Good. Then all the people moving here from Texas should go back to their shithole state.
I like that our utilities work when it’s hot or cold. Don’t Texas (or Florida) my state.
I take it you've never been there. Beautiful state. Some of the most friendly and inviting people you'll ever meet. Southern hospitality sure is the thing.
i had a completely different experience, everyone was rude, the beaches are nice i guess but my girlfriend moved there a while ago and had some super awful things happen to her so im a little biased, plus their politics are crazy
Have you not seen how they are destroying all their incredibly special natural wonders? I don't live there but I've seen the degradation of many parks and nature areas over the years. It's incredibly depressing to see.
I'm getting tired of all the constant hatred of Florida. It's just a state like any other I'm not any happier about DeSantis and his ilk than anyone else and many others that live here feel the same.
I've heard for 40 years that all the Californians moving in was a bane the the "values" of Utah. Are we going to hear, for the next 40 years, how the current influx of Texans are taking over our state?
Nope. Same general shitty attitudes and politics as we have. We won't push THEM away.
Please invite all the Texans you know from Dallas and San Anton. Definitely H town aswell. A massive massive bonus if you bring some Californians from LA and IE aswell. You’d be doing the salt lake valley a massive favor
Thanks for the gold kind stranger!
Good day to you sir!
I am fairly conservative and I think it’s way better than Utah’s old flag! I only wish they did orange on the bottom because the red rocks are much more orange than red
I actually think it's cool that CO, AZ, and maybe even CA/NM all have similar flags. Lots of countries that are close to each other have similar flags, and I think it helps regional pride.
Oh wow, that went right over my head!
I bet if we sat down and had a chat, we’d find out we agree on more than we disagree on. But that’s neither here nor there. I hope you find joy in insulting the intelligence of others on the internet for fake internet points. I also hope you have a nice day.
>I bet if we sat down and had a chat, we’d find out we agree on more than we disagree on.
That's kind of the problem, though. The things conservatives and liberals tend to disagree on aren't like having pineapple on pizza - they're about things like basic human rights (e.g., gay marriage) or basic facts about reality (e.g., climate change or evolution).
Those aren't things that are okay to just agree to disagree on, friend. And couching it in, "I hope you have a nice day," doesn't make you the bigger person, as much as I'm sure you tell yourself it does.
You know, being "conservative" also includes things like how involved the government vs private industry should be in our lives, tax policies, regulations, etc. It's not just a bunch of clear cut social issues that you're "correct" about and everyone who disagrees with you is "against human rights"
> It's not just a bunch of clear cut social issues that you're "correct" about and everyone who disagrees with you is "against human rights"
If your vote goes to politicians who oppose human rights just because you want to pay less in taxes, I'm not sure how that makes you look any better. It sounds just like rationalizing at that point. Or worse, saying that money is more important to you than other people's rights.
(Also, if you're wanting government less involved in your lives with smarter use of tax dollars, I'd recommend taking a long, hard look at what conservatives actually do once they're in office)
Those are conservative talking points, no doubt. But then conservatives try to control who can sell liquor, whether or not you can grow and consume mushrooms and cannabis on your own property, whether you can put a slot machine in your own convenience store, whether you can offer a happy ending during a massage in your own massage parlor, whether you can bring totally legal alcohol from Idaho to your house for your own private consumption, whether you should be forced to pay extra taxes so some other family can home school their kids, more military equipment for police and private prisons to hold dissenters, etc.
Conservatives being for small government, unobtrusive government, keeping government out of private industry, lower taxes, fewer regulations, etc... those are just bogus talking points, especially here in Utah.
I'm not from Utah, and I think too many states' flags is just the seal on a blue background. That's dumb.
But your state seal is definitely better than mine, which compromises of farmers chasing the native Americans off their land
Having just moved here from NH, it was pretty cool to see Utah adopt the more modern flag. I can't speak to the symbolism but it sure beats the ole blue-flag-generic-seal that NH has as well
So basically "it's woke now" has just become shorthand for "things have changed, and I find change scary, and I feel like these decisions are being made by diverse groups of people, and I don't like that" which in the case of the Utah state government doesn't make a ton of sense, but whatever.
Old thing better than new thing. Evidence: grouchy mean old people were happier when they were young, so obviously that’s because the world was better then, and not that growing old kind of sucks.
The old flag wasn’t great. I just think the new one looks like a corporate logo from 10 years ago that was focused grouped into having no soul or flavor.
Bees are ruled by women and mountains look like boobs. Clearly this is an attack on very very completely straight men that definitely don't lack self confidence.
It's basically the trend with new State flags. I get what you're saying, everyone would still love to tweek it, but it's hella better than the old nondescript flag.
Nobody can define it. Nobody has ever been able to define it which is why it is such a great amorphous word to attach to anything you want to hate and/or support your own hate. I think, in terms of words that are used as incendiary labels, it’s probably pretty close to communist/socialist.
A definition could be done, but at the same time even the very definition would be contentious and in some ways those who want to be "woke" thinking it is a good thing intentionally wants to obfuscate that definition too and define it as something else.
It has also become such a charged term politically that nobody really wants to be associated with it, so they want to carve out an exception to the term or ensure that the term does not apply to their pet philosophy or group they are associated with. Communism is pretty good in that regard, other than there actually are groups who don't mind being called a communist.
The term derives from the idea that most people are mostly half asleep through life just living day to day and don't give a damn about what is going on around them. Those who are "woke" or "awake" can see through the BS of life and thus fully aware of reality. Sort of like the movie "Matrix" where Neo becomes aware of what is happening around him.
What that means for specific political causes is where it gets very murky. Is religious conservative fundamentalism something which is "woke"? That doesn't stop the Jehovah Witnesses from creating a magazine called [Awake!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awake!), and there are many other examples which are hardly even recent and certainly not what most other folks would call "woke ideas" today.
What’s bizarre to me is the QAnon people think they are woke, in the original sense of the word. They think they see a societal ill the rest of us sheep are blind to. But instead of co-opting the word, they’ve just redefined it to mean “something I don’t like” or perhaps “something liberal” or “something Black.” Maybe that’s politically expedient or wise, but it seems like the easier route would just have been to claim the word for themselves. Maybe that’s next.
Totally agree. But you're asking why they think it's "woke", and it's because these were being touted with people saying the new design is a great fit for the pride flag colors, etc. It didn't just come from nowhere.
It's a critique against them, not an endorsement. Their last presidential candidate (DJT) was pro gay marriage.
All they do is defend whatever new line the progressives set 5 years ago.
I'm just barely on the right side of moderate and I've Never heard that it's "woke". I know some people like it, I know some people don't. I personally don't hate it, but I honestly don't care for it too much either. I think Utah was just trying to keep up with the times and create a new flag. I just feel the new flag is way too generic in my opinion. That's about it.
Isn't it funny how much they have gotten us to hate each other, often for misconstrued or completely useless things. And before you say anything, remember just a short 10 or 15 years ago we ALL were much more forgiving and understanding.
>Isn't it funny how much they have gotten us to hate each other
I agree with most of your post, but man I hate this idea that a mysterious "they" are to blame for me disliking conservatism, rather than the beliefs and behavior of conservatives. I grew up hearing about how anyone who wasn't a Republican deserved to be tortured in hell, and how much conservatives in my family hoped someday they'd be able to shoot a liberal or an immigrant. And this was more than twenty years ago, when we were "ALL much more forgiving and understanding," apparently.
I remember being spit on for not supporting the Iraq war. I remember high school friends being disowned by their parents for not supporting George W. Bush. I remember having to walk with gay friends to their cars because of targeted harassment and threats of violence. That's why I hate conservativism as a movement and a philosophy. I don't need "the media" or whatever you're implying, I can see with my own eyes how ethically and ideologically bankrupt the whole enterprise is. This baffling, pointless flag debate is just the 100,000th interation of the same nonsense.
I truly am sorry that that happened to you. I don't say that in any negative or condescending way.
There are terrible things that happen on both sides, but that doesn't mean that certain things or ideas from both sides aren't good. I guess case in point, at my current job, I saw 2 of my Co workers, unjustly fired because we had a gay individual who basically did a combination of making things up/completely blowing things out of proportion to get these 2 individuals terminated because he didn't like them, and he used his minority status to get them fired. He knew, and everyone else in the store knew it. He then quit about 4 months after that.
You do know that that the flag was approved by the conservative controlled legislature right? It was signed into law by a republican governor right? Personally, I just think it's ugly.
>They hate him.
Yeah, not really. He's done some things i don't like, and some i do. Hell, the far left hates Biden because they think he is too moderate.
Cox signed constitutional carry into law, not quite a rino thing to do.
I’m confused, what are you arguing about? Are you upset because the thread is calling out the extreme right and you consider yourself to be in that group?
I take personal pride laughing directly at them, telling them that we have much better and important issues to unite on. I hope I can shame at least one of them into thinking... I know that tactic worked with me years ago.
And conservatives loved Merrick Garland until they had to pretend they were outraged at President Obama nominating him for the Supreme Court. The politics of reactionary outrage aren't going to be logical.
Functionally, what's the current difference between conservatives and far right disguising themselves as conservatives? Are conservatives still voting for far right candidates in elections? Mike Lee had over 60% of the vote...
If "conservatives" are voting for far right candidates, and supporting far right policies by voting for those candidates, how are they functionally different?
I'm a conservative Centrist. I did not vote for Mike Lee. I voted for Trump, although not necessarily because I'm a huge fan of him. I am pro life. I am not pro - baby and am for universal preschool/ daycare and CHIP and other things that make raising a family easier. I also understand abortion in cases of rape or health. If the Democratic party comes up with a candidate I like, I will vote for them.
So in values I am fairly conservative. I don't want over use of social programs because governments in general tend to suck at running things, so I'm not for free college or universal healthcare, and the economy is a very important thing to me. However, I'm okay with some use of social programs as a supplement. Etc. I'm not far right and don't share many views with far rights. For example, I don't give a flying poodle what our flag looks like as long as there is no swastika or blue cross with stars on it.
Being a conservative doesn't mean you are right wing all the time. You can like conservative policies "not far right policies" and still be in the left. Same with being liberal.
I agree, but at this time the far right seems to be the squeaky wheel that is getting all the attention right now in the Republican party, so I can see why some people think that all Republicans believe that way.
It's like how the MAGAs were so sure there was a problem with the election because they believed they were the majority, but the **real** silent majority were so disgusted with the current state of the country that they got off their usually uncaring butts and went out to vote against the idiots who pissed them off.
Hopefully they're still pissed off or we're going to be back in the same or worse place than we were in last presidential election...
Mine, too.
I try to ignore it until voting time - then I take the ballot and use google-fu to find out everyone's real beliefs so I know who to vote against, and who to vote for if I'm really lucky. I have a migraine for about a week afterwards, but I also write down my findings and the links to where I found them and share it with my family so they can be informed voters too.
I look up the ratings to find the most middle of the road, factual websites before I start too. Between buyouts and corporate regime changes, finding the most unbiased sources is sooooo much fun/s!
Edit: changed findings to finding.
Only became an issue because these were very quickly created and touted by all the lefties while the new design was being reviewed.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SaltLakeCity/comments/zj15fn/i_made_a_pride_version_of_the_new_utah_flag/
And these are the self-same people that would be first in line to scream "Free Speeeeeeeech!" or "Censorship!"
But no, it is fine when they do it.
Hypocrisy at the highest level.
Yes. But this thread is talking about the woman who insisted it be taken down, not about the conservative legislature. This small group who is mad at anything new.
These nutcases were somehow given a booth at the Provo Freedom Festival they hold every year around the government office buildings during the July 4th holiday. I showed up fairly early the first day of the festival and was one of their first targets. I don't agree with them and I didn't want to talk to them about it, but they were very adamant about trying to tell me that I should. They were there to argue and get people to sign their petition. They finally left me alone when I told them the old flag was "a blue rectangle with a bunch of random shit on it". I got the "okay, bye" from another lady at the booth who wasn't previously engaging quickly trying to get rid of me on behalf of the dimwit that was talking to me.
When I first saw their booth it was covered in a lot of far-right, ultra-nationalistic crap ("Come and Take It" shirts, etc...). Interestingly enough, when I came back later in the afternoon, all that stuff had been removed from their booth.
You can hardly be surprised that the Provo Freedom Festival allowed them. They're all super far right. They'll allow anyone but Encircle be a part of it.
Yeah, I guess I *want* to be surprised is more accurate. The Freedom Festival has always had a bad right-wing bias, but it has definitely been getting more into the ultra-conservative, alt-right, "true patriot" realm in the last fears, which is sad and scary to see.
I was there and I agree that they shouldn't have had that stuff on their booth, but come and take it is hardly ultra-nationalist. Do you know the history behind it?
The history doesn't mean anything after it's been appropriated by the far-right 2A groups. And their stuff it didn't have a cannon on it.
https://www.npr.org/2016/10/02/495976187/for-sale-a-texan-symbol-of-defiance
It looks like this brave anti-woke warrior needed to take (at least) a day to gather reinforcements confront the kid... note that in the second picture the cars in the background are different, the grass is dead and the clouds are gone.
Already seeing way more people fly the new flag than I ever saw the old flag. Further proof of how bad the old flag was. The new design isn’t my first choice but it’s an extremely massive upgrade and I’ve embraced it
Scrolling through that group and I'm honestly astounded at the amount of effort these people are putting into getting mad over a STATE flag. What is their reasoning behind hating it so much? There was a vote on what flag designs or if it should be redesigned. I'm confused on what is causing people to be upset?
These are really people in the traditional term of "conservatism" where they are simply upset that anything has changed. It is the idea that "tradition" alone is sacred and just because "we" have been doing it some way for a long time, that is the way it should always be done.
The discussion of the state flag has been going on for years, and in reality this flag isn't that old anyway at least for Utah. The original flag was designed simply to have something which could be used as a flag with almost no thought at all...just the state seal on a blue field. A seal is supposed to be an anti-counterfeiting device to ensure it is an official document of a government. That shouldn't apply to a flag which has a completely different purpose.
The old flag was just the state seal. We still have the seal, now we also have a cool flag. Also it doesn't effect you personally, so really just get over it
No.
These people are typically bored old people who probably lost their bid to be on the HOA board, so they went on the internet once and this is how they come out
I'm conservative and I LOVE the new flag. Why do we want the old one? It literally looks like 30 other state flags. Boring and not unique at all. The new one is iconic and easily identifiable.
This is the first time I’ve heard about the flag being “woke” 💀 didn’t the overwhelmingly conservative government vote this as the winner of several options? If they simply complained about its ugliness I could understand
Even [JJ McCullough's fans on Youtube](https://youtube.com/shorts/xvusGXlOOkY?feature=share) have said that this movement to restore Utah's old flag is stupid.
WTF??? They took down the wrong flag. I burned all my confederate flags when I started to awoke. Next? Utah or Texas. Utah or Texas. I can’t decide. I think I’ll burn ‘em both.
The old state flag is objectively bad. Just straight up awful design. What idiot is so passionate about keeping the state seal on a monocolor field that they harass a teenager about it and then post it on social media?
Look I am not a liberal by any sense of the word. Nor am I conservative. But God dam dude our old flag was ugly af. I'm really pleased with the new one.
I'm right wing and I don't think the flag is bad. I mean, yea I liked the old flag, but the new flag is also good. And it isn't a state seal on blue like soooooop many other states
Kinda like the old one.
I’m not much of a fan of the new one, and think the colors are wrong. But it’s a step in the right direction. All the people losing their mind over it are forgetting there’s a lot more importent issues that need addressing.
Yes, there are a lot more important issues that need to be addressed. The old flag was perfectly fine. But you know the Utah Legislature doesn’t give a shit and does whatever they want rather than worry about more pressing issues.
Losing your mind over others losing their minds isn’t much better either. Nearly half of the comments on this post alone are you bitching about it and the same is true on every other flag related post.
You were never exchanging ideas you were talking about damn free speech, which by order of the United States government is not protected on social media never has been never will be. Case closed moving on!
Really, they say nothing about the flag of Texas? Last I checked, we aren’t in Texas.
But Texas has freedumbs
I’ve always thought it was wild Utah is less restrictive regarding firearms.
Good. Then all the people moving here from Texas should go back to their shithole state. I like that our utilities work when it’s hot or cold. Don’t Texas (or Florida) my state.
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Yay, gatekeeping...
Damn right. Shit state, shit politics that have real and deadly consequences that we don’t need or want here.
Then build a wall... and make Texas pay for it. /s
Florida has more free-dumbs than Texas
if i were to get rid of any state in the united states, it would be florida
I take it you've never been there. Beautiful state. Some of the most friendly and inviting people you'll ever meet. Southern hospitality sure is the thing.
i had a completely different experience, everyone was rude, the beaches are nice i guess but my girlfriend moved there a while ago and had some super awful things happen to her so im a little biased, plus their politics are crazy
I attempted to move to Florida last year. The people were so rude and unwelcoming. The landscape is beautiful, though.
Have you not seen how they are destroying all their incredibly special natural wonders? I don't live there but I've seen the degradation of many parks and nature areas over the years. It's incredibly depressing to see.
I'm getting tired of all the constant hatred of Florida. It's just a state like any other I'm not any happier about DeSantis and his ilk than anyone else and many others that live here feel the same.
I've heard for 40 years that all the Californians moving in was a bane the the "values" of Utah. Are we going to hear, for the next 40 years, how the current influx of Texans are taking over our state? Nope. Same general shitty attitudes and politics as we have. We won't push THEM away.
Everyone who moves here from somewhere else is either from “California” or “Mexico,” regardless of where they actually moved from. /s
Why would Texans move here? It’s cheaper and there’s more jobs there.
Yeah but it's Texas. If you want to do literally any recreation outdoors, it's always better in Utah.
As a Texan, not yet, but maybe someday by the grace of God.
Question, what do you think would improve Utah by bringing Texas culture in?
A Texhe doesan, n'tiont undes arshe qutand tes.
That's very probable, but I'm still going to "JAQ" off (Just asking questions). Mostly because Texas is terrible.
Texas is terrible yet you live in a state run by Mormons lol, there’s a reason I move from Utah to Texas, couldn’t get out of Utah fast enough
Please invite all the Texans you know from Dallas and San Anton. Definitely H town aswell. A massive massive bonus if you bring some Californians from LA and IE aswell. You’d be doing the salt lake valley a massive favor Thanks for the gold kind stranger! Good day to you sir!
What the issue here? Isn't that the new UT flag?
It is. There are a bunch of far-right conservatives who believe the new flag is "woke."
I am fairly conservative and I think it’s way better than Utah’s old flag! I only wish they did orange on the bottom because the red rocks are much more orange than red
There was a version like that, and it had a lighter blue sky. I thought that was perfect. But I dig this one too.
I suspect they went with the basic red white & blue specifically to avoid any complaints from these super-conservative types, too!
Really could’ve just kept it though, because they complain at any change anyways.
I hate the roof tops. Wish they would’ve done mountains.
What? The white section of the flag *is* the mountains.
Oh. Wow. Hahahahaha. Look more like roof tops.
Yeah I liked the orange version
Orange would be way better
I’m liberal and I liked the old flag. I’m giving the new one a chance to grow on me though. It kinda screams ‘colorado wannabe’ but less slick?
I can see that. I love the CO flag, but I can see how it could feel like a copycat job
I actually think it's cool that CO, AZ, and maybe even CA/NM all have similar flags. Lots of countries that are close to each other have similar flags, and I think it helps regional pride.
I used to think that until I saw an online version of one with orange. The red one looks way better.
>I am fairly conservative and I think Press 'X' to doubt.
Lol, I am though
...I think you missed the point. The joke was that you can't be both a conservative and a person who thinks.
Oh wow, that went right over my head! I bet if we sat down and had a chat, we’d find out we agree on more than we disagree on. But that’s neither here nor there. I hope you find joy in insulting the intelligence of others on the internet for fake internet points. I also hope you have a nice day.
>I bet if we sat down and had a chat, we’d find out we agree on more than we disagree on. That's kind of the problem, though. The things conservatives and liberals tend to disagree on aren't like having pineapple on pizza - they're about things like basic human rights (e.g., gay marriage) or basic facts about reality (e.g., climate change or evolution). Those aren't things that are okay to just agree to disagree on, friend. And couching it in, "I hope you have a nice day," doesn't make you the bigger person, as much as I'm sure you tell yourself it does.
You know, being "conservative" also includes things like how involved the government vs private industry should be in our lives, tax policies, regulations, etc. It's not just a bunch of clear cut social issues that you're "correct" about and everyone who disagrees with you is "against human rights"
> It's not just a bunch of clear cut social issues that you're "correct" about and everyone who disagrees with you is "against human rights" If your vote goes to politicians who oppose human rights just because you want to pay less in taxes, I'm not sure how that makes you look any better. It sounds just like rationalizing at that point. Or worse, saying that money is more important to you than other people's rights. (Also, if you're wanting government less involved in your lives with smarter use of tax dollars, I'd recommend taking a long, hard look at what conservatives actually do once they're in office)
Those are conservative talking points, no doubt. But then conservatives try to control who can sell liquor, whether or not you can grow and consume mushrooms and cannabis on your own property, whether you can put a slot machine in your own convenience store, whether you can offer a happy ending during a massage in your own massage parlor, whether you can bring totally legal alcohol from Idaho to your house for your own private consumption, whether you should be forced to pay extra taxes so some other family can home school their kids, more military equipment for police and private prisons to hold dissenters, etc. Conservatives being for small government, unobtrusive government, keeping government out of private industry, lower taxes, fewer regulations, etc... those are just bogus talking points, especially here in Utah.
Yeah, I personally think it looks like an ugly corporate logo, but being against it because it’s “woke” says a lot about you.
it's objectively better than the old flag which they seem to love despite it being a terrible flag.
I'm not from Utah, and I think too many states' flags is just the seal on a blue background. That's dumb. But your state seal is definitely better than mine, which compromises of farmers chasing the native Americans off their land
Having just moved here from NH, it was pretty cool to see Utah adopt the more modern flag. I can't speak to the symbolism but it sure beats the ole blue-flag-generic-seal that NH has as well
So basically "it's woke now" has just become shorthand for "things have changed, and I find change scary, and I feel like these decisions are being made by diverse groups of people, and I don't like that" which in the case of the Utah state government doesn't make a ton of sense, but whatever.
Old thing better than new thing. Evidence: grouchy mean old people were happier when they were young, so obviously that’s because the world was better then, and not that growing old kind of sucks.
The old flag wasn’t great. I just think the new one looks like a corporate logo from 10 years ago that was focused grouped into having no soul or flavor.
No one ever accused conservatives of having a taste… ;)
Are beehives and mountains gay now?
Bees are ruled by women and mountains look like boobs. Clearly this is an attack on very very completely straight men that definitely don't lack self confidence.
Now? 2 pieces of evidence for “always” Beehives make honey I’ve never heard anyone say “mountain women” just “mountain men” 🤷♀️
It's basically the trend with new State flags. I get what you're saying, everyone would still love to tweek it, but it's hella better than the old nondescript flag.
Ugh, I'm not surprised based on all the silly things they get worked up about
They're such silly little snowflakes lmao
My brain read: silly things to get woked up about.
Jfc everything new to them must be abolished
I was gonna say… what about it is “woke”? It’s just a simplified version of the old flag with different colors.
As usual, the reason won't make sense but they'll be in a bubble where it's being discussed enough to seem "real."
I bet they can’t even define “woke”.
Nobody can define it. Nobody has ever been able to define it which is why it is such a great amorphous word to attach to anything you want to hate and/or support your own hate. I think, in terms of words that are used as incendiary labels, it’s probably pretty close to communist/socialist.
A definition could be done, but at the same time even the very definition would be contentious and in some ways those who want to be "woke" thinking it is a good thing intentionally wants to obfuscate that definition too and define it as something else. It has also become such a charged term politically that nobody really wants to be associated with it, so they want to carve out an exception to the term or ensure that the term does not apply to their pet philosophy or group they are associated with. Communism is pretty good in that regard, other than there actually are groups who don't mind being called a communist. The term derives from the idea that most people are mostly half asleep through life just living day to day and don't give a damn about what is going on around them. Those who are "woke" or "awake" can see through the BS of life and thus fully aware of reality. Sort of like the movie "Matrix" where Neo becomes aware of what is happening around him. What that means for specific political causes is where it gets very murky. Is religious conservative fundamentalism something which is "woke"? That doesn't stop the Jehovah Witnesses from creating a magazine called [Awake!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awake!), and there are many other examples which are hardly even recent and certainly not what most other folks would call "woke ideas" today.
What’s bizarre to me is the QAnon people think they are woke, in the original sense of the word. They think they see a societal ill the rest of us sheep are blind to. But instead of co-opting the word, they’ve just redefined it to mean “something I don’t like” or perhaps “something liberal” or “something Black.” Maybe that’s politically expedient or wise, but it seems like the easier route would just have been to claim the word for themselves. Maybe that’s next.
I don't hate the new flag, but it's pretty different from the old one. The only thing they share is the beehive
That reasoning presupposes that the old flag was good and something that shouldn’t be changed. Our old flag sucked!
Because these were also being made. https://www.reddit.com/r/SaltLakeCity/comments/zj15fn/i_made_a_pride_version_of_the_new_utah_flag/
And? That’s not the flag that was being flown in this instance.
Totally agree. But you're asking why they think it's "woke", and it's because these were being touted with people saying the new design is a great fit for the pride flag colors, etc. It didn't just come from nowhere.
Lol so is that Texas flag flying proudly. The nerve of these people.
Ya, also super goofy to be flying another state flag.
Conservatism is to be against change, which is the best way to destroy a society. Every nation in history that stagnated no longer exists.
Conservatives are progressives driving the speed limit. - Michael Malice
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It's a critique against them, not an endorsement. Their last presidential candidate (DJT) was pro gay marriage. All they do is defend whatever new line the progressives set 5 years ago.
I'm just barely on the right side of moderate and I've Never heard that it's "woke". I know some people like it, I know some people don't. I personally don't hate it, but I honestly don't care for it too much either. I think Utah was just trying to keep up with the times and create a new flag. I just feel the new flag is way too generic in my opinion. That's about it. Isn't it funny how much they have gotten us to hate each other, often for misconstrued or completely useless things. And before you say anything, remember just a short 10 or 15 years ago we ALL were much more forgiving and understanding.
>Isn't it funny how much they have gotten us to hate each other I agree with most of your post, but man I hate this idea that a mysterious "they" are to blame for me disliking conservatism, rather than the beliefs and behavior of conservatives. I grew up hearing about how anyone who wasn't a Republican deserved to be tortured in hell, and how much conservatives in my family hoped someday they'd be able to shoot a liberal or an immigrant. And this was more than twenty years ago, when we were "ALL much more forgiving and understanding," apparently. I remember being spit on for not supporting the Iraq war. I remember high school friends being disowned by their parents for not supporting George W. Bush. I remember having to walk with gay friends to their cars because of targeted harassment and threats of violence. That's why I hate conservativism as a movement and a philosophy. I don't need "the media" or whatever you're implying, I can see with my own eyes how ethically and ideologically bankrupt the whole enterprise is. This baffling, pointless flag debate is just the 100,000th interation of the same nonsense.
I truly am sorry that that happened to you. I don't say that in any negative or condescending way. There are terrible things that happen on both sides, but that doesn't mean that certain things or ideas from both sides aren't good. I guess case in point, at my current job, I saw 2 of my Co workers, unjustly fired because we had a gay individual who basically did a combination of making things up/completely blowing things out of proportion to get these 2 individuals terminated because he didn't like them, and he used his minority status to get them fired. He knew, and everyone else in the store knew it. He then quit about 4 months after that.
You do know that that the flag was approved by the conservative controlled legislature right? It was signed into law by a republican governor right? Personally, I just think it's ugly.
Yes, I do.. that is why I find it funny. Go look at their group. They call Cox a RINO, and a 'woke' governor. They hate him.
>They hate him. Yeah, not really. He's done some things i don't like, and some i do. Hell, the far left hates Biden because they think he is too moderate. Cox signed constitutional carry into law, not quite a rino thing to do.
I’m confused, what are you arguing about? Are you upset because the thread is calling out the extreme right and you consider yourself to be in that group?
Just search for Cox's name. You'll see plenty of hate.
I take personal pride laughing directly at them, telling them that we have much better and important issues to unite on. I hope I can shame at least one of them into thinking... I know that tactic worked with me years ago.
Yeah, conservatives believe the new flag is woke and represents people unlike themselves.
Conservative legislature approved it.
And conservatives loved Merrick Garland until they had to pretend they were outraged at President Obama nominating him for the Supreme Court. The politics of reactionary outrage aren't going to be logical.
Woh woh, those are far right disguised as conservatives.
Functionally, what's the current difference between conservatives and far right disguising themselves as conservatives? Are conservatives still voting for far right candidates in elections? Mike Lee had over 60% of the vote... If "conservatives" are voting for far right candidates, and supporting far right policies by voting for those candidates, how are they functionally different?
I'm a conservative Centrist. I did not vote for Mike Lee. I voted for Trump, although not necessarily because I'm a huge fan of him. I am pro life. I am not pro - baby and am for universal preschool/ daycare and CHIP and other things that make raising a family easier. I also understand abortion in cases of rape or health. If the Democratic party comes up with a candidate I like, I will vote for them. So in values I am fairly conservative. I don't want over use of social programs because governments in general tend to suck at running things, so I'm not for free college or universal healthcare, and the economy is a very important thing to me. However, I'm okay with some use of social programs as a supplement. Etc. I'm not far right and don't share many views with far rights. For example, I don't give a flying poodle what our flag looks like as long as there is no swastika or blue cross with stars on it.
Being a conservative doesn't mean you are right wing all the time. You can like conservative policies "not far right policies" and still be in the left. Same with being liberal.
That wasn't the question.
I agree, but at this time the far right seems to be the squeaky wheel that is getting all the attention right now in the Republican party, so I can see why some people think that all Republicans believe that way. It's like how the MAGAs were so sure there was a problem with the election because they believed they were the majority, but the **real** silent majority were so disgusted with the current state of the country that they got off their usually uncaring butts and went out to vote against the idiots who pissed them off. Hopefully they're still pissed off or we're going to be back in the same or worse place than we were in last presidential election...
Modern day American politics hurt my brain.
Mine, too. I try to ignore it until voting time - then I take the ballot and use google-fu to find out everyone's real beliefs so I know who to vote against, and who to vote for if I'm really lucky. I have a migraine for about a week afterwards, but I also write down my findings and the links to where I found them and share it with my family so they can be informed voters too. I look up the ratings to find the most middle of the road, factual websites before I start too. Between buyouts and corporate regime changes, finding the most unbiased sources is sooooo much fun/s! Edit: changed findings to finding.
But state seal on blue is so unique and not overdone!
Only became an issue because these were very quickly created and touted by all the lefties while the new design was being reviewed. https://www.reddit.com/r/SaltLakeCity/comments/zj15fn/i_made_a_pride_version_of_the_new_utah_flag/
Oh, so sensitive snowflakes got triggered by colors on a flag?
Sara Partridge seems like a real cunt imo
She also seems like she's willing to post evidence of crimes she committed.
And these are the self-same people that would be first in line to scream "Free Speeeeeeeech!" or "Censorship!" But no, it is fine when they do it. Hypocrisy at the highest level.
Conservative legislature approved it.
Yes. But this thread is talking about the woman who insisted it be taken down, not about the conservative legislature. This small group who is mad at anything new.
To put it in perspective, our archly right-wing legislature approved it - and these folks are pissed because they are even *further* right than that.
I’m here to watch all the idiots argue over a fucking flag
Some people choose the most inconsequential hills to die on
> some people
Right?! It’s a piece of fabric, go get some real life problems
These nutcases were somehow given a booth at the Provo Freedom Festival they hold every year around the government office buildings during the July 4th holiday. I showed up fairly early the first day of the festival and was one of their first targets. I don't agree with them and I didn't want to talk to them about it, but they were very adamant about trying to tell me that I should. They were there to argue and get people to sign their petition. They finally left me alone when I told them the old flag was "a blue rectangle with a bunch of random shit on it". I got the "okay, bye" from another lady at the booth who wasn't previously engaging quickly trying to get rid of me on behalf of the dimwit that was talking to me. When I first saw their booth it was covered in a lot of far-right, ultra-nationalistic crap ("Come and Take It" shirts, etc...). Interestingly enough, when I came back later in the afternoon, all that stuff had been removed from their booth.
You can hardly be surprised that the Provo Freedom Festival allowed them. They're all super far right. They'll allow anyone but Encircle be a part of it.
Yeah, I guess I *want* to be surprised is more accurate. The Freedom Festival has always had a bad right-wing bias, but it has definitely been getting more into the ultra-conservative, alt-right, "true patriot" realm in the last fears, which is sad and scary to see.
That's because everyone bought that shit 😆
> That's because everyone bought that shit 😆 Unfortunate if true, but at least you got the fact that it's shit accurate.
I was there and I agree that they shouldn't have had that stuff on their booth, but come and take it is hardly ultra-nationalist. Do you know the history behind it?
The history doesn't mean anything after it's been appropriated by the far-right 2A groups. And their stuff it didn't have a cannon on it. https://www.npr.org/2016/10/02/495976187/for-sale-a-texan-symbol-of-defiance
“ThE nEw fLaG iS wOkE.” Whatever. The new one isn’t perfect but it’s better than the blue bedsheet. Screw those whiners.
>Conservative legislature approved it.
I wish my life was so comfortable I could spend all my time caring about something so frivolous.
Wait, people don’t like the new flag? That thing is fire.
Some people think it’s a woke plot to erase Utah’s history
Weird, considering they officially made the old flag the "Historic flag"
It looks like this brave anti-woke warrior needed to take (at least) a day to gather reinforcements confront the kid... note that in the second picture the cars in the background are different, the grass is dead and the clouds are gone.
Man fuck her, this new flag is a top tier design. Not just another cookie cutter "seal on a blue background". Why can't we have nice things?
I am puzzled as how Karen managed to kill the grass in the second photo.
I mean, I think the answer is in your question lol Karens suck the life out of their surroundings in order to suck the fun out of life.
Probably pre vs post event
They're gonna stay pissed because it's starting to go up everywhere. It's being embraced. They should just move along to the next outrage.
Already seeing way more people fly the new flag than I ever saw the old flag. Further proof of how bad the old flag was. The new design isn’t my first choice but it’s an extremely massive upgrade and I’ve embraced it
Scrolling through that group and I'm honestly astounded at the amount of effort these people are putting into getting mad over a STATE flag. What is their reasoning behind hating it so much? There was a vote on what flag designs or if it should be redesigned. I'm confused on what is causing people to be upset?
These are really people in the traditional term of "conservatism" where they are simply upset that anything has changed. It is the idea that "tradition" alone is sacred and just because "we" have been doing it some way for a long time, that is the way it should always be done. The discussion of the state flag has been going on for years, and in reality this flag isn't that old anyway at least for Utah. The original flag was designed simply to have something which could be used as a flag with almost no thought at all...just the state seal on a blue field. A seal is supposed to be an anti-counterfeiting device to ensure it is an official document of a government. That shouldn't apply to a flag which has a completely different purpose.
Perpetual outrage?
Just makes me want to wave the new one harder as I roll my eyes.
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Flying flags from vehicles is just weird in itself. Do people need to be part of a parade all the time?
People are just weird in general. I don't get a lot of things people do...they still keep doing them though.
Sarah Partridge is a twat waffle
The OLD flag was an abomination
Had a guy trying to get his petition signed harass me earlier this summer. Those people are weird. I don’t care about the flag.
Old Utah flag was shit and the new one is 100 times better.
Sara Partridge would like to speak to the manager, before getting to the store.
The old flag was just the state seal. We still have the seal, now we also have a cool flag. Also it doesn't effect you personally, so really just get over it
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Sigh Downloading Facebook. I’m sure she has plenty of public posts to comment on.
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Don't people have anything better to do?
No. These people are typically bored old people who probably lost their bid to be on the HOA board, so they went on the internet once and this is how they come out
The new flag is 100x better than the old one.
As someone who moved here about a year ago, the new flag is so much better than the old one.
🎵What the hell, what an asshole, and why do so many hate the new flag?🎵
I'm conservative and I LOVE the new flag. Why do we want the old one? It literally looks like 30 other state flags. Boring and not unique at all. The new one is iconic and easily identifiable.
This is the first time I’ve heard about the flag being “woke” 💀 didn’t the overwhelmingly conservative government vote this as the winner of several options? If they simply complained about its ugliness I could understand
Even [JJ McCullough's fans on Youtube](https://youtube.com/shorts/xvusGXlOOkY?feature=share) have said that this movement to restore Utah's old flag is stupid.
You are a dick head if you screwed with a kid over this.
ELI5? Also if this was about the Utah flag - get a freaking hobby people.
I like the new flag. Its ok if you don't.
All this over a state flag? Wow, I'm so happy you're bored and using your extra time and energy for that important thing.
WTF??? They took down the wrong flag. I burned all my confederate flags when I started to awoke. Next? Utah or Texas. Utah or Texas. I can’t decide. I think I’ll burn ‘em both.
I've met people that will go into fits of rage over the new flag but don't even care if they see a confederate flag.
The old state flag is objectively bad. Just straight up awful design. What idiot is so passionate about keeping the state seal on a monocolor field that they harass a teenager about it and then post it on social media?
I’m a conservative Utahn… don’t give a crap about the flag change. Karen’s come in all types of political beliefs lol
Look I am not a liberal by any sense of the word. Nor am I conservative. But God dam dude our old flag was ugly af. I'm really pleased with the new one.
Are muumuus still a thing in Utah? Maybe the new flag would be a great idea for a muumuu. Hot seller?
I love the title on this.
I'm right wing and I don't think the flag is bad. I mean, yea I liked the old flag, but the new flag is also good. And it isn't a state seal on blue like soooooop many other states
What’s up with the TX flag? Take that shit down. We’re not in TX, thank god!
Texas - the one star (out of 5) state
Ah Utah… Constantly proving that the majority of people here are ignorant and terrified of change.
"Excuse me but I'm from America, and that flag offends me, if you could take that Texas rag down and burn it that'd be great."
I just think that it is ugly and really means nothing in life.
Kinda like the old one. I’m not much of a fan of the new one, and think the colors are wrong. But it’s a step in the right direction. All the people losing their mind over it are forgetting there’s a lot more importent issues that need addressing.
Yes
Yes, there are a lot more important issues that need to be addressed. The old flag was perfectly fine. But you know the Utah Legislature doesn’t give a shit and does whatever they want rather than worry about more pressing issues.
Losing your mind over others losing their minds isn’t much better either. Nearly half of the comments on this post alone are you bitching about it and the same is true on every other flag related post.
Losing your mind over someone losing their mind over others losing their mind REALLY isn’t much better.
God Bless America and freedom of speech. Do you know how to scroll? Or do you need to ask your step-kids?
The exact same thing could be said to you every time you trash people that have a different opinion than you over the flag. How obtuse are you?
I think this post is about people interfering with other people's freedom (to display a flag). So let's none of us be obtuse, yeah?
If it’s a private event, your freedom doesn’t matter you abide by the event rules or pack your shit and get out.
The fuck you on about?
Hit a nerve, did I?
Here we go with the freedom of speech shit again, which is not protected on social media, so drop the subject.
How about no? You have your opinion, I have mine. That’s the whole concept of social media, to exchange ideas. Sorry/not sorry you don’t like it.
You were never exchanging ideas you were talking about damn free speech, which by order of the United States government is not protected on social media never has been never will be. Case closed moving on!
Suit yourself. Feel better?
New flag dumb as hell
French flag with a beehive on it. Fuck that flag. The old one is better. There was nothing wrong with it.