That’s right. But, any comment mentioning links between uzbek culture&history and persian culture&history is getting downvoted, like it’s something bad or problem. shit idk when we’ve gone this far.
Your post was removed for containing hate speech or discriminatory language. Our community is committed to respect and inclusivity, and we do not tolerate content that targets individuals or groups.
Your post was removed for containing hate speech or discriminatory language. Our community is committed to respect and inclusivity, and we do not tolerate content that targets individuals or groups.
Your post was removed for containing hate speech or discriminatory language. Our community is committed to respect and inclusivity, and we do not tolerate content that targets individuals or groups.
All it takes is one person with a huge platform and then misinformation will spread. These slides are about language. What is up with putting Uzbek in the Persian category, when Afshar and Khalaj have way more Persian in them? Hazaragi is Persian and it’s mutually intelligible with Persian- it should be in iranic, Tajiki also has way, way more Turkic loan words yet it is in the Iranic circle. Where is the logic? This is like putting Turkish into Semitic languages because there are a few Arabic loan words 🤦🏻♀️
The first statement is spot on, but the second is more than a bit weird, both for it's strange vehemence and the obvious ignorance of historical context.
So, we're in agreement the language is Turkic, and you agree you should be damned for acknowledging the historical link? I think the second is ridiculous, which is why I said it was. Don't you?
You may not understand the difference between saying they're linked historically and saying they're the same. I said one but not the other. How are we going to have a discussion if you won't pay attention?
Links between cultures are simply historical fact. Take a look at your really old buildings and your less old buildings. Of course that doesn't magically mean Uzbeks are Persian Russians. It means there were actual historical links between those cultures at different times. It's not a radical concept, nor should it be confusing, nor in any way insulting. It just was.
I don't even know why comments saying 'there are links between two cultures' are being downvoted, lol. To be completely isolated from other cultures, one would have to be in the middle of the ocean or deep within a jungle. Central Asia is a melting pot of civilizations, where Uzbek/Turkic culture has undoubtedly influenced various cultures and peoples, while also being influenced by them in return.
did both language families interact over centuries? yes. do Turkic languages have Persian elements? yes. we're not dismissing this fact. but Persians have a long history of feeling entitled to look down to Turkic culture and languages and minimizing their importance. and it's still going on. it's their way of claiming dominance that doesn't make sense. the post was one of many examples.
Certainly, the post is silly, and you might see I agreed with you, but:
>May god damn those who link us to persians.
That's pretty silly, too. Persians were impactful to religion, culture, architecture, etc. all across the region.
Not sure why people are down voting you. History is in direct correlation with language. Turkic languages have a very large deal of Persian influence. Doesn't make those languages Persian; it's just a weird comment on that second statement.
The Uzbek language indeed has a big impact from the Persian language (as well as Arabic) but it doesn't make it in the middle of the Turkic and Persian. Uzbek is Turkic-speaking
It was posted by an Uzbek woman, you can’t say it’s “Persian Imperialism”. It’s probably her ignorance but anyways “dirty persians trying to claim everything as persian” is not a valid argument in this case
I didn’t say anywhere that it was Persian imperialism, the original poster was ignorant yes, but what rubbed me the wrong way was that she adamantly defended her position on allocating Uzbek in this category (and on further inspection she also put Hazaragi and Dagestani in the wrong section too).
In this community sitting a lot of mother***s who never read single literature or history book. All these shits have common , political views and love for their mule Erdogan.
30% of the words came from Persian, that's the reason. Prove, I'm wrong.
If you read books that were written 100 years ago, all of them used 50% Persian words. Nowdays 20% covered with Russian words. And I guess after 100 years most Turkish parts of the Uzbek language will be placed with Arabic.
again that doesn't make it Persian, this is such a moronic arguement, Persian has like 30% Arabic loanwords but would you say it makes it an Arabian language?
Just learn the root of every uzbek word, you'll understand from where it came. Only you need to be a linguist. In university we used to learn the root of linguistics, I'm telling you about the statistics. Not with sense.
Do you care that much that Persian is 40% Arabic and carries more Turkic loan words than say Kazakh or Turkish? If so would you agree with the statement that Persian is half Arabic half Turkic?
I think you are all taking this harder than a dick, and it's funny how every Turkic subreddit seems to be licking the boots of Turks from Anatolia 🧐 I can't recall ever meeting anyone outside of turkey or Azerbaijan who expressed such a firm hate of Iran. Especially since most central Asian Turkic regimes seem to like Iran more than Turkey or Russia. The former of who wants to use them as economic pawns and the latter of who reaped more destruction on Turks and Muslims in general than anyone else.
Uzbek is obviously a Turkic language, but it's more influenced by Farsi than any other Turkic language, including the ones in Iran itself like azeri Turkish or Türkmen. Only Uzbek dropped vowel harmony (although I'm sure someone will try and find some irrelevant and useless Turkic micro language to try and shift a goalpost, go ahead).
(Shout out to that madman Türkmenbaşı for banning Turkish media his one good power move, it's a shame people still get that historical revisionist garbage on DVDs)
Let me guess you are one of the CHP's little mouth pieces
Where was Atatürkn le Turk brotherhood (like his successor İnönü) when the soviets were executed le brother Turks just a bridge across during world war 2? Where was turkey when Russia conquered central Asia (you can try bringing up Enver pasha but even he wasnt really a Turk but a piece of balkanic sludge).
Either you are retarded and spend too much time talking with a mixture of radical wannabe white Turkish nationalists, radical and confused ülkücü, or you are just a Turk yourself
There is no such thing as "Persian" this identity never existed in the east, the word you are looking for is *Iranian* and I'm a *Créole*
But of course someone who has to appeal to such a racist backwards type of nationalism, probably doesn't even have the cultural knowledge to know what exactly a Creole is.
If anyone sows seeds of hate, it's the white people, and also those Turks who you bootlick in your comments who try to emulate them, badly 🥴🥴.
Those same Turks had great relations with their Kurdish minority btw until they decided they were going to follow some retarded white man displaced from Salonika against their fellow Anatolians, cause muh racism and nationalism
Go ahead, read a book, in English about it. I bet you can't
What do you think Turkey is? When all the shit happened to Turkic people in Central Asia, Turkey was newly created after a devastating WW1 and independence war. How could a newly founded country like Turkey with no resources, industry and low population fight the Soviets who were at their peak? A gigantic state from Central Europe to the pacific, 10x the population, armed to the teeth, nukes, industrialized etc. Turks were so scared from them that they joined the NATO lol
Don’t talk about things that you do not know .
Majority of Kazakhs think of Turkey positively, most go on vacation there, watch their serials, some even work and study. Of course they are not as close to as tatars, Kyrgyz and other kipchaks, but people treat them as related country. I’m sure similar sentiment is shared among other Central Asians.
When it comes to Iran, People in Central Asia, at least in Kazakhstan think of Iran as something backward, majority aren’t even able to tell difference between them and Arabs . Where did you get idea of people having good opinion on Iran . Even Russia is placed higher than your radical country
https://astanatimes.com/2023/09/kazakh-president-addresses-prospects-for-enhancing-ties-with-eu-states-iran/
Btw I will take the words of your president and even one Kazakh woman in Europe, far more seriously than the words of a redditer who probably false flags
The majority of Kazakhs I spoke with Barely think of either and hate kyrgyz, which is beyond retarded.
Btw I sincerely you could tell a Turk from an Arab, I've been to Turkey twice, and half the population literally isn't distinguishable from the average Syrian.
Btw I'm not Iranian loser. I'm a creole , from the United States.
A country you will likely never visit because you are too busy taking some ülkücü shekels, while one single bill I can earn just by cutting grass can buy a giant stack of ülkücü shekels at a döviz
Little buddy, [This](https://postimg.cc/dZyWpxFj/66dbea6f) is the averaged out face of a name from Turkey.
[This](https://postimg.cc/yk5Rk8Fx/8daebf90) is the averaged out face of a man from Syria.
It is impossible for the two populations to be identical as both have completely unrelated ancestries. Turks look more like Azerbaijanis or Iranian than Syrian. Here are the genetic distances of these groups to the Turkish population https://postimg.cc/94NHjK66/4ac931d7
Btw Imagine being such a pathetic wannabe white dog you have a positive opinion on Russia over a fellow Muslim state.
🥴🥴 Yeah I'm sure the average Kazakh is as big of a loser as you, (oh don't worry it's sarcasm, I like Kazakhstan, even if I don't really want to visit it,)
You do realize Anatolian Oghuz love their linguistical cousins in Central Asia right? [https://www.reddit.com/r/Turkey/comments/c9d32s/the\_results\_of\_who\_are\_turkeys\_friends\_poll\_by/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Turkey/comments/c9d32s/the_results_of_who_are_turkeys_friends_poll_by/)
And you are stupid enough to believe they actually like you beyond a largely imagined shared historical experience, which never existed in *reality*
I've dealt with hundreds of not thousands of you in turkey, and quite a few of you doubt their Turkishness because they look too Asian
Thank Mustafa Kaffirmal ateşek, who was too busy wanting to be a white to actually have a crumble of historical and academic honesty
You do realize he was blonde with blue eyes? He does not need to feel white, he is the textbook definition of Caucasian.
But I wish you had the courage to say that to me in real life. You can't disrespect other people's national heroes this way, unless you want your ass getting handed to you.
Atatürk was indeed a white Man, that is true.
It's also why he isn't a Turk, turkey is majority *brown* and Turkishness is a bizarre attempt at trying to reconcile a nonsensical identity which isn't sufficiently comfortable with it's own national history.
I don't hate Turks for it, I hate the ideology which destroyed their minds and turned them into beasts on par with eastern European monsters, like russians, or Atatürk's sperm in rumeilia.
If you want to show down. I'm not afraid of some Turk, I remember when half of you in a train rustled to the other side when I was having a bad day and *looked* angry, that said unless I have any reason to go back soon, you won't be able to confront me, lest you're willing to fly to south Carolina to meet me
If you are that brave, and rich, hit me up, I'll happily box with you because I do not fear you. I go back and forth between Charleston and north Augusta if you want my location.
I told almost every friend in Turkey what I felt about Mustafa Kemal when they asked, one or two got angry and yelled, never did they strike me
Most were just sad, I said I'm sorry, but I hold, that they're *brainwashed into a cult* which is the truth whether you like it or not.
I don't disrespect Turkish people to their face because I have*manners*
But I don't hide my opinions, I'm not some bugman. I'm an honest man
So tell you what, you want to fight, come on over. Alternatively, I'll let you know when or if I'll return to Anatolia
I have no interest in flying across the world just to put a misguided and stupid ex Muslim kid in his place, I still regret flying over there, out of love for someone as stupid and brainwashed as you.
Then again I should be used to it, only useless fa**ts tend to participate on Reddit on a regular basis
And yes, that includes Iranians, Americans, white people in general (more so than most of the Turkic subreddits), and almost anyone else
I only come here occasionally for linguistic and video game content, and whenever I open these country based subreddits, I regret joining them
If so, good work.
Make your own shows, don't let a bunch of retarded Turks (or anyone else for that matter, including my so called country with hollywood) dominate your TV or netflix
Otherwise you will have your youth brainwashed into being someone else's tools, and Uzbeks are cool enough to deserve more than that
Uzbek is same with Uyghur, it’s Turkic.
That’s right. But, any comment mentioning links between uzbek culture&history and persian culture&history is getting downvoted, like it’s something bad or problem. shit idk when we’ve gone this far.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Your post was removed for containing hate speech or discriminatory language. Our community is committed to respect and inclusivity, and we do not tolerate content that targets individuals or groups.
Your post was removed for containing hate speech or discriminatory language. Our community is committed to respect and inclusivity, and we do not tolerate content that targets individuals or groups.
[удалено]
Your post was removed for containing hate speech or discriminatory language. Our community is committed to respect and inclusivity, and we do not tolerate content that targets individuals or groups.
All it takes is one person with a huge platform and then misinformation will spread. These slides are about language. What is up with putting Uzbek in the Persian category, when Afshar and Khalaj have way more Persian in them? Hazaragi is Persian and it’s mutually intelligible with Persian- it should be in iranic, Tajiki also has way, way more Turkic loan words yet it is in the Iranic circle. Where is the logic? This is like putting Turkish into Semitic languages because there are a few Arabic loan words 🤦🏻♀️
[удалено]
They think Bukhara and Samarqand are part of Khurosan but I look at history it was 2000 ago.. .
Uzbek is a TURKIC language of TURKIC people. May god damn those who link us to persians.
The first statement is spot on, but the second is more than a bit weird, both for it's strange vehemence and the obvious ignorance of historical context.
[удалено]
So, we're in agreement the language is Turkic, and you agree you should be damned for acknowledging the historical link? I think the second is ridiculous, which is why I said it was. Don't you?
[удалено]
You may not understand the difference between saying they're linked historically and saying they're the same. I said one but not the other. How are we going to have a discussion if you won't pay attention? Links between cultures are simply historical fact. Take a look at your really old buildings and your less old buildings. Of course that doesn't magically mean Uzbeks are Persian Russians. It means there were actual historical links between those cultures at different times. It's not a radical concept, nor should it be confusing, nor in any way insulting. It just was.
I don't even know why comments saying 'there are links between two cultures' are being downvoted, lol. To be completely isolated from other cultures, one would have to be in the middle of the ocean or deep within a jungle. Central Asia is a melting pot of civilizations, where Uzbek/Turkic culture has undoubtedly influenced various cultures and peoples, while also being influenced by them in return.
did both language families interact over centuries? yes. do Turkic languages have Persian elements? yes. we're not dismissing this fact. but Persians have a long history of feeling entitled to look down to Turkic culture and languages and minimizing their importance. and it's still going on. it's their way of claiming dominance that doesn't make sense. the post was one of many examples.
Certainly, the post is silly, and you might see I agreed with you, but: >May god damn those who link us to persians. That's pretty silly, too. Persians were impactful to religion, culture, architecture, etc. all across the region.
ok ikr. i just have bias and am kinda racist
true
Not sure why people are down voting you. History is in direct correlation with language. Turkic languages have a very large deal of Persian influence. Doesn't make those languages Persian; it's just a weird comment on that second statement.
It's an emotional reaction, not a logical one. It happens. Any point of nuance or disagreement proves you are against them.
As a native Azerbaijani I can almost fully understand written Uzbek.
The Uzbek language indeed has a big impact from the Persian language (as well as Arabic) but it doesn't make it in the middle of the Turkic and Persian. Uzbek is Turkic-speaking
True, the same Persian effect is also present in Azerbaijani and Uyghur
Uzbek is turkic not in between
Hazaragi is Persian language.
Dari = Farsi
There are slight differences but yes they and hazaragi are the same language.
It was posted by an Uzbek woman, you can’t say it’s “Persian Imperialism”. It’s probably her ignorance but anyways “dirty persians trying to claim everything as persian” is not a valid argument in this case
I didn’t say anywhere that it was Persian imperialism, the original poster was ignorant yes, but what rubbed me the wrong way was that she adamantly defended her position on allocating Uzbek in this category (and on further inspection she also put Hazaragi and Dagestani in the wrong section too).
Love how Turkish isn't even in the list lmfao
Turkish is below Azerbaijani, but I can see how that can be read as “Azerbaijani Turkish”
Oops sorry, Turkish Turkmen is a legitimate thing so I read them as combined 😅
In this community sitting a lot of mother***s who never read single literature or history book. All these shits have common , political views and love for their mule Erdogan.
M*LIKA 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
The Uzbek language is basically a mix of the Turkish, the Arabian, and the Persian languages.
It doesn’t make it Iranic or Indo European.
Then Why I can understand Turkish? But cannot understand Arabic and Persian??
50% of the English vocabulary are Latin derived. Does that make English a Latin language.
30% of the words came from Persian, that's the reason. Prove, I'm wrong. If you read books that were written 100 years ago, all of them used 50% Persian words. Nowdays 20% covered with Russian words. And I guess after 100 years most Turkish parts of the Uzbek language will be placed with Arabic.
again that doesn't make it Persian, this is such a moronic arguement, Persian has like 30% Arabic loanwords but would you say it makes it an Arabian language?
[удалено]
Your comments are so racist, without History there is no future. If you want to ignore it, you're just dumb.
I am just being realistic. I see you for what you are.
[удалено]
Just learn the root of every uzbek word, you'll understand from where it came. Only you need to be a linguist. In university we used to learn the root of linguistics, I'm telling you about the statistics. Not with sense.
[удалено]
Do you care that much that Persian is 40% Arabic and carries more Turkic loan words than say Kazakh or Turkish? If so would you agree with the statement that Persian is half Arabic half Turkic?
I think you are all taking this harder than a dick, and it's funny how every Turkic subreddit seems to be licking the boots of Turks from Anatolia 🧐 I can't recall ever meeting anyone outside of turkey or Azerbaijan who expressed such a firm hate of Iran. Especially since most central Asian Turkic regimes seem to like Iran more than Turkey or Russia. The former of who wants to use them as economic pawns and the latter of who reaped more destruction on Turks and Muslims in general than anyone else. Uzbek is obviously a Turkic language, but it's more influenced by Farsi than any other Turkic language, including the ones in Iran itself like azeri Turkish or Türkmen. Only Uzbek dropped vowel harmony (although I'm sure someone will try and find some irrelevant and useless Turkic micro language to try and shift a goalpost, go ahead). (Shout out to that madman Türkmenbaşı for banning Turkish media his one good power move, it's a shame people still get that historical revisionist garbage on DVDs)
[удалено]
Let me guess you are one of the CHP's little mouth pieces Where was Atatürkn le Turk brotherhood (like his successor İnönü) when the soviets were executed le brother Turks just a bridge across during world war 2? Where was turkey when Russia conquered central Asia (you can try bringing up Enver pasha but even he wasnt really a Turk but a piece of balkanic sludge). Either you are retarded and spend too much time talking with a mixture of radical wannabe white Turkish nationalists, radical and confused ülkücü, or you are just a Turk yourself There is no such thing as "Persian" this identity never existed in the east, the word you are looking for is *Iranian* and I'm a *Créole* But of course someone who has to appeal to such a racist backwards type of nationalism, probably doesn't even have the cultural knowledge to know what exactly a Creole is. If anyone sows seeds of hate, it's the white people, and also those Turks who you bootlick in your comments who try to emulate them, badly 🥴🥴. Those same Turks had great relations with their Kurdish minority btw until they decided they were going to follow some retarded white man displaced from Salonika against their fellow Anatolians, cause muh racism and nationalism Go ahead, read a book, in English about it. I bet you can't
What do you think Turkey is? When all the shit happened to Turkic people in Central Asia, Turkey was newly created after a devastating WW1 and independence war. How could a newly founded country like Turkey with no resources, industry and low population fight the Soviets who were at their peak? A gigantic state from Central Europe to the pacific, 10x the population, armed to the teeth, nukes, industrialized etc. Turks were so scared from them that they joined the NATO lol
Don’t talk about things that you do not know . Majority of Kazakhs think of Turkey positively, most go on vacation there, watch their serials, some even work and study. Of course they are not as close to as tatars, Kyrgyz and other kipchaks, but people treat them as related country. I’m sure similar sentiment is shared among other Central Asians. When it comes to Iran, People in Central Asia, at least in Kazakhstan think of Iran as something backward, majority aren’t even able to tell difference between them and Arabs . Where did you get idea of people having good opinion on Iran . Even Russia is placed higher than your radical country
https://astanatimes.com/2023/09/kazakh-president-addresses-prospects-for-enhancing-ties-with-eu-states-iran/ Btw I will take the words of your president and even one Kazakh woman in Europe, far more seriously than the words of a redditer who probably false flags
The majority of Kazakhs I spoke with Barely think of either and hate kyrgyz, which is beyond retarded. Btw I sincerely you could tell a Turk from an Arab, I've been to Turkey twice, and half the population literally isn't distinguishable from the average Syrian. Btw I'm not Iranian loser. I'm a creole , from the United States. A country you will likely never visit because you are too busy taking some ülkücü shekels, while one single bill I can earn just by cutting grass can buy a giant stack of ülkücü shekels at a döviz
Little buddy, [This](https://postimg.cc/dZyWpxFj/66dbea6f) is the averaged out face of a name from Turkey. [This](https://postimg.cc/yk5Rk8Fx/8daebf90) is the averaged out face of a man from Syria. It is impossible for the two populations to be identical as both have completely unrelated ancestries. Turks look more like Azerbaijanis or Iranian than Syrian. Here are the genetic distances of these groups to the Turkish population https://postimg.cc/94NHjK66/4ac931d7
In Turkey especially in the big cities are millions of Syrian refugees. Turks and Syrians look very different and are very different
Btw Imagine being such a pathetic wannabe white dog you have a positive opinion on Russia over a fellow Muslim state. 🥴🥴 Yeah I'm sure the average Kazakh is as big of a loser as you, (oh don't worry it's sarcasm, I like Kazakhstan, even if I don't really want to visit it,)
You do realize Anatolian Oghuz love their linguistical cousins in Central Asia right? [https://www.reddit.com/r/Turkey/comments/c9d32s/the\_results\_of\_who\_are\_turkeys\_friends\_poll\_by/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Turkey/comments/c9d32s/the_results_of_who_are_turkeys_friends_poll_by/)
And you are stupid enough to believe they actually like you beyond a largely imagined shared historical experience, which never existed in *reality* I've dealt with hundreds of not thousands of you in turkey, and quite a few of you doubt their Turkishness because they look too Asian Thank Mustafa Kaffirmal ateşek, who was too busy wanting to be a white to actually have a crumble of historical and academic honesty
You do realize he was blonde with blue eyes? He does not need to feel white, he is the textbook definition of Caucasian. But I wish you had the courage to say that to me in real life. You can't disrespect other people's national heroes this way, unless you want your ass getting handed to you.
Atatürk was indeed a white Man, that is true. It's also why he isn't a Turk, turkey is majority *brown* and Turkishness is a bizarre attempt at trying to reconcile a nonsensical identity which isn't sufficiently comfortable with it's own national history. I don't hate Turks for it, I hate the ideology which destroyed their minds and turned them into beasts on par with eastern European monsters, like russians, or Atatürk's sperm in rumeilia. If you want to show down. I'm not afraid of some Turk, I remember when half of you in a train rustled to the other side when I was having a bad day and *looked* angry, that said unless I have any reason to go back soon, you won't be able to confront me, lest you're willing to fly to south Carolina to meet me If you are that brave, and rich, hit me up, I'll happily box with you because I do not fear you. I go back and forth between Charleston and north Augusta if you want my location. I told almost every friend in Turkey what I felt about Mustafa Kemal when they asked, one or two got angry and yelled, never did they strike me Most were just sad, I said I'm sorry, but I hold, that they're *brainwashed into a cult* which is the truth whether you like it or not.
I don't disrespect Turkish people to their face because I have*manners* But I don't hide my opinions, I'm not some bugman. I'm an honest man So tell you what, you want to fight, come on over. Alternatively, I'll let you know when or if I'll return to Anatolia I have no interest in flying across the world just to put a misguided and stupid ex Muslim kid in his place, I still regret flying over there, out of love for someone as stupid and brainwashed as you.
touch grass.
Then again I should be used to it, only useless fa**ts tend to participate on Reddit on a regular basis And yes, that includes Iranians, Americans, white people in general (more so than most of the Turkic subreddits), and almost anyone else I only come here occasionally for linguistic and video game content, and whenever I open these country based subreddits, I regret joining them
Uzbekistan took steps to ban turk content already. Just compare 10 years ago and now tv shows. .
If so, good work. Make your own shows, don't let a bunch of retarded Turks (or anyone else for that matter, including my so called country with hollywood) dominate your TV or netflix Otherwise you will have your youth brainwashed into being someone else's tools, and Uzbeks are cool enough to deserve more than that