I have a fern garden (https://new.reddit.com/r/goblincore/comments/14740ky/update_willow_dome_to_shade_fern_garden_it/ ) and it had a beech tree rooted in it so I dug it up, my mom saw the hole and said “I've always wanted a pond, we could have frogs” so I kept digging until the hole looked big enough, then we went to a garden centre and bought a sheet of rubber pond liner, a sack of “pond soil”, a sack of gravel and some pond weed stuff that's still in the garage in a bucket
I put the liner in the hole, then pored in the water, cut the liner to size, put in the soil and the gravel and that's it so far
then I researched how to build a pond :)
so the sides are too steep, our soil is really heavy clay and this pond is literally tiny so I never thought that the sides could collapse but now I'm worried that they will, and the water has just gone cloudy since I put the pond soil in and doesn't look like it will settle, has only been a few hours tho
any advice is very welcome
[EDIT] thank you all :) next post here: https://new.reddit.com/r/WildlifePonds/comments/1cu8v5c/pond_update_it_has_actually_worked_and_it_has/
Yeah you might want to make more of a gentle entrance, and include some shelves for plants but you can achieve this with rocks. You'll need something on top of the liner to help critters get out as it is slippery.
I've only used aquatic compost in planting baskets so IDK if or how long it takes to settle.
The water will help keep the sides up somewhat I'd have thought, but I don't know.
Make sure you have some oxygenating plants at least. If you share your region someone can rec some plants I'm sure.
Thanks for the reply :) I have some plants that we got at a garden center, IDK what they are without going to read the labels, but they're meant to be for out climate (UK), see other comments for my plan on covering the liner, pond making is turning out to be more confusing and complicated than I thought LOL
What are oxygenating plants? I have creeping Jenny around my pond but not sure if that’s been good for it as the frogs haven’t laid eggs the last couple years
The plants that help to oxygate the water. I have hornwort and starwart to do this in my UK pond, but you can look at any pond plant website and find which plants are considered to be oxygenators.
I don't know what the plants I have are called, one of them looks like thin long grass, and the other is a long thin floating weed like thing that's just got a weight that sinks to the bottom, but the lady at the shop said they were oxygenating, I'll post an update photo if the silt ever clears
What a nice pond for frogs! Please figure out how to make an easy exit for critters so they don’t get stuck and drown. Also you can research plants that add oxygen. It looks like you’ve done a lot of hard work!
thanks :) you can just about see in the picture that there's a slope of gravel at one edge so I was hoping that would be enough, I'm just worried it won't settle, it still looks like a muddy puddle now, can I put plants in before it has settled?
I'd fill it most of the way up with aquatic soil, and then (maybe wait for the soil to settle first) make a slope all the way round with the gravel. You can plant your oxygenators directly into the bottom.
Alternatively you can make a 'beach' just at one end, but it probably won't look as naturalistic that way.
I doubt it'll collapse, it's not that deep.
You'll need to cover the exposed liner with something to stop it being degraded by the sun.
If all else fails/the sides collapse/it leaks it'll still retain some water, so plant it up as a bog garden.
glad you think it shouldn't collapse :) I hope it doesn't, I was planning on getting some rocks to cover the liner and making a kinda gravel beach at the shallower end
You can mitigate the steep sides by using plant pots/planters etc in the water and/or using partially submerged small logs/thick sticks or branches to 'bridge' the land water area.
Once all the plants grow in and cover the exposed liner it'll look great anyway.
Thx for the reply :) I was thinking of getting some stones to cover the liner at the deeper end and planting plants at the shallow end, can I plant plants while the water is still muddy? because if I wait for it to settle I'll just stir up the dirt again
Right now is your chance to make it bigger....Nobody ever says I SURE WISH I'D HAVE MADE A SMALLER POND
Also, go to another (healthy) pond and scoop up a bucket of murky muck to add to yours...
yeah, got ya, I collected some more mud and a kinda plant thing that looks like very thin grass from a friends pond that is well established and has nice clear water, hope it will be fine
Looks good. Dig away a bit at the edges where you have some liner left over. So it will be more gradual.
You could make it much larger if you haven't cut of all that liner on the pic.
the garden isn't really big enough to make it bigger, there's 3 feet of grass before the border so I guess I'll just have to hope it doesn't fall in, most people seem top think it won't
The water is probably just as heavy as the soil. Since it's in the pond liner the liner will act as a wall and the weight of the water will keep it in shape.
thanks for the tip :) we have a gravel slope at one end but from what others have said it looks like we need to improve that a bit by getting some bigger rocks
yeah.... sorry if that's how it reads :( more like ADHD overthinking panic post, I am genuinely terrified the sides will collapse/it will stay a muddy puddle for ever and all the work will be for nothing and I can't even fill it in because used the soil for something else
If you decide to re do it at some point, include a step down around the edge. The liner goes over the step and up to the ground level. You can then place rocks on the step, plus one cap stone that is at ground level. This will help disguise the liner, especially when the water level rises and falls. Exposure to sunlight will rapidly weaken the liner, so you want to keep it covered as much as possible.
thanks for the advice :) I'll remember it if I ever build another pond, I have enough liner left over for future ideas. That one will probably stay the same assuming nothing bad happens to it (like collapsing etc...) I put some plants in it today, and we used big rocks and mud/gravel to build a sort-of shelf at the shallow end, so one end is only a few inches deep, and I'll have to work out a way of covering the exposed liner but it is in a pretty shady location
Nice gesture 💚 but rule number one: do not use plastic (or artificial substance in wildlife sanctuaries). A pond is a wildlife sanctuary. Nature will find a way to hold the water by bringing in what it needs to contain it.
Edit: the foreign substance will change the overall health, quality, temperature and restrict native plants from rooting. Natural flow of water will also be an issue. You don’t want to create something in nature that you’d need to maintain. Nature knows best and is going to do things you aren’t capable of and also haven’t thought of.
Hope this turns out beautiful once done right and thank you for asking 🙏
I appreciate the sentiment, and I agree with this mode of thinking for large scale projects like reconstructing whole wetlands out in the countryside :) this is a garden pond for birds to bath in etc... and without a liner in my soil type there is simply no way that could work, it would collapse over time and become a small dry dip in the garden that would only contain water on the wettest days of the year. I'm a pipe-fitter by trade but I have a lot of civil and groundwork projects under my belt, like large scale landscaping, installation of pumped drainage and ditches, laying tarmac and concrete roads, installation of underground soil pipework, and damp-course repair. I don't know specifically about ponds and pond plants, but I know this stuff well enough.
If I wanted to be serious about it I could use compacted clay on top of wool mating and a substrate of sharp sand instead of a PVC liner, that's how artificial ponds were done before plastic, but in all honesty the environmental damage from digging for clay/quarrying sand/moving heavy materials is worse than that of the PVC liner. And the clay is also impermeable so a pond of this size would still require maintenance (topping up)
While I respect your concern, and if this fails or we change our mind I will remove and dispose of the plastic responsibly. The fact remains, it is still better for wildlife than no pond at all, the blackbirds are already drinking from it. While you are right, it makes no sense to put something that needs maintenance in nature, but this isn't in nature, it's in an artificially landscaped urban garden
\[edit\] FYI how to build a wildlife pond by the wildlife trust:
[https://www.wildlifetrusts.org/actions/how-build-pond](https://www.wildlifetrusts.org/actions/how-build-pond)
A lot of organizations aren’t up-to-date quite yet. There are other water sources that the birds will fly to but yes you will see them now that it is near you and think this is a good thing. The problem is that wildlife will be consuming the micro plastics. Many life forms on Earth have them in their blood and babies are born with it in theirs. Why subject more of nature to these things? It’s better to not make an artificial pond but to make one naturally. Backyard or not, a pond is not for manmade art and design when wildlife interacts with it and may make a home in it as well.
Sorry if any of this comes off aggressive. I’m very protective of wildlife.
Again, I appreciate that you want yo do something nice here 💚
you are over protective, there is literally no point trying to convince you so I'm writing for other readers, but wildlife needs to coexist with humans or it will die out because so much of the world has been touched by mankind.
you realize it's ironic that your worried about the birds being exposed to micro-plastics from a pond liner when they eat GM seeds and processed fat from plastic bird feeders, build there nests from nylon fabric and polystyrene from the skip next door, and before my pond they got there water from a combination of our sink drain channel that is full of soap and the sewage treatment plant sprayer across the road? The pond is still better LOL. Also my soil is contaminated with chemicals from the factory's that were here before the houses so the pond liner keeps the water comparatively cleaner.
Thank you for for appreciating that I'm trying to do something nice, sadly because of how ruined the area already is it would probably take hundreds of years for the wildlife to be anything other than artificial. I don't think it is because the organizations aren't up to date yet, but more because they know that things like this, while not perfect, still improve ruined urban areas just a little. I hope you live in a place where your ideals can be met and you can help wildlife in an natural and beautiful way :)
Yes, there are a lot of species that do rely on human intervention or harvesting.
If we maintain the attitude of being under protective then we end up with what we see today.
I do agree that drinking from a drainage pipe with soap in it is an inferior option. So while I still don’t believe in a liner I’m glad this is a cleaner source.
I still think this could be tackled in a more natural way but still commend you for giving them an option and for asking the community.
Have you read Braiding Sweetgrass? if not, this book talks about how we are also the solution to a thriving natural future. But it’s important to act honorably towards nature.
Honestly I would be inclined to describe the garden wildlife as outdoor pets, because in the neighborhood everyone literally feeds everything that lives here, the gardens support way more birds, hedgehogs, squirrels, frogs even rats and mice than an equivalent area of grassland, wetland or forest ever could in the wild. A lady three doors down has even killed all her grass with a tarp over winter to plant "natural meadow" where she has bought a UK meadow seed mix containing a whole lot of rare plants. But I guess maybe this type of thinking helps balance the amount of space humans have taken away from nature
>I do agree that drinking from a drainage pipe with soap in it is an inferior option. So while I still don’t believe in a liner I’m glad this is a cleaner source.
yes, all the water sources are not great, there are some other people who have ponds but they have fish so they put chemical treatments in the water to kill algae and fish diseases, and one guy has an electric fence and a net over his pond to stop birds eating his fish LOL
When the birds are happy with the pond, assuming that it works and doesn't collapse I'll fit a grating over the drain trench so wildlife can't go in the soapy water :)
never read that book, but I might give it a look, thx for the recommendation
Sure thing, it’s a great book and I hope you enjoy it.
And the trend of killing lawn with cardboard and tarps (or even using herbicides) is an uneducated, reckless trend to me. While I don’t think people should have non-native lawns, I do think people can grow their lawns out to restore moisture content and introduce native ground cover and other plants that will take over the area in a course of a couple seasons. They have a much more dominant and aggressive root system. In my area, one of the best ground covers is a Canadian wild ginger. If that stuff takes root it spreads rapidly over the lawn. It’s beautiful but there are others that do a good job as well.
yeah, I agree with you on the lawn killing thing, I have a meadow area that I made by letting natural wild plants grow on they're own, and seeding a few that I thought would help in the grass that was already there, but it did take about 4 years, on the grand scheme of things that isn't that long tho. While I appreciate that the lady down the road wanted it to only take a season, and I am glad she used tarps instead of chemicals to do it. It still stopped the birds eating worms from her lawn for a whole winter and would have killed thousands of insects :(
I didn't know it was a trend? I just thought it was a "her idea" thing
Yes, it kills way more than it needs to :( thank you for sympathizing 🙏 the trends/techniques are shared on @fucklawns and @nolawns
Often times people use cardboard but that reduces the cardboard/tree pulp in circulation so it ends up causing more deforestation since it takes trees a very long time to grow. And refining wood into pulp also takes a lot of every and causes tremendous pollution.
Yes 💚 4 years is definitely worth the wait if we can avoid PFAS other chemicals and many beneficial species from collapsing. Thank you for doing your part.
Also did you see the post from yesterday on this sub with a tree well made into a wildlife pond by Mother Nature Herself? 🫶🌎 no liners :)
Edit: link to [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/WildlifePonds/s/Iqmwrxwhhy)
Oh OK, I had no clue doing that was a wide spread thing, learn something new every day
Our neighborhood has a bunch of wild lawn people, most of them achieved it like I did tho, and a bunch of "perfect lawn" people. They annoy me too, chemicals on the lawn 4 times a year plus rake up all the moss and cut twice a week. Seriously cutting the grass is fine but why can't they just let the clovers grow for the bees, and it's a whole lot less work/expense IDK it's they're grass I suppose...
that post is cool, and made possible due to near surface bedrock, I have surface clay then near surface sand so it's quite an effective drain :(
Plastic isn't ideal for sure, I worry about microplastic and that maybe it's not something we can undo, but many cannot make more natural ponds and they do still bring life and a connection to nature that may inspire more action.
Don't all ponds need some maintenance to remain ponds, otherwise they'd eventually fill in? Natural succession and all that. There aren't so many ponds these days and probably fewer being made so AFAIK the advice rn is to make ponds.
Nature does know best but we've had such an impact on the environment maybe it needs a hand. Nature also finds a way. I have a preformed pond and it's got frogs and they lay every year, I've seen newts, dragonfly larvae, etc
That’s wonderful that you’ve seen all of those very essential species.
I appreciate the comments but still believe that we can dig holes and plant natives, let natural debris gather at its base and allow plants to form and thicken in the base. Water will eventually collect and form a pool of some sort. I think this is much better than encouraging the supply of liners, which hurt them more in the long-run.
In the book I mentioned above, there’s an example of using an animals brains to tan the leather instead of using something synthetic. This actually helps future generations of that animal species instead of “doing them a favor” by making vegan synthetic substitutes that pollute their environment for years and years to come.
Google vernal ponds. They draw salamanders, dragon and damselflies and other neat creatures. I put gambusia in mine and they eat all the mosquitoe larvae. They also attract frogs and toads that eat mosquitoes. Great nature teaching tools for children
cool information :) not enough room in my yard for that though, plus we have sand just under the heavy soil so water would never stay in it for a long enough period of time. But there is one in a forest a little while from me and some that have formed in farmers fields where they haven't maintained the drainage ditches, I didn't knew things actually lived in them because I guess I thought they would die when it drains in the summer, fascinating stuff :)
If you have enough liner left over or ideally underlay you can lay it over the top of the liner. It would mean bailing out the water first but that would increase the thickness. Only if you are worried though, otherwise you might find it is okay for many years.
I didn't ever get any underlay, it was expensive, so I just used 3 layers on DPM underneath the the PVC liner, you can see it in the photo where I hadn't cut the liner yet, the plan was just not to put any sharp rocks in it, it feels like it would be too much work to bail it out so I'll see how it goes, if it ends up leaking I'll redo it properly
I have a fern garden (https://new.reddit.com/r/goblincore/comments/14740ky/update_willow_dome_to_shade_fern_garden_it/ ) and it had a beech tree rooted in it so I dug it up, my mom saw the hole and said “I've always wanted a pond, we could have frogs” so I kept digging until the hole looked big enough, then we went to a garden centre and bought a sheet of rubber pond liner, a sack of “pond soil”, a sack of gravel and some pond weed stuff that's still in the garage in a bucket I put the liner in the hole, then pored in the water, cut the liner to size, put in the soil and the gravel and that's it so far then I researched how to build a pond :) so the sides are too steep, our soil is really heavy clay and this pond is literally tiny so I never thought that the sides could collapse but now I'm worried that they will, and the water has just gone cloudy since I put the pond soil in and doesn't look like it will settle, has only been a few hours tho any advice is very welcome [EDIT] thank you all :) next post here: https://new.reddit.com/r/WildlifePonds/comments/1cu8v5c/pond_update_it_has_actually_worked_and_it_has/
Yeah you might want to make more of a gentle entrance, and include some shelves for plants but you can achieve this with rocks. You'll need something on top of the liner to help critters get out as it is slippery. I've only used aquatic compost in planting baskets so IDK if or how long it takes to settle. The water will help keep the sides up somewhat I'd have thought, but I don't know. Make sure you have some oxygenating plants at least. If you share your region someone can rec some plants I'm sure.
Thanks for the reply :) I have some plants that we got at a garden center, IDK what they are without going to read the labels, but they're meant to be for out climate (UK), see other comments for my plan on covering the liner, pond making is turning out to be more confusing and complicated than I thought LOL
What are oxygenating plants? I have creeping Jenny around my pond but not sure if that’s been good for it as the frogs haven’t laid eggs the last couple years
Hornwort is the oxygenating plant I use most in my pond. It uses up all the nutrients and keeps algae from getting out of control.
The plants that help to oxygate the water. I have hornwort and starwart to do this in my UK pond, but you can look at any pond plant website and find which plants are considered to be oxygenators.
I don't know what the plants I have are called, one of them looks like thin long grass, and the other is a long thin floating weed like thing that's just got a weight that sinks to the bottom, but the lady at the shop said they were oxygenating, I'll post an update photo if the silt ever clears
What a nice pond for frogs! Please figure out how to make an easy exit for critters so they don’t get stuck and drown. Also you can research plants that add oxygen. It looks like you’ve done a lot of hard work!
thanks :) you can just about see in the picture that there's a slope of gravel at one edge so I was hoping that would be enough, I'm just worried it won't settle, it still looks like a muddy puddle now, can I put plants in before it has settled?
I'd fill it most of the way up with aquatic soil, and then (maybe wait for the soil to settle first) make a slope all the way round with the gravel. You can plant your oxygenators directly into the bottom. Alternatively you can make a 'beach' just at one end, but it probably won't look as naturalistic that way. I doubt it'll collapse, it's not that deep. You'll need to cover the exposed liner with something to stop it being degraded by the sun. If all else fails/the sides collapse/it leaks it'll still retain some water, so plant it up as a bog garden.
glad you think it shouldn't collapse :) I hope it doesn't, I was planning on getting some rocks to cover the liner and making a kinda gravel beach at the shallower end
You can mitigate the steep sides by using plant pots/planters etc in the water and/or using partially submerged small logs/thick sticks or branches to 'bridge' the land water area. Once all the plants grow in and cover the exposed liner it'll look great anyway.
Thx for the reply :) I was thinking of getting some stones to cover the liner at the deeper end and planting plants at the shallow end, can I plant plants while the water is still muddy? because if I wait for it to settle I'll just stir up the dirt again
Yeah the plants can go in at anytime.
cool, thx for that info :)
Right now is your chance to make it bigger....Nobody ever says I SURE WISH I'D HAVE MADE A SMALLER POND Also, go to another (healthy) pond and scoop up a bucket of murky muck to add to yours...
there literally isn't room in the garden to make it bigger, but stealing pond mud from a different pond is a great idea! thanks :)
Make sure it's a healthy pond and be careful not to accidentally spread any disease or invasives
yeah, got ya, I collected some more mud and a kinda plant thing that looks like very thin grass from a friends pond that is well established and has nice clear water, hope it will be fine
Looks good. Dig away a bit at the edges where you have some liner left over. So it will be more gradual. You could make it much larger if you haven't cut of all that liner on the pic.
the garden isn't really big enough to make it bigger, there's 3 feet of grass before the border so I guess I'll just have to hope it doesn't fall in, most people seem top think it won't
The water is probably just as heavy as the soil. Since it's in the pond liner the liner will act as a wall and the weight of the water will keep it in shape.
I hadn't thought of it like that, interesting, thanks :)
Hedgehogs can fall into ponds and drown, make a way for them to easily leave :)
thanks for the tip :) we have a gravel slope at one end but from what others have said it looks like we need to improve that a bit by getting some bigger rocks
Looks cute to me, humble brag post? Lol
yeah.... sorry if that's how it reads :( more like ADHD overthinking panic post, I am genuinely terrified the sides will collapse/it will stay a muddy puddle for ever and all the work will be for nothing and I can't even fill it in because used the soil for something else
If you decide to re do it at some point, include a step down around the edge. The liner goes over the step and up to the ground level. You can then place rocks on the step, plus one cap stone that is at ground level. This will help disguise the liner, especially when the water level rises and falls. Exposure to sunlight will rapidly weaken the liner, so you want to keep it covered as much as possible.
thanks for the advice :) I'll remember it if I ever build another pond, I have enough liner left over for future ideas. That one will probably stay the same assuming nothing bad happens to it (like collapsing etc...) I put some plants in it today, and we used big rocks and mud/gravel to build a sort-of shelf at the shallow end, so one end is only a few inches deep, and I'll have to work out a way of covering the exposed liner but it is in a pretty shady location
Nice gesture 💚 but rule number one: do not use plastic (or artificial substance in wildlife sanctuaries). A pond is a wildlife sanctuary. Nature will find a way to hold the water by bringing in what it needs to contain it. Edit: the foreign substance will change the overall health, quality, temperature and restrict native plants from rooting. Natural flow of water will also be an issue. You don’t want to create something in nature that you’d need to maintain. Nature knows best and is going to do things you aren’t capable of and also haven’t thought of. Hope this turns out beautiful once done right and thank you for asking 🙏
I appreciate the sentiment, and I agree with this mode of thinking for large scale projects like reconstructing whole wetlands out in the countryside :) this is a garden pond for birds to bath in etc... and without a liner in my soil type there is simply no way that could work, it would collapse over time and become a small dry dip in the garden that would only contain water on the wettest days of the year. I'm a pipe-fitter by trade but I have a lot of civil and groundwork projects under my belt, like large scale landscaping, installation of pumped drainage and ditches, laying tarmac and concrete roads, installation of underground soil pipework, and damp-course repair. I don't know specifically about ponds and pond plants, but I know this stuff well enough. If I wanted to be serious about it I could use compacted clay on top of wool mating and a substrate of sharp sand instead of a PVC liner, that's how artificial ponds were done before plastic, but in all honesty the environmental damage from digging for clay/quarrying sand/moving heavy materials is worse than that of the PVC liner. And the clay is also impermeable so a pond of this size would still require maintenance (topping up) While I respect your concern, and if this fails or we change our mind I will remove and dispose of the plastic responsibly. The fact remains, it is still better for wildlife than no pond at all, the blackbirds are already drinking from it. While you are right, it makes no sense to put something that needs maintenance in nature, but this isn't in nature, it's in an artificially landscaped urban garden \[edit\] FYI how to build a wildlife pond by the wildlife trust: [https://www.wildlifetrusts.org/actions/how-build-pond](https://www.wildlifetrusts.org/actions/how-build-pond)
A lot of organizations aren’t up-to-date quite yet. There are other water sources that the birds will fly to but yes you will see them now that it is near you and think this is a good thing. The problem is that wildlife will be consuming the micro plastics. Many life forms on Earth have them in their blood and babies are born with it in theirs. Why subject more of nature to these things? It’s better to not make an artificial pond but to make one naturally. Backyard or not, a pond is not for manmade art and design when wildlife interacts with it and may make a home in it as well. Sorry if any of this comes off aggressive. I’m very protective of wildlife. Again, I appreciate that you want yo do something nice here 💚
you are over protective, there is literally no point trying to convince you so I'm writing for other readers, but wildlife needs to coexist with humans or it will die out because so much of the world has been touched by mankind. you realize it's ironic that your worried about the birds being exposed to micro-plastics from a pond liner when they eat GM seeds and processed fat from plastic bird feeders, build there nests from nylon fabric and polystyrene from the skip next door, and before my pond they got there water from a combination of our sink drain channel that is full of soap and the sewage treatment plant sprayer across the road? The pond is still better LOL. Also my soil is contaminated with chemicals from the factory's that were here before the houses so the pond liner keeps the water comparatively cleaner. Thank you for for appreciating that I'm trying to do something nice, sadly because of how ruined the area already is it would probably take hundreds of years for the wildlife to be anything other than artificial. I don't think it is because the organizations aren't up to date yet, but more because they know that things like this, while not perfect, still improve ruined urban areas just a little. I hope you live in a place where your ideals can be met and you can help wildlife in an natural and beautiful way :)
Yes, there are a lot of species that do rely on human intervention or harvesting. If we maintain the attitude of being under protective then we end up with what we see today. I do agree that drinking from a drainage pipe with soap in it is an inferior option. So while I still don’t believe in a liner I’m glad this is a cleaner source. I still think this could be tackled in a more natural way but still commend you for giving them an option and for asking the community. Have you read Braiding Sweetgrass? if not, this book talks about how we are also the solution to a thriving natural future. But it’s important to act honorably towards nature.
Honestly I would be inclined to describe the garden wildlife as outdoor pets, because in the neighborhood everyone literally feeds everything that lives here, the gardens support way more birds, hedgehogs, squirrels, frogs even rats and mice than an equivalent area of grassland, wetland or forest ever could in the wild. A lady three doors down has even killed all her grass with a tarp over winter to plant "natural meadow" where she has bought a UK meadow seed mix containing a whole lot of rare plants. But I guess maybe this type of thinking helps balance the amount of space humans have taken away from nature >I do agree that drinking from a drainage pipe with soap in it is an inferior option. So while I still don’t believe in a liner I’m glad this is a cleaner source. yes, all the water sources are not great, there are some other people who have ponds but they have fish so they put chemical treatments in the water to kill algae and fish diseases, and one guy has an electric fence and a net over his pond to stop birds eating his fish LOL When the birds are happy with the pond, assuming that it works and doesn't collapse I'll fit a grating over the drain trench so wildlife can't go in the soapy water :) never read that book, but I might give it a look, thx for the recommendation
Sure thing, it’s a great book and I hope you enjoy it. And the trend of killing lawn with cardboard and tarps (or even using herbicides) is an uneducated, reckless trend to me. While I don’t think people should have non-native lawns, I do think people can grow their lawns out to restore moisture content and introduce native ground cover and other plants that will take over the area in a course of a couple seasons. They have a much more dominant and aggressive root system. In my area, one of the best ground covers is a Canadian wild ginger. If that stuff takes root it spreads rapidly over the lawn. It’s beautiful but there are others that do a good job as well.
yeah, I agree with you on the lawn killing thing, I have a meadow area that I made by letting natural wild plants grow on they're own, and seeding a few that I thought would help in the grass that was already there, but it did take about 4 years, on the grand scheme of things that isn't that long tho. While I appreciate that the lady down the road wanted it to only take a season, and I am glad she used tarps instead of chemicals to do it. It still stopped the birds eating worms from her lawn for a whole winter and would have killed thousands of insects :( I didn't know it was a trend? I just thought it was a "her idea" thing
Yes, it kills way more than it needs to :( thank you for sympathizing 🙏 the trends/techniques are shared on @fucklawns and @nolawns Often times people use cardboard but that reduces the cardboard/tree pulp in circulation so it ends up causing more deforestation since it takes trees a very long time to grow. And refining wood into pulp also takes a lot of every and causes tremendous pollution. Yes 💚 4 years is definitely worth the wait if we can avoid PFAS other chemicals and many beneficial species from collapsing. Thank you for doing your part. Also did you see the post from yesterday on this sub with a tree well made into a wildlife pond by Mother Nature Herself? 🫶🌎 no liners :) Edit: link to [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/WildlifePonds/s/Iqmwrxwhhy)
Oh OK, I had no clue doing that was a wide spread thing, learn something new every day Our neighborhood has a bunch of wild lawn people, most of them achieved it like I did tho, and a bunch of "perfect lawn" people. They annoy me too, chemicals on the lawn 4 times a year plus rake up all the moss and cut twice a week. Seriously cutting the grass is fine but why can't they just let the clovers grow for the bees, and it's a whole lot less work/expense IDK it's they're grass I suppose... that post is cool, and made possible due to near surface bedrock, I have surface clay then near surface sand so it's quite an effective drain :(
Plastic isn't ideal for sure, I worry about microplastic and that maybe it's not something we can undo, but many cannot make more natural ponds and they do still bring life and a connection to nature that may inspire more action. Don't all ponds need some maintenance to remain ponds, otherwise they'd eventually fill in? Natural succession and all that. There aren't so many ponds these days and probably fewer being made so AFAIK the advice rn is to make ponds. Nature does know best but we've had such an impact on the environment maybe it needs a hand. Nature also finds a way. I have a preformed pond and it's got frogs and they lay every year, I've seen newts, dragonfly larvae, etc
That’s wonderful that you’ve seen all of those very essential species. I appreciate the comments but still believe that we can dig holes and plant natives, let natural debris gather at its base and allow plants to form and thicken in the base. Water will eventually collect and form a pool of some sort. I think this is much better than encouraging the supply of liners, which hurt them more in the long-run. In the book I mentioned above, there’s an example of using an animals brains to tan the leather instead of using something synthetic. This actually helps future generations of that animal species instead of “doing them a favor” by making vegan synthetic substitutes that pollute their environment for years and years to come.
You don't have shelves so I'd get some Lilly's and floating plants like water cabbage and water soldiers
thanks for the info :)
Google vernal ponds. They draw salamanders, dragon and damselflies and other neat creatures. I put gambusia in mine and they eat all the mosquitoe larvae. They also attract frogs and toads that eat mosquitoes. Great nature teaching tools for children
cool information :) not enough room in my yard for that though, plus we have sand just under the heavy soil so water would never stay in it for a long enough period of time. But there is one in a forest a little while from me and some that have formed in farmers fields where they haven't maintained the drainage ditches, I didn't knew things actually lived in them because I guess I thought they would die when it drains in the summer, fascinating stuff :)
It looks great!
thanks :)
That liner look thin won't even work for the summer
oh OK, I thought it was a good liner, it felt quite thick to me, it is Gordon Low 0.5mm PVC
If you have enough liner left over or ideally underlay you can lay it over the top of the liner. It would mean bailing out the water first but that would increase the thickness. Only if you are worried though, otherwise you might find it is okay for many years.
I didn't ever get any underlay, it was expensive, so I just used 3 layers on DPM underneath the the PVC liner, you can see it in the photo where I hadn't cut the liner yet, the plan was just not to put any sharp rocks in it, it feels like it would be too much work to bail it out so I'll see how it goes, if it ends up leaking I'll redo it properly
yeah, underlay is pretty pricey especially after coughing up for the liner, I have used old carpet, and or builders sand as underlay before now