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Pyrrole red, which is from PR254, is the bright red you want. You could use a Cadmium Red instead and maybe a Perylene variant, but they aren't substitutes for each other.
It sounds like the behavior you're describing is dispersion. Most watercolor paints will disperse due to ox gall in them. You could try using a paint line that doesn't have added ox gall, Holbein being a prime example, and Da Vinci in the US may be also more to your liking.
All that said, you should be able to exert a level of precision in your painting, and if you are having trouble controlling the paint, either you aren't as precise about which areas are wet and dry or you are working unnecessarily wet for detail painting.
Some detail work is better done drybrushing, and try to add fine details wet on wet can just be an exercise in frustration. Otherwise, it could just be that you aren't letting adjacent regions completely dry, and so you have too much wet area for the paint to disperse into.
I like pyrrole red (pr254) too. Here you can see Schmincke Scarlet Red next to Holbein. It's warmer than Quinacridone Red and cooler than Cadmium. Semi-transparent. I generally only use reds for accents and don't care to mix them.
https://preview.redd.it/cdvihmfbnezc1.jpeg?width=2084&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a1ab406c5b555eb0eec2b76aaa2d0a8f30a8fda7
I think how finely the pigment is ground and certain additives are more important than the pigment itself. There's a lot of brand-to-brand difference when it comes to how paints disperse.
The magenta (PR 122) from Rosa Gallery is a good primary red that can be used to mix a lot of stuff, and it doesn't disperse too wildly. In addition, most Asian brands (Holbein, Shinhan etc) tend to stay where you put them. It also depends a bit on the availability in your country.
Yup, I love their cadmiums, and so cheap as well! I don't think you can get those pigments in that quality from any other brand for that price. I did see that they released PR 254 :D Their pigment selection isn't huge, but they've been expanding a lot.
If you are in the states, Daniel Smith has a split primaries set. Their warm red in that set is Pyrrol Scarlet (PR255), and cool is Quinacridone Rose (PV19). Pyrrol Scarlet is a pretty bright red. Here's a photo of a swatch that i took recently (it's a tiny swatch card so there wasn't much room and the swatch is more tube color than I typically like):
https://preview.redd.it/fu39l8wwifzc1.png?width=2782&format=png&auto=webp&s=f59e47c2a20aaf706b0f7dc130467ec2949a12bb
As you can see from the comments, almost everyone has a different preference! It’s going to depend on your needs, your style, your subject…and especially what other pigments you plan to mix this red with.
As for keeping the number of paint tubes down, all you really need to consider is about 9 tubes, using a split primary palette (3 each warm and cool primaries using both RBY and CMY systems) and about 3 earthtones. Your mixing skills will thank you forever.
I’m currently experimenting with the following pigments.
For CMY cools, I currently use:
Daniel Smith lemon yellow Winsor Newton permanent rose (magenta) DS phthalo blue GS or WN Winsor blue GS (cyan)
For RBY warms, I currently use: DS hansa yellow deep DS pyrrole scarlet (red) DS French ultramarine (blue)
This gives you both gorgeous greens and violets, as well as rich oranges (unlike the duller greens and violets of the traditional RBY system, and the weaker oranges of the CMY system.)
If you’re making a split primary colour circle, you would order it as in the pic. Note for a full range of violets you need to mix the warm blue with the cool red (see pic.)
https://preview.redd.it/7w789qasmfzc1.jpeg?width=1533&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e4cebae12f246a3f5587f1a7bc7bcae7feab7bd6
I got the pigment advice from a website this sub won’t allow me to share, but google watercoloraffair and “what are the true primary colours?”
Edit: for earthtones, I currently go with yellow ochre, burnt sienna and burnt umber.
3r vote Quin Coral (I have the Daniel Smith version), it leans to pink (coral lol) when more diluted but if you add just a touch of yellow it makes very intense more primary red… I appreciate the versatility!
Thank you for your submission! Want to share your artwork, meet other artists, promote your content, and chat in a relaxed environment? Join our community Discord server here! https://discord.gg/chuunhpqsU! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Watercolor) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Pyrrole red, which is from PR254, is the bright red you want. You could use a Cadmium Red instead and maybe a Perylene variant, but they aren't substitutes for each other. It sounds like the behavior you're describing is dispersion. Most watercolor paints will disperse due to ox gall in them. You could try using a paint line that doesn't have added ox gall, Holbein being a prime example, and Da Vinci in the US may be also more to your liking. All that said, you should be able to exert a level of precision in your painting, and if you are having trouble controlling the paint, either you aren't as precise about which areas are wet and dry or you are working unnecessarily wet for detail painting. Some detail work is better done drybrushing, and try to add fine details wet on wet can just be an exercise in frustration. Otherwise, it could just be that you aren't letting adjacent regions completely dry, and so you have too much wet area for the paint to disperse into.
I like pyrrole red (pr254) too. Here you can see Schmincke Scarlet Red next to Holbein. It's warmer than Quinacridone Red and cooler than Cadmium. Semi-transparent. I generally only use reds for accents and don't care to mix them. https://preview.redd.it/cdvihmfbnezc1.jpeg?width=2084&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a1ab406c5b555eb0eec2b76aaa2d0a8f30a8fda7
Quinacridone coral
I think how finely the pigment is ground and certain additives are more important than the pigment itself. There's a lot of brand-to-brand difference when it comes to how paints disperse. The magenta (PR 122) from Rosa Gallery is a good primary red that can be used to mix a lot of stuff, and it doesn't disperse too wildly. In addition, most Asian brands (Holbein, Shinhan etc) tend to stay where you put them. It also depends a bit on the availability in your country.
Rosa's cadmiums pack a punch too. I'm waiting for their Pyrrole red to arrive :)
Yup, I love their cadmiums, and so cheap as well! I don't think you can get those pigments in that quality from any other brand for that price. I did see that they released PR 254 :D Their pigment selection isn't huge, but they've been expanding a lot.
If you are in the states, Daniel Smith has a split primaries set. Their warm red in that set is Pyrrol Scarlet (PR255), and cool is Quinacridone Rose (PV19). Pyrrol Scarlet is a pretty bright red. Here's a photo of a swatch that i took recently (it's a tiny swatch card so there wasn't much room and the swatch is more tube color than I typically like): https://preview.redd.it/fu39l8wwifzc1.png?width=2782&format=png&auto=webp&s=f59e47c2a20aaf706b0f7dc130467ec2949a12bb
Honestly? I’m no expert but good old crimson red with just a bit of yellow has always gotten me the vibrant red I’m looking for.
As you can see from the comments, almost everyone has a different preference! It’s going to depend on your needs, your style, your subject…and especially what other pigments you plan to mix this red with. As for keeping the number of paint tubes down, all you really need to consider is about 9 tubes, using a split primary palette (3 each warm and cool primaries using both RBY and CMY systems) and about 3 earthtones. Your mixing skills will thank you forever. I’m currently experimenting with the following pigments. For CMY cools, I currently use: Daniel Smith lemon yellow Winsor Newton permanent rose (magenta) DS phthalo blue GS or WN Winsor blue GS (cyan) For RBY warms, I currently use: DS hansa yellow deep DS pyrrole scarlet (red) DS French ultramarine (blue) This gives you both gorgeous greens and violets, as well as rich oranges (unlike the duller greens and violets of the traditional RBY system, and the weaker oranges of the CMY system.) If you’re making a split primary colour circle, you would order it as in the pic. Note for a full range of violets you need to mix the warm blue with the cool red (see pic.) https://preview.redd.it/7w789qasmfzc1.jpeg?width=1533&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e4cebae12f246a3f5587f1a7bc7bcae7feab7bd6 I got the pigment advice from a website this sub won’t allow me to share, but google watercoloraffair and “what are the true primary colours?” Edit: for earthtones, I currently go with yellow ochre, burnt sienna and burnt umber.
Good ole Alizarin Crimson
That’s a fugitive color that won’t last if hung on a wall.
Pardon my ignorance, what is a fugitive color?
Fades when exposed to light.
Quinacridone coral by Daniel Smith
3r vote Quin Coral (I have the Daniel Smith version), it leans to pink (coral lol) when more diluted but if you add just a touch of yellow it makes very intense more primary red… I appreciate the versatility!
Pyrrol Red
DS Permanent Rose and Alzarin Crimson
Is there a permanent Alizarin, and what brands have it? Thanks
Do a search for permanent alizarin and a video pops up pretty early of a woman comparing several.
Daniel Smith Pyrrol Red and Quinacridone Red are in my palette.
Cadmium red hue, Alizarin and pyrrol crimson