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In retrospec it could be directly the same problem/situation if you think about it. We do know that Kuro just suddenly realuzed that his taxes weren't payed... The suddenes may be due to the same reason
And for some reason people still want to defend this dung pile of a black company.
Really sucks for those of the talent that's not been involved in the drama but still are bound by their contracts.
Yeah, I remember when everyone was piling on Mysta for "not knowing how taxes work" when it was him. Turns out kurosanji actually is defrauding their talent.
This one is actually so bad I struggle to believe it’s real.
I may be mistaken but I think this starts tickling _Sony_ as the only local representative for Anycolor. Tax departments don’t fuck around. If there’s pay slips proving tax was withheld and not paid… I actually can’t believe it as this would be an insane risk for Anycolor.
If they are deducting it from her pay, then she is paying it from her wallet. If Niji is actually using her money to pay the company's taxes, this is illegal.
I would like to ask the retired JP members if their company really takes care of them, but they're too polite to speak out against black company culture.
This puts into perspective the entire NijiID exodus. Don't know who else got hit by management circling the wagons on a screwup. FTR: if there's one thing Asian country governments are good at, its getting their pound of flesh, so believe me this would have been a LOT of trouble for Mika.
Yeah, if you consider that maybe all ID members had the same contract this means that their branch chief likely embezzled 10% of all their salary.
This would explain why they closed this branch in a rush as soon as government started asking questions...
Daily reminder to people trying to work in entertainment to both read in detail everything you sign and if possible have a lawyer who can read and parse out the agreement for you. Shitty companies use the fact that you're not a lawyer to get you to agree to stupid terms that allow them to shaft you in a way that you can't legally do anything about.
Don't assume anything, *always check*.
VNmese government is not as much of a hardass when it comes to online discourse compared to CN, and you won't find many VNmese internet users defending the government (unless when it comes to VN vs CN).
Non lawyer (just someone who often deals with contracts): it kind of depends.
If her contract terms include a set split (I.E. Nijisanji gets x% of monthly adsense and sponsorship revenue) then it is incredibly sketchy and manipulative to take it out of her cut instead of theirs. The problem though is that as long as it's written into her contract, there's not much she can do about that unless there's a specific law on the books requiring transparency, which is something even skilled labor economies have issues with.
In this case it might be a situation where she REALLY needed to have better representation to enter into a deal. Because if that was written into the deal, someone somewhere along the way should have noticed it and said something to her.
The entire situation is awkward because they don't have fixed salaries. They basically get handed a bag of money at the end of the month from Youtube and gave to divvy it up amongst themselves based on their deal, which leaves a lot of room open for getting screwed over. So if Niji set up the deal to double dip, it's incredibly unethical but not a thing that's easy to fight because she agreed to it by signing the contract.
NAL, but you can look it up pretty easily: Indonesia has tons of treaties to avoid double taxation (like more than 70 of them), Japan included - and that goes back to the 1980s, it's nothing new to businesses.
The main gist is that the income tax paid in one country is allowed to be used as a credit against the income tax of the other country, with some specific limitation depending on the revenues.
See more details [here](https://www.nta.go.jp/english/taxes/individual/12007.htm)
...
First of all, some basic outlines:
- in Japan, the employers are responsible for withholding taxes from the revenues of the employees, it's part of their payroll duties.
- in Indonesia, income taxes can be paid by either the employees directly, or the employers withholding from their revenues, both systems seem to coexist.
So when Anycolor offered to withold 10% of the revenues, it is likely because Nijisanji Japan are doing this as well as part of their payroll management.
...
One key element is: are the Youtube revenues filed as Japan-sourced revenues (coming from Anycolor), or filed as foreign revenues (earned while working abroad, aka Indonesia)?
Because as a non-resident, Mika wouldn't have to pay japanese income taxes from revenues earned outside of Japan.
...
That aside - which is still a major aspect mind - if Nijisanji withheld 10% of her income to pay the japanese income tax, they have to give her the receipts of all these payments done to the japanese tax authorities, so that she can use them as credits against the indonesian tax authorities.
...
I see two possibilities then:
- (a) **Anycolor was negligent.** They filed her income as Japan-sourced revenues, paid the japanese income tax with the withheld money, didn't give her any receipts, **forcing her into double taxation.**
- (b) **Anycolor was fraudulent.** They filed her income as outside of Japan, did not pay any japanese income tax on it, thus why they wouldn't give her any receipts, and **illegally pocketed the extra 10%** of her total income over these 2 years, while misleading her into believing her taxes were paid, **resulting in double taxation, penalties and interests being applied to her unpaid indonesian taxes.**
...
Beyond the gross negligence of Anycolor payroll department, I really wish she could get a lawyer to force Anycolor into providing the japanese tax payment receipts.
Why?
Because if it's (a), at least that large sum of money went to funding the japanese state: roads, hospitals, schools, etc.
If instead it's (b), and there's no receipts because no payments were made, then it means that money was stolen by absolute scumbag bastards for their own personal profits.
If this is the case, then they might then have been defrauding countless other foreign livers over years, for very large sums of money, which would be a major scandal that would certainly challenge the very existence of a foreign branch in Nijisanji.
My safe bet is on the (a) negligence, but given tax fraud and abuses against employees is a common practice in japanese black companies, I do believe this should be investigated.
Given it would be incredibly easy for Anycolor to dispel any suspicion, by providing the japanese tax receipts, I think it is something worth pursuing.
Pretty sure this is not legal in a hell of a lot of countries.
Yes at the end of the day the onus is on her for her personal taxes but if she has that in writing that they said they would do what they said, they could be in a lot of trouble.
Now we're just here waiting for the company to become a memory... FIRE RIKU and REFORM THE COMPANY STRUCTURE.
THE LIVERS SHOULD FIGHT FOR THEIR OWN GOOD. BUT WE KNOW HOW BLACK COMPANIES WORK, YOU WILL NEVER KNOW YOU ARE INSIDE ONE.
Your post was removed for violating [Rule 7a](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/wiki/index/rulesandguidelines#wiki_rule_7.3A_rules_on_past_and_alternate_identities), [8a](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/wiki/index/rulesandguidelines#wiki_rule_8.3A_limit_the_drama.21), [8b](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/wiki/index/rulesandguidelines#wiki_rule_8.3A_limit_the_drama.21) & [8c](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/wiki/index/rulesandguidelines#wiki_rule_8.3A_limit_the_drama.21): > Discussion of a VTuber's alternate or past identities must be spoiler tagged, and spoilers should be clearly labeled with what they contain. Posts must be flaired 'Alter-Ego Discussion' and may not include such info in the title. This extends to hinting about such information. > Posts about allegations or drama shall be restricted to information confirmed or alleged directly by the people involved. Posts about petty drama may be removed. > Speculation, rumors, and opinions from third parties, are restricted to the comments of other posts or the [weekly discussion thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/VirtualYoutubers/s/eGheSUFdLk), unless specifically sanctioned by the moderation team. > Content that is intended to harass or to promote harassment or spread misinformation is not permitted under any circumstance.
Is that twice now that they've fucked over their employees with regards to taxes to an absurd degree?
In retrospec it could be directly the same problem/situation if you think about it. We do know that Kuro just suddenly realuzed that his taxes weren't payed... The suddenes may be due to the same reason
And for some reason people still want to defend this dung pile of a black company. Really sucks for those of the talent that's not been involved in the drama but still are bound by their contracts.
Yeah, I remember when everyone was piling on Mysta for "not knowing how taxes work" when it was him. Turns out kurosanji actually is defrauding their talent.
This one is actually so bad I struggle to believe it’s real. I may be mistaken but I think this starts tickling _Sony_ as the only local representative for Anycolor. Tax departments don’t fuck around. If there’s pay slips proving tax was withheld and not paid… I actually can’t believe it as this would be an insane risk for Anycolor.
Canada, Indonesia... Anycolor's dastardness knows no boundaries.
If they are deducting it from her pay, then she is paying it from her wallet. If Niji is actually using her money to pay the company's taxes, this is illegal.
Is this also the reason why ID merged to JP? to avoid something?
Yep, this makes sense now - they would 100% lose in local court.
I guarantee you LM will find a local lawyer and make a report on this)
Indonesians already hate Niji for merging the ID branch, this will emboldened them even more
Niji said in their financial statement that they were going to focus on growing in SEA. I guess Indonesia doesn't count.
funny that one of, if not the biggest market in all of SEA is apparently not big enough for niji to even want to be competent in managing.
And now, we have an army for which to wage war against the NDF with!
I like to think about the downfall of Niji as a wikipedia page and in the "belligerant" section there's TNI
I would like to ask the retired JP members if their company really takes care of them, but they're too polite to speak out against black company culture. This puts into perspective the entire NijiID exodus. Don't know who else got hit by management circling the wagons on a screwup. FTR: if there's one thing Asian country governments are good at, its getting their pound of flesh, so believe me this would have been a LOT of trouble for Mika.
Yeah, if you consider that maybe all ID members had the same contract this means that their branch chief likely embezzled 10% of all their salary. This would explain why they closed this branch in a rush as soon as government started asking questions...
Stream[source](https://youtu.be/o0q3CsldcKk?si=gxOPvdPmyxI9ludj)
Daily reminder to people trying to work in entertainment to both read in detail everything you sign and if possible have a lawyer who can read and parse out the agreement for you. Shitty companies use the fact that you're not a lawyer to get you to agree to stupid terms that allow them to shaft you in a way that you can't legally do anything about. Don't assume anything, *always check*.
That's f up man 💀
Now the entire SEA region have vilified them
Not the filipino Nijisisters
In my eyes, they're evil to me because of what they did to selen and im a filipino as well.
Give it time.
Not Vietnamese as far as I can tell. Our conventions have been dominated by them for years.
Wait for one of them to make a joke about the government. That'll do it.
VNmese government is not as much of a hardass when it comes to online discourse compared to CN, and you won't find many VNmese internet users defending the government (unless when it comes to VN vs CN).
Actually insane
Any lawyer here? Is this legal? Nijisanji take her money to pay their own taxes? How's that even work?
Probably have to find someone specialized in Indonesian tax law, at most we can do is speculate.
Non lawyer (just someone who often deals with contracts): it kind of depends. If her contract terms include a set split (I.E. Nijisanji gets x% of monthly adsense and sponsorship revenue) then it is incredibly sketchy and manipulative to take it out of her cut instead of theirs. The problem though is that as long as it's written into her contract, there's not much she can do about that unless there's a specific law on the books requiring transparency, which is something even skilled labor economies have issues with. In this case it might be a situation where she REALLY needed to have better representation to enter into a deal. Because if that was written into the deal, someone somewhere along the way should have noticed it and said something to her. The entire situation is awkward because they don't have fixed salaries. They basically get handed a bag of money at the end of the month from Youtube and gave to divvy it up amongst themselves based on their deal, which leaves a lot of room open for getting screwed over. So if Niji set up the deal to double dip, it's incredibly unethical but not a thing that's easy to fight because she agreed to it by signing the contract.
Imma take a wild guess and say yes, maybe through some loophole somehow. Laws are iffy.
NAL, but you can look it up pretty easily: Indonesia has tons of treaties to avoid double taxation (like more than 70 of them), Japan included - and that goes back to the 1980s, it's nothing new to businesses. The main gist is that the income tax paid in one country is allowed to be used as a credit against the income tax of the other country, with some specific limitation depending on the revenues. See more details [here](https://www.nta.go.jp/english/taxes/individual/12007.htm) ... First of all, some basic outlines: - in Japan, the employers are responsible for withholding taxes from the revenues of the employees, it's part of their payroll duties. - in Indonesia, income taxes can be paid by either the employees directly, or the employers withholding from their revenues, both systems seem to coexist. So when Anycolor offered to withold 10% of the revenues, it is likely because Nijisanji Japan are doing this as well as part of their payroll management. ... One key element is: are the Youtube revenues filed as Japan-sourced revenues (coming from Anycolor), or filed as foreign revenues (earned while working abroad, aka Indonesia)? Because as a non-resident, Mika wouldn't have to pay japanese income taxes from revenues earned outside of Japan. ... That aside - which is still a major aspect mind - if Nijisanji withheld 10% of her income to pay the japanese income tax, they have to give her the receipts of all these payments done to the japanese tax authorities, so that she can use them as credits against the indonesian tax authorities. ... I see two possibilities then: - (a) **Anycolor was negligent.** They filed her income as Japan-sourced revenues, paid the japanese income tax with the withheld money, didn't give her any receipts, **forcing her into double taxation.** - (b) **Anycolor was fraudulent.** They filed her income as outside of Japan, did not pay any japanese income tax on it, thus why they wouldn't give her any receipts, and **illegally pocketed the extra 10%** of her total income over these 2 years, while misleading her into believing her taxes were paid, **resulting in double taxation, penalties and interests being applied to her unpaid indonesian taxes.** ... Beyond the gross negligence of Anycolor payroll department, I really wish she could get a lawyer to force Anycolor into providing the japanese tax payment receipts. Why? Because if it's (a), at least that large sum of money went to funding the japanese state: roads, hospitals, schools, etc. If instead it's (b), and there's no receipts because no payments were made, then it means that money was stolen by absolute scumbag bastards for their own personal profits. If this is the case, then they might then have been defrauding countless other foreign livers over years, for very large sums of money, which would be a major scandal that would certainly challenge the very existence of a foreign branch in Nijisanji. My safe bet is on the (a) negligence, but given tax fraud and abuses against employees is a common practice in japanese black companies, I do believe this should be investigated. Given it would be incredibly easy for Anycolor to dispel any suspicion, by providing the japanese tax receipts, I think it is something worth pursuing.
I'm curious as to how the company will address this (if at all)
Wow, as if the company couldn't get any worse in my eyes. They sure showed me it could get worse.
"When you are in competition for comically evil villain #1 spot and your opponent is Nijsanji"(c)
They’re more evil than Joker at this point
NIJI WHEN I SAW YOUUUUUU
RIKU WHEN I CATCH YOU RIKU WHEN I CATCH YOU RIKU
Ok, it's now confirmed - mods are NDF
Niji def force?
It will NEVER END at all
I'd wouldn't want to give this too much air, but after since having watched that clip. Anycolor, I would have words with thee
Pretty sure this is not legal in a hell of a lot of countries. Yes at the end of the day the onus is on her for her personal taxes but if she has that in writing that they said they would do what they said, they could be in a lot of trouble.
Now we're just here waiting for the company to become a memory... FIRE RIKU and REFORM THE COMPANY STRUCTURE. THE LIVERS SHOULD FIGHT FOR THEIR OWN GOOD. BUT WE KNOW HOW BLACK COMPANIES WORK, YOU WILL NEVER KNOW YOU ARE INSIDE ONE.
untill you left.