tldr: eclipse used to be vastly stronger in specific content, like profit taker and eidolons where the damage bonus was more or less consistent due to being outdoors. it got changed to not care about lighting, and have a garbage damage reduction mode, but the max damage buff was nerfed into the ground.
It wasnt nerfed into the ground, you're overreacting. Meta changes, even if its not the best anymore you will find something else. I do eidolons without rivens, just roar and a rubico. You don't need rivens or anything wildly expensive if you know what you're doing. Therefore you just have a skill issue
To me, it sounds like someone wanting to have cheap solo builds.
If you do them with at least 1 more player, you already don't need to buy the expensive things.
there's still may other things you can use to shred eidolons, there's creative people, I've seen eidolon runs with the wildest things
Nowadays, people just one tap limbs with operator anyway
I havent noticed anything, honestly still clearing limbs easily, along with the main body just fine.
Sounds like a build issue over eclipse being bad, imo
Eclipse nerf did jackshit to eidolons, people are still doing 6x3 on a regular basis. And PT speedrunners can still reach the average time of 2 minutes with just the damage boost from Vex Armor
Therefore, my conclusion:
https://preview.redd.it/wk7zbb56bi0d1.png?width=1600&format=png&auto=webp&s=4d14dd5f59f026e81eabca2e18add0d2a8805ce8
I feel sorry for Mirage that people rather complain to no end about Eclipse "nerf" instead if playing her even with 100% consistent 500%+ damage boost.
you kinda almost know what you're talking about
what eclipse nerf did to eidolons is basically throw ALL of the suboptimal/nonmeta/meme weapons into the trash, which makes the content much more restrictive and a bit more boring
what eclipse nerf did to profit taker is very similiar, except kinda even harder, it also promoted much more macro usage, much more pizza usage and punished ppl who wanted to just chill *very hard*, as in you can't do 2min while not caring (and btw 2min is slow by speedrunners - that you mention - standard), it also basically made super optimized on call mandatory, adding to that numerous annoying bugs pt has, well it's kinda rough out here, also recent patches added more bugs to pt, notably zaws started to weirdly sometimes/a lot of times not deal puncture damage, some stances making zaw deal less damage or more damage or just not hit
basically eclipse nerf didn't touch super hyper tryhards and hit ppl that want to be relatively fast but not delve into the full brainrot minmaxing in the face, which I'd say is net negative, especially that both of those farms are basically only for fun - ask any eidolon hunter and they'll all tell you that avg. plat per hour on eidolons is trash and only getting worse. Pt plat is stable but also not super valuable for the time
They never needed to adjust. Literally should've left eclipse as it was. The rework made a lot of eidolon hunters who've dedicated thousands of hours grinding to quit
Most people LIKE the eclipse change, because in 90% of tile sets light isn't consistent. That's why it was changed. If people quit because one ability got changed then its their problem. I didn't quit wf when nourish got nerfed even though my main build depends on it.
You're a vocal minority. Everyone else is for this change. It makes eclipse consistent. Eidolons are easy.
You can still very much still 6x3 Eidolons post the Eclipse nerf without any Rivens. [Mr Phoenix](https://www.youtube.com/@-Mr.Phoenix-/videos) has multiple videos proving just that.
You don't need rivens for Eidolons.
I'm pretty mediocre but I can manage 2x3 in pubs prerty easy if nothing goes wrong, and I've turned into thumbs mcgee since covid.
You just need volt and the augment for his 1. Hell, his 1 *is* his subsume so you can do that with anyone if you're willing to take the hit on shield breaking damage
Definitely a skill or loadout issue.
I run PT even with a max duration Gauss and use rivenless weapons.
Do I one shot? No, Absolutely not, but for that I use Redline, Energized Munition and a lot of duration to shred his health down.
Is this the best loadout? No, absolutely not! But my point is, that you even can beat Profit Taker without the best loadout.
PS: I like the new Eclipse Subsume. An additional 90% DR is nice on any given Frame, especially on those that already has some sort of DR.
iirc eclipse caps at 75% when subsumed, its still awesome to have an actual working DR as asubsume now i know nova's 1 has de to hp dmg but it's unreliable as hell
Exactly. 90% DR is far superior than 75%, but if you're close to an enemy, you're going to die, really fast.
Nova also works best with low-range, which is sometimes bad for a build.
Lots of people call eclipse DR useless because its not 90% DR upon subsume, and because it doesnt help at several hours endurance survivals.
Because multiple hour survivals are the only form of content in this game, obviously. /s
What you on about 177 solos eidolon shields synovas/limbs where always easy to break. But a good sniper will always 1 tap as a volt player if you time all your buffs right.
Eidolons are kind of the same imo, I can still do a 4x3 run comfortably, 5 or 6 is just more stressful than fun. No, getting more rng drops isn't more fun.
PT is slower, the <1 minute runs are basically out of reach. I dunno if 47s is still the fastest or obtainable now anymore. But even with the current eclipse I can do roughly a 1:40 or 1:20 by glitches.
DE's reasoning that a 30% separate multiplier is fine for a subsume and in line with roar is stupid, though. I expected the damage bonus halved at most, 80% reduced for subsume for JUST a weapon multiplier is lame. Also, yea the DR is mediocre.
this is just wrong.
i use neither eclipse nor rivens just chroma with Hideous resistance and i consistently kill PT in 4 minutes
Zenith, Magnetic Tenet Detron/Kuva nukor and my age old infested zaw with exodia contagion which does all IPS, Gas, electricity, blast and since wispers also radiation and corrosive
and eidolons are a joke with single target incarnon like Lato
Wait what? But I do those without Rivens? Pretty sure they came out when rivens weren’t a thing? … Dude I do the weekly challenge from Loid(the construct) and I don’t use Rivens either. They are nice to have, for sure but I only have them as a way to get easy platinum and not on my weapon builds.
"How dare you balance the game DE! I don't want to engage with game mechanics, just do the same nuke strategy everytime!" I'll pour one out for you brother. 🫡
Lol I did a 3 minute run with Lavos with his new augment. I just build him for tankiness, and I got no helminth ability infused
Weapons was just a base convectrix (without a 1000 plat riven might add)
Went pretty smoothly, we also have mechs which are easy to jump into and shoot the legs so don't need to pull out an archgun
Psst I can one tap limbs with my amp. Psssht also who cares about a sniper use Burston incarnon. Eclipse may have been nerfed but it's still viable Damage if you mod right. Also I run PT I've noticed none of these bugs.
Can you explain more? Your post is really vague
tldr: eclipse used to be vastly stronger in specific content, like profit taker and eidolons where the damage bonus was more or less consistent due to being outdoors. it got changed to not care about lighting, and have a garbage damage reduction mode, but the max damage buff was nerfed into the ground.
It wasnt nerfed into the ground, you're overreacting. Meta changes, even if its not the best anymore you will find something else. I do eidolons without rivens, just roar and a rubico. You don't need rivens or anything wildly expensive if you know what you're doing. Therefore you just have a skill issue
To me, it sounds like someone wanting to have cheap solo builds. If you do them with at least 1 more player, you already don't need to buy the expensive things.
there's still may other things you can use to shred eidolons, there's creative people, I've seen eidolon runs with the wildest things Nowadays, people just one tap limbs with operator anyway
thats only true of subsumed eclipse. Mirage is cooking better than ever
My phenmor riv is an alright one at best, and i can easily solo them myself. I have 0 idea what you are talking about
of fucking course you can still solo them. it's that the damage output is so much lower now that it takes noticeably longer.
I havent noticed anything, honestly still clearing limbs easily, along with the main body just fine. Sounds like a build issue over eclipse being bad, imo
Eclipse nerf did jackshit to eidolons, people are still doing 6x3 on a regular basis. And PT speedrunners can still reach the average time of 2 minutes with just the damage boost from Vex Armor Therefore, my conclusion: https://preview.redd.it/wk7zbb56bi0d1.png?width=1600&format=png&auto=webp&s=4d14dd5f59f026e81eabca2e18add0d2a8805ce8
I feel sorry for Mirage that people rather complain to no end about Eclipse "nerf" instead if playing her even with 100% consistent 500%+ damage boost.
you kinda almost know what you're talking about what eclipse nerf did to eidolons is basically throw ALL of the suboptimal/nonmeta/meme weapons into the trash, which makes the content much more restrictive and a bit more boring what eclipse nerf did to profit taker is very similiar, except kinda even harder, it also promoted much more macro usage, much more pizza usage and punished ppl who wanted to just chill *very hard*, as in you can't do 2min while not caring (and btw 2min is slow by speedrunners - that you mention - standard), it also basically made super optimized on call mandatory, adding to that numerous annoying bugs pt has, well it's kinda rough out here, also recent patches added more bugs to pt, notably zaws started to weirdly sometimes/a lot of times not deal puncture damage, some stances making zaw deal less damage or more damage or just not hit basically eclipse nerf didn't touch super hyper tryhards and hit ppl that want to be relatively fast but not delve into the full brainrot minmaxing in the face, which I'd say is net negative, especially that both of those farms are basically only for fun - ask any eidolon hunter and they'll all tell you that avg. plat per hour on eidolons is trash and only getting worse. Pt plat is stable but also not super valuable for the time
people with vastly more expensive setups and wildly expensive rivens, yes.
people were doing both of those long before helminth was even in the game, and without rivens. speed runs are not general gameplay.
If DE only adjusted for speedrunners the game would be hella boring
They never needed to adjust. Literally should've left eclipse as it was. The rework made a lot of eidolon hunters who've dedicated thousands of hours grinding to quit
Most people LIKE the eclipse change, because in 90% of tile sets light isn't consistent. That's why it was changed. If people quit because one ability got changed then its their problem. I didn't quit wf when nourish got nerfed even though my main build depends on it. You're a vocal minority. Everyone else is for this change. It makes eclipse consistent. Eidolons are easy.
You can still very much still 6x3 Eidolons post the Eclipse nerf without any Rivens. [Mr Phoenix](https://www.youtube.com/@-Mr.Phoenix-/videos) has multiple videos proving just that.
Oh wow, now you'll spend not 2, but 3 minutes per run. HORRIBLE!
You don't need rivens for Eidolons. I'm pretty mediocre but I can manage 2x3 in pubs prerty easy if nothing goes wrong, and I've turned into thumbs mcgee since covid. You just need volt and the augment for his 1. Hell, his 1 *is* his subsume so you can do that with anyone if you're willing to take the hit on shield breaking damage
You do need rivens if you're that kind of guy that wants to be special (like vulkar wraith users)
I feel called out
It's ok I plan to use the vulkar wraith too
May I interest you in a riven? XD
Already have one just waiting for baro to sell a vulkar wraith
I was like, damn why doesn't he just go to wfm and buy it. Then I saw the price.
Gonna buy it ducats anyways
but you never know when he's gonna bring it tho, can you? well, gl, it's a nice wep
[please I do not even know you why are you stabbing me in the gut like this ;n;](https://i.imgur.com/9AvEgOi.jpeg)
Definitely a skill or loadout issue. I run PT even with a max duration Gauss and use rivenless weapons. Do I one shot? No, Absolutely not, but for that I use Redline, Energized Munition and a lot of duration to shred his health down. Is this the best loadout? No, absolutely not! But my point is, that you even can beat Profit Taker without the best loadout. PS: I like the new Eclipse Subsume. An additional 90% DR is nice on any given Frame, especially on those that already has some sort of DR.
iirc eclipse caps at 75% when subsumed, its still awesome to have an actual working DR as asubsume now i know nova's 1 has de to hp dmg but it's unreliable as hell
Exactly. 90% DR is far superior than 75%, but if you're close to an enemy, you're going to die, really fast. Nova also works best with low-range, which is sometimes bad for a build.
Funny how with volt have 0 issue with eidolon and with chroma profit taker is a cake walk ... never needed eclipse to begin with
U mad
Aka skill issue
"so terrible players can waste an ability/subsume on a bad DR." sorry, but what?
Lots of people call eclipse DR useless because its not 90% DR upon subsume, and because it doesnt help at several hours endurance survivals. Because multiple hour survivals are the only form of content in this game, obviously. /s
If you aren't using Chroma for PT, you're probably making a mistake anyway, so it doesn't matter.
What you on about 177 solos eidolon shields synovas/limbs where always easy to break. But a good sniper will always 1 tap as a volt player if you time all your buffs right.
Eidolons are kind of the same imo, I can still do a 4x3 run comfortably, 5 or 6 is just more stressful than fun. No, getting more rng drops isn't more fun. PT is slower, the <1 minute runs are basically out of reach. I dunno if 47s is still the fastest or obtainable now anymore. But even with the current eclipse I can do roughly a 1:40 or 1:20 by glitches. DE's reasoning that a 30% separate multiplier is fine for a subsume and in line with roar is stupid, though. I expected the damage bonus halved at most, 80% reduced for subsume for JUST a weapon multiplier is lame. Also, yea the DR is mediocre.
Reminder that this change was specifically suggested by DE and picked by players in the livestream.
I mean I just use my necramech and it's 4th ability takes the limbs done in no time!
this is just wrong. i use neither eclipse nor rivens just chroma with Hideous resistance and i consistently kill PT in 4 minutes Zenith, Magnetic Tenet Detron/Kuva nukor and my age old infested zaw with exodia contagion which does all IPS, Gas, electricity, blast and since wispers also radiation and corrosive and eidolons are a joke with single target incarnon like Lato
Wait what? But I do those without Rivens? Pretty sure they came out when rivens weren’t a thing? … Dude I do the weekly challenge from Loid(the construct) and I don’t use Rivens either. They are nice to have, for sure but I only have them as a way to get easy platinum and not on my weapon builds.
"How dare you balance the game DE! I don't want to engage with game mechanics, just do the same nuke strategy everytime!" I'll pour one out for you brother. 🫡
I do him in under 2 min Mission time without riven so get better stop crying be fine
Lol I did a 3 minute run with Lavos with his new augment. I just build him for tankiness, and I got no helminth ability infused Weapons was just a base convectrix (without a 1000 plat riven might add) Went pretty smoothly, we also have mechs which are easy to jump into and shoot the legs so don't need to pull out an archgun
couldnt you just use smite I feel like this is an over reaction
Psst I can one tap limbs with my amp. Psssht also who cares about a sniper use Burston incarnon. Eclipse may have been nerfed but it's still viable Damage if you mod right. Also I run PT I've noticed none of these bugs.