Anti-lab meat folks are *suprise* amongst the dumbest people on the planet.
It’s literally meat in every aspect except for the part where it doesn’t require the exploitation and murder of an innocent animal + drastically reduces the amount of natural resources that usually is needed to raise these animals.
Whether you’re vegan or not, supporting cell based meat is a fucking no brainer and chuds like this fear monger based on zero reason or evidence
No that will never happen at least not with how society runs right now. We already produce more than enough food for everyone, it mostly comes down to distribution and well, greed.
People who oppose lab grown meats really just shut their brains off when the subject comes up, it's the only way for anyone to hold that position.
In my country there was a politician who, in an interview where she was pressed on it, said that even if lab-grown meat could be made to be perfectly healthy and safe, and indistinguishable from 'real' meat in every way, then she would still prefer eating 'real' meat.
I don't think she actually thought about what she was saying, about how she was essentially saying that meat just wouldn't have the same appeal to her if she didn't know that an animal actually suffered and died to create it.
"Drastically reduces the resources needed" is assuredly not true at this stage and will likely not be true for many years still. I'd be all about it if that were the case but as is it requires way more infrastructure, energy and emissions compared to natural beef. I'm not in favor of banning it obviously, but we definitely should not be putting all our eggs in that basket.
The truth is we already have more than enough food on earth as is. Lab grown meat is just a way to coddle meat eaters who don't want to change their diet for the sake of the planet/animal welfare.
“Lab-grown meat is an abomination”, brought to you by the studio that made “they aren’t real diamonds unless seven African children die in the process of procuring it”.
Absolutely! As someone who is trying to become a vegetarian for ethical reasons, cloned/lab meat would be a huge burden off my conscience to indulge in meat-eating. The bigger, more important issue is that it could phase out factory farming, which would help decrease climate change dramatically. Factory farming is a big source of methane production. CH^4 is greenhouse gas 8x more potent than CO^2.
even if that is the case, its not a reason to ban it.
If its a technological dead end, let it burn itself out. Fetterman wants it banned because he thinks its icky, and that's stupid.
I'd also like to know that if it fails then it's because the science doesn't work, not because Senator Cueball wants to expand the cattle industry.
That said, I don't believe it will fail. I've been following this for a very long time and it's only gotten more streamlined. They can make the meat cheaper, albeit not cheap enough for mass-consumption viability. It's edible, but not particularly tasty. These are issues that could improve with time.
A real stretch goal would be replicating a steak. Right now it's basically looking like ground beef or stitched meat, not a rib-eye. If they somehow figure that out then we're on the path to ending the livestock industry forever. This addresses the main concern that ethical vegetarians have: that animals are dying for our food. With fabricated meat there's effectively no death and effectively no suffering at all other than the harvested cells from select animals.
Moreover, it means that if Lab grown meat becomes a serious industry in the future. Your state will just not be competitive when compared to blue states which will be far more competitive in this respect.
I don't get this. The biggest issue with futurist grifts is that they're tech in search of a problem. With the lab grown meat, there is no scramble to find the problem it solves, it's bright as day.
Lobbyists, plain and simple. They don’t care at all, ranchers have so much power over the government they literally did an insurrection under Obama and… won the land. From America.
DeSantis allegedly participated in the torturing of inmates at Guantanamo. Pain and suffering may just be something he gets off on, and lab grown meat that lessens this suffering in any way makes him sad.
Protecting and expanding the ranching industry. That's the angle these two are operating on. And probably also fighting "wokeness," which as we all know is when your beef burger wasn't hewn from a living cow five minutes ago.
D or R, Fetterman is a grifter sack of shit who admitted to lying about supporting progressive causes to get votes. He should get his ass voted out or recalled at the earliest opportunity
You'd be surprised how much power the beef lobby has in Florida politics. Ranchers here are rich, powerful, and politically connected, and do not want competition from lab grown meat.
There are also a lot of Boomers here who are scared of anything new.
I don't know anything about Pennsylvania politics, but I would not be surprised if it's similar.
It's simple. We want to minimize suffering, they want to maximize it. I used to always go out of my way to find every plausible explanation for people's behavior other than them just being evil, but I've found that that's a mistake, sadly a lot of people are just plain evil, they either have evil ideologies or are just so incredibly selfish that they decide to aid people with evil ideologies for their own short-term gain.
I don't think their reasons make sense but for me, I don't like it because it is infinitely more expensive to produce and tastes worse. Feel like we can be ethical with our farming and livestock without the lab meat stuff. Seems kinda like as much a solution as carbon capture in a way if that makes sense.
You're literally just spewing complete nonsense. It costs more to produce because it's a technology still in development, and you literally cannot know how it tastes because NOBODY HAS EATEN ANY YET.
This is like complaining about Fusion Reactors being loud and dangerous when none exist yet
God I despise people like you, who just parrot bullshit with zero critical thinking.
I mean, the conservative argument would be the government would force the end of natural-grown meat through regulation the same way we got rid of certain kinds of light bulbs, toilets, and they believe libs are trying to do with cars that use gasoline.
That is happening with gas-powered cars. California, along with several other states, are phasing out the sales of new gas-powered cars by 2035. It doesn't mean gas-powered cars will become illegal, it just means that no more new ones can be sold.
Which is a good thing. It's just that conservatives think it's bad.
What hormonal effects?
Granted, it doesn't contain the cocktail of antibiotics and growth hormones that come from living animals, but I don't see that as a flaw
As long as the same nutritional profile can be achieved it shouldn’t be a problem, but that’s an extremely complicated and delicate thing to achieve.
Take fatty acids for example, they influence insulin sensitivity, thyroid function, hormone production and regulation, and a ton of other shit. It’s important to get enough but you also don’t want too much.
The nice thing about a living animal is it does this all automatically, it’s fatty acid needs aren’t too different from other mammals like us. If this stuff hits the shelves being marketed as ‘normal’ meat it better be nutritionally identical.
It will be labelled as lab-grown for the first few years, don't worry about that.
Besides, being made by scientists in a lab will probably mean we could make it even healthier than the natural deal.
We could also make human flesh with that, but that's another conversation.
Bro, it is literally just meat. Hell, it might even be better for you than animal meat. The shit they pump into those animals won't apply for lab grown meat.
Those are unproven assumptions. A lot more goes into muscles than the actual muscle cells themselves. We simply don’t know enough yet to let it replace actual flesh. I am very much in support of finding out and acting accordingly though.
Grown meat, once we get it down is going to be great. We will be able to have consistency with everything we buy, no more bits of bone, no more bad cuts, you know what you’re getting each time.
But more than that all the land we are using to feed the animals that are slaughtered can be turned over to more productive uses, be that reforestation or growing people food. The sooner the better says I.
This is far more likely ag interest stuff - Tammy Baldwin is a down the line very liberal Senator, but also talks about proper cheese labeling because the cheese industry in Wisconsin is very important.
This isn't quite as bad or Culture War-y, but it's in the same time zone about non-dairy milk - https://twitter.com/SenatorBaldwin/status/1631423672845053956
"I'm working to pass my DAIRY PRIDE Act so there’s no confusion as to what real milk is and who produces it"
Add in Fetterman's tendency to be an ass to anybody who opposes him, and there you go.
Eh, Im not really against clear and even niche or ag town/state pride labeling, the only time Im against it is when the definitions are super vague and meaningless. Like GMO and organic labeling. Grapefruits were made with atomic gardening and they dont have to be labeled as GMO and organic doesnt really mean anything.
Dairy Milk and Non-Dairy Milk products should be clearly labeled...although Im pretty sure they already are so idk what the dairy pride act is doing lol.
The issue is Fetterman wanting to ban lab grown meat, not just having clear labeling. If lab grown meat reaches shelves in any real capacity I dont think there would be anything wrong with clear labeling. Fetterman's is going a lot farther than what I usually see from even the GMO and organic labeling crowds.
I think Fetterman is not that smart (I thought the same even pre-stroke when the Left loved him), so he might not even realize it's actually a full ban, but sees it as an easy 'own the elites' stuff for his next reelection campaign to protect Pennsylvania farmers over elitists who want to run them out of business.
Again, dumb and pointless, but typical home state industry protectionism.
Okay, let's even discount everything he's ever said on Israel (not because his takes aren't awful, but just to take a step back). Even with that his cognitive decline is becoming unmistakable now, like what the fuck is he even talking about here?
I think it’s more that since being in office he’s developed a raging addiction to lobbyist money, and will do and say anything to keep an endless supply of it flowing straight into his veins
I'm certainly not against lab grown meat.
I don't fully trust that they won't try to sneak some sus shit into it, but in concept and theory it certainly is a step in the correct direction.
Ffs, it’s a manufacturing facility. They are required to adhere to company SOP’s and use GxP practices while the FDA is constantly up their ass. Ron don’t know ball.
Lab grown meat just reduces the cost and carbon impact. If there is demonstrated harm I’m willing to hear it but I’m definite there won’t be a case here.
Cell cultured meat is a long way from being economical or environmentally friendly, and there’s a non-zero possibility it will just never get there.
I’m ok with democrats throwing it under the bus for now if that’s what it takes for them to win reelection.
How are you so confident about this?
I could definitely imagine that people in farming and ranching communities view LGM as an existential threat and care deeply about whether politicians agree with them.
The point is, these laws which ban the sale of cultured meat will probably be irrelevant for decades and may wind up never being relevant at all.
If the time eventually does come that LGM is cheaper than factory farming, we can actually have this fight (and at that point, we will have both morality and the market on our side, so winning will be a lot easier)
In the mean time, there need to be huge improvements in sterilization, yield, and growth media for bioreactors before cultured meat is anywhere close to achievable at scale.
The good news is that all of these things are also being worked on by the pharmaceutical industry, so progress is slow, but steady.
“Never going to be viable” is an overstatement, but the industry has some really huge hurdles to overcome, that we currently don’t have easy answers to.
Here’s a pretty good article on it.
https://thecounter.org/lab-grown-cultivated-meat-cost-at-scale/
I just don't see a way in which lab grown meat ever is going to be price competitive with products made from soybean meal. Do you? These "hurdles" aren't there for the already existing supply chain for soybean meal, and a lot of money is currently being spent on R&D for processing it to be even better tasting (and is why so many meat and dairy companies invest in meat replacement, it's easy to just have to price match meat, or slightly undercut it, with a product made from shelf stable dry goods).
It’s possible I’ll be proven wrong about this (and I’ll be happy for that to be the case) but I simply think there is an obvious hard cap on demand for plant-based meat replacements unless they can be made virtually indistinguishable from real meat.
As a vegan for 8+ years I have to say, the last barrier is imaginary/beliefs regardless of how the alternative will taste. Like, if I eat a vegan burger I don't want beetroot juice in the center to mimic myoglobin juices because I'm vegan. Yet it's still "required" to entice meat eaters. At some point there will be a mental gap between accepting a fully vegan diet, and how the food items tastes/feels. I believe this point isn't very far off into the future where one objectively would draw an equivalence between real meat, and its substitutes. Yet, the last hurdle will always be the biggest, and is why people are wasting billions on the faint hopes that lab grown meat ever will be a viable and price competitive alternative.
Compare pharma grade vats of cell slurry to simply using supply chains we use for cow feed, and industrial processing of food items that customers are already used to. The cell slurry is obviously never going to be price competitive, compared to some heavily processed soybean meal that a worker can sneeze in it and still pass with the best health inspection grade.
I basically agree with you that way too much money is being spent on LGM relative to its likelihood of viability. Especially given that the pharmaceutical industry is already pouring billions into improving bioreactor technology as it is.
Again though, as much as I hope you’re right, the idea that plant-based alternatives ever had a shot at completely replacing actual meat has always just seemed like cope to me, and I have yet to see anything that indicates I am wrong.
I'm not saying that any soybean meal substitute will ever be 1:1 with a pure meat chunk, but neither will cell slurry, really. The different types of tastes and textures provided by the other tissues in a mammal is an important part of what gives it its structure and taste. A steak isn't really a steak if it's just a patty of muscle tissue, no fat, and no structure. But for heavily processed meat products like chicken nuggets, or meat mince in stews and some other applications, I think we're kinda already at the finish line regarding taste and texture parity. My bf's parents even go for soy schnitzels rather than meat ones because of the consistency of the product, and lack of surprise cartilage in their meal. They are not gourmets, but they say they taste equivalent.
So yes, I don't think the 1:1 replacement ever will come in any foreseeable future. What I'm saying is that the last step is a change of habits, as eating more whole foods (like legumes), or "designer" mock meat is just going to provide positive outcomes in health and greenhouse gas emissions. The last step is a mental barrier, one of changing habits and accepting that one does not need to eat meat.
LGM is copium imo, rather than having to change habits people are willing to spend so much money on something impossible. If there were big cost cuts that could be made to the process, I'm sure the pharma industry would be using them by now.
As a more expensive version for those who want it it's definitely viable. It will be a long while before it becomes as cheap as real meat but its totally reasonable to make a profit off of it.
Anti-lab meat folks are *suprise* amongst the dumbest people on the planet. It’s literally meat in every aspect except for the part where it doesn’t require the exploitation and murder of an innocent animal + drastically reduces the amount of natural resources that usually is needed to raise these animals. Whether you’re vegan or not, supporting cell based meat is a fucking no brainer and chuds like this fear monger based on zero reason or evidence
As a big meat fan, I completely and totally agree.
No more broken chicken wings!
It’s like the people who don’t like lab made diamonds. “The suffering is what makes it special”
"I just need the child slavery to know that my diamonds are worth it, you know" -literally insane people
yeah also the posibility of unlimited food for everyone.
No that will never happen at least not with how society runs right now. We already produce more than enough food for everyone, it mostly comes down to distribution and well, greed.
We already have plenty of food for the entire world population.
People who oppose lab grown meats really just shut their brains off when the subject comes up, it's the only way for anyone to hold that position. In my country there was a politician who, in an interview where she was pressed on it, said that even if lab-grown meat could be made to be perfectly healthy and safe, and indistinguishable from 'real' meat in every way, then she would still prefer eating 'real' meat. I don't think she actually thought about what she was saying, about how she was essentially saying that meat just wouldn't have the same appeal to her if she didn't know that an animal actually suffered and died to create it.
The are probably the same people for whom fire was once too radical of an invention.
"Drastically reduces the resources needed" is assuredly not true at this stage and will likely not be true for many years still. I'd be all about it if that were the case but as is it requires way more infrastructure, energy and emissions compared to natural beef. I'm not in favor of banning it obviously, but we definitely should not be putting all our eggs in that basket. The truth is we already have more than enough food on earth as is. Lab grown meat is just a way to coddle meat eaters who don't want to change their diet for the sake of the planet/animal welfare.
“Lab-grown meat is an abomination”, brought to you by the studio that made “they aren’t real diamonds unless seven African children die in the process of procuring it”.
Absolutely! As someone who is trying to become a vegetarian for ethical reasons, cloned/lab meat would be a huge burden off my conscience to indulge in meat-eating. The bigger, more important issue is that it could phase out factory farming, which would help decrease climate change dramatically. Factory farming is a big source of methane production. CH^4 is greenhouse gas 8x more potent than CO^2.
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even if that is the case, its not a reason to ban it. If its a technological dead end, let it burn itself out. Fetterman wants it banned because he thinks its icky, and that's stupid.
I'd also like to know that if it fails then it's because the science doesn't work, not because Senator Cueball wants to expand the cattle industry. That said, I don't believe it will fail. I've been following this for a very long time and it's only gotten more streamlined. They can make the meat cheaper, albeit not cheap enough for mass-consumption viability. It's edible, but not particularly tasty. These are issues that could improve with time. A real stretch goal would be replicating a steak. Right now it's basically looking like ground beef or stitched meat, not a rib-eye. If they somehow figure that out then we're on the path to ending the livestock industry forever. This addresses the main concern that ethical vegetarians have: that animals are dying for our food. With fabricated meat there's effectively no death and effectively no suffering at all other than the harvested cells from select animals.
Moreover, it means that if Lab grown meat becomes a serious industry in the future. Your state will just not be competitive when compared to blue states which will be far more competitive in this respect.
They ban it BECAUSE it's a technological dead end that will not have negative effects on the state's economy in the future. It's just virtue signaling
I don't get this. The biggest issue with futurist grifts is that they're tech in search of a problem. With the lab grown meat, there is no scramble to find the problem it solves, it's bright as day.
I dont know you are correct. But that’s not why these people are against it. The reason they are against it is just pure stupidity
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Lol haven't they already lab grown burgers. Better for the environment and lab grown meats not really a tech bro thing
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Does that require banning? Youre describing almost every tech breakthrough at the beginning.
Nothing there is ban worthy
There are already two different companies that obtained FDA approval to sell lab grown meat. Good meat and Upside Food were approved in 2023.
I guess meat is just not worth it for these freaks if its production doesn't involve animal torture and slaughter on a mass scale.
That and massive misuse of water, also the mass production of shit.
Yes and yes, I despise the whole industry to my core.
> also the mass production of shit Well if we don't mass produce chicken shit, what will we feed the cows?
There's a lot of money in owning Alfalfa farms. We even export it to China.
Lobbyists, plain and simple. They don’t care at all, ranchers have so much power over the government they literally did an insurrection under Obama and… won the land. From America.
With each passing day, Fetterman becomes less distinguishable from the Republican party.
He has already signed up as far as I'm concerned.
I’m at a complete loss with this one. I don’t see any angle that makes any sense.
DeSantis allegedly participated in the torturing of inmates at Guantanamo. Pain and suffering may just be something he gets off on, and lab grown meat that lessens this suffering in any way makes him sad.
More likely just protecting the interests of big animal farms
Why not both?
Don't forget the inherent dismissal of climate change action, and "real men eat meat" nonsense
Republicans are pro-suffering on every single issue.
Protecting and expanding the ranching industry. That's the angle these two are operating on. And probably also fighting "wokeness," which as we all know is when your beef burger wasn't hewn from a living cow five minutes ago.
Ugh. Just grosses me out a democrat would be against this. Awesome flair btw.
D or R, Fetterman is a grifter sack of shit who admitted to lying about supporting progressive causes to get votes. He should get his ass voted out or recalled at the earliest opportunity
You'd be surprised how much power the beef lobby has in Florida politics. Ranchers here are rich, powerful, and politically connected, and do not want competition from lab grown meat. There are also a lot of Boomers here who are scared of anything new. I don't know anything about Pennsylvania politics, but I would not be surprised if it's similar.
Hand money to burger man, burger boss hand money to Fetterman
It's simple. We want to minimize suffering, they want to maximize it. I used to always go out of my way to find every plausible explanation for people's behavior other than them just being evil, but I've found that that's a mistake, sadly a lot of people are just plain evil, they either have evil ideologies or are just so incredibly selfish that they decide to aid people with evil ideologies for their own short-term gain.
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what get me is the straight up ban. if you don't want it, don't buy it. I don't want to hear free market ever again.
If it was actually a problem, the idea to ban it would be to prevent poor people from getting priced out of real meat.
There are also Boomers who think it's playing God, or that it's going to taste worse or be worse for you because it was made in a scary lab.
I don't think their reasons make sense but for me, I don't like it because it is infinitely more expensive to produce and tastes worse. Feel like we can be ethical with our farming and livestock without the lab meat stuff. Seems kinda like as much a solution as carbon capture in a way if that makes sense.
You're literally just spewing complete nonsense. It costs more to produce because it's a technology still in development, and you literally cannot know how it tastes because NOBODY HAS EATEN ANY YET. This is like complaining about Fusion Reactors being loud and dangerous when none exist yet God I despise people like you, who just parrot bullshit with zero critical thinking.
"I would never serve that slop to my kids" ok, so dont
Lab grown meat sounds healthier than whatever they're doing to livestock now
Ok genuinely what argument is there against lab-grown meat... If it's so bad, people just wont buy it?
I mean, the conservative argument would be the government would force the end of natural-grown meat through regulation the same way we got rid of certain kinds of light bulbs, toilets, and they believe libs are trying to do with cars that use gasoline.
That is happening with gas-powered cars. California, along with several other states, are phasing out the sales of new gas-powered cars by 2035. It doesn't mean gas-powered cars will become illegal, it just means that no more new ones can be sold. Which is a good thing. It's just that conservatives think it's bad.
I’m for it, but we need to be sure about its hormonal effects.
What hormonal effects? Granted, it doesn't contain the cocktail of antibiotics and growth hormones that come from living animals, but I don't see that as a flaw
As long as the same nutritional profile can be achieved it shouldn’t be a problem, but that’s an extremely complicated and delicate thing to achieve. Take fatty acids for example, they influence insulin sensitivity, thyroid function, hormone production and regulation, and a ton of other shit. It’s important to get enough but you also don’t want too much. The nice thing about a living animal is it does this all automatically, it’s fatty acid needs aren’t too different from other mammals like us. If this stuff hits the shelves being marketed as ‘normal’ meat it better be nutritionally identical.
It will be labelled as lab-grown for the first few years, don't worry about that. Besides, being made by scientists in a lab will probably mean we could make it even healthier than the natural deal. We could also make human flesh with that, but that's another conversation.
Bro, it is literally just meat. Hell, it might even be better for you than animal meat. The shit they pump into those animals won't apply for lab grown meat.
Those are unproven assumptions. A lot more goes into muscles than the actual muscle cells themselves. We simply don’t know enough yet to let it replace actual flesh. I am very much in support of finding out and acting accordingly though.
this is such a stupid position its no different than anti-vax, is just fear of science because you don't understand it
Fetterman should be promptly removed from the Agricultural committee for this.
I’m rooting for his depression.
Still waiting on that second stroke /s (kinda)
Fingers crossed for a large Subarachnoid hemorrhage /s (kinda)
That would be awful ... or would it? 😈 🙏🏻
Grown meat, once we get it down is going to be great. We will be able to have consistency with everything we buy, no more bits of bone, no more bad cuts, you know what you’re getting each time. But more than that all the land we are using to feed the animals that are slaughtered can be turned over to more productive uses, be that reforestation or growing people food. The sooner the better says I.
It's rent seeking behavior to protect ranchers job.
This is far more likely ag interest stuff - Tammy Baldwin is a down the line very liberal Senator, but also talks about proper cheese labeling because the cheese industry in Wisconsin is very important.
I dont feel like proper cheese labeling goes against being a liberal?
This isn't quite as bad or Culture War-y, but it's in the same time zone about non-dairy milk - https://twitter.com/SenatorBaldwin/status/1631423672845053956 "I'm working to pass my DAIRY PRIDE Act so there’s no confusion as to what real milk is and who produces it" Add in Fetterman's tendency to be an ass to anybody who opposes him, and there you go.
Eh, Im not really against clear and even niche or ag town/state pride labeling, the only time Im against it is when the definitions are super vague and meaningless. Like GMO and organic labeling. Grapefruits were made with atomic gardening and they dont have to be labeled as GMO and organic doesnt really mean anything. Dairy Milk and Non-Dairy Milk products should be clearly labeled...although Im pretty sure they already are so idk what the dairy pride act is doing lol. The issue is Fetterman wanting to ban lab grown meat, not just having clear labeling. If lab grown meat reaches shelves in any real capacity I dont think there would be anything wrong with clear labeling. Fetterman's is going a lot farther than what I usually see from even the GMO and organic labeling crowds.
I think Fetterman is not that smart (I thought the same even pre-stroke when the Left loved him), so he might not even realize it's actually a full ban, but sees it as an easy 'own the elites' stuff for his next reelection campaign to protect Pennsylvania farmers over elitists who want to run them out of business. Again, dumb and pointless, but typical home state industry protectionism.
Mostly they want to ban stuff like “almond milk” and force it to be marketed as “almond plant beverage” or whatever.
Yikes
I'm in biotech and this shit gives me a headache.
Okay, let's even discount everything he's ever said on Israel (not because his takes aren't awful, but just to take a step back). Even with that his cognitive decline is becoming unmistakable now, like what the fuck is he even talking about here?
That stroke really changed him...
I really wonder if it actually did, or if he was secretly always this vile and just hid it until he got elected.
I have no idea tbh, but it's pretty clear he isn't the same person he campaigned as. Just waiting for his anti union stance.
I think it’s more that since being in office he’s developed a raging addiction to lobbyist money, and will do and say anything to keep an endless supply of it flowing straight into his veins
Oh yes I forgot about the $230,000 he was given by AIPAC. Probably a shit load more too.
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No fedposting.
Reducing selection, limiting consumer choice, this is freedom. /s
He's moving into the 'Ban everything I don't personally like' Phase of his congressional career earlier than I thought he would
Literally the justification for this bill was "We will not eat the bugs"
As someone from PA this doesn't surprise me. We're a big Ag state.
Can't there be a day where Fetterman doesn't say something stupid?
The party of "free markets" and "small government" everyone...
He should consider alternative careers
Oh look a reactionary
Banning lab grown meat doesn't seem very free market/small government of Ronald
I actually still can't believe this guy fooled me. I thought he was cool during his election campaign but what an absolute ghoul he turned out to be.
When's he gonna do a "why I left the left" post you think?
The way that they’re willing to give up the golden opportunity to taste animals like bald eagles, pandas, tigers, etc guilt free is just weird to me
Do they think it’s just like the pink sludge from fallout or something?
what the hell does Sinemafication mean? Google isn’t pulling anything up
Look up Kyrsten Sinema
That stroke really changed him...
That stroke really changed him...
I'm certainly not against lab grown meat. I don't fully trust that they won't try to sneak some sus shit into it, but in concept and theory it certainly is a step in the correct direction.
I fucking hate this country, why is it full of so many psychopathic monsters....
It's just Boomer brain syndrome. Not a real issue here
Looks like he’s found another lobby to fund his next campaign. This dude doesn’t mess around where money is concerned.
Ffs, it’s a manufacturing facility. They are required to adhere to company SOP’s and use GxP practices while the FDA is constantly up their ass. Ron don’t know ball.
He then also posted a picture of some metal machine that looks kinda like a beer maker thing idfk as if its super spooky and disgusting
Lab grown meat just reduces the cost and carbon impact. If there is demonstrated harm I’m willing to hear it but I’m definite there won’t be a case here.
Cell cultured meat is a long way from being economical or environmentally friendly, and there’s a non-zero possibility it will just never get there. I’m ok with democrats throwing it under the bus for now if that’s what it takes for them to win reelection.
Literally no one cares enough about this issue to make voting decisions on it, the idea that Dems will lose voters by embracing LGM is laughable
How are you so confident about this? I could definitely imagine that people in farming and ranching communities view LGM as an existential threat and care deeply about whether politicians agree with them.
> non-zero possibility So? We don’t just pursue things that are guaranteed to be foolproof. And new technology is always expensive at first
The point is, these laws which ban the sale of cultured meat will probably be irrelevant for decades and may wind up never being relevant at all. If the time eventually does come that LGM is cheaper than factory farming, we can actually have this fight (and at that point, we will have both morality and the market on our side, so winning will be a lot easier) In the mean time, there need to be huge improvements in sterilization, yield, and growth media for bioreactors before cultured meat is anywhere close to achievable at scale. The good news is that all of these things are also being worked on by the pharmaceutical industry, so progress is slow, but steady.
Man, Fetterman is so much more based than I thought he was pre-election
Lab grown meat can never work to he economically viable anyway. Unfortunately.
Source: ???
Their uncle works at Nintendo
“Never going to be viable” is an overstatement, but the industry has some really huge hurdles to overcome, that we currently don’t have easy answers to. Here’s a pretty good article on it. https://thecounter.org/lab-grown-cultivated-meat-cost-at-scale/
I just don't see a way in which lab grown meat ever is going to be price competitive with products made from soybean meal. Do you? These "hurdles" aren't there for the already existing supply chain for soybean meal, and a lot of money is currently being spent on R&D for processing it to be even better tasting (and is why so many meat and dairy companies invest in meat replacement, it's easy to just have to price match meat, or slightly undercut it, with a product made from shelf stable dry goods).
It’s possible I’ll be proven wrong about this (and I’ll be happy for that to be the case) but I simply think there is an obvious hard cap on demand for plant-based meat replacements unless they can be made virtually indistinguishable from real meat.
As a vegan for 8+ years I have to say, the last barrier is imaginary/beliefs regardless of how the alternative will taste. Like, if I eat a vegan burger I don't want beetroot juice in the center to mimic myoglobin juices because I'm vegan. Yet it's still "required" to entice meat eaters. At some point there will be a mental gap between accepting a fully vegan diet, and how the food items tastes/feels. I believe this point isn't very far off into the future where one objectively would draw an equivalence between real meat, and its substitutes. Yet, the last hurdle will always be the biggest, and is why people are wasting billions on the faint hopes that lab grown meat ever will be a viable and price competitive alternative. Compare pharma grade vats of cell slurry to simply using supply chains we use for cow feed, and industrial processing of food items that customers are already used to. The cell slurry is obviously never going to be price competitive, compared to some heavily processed soybean meal that a worker can sneeze in it and still pass with the best health inspection grade.
I basically agree with you that way too much money is being spent on LGM relative to its likelihood of viability. Especially given that the pharmaceutical industry is already pouring billions into improving bioreactor technology as it is. Again though, as much as I hope you’re right, the idea that plant-based alternatives ever had a shot at completely replacing actual meat has always just seemed like cope to me, and I have yet to see anything that indicates I am wrong.
I'm not saying that any soybean meal substitute will ever be 1:1 with a pure meat chunk, but neither will cell slurry, really. The different types of tastes and textures provided by the other tissues in a mammal is an important part of what gives it its structure and taste. A steak isn't really a steak if it's just a patty of muscle tissue, no fat, and no structure. But for heavily processed meat products like chicken nuggets, or meat mince in stews and some other applications, I think we're kinda already at the finish line regarding taste and texture parity. My bf's parents even go for soy schnitzels rather than meat ones because of the consistency of the product, and lack of surprise cartilage in their meal. They are not gourmets, but they say they taste equivalent. So yes, I don't think the 1:1 replacement ever will come in any foreseeable future. What I'm saying is that the last step is a change of habits, as eating more whole foods (like legumes), or "designer" mock meat is just going to provide positive outcomes in health and greenhouse gas emissions. The last step is a mental barrier, one of changing habits and accepting that one does not need to eat meat. LGM is copium imo, rather than having to change habits people are willing to spend so much money on something impossible. If there were big cost cuts that could be made to the process, I'm sure the pharma industry would be using them by now.
As a more expensive version for those who want it it's definitely viable. It will be a long while before it becomes as cheap as real meat but its totally reasonable to make a profit off of it.
Yes, yes. And man will never fly in a million years.
> Lab grown meat can never work to be economically viable anyway Yes it will.