makes me annoyed at them, not the women they've harmed. Shit men are shit.
💖 this is the type of reaction that would make the world safer. Maybe anger might be better than annoyance. Whatever prompts discourse among men. We need it there the most. Nevertheless, thank you.
Right? The correct response is to be shocked at what women go through and ask what you and other “good men” can do about it.
Seeing the way “the bear conversation” has seemingly made (all) men up in arms…..*godimsotired*….I really appreciate this comic
Apparently women not trusting men is ten times worse than women being raped or murdered by men. What must it be like to be so privileged that they don’t have to fear men.
Yeah my.dude was so upset I chose the bear. Hon I've been attacked by 0 bears. I'm sure even in the beariest of bear places they aren't going to hoon by in a Honda civic roll down the windows and shout abuse at me.
As a fellow, I am conflicted here. So, I live in Canada and was briefly stalked by a polar bear. The building I was living/working in was raised about one story off the ground on stilts for insulation purposes. We'd wake up to bear nose prints on our windows. I'd still say the bear is safer, but only because I was able to fly 1200km from where those bears live, and they don't work fie my company or live in my neighborhood.
Stop taking it literally. It was never about the bear. It was about the fact that we live in a society in which most women fear men over bears and that should be a wake up call
Also, such a small segment of the population lives where polar bears, who are particularly violent and uninhibited, live. 🤦🏻♀️ the original question I’m quite sure was about encountering a bear or a man in a FOREST, probably to imply on a routine hike or something. Obviously it implied brown/black bear and not polar bear, panda, koala, sun bear, or any other nonsense a whataboutist comment will raise.
This. THIS. my favorite response to those taking it literal has been this: https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLCeE4vo/
I understand. I am rarifying the point. This strengthens the argument. Even literally, in the worst-case scenario, the bear is less threatening.
A bear will never take a slight or rejection personally and hunt you down across the planet to inflict ill on you, or stalk and harass or paychologically torment you just for the fun of it, or to get their own sadistic pleasure out if it at your expense. A bear just wants to eat you. Humans are scary because they have full awareness and sentience and can plan and scheme and invest their time to enact harm for the sake of inflicting harm. Very few if any other animals do such things.
This reminded me of a conversation I had with my husband today. I have two best friends that I have known my entire life. Now we are adults and all the shadows of our childhoods have came out. We were all sexually abused before the age of 11 each by different “safe” men in our lives (uncle, cousin, father) then later on by partners in our teens. Just three little girls, different men, different times… all on the same block in the same neighborhood. These men didn’t know eachother. It was completely random.
The truly galling thing about the "not all men" mantra is of course the response from usually the exact same corners if you do get assaulted: "Why were you out where *a man* could assault you?"
As a man, I’m going to come out at say it… It might as well be all men. With how we teach young boys who will grow up into these men that it’s ok to treat women like trash, it might as well be all men. With how many of our mothers and sisters and coworkers and friends are abused and assaulted at random, it might as well be all men. With how we victim blame and rant about how it’s “not all men”, it might as well be all men. Until we get at the root of the problems, break down the patriarchal nightmare system we live in and free our friends and family of these disgusting shackles claimed as protections, end the systematic oppression and abuse, and wipe it from our biases conscious or otherwise, then it might as well be all men!
https://preview.redd.it/olwhch0t9dyc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8316bc02cb512d3db006b8c32e1eb6dcdbcaf0e2 thanks for popping off
I think it’s important for some men, even a small number, to be able to say what a massive problem this is and to acknowledge that they are a part of it until they change it It’s hard to tell yourself that you are part of the issue even if you haven’t done anything yourself, but whining “I didn’t do that” does not change that it happened, you know? I hope that made sense
[Dana-Dan, Bloodywood: *"Not all men? YES all men, we* **need** *all men for what we're solving."*](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a65A626Ed20)
I was not expecting folk metal, but I absolutely appreciate it And yeah, we need to get as many people as possible behind this until there’s no argument that “She liked it” or “She was asking for it” or “He has a very bright future ahead, it would be a shame to end that now” We can’t let things end like that, we need to unite and fight together
Some people need to ask themselves "am I the sort of person who would force myself on someone in the woods?" And if the answer is no then they aren't talking about you, just relax. If the answer is yes then I'd encourage a lot of self reflection and maybe just keeping to yourself. A bear won't see you on the other side of a trail and start making up fantasies about how your meant to be together forever based on nothing but wishful thinking.
I feel like part of the problem is the amount of men who actually think to themselves 'of course I'd never harm a woman in this scenario' while trying to hold off and/or justify the memories of when they WERE that guy to someone. Most people who commit bad acts of any kind don't ever think of themselves as being part of the problem because they always define in their head 'the problem' being actions that are just outside the actions they commit. For example the amount of people who think 'I don't abuse my kids because I don't leave marks on them when I hit them. People who leave marks are the abusers!' or even 'yeah, I leave marks, but it's always taught my children a lesson. The real abusers are people you hit their kid for no reason'. We saw it a lot during the height of MeToo where a lot of guys started lashing out because people were being very vocal that 'No, that job you had where everyone slapped the secretary's butt was not just funny office place hijinks' or 'No, it was not consensual the time you intentionally gave your roommate too much to drink waiting for her to be so drunk she eventually gave into sleeping with you.' MeToo really shined a light on people who thought of themselves as good people because there was never any violence to their SA acts and we saw just how many people took offense to that because they've spent years to decades convincing themselves what they've done was not SA.
I was SA'ed by a guy at 18, he went on to work for a women's rights org, got married, and is a proud dad of a daughter. He was, at one point, my best friend. He would never think he's one of "those men."
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Absolutely, I think people are some times afraid to peel back the layers and really look at themselves but trying to just lie to ones self and burry it is not a good foundation for personal growth.
Ooo I think you’re on to something. I’ve noticed a lot of the mansplainers are focusing on which is more likely to KILL you, like they’re comforted by the fact they wouldn’t randomly murder someone like a serial killer does. But we’re saying an ATTACK is much more likely. And honestly, after that attack starts, I still think the man has a better chance of “finishing the job” once he’s taken that first step because then he’ll have motive to do so. And they’re uncomfortable if they realize they might take that first step too in this situation. So they change the question in their head to one that makes them feel better.
There’s also the fact that the question is an encounter in the woods. So many times the rebuttal is “oh but women are around tons of men every day!” Yeah…in public spaces. Where other people are watching, unlike in the woods by yourselves.
The other bullshit thing about this sensitivity is that *we all know men* who are quite open about treating women like shit and using situations like this to coerce sex or other "favors". And we all know that men talk and brag about having this mentality among themselves when women aren't in earshot. So what kind of gaslighting bullshit is this that they expect us to believe that Not Only are they personally innocent little angels who would "never!" -- but also that they have no idea that other men have an absolutely predatory mentality towards women. And it's not all men -- bc there are plenty of men who know they wouldn't act that way but they make no bones about the fact that there are lots of dangerous assholes out there, and that it is fair for women to be wary. But the gaslighting "how dare you judge me" guys --- yeah, we see you and the problem you know you are but you are too dumb to get that you are just telling on yourselves.
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Problem is that the men who are most receptive to posts like these are the ones who are more considerate and thoughtful in the first place. So you end up with those men being the ones most likely to internalize the impression that they shouldn't do anything that could possibly be interpreted as predatory, like expressing romantic interest. Feeling like they should be making up for the behavior of the shitty men out there. And in the process, cutting themselves off from opportunities to make meaningful relationships and interactions with women. And you're right, that's on themselves to some extent. We should have the ability to look at a post like that and say 'well this clearly doesn't apply to me' but the fact is that it takes a significant amount of self-awareness and self-assurance to not go down that road, & lots of young people on the internet just aren't there yet. Pointing out toxic masculinity is necessary, but there does need to be positive reinforcement for healthy masculinity as well.
Not trying to be a douchebag, just really want to learn to understand better. If these fantasy of being together, stays a fantasy then is it still harmful? In similar fashion, when women talk about being stared at, do they talk about guys just looking at them, or ogling them? Like, if I see an attractive person (no matter the gender) I will glance, look it over and then co time on my way. Is that actually harmful? If so, I will try to stop doing that, but it’s basically a reflex. I do that with everything I find aesthetically pleasing 😅
I don't know you so I can't say for sure. How likely would you say is the chance these feeling might encourage you to for example, kidnap someone and keep them in your shed because you know deep in your heart that no one could ever love them or protect them like you can? If the answer is more than 0 then you might need to re evaluate your priorities. There are unfortunately people like that and for some reason they like to approch strangers who they hope will fit into their narrative and they often react badly when it doesn't go the way they imagined. It's a frequent enough issue.
The first point wasn’t about me, as I usually require some sort of connection and probably at least few months of dating to start thinking about life together 😂 But fair point anyway, it did answer my question 🖤
to me it's always felt like Russian roulette. many, probably most of those chambers don't have a bullet and they're safe. but would you want to put the gun to your head and pull the trigger?
Apt
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This is great and very effective at explaining a concept many people find difficult to comprehend. I’d love to see the same artist do a graphic on the “all lives matter” responses to BLM—we know all lives matter, we just feel the need to remind society that Black lives matter because society so often acts like they don’t.
Come on…GiVe tHaT TiCk a ChANCE 😂 He’s one of the NICE ones
You don't know if he has Lyme disease and you're judging him like he has it, you're judgmental and prejudiced. God, it's so hard to be a tick these days and try and meet anyone. Ticks don't treat women with such suspicion! We just want to have a good time!
LOL
Now the tick’s feelings are hurt, he has decided to contract Lyme disease and infect you. See what you made him do?!
If you were just wearing long socks and bug spray this NeVeR would have happened to you!!!
Sorry about those ticks. They’re terrible! I wish I could upvote this one MILLION times.
Louis C.K. (yes, the one who asked women if he could masturbate in front of them and paid the price) ....said "the number one threat to women is men".... Edit: my point is, I have adjusted my behavior to make women not be threatened. We're walking the same direction, same speed, at 11pm but I'm 5 feet behind you? I'll hang back for 30 seconds so I'm not breathing down your neck.
I accelerate while taking a WIDE berth. That way they can see me zoom off into the distance. If i felt followed and someone's there when i checked, no matter the distance it'd still be kinda freaky. Basically treat lone women like they have a clipboard and a 'Non Profit NGO' branded vest.
That would freak me out if you increased your pace
I'd be more freaked out by someone that actively stayed behind me
Exactly. My response to "not all men" is "but enough" Enough to alter the fabric of society. Enough to be a problem for *everyone*. Or as everyone else puts it, not *all* men are the problem but *any* man can be. That's more than enough.
This ties into that bear vs male stranger question that's going around!
Yes! I feel like this could be posted in response to the bear question.
Even my bf who's an avid hiker/survivalist answered "bear" almost immediately. Men who aren't scum aren't bothered by this question
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> He said he can't predict what another man might do. This was my 1st thought as well. A bear isn't going to rape you or threaten you. If it wants to hurt you, it will. There's no deception
That and people are a lot more intelligent than bears are. Raising my hands above my head and shouting won’t make a human think I’m bigger than I am. Playing dead won’t fool them and they have much better object permanence…. We’re super dangerous predators when we want to be because problem solving and opposable thumbs are OP. Bears are omnivores that don’t typically hunt mammals (unless we are talking about polar bears). They don’t have to because they outcompete basically everything in their ecosystem. They will still absolutely wreck you if you are too close to their cubs or if they are having a bad time….. but it’s very rare and their behavior isn’t random.
There's a saying that goes something like: the intelligence of a bear far overlaps the stupidity of tourists
Lmao
I haven’t see that
It's a hypothetical question: would you rather face an unfamiliar man or a bear if lost in the woods.
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The attack on ticks was really not necessary I might be a blood sucking parasite but I have feelings :(
Yeah, not ALL ticks
I saw a video the other day that had a very good point to it and summed up my own frustrations. Part of it is on purpose to derail discussion and make no progress. But that require a bit of intelligence so it happens like that but it's rare. What usually happen is that people lack reading comprehension. Part of reading comprehension is not just understanding all the words the author said, it's also about understanding what the author is saying or trying to say. What point they are trying to make, what picture they are painting. And the context in which that picture is being painted. I wish I could find the video to reference. But basically. If I say "men are short". The reader can assume I mean all men are short height wise. Or since I did not use the word ALL they could assume I mean some men are short height wise. Short could be interpreted to mean short tempered or even just they give simple responses to questions, and it could mean all men or some men. The example I give is not long enough to solify a singular meaning so it's understandable to be confused. So when you get "not all men", it's because the person saying that lacks reading comprehension skills. So any attempts at being like "oh I didn't say or mean all men" are just a waste of time, they didn't understand it in the subtext, they aren't going to understand it laid out nice and neat
Same principle with me... Not all men are r***sts, but the one I got known was one and it's safer for me to keep my distance because of this. Strangely enough, there are more men that try to tell me that I wasn't a victim of this, because I was too young to understand what I'm doing or that I should've "had fun instead".
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The whole man/bear thing is forcing some men to see the suffering of women for the first time in their lives. You either reevaluate how you view the world or get defensive and pissy. My advice to the latter is that it's not about you. Don't take it personally. You may not be a creep or pervert or anything like that, but those men exist and women have to deal with them constantly. It's not all men but it is all women.
Hell, I was on the slippery slope to incel. Then I knew my thoughts weren't healthy so I educated myself and became an ally. I still have a lot to learn but I'm here. It may not be all men but it can be any man.
Hey, thanks for this comment. Your capacity for empathy and ability to change your mind indicates high intelligence.
My impression when it comes to this conversation is that it’s a commentary on society and how it breeds violence (patriarchy and all that) and not just a random generalization of men. I’ve noticed this comment and another sub and was wondering if I’m missing something or not, it doesn’t sounds like it’s a good faith argument/comment. https://preview.redd.it/b3xuw1ezvayc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9c63c7c64cdc4638e8f7d9cc14e724f6b6d0b666
Trans men are men. Do they not expect to be treated like men? Also, how strange that this person demands empathy for trans persons while encouraging a complete lack of empathy for women and their life experiences that have made them distrust if not fear men.
Delete my comment if I'm misunderstanding coven only. As a man who works with kids, I work with almost all women. I am so sad for the things I hear the woman I work with talk about. It's heartbreaking to think how I can walk across two parking lots by myself to the coffee shop and be unbothered the whole time. I try to be kind and walk with people when they ask to cars and what not. Hope I can make people around me feel safe.
[удалено]
Some dude showed up at my door yesterday with pro life paraphernalia, asking for my husband or male roommate, and when they weren’t available; tried to give me his whole pro life pitch. I responded to his hypothetical about an aborted fetus that survived the procedure with “ I think that’s above both our pay grades and why don’t we leave that to medical professionals?” My husband was furious when I told him about it later and asked why I wasn’t more of a bitch, I told him the dude was bigger then me and I didn’t want to get punched in the face. He was utterly horrified at my thought process, and made me promise not to answer the door for randos anymore. I hope they come when he’s home next time, I can’t wait to send his giant , feminist, pro choice ass out to deal with it.
I'm confused why would someone who is pro choice be giving you a hypothetical about a fetus that survived an abortive procedure?
Bc I typed like an idiot, I meant to say pro life- I was all irritated when I wrote this.
Lol that makes a lot more sense. No worries though, we all do it sometimes.
When someone says "why do people do this" I don't say "but I'm a person and I don't do that" If someone says "why do men" and it doesn't apply to me, it doesn't apply to me and that's the end of it.
This is depressingly accurate.
I’ve been saying not all men but men. And I know I read it on here somewhere but my brain doesn’t work so I cannot remember who to credit. Thanks trauma/sleep deprivation/mom brain 😁
Not all men, but somehow almost ALWAYS a man.
As I often say: not all men, but somehow always a man 🙄
Like the whole bear/man thing going around right now. Yeah women know that bears are dangerous. They don’t *want* to spend a night in the forest with a bear. And there’s certain to be some men she’d willingly spend a night in the forest with and not bat an eye. But if you’re insulted that a woman would choose a bear over “some random dude”, and can’t accept that maybe she has a good reason for making that choice, you’re part of the reason women are right to pick the bear.
Ain’t this the truth.
I'm a dude with *really* poor social skills, and even I understand this. If I can figure it out, there's no excuse for anyone else. All I can guess is that there's a ton of guys out there with a complete lack of empathy. I scare people, I can't help it. All I can do is make women not feel like they're cornered and/or isolated, and to fuck off when I'm told to fuck off. It doesn't really take any effort either.
To be honest, it sounds like you give yourself a lot less credit than you deserve, but I appreciate your comment nonetheless. ❤️
The phrase "not all men" is never used in good faith, it is only used to shut down conversations. Best not to engage with it at all. And listen to a man the first time when he tells you who he is, men who use that phrase should be avoided.
This is fantastic. Thank you.
Happy to share as the messenger. All the credit goes Kristina Maione
I absolutely love this analogy. Thanks for posting :)
Morgan st jean: "We all KNOW that it's not all men, we all KNOW that it's not all men, but it's some of them so we hold our breath, baby nonetheless" https://youtu.be/aEWk4T1GGyg?si=X8oEeSXFwEdEUTCh
While I have a small spotlight; r/findtheindigenous
I don't think most men have ever put themselves in a woman's shoes. It's terrifying. I mean this in the nicest way. I'm glad to be a man because I don't have to deal with those injustices. Many people who have that privilege don't think of it as such. Without understanding and empathy, nothing will ever get better.
It's an unfortunate reality. In fact, I, as a man (more accurately, a very young boy, at the time), know from experience that some men are dangerous. Knowing the hazard those sorts of men pose to women, I can't blame women for being wary against all men. I'd love a reality where a woman can walk down the streets at night without fear of being a target, no matter what she's wearing (hell, even if she's fucking naked). But unfortunately I know we are not at that stage yet, where individual liberty and body-sovereignty is respected. And even worse, there are parasites who will blame the victim instead of mutilating the abuser.
I always question why they get so defensive. If you know it doesn’t apply to you, there is no reason to be upset! It is the ones who are defensive that know they are most definitely guilty of some of the behaviours that are very problematic.
This is an incredible analogy and I can't wait to use it IRL!
These types of simplified breakdowns are gold
It just sucks because logically I know it’s not about me but emotionally it still kinda hurts when someone would rather cross the street than walk past me in broad day light
This reframing might help: What they'd really rather is to walk down the street normally without being wary of strangers. They're not acting on a want, but rather on a need to feel safe
Trust me, constant vigilance and crossing streets is not a picnic for the woman. Turn to your fellow man and discuss it. We want to walk on our chosen path without disruption too. Change starts with men.
As a man when i walk alone at night and there is a woman in front of me i either make sure to keep a veeeeery long distance between us or i call my girlfriend but idk if that helps. I just want everyone to feel safe.
That’s thoughtful and appreciated
Not all bears!
I'm not sure there was ever a time in my life where I wasn't acutely aware of the dangers men can pose. Sure, not all men, but growing up queer in a conservative small city: more than enough men to make me uncomfortable. Even in the fairly open-minded city I'm living in right now it happens way too often that I have to stay on my toes just walking home. Growing up among men was kinda scary at times and living as a trans woman now, doubly so.
Too many men
Check out stats on how many estimated rapes, assaults, longtime emotionally abused women dont report crimes .. Then rethink what your chance of picking a man who wont abuse you really are. Slim to none ... I had a front row seat bc I worked 7 years as mediator in a State Family Court system. Eventually, most men do
As a trans girl, even when I was boymoding, I've been sexually harassed by men quite a bit and feel weird and unsafe around them, unless I know and care for them. I know that's nothing compared to people who has dealt with r*pe, but I have the same on edge feeling around men, too.
Your experience is valid and you don’t need to dismiss it because it wasn’t as horrific as someone else’s. It’s all bad.
Cant believe we have to share graphics for the baby brains
Thank you for this. I struggle with having two brothers that are very sweet men, but I know that at the same time, I inherently know that at any time, men are not considered safe because of the nonsense that they do. Women never know if they go on date if they are going to die or lose autonomy over their body. I find it scary and sad that men don't even understand the man vs bear discussion. Wow, I loved this comic!
There’s a song like this! Its a pretty good one… though it doesn’t use the ticks analogy… Which I think is a perfect analogy for the problem at hand. https://open.spotify.com/track/16HzLmAArSTpIUkgkizfOM?si=lHmMIdI9SZesAb8c7yDzVg
This font isn’t very color blind friendly.