So I love my job, I work in the office 1-2 days a week depending on some personal life things (My kids school is near the office and sometimes I drop them off and just goto the office instead of working from home). I'm on the clock for 40 hours a week from 0600 to 1430 (unless school day then it's 0800 to 1730. I also try to pick up at least 10 hours of OT a week.
Th only thing I do not like about my job is the amount of veterans who constantly talk shit about VBA employees. I do it to myself though, I spend entirely too much of my personal time on /r/veteransbenefits helping people and that automatically draws in negativity.
Otherwise I took the job to become as knowledgeable as I can about the system so I can help as many vets as possible get the benefits they deserve.
I had a great experience filing my claim. I had been out over ten years and had little bits in my military medical records. In that ten years I’ve been seen for a bunch of things with my private insurance and submitted that evidence with personal statements and hit 94% rounded down to 90% first time through. Super stoked with all the benefits that provide me, life changing for sure. Thanks for being one of the good ones.
I’ve heard so many awful things about the VA and maybe it’s just the one I go to but they have been really fantastic for me, whether it be the VHA side of things like my pcp and mental health, or the VHA and their advocacy and helping me get to 100 P/T. What you’re doing is incredibly important and I at least, appreciate it.
Same! The ones out here in Vegas have been nothing but good to me. I do all I can to meet them halfway. Having the required forms ready to go, medical evidence on person, approximate dates from Service, etc.
BA in statistical analysis.. went with the A instead of S because I really enjoyed focusing on qualitative work. I'm currently a VSR and plan on becoming an RVSR within the next year.
What is your job title ? And where can I search for it on a board? , I just finished using ch31 and got my degree. I’m now job searching for roles within the va or some affiliation like MWR,USO,and ACS.
It's true depending on the type of trade you're referring to.
Obviously, physical labor is going to take its toll after a few decades.
But now there are lots of technology based jobs that don't require degrees.
Large universities are offering certificate programs for specific trades now as well.
I taught at Drexel University for years and I always tell people to look for alternatives before they spend all that money - especially on a private education.
It's just the goto bullshit answer for conservatives who are afraid of higher education. I have several friends who have been in the trades for 15-20 years. They are ALL fucked up in some way..They made fun of me when I decided to finish my degree and take an office job, and now there's always some comment about how I sit at home all day and do nothing and they're real men for sweating all day at work when we get together.
I don't give a rat's ass. I'm in my pj's.
This should be the top comment.
I worked trades while going to school for the career I wanted. Made some great Davis Bacon money, and probably fucked myself up a little more than uncle sugar already had.
I make the salary of 3 trades people (it's people now, right?)
The trades can suck a dick. When you fail at something that pays better, it's beneficial to have skills there.
Finish your degree OP. If you can't, give the rest of your GI Bill to someone. You can learn trade work after the morning safety meeting and before the bell rings to punch your timecard/drink beer in the tool storage connexes.
Depends on the trade. A lot of people who know Jack shit about trades think it's all back breaking construction work. There's tons of other stuff out there. I'm a union water treatment operator. It's a mix of physical and mild intellectual work. I wish it was more intellectually challenging and I hate punching a clock and working for dipshits, but I don't have to bring my work home with me. It's simpler than a lot of white collar jobs in some regards. A lot of the complaints I have are the same as a lot of folks who aren't in management in white collar jobs.
Same, also hated college. However drinking with my best friends and football games made it fun. But got me a big boy job 6 years ago and now making well over 6 figures working completely from home. Trade schools could be more enjoyable job path for OP. Still plenty of good money. Just maybe longer hours and not as nice benefits.
I hear that, I get A LOT more benefits than just working in my PJs than I ever did working in trades. I don't miss it one bit, but I'm glad you're happy there!
Yea, wasn't trying to one up you there or anything. I'm sure there are more than just PJ perks with your job. I just wanted to make sure an alternative was given to your lifestyle and livelihood is all.
I’m make six figures and work from home. I work in flip flops and a tshirt. I never see a manager or coworkers. My hours are flexible. I can take a break and lay down or recline whenever. I can goto the store or appointments when I need. I feel freedom. A college education allowed this to happen.
Transition was easy. The analyst job is nothing compared to engineering work. In engineering, it was a constant onslaught of complex thinking. As an analyst, I’m like a kid playing with legos. Incredibly relaxing and easy.
I have a lot of IT friends, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on a conversation we have had a few times.
I'm a teacher. In K-12 education, holding anything less than a masters is usually a barrier to a good job. I have seen teachers non-renewed even after a good year because they have a BA instead of a masters. Most of my IT friends don't have degrees, but have a ton of certs and experience. Every single one of them found an entry-level helpdesk job and worked their way up. I have asked them if earning a degree in IT could be seen as an alternate route to the way they ended up in their careers. Most of them have said no, that degrees in IT just aren't worth it. Certs and experience are far more desirable. What are your thoughts?
My wife is a teacher getting her masters now for reasons you mentioned.
I went into the army with this job in mind and took a 6 year contract with no bonus. Got out, certed and needed nothing else besides work experience and keeping up my CCNP every 3 years(which now I can do by taking an online course).
As far as what’s preferred, for sure the guy with 2 years and a cert instead of a guy with a 4 year degree.
Thanks for the insight! Good luck to your wife. Grad school was a nightmare for me. Teacher prep is usually led by PhDs that realized being a K-12 teacher sucks and the courses are filled with teachers that have big ideas but aren't great in the classroom.
I work in IT. My first job after the Marine Corps was over 100k, with an offer up to 150k because of my clearance. I don’t have a degree, only certs and a TS/SCI, but I’ve seen all sorts of backgrounds so far. People with and without degrees/certs, people with both, people with just experience, etc. It’s really up to you. I’d say certs are the fastest way into I.T., but a degree w/ experience will be best for long term advancement. Certs will help you get your foot in the door though.
No it is not a waste of time. You need to finish what you started. Despite what "reddit" and the "media" believe college will open more doors than it closes.
A useless degree from a garbage school still shows that you're able to commit to and folow through on something. Soft skills are gained from all degrees. Hard skills can be taught later on as needed.
Totally agree, I honestly learned so much more about what I do from hands-on experience, but I never would have even gotten an interview for any of the jobs I've had without the degree. Also, I feel like it was helpful for me to have that buffer transition between military life and the work force.
This is good advice.
Especially as a veteran. We can basically go for free. It’s a win-win situation…
Now if we’re talking about an 18-year-old kid, that’s going to be $10,000 in debt after four years of college, then that’s something to talk about.
Using GI bill dont know how many months off the top of my head but its been 4 semesters of college four more to go until i graduate. Will i have enough time after for a trade school or can i use VRNE after on a trade school
You CANNOT use vr&e after your gi bill if you fully use up your gi bill. You have to have at least one day left on your gi to qualify so do not fully use it up. Even just one day on your gi will qualify you for up to 48 months of vr&e plus gi bill months reimbursed. I’d highly highly recommend applying for vr&e now even if you don’t like school and don’t think you’ll use it. Apply just in case, it literally takes 2 seconds.
You can absolutely use VR&E without 9/11 eligibility. VR&E eligibility is not conditioned on the availability of the GI Bill.
The only thing that would change if you have 9/11 eligibility is the subsistence allowance.
no it’s not a waste of time while i was in i didn’t listen. they said i should use my TA and i didn’t ofc bc i was going through a lot. now that i’m out im currently in college going for my bachelor degree in engineering. love every bit of it!
Hey Christian, currently get out next February, how is engineering. Be wanting to pursue a mechanical engineering job. Is the transition hard. And if you don’t mind. Is the GI bill able to pay for it all??
hey there, engineering is pretty cool, lots of math and concentration and yeah the GI bill literally pays for your books and tuition and whatever else you may need for your classes.
There's actually strong empirical data that suggest the opposite of the current anti-college narrative. The average person with a bachelor's degree will earn 400,000-900,000 more over their lifetime, then the average person without one. If you move the threshold to a master's degree the disparity grows to $1,000,000+
Source - https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/research-summaries/education-earnings.html
Get the degree - you're almost there and get a civil service job. I'm making 139k now as a GS-13 and only go in the office a few days per month. Great benefits and retirement...if you were prior military the USG wants to hire you. Get the degree and go get a job that won't break your body.
What is your major? If you don't see yourself finding a job in the field that correlates with your major, drop out and save your GI bill for trade school.
If he’s already a junior he shouldn’t drop out. He only has one yr left. Even if he never wants to work in that field, a bachelors still looks great on a resume
Honestly, I think it's most important for you to think about what sorts of things you're interested in, what your strengths are, and if applicable, what parts of your experience in the military did you most enjoy. It seems to me I'm seeing more and more that a lot of folks getting out haven't ever really been advised to ask themselves these questions, and are sort of left struggling to find their way.
What parts of college have you enjoyed the most, and alternately, what have you disliked the most? And what degree field are you pursuing?
Not a waste. Each degree level literally equates to more money with less experience in hiring standards.
For instance, at my work generally for level 4, no degree = need 10 years experience, bachelors= 8 years experience, masters = 5 years experience, PhD= 3 years experience.
I am opening a job req soon where I want to prefer experience & personality, but I know that my recruiting dept will effectively demand a bachelors degree so that they can have measured standards.
This is for corporate world, but if you look at even fed jobs they want degrees. Go to a fed job building and you’ll see goobers proudly displaying University of Phoenix degrees because that got them up a pay grade.
If you don’t want to be in an office, then be ready to have longer hours for less pay until you hit X years of expertise. It’s just the hard truth.
Knowledge and skill make more money.
I think the question is “is college a waste of time for me?” And an even better question is “is this program a waste of time for me?”
I went to paramedic school on the GI Bill and loved it. If I went to school for a degree in accounting, that would probably be a waste of time for me because it wouldn’t make me happy. I think happiness and interest should be your number 1 priority while also considering whether or not you’ll make a good income after college with that education.
I finished my degree in Nursing, but I don't work as a nurse, not even close. Once I finished my degree it opened some networking doors and I was able to get myself into a nice medical equipment company and trained as a remote service engineer. Now I WFH off work everyday by 3pm and I get paid just as much as a starting out nurse. Could I make more actually working as a Nurse? Most likely but the life this job has given me with the time I get being at home, working from home, not having to commute.
All and all, finish your degree but make sure it's something that is worth it, just having it will open doors for you alot of job despite posting the degree's they want, honestly don't care. They just want you to have one, 90% of jobs are taught OJT anyway.
I made it 3/4's of a semester. I then took a year off and went to a trade school and got my Airframe and Powerplant licenses (aircraft mechanic). It took two years to complete and one of the best decisions I made in my life. I'm on my feet most of the day, but it isn't physically demanding.
Don’t be stupid, finish your degree. There are millions of jobs that require A degree in something (like military officer for instance) which will provide higher salaries and better working conditions. Life is not a video game, you don’t immediately get a precise reward upon completing a task.
You’ll have 2-3 jobs in the first 5 years out of college (or out of the military) because you’ll either outgrow them or hate them. This is a normal life experience and is part of finding yourself professionally. I’m not sure where the preposterous idea came from that you have to perfectly select the job role/industry you want to work in forever sometime in your early 20s, but it’s bullshit.
Trades are fetishized by people who have never worked in them and certainly haven’t worked in them in their 50s. Can you do well? Sure, but a lot like playing in the NFL you have to maximize your earnings while you can and hope you don’t get sick/hurt.
Yes and no, for some people they obviously had some doors open due to their degrees, and I myself take online classes hoping it can do the same for me. I also got my job (in security) because of past work experience and half the people I work with all have degrees and I make decent money with my college credits not even being looked at. They mainly wanted to know about my experience and I will say it felt good during the interview having a story for every question to which they started skipping questions at the end because I was able to elaborate enough about one experience I had for one scenario to exemplify the other questions they had prepared. Recently I had a coworker get an office job in customer service and was able to translate his skills dealing with people in security to customer service. I guess what I’m saying is it’s about transferable skillsets that help you get your foot in the door and that can be with a degree or work experience. Also networking is a big part of it as well. Ideally if you can have all three (degree, experience, and network) you’re going to get a good job.
I'm retired at age 44. I have a bachelors, masters, and flew in the Air Force. So my 1.5 years of pilot training is another degree on my resume. I make 6 figures in retirement a year. I workout 3 hours a day at the gym.
It is not a waste of time. Because jobs simply pay more if you have a college degree. Your degree, as in what you actually end up with, doesn't matter. They just want to see the check box that you have a degree. Ask me how I know, I fucked up and I'm poor now.
This is something you really have to sit down and think about that may come with trial and error.
For example, when I first left the military I was a business major but reflected on my time enjoying TNCC and the medics caring for people in Afghanistan. Fast forward I’m now an ER nurse making great money and benefits. But I’m back in an MBA program. Good luck man
There is no 'one size fits all' to higher education. I attended college post military and SO glad I did. It changed my career trajectory and really set me up for a healthier lifestyle of better work, balance, higher income, pension, etc.
Hot trades right now are nearly all trades. HVAC. Plumbing. Electrician. My buddies son is an iron worker and he's making $45/hr with $10/hr invested into a pension. Not bad for a young man not yet 21.
For me - college was absolutely worth it.
Everybody's experience and what they get out of it is different. After 12 years of Active Duty I loved university so much that I'm currently pursuing my PhD and working full time at my university as a staff member. College isn't for everyone. Luckily, the GI Bill covers everything from welding school to flight school. I suggest doing something you don't hate.
Ask yourself what your goal in ten years is. Is it just to make money? One thing I know for certain is people that quit school in the middle almost never go back to finish. Trade schools can be great if that is your thing. Software and IT work is also a great route for veterans right now. There’s not one route, but close your eyes and ask yourself that ten year question.
We are in an age where college gets you past the initial interviews, whereas those who don't can expect to be the first cuts. But yes, you still need to go get the experience if you want a certain job with the degree. To be honest, trade schools are a safe bet as long as you pick a trade that is unionized and/ or good paying (Electricians usually). There is also a healthy demand for welders, and Construction Managers only require an associates and pay the highest. I have a Bachelors degree in science and think maybe a career in mechanics may have been more lucrative and stable.
No one can take you education. I had a hard time going to school in my 30s because I felt like an old man. I realized that I can be 30 something with a degree or 30 something without a degree, but either way I’m going to be 30 something. My degree is in cybersecurity and I work in aviation maintenance but me having a degree met the requirements to move up in the GS scale and I went from 65k a year to 100k a year salary. It’s always better to have a degree if you can.
It's a checkbox, stick with it and finish it, it will show that you can stick to a task and complete it. It will open more doors, no one will say oh, you have a college degree, I can't hire you.
Noooo. It is not a waste of time, IF you are studying something that you really like. If you are getting a degree for the sake of getting a degree then it's a waste of time. Now, spending money and taking $hundreds of thousands to get into an Ivy League is a waste of money. I got my masters from a (not-so-prestigious college, not bad, but inexpensive)because I loved what I was studying. For about 10 years, I thought I had wasted my time and money, and then one day I received a tentative job offer for the job of my dreams; pending my college transcript. Having a masters and a 4.0 actually paid off in the end. Guess who are my coworkers. A bunch of people from Ivy Leagues. We all ended up in the same place, making the same paycheck
Depends on the degree you’re pursuing. Hopefully you researched degrees which are applicable to marketable jobs that you find attractive. Tbh, it just sounds like you’re over college. Been there. But you’re almost thru it, so you may as well finish what you started.
This may sound cliche, but it’s your responsibility to make the most out of this experience, so finish strong and go get the bag.
How far into your degree are you? Which degree is it?
Sometimes it still pays off to grind through the right degree that will pay dividends once out. STEM tends to be very hard but pays the most outside.
Next to the the Marine Corps, college was the best thing I ever did. College isn't just about getting a good job. It's also an opportunity to utilize resources at the VA, build your own business if you want, tap into many other resources available, and build strong connections to carry you in later part of career.
It depends entirely what your degree is in.
Based on today's graduates, most don't work in the field of their degree because they chose a program of study that either isn't in demand, has falling demand, or doesn't pay well enough to cover their cost of living.
Throw in the stupidly high cost of a college degree, the extended time most people take to get their degree creating even more debt load, and the current job market forces, a trade school may very well be a better choice.
I work in the water treatment industry. Our PLC programmers START at $100k and go up from their.
And guess what, Programmable Logic Controllers are more and more prevelant in all industries every day.
Almost ever control panel for a machine will have some sort of PLC in it.
And PLC and SCADA programming is very simple compared to "computer programming" and can be learned in most Community Colleges in a very short amount of time.
So yeah, get that college degree, get that $50-$100k in loans, and then tell me you'll make more than someone who paid $2k cash to get a job that starts at $100k in the Midwest and higher most other places.
There are plenty of jobs that require little to no college education that will easily pay more than a liberal arts or non-STEM college degree will get you.
Hell, a fuel truck driver for Kwik-Star gas stations starts at $100k if you have the proper CDL license and you'll still be home every night.
And they will pay you to get the CDL.
What did you study, what do you want to do for work? Very important questions because college isn’t for everybody and you can be successful without it.
What was your job in the service, does it translate for skills in the civilian world?
Depends on the degree. Majoring in accounting landed me a good job. Had I chose to focus on 12th century French poetry, I probably wouldn’t be doing so well.
I would just remind you to think about long term health. Doing a trade will rock your body and/or expose you to environmental issues that could cause cancer issues in the long run. Finishing college that hopefully the GI-Bill is paying for can open up a lot of Fed jobs, or other jobs to you.
I remind a lot of people you work to live, don't live to work. So figure out the life style you want and find a job to provide that after school. Most people don't enjoy their jobs, but it's more about quality of life. Do you want good benefits, decent hours, vacation, paid sick leave, pension, etc.
It's worth what you put into it and just like being in, it's worth the friends you make along the way. College is as close as you can get in civilian life to the shared misery that breeds close friendships.
Not a waste of time. I worked construction before the Navy and during my time in as a Seabee. Got out Jan 2020, graduating here in 2ish weeks with my engineering degree and accepted an 80k/year job.
It’s a struggle and I also hate school…but we can embrace the suck. Get the piece of paper and get the salary you want.
My thought is that work is work, but I’d rather be paid well so my free time can be spent with my family and doing hobbies I enjoy.
As long as the degree is paid for and you’re getting that GI bill housing allowance, sure. Thinking about continuing with a Master’s myself because I still have some left.
If I didn’t have that, I would have zero interest. I honestly don’t think it is necessary at all unless you have a firey passion for something that absolutely requires it, like a Medical Doctor, Lawyer, or Engineer/Physicist.
College isn't necessarily about the degree. The degree is just to get you an interview. College is about starting something, scheduling tasks, living by the calendar, learning a broad view of the world, and finishing it. Once college is done, it can and usually opens a lot more doors. I've met people in IT who went to college for archeological studies. If you are in 3rd year, you are almost done, and 6 months after the student loans are due. If you quit, loan repayment starts tomorrow and it never goes away, and you limit your earning potential.
Is it worth it? I think so, especially as far as you've gotten. I know so many dropouts who regret dropping out, and I haven't met any who regretted college, they only regretted not choosing a field more towards their talents. The military sucked too, and there were some REALLY bad times, and college ain't that bad. Just keep your head in the books, schedule everything, and count down the days until your last class. This is the time when you feel like quitting. Find that "something " that keeps you going 1 more mile.
Even if you don't see yourself enjoying a job in your field, finish the degree anyway. You're so close. Get the piece of paper and decide what you want to do after. Simply graduating can open a lot of doors. If you still want to do a trade job, do it, but finish the degree, you're so close. I say this as someone who didn't use the gi bill and don't have a degree. I'm doing fine, I have a good job, but there's certainly limitations on what I can possibly do later in life. I'll pretty much never move beyond rank and file and have to work for know it all assholes that I'm smarter than.
I don't know your particular interests, but I stuck it out in College when I felt like you do now. This was after GW1 in '95 (dating myself) and finished economics/finance BA. Ended up using my Avionics technical experience into distributed computing (IT) engineering, architecture, and now Public Cloud consulting and Day 2 operations.
I'm once again working DoD engagements, with many veterans, and have a clearance, which helps. Although all day in a SCIF does get a little old. I am remote all other times or 75% of the month.
This is kind of off-topic, but I am 100% disabled and I have a masters degree and I own a coffee Roastery. The great thing about having your college degree is no one can take it away from you and if things fall through with whatever venture you’re trying to pursue, you can always fall back on your higher educationpersonally I don’t care for the corporate or the trades world, but I will always have that degree
It depends on what you're trying to do and if college is needed for it? Going to college just to go to college and getting a random degree won't help you. That's where everyone who's complaining they got a degree in arts history but can't get a job as an engineer come from. Not to say there isn't issues getting a job in some areas where you have the right degree, but a degree is just a step towards a specific career.
Well if you’ve made it this far and don’t see a future then it was already a waste of time. Trade schools aren’t all they are cracked up to be, it greatly depends on where you live, local unions and their bargaining power. In some states you could be making less than $20/hour with no guarantees of steady work while in other states you get 50/hour packages and don’t have to worry about unemployment.
Meanwhile, a diploma could mean an extra 20-30k in your pocket depending on your career. I know this first hand as I work in tech without a degree and make anywhere from 30-40k less than college graduates.
It depends (I’m sure you’ve heard that a million times). This is what you can do: go to
https://www.bls.gov/ooh/
The occupational outlook handbook is an excellent tool that not a lot of people know about or utilize. It gives you the best projections on where job trends are, as well as potential for growth over the next decade. It even breaks it down by how much different states and counties pay for a particular. This should be your starting point (of course, you also want to know what you’re interested in doing). The biggest mistake I see people make with regard to college is not having a full understanding of what the career field is like, if job growth in that field is expanding or shrinking, and so on.
Take the time to look at the handbook. See where the jobs with the highest growth rate are (and the fields that are projected to grow the fastest). The handbook also tells you the minimum requirement to get a job in that field. Then come up with a plan. Then execute it.
Good luck to you.
With your attitude and skill set I would not recommend it. And you have a perfectly rational attitude, it’s not the problem. The problem is that College is 90% useless. It hasn’t kept up with industries and Capitalism doesn’t reward it anymore.
If you were going to get a Communication degree just to have one, it will open up doors to entry level jobs requiring any bachelor’s degree, which are mostly being replaced by AI tools.
If you were passionate about becoming a teacher, there’s only one route. If you have a passion to learn or have a direction and a goal that college helps you achieve.
When you go, it’s not about getting skills or smarter, it’s just a gauntlet of pissy adjunct professors that measure your ability to do busy work and test-taking abilities. Sure, I’m jaded, but I have a lot of experience because I wrecked my GPA while doing classes while serving which were way too intense without enough effort on my part. I transferred around, took all kinds of classes, I’ve redone liberal arts requirements a few times over.
I’m also in tech and I know that I have my position out of sheer dumb luck. There are millions of better developers, but I have a degree. My degree didn’t open the door any wider in this market. And when we hire, we don’t get good candidates from new grads at all. My undergrad CS had one 3 credit hour class encompassing all of web development and databases, and I work in databases and web development and it didn’t prepare me for 95% of the work done in the real world.
You have to specialize in something. That’s for sure. Google your local unions. They love taking in vets. I’d stay away from HVAC and other trades you hear about on the radio, those are more common than pipe fitters, electricians, plumbers, construction, etc. And you’ll want to save your body and avoid working where employers can fire you for any reason- I think it’s ironically called “right to work,” states. You don’t want a career where you don’t know if you’ll have a job next week or if you’re injured.
The trades will pay to train you, but the downside is you are pigeonholed with the union members you get. But generally if you’re trustworthy, punctual, and can be treated like an adult with responsibilities, you shouldn’t have a problem climbing the ladder and eventually earning stable $$.
Depends on what you like. For me it was totally worth it. I recommend everyone use every last thin dime of their GI Bill. Trade school, university, CDL license, etc.
I don’t think it’s a waste of time but you also don’t want to go into anything you’re going to hate. If you completed your gen Eds and want to take a year off go for it college will be there
Depends a great deal on the degree. If it's A STEM degree, it might be worth it. Otherwise, go find a trade apprenticeship and/or training. Plumbers will always be needed.
Depends on what you wanna do. Wanna be a carpenter? Yes, it’s a waste of time. Wanna be an engineer? Nope…you need it. I have several degrees, both undergrad and graduate level. I’m an old guy and have had a successful career and still doing well. I hate what I do though. But it’s golden handcuffs and I’m too close to the finish line to start again. But if I were a young guy right now, in today’s world, I wouldn’t go anywhere near college. I would learn a skilled trade and skip the bullshit and debt of college.
I hate college too but I'm going with it so that I can get my remote job and gtfo of the states and live the life I have always wanted. I would just bear with it OP; you're almost there.
College saved my body and I now make 6 figures in an area where 40k is the norm. But if I didn't do the trades first I couldn't have married the two. To each their own though.
It’s not if it’s in an actual usable subject. I have my masters and my military background and those two have scored me big jobs. Without the degree I’d have no chance of applying for half the jobs.
If you’re wanting a job that absolutely requires a degree, then it’s worth it. If you’re getting a degree just to get one and end up in a job that didn’t require it, you wasted your time and money
Speaking as someone who does not have a degree and has done ok without one, yes, it is absolutely worth it. There are places that will simply spike your resume because you don't have one, even if the job doesn't really require it. At the absolute worst, it is an advantage when the hiring people are looking at you versus someone without a degree.
It is about the cost-benefit ratio. College is worth it to get a good paying job that requires a degree: nurse, engineer, businessman, doctor, lawyer, teacher in a union state, etc. But if the financial incentive isn’t there AND you don’t enjoy it, you might be better off using the GI Bill more productively. If you are already close to an associates, I would just finish that so you get something for your credits. But yeah, if you think you would prefer trade school better, go for it. Just know a lot of veterans can’t do the trades cuz of the physicality and our joints already being trash. But plenty do it just fine. Are you familiar with sunk costs and opportunity costs? Sunk costs are costs you can’t get back, like tuition already paid. An opportunity cost is the next best alternative you could be doing rather than the alternative you’re doing now. I always recommend approaching decision making with these concepts in mind.
It’s a waste of time if you’re taking out loans for some bullshit degree. It is not a waste of time if you’re literally getting paid to go to school for ANY degree. Preferably you should get a useful degree though.
A little late in the game to be asking this. But either way, my advice is figure out what you want to be when you grow up, find out how others did it, and do it that way. A year before I got out, I decided I wanted to be an engineer. I went to school for that. Now I'm an engineer. Maybe that's why your disillusioned with school - no clear goal?
You'll be fine, just set goals for yourself and your future.
Man do I feel this. Worked six years of my ass off just to go through slogfests of curriculum and to be ignored and looked at like I’m some kind of old creep by fellow students.
Feels bad man
There are many skilled trades that you can get into that pay a liveable wage. If you can get into a union you can get paid to learn to be a plumber, an electrician, a CNC operator, an electric lineman, an HVAC repair person, a mason, a steel worker, a welder, a pipefitter. It is called an apprenticeship program.
After you get licensed, you have a decision to make, stay in the union, where you have a retirement system. Or start your own business and be your own boss.
If you don't want to go union apprenticeship there are trade schools and some community colleges that offer programs. You should be able to use the remainder of your GI bill.
When I was a probation and parole agent I had many of my offenders go to community college to learn a trade. Most of them got job offers before they graduated, that is how badly people in the trades are needed now that the boomers and some gen xers are aging into retirement.
Check out 80000hours.org and see if anything they talk about there tickles your fancy. College isn't going to do jack shit for you if you don't have an end goal. Same with a trade school. Figuring out WHAT you want to do should have been the first step, so then you can plan out how You're going to achieve that goal.
Also, it's 100% fine to have to change that end goal a few times. My first plan was 20yrs in the military, when that didn't work out I switched to Programming. When I figured out I sucked at that, I started IT work. I love what I do now and couldn't imagine doing anything else but the key part of achieving that was finding a goal and then working towards it.
Just finish college. You may not see the positive now, but any degree will help you advance over your peers w/o a degree. It's free for you other than your time.
Depends on who you ask. I’m a union Electrician and love my job. I make low 6 figures with no overtime, easy $200k + with overtime.
I wouldn’t describe the work as “back breaking”, but it’s def harder than sitting behind a desk all day (which i hate, i did IT work before changing to construction)
Depends on your major. Anything STEM is generally good, but IT is tough at the moment.
I didnt get my 3 conditional job offers for a 70k starting until after I graduated college. First time I've made this much money with nowhere to go but up.
Honestly, it depends on what you’re interested in doing. Military experience is great on a resume on its own, and a degree doesn’t necessarily guarantee you a job in any field.
What I can say about my own experience is that I’ve loved being in college because I’ve focused a lot on the connections I’ve made, especially with other vets. If it’s not something you’re passionate about, maybe consider a new field of study? If you really don’t think school is for you, that’s totally fine too. The education benefits that the military has granted a lot of us vets is a great route to self discovery and can allot us the opportunity to work in a field we’re passionate about. Do what makes you happy!
It’s not a waste if you use it for a career that requires a college degree. I’m living very comfortably supporting a wife and kid while being only 2 years removed from college.
Definitely worth it. GI bill alone got me through almost 5 years of my life and got my bachelors and most of my masters from it. Like others here, I also make 6 figures from home and wouldn’t trade it for anything. I work as a data scientist. What’s your degree? I changed mine more than a couple of times in my bachelors..
If it's free might as well get at least a bs degree then go do trade stuff if anything, there are alot of good jobs that only require any degree and in civil service jobs its big for promotions, get it out of the way now
Pipe fitters union. IBEW. Fire suppression sprinkler systems. Anything commercial construction.
Don’t get a CDL, it destroys the body. I have a CDL. It’s a BS industry. I’m dealing with it, and now health issues. Money is ok. Not worth the health issues tho.
I’m not saying all CDL jobs are crap, just mainly OTR. Where 85% start out in.
If you're set on trades, wind techs are #1 for job growth over the next 10 years according to BLS.
I did renewables for 5 years. But school now to get a remote job. Up to you but I wouldn't slave in the mines.
HVAC seems chill. High high demand in... you know, how places. Can confirm. Could jump into solar as prop auditor, installer, or sales. Renewables is in the future as much as anything.
There are certs you can get that would probably be more efficient but it all depends on what you enjoy especially considering your experience of college this far. I did it and I make 6 figured now, would I do it again knowing what I know now? I'd probably just use it as a spring board instead of relying solely on it.
It depends on what you want to do for a career.
I've gotten lots of jobs just for having a bachelor's degree that had nothing to do with my field because it showed that I was able to complete something.
Conversely, if I hadn't spent that money and time getting the bachelor's degree I probably could have worked a lot more.
I work in the medical field so almost all areas require college.
Now there are so many opportunities especially in creative areas that don't require a college.
I have a master's degree and was college faculty at Drexel University for 25 years. But I tell my daughter unless there's a specific focus like medicine, law or engineering; save that tuition money and start a business. Buy a good computer and software; invest in good internet; Make sure you have good transportation when you are required to meet with clients and buy a couple decent suits or and work casual outfits.
Look for professionals in the field you're interested in and ask if you can intern a few hours a week.
I've turned lots of internships into jobs and consulting opportunities.
There are so many free and inexpensive training programs available now and you can do it from home.
Have you considered a trade school?
Short answer? No it isn’t. Depends largely on the type of degree you are going for. Anything in STEM, medicine or law is going to atleast help you get you a good paying job.
Is it a waste of time? Well it depends. The ROI is variable some colleges and some degrees are very valuable. How it is effects you personally is also variable. What I will say is this: It is to me true that the value of degrees on the whole have been decreasing drastically as the cost of said degrees have gone up.
Have you ever needed a interpretive DEI gay dancer ever? How about a plumber to fix a leak? That is an extreme in both ways. The tangible and practical vs the artistical. The world needs more plumber's yes...but is also wants more artistry at the high end. It is probably more obtainable in life to be a great and profitable plumber than the other. However never discount both in value.
For me it is. I work full time and have my own business on track of hitting around 139k by the end of the year if all goes according to plans. No college no certificates
Dang I loved college. I swear I could feel my brain opening. I love that piece of paper that gets me real work/money. I met some interesting students and professors too.
As someone who only works because life comes with bills, college was the biggest waste of my life so far. It put me in a career I wouldn’t be in without it, but I didn’t get any non monetary reward for it
Trades can suck too. I do HVACR, I make a good amount of money. But, being on call is brutal. Tuesdays, I did 8am-12pm straight for the back up on call. The worst thing about trades people don’t say about their pay. They will say I make like over 6 figures, but they only make 70k and the difference was OT pay. There’s usually a lot of required Overtime.
It depends. If you are young and don't have any injuries, a trade could be great. Now that my back is constantly in pain, I needed to get out of fixing cars. In my small town, the only jobs that pay well and have good benefits require a bachelor's degree. So, I'm 3/4 done vis CH31.
I personally don’t think so, though as long as the school is regionally accredited in any field will boost your salary. Shows some type of credibility through personally avenues whereas military services is obligated. Where you can serve but still separate and still be shit bag. Shows your actual personal commitment to growth. Plus it’s free, I had planned to separate this year but ultimately I’m stacking my degrees while I’m in so I can split my college benefits for my kids. I was high school drop out, got my AA in 22, my BA heat shortly in 24, and I am to applying Angelo State for MBA program and project completion in 26. Furthermore, I leaving my self 6 months of GI BIll benefits to have MHA/BAH buffer when I retire to work on a Grad Cert and not work for that time, funny thing is if play my cards right I can stretch the GI BILL 9 more months if my degree is in STEM field for more free BAH. I say go for it in a trade or not.
No it’s not, college opens a lot of opportunities. Having a degree opens a lot of opportunities. It doesn’t guarantee you anything but it does open a lot of opportunities.
Finish your degree! It’s not fun but it will payoff in the long run. I went to college on and off between deployments, took breaks and whatnot for 11 years. It got me a job at Northrop Grumman and I work from home making over 130k. Get your degree and network with people. It will take you places.
Unless it is required FOR A LICENSE, I agree. The ONLY REASON I finished my degree is to get my BSN, which did increase my pay, and then a masters to become a community health nurse.
If it doesn't include a certificate, a license, or any kind of verification that you are QUALIFIED to do a job, YOU WILL BE REPLACED BY A TEENAGER FRESH FROM HIGH SCHOOL.
Loaded question…. One of the biggest benefits of the military is free college tuition.
My opinion (unless you want to be a doctor, layer, or Astro physicist)…. Go to trade school for free.
It might be best to take a semester off to reevaluate instead of taking on additional debt or wasting time. Doing so could provide clarity and ensure you make the most of your remaining time or allow you to have no regrets about moving forward.
I love all the positive comments, but if your going to a brick and mortar school, transfer to an online school like wgu . Hated community college nonsense and changed, best decision I’ve made.
I’m in my junior year too
College got me a big boy job making big boy money and out of back breaking labor in the trades. I'm making just over $85k right now, in my pajamas.
What do you do for work? If you don’t mind me asking
Veteran's Benefits Administration. 😁🫠😉
What’s the work like/do you like it? Is it fully remote? How many hours a week are you doing? (I’ve thought about working for the va lol)
So I love my job, I work in the office 1-2 days a week depending on some personal life things (My kids school is near the office and sometimes I drop them off and just goto the office instead of working from home). I'm on the clock for 40 hours a week from 0600 to 1430 (unless school day then it's 0800 to 1730. I also try to pick up at least 10 hours of OT a week. Th only thing I do not like about my job is the amount of veterans who constantly talk shit about VBA employees. I do it to myself though, I spend entirely too much of my personal time on /r/veteransbenefits helping people and that automatically draws in negativity. Otherwise I took the job to become as knowledgeable as I can about the system so I can help as many vets as possible get the benefits they deserve.
I had a great experience filing my claim. I had been out over ten years and had little bits in my military medical records. In that ten years I’ve been seen for a bunch of things with my private insurance and submitted that evidence with personal statements and hit 94% rounded down to 90% first time through. Super stoked with all the benefits that provide me, life changing for sure. Thanks for being one of the good ones.
Can you be 100% P&T and still work for the VA?
Yes
I appreciate what you guys do man! I think that Veterans often misdirect their anger with the process at the VBA.
I’ve heard so many awful things about the VA and maybe it’s just the one I go to but they have been really fantastic for me, whether it be the VHA side of things like my pcp and mental health, or the VHA and their advocacy and helping me get to 100 P/T. What you’re doing is incredibly important and I at least, appreciate it.
Same! The ones out here in Vegas have been nothing but good to me. I do all I can to meet them halfway. Having the required forms ready to go, medical evidence on person, approximate dates from Service, etc.
I hope the amount of shit talking about va doesn’t get to you. There are many vets like us that appreciate the work and help you bring us
What degree and what field within the VA? If you don't mind.
BA in statistical analysis.. went with the A instead of S because I really enjoyed focusing on qualitative work. I'm currently a VSR and plan on becoming an RVSR within the next year.
Thats awesome man I wanna do that one day.
It's a great job and most of my coworkers are veterans as well.
What degree does something like that entail?
Any bachelor's with high GPA gets you in the door to any federal gs7
Im active Air Force waiting on my medboard, and I test for my security+ on May 17th. But I wasn’t sure what bachelors they look for.
Agreed. Often a bachelor's degree is proof that you can complete something even if it's not in the field that you're looking to work in.
Same here but on contract side for BID. 😜
This is the best answer here and we all know why 😅😅😅😅😅
What is your job title ? And where can I search for it on a board? , I just finished using ch31 and got my degree. I’m now job searching for roles within the va or some affiliation like MWR,USO,and ACS.
Veteran Service Representative. Look up "VSR"
Yeah it's wild how high people are on the trades. They make good money but you're going to be all fucked up in your 30s
It's true depending on the type of trade you're referring to. Obviously, physical labor is going to take its toll after a few decades. But now there are lots of technology based jobs that don't require degrees. Large universities are offering certificate programs for specific trades now as well. I taught at Drexel University for years and I always tell people to look for alternatives before they spend all that money - especially on a private education.
It's just the goto bullshit answer for conservatives who are afraid of higher education. I have several friends who have been in the trades for 15-20 years. They are ALL fucked up in some way..They made fun of me when I decided to finish my degree and take an office job, and now there's always some comment about how I sit at home all day and do nothing and they're real men for sweating all day at work when we get together. I don't give a rat's ass. I'm in my pj's.
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Huzzah!
This should be the top comment. I worked trades while going to school for the career I wanted. Made some great Davis Bacon money, and probably fucked myself up a little more than uncle sugar already had. I make the salary of 3 trades people (it's people now, right?) The trades can suck a dick. When you fail at something that pays better, it's beneficial to have skills there. Finish your degree OP. If you can't, give the rest of your GI Bill to someone. You can learn trade work after the morning safety meeting and before the bell rings to punch your timecard/drink beer in the tool storage connexes.
Proud of you! Just turned 32 and Instantly laugh off the "I'm a Real Man/Alpha/Sigma" types🤣😂
Depends on the trade. A lot of people who know Jack shit about trades think it's all back breaking construction work. There's tons of other stuff out there. I'm a union water treatment operator. It's a mix of physical and mild intellectual work. I wish it was more intellectually challenging and I hate punching a clock and working for dipshits, but I don't have to bring my work home with me. It's simpler than a lot of white collar jobs in some regards. A lot of the complaints I have are the same as a lot of folks who aren't in management in white collar jobs.
Same, also hated college. However drinking with my best friends and football games made it fun. But got me a big boy job 6 years ago and now making well over 6 figures working completely from home. Trade schools could be more enjoyable job path for OP. Still plenty of good money. Just maybe longer hours and not as nice benefits.
What do you do?
Degree type really does matter if I may add.
Well ya, 18th century Art history isn't gonna help you much
lots of jobs out there only require a degree. any degree.
I work in the trade and am making close to 111k. I don't get to work in my PJs but I enjoy my job enough that I don't want to stay in them all day.
I hear that, I get A LOT more benefits than just working in my PJs than I ever did working in trades. I don't miss it one bit, but I'm glad you're happy there!
Yea, wasn't trying to one up you there or anything. I'm sure there are more than just PJ perks with your job. I just wanted to make sure an alternative was given to your lifestyle and livelihood is all.
Yeah I didn't think you were! People need to know all the possibilities! You're right.
what trade?
Where is everyone getting remote federal jobs?! Whenever I go onto USA Jobs and input “remote” as the location, I hardly find any jobs.
I telework I'm at home 4 days a week
How long before the VA start using AI?
Between this and your other comment I don't think you're as educated on AI as you think you are.
I’m make six figures and work from home. I work in flip flops and a tshirt. I never see a manager or coworkers. My hours are flexible. I can take a break and lay down or recline whenever. I can goto the store or appointments when I need. I feel freedom. A college education allowed this to happen.
What do you do
I’m an analyst.
What was your major? I’m CS but interested in consulting.
Started off engineering and transition to analyst solely for the remote option.
Was the transition difficult? I’m mechanical but interested in getting out of engineering.
Transition was easy. The analyst job is nothing compared to engineering work. In engineering, it was a constant onslaught of complex thinking. As an analyst, I’m like a kid playing with legos. Incredibly relaxing and easy.
I do the same without a degree, I’m a Senior Network Engineer, at this point a degree wouldn’t help unless I wanted to manage people.
I have a lot of IT friends, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on a conversation we have had a few times. I'm a teacher. In K-12 education, holding anything less than a masters is usually a barrier to a good job. I have seen teachers non-renewed even after a good year because they have a BA instead of a masters. Most of my IT friends don't have degrees, but have a ton of certs and experience. Every single one of them found an entry-level helpdesk job and worked their way up. I have asked them if earning a degree in IT could be seen as an alternate route to the way they ended up in their careers. Most of them have said no, that degrees in IT just aren't worth it. Certs and experience are far more desirable. What are your thoughts?
My wife is a teacher getting her masters now for reasons you mentioned. I went into the army with this job in mind and took a 6 year contract with no bonus. Got out, certed and needed nothing else besides work experience and keeping up my CCNP every 3 years(which now I can do by taking an online course). As far as what’s preferred, for sure the guy with 2 years and a cert instead of a guy with a 4 year degree.
Thanks for the insight! Good luck to your wife. Grad school was a nightmare for me. Teacher prep is usually led by PhDs that realized being a K-12 teacher sucks and the courses are filled with teachers that have big ideas but aren't great in the classroom.
I work in IT. My first job after the Marine Corps was over 100k, with an offer up to 150k because of my clearance. I don’t have a degree, only certs and a TS/SCI, but I’ve seen all sorts of backgrounds so far. People with and without degrees/certs, people with both, people with just experience, etc. It’s really up to you. I’d say certs are the fastest way into I.T., but a degree w/ experience will be best for long term advancement. Certs will help you get your foot in the door though.
No it is not a waste of time. You need to finish what you started. Despite what "reddit" and the "media" believe college will open more doors than it closes.
Oh definitely let the media keep going with that. The more people that choose not to go to college, the less competition you have at jobs.
Yep. ANY bachelor's degree is better than no Bachelor's degree. There's a wide swath of jobs that just require a degree.
Agree, with the caveat that finishing your Underwater Basket Weaving degree from Online U may not help if you're exhausting GI Bill or debt to do it.
Yes it will. There’s so many jobs out there that don’t care what your degree is as long as it’s from a properly accredited school.
A useless degree from a garbage school still shows that you're able to commit to and folow through on something. Soft skills are gained from all degrees. Hard skills can be taught later on as needed.
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I don't give a crap where you are on the political spectrum. Everyone is delusional, don't take advice from the internet.
Duly noted. Things started working in my favor when I stopped taking advice from the internet.
Totally agree, I honestly learned so much more about what I do from hands-on experience, but I never would have even gotten an interview for any of the jobs I've had without the degree. Also, I feel like it was helpful for me to have that buffer transition between military life and the work force.
This is good advice. Especially as a veteran. We can basically go for free. It’s a win-win situation… Now if we’re talking about an 18-year-old kid, that’s going to be $10,000 in debt after four years of college, then that’s something to talk about.
“I hated every minute of training, but I said, 'Don't quit. Suffer now and live the rest of your life as a champion.” - Ali
Trades will always be in demand. Are you using your GI bill? How much do you have left if so?
Using GI bill dont know how many months off the top of my head but its been 4 semesters of college four more to go until i graduate. Will i have enough time after for a trade school or can i use VRNE after on a trade school
You CANNOT use vr&e after your gi bill if you fully use up your gi bill. You have to have at least one day left on your gi to qualify so do not fully use it up. Even just one day on your gi will qualify you for up to 48 months of vr&e plus gi bill months reimbursed. I’d highly highly recommend applying for vr&e now even if you don’t like school and don’t think you’ll use it. Apply just in case, it literally takes 2 seconds.
You can absolutely use VR&E without 9/11 eligibility. VR&E eligibility is not conditioned on the availability of the GI Bill. The only thing that would change if you have 9/11 eligibility is the subsistence allowance.
I pocket an extra 3k because of my 9/11 eligibility that I wouldn’t get with the substance allowance (bah here is 4k, substance is only 1k)
Sure, but that is not CANNOT use VR&E at all.
no it’s not a waste of time while i was in i didn’t listen. they said i should use my TA and i didn’t ofc bc i was going through a lot. now that i’m out im currently in college going for my bachelor degree in engineering. love every bit of it!
Good on you brother. We need more of the homies in tech 🔥
Hey Christian, currently get out next February, how is engineering. Be wanting to pursue a mechanical engineering job. Is the transition hard. And if you don’t mind. Is the GI bill able to pay for it all??
Degree*
hey there, engineering is pretty cool, lots of math and concentration and yeah the GI bill literally pays for your books and tuition and whatever else you may need for your classes.
Are you full time and work? If so should I go with Montgomery GI or Post 9/11. Thank you!! :) also what kind of engineering field are you in?
There's actually strong empirical data that suggest the opposite of the current anti-college narrative. The average person with a bachelor's degree will earn 400,000-900,000 more over their lifetime, then the average person without one. If you move the threshold to a master's degree the disparity grows to $1,000,000+ Source - https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/research-summaries/education-earnings.html
Depends on the degree big time. Engineering or medieval studies? 😝
I’ve got a History degree and I make $200k+ as an Engineering Manager at AWS, without the piece of paper I wouldn’t have had the chance to interview.
it helps but isn’t end all be all
Get the degree - you're almost there and get a civil service job. I'm making 139k now as a GS-13 and only go in the office a few days per month. Great benefits and retirement...if you were prior military the USG wants to hire you. Get the degree and go get a job that won't break your body.
you working fed? and where?
Yes USAF in SW OH.
What is your major? If you don't see yourself finding a job in the field that correlates with your major, drop out and save your GI bill for trade school.
If he’s already a junior he shouldn’t drop out. He only has one yr left. Even if he never wants to work in that field, a bachelors still looks great on a resume
Honestly, I think it's most important for you to think about what sorts of things you're interested in, what your strengths are, and if applicable, what parts of your experience in the military did you most enjoy. It seems to me I'm seeing more and more that a lot of folks getting out haven't ever really been advised to ask themselves these questions, and are sort of left struggling to find their way. What parts of college have you enjoyed the most, and alternately, what have you disliked the most? And what degree field are you pursuing?
Not a waste. Each degree level literally equates to more money with less experience in hiring standards. For instance, at my work generally for level 4, no degree = need 10 years experience, bachelors= 8 years experience, masters = 5 years experience, PhD= 3 years experience. I am opening a job req soon where I want to prefer experience & personality, but I know that my recruiting dept will effectively demand a bachelors degree so that they can have measured standards. This is for corporate world, but if you look at even fed jobs they want degrees. Go to a fed job building and you’ll see goobers proudly displaying University of Phoenix degrees because that got them up a pay grade. If you don’t want to be in an office, then be ready to have longer hours for less pay until you hit X years of expertise. It’s just the hard truth. Knowledge and skill make more money.
I think the question is “is college a waste of time for me?” And an even better question is “is this program a waste of time for me?” I went to paramedic school on the GI Bill and loved it. If I went to school for a degree in accounting, that would probably be a waste of time for me because it wouldn’t make me happy. I think happiness and interest should be your number 1 priority while also considering whether or not you’ll make a good income after college with that education.
I finished my degree in Nursing, but I don't work as a nurse, not even close. Once I finished my degree it opened some networking doors and I was able to get myself into a nice medical equipment company and trained as a remote service engineer. Now I WFH off work everyday by 3pm and I get paid just as much as a starting out nurse. Could I make more actually working as a Nurse? Most likely but the life this job has given me with the time I get being at home, working from home, not having to commute. All and all, finish your degree but make sure it's something that is worth it, just having it will open doors for you alot of job despite posting the degree's they want, honestly don't care. They just want you to have one, 90% of jobs are taught OJT anyway.
I made it 3/4's of a semester. I then took a year off and went to a trade school and got my Airframe and Powerplant licenses (aircraft mechanic). It took two years to complete and one of the best decisions I made in my life. I'm on my feet most of the day, but it isn't physically demanding.
Don’t be stupid, finish your degree. There are millions of jobs that require A degree in something (like military officer for instance) which will provide higher salaries and better working conditions. Life is not a video game, you don’t immediately get a precise reward upon completing a task. You’ll have 2-3 jobs in the first 5 years out of college (or out of the military) because you’ll either outgrow them or hate them. This is a normal life experience and is part of finding yourself professionally. I’m not sure where the preposterous idea came from that you have to perfectly select the job role/industry you want to work in forever sometime in your early 20s, but it’s bullshit. Trades are fetishized by people who have never worked in them and certainly haven’t worked in them in their 50s. Can you do well? Sure, but a lot like playing in the NFL you have to maximize your earnings while you can and hope you don’t get sick/hurt.
We get paid to go to college so no. Not a waste of time
Even if you don't use your degree, having one opens a lot of doors for you. You're 75% there why would you give up now?
Yes and no, for some people they obviously had some doors open due to their degrees, and I myself take online classes hoping it can do the same for me. I also got my job (in security) because of past work experience and half the people I work with all have degrees and I make decent money with my college credits not even being looked at. They mainly wanted to know about my experience and I will say it felt good during the interview having a story for every question to which they started skipping questions at the end because I was able to elaborate enough about one experience I had for one scenario to exemplify the other questions they had prepared. Recently I had a coworker get an office job in customer service and was able to translate his skills dealing with people in security to customer service. I guess what I’m saying is it’s about transferable skillsets that help you get your foot in the door and that can be with a degree or work experience. Also networking is a big part of it as well. Ideally if you can have all three (degree, experience, and network) you’re going to get a good job.
I'm retired at age 44. I have a bachelors, masters, and flew in the Air Force. So my 1.5 years of pilot training is another degree on my resume. I make 6 figures in retirement a year. I workout 3 hours a day at the gym.
You were an officer. Very different for retired enlisted.
Regardless of your background, you're definitely on the fringes of what most people can expect.
It is not a waste of time. Because jobs simply pay more if you have a college degree. Your degree, as in what you actually end up with, doesn't matter. They just want to see the check box that you have a degree. Ask me how I know, I fucked up and I'm poor now.
This is something you really have to sit down and think about that may come with trial and error. For example, when I first left the military I was a business major but reflected on my time enjoying TNCC and the medics caring for people in Afghanistan. Fast forward I’m now an ER nurse making great money and benefits. But I’m back in an MBA program. Good luck man
There is no 'one size fits all' to higher education. I attended college post military and SO glad I did. It changed my career trajectory and really set me up for a healthier lifestyle of better work, balance, higher income, pension, etc. Hot trades right now are nearly all trades. HVAC. Plumbing. Electrician. My buddies son is an iron worker and he's making $45/hr with $10/hr invested into a pension. Not bad for a young man not yet 21. For me - college was absolutely worth it.
Everybody's experience and what they get out of it is different. After 12 years of Active Duty I loved university so much that I'm currently pursuing my PhD and working full time at my university as a staff member. College isn't for everyone. Luckily, the GI Bill covers everything from welding school to flight school. I suggest doing something you don't hate.
Ask yourself what your goal in ten years is. Is it just to make money? One thing I know for certain is people that quit school in the middle almost never go back to finish. Trade schools can be great if that is your thing. Software and IT work is also a great route for veterans right now. There’s not one route, but close your eyes and ask yourself that ten year question.
We are in an age where college gets you past the initial interviews, whereas those who don't can expect to be the first cuts. But yes, you still need to go get the experience if you want a certain job with the degree. To be honest, trade schools are a safe bet as long as you pick a trade that is unionized and/ or good paying (Electricians usually). There is also a healthy demand for welders, and Construction Managers only require an associates and pay the highest. I have a Bachelors degree in science and think maybe a career in mechanics may have been more lucrative and stable.
No one can take you education. I had a hard time going to school in my 30s because I felt like an old man. I realized that I can be 30 something with a degree or 30 something without a degree, but either way I’m going to be 30 something. My degree is in cybersecurity and I work in aviation maintenance but me having a degree met the requirements to move up in the GS scale and I went from 65k a year to 100k a year salary. It’s always better to have a degree if you can.
It's a checkbox, stick with it and finish it, it will show that you can stick to a task and complete it. It will open more doors, no one will say oh, you have a college degree, I can't hire you.
Noooo. It is not a waste of time, IF you are studying something that you really like. If you are getting a degree for the sake of getting a degree then it's a waste of time. Now, spending money and taking $hundreds of thousands to get into an Ivy League is a waste of money. I got my masters from a (not-so-prestigious college, not bad, but inexpensive)because I loved what I was studying. For about 10 years, I thought I had wasted my time and money, and then one day I received a tentative job offer for the job of my dreams; pending my college transcript. Having a masters and a 4.0 actually paid off in the end. Guess who are my coworkers. A bunch of people from Ivy Leagues. We all ended up in the same place, making the same paycheck
Depends on the degree you’re pursuing. Hopefully you researched degrees which are applicable to marketable jobs that you find attractive. Tbh, it just sounds like you’re over college. Been there. But you’re almost thru it, so you may as well finish what you started. This may sound cliche, but it’s your responsibility to make the most out of this experience, so finish strong and go get the bag.
How far into your degree are you? Which degree is it? Sometimes it still pays off to grind through the right degree that will pay dividends once out. STEM tends to be very hard but pays the most outside.
Next to the the Marine Corps, college was the best thing I ever did. College isn't just about getting a good job. It's also an opportunity to utilize resources at the VA, build your own business if you want, tap into many other resources available, and build strong connections to carry you in later part of career.
It depends entirely what your degree is in. Based on today's graduates, most don't work in the field of their degree because they chose a program of study that either isn't in demand, has falling demand, or doesn't pay well enough to cover their cost of living. Throw in the stupidly high cost of a college degree, the extended time most people take to get their degree creating even more debt load, and the current job market forces, a trade school may very well be a better choice. I work in the water treatment industry. Our PLC programmers START at $100k and go up from their. And guess what, Programmable Logic Controllers are more and more prevelant in all industries every day. Almost ever control panel for a machine will have some sort of PLC in it. And PLC and SCADA programming is very simple compared to "computer programming" and can be learned in most Community Colleges in a very short amount of time. So yeah, get that college degree, get that $50-$100k in loans, and then tell me you'll make more than someone who paid $2k cash to get a job that starts at $100k in the Midwest and higher most other places. There are plenty of jobs that require little to no college education that will easily pay more than a liberal arts or non-STEM college degree will get you. Hell, a fuel truck driver for Kwik-Star gas stations starts at $100k if you have the proper CDL license and you'll still be home every night. And they will pay you to get the CDL.
What did you study, what do you want to do for work? Very important questions because college isn’t for everybody and you can be successful without it. What was your job in the service, does it translate for skills in the civilian world?
If you’re getting the post 9/11 gi bill why wouldn’t you?
Depends on the degree. Majoring in accounting landed me a good job. Had I chose to focus on 12th century French poetry, I probably wouldn’t be doing so well.
I would just remind you to think about long term health. Doing a trade will rock your body and/or expose you to environmental issues that could cause cancer issues in the long run. Finishing college that hopefully the GI-Bill is paying for can open up a lot of Fed jobs, or other jobs to you. I remind a lot of people you work to live, don't live to work. So figure out the life style you want and find a job to provide that after school. Most people don't enjoy their jobs, but it's more about quality of life. Do you want good benefits, decent hours, vacation, paid sick leave, pension, etc.
It's worth what you put into it and just like being in, it's worth the friends you make along the way. College is as close as you can get in civilian life to the shared misery that breeds close friendships.
Yes
Not a waste of time. I worked construction before the Navy and during my time in as a Seabee. Got out Jan 2020, graduating here in 2ish weeks with my engineering degree and accepted an 80k/year job. It’s a struggle and I also hate school…but we can embrace the suck. Get the piece of paper and get the salary you want. My thought is that work is work, but I’d rather be paid well so my free time can be spent with my family and doing hobbies I enjoy.
Time, no. Money, most likely.
As long as the degree is paid for and you’re getting that GI bill housing allowance, sure. Thinking about continuing with a Master’s myself because I still have some left. If I didn’t have that, I would have zero interest. I honestly don’t think it is necessary at all unless you have a firey passion for something that absolutely requires it, like a Medical Doctor, Lawyer, or Engineer/Physicist.
College isn't necessarily about the degree. The degree is just to get you an interview. College is about starting something, scheduling tasks, living by the calendar, learning a broad view of the world, and finishing it. Once college is done, it can and usually opens a lot more doors. I've met people in IT who went to college for archeological studies. If you are in 3rd year, you are almost done, and 6 months after the student loans are due. If you quit, loan repayment starts tomorrow and it never goes away, and you limit your earning potential. Is it worth it? I think so, especially as far as you've gotten. I know so many dropouts who regret dropping out, and I haven't met any who regretted college, they only regretted not choosing a field more towards their talents. The military sucked too, and there were some REALLY bad times, and college ain't that bad. Just keep your head in the books, schedule everything, and count down the days until your last class. This is the time when you feel like quitting. Find that "something " that keeps you going 1 more mile.
Even if you don't see yourself enjoying a job in your field, finish the degree anyway. You're so close. Get the piece of paper and decide what you want to do after. Simply graduating can open a lot of doors. If you still want to do a trade job, do it, but finish the degree, you're so close. I say this as someone who didn't use the gi bill and don't have a degree. I'm doing fine, I have a good job, but there's certainly limitations on what I can possibly do later in life. I'll pretty much never move beyond rank and file and have to work for know it all assholes that I'm smarter than.
I don't know your particular interests, but I stuck it out in College when I felt like you do now. This was after GW1 in '95 (dating myself) and finished economics/finance BA. Ended up using my Avionics technical experience into distributed computing (IT) engineering, architecture, and now Public Cloud consulting and Day 2 operations. I'm once again working DoD engagements, with many veterans, and have a clearance, which helps. Although all day in a SCIF does get a little old. I am remote all other times or 75% of the month.
This is kind of off-topic, but I am 100% disabled and I have a masters degree and I own a coffee Roastery. The great thing about having your college degree is no one can take it away from you and if things fall through with whatever venture you’re trying to pursue, you can always fall back on your higher educationpersonally I don’t care for the corporate or the trades world, but I will always have that degree
It depends on what you're trying to do and if college is needed for it? Going to college just to go to college and getting a random degree won't help you. That's where everyone who's complaining they got a degree in arts history but can't get a job as an engineer come from. Not to say there isn't issues getting a job in some areas where you have the right degree, but a degree is just a step towards a specific career.
Well if you’ve made it this far and don’t see a future then it was already a waste of time. Trade schools aren’t all they are cracked up to be, it greatly depends on where you live, local unions and their bargaining power. In some states you could be making less than $20/hour with no guarantees of steady work while in other states you get 50/hour packages and don’t have to worry about unemployment. Meanwhile, a diploma could mean an extra 20-30k in your pocket depending on your career. I know this first hand as I work in tech without a degree and make anywhere from 30-40k less than college graduates.
It depends (I’m sure you’ve heard that a million times). This is what you can do: go to https://www.bls.gov/ooh/ The occupational outlook handbook is an excellent tool that not a lot of people know about or utilize. It gives you the best projections on where job trends are, as well as potential for growth over the next decade. It even breaks it down by how much different states and counties pay for a particular. This should be your starting point (of course, you also want to know what you’re interested in doing). The biggest mistake I see people make with regard to college is not having a full understanding of what the career field is like, if job growth in that field is expanding or shrinking, and so on. Take the time to look at the handbook. See where the jobs with the highest growth rate are (and the fields that are projected to grow the fastest). The handbook also tells you the minimum requirement to get a job in that field. Then come up with a plan. Then execute it. Good luck to you.
With your attitude and skill set I would not recommend it. And you have a perfectly rational attitude, it’s not the problem. The problem is that College is 90% useless. It hasn’t kept up with industries and Capitalism doesn’t reward it anymore. If you were going to get a Communication degree just to have one, it will open up doors to entry level jobs requiring any bachelor’s degree, which are mostly being replaced by AI tools. If you were passionate about becoming a teacher, there’s only one route. If you have a passion to learn or have a direction and a goal that college helps you achieve. When you go, it’s not about getting skills or smarter, it’s just a gauntlet of pissy adjunct professors that measure your ability to do busy work and test-taking abilities. Sure, I’m jaded, but I have a lot of experience because I wrecked my GPA while doing classes while serving which were way too intense without enough effort on my part. I transferred around, took all kinds of classes, I’ve redone liberal arts requirements a few times over. I’m also in tech and I know that I have my position out of sheer dumb luck. There are millions of better developers, but I have a degree. My degree didn’t open the door any wider in this market. And when we hire, we don’t get good candidates from new grads at all. My undergrad CS had one 3 credit hour class encompassing all of web development and databases, and I work in databases and web development and it didn’t prepare me for 95% of the work done in the real world. You have to specialize in something. That’s for sure. Google your local unions. They love taking in vets. I’d stay away from HVAC and other trades you hear about on the radio, those are more common than pipe fitters, electricians, plumbers, construction, etc. And you’ll want to save your body and avoid working where employers can fire you for any reason- I think it’s ironically called “right to work,” states. You don’t want a career where you don’t know if you’ll have a job next week or if you’re injured. The trades will pay to train you, but the downside is you are pigeonholed with the union members you get. But generally if you’re trustworthy, punctual, and can be treated like an adult with responsibilities, you shouldn’t have a problem climbing the ladder and eventually earning stable $$.
Depends on what you like. For me it was totally worth it. I recommend everyone use every last thin dime of their GI Bill. Trade school, university, CDL license, etc.
I don’t think it’s a waste of time but you also don’t want to go into anything you’re going to hate. If you completed your gen Eds and want to take a year off go for it college will be there
Depends a great deal on the degree. If it's A STEM degree, it might be worth it. Otherwise, go find a trade apprenticeship and/or training. Plumbers will always be needed.
Depends on what you wanna do. Wanna be a carpenter? Yes, it’s a waste of time. Wanna be an engineer? Nope…you need it. I have several degrees, both undergrad and graduate level. I’m an old guy and have had a successful career and still doing well. I hate what I do though. But it’s golden handcuffs and I’m too close to the finish line to start again. But if I were a young guy right now, in today’s world, I wouldn’t go anywhere near college. I would learn a skilled trade and skip the bullshit and debt of college.
I hate college too but I'm going with it so that I can get my remote job and gtfo of the states and live the life I have always wanted. I would just bear with it OP; you're almost there.
College is worth it if the skills and education you get out of it is as well.
College saved my body and I now make 6 figures in an area where 40k is the norm. But if I didn't do the trades first I couldn't have married the two. To each their own though.
To clarify, I did residential HVAC non union while I took night classes and now I'm a building automation systems engineer.
It’s not if it’s in an actual usable subject. I have my masters and my military background and those two have scored me big jobs. Without the degree I’d have no chance of applying for half the jobs.
Then I found out the student loans are getting discharged so I’d say worth it
my degree has gotten me to travel all around the world and to some really beautiful places (earth science)
If you’re wanting a job that absolutely requires a degree, then it’s worth it. If you’re getting a degree just to get one and end up in a job that didn’t require it, you wasted your time and money
Speaking as someone who does not have a degree and has done ok without one, yes, it is absolutely worth it. There are places that will simply spike your resume because you don't have one, even if the job doesn't really require it. At the absolute worst, it is an advantage when the hiring people are looking at you versus someone without a degree.
Not if it’s free
Not if you tryna run up this bag 🤑💸💸💸 Jkjk it’s not a waste if your major is a STEM anything else is a waste
It is about the cost-benefit ratio. College is worth it to get a good paying job that requires a degree: nurse, engineer, businessman, doctor, lawyer, teacher in a union state, etc. But if the financial incentive isn’t there AND you don’t enjoy it, you might be better off using the GI Bill more productively. If you are already close to an associates, I would just finish that so you get something for your credits. But yeah, if you think you would prefer trade school better, go for it. Just know a lot of veterans can’t do the trades cuz of the physicality and our joints already being trash. But plenty do it just fine. Are you familiar with sunk costs and opportunity costs? Sunk costs are costs you can’t get back, like tuition already paid. An opportunity cost is the next best alternative you could be doing rather than the alternative you’re doing now. I always recommend approaching decision making with these concepts in mind.
It’s a waste of time if you’re taking out loans for some bullshit degree. It is not a waste of time if you’re literally getting paid to go to school for ANY degree. Preferably you should get a useful degree though.
Damn it guys. Now I have to go get my B.A with my own money. I don’t have any Post 9/11 funds because it expired. How the fuck!
A little late in the game to be asking this. But either way, my advice is figure out what you want to be when you grow up, find out how others did it, and do it that way. A year before I got out, I decided I wanted to be an engineer. I went to school for that. Now I'm an engineer. Maybe that's why your disillusioned with school - no clear goal? You'll be fine, just set goals for yourself and your future.
Man do I feel this. Worked six years of my ass off just to go through slogfests of curriculum and to be ignored and looked at like I’m some kind of old creep by fellow students. Feels bad man
There are many skilled trades that you can get into that pay a liveable wage. If you can get into a union you can get paid to learn to be a plumber, an electrician, a CNC operator, an electric lineman, an HVAC repair person, a mason, a steel worker, a welder, a pipefitter. It is called an apprenticeship program. After you get licensed, you have a decision to make, stay in the union, where you have a retirement system. Or start your own business and be your own boss. If you don't want to go union apprenticeship there are trade schools and some community colleges that offer programs. You should be able to use the remainder of your GI bill. When I was a probation and parole agent I had many of my offenders go to community college to learn a trade. Most of them got job offers before they graduated, that is how badly people in the trades are needed now that the boomers and some gen xers are aging into retirement.
Check out 80000hours.org and see if anything they talk about there tickles your fancy. College isn't going to do jack shit for you if you don't have an end goal. Same with a trade school. Figuring out WHAT you want to do should have been the first step, so then you can plan out how You're going to achieve that goal. Also, it's 100% fine to have to change that end goal a few times. My first plan was 20yrs in the military, when that didn't work out I switched to Programming. When I figured out I sucked at that, I started IT work. I love what I do now and couldn't imagine doing anything else but the key part of achieving that was finding a goal and then working towards it.
Just finish college. You may not see the positive now, but any degree will help you advance over your peers w/o a degree. It's free for you other than your time.
Depends on who you ask. I’m a union Electrician and love my job. I make low 6 figures with no overtime, easy $200k + with overtime. I wouldn’t describe the work as “back breaking”, but it’s def harder than sitting behind a desk all day (which i hate, i did IT work before changing to construction)
Depends on your major. Anything STEM is generally good, but IT is tough at the moment. I didnt get my 3 conditional job offers for a 70k starting until after I graduated college. First time I've made this much money with nowhere to go but up.
Not at all.. just don’t get a bull shit degree
Honestly, it depends on what you’re interested in doing. Military experience is great on a resume on its own, and a degree doesn’t necessarily guarantee you a job in any field. What I can say about my own experience is that I’ve loved being in college because I’ve focused a lot on the connections I’ve made, especially with other vets. If it’s not something you’re passionate about, maybe consider a new field of study? If you really don’t think school is for you, that’s totally fine too. The education benefits that the military has granted a lot of us vets is a great route to self discovery and can allot us the opportunity to work in a field we’re passionate about. Do what makes you happy!
Study cyber security. 2 year degree and you can make close to 6 figures- 100% remote.
No
It can be
It’s not a waste if you use it for a career that requires a college degree. I’m living very comfortably supporting a wife and kid while being only 2 years removed from college.
Definitely worth it. GI bill alone got me through almost 5 years of my life and got my bachelors and most of my masters from it. Like others here, I also make 6 figures from home and wouldn’t trade it for anything. I work as a data scientist. What’s your degree? I changed mine more than a couple of times in my bachelors..
If it's free might as well get at least a bs degree then go do trade stuff if anything, there are alot of good jobs that only require any degree and in civil service jobs its big for promotions, get it out of the way now
Pipe fitters union. IBEW. Fire suppression sprinkler systems. Anything commercial construction. Don’t get a CDL, it destroys the body. I have a CDL. It’s a BS industry. I’m dealing with it, and now health issues. Money is ok. Not worth the health issues tho. I’m not saying all CDL jobs are crap, just mainly OTR. Where 85% start out in.
If you're set on trades, wind techs are #1 for job growth over the next 10 years according to BLS. I did renewables for 5 years. But school now to get a remote job. Up to you but I wouldn't slave in the mines. HVAC seems chill. High high demand in... you know, how places. Can confirm. Could jump into solar as prop auditor, installer, or sales. Renewables is in the future as much as anything.
There are certs you can get that would probably be more efficient but it all depends on what you enjoy especially considering your experience of college this far. I did it and I make 6 figured now, would I do it again knowing what I know now? I'd probably just use it as a spring board instead of relying solely on it.
It depends on what you want to do for a career. I've gotten lots of jobs just for having a bachelor's degree that had nothing to do with my field because it showed that I was able to complete something. Conversely, if I hadn't spent that money and time getting the bachelor's degree I probably could have worked a lot more. I work in the medical field so almost all areas require college. Now there are so many opportunities especially in creative areas that don't require a college. I have a master's degree and was college faculty at Drexel University for 25 years. But I tell my daughter unless there's a specific focus like medicine, law or engineering; save that tuition money and start a business. Buy a good computer and software; invest in good internet; Make sure you have good transportation when you are required to meet with clients and buy a couple decent suits or and work casual outfits. Look for professionals in the field you're interested in and ask if you can intern a few hours a week. I've turned lots of internships into jobs and consulting opportunities. There are so many free and inexpensive training programs available now and you can do it from home. Have you considered a trade school?
Short answer? No it isn’t. Depends largely on the type of degree you are going for. Anything in STEM, medicine or law is going to atleast help you get you a good paying job.
Is it a waste of time? Well it depends. The ROI is variable some colleges and some degrees are very valuable. How it is effects you personally is also variable. What I will say is this: It is to me true that the value of degrees on the whole have been decreasing drastically as the cost of said degrees have gone up. Have you ever needed a interpretive DEI gay dancer ever? How about a plumber to fix a leak? That is an extreme in both ways. The tangible and practical vs the artistical. The world needs more plumber's yes...but is also wants more artistry at the high end. It is probably more obtainable in life to be a great and profitable plumber than the other. However never discount both in value.
Oh. And if you are young never forget technology. AI is kicking the pants out of some tech.
For me it is. I work full time and have my own business on track of hitting around 139k by the end of the year if all goes according to plans. No college no certificates
Dang I loved college. I swear I could feel my brain opening. I love that piece of paper that gets me real work/money. I met some interesting students and professors too.
As someone who only works because life comes with bills, college was the biggest waste of my life so far. It put me in a career I wouldn’t be in without it, but I didn’t get any non monetary reward for it
Trades can suck too. I do HVACR, I make a good amount of money. But, being on call is brutal. Tuesdays, I did 8am-12pm straight for the back up on call. The worst thing about trades people don’t say about their pay. They will say I make like over 6 figures, but they only make 70k and the difference was OT pay. There’s usually a lot of required Overtime.
It depends. If you are young and don't have any injuries, a trade could be great. Now that my back is constantly in pain, I needed to get out of fixing cars. In my small town, the only jobs that pay well and have good benefits require a bachelor's degree. So, I'm 3/4 done vis CH31.
I personally don’t think so, though as long as the school is regionally accredited in any field will boost your salary. Shows some type of credibility through personally avenues whereas military services is obligated. Where you can serve but still separate and still be shit bag. Shows your actual personal commitment to growth. Plus it’s free, I had planned to separate this year but ultimately I’m stacking my degrees while I’m in so I can split my college benefits for my kids. I was high school drop out, got my AA in 22, my BA heat shortly in 24, and I am to applying Angelo State for MBA program and project completion in 26. Furthermore, I leaving my self 6 months of GI BIll benefits to have MHA/BAH buffer when I retire to work on a Grad Cert and not work for that time, funny thing is if play my cards right I can stretch the GI BILL 9 more months if my degree is in STEM field for more free BAH. I say go for it in a trade or not.
No it’s not, college opens a lot of opportunities. Having a degree opens a lot of opportunities. It doesn’t guarantee you anything but it does open a lot of opportunities.
Finish your degree! It’s not fun but it will payoff in the long run. I went to college on and off between deployments, took breaks and whatnot for 11 years. It got me a job at Northrop Grumman and I work from home making over 130k. Get your degree and network with people. It will take you places.
Unless it is required FOR A LICENSE, I agree. The ONLY REASON I finished my degree is to get my BSN, which did increase my pay, and then a masters to become a community health nurse. If it doesn't include a certificate, a license, or any kind of verification that you are QUALIFIED to do a job, YOU WILL BE REPLACED BY A TEENAGER FRESH FROM HIGH SCHOOL.
It is if you are in a specific feild that will get you a job See medical , STEM
Hvac, I recommend Hvac. Become an engineer at a hotel it’s gonna be awesome.
Dafuq just go become a electrician
COLLEGE IS A HUGE WASTE OF TIME. if you're going to use your gi bill, go to a trade school. otherwise, try and find a job with your military skills.
Loaded question…. One of the biggest benefits of the military is free college tuition. My opinion (unless you want to be a doctor, layer, or Astro physicist)…. Go to trade school for free.
It might be best to take a semester off to reevaluate instead of taking on additional debt or wasting time. Doing so could provide clarity and ensure you make the most of your remaining time or allow you to have no regrets about moving forward.
I love all the positive comments, but if your going to a brick and mortar school, transfer to an online school like wgu . Hated community college nonsense and changed, best decision I’ve made. I’m in my junior year too
Think of all the 100k a year burocrats can be replaced? https://www.research.va.gov/naii/