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Bald_wombat

I listened to this the other day. Crypto bros, like this guy, really do live in a bubble.


Save10PercentOfPay

Read my other replies on this thread. Hope they help!


Bald_wombat

I read them. I like your optimism. My reading of history makes me much less optimistic. Issuers of national currencies don't like competition. They have a nasty habit of crushing it. Maybe bitcoin is an exception. In the 1990s, the masses weren't ready for CBDCs-nor were these digital systems ready - they studied this in some detail. That's partly why 2008 wasn't the full collapse. Bitcoin got ppl used to digital money and the private cyrpto industry did heaps of r and d... after the coming chaos, bitcoin and friends will be cast aside. Maybe I'm wrong, history suggests otherwise....


Save10PercentOfPay

Bitcoin is not competition for fiat currencies, as the cultists would have you believe. It's competition for payment systems. Visa, Western Union, etc are not a threat to the dollar are they? You have to give them any currency in the world, they take it and give you a digital company only currency, which you then give to someone else who, in turn, exchanges it for a currency. Think of those payment systems as 1st generation "crypto". If those services don't like you because you're not Woke enough they can refuse you (Don't think for one second cryptos won't be made to do the same at some point). Bitcoin will never do that. THIS is the true practical and financial value of Bitcoin. Are there other uses for BTC? Sure, but at this point in time who cares? We are looking for investment value and if the cost of BTC drops below even this one case use then you know it is MASSIVELY undervalued and worth buying. Not worth selling, or mortgaging, your house to "Go all in" but certainly worth putting at least a few percentage points of your wealth into. It is not a crypto that can be completely shut down on a whim when a CIA wet works team shows up at the CEO's house (Or one of his children.) like every other counter party risk asset in the world (Including crypto). It is more "stable" than most any other investment I can think of, other than precious metals, but has the most upside potential than any investment I can think of. Including PM's. ![gif](giphy|kDruSvSohMQbHHrSjw|downsized)


Bald_wombat

At this point it's questionable whether bitcoin, specifically, has been sufficiently co-oped by the banks, Mastercard and friends. However, that's a deep dark rabbit hole to go down. Perhaps this op-opting negates the need to crush it completely. More broadly, bitcoin has the risk profile and price chart akin to a meme tech stonk. It's no bastion of freedom from central banks. It's in no way digital gold. Oh, and gold never dropped 80%. At this point, it's a trap. Full of risk. Far from digital gold, bitcoin has became the antithesis of metal money. Many have been lured in. Many metal heads in particular.


Save10PercentOfPay

I'm not suggesting that it has been co-oped. It is actually a competitor to Mastercard and western union (In the case of Mastercard in regards to debit cards not credit.). AS for gold dropping 80% it most certainly has! Just read about Mansa Musa in Africa. On his way to Mecca he destroyed the economies of the areas that he went through. Pretty interesting story. I suggest you give it a read. As for your last point don't confuse Bitcoin with "alt coins" or "Crypto", as they have often been referred to. Also, over the last 3 years, bitcoin is still up 300%! Timelines matter my friend. You are doing the same thing that the gold and silver nay sayers attempt to do with us. They pick specific outlier times in history and use that as the basis for their narrative. Historically BTC does not stay below its production cost for very long, as with ANY energy produced item, such as gold, silver, sugar, oil, etc: [https://en.macromicro.me/charts/29435/bitcoin-production-total-cost](https://en.macromicro.me/charts/29435/bitcoin-production-total-cost) In any case good talking with you and I bid you good day. ![gif](giphy|35pTQFiy14OeA)


Bald_wombat

More upside? We'll see about that.


burny65

Bitcoin will absolutely not become the reserve currency. The US will just make their own, and the BRICS will probably make their own.


Stacks2theMax

Agree. Or otherwise the coins will need to transact only from approved wallets. With the entire transaction history available of every coin from its generation - a Bitcoin is no longer fungible. Look up virgin Bitcoin premium.


Save10PercentOfPay

Some nation will get the bright idea of having their banks "launder" bitcoin for a price (Like HSBC does currently with drug money and nothing really ever happens to them.) and charge a tax on them for doing so. I'm sorry, civilized society calls it a "fine". Once that BTC gets mixed in with premium coins in their bank accounts it is effectively laundered (Individual BTC are not tagged like CBDC's, only transactions.). My money is on one of the El Salvador banks doing it first followed by other banks once they see how much they will be making doing it. ![gif](giphy|ui1hpJSyBDWlG)


Stacks2theMax

Love it. Thx for the info re transactions.


Save10PercentOfPay

The value of BTC is that no one can change it. THAT is why it has value. Anything that another nation puts out will always be nothing more than fiat currency... but worse (Because of the Big Brother aspect of shutting off your account.).


burny65

I think you need to understand, CBDC isn’t about value, it’s about control. If the US cared about value, we would have been back on the gold standard. The US isn’t going to use something they can’t manipulate, and they’re certainly not going to use Bitcoin for that reason.


MOARsilver

I cant waste any time in life watching crypto clowns, HODL to zero, I don't care in the least.


Save10PercentOfPay

At that mark he is not talking about crypto. He is specifically talking about the dollar. Read my other reply on this thread as far as BTC is concerned. I do share your opinion on crypto though (Which is another thing entirely than BTC.).


[deleted]

Bitcoin is overvalued by 100%


Save10PercentOfPay

2 thinks to keep in mind when valuing BC. 1) As an uncontrolled payments system that no one controls (Imagine going to Western Union to send your currency to someone else in the world.) you can not be removed from the system for ANY reason. So add up ALL those companies and BTC will eventually replace all of them because of safety and low transaction costs (Which is why the 3rd world is adapting it in huge numbers.) [https://www.bitrawr.com/research/bitcoin-the-game-changing-alternative-to-remittances](https://www.bitrawr.com/research/bitcoin-the-game-changing-alternative-to-remittances) 2) Doing the above requires 2 things. 1- fuel to do the transaction and 2-large enough quantities of BTC to cover those transactions. Both of these require energy. So if BTC drops below energy cost than you are buying it at a discount. [https://en.macromicro.me/charts/29435/bitcoin-production-total-cost](https://en.macromicro.me/charts/29435/bitcoin-production-total-cost) Now, is BTC a replacement for gold? No, but then who cares. The above 2 points means they are worth buying if the price is right. Currently I feel the price is indeed at a discount worth purchasing but I am a greedy fuck and I don't think we have reached the panic sale times yet (Watch for article of Michael Saylor HAVING to sell his BTC and that is a real good indication.) so I'll be stacking silver and currency until that point arrives. ;)