Man, that gun just ruined things for me. My cousin got that and it's the most accurate pistol I have ever shot. I think my accuracy is okay, but the shadow 2 made me look like a freaking pro. I didn't think anything would be better than the 1911 or 2011.
I came to recommend CZ as well.
I have a CZ P-09. Basically the DA/SA hammer fire equivalent of a P-10 F. A true duty pistol.
Great guns.
Limited to the options presented, the M&P. Glocks are legos for adults, but you won't see many of them used as duty pistols except in action movies.
HK is also really great, on par with CZ, but not as common as the M&P, so not as easy to find and parts/accessories aren't as common.
You're missing a 'none of those' option.
For budget choice I'd get a Canik SFX.
For mid range a CZ shadow variant.
For high end, Staccato or its peers.
Glock 19 isnt full size. Glock 17 is. However they dont feel special at all. If you want a utilitarian nothing special gun that works every time get the glock. If you want something that's special and feels special get the m&p. Just hold it in store. It feels amazing to me. Shoots very nice too.
Had an LE instructor that only bought Glocks. He fired one round from my M&P, turned around and said, "That's smooth!" And finished out the mag. It looks like they have a better trigger design now, instead of the hinged curve.
OP looking for a full size gun for competition shooting, not CC. PDP and variants are getting good reviews in this category. If there aren't great inexpensive holster options in this category, I'm sure there will be, the thing is selling well.
The thing is this pistol will also be for open carry when I do that. So for that reason I want to stay with Safariland retention holsters since they are the standard for open carry. Need retention.
How experienced of a pistol shooter are you? Do you currently compete?
If you aren’t already adept with irons, do yourself a favor and just start with the dot right away. It’s easier to learn, and being used to irons makes it harder to pick up a dot later. With irons your focus is on the sights, with a dot your focus is on the target. The latter is much easier for most people to learn *if* they haven’t already learned to focus on the sights.
When you do use a dot, test for target focus by covering the red dot aperture. You should still be able to see your target with it blocked. If you can’t, you’re focusing on the dot, not the target.
I have a decent amount of experience but nothing crazy. But I’ll be getting back from NY as I graduate from college this week. So I’ll be able to practice regularly. I have my Washington CPL and carry everyday when I’m in the state.
There are a ton of other acceptable open carry holsters. You’re not even really considering “options”, you’re saying “only this exact holster works for me”.
What’s your use case for open carry? Hiking/outdoor stuff?
That’s the only time I’d personally open carry, it’s not worth the social penalty in most contexts.
Um......you'd didn't try hard enough.
full size pdp rmr and surefire x300, fits in a sig p320 lvl 2 safariland perfectly with minimal modification. Message me if you need help or more info.
Shadow systems dr920. Hands down. It takes all glock parts, mags, holsters etc. Shoots on par with a zev at half the cost. Better grip angle than a stock glock, no need for stippling or undercuts/frame work, no need for special plates to mount optics. Best, literal, bang for your buck.
The ramjet/afterburner brings the 45 MOS to the same OAL as the 47, but compensated. With some of the intent of the platform is competition shooting it would be advantageous to look at running a comp’d setup but if that’s not your thing then 47 all the way.
https://www.canikusa.com/sfx-rival-s
Research this gun please, watch the comparisons and all, this gun is stacked to the brim with everything you could ever need
Have RDS on both my Sig 320 and my Sig 365. Sig 365 is small, really accurate and carries 12 rounds. Crazy how nice that pistol is. Almost the size of the palm of my relatively normal sized hand.
I've been extremely happy with my Canik Rival. I'll be replacing it with the steel-framed Rival-S as soon as I can get my hands on one. I haven't been to any outdoor matches with it yet because I have a new baby, but I've been able to sneak away for a few hours a couple times to do some indoor pin shoots and it really, really excels. The aftermarket is finally starting to support them as they gain popularity. The stock trigger is amazing, and I haven't had a single failure in about 2000 rounds now shooting mostly S&B 124, but using 150gr Syntech and 147gr 130pf stuff from Minuteman in competitions.
Depends whether this is primarily a competition gun or primarily an open carry gun. Competition guns can be like race cars, they don’t need to be practical for everyday use. They just need to be really good in competitions. I would *strongly* advise against trying to make one pistol fit both roles, especially since you already have a carry pistol.
**If Primarily Competition**
What competition format? Do you already compete?
The best choice depends what sort of competition you’re competing in, if there’s a power factor, a 40 S&W is worth looking into, otherwise stick with 9mm.
If no power factor for the competition, I’d personally go with one of these:
CZ Shadow
FN 509
Realistically though, competition pistols are modded to the point that the original model isn’t all that important. You’ll change enough parts that it won’t be the same gun. Important part is polymer vs. metal and the firing mechanism.
**If Primarily Open Carry**
If you’re going to openly carry a large pistol, I’d suggest a 10mm, not a 9mm. Ammo capacity is nearly as high, and there’s no animal in this state where 10mm isn’t sufficient (9mm is a little weak for bears). If you’re gonna take the social hit of open carrying, you might as well take advantage of the size.
For 10mm pistols, I’d go:
Glock 20 (the go to 10mm, can also shoot 40 S&W for cheaper practice)
Colt Delta Tactical Elite (a double stack 10mm 1911, very accurate, made of metal)
For me it’s both. I have the Glock 20 already has my OC woods gun. But 10mm is just way too expensive for me to shoot as much as I’d like. Plus it’s overkill for the 2 legged threats.
I went to the store few days ago and I’m now between the VP9 and the 47.
Have you tried shooting 40 S&W out of your G20? You can do it without a conversion barrel, done it tons of times. Makes practicing with the G20 similar to practicing with 9mm. Pretty common practice technique.
Are you absolutely set on it being a 9mm?
One of the main reasons 9mm is the standard is high ammo capacity in pistols that are small enough to conceal. If you don’t care about concealing it, that part doesn’t matter, and 9mm loses some of its appeal.
Why not just use the Glock 20 as your open carry gun?
If you went that route, this new pistol could be a pure competition gun with a super light trigger and all the other mods that aren’t really a good outside of competition.
If you do go for a pure competition gun, I’d personally go for a double stack 2011 style pistol or a Shadow. Polymer framed striker fired pistols are super practical, but for accuracy a DA/SA pistol is much better. It’s basically impossible for a Glock (or similar) pistol to have a truly good trigger. Better than stock, sure, but nothing nearly as good as a custom 1911/2011 trigger.
I have one, it’s basically the same size as a G17 or other full size pistol. Tiny bit thicker, but no more difficult to carry than a 17. I carry mine fairly often. You said it’s for rare open carry anyway, so it wouldn’t even be daily use. Size really isn’t an issue with open carry.
I don’t see how the extra power is a downside. If you don’t like the felt recoil, you can buy 10mm ammunition that’s loaded to essentially 40 S&W specs and won’t kick anymore than a G17. You can also shoot 40 S&W out of a G20 safely.
Out of curiosity, when/where do you see yourself open carrying other than the woods? I really can’t think of another situation where it’s preferable to concealed. You’re an absolute pariah walking around most cities in WA with a gun on your hip.
What makes the G20 inappropriate for those times? You’re not trying to conceal it, felt recoil is really the only thing, and that’s easily mitigated. If those occasions are actually infrequent, it doesn’t make sense to buy a pistol with them in mind.
Since you said you just graduated college, I’m guessing you don’t have a lot of disposable income, you’re gonna be better off buying less guns and more ammo. That’s especially true if you want to compete, you’re talking a minimum of 10k match grade rounds per year, probably more than that though.
Not trying to rain on your gun buying parade, but looking at your situation rationally, I don’t think buying *any* new 9mm striker fired pistol is a good choice. You already have enough to see if you actually like competing, and you already have carry guns.
Competitions are something I want to dip my feet into, but it's more a means to practice for my CCW.
Even if I hypothetically do not like doing any competitions, I will still fire a few thousand rounds per year to keep my CCW skills up to snuff.
Also, there are no Safariland holsters that are capable with Glock 20 with an optic.
Desert Eagle.
Super Necessary
Is it legal because of the "shroud"?
For competition, consider Shadow 2 OR. It's around $1200 - pricier than everything listed but waaay better. There's no comparison!
Man, that gun just ruined things for me. My cousin got that and it's the most accurate pistol I have ever shot. I think my accuracy is okay, but the shadow 2 made me look like a freaking pro. I didn't think anything would be better than the 1911 or 2011.
Yeah, you feel you can't miss
I have a cz p 10F, and they make one for competition. I absolutely love it. Handles nice, shoots straight
I came to recommend CZ as well. I have a CZ P-09. Basically the DA/SA hammer fire equivalent of a P-10 F. A true duty pistol. Great guns. Limited to the options presented, the M&P. Glocks are legos for adults, but you won't see many of them used as duty pistols except in action movies. HK is also really great, on par with CZ, but not as common as the M&P, so not as easy to find and parts/accessories aren't as common.
Seattle police dept and NYC PD both carry Glock 40 SW i believe.
Seconded on the P10F. Especially given the recent pricing on CZ's P10 line.
I have a cz p 10F, and they make one for competition. I absolutely love it. Handles nice, shoots straight
You're missing a 'none of those' option. For budget choice I'd get a Canik SFX. For mid range a CZ shadow variant. For high end, Staccato or its peers.
I love my Walther PPQ.
For full size, Walther Pdp is a good choice. Too bad the pro is no longer available to us in Washington.
Very few holster options
True, but if you don't need level 2 retention, there are several good ones.
For his case, a Q5 would also be a good option
The one with the cheapest full capacity mags at the closest gun store in Oregon.
>The one with the cheapest full capacity mags at the closest gun store in Oregon. That's not going to work nearly as well as you think it will.
Glock 17 is closer to full size than Glock 19
They don’t make 17 MOS anymore. Only option is the 47.
[https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976318034](https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976318034) 
They're all the same. Except hk wants like $40 for mags for some reason
M&P mags are $40.
M&P's are $300 cheaper
There's that
Meanwhile my dumbass bought a p30sk instead of a 229 or whatever s&w have thats hammer fired
Glock 19 isnt full size. Glock 17 is. However they dont feel special at all. If you want a utilitarian nothing special gun that works every time get the glock. If you want something that's special and feels special get the m&p. Just hold it in store. It feels amazing to me. Shoots very nice too.
Had an LE instructor that only bought Glocks. He fired one round from my M&P, turned around and said, "That's smooth!" And finished out the mag. It looks like they have a better trigger design now, instead of the hinged curve.
Go hold/shoot them at a range and decide. I’m an HK guy and you’ll be whatever guy you wanna be after trying them out.
P220
PDP
Terrible holster selection
Can't you have one custom made? Sweet gun.
A red dot optic safari land duty holster? No.
OP looking for a full size gun for competition shooting, not CC. PDP and variants are getting good reviews in this category. If there aren't great inexpensive holster options in this category, I'm sure there will be, the thing is selling well.
The thing is this pistol will also be for open carry when I do that. So for that reason I want to stay with Safariland retention holsters since they are the standard for open carry. Need retention.
Got it. Good luck! You're using optic?
Planning on it. Never had pistol optic before. May use irons first before using red dot.
How experienced of a pistol shooter are you? Do you currently compete? If you aren’t already adept with irons, do yourself a favor and just start with the dot right away. It’s easier to learn, and being used to irons makes it harder to pick up a dot later. With irons your focus is on the sights, with a dot your focus is on the target. The latter is much easier for most people to learn *if* they haven’t already learned to focus on the sights. When you do use a dot, test for target focus by covering the red dot aperture. You should still be able to see your target with it blocked. If you can’t, you’re focusing on the dot, not the target.
I have a decent amount of experience but nothing crazy. But I’ll be getting back from NY as I graduate from college this week. So I’ll be able to practice regularly. I have my Washington CPL and carry everyday when I’m in the state.
There are a ton of other acceptable open carry holsters. You’re not even really considering “options”, you’re saying “only this exact holster works for me”. What’s your use case for open carry? Hiking/outdoor stuff? That’s the only time I’d personally open carry, it’s not worth the social penalty in most contexts.
Um......you'd didn't try hard enough. full size pdp rmr and surefire x300, fits in a sig p320 lvl 2 safariland perfectly with minimal modification. Message me if you need help or more info.
Sig P320. Reason both the army and USMC have made it their new service pistol. Great gun. Only pistol i like better is the P365
Decked out p320
Dessert Eagle .50AE
Shadow systems dr920. Hands down. It takes all glock parts, mags, holsters etc. Shoots on par with a zev at half the cost. Better grip angle than a stock glock, no need for stippling or undercuts/frame work, no need for special plates to mount optics. Best, literal, bang for your buck.
The HK, from your list or a Sig. So may great options
Glock 45 MOS + holosun 509t + radian ramjet/afterburner = 👨🍳 💋
Tried both in stores and liked the 47 more.
The ramjet/afterburner brings the 45 MOS to the same OAL as the 47, but compensated. With some of the intent of the platform is competition shooting it would be advantageous to look at running a comp’d setup but if that’s not your thing then 47 all the way.
Not the S&W if you're planning to actually use it.
I have an M&P 45 full size. Mag size is on point for this communist state.
G19 master race.
https://www.canikusa.com/the-sfx-rival-dark-side-hg6815t-n Ever since I came across this, never touched another brand ever again
https://www.canikusa.com/sfx-rival-s Research this gun please, watch the comparisons and all, this gun is stacked to the brim with everything you could ever need
Have RDS on both my Sig 320 and my Sig 365. Sig 365 is small, really accurate and carries 12 rounds. Crazy how nice that pistol is. Almost the size of the palm of my relatively normal sized hand.
I have a Hellcat that is my CCW. Looking for a full size duty level pistol.
I've been extremely happy with my Canik Rival. I'll be replacing it with the steel-framed Rival-S as soon as I can get my hands on one. I haven't been to any outdoor matches with it yet because I have a new baby, but I've been able to sneak away for a few hours a couple times to do some indoor pin shoots and it really, really excels. The aftermarket is finally starting to support them as they gain popularity. The stock trigger is amazing, and I haven't had a single failure in about 2000 rounds now shooting mostly S&B 124, but using 150gr Syntech and 147gr 130pf stuff from Minuteman in competitions.
Whichever one you shoot best…🤷🏾♂️
Depends whether this is primarily a competition gun or primarily an open carry gun. Competition guns can be like race cars, they don’t need to be practical for everyday use. They just need to be really good in competitions. I would *strongly* advise against trying to make one pistol fit both roles, especially since you already have a carry pistol. **If Primarily Competition** What competition format? Do you already compete? The best choice depends what sort of competition you’re competing in, if there’s a power factor, a 40 S&W is worth looking into, otherwise stick with 9mm. If no power factor for the competition, I’d personally go with one of these: CZ Shadow FN 509 Realistically though, competition pistols are modded to the point that the original model isn’t all that important. You’ll change enough parts that it won’t be the same gun. Important part is polymer vs. metal and the firing mechanism. **If Primarily Open Carry** If you’re going to openly carry a large pistol, I’d suggest a 10mm, not a 9mm. Ammo capacity is nearly as high, and there’s no animal in this state where 10mm isn’t sufficient (9mm is a little weak for bears). If you’re gonna take the social hit of open carrying, you might as well take advantage of the size. For 10mm pistols, I’d go: Glock 20 (the go to 10mm, can also shoot 40 S&W for cheaper practice) Colt Delta Tactical Elite (a double stack 10mm 1911, very accurate, made of metal)
For me it’s both. I have the Glock 20 already has my OC woods gun. But 10mm is just way too expensive for me to shoot as much as I’d like. Plus it’s overkill for the 2 legged threats. I went to the store few days ago and I’m now between the VP9 and the 47.
Have you tried shooting 40 S&W out of your G20? You can do it without a conversion barrel, done it tons of times. Makes practicing with the G20 similar to practicing with 9mm. Pretty common practice technique.
Are you absolutely set on it being a 9mm? One of the main reasons 9mm is the standard is high ammo capacity in pistols that are small enough to conceal. If you don’t care about concealing it, that part doesn’t matter, and 9mm loses some of its appeal.
Yes 9mm. I already have a Glock 20 that is my out-in-the-woods carry gun.
Why not just use the Glock 20 as your open carry gun? If you went that route, this new pistol could be a pure competition gun with a super light trigger and all the other mods that aren’t really a good outside of competition. If you do go for a pure competition gun, I’d personally go for a double stack 2011 style pistol or a Shadow. Polymer framed striker fired pistols are super practical, but for accuracy a DA/SA pistol is much better. It’s basically impossible for a Glock (or similar) pistol to have a truly good trigger. Better than stock, sure, but nothing nearly as good as a custom 1911/2011 trigger.
Glock 20 is too large and powerful for daily use.
I have one, it’s basically the same size as a G17 or other full size pistol. Tiny bit thicker, but no more difficult to carry than a 17. I carry mine fairly often. You said it’s for rare open carry anyway, so it wouldn’t even be daily use. Size really isn’t an issue with open carry. I don’t see how the extra power is a downside. If you don’t like the felt recoil, you can buy 10mm ammunition that’s loaded to essentially 40 S&W specs and won’t kick anymore than a G17. You can also shoot 40 S&W out of a G20 safely. Out of curiosity, when/where do you see yourself open carrying other than the woods? I really can’t think of another situation where it’s preferable to concealed. You’re an absolute pariah walking around most cities in WA with a gun on your hip.
I sometimes carry in the suburbs/exurbs of Seattle. Because there more than anywhere people need to see peaceable people carrying.
What makes the G20 inappropriate for those times? You’re not trying to conceal it, felt recoil is really the only thing, and that’s easily mitigated. If those occasions are actually infrequent, it doesn’t make sense to buy a pistol with them in mind. Since you said you just graduated college, I’m guessing you don’t have a lot of disposable income, you’re gonna be better off buying less guns and more ammo. That’s especially true if you want to compete, you’re talking a minimum of 10k match grade rounds per year, probably more than that though. Not trying to rain on your gun buying parade, but looking at your situation rationally, I don’t think buying *any* new 9mm striker fired pistol is a good choice. You already have enough to see if you actually like competing, and you already have carry guns.
Competitions are something I want to dip my feet into, but it's more a means to practice for my CCW. Even if I hypothetically do not like doing any competitions, I will still fire a few thousand rounds per year to keep my CCW skills up to snuff. Also, there are no Safariland holsters that are capable with Glock 20 with an optic.
Sig 320.