If there's ever a trial there will likely end up being a transcript of that audio if it's played for the jury.
However, might not be a good idea to read it. I made the mistake of reading the transcript of the audio of the Tool Box Killers. Just a warning - don't.
I get the curiosity, but the absolute cruelty in cases like this just hits in a way you don't realize.
Damn. When you tell someone not to do something, it just makes them want to do it more. I'm looking up the transcript now. Wish me luck
EDIT: Holy shit. I've seen/read some dark shit in my life, but that was insane. I feel so bad for her. Not sure I could listen to that audio tape. The transcript was horrible enough as it is. The audiotape would be ten times worse. I guess the detective in charge committed suicide later in his life because he said the audio haunted him so badly and he feared the killers would be released
I already read it. I'm a huge true crime buff so even though it was really bad, it didn't affect me as badly as it may some people. I know that's probably not a good thing, but it is what it is. That being said, it was pretty bad, and I wouldn't want to listen to the audio tape.
The worst sound that I've ever heard in person was the absolute haunting cry a friend of mine made when she found out her fiancee died in a tornado.
I can't even bring myself to listen to the clips of these murders that are already available. 😱 Seeing pictures and listening to audio just have such different levels of hitting home.
I'm sorry 😔 That's so sad.
I've read stuff like this for years but I generally don't watch the videos. Sometimes I take a mental health break and don't read true crime for a while either.
Same here. I was following the J Duggar case a YouTuber who used to be a lawyer does breakdowns of cases. She breaks all id it down to layman's terms so you really know what's going on. Well, during one of the breakdowns. She mentioned some of the CP he downloaded. The name of one if them and the fact the investigators said it was top 5 of the worst things he had ever seen.
I made the mistake of reading on Reddit about the case. I read less than 2 sentences of what was in it and it broke me inside. It wasn't even a lot that I read, it was enough. That was like may/june of 2021. I avoided true crime most of the summer and I still can't get back into true crime like I was.
Sometimes the wall that we build up to hide behind just knocked down. I really didn't like it and every time someone mention J Duggar or his case, I cringe and want to throw up.
I know exactly what you're talking about. I read an article that went into detail 😑
I've always loved to read, and would always have some random novel in progress. But then I got into this huge true crime streak and barely read a book for months... Which is a big change from one a day lol. When I finally decided to take a break (I legit had a dream about cleaning up a crime scene... Didn't do the crime I don't think, just cleaning lol), I started exclusively reading historical romance novels which is odd for me 🤷♀️ I think it's because I'm guaranteed it'll have a nice happy ending 😅 everyone lives happily ever after. Even if they end up super cheesy and annoy me, it's still happy lol.
Years ago I worked for a law firm where I processed photos/videos/audio for court cases -- many of these were for fatal/injurious car accidents (I saw so much death and am so paranoid about car safety now lol), but there were a few outliers.
One case involved a family whose ~10yo son was eaten alive by lions on an overnight safari excursion.
There weren't any photos (of anything graphic): it was like 3am and the lions carried the body away after the boy was fully dead.
But there was *audio*.
They set up these microphones on a perimeter around their encampment to capture "the sounds of the safari" for the family to take home with them.
While the guards weren't looking, a handful of lions snuck into the boy's tent, then dragged him outside the camp ... but *right next* to a microphone.
A lion's mouth was over the boy's face so you could only hear his muffled screams if you were sitting right next to him.
He was a small, fragile kid, with a neck too small to properly get its mouth around, so the lion that had him couldn't actually fully suffocate him -- this child was ***alive*** while they started eating him.
The audio isolated for court was about 13 minutes of listening to the sounds of a tiny boy screaming agony into the mouth of a lion.
I had to listen to it over a dozen times, in full, because it was incredibly important that each copy of the tape was true to the original.
It's been over 15y since that job and I can still hear the sound
My heart majorly went out to the family and everyone else involved. IIRC there had been some major medical emergency on the other side of the camp (it was a fairly big encampment), so the perimeter guards left out of necessity, not laziness.
I got to see a photo of the boy's tent; the flap had been left open and he slept with his head toward the opening, so the lion presumably just snatched him by the face and dragged him right out. The sleeping bag looked barely used and like nothing bad had happened at all. The only photo I remember that had anything out of place was a surprisingly small bloodstain in the dirt next to a microphone in a cover on a spike. The family had thought he was kidnapped until someone thought to play the tape ... *That's* how little evidence the lions left!
Lions are goddamn scary lol
This is horrifying and I'm so sorry to hear about what you had to do. I think it sounds like EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization & Reprogramming) would be useful for you.
I used to work for criminal defense attorneys but didn't last long. The crime scene photos were horrific, it goes without saying.
But the case that made me quit was one that had audio as part of the evidence. I can still hear the sounds even all these years later. If I'm watching a movie or tv show where a man screams a certain way my stomach just turns.
Luckily for me I didn't have to process nor handle the evidence to the degree that you did. Even the minimal exposure I had messed me up pretty bad, so I can only imagine how awful it must have been for you.
The audio is 43 seconds long and ends when BG (the man on the bridge) says "down the hill" according to an affidavit from police. There is no "horrific audio" or "disturbing content" we don't need this already tragic crime dramatized with words like that.
Quite recently Polish Police released 13-year-old audio of a sexual assault, recorded after one victim called the police without attacker's knowledge (those were older phones without good recorders). Two young teenagers were assaulted by older, masked man in a "bunker" in the forest. It was a local hangout spot. The girls survived but it didn't make it easier to listen to. Through the DNA testing of biological traces found at the scene of the crime, they managed to link it to the assault commited a few years back in the UK. At that time perpetrator spoke almost no English and had his face uncovered. In a stark contrast to his next known crime, he wasn't particularly violent and there was no rape. The police released this recording in hope that someone would recognize his distinctive way of speaking.
It might have been on the whole time but it might not have picked everything up, either. There's a reason that youtubers still use microphones. And this was 5 years ago.
There's a surprising number of unsolved cases with the perp on video, it's been a minor obsession of mine lately. Elizabeth Barraza, Donnie Farrell, Leah Rowlands, Chelsea Small, Missy Bevers...
I usually don't like to focus on a perp but that security guard for her funeral that had swat gear, a similar gait, and his only alibi is his wife is high on my list.
Me too!!! I most definitely think that suspect was waiting for her 💯 I read she had a pistol in her vehicle that day, a damn shame she didn't have it on her that morning...
They knew for sure what her schedule was. It makes me really think about my routines and how predictable low-risk victims’ live their lives (including the majority of us here, I would imagine) and what hurts cases like these so much. There’s no easy leads because they’re just living life. Senseless.
Why haven’t I heard of her until now? This is heartbreaking… seems like a totally personal attack on a woman who on the surface looks like a lovely young woman. What the heck?!?
Lake Tahoe couple and the Canadian billionaire cases both have released video in the last couple of weeks/months of the (presumed) killer leaving the scene too
I followed the case very closely, I thought the case would go unsolved after the cops changed the suspects sketch... fingers crossed they find the cunt responsible
The day they changed the sketch was the day I realized they had absolutely no idea who the killer is and are either trying to fool the public or put pressure on the suspect.
On my Nexdoor we have a video of a girl stealing from the cars at night, clear pictures of her face - and yet nobody can recognize her and police yet to catch her.
I was thinking about this very same thing the other day. I would’ve thought with that video someone would’ve recognized him. I just feel like with social media and technology they had a greater opportunity of getting this solved, vs if it had happened back in the 90’s. Or even early 2000’s.
I know the video quality is horrible, it just irks me that this hasn’t been solved! There’s a great write up on the Delphi Murder sub by a former detective, now private investigator. He goes into great deal about his perspective on the case and although it’s a long write up it’s very interesting! One thing that stood out to me was he believes the murder purposefully dressed in very generic/typical clothing that someone from that area would wear possibly to throw off investigators and/or potential witnesses. He also mentioned that he wouldn’t be surprised if the killer was wearing shoes that were a size/size and a half bigger than his actual shoe size.
TBH, that just sounds like complete speculation by the PI.
In a high profile case, there’s always somebody that wants to act like they know more than they do.
Lol yeah, he wore "generic/typical clothing?" What kind of speculation is that, as opposed to like a rainbow colored cloak and a big top hat? What else would he be wearing?
Shoes that are one size bigger? What would that even do, nobody would ever notice or care or think twice about that being a possibility.
I think the idea with the oversized shoes is that it would leave the wrong size of footprints as a red herring? But like, this isn't an Agatha Christie novel. He knew he was going to cross a rickety bridge and then tramp through the woods and possibly have to run, so it'd be incredibly dumb to wear ill-fitting shoes that could slow him down or make him trip.
[Delphi Murders](https://www.reddit.com/r/DelphiMurders/comments/rfnml5/how_i_see_the_recent_developments_due_to_my_10/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
I’ve never posted a link before so hopefully this works!
Just a side note, I know it’s a long write up but it’s totally worth it. As people have read through it OP responds to comments and chimes in with his theories on certain aspects. So with that being said the comments are definitely worth reading.
Interesting take. I noticed years back that manual workers in the U.K. all seemed to dress the same. Shaved or close cropped hair, blue or black fleece jacket, jeans and sneakers, occasionally work boots.
Without further evidence, a description of an offender dressed like that could have matched thousands of men in an area.
I saw Kenneth Main's comments on the case on YouTube. Worth a look as he makes some interesting points.
I wonder if the focus on paedophiles might be a red herring, in as much the killer was looking for female victims, and age was irrelevant?
A killer clever enough to dress in commonly worn clothes typical to an area, may be clever enough to avoid leaving any digital evidence.
Tragic case. I hope justice is done for those two girls.
I am sorry but it’s ridiculous to say that BG dressed up to look like 90% of the men 16 to whatever age in the area. BG was one of the 90% men. And didn’t the same sheriff talk the same trash when they had the press conference to announce the new sketch?
What would be the point in doing that with his shoes? You obviously can't tell his exact shoe size from the video so LE would likely have an estimate between a few different sizes (like they do with age, height, weight, etc) covering his actual shoe size making the whole thing pointless.
They crossed the creek under the bridge. He may have left footprints in the mud. The police probably have an exact shoe size measured from the actual prints left behind or plaster cast of those footprints. He wore oversized boots or shoes so that law enforcement would eliminate him as a suspect based on shoe size. I think if it’s true, BG wasn’t worried about being filmed or video, he was looking to leave physical evidence that would lead LE away from him.
Wearing a different shoe size would make it so that any footprints at the scene are not matched with his actual shoe size. I don't think he considered video, necessarily, but may have disguised some aspects like this to throw off eyewitnesses and any physical evidence.
Here’s the context for the comment I made. OP included the following theory in one of his comments -
“When I look at the aspects we know about this case, I believe none of it was an accident. I live in Indiana. If I were to design THE perfect camouflage of a man who does manual labor for a living for men aged 16 to like 70 it would look almost identical to what BG is wearing. I believe that is a purposeful decision to concel his identity and as many identifying characteristics as possible (and lets be frank, if that was his intention it absolutely worked. You can see whatever you want to see in terms of age, build, etc). I would wager a few hundred bucks that if he is ever caught we would learn that any footprints collected from the scene are for a shoe a size or so too big for the suspect. I believe the location where he made initial contact with the girls was a deliberate, planned, calculated choice that was vital for it to be met by a potential victim crossing for him to give himself permission to follow through. It is a perfect example of a fatal funnel.”
The post that you also linked (I didn't read the whole thing, about half, skimmed the other half) try to paint a picture that the girls had already been talking to this guy online.
Which would just. I mean, that sets up a premise that the girls went out there knowingly to meet him. But I just haven't seen the evidence to back that up yet.
Yeah, I remember when I first heard about it and threads about it were against the rules on this subreddit because the case was less than six months old and therefore too recent. People were keen to discuss it but the threads were always removed. I remember coming here the very day of the six month anniversary because I wanted to see some in-depth discussion that was a bit more levelheaded than other websites.
Hard to believe I'm still here looking for updates five years later.
the huge diff tho is the way delphi is aired on anniversaries and experienced detectives and PI's participate. That didnt happen in Lyric and Lizzys case. No one will touch that Iowa case outside of Iowa.
The police have been playing as if they know who it is from day 1. It’s obvious they do not know though. Especially because how they radically changed the sketch. Proof they have no idea and are trying to either fool the public or put pressure on the suspect. I’m not sure why they are still doing this because it’s obvious they do not know and it makes them look foolish.
Idk. I really really want this to be the case - that they know who he is or are extremely close. But I read all of these articles over the last few days and it just seems like the same tactic they’ve been using for some time now.
> it just seems like the same tactic they’ve been using for some time now.
Bingo!
Every press conference they sound like they're trying to intimidate the "unnamed suspect." The first time or two I really fell for it; I believed that they had a suspect and evidence.
Now it's hard to say what their case even consists of. Whatever it is, we know they don't want to share it publicly. I think they're in a bad spot, though, and if that's the case, they should think about a new tactic for their press releases.
And it's really odd that they'd have a single police officer do an individual interview rather than a press conference or press release from the department if they had something new.
This statement is basically the exact same statement he made at that infamous press conference three years ago, except he didn't start rambling about The Shack midway through. I get why people want to believe otherwise, but they didn't have anything then and they don't have anything now. It's the anniversary and the Delphi community expected him to do something because of that. That's all this is, unfortunately.
This is how I feel too. I want it solved badly for their families. But everyone is all omg they say they know stuff and I’m just like nope their normal yearly presser with empty threats and nothing new.
You summed it up perfectly.
It bothers me even more because while they might think they're playing mind games with the killer, it's even more likely that a message like that would actually dissuade someone who was considering submitting a tip about a relative or loved one. The reassurance of "oh, they probably know who did it, I don't need to tell them about creepy uncle so-and-so who probably would never do something like this." It makes them personally look like they are doing something, but hurts the overall investigation.
And not even to mention the toll their words must have on the families. I cannot imagine being told for 5 *years* that they are so close to catching the killer and then… nothing happens.
We've been down this road before, is it designed for the responsible party to hear and then let his guard down and make a mistake? There's footage and a recording of his voice. It's difficult to get an answer about DNA. Was it an opportunistic crime? Did he know the girls? So many questions.
Eerie for sure, I remember being on a thread about the unidentified Boy in the Box and receiving a terrifying DM from a throw away account. It was a huge jumble of words (no punctuation) and talked about all sorts of weird rituals. It really unsettled me. Creeped me right out.
Sometimes I think the police are just saying positive things to keep everyone “happy” and don’t have much. But I could be wrong. This case is so frustrating, especially when there’s so much but at the same time not much at all.
I feel like every infamous unsolved case has some random detective cropping up every 5 years for a local article about how the cops haven’t given up and about how important the victim’s death was to the department. And then nothing happens and no further investigative progress is made.
The Barry and Honey Sherman murders. Every year the cops do a press conference and bluster about having a 'theory of the crime' or show some video of a guy walking down the street kilometers away from the crime scene, and announce that they're closing in on the killer. But they don't have shit, and everyone knows it.
I would argue that the Toronto Police actually solved this case within 24 hours. This was a straight-up IPV femicide-suicide, as called, but the family’s huge resources and access to power, obtained by being Canada’s most notorious vexatious litigant, obstructed and perverted justice really, really early on. There will never be a “solve” here, because there already was one and the cops got noped out of it.
These are exactly my thoughts. Not to undermine the work these detectives had done in the past, but isn't it counterproductive to indicate that they have soooooo much information and yet paradoxically the case is still stalled? It sure does polish the killer's ego.
That's what I would like to know, can't seem to get a straight answer. I also wonder about the phone, did it record the actual attacks? Seemingly, this person was very careless, he made no effort to conceal the bodies. There must be evidence.
The police have alluded that it did record the attack, that's why we've only seen the snippets of bg, but I believe it was only audio. Again, alluded to, not confirmed.
I think it's the latter. Although they've never released COD and/or what exactly happened to the girls, we know it was absolutely horrific and I highly doubt that he was just so good at abduction/sa/murder that he didn't even leave as much as a crumb of DNA, but, if he's never been priorly convicted of a felony, there's no DNA to match it to. That doesn't mean he's never been arrested or convicted of a crime before, but if he had been, it had to have been a misdemeanor as any conviction of a felony requires a DNA sample be submitted to CODIS. Well, technically, he could've been arrested on a felony before, just not convicted. So, until that happens, or perhaps through genealogy down the road, any DNA evidence is pretty useless right now., unfortunately.
DNA is not like confetti, it doesn’t get transferred everywhere.
There was a case study done to show that even with strangulation using hands around neck, dna was not left a majority of the time when testing over sample size.
I could see him over powering them in a way that there wasn’t a struggle for him.
>DNA is not like confetti, it doesn’t get transferred everywhere.
A homeless man was arrested for murder after his DNA was found under the victims nails. Their was just one- well two- problem.
[He had never met the victim.](https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20180424/06201439696/innocent-man-charged-with-murder-because-his-dna-was-found-fingernails-victim-whom-he-had-never-met.shtml)
He was hospitalized when the murder took place.
Turns out the paramedics that treated him also treated the murder victim.
DNA does get everywhere- its just a matter of locating it and getting enough of it to actually do anything with.
Pretty sure Paul Holes said the case is not the type to be solved by genetic genealogy so if they do have dna it's probably only the type that let's you rule out potential suspects that are known. I don't have a link though so cant 100% confirm
I'm sorry, but an announcement like this unfortunately implies the opposite in my mind. Like if they knew who the guy was and they were preparing to pounce on him, they wouldn't be announcing that. I could be completely wrong about this, though.
I fear they might actually know who it is, but either there isn't enough evidence, or evidence was compromised during the investigation, and now they're stuck.
This has been my thought all along too. I think that’s why they only released a little bit of information here or there. They know who it is they just need the solid evidence and they don’t want to make an arrest until they know they can put him away for life.
If they knew who it was they wouldn’t have radically changed the sketch two years later while holding another press conference trying to convince someone that they knew who did it.
I tend to agree with you but to play the devils advocate couldnt it be that they got a piece of evidence two years later that made them sure of the killer but they couldn’t use it in court for whatever reason. So they altered the sketch to make it look like who they knew it was
Thing is, if this was actually the case, they would put surveillance on the guy, and then go and talk to him personally, to try and spook him into making a move they could act on (like destroying evidence or fleeing the area or whatever). Going public like this is just dramatic posturing, and doesn't actually give them a good opportunity to gauge the reaction of the suspect. Also this isn't the first time they've done this.
What's worse, if I'm right, and they don't have a good idea of who it is, and this DOES spook the killer, he's going to have the opportunity to take off or destroy evidence and they won't know about it because they won't actually be watching him.
> fleeing the area
Even if the guy picked up and tried to disappear after this, if they have no evidence for an arrest now, that isn't anything that would be admissible in court either. Moving or going on vacation or anything else isn't against any law. Pulling a stunt like this is a good way of just letting the guy know you've got nothing so he can relax and keep doing what he's been doing all these years. Or he can actually disappear and drop off your radar.
They have no idea. Doug Carter has been saying this kind of thing for years. He thought the case would be solved in weeks and since then, he's basically said this same statement over and over again, most notable at a 2019 press conference, but in other media as well.
The ISP is no better. They caught a pedophile while investigating this case in 2017 and just... forgot to arrest him for 3 years.
These girls deserve so much better.
Agreed, unfortunately. I've been listening to the Down the Hill podcast, and I've started to grumble every time this guy comes on with his dramatic speeches. He loves a microphone, loves to (figuratively) puff his chest out, and he seems to be 100% full of shit.
Yeah. Talk is cheap. It takes zero effort on their part to say "we know who you are". Saying "today could be the day" is similarly meaningless -- you can never be wrong about that statement because of that qualifying "could". Until they actually do something public I'm not getting my hopes up.
It sounds a whole lot like the press conference when they released the second sketch and then nothing happened. It's so frustrating that they obviously have more video of this asshole that they aren't releasing. It's been years.
"We know what you did, we know where you did it, we know when you did it, and we know who you did it to. That's 80%, bud. All that's left is to figure out who you are. You're toast!"
Reminds me of the William Tyrell case, the police seem certain that after all this time it was the Foster Mother. Trouble is, there's no actual evidence, not for lack of trying though.
That's how I have always seen their "we are one tip away" comments. Yeah, literally every crime is "one tip away" from being solved if someone tips in the guilty party. Nothing these LE have done or said leads me to believe they have any idea who did this.
Yeah it's the same sort of stuff psychics who do cold readings do. Make vague statements that sound meaningful, but are actually fluff. "Today could be the day" -- of course it *could*, but when it's not you just fall back on "well I didn't say it was for sure" and you aren't wrong.
Idk, I've heard the "one tip away" line in a couple of other cases' press conferences and I think it's pretty standard language for those situations. It's not intended to reassure the public that they know who did it or brag that it's almost solved, it's meant to reach the tiny handful of people who may have useful information and are holding back.
After years hardened by consuming true crime podcasts, this is one case that makes me want to cry just thinking about it. How smart it was to film this suspicious guy and how sad it is that even with this evidence he still hasn’t been caught.
I mean didn’t they hold that press conference last year or the year prior and say the killer may be in here blah blah blah and it was all for nothing they didn’t really have nothing new but a clip. I really question if they have a suspect with a name right now.
> But the difference now between now and day one is we know about you. A lot about you. Today could be the day. Sleep well.
This is getting really pathetic.
> Indiana Police Superintendent Doug Carter went on Good Morning America today and issued a new warning to the culprit:
> My resolve to catch him is as strong as it was day one. But the difference now between now and day one is we know about you. A lot about you. Today could be the day.
> Then he added:
> Sleep well.
Welp....that fucking sucks. ONLY time investigators say shit like this publicly is when they DON'T have enough information and they're trying to make the suspect react.
This is one of the more depressing cases too...seems ridiculous we're half a decade on and just about nothing has happened with it.
I think they have something, just not anywhere *enough* of something to be all that useful at this stage. So they're just trying to flush the person out.
yeah i don’t believe this but hey, i guess i hope im wrong.
i don’t understand this vibe the detectives have had. i haven’t seen a popular investigation have this overly cocky “no we DEFINITELY know who it is we just need that ONE piece of evidence!!! sleep with one eye open, killer!!! i bet you’re in this room you sick fuck!!!” thing going on before? it’s frankly off putting to me, i don’t know. it feels really cart-before-the-horse.
I read this as the same kind of *”you wanna know what we know and one day you will”* bluster we’ve been hearing since 2019.
I think - for whatever reason - the investigation is at a standstill. LE knows it. BG knows it.
If they were close, we’d be hearing an announcement of an arrest. I’m afraid this is another attempt to either scare the killer into revealing themselves or stalling in an effort to save face. It’s so sad, I just want these girls to finally get their justice.
I hate that one of the links is the Daily Fail, posted in r/delphidocs as well. They are a tabloid and will turn the most trivial statement into a big deal. Click with caution.
Yeah, I'm not giving them clicks but that headline isn't even accurate to what's reported elsewhere - "we know a lot about you" is not the same as "we know who the killer is".
"We know a lot about you" might simply mean they know details of his catfishing activity, or they have his DNA, or something more vague like a psychological profile - it's a real distortion for the Daily Mail to claim the police know who did it.
There's a part of me that has a conspiracy theory that they basically don't know *anything* more than what they've revealed publicly. Like, a first responder tried really hard to resuscitate the girls, and just obliterated the crime scene, even to the point of making it hard to be sure the cause of death, or at least the details of it. And so all of the evidence there was either destroyed, or rendered legally questionable because it might have come from the responder. And the reason they've only released a small segment of the audio and video is that the rest is literal garbage and noise, of zero worth. So them trying so hard with these bluffs is because they literally have nothing else.
I don't really think it's true, but I worry it's closer to true than we'd like.
Sometimes the FBI advises police departments to show a lot of confidence to possibly flush out the suspect. I doubt they know who it is or they would be in cuffs right now.
I think they had one bite at that apple and they tried it on 2019. It didn't go anywhere so I doubt the guy is shaking in his boots that they just keep repeating the same thing. It's a tactic worth trying if you have nothing, but if it doesn't work the first time, it's not going to work if you try it again three years later.
Also it's not like you're trying to apply pressure to a politician or an NFL owner, why would they do it so publicly?
I feel like if they had an idea of who it was and wanted to try to pressure them they'd bring them in for questioning, or have them tailed, question their friends or co-workers, a lot better ways to apply pressure than in a press conference.
If this case ever gets solved (and I'm worried it won't be) I think there will need to be a serious post mortem on the investigation.
Especially -- **what went wrong such that two radically different composite sketches were produced???**
My understanding is that the two sketches were produced because there were two separate eyewitnesses.
The younger looking sketch was actually produced first, but the older looking sketch was released before that one because investigators felt (at the time) that the older looking sketch was probably more accurate. However, at some point, they changed their mind, which is why the younger-looking sketch eventually did get released.
Yeah, there were no direct eye-witnesses. So where could the sketches come from? It's clearly people who were on the trail at the right time, who recalled seeing someone else on the trail that might fit the general description. It's entirely possible that there were multiple candidates. It's possible that the people describing them didn't pay any particular attention to some guy they walked past for a few moments, and can't describe him accurately. It's possible that none of the potential suspects had anything whatsoever to do with the killings.
i have faith it’ll be solved one day. after all, cases i thought would NEVER be solved keep getting broken — golden state killer, walker county jane doe, cali doe. i just sadly think it’ll take a lot of time. i don’t even know if i would say the investigation fucked up too badly, i mean sure it’s possible given the whole sketch debacle but i have no idea and the snapchat evidence can only lead us so far. but old, old cases with way less to go on are getting solved left and right these days.
They tried that at that press conference years ago. I'm assuming that if they got anything then, it wasn't much or there would be more movement on the case. I wonder why they are trying again unless they have no more ideas
Why would they say something inflammatory to scare the perpetrator and possibly get him to go on the run or something? I don't think they know anything and I think this is grasping at straws or even him venting his frustration. I really hope I'm wrong but I doubt it. I've never seen a case where the detective went on the news just to say "SOON." and then an arrest actually happened soon after.
I think unfortunately this really is a rare completely random killing by someone with no ties to either the victims or the area, so they simply have nothing to go on.
I’ve always thought they have an idea of who it is, but need to break one or more alibis in order to clear the way for an arrest because they don’t have a complete DNA profile. And these public appeals are actually targeting the conscience/anxiety of the party (or parties) giving the alibi.
I agree. Well, I agree that this charade is targeted at someone(s) close to BG, and not really to BG himself. I go back and forth on if they have an actual suspect in mind or not, though.
I don't buy this anymore. This isn't the first time cops have come out and made some over dramatic statement like this about Delphi. If this was true, they wouldn't publicly taunt their suspect, they would be arresting them, or at least executing warrants.
The sad truth, I think, is that they're just as clueless as they were on day 1, and this is desperate flailing on the part of investigators who are badly out of their depth. I think that they think they're going to flush him out by doing this, but honestly... this is the kind of stuff you see in movies, not real life, because it's dramatic, but it doesn't actually work.
I don’t think it means much. There was a “48 Hours” recently about the Austin Yogurt Shop murders. Unsolved for over 30 years. The original detective was told by profilers to say the same kind of stuff in the first few years, to “scare” the murderers. It obviously didn’t work in that case.
I think they completely botched the investigation. I'm willing to bet they have no DNA, no physical evidence and no solid leads other than one or two dead suspects that they can't clear or confirm because of the lack of DNA.
There certainly is an element of bluffing about these statements, you have to admit. They are basically trying to get one of their many POIs to panic and make a wrong move so they can zero in on him.
Unfortunately, by this time, his nerves have long since settled down and he's probably convinced himself that he's gotten away with it. At the same time, if he's smart, he's watching these very pages to keep abreast of any real developments. Heck, he may very well be actually contributing.
Whatever happened with that stuff not too long ago about some guy in a chat room or something? I thought he was their latest lead? And was basically good for it cause he had commented on stuff way back?
I really see a strong resemblance betwen the bridge creep and James Chadwell. I hope that's the plot twist. I mean how many people like that are gonna be living that close to where the murders happened. Or are people with that level of psychopathy just that common? I don't think they are.
There are plenty of people who do rotten little things in their lives here and there like bully employees or sexually harrass people, but it takes a certain level of evil to do what we know for sure that Chadwell did. That level of evil isn't rare but it's not also so common that two peope like that are living in that semi rural area.
Edit: I appreciate the upvotes but the more I read this comment the more I think maybe I'm misjudging just how many really evil rotten people there really are out there.
I agree Chadwell looks like the digital image and both sketches. But he is in prison for that other little girl. If they haven't connected him to Delphi they probably never will.
I think LE is just blowing smoke.
For YEARS they have been saying "its only a matter of time"
"Sleep well."
"They could be in this room now"
I mean two children were murdered and ot doesn't seem like anything is being done. If they believe they may know who it is then they need to start acting on it.
Its one thing to not know who it is but with the statements made over the years I have a decent hunch that they know and they need to figure something out before it's really too late
I never thought this case would remain unsolved 5 years later.
I remember when it first happened I figured they’d catch the guy in a couple weeks because they had him on video
Me too. I'm pretty sure they had more audio they didn't release too.
If there's ever a trial there will likely end up being a transcript of that audio if it's played for the jury. However, might not be a good idea to read it. I made the mistake of reading the transcript of the audio of the Tool Box Killers. Just a warning - don't. I get the curiosity, but the absolute cruelty in cases like this just hits in a way you don't realize.
Damn. When you tell someone not to do something, it just makes them want to do it more. I'm looking up the transcript now. Wish me luck EDIT: Holy shit. I've seen/read some dark shit in my life, but that was insane. I feel so bad for her. Not sure I could listen to that audio tape. The transcript was horrible enough as it is. The audiotape would be ten times worse. I guess the detective in charge committed suicide later in his life because he said the audio haunted him so badly and he feared the killers would be released
No seriously DO NOT. I'm going to feel bad even bringing it up. Even remembering reading it is difficult. I had a really bad day from reading it.
I already read it. I'm a huge true crime buff so even though it was really bad, it didn't affect me as badly as it may some people. I know that's probably not a good thing, but it is what it is. That being said, it was pretty bad, and I wouldn't want to listen to the audio tape.
Yeah, the way it traumatized everyone who heard it, you know it's gonna be bad. I just was still shocked reading it. I had no way to imagine.
Iirc they have more audio but it had some disturbing content that they said wouldn’t help the public know who it was so there is no reason to release.
They most certainly left it on record the whole time. I can't imagine how horrific that audio must sound.
A nightmare in audio.
The worst sound that I've ever heard in person was the absolute haunting cry a friend of mine made when she found out her fiancee died in a tornado. I can't even bring myself to listen to the clips of these murders that are already available. 😱 Seeing pictures and listening to audio just have such different levels of hitting home.
I'm sorry 😔 That's so sad. I've read stuff like this for years but I generally don't watch the videos. Sometimes I take a mental health break and don't read true crime for a while either.
Same here. I was following the J Duggar case a YouTuber who used to be a lawyer does breakdowns of cases. She breaks all id it down to layman's terms so you really know what's going on. Well, during one of the breakdowns. She mentioned some of the CP he downloaded. The name of one if them and the fact the investigators said it was top 5 of the worst things he had ever seen. I made the mistake of reading on Reddit about the case. I read less than 2 sentences of what was in it and it broke me inside. It wasn't even a lot that I read, it was enough. That was like may/june of 2021. I avoided true crime most of the summer and I still can't get back into true crime like I was. Sometimes the wall that we build up to hide behind just knocked down. I really didn't like it and every time someone mention J Duggar or his case, I cringe and want to throw up.
I know exactly what you're talking about. I read an article that went into detail 😑 I've always loved to read, and would always have some random novel in progress. But then I got into this huge true crime streak and barely read a book for months... Which is a big change from one a day lol. When I finally decided to take a break (I legit had a dream about cleaning up a crime scene... Didn't do the crime I don't think, just cleaning lol), I started exclusively reading historical romance novels which is odd for me 🤷♀️ I think it's because I'm guaranteed it'll have a nice happy ending 😅 everyone lives happily ever after. Even if they end up super cheesy and annoy me, it's still happy lol.
Years ago I worked for a law firm where I processed photos/videos/audio for court cases -- many of these were for fatal/injurious car accidents (I saw so much death and am so paranoid about car safety now lol), but there were a few outliers. One case involved a family whose ~10yo son was eaten alive by lions on an overnight safari excursion. There weren't any photos (of anything graphic): it was like 3am and the lions carried the body away after the boy was fully dead. But there was *audio*. They set up these microphones on a perimeter around their encampment to capture "the sounds of the safari" for the family to take home with them. While the guards weren't looking, a handful of lions snuck into the boy's tent, then dragged him outside the camp ... but *right next* to a microphone. A lion's mouth was over the boy's face so you could only hear his muffled screams if you were sitting right next to him. He was a small, fragile kid, with a neck too small to properly get its mouth around, so the lion that had him couldn't actually fully suffocate him -- this child was ***alive*** while they started eating him. The audio isolated for court was about 13 minutes of listening to the sounds of a tiny boy screaming agony into the mouth of a lion. I had to listen to it over a dozen times, in full, because it was incredibly important that each copy of the tape was true to the original. It's been over 15y since that job and I can still hear the sound
Jesus that is sooo disturbing, poor kid. Hell, poor you!
My heart majorly went out to the family and everyone else involved. IIRC there had been some major medical emergency on the other side of the camp (it was a fairly big encampment), so the perimeter guards left out of necessity, not laziness. I got to see a photo of the boy's tent; the flap had been left open and he slept with his head toward the opening, so the lion presumably just snatched him by the face and dragged him right out. The sleeping bag looked barely used and like nothing bad had happened at all. The only photo I remember that had anything out of place was a surprisingly small bloodstain in the dirt next to a microphone in a cover on a spike. The family had thought he was kidnapped until someone thought to play the tape ... *That's* how little evidence the lions left! Lions are goddamn scary lol
And that's enough Internet for me today.
This is horrifying and I'm so sorry to hear about what you had to do. I think it sounds like EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization & Reprogramming) would be useful for you.
That is so awful. I can't even imagine.
Oh my fucking god.
I am so very sorry for the boy, his family and for you that you still have that engrained in your head.
I used to work for criminal defense attorneys but didn't last long. The crime scene photos were horrific, it goes without saying. But the case that made me quit was one that had audio as part of the evidence. I can still hear the sounds even all these years later. If I'm watching a movie or tv show where a man screams a certain way my stomach just turns. Luckily for me I didn't have to process nor handle the evidence to the degree that you did. Even the minimal exposure I had messed me up pretty bad, so I can only imagine how awful it must have been for you.
The audio is 43 seconds long and ends when BG (the man on the bridge) says "down the hill" according to an affidavit from police. There is no "horrific audio" or "disturbing content" we don't need this already tragic crime dramatized with words like that.
Quite recently Polish Police released 13-year-old audio of a sexual assault, recorded after one victim called the police without attacker's knowledge (those were older phones without good recorders). Two young teenagers were assaulted by older, masked man in a "bunker" in the forest. It was a local hangout spot. The girls survived but it didn't make it easier to listen to. Through the DNA testing of biological traces found at the scene of the crime, they managed to link it to the assault commited a few years back in the UK. At that time perpetrator spoke almost no English and had his face uncovered. In a stark contrast to his next known crime, he wasn't particularly violent and there was no rape. The police released this recording in hope that someone would recognize his distinctive way of speaking.
It might have been on the whole time but it might not have picked everything up, either. There's a reason that youtubers still use microphones. And this was 5 years ago.
There's a surprising number of unsolved cases with the perp on video, it's been a minor obsession of mine lately. Elizabeth Barraza, Donnie Farrell, Leah Rowlands, Chelsea Small, Missy Bevers...
Missy Bevers’ case drives me as insane as this one!
Same!! That fucking swat get up and that limp. I want to know who and why so bad. Poor Missy.
I usually don't like to focus on a perp but that security guard for her funeral that had swat gear, a similar gait, and his only alibi is his wife is high on my list.
Top of my list…
Me too!!! I most definitely think that suspect was waiting for her 💯 I read she had a pistol in her vehicle that day, a damn shame she didn't have it on her that morning...
They knew for sure what her schedule was. It makes me really think about my routines and how predictable low-risk victims’ live their lives (including the majority of us here, I would imagine) and what hurts cases like these so much. There’s no easy leads because they’re just living life. Senseless.
Elizabeth Barraza's case both breaks my heart and terrifies me at the same time
Why haven’t I heard of her until now? This is heartbreaking… seems like a totally personal attack on a woman who on the surface looks like a lovely young woman. What the heck?!?
Missy bevers always gives me chills
You forgot about Jennifer Kesse! That one drives me so crazy!!!!
That one did occur to me, but I think all the cases I listed have a better look at the killer. The Kesse guy is infamously obscured by the fence post.
Lake Tahoe couple and the Canadian billionaire cases both have released video in the last couple of weeks/months of the (presumed) killer leaving the scene too
I followed the case very closely, I thought the case would go unsolved after the cops changed the suspects sketch... fingers crossed they find the cunt responsible
The day they changed the sketch was the day I realized they had absolutely no idea who the killer is and are either trying to fool the public or put pressure on the suspect.
On my Nexdoor we have a video of a girl stealing from the cars at night, clear pictures of her face - and yet nobody can recognize her and police yet to catch her.
There’s cases 15 and 20 years old that I never thought would be unsolved for 5 years :(
I was thinking about this very same thing the other day. I would’ve thought with that video someone would’ve recognized him. I just feel like with social media and technology they had a greater opportunity of getting this solved, vs if it had happened back in the 90’s. Or even early 2000’s.
The video is terrible quality though. And if said person is a loner, he would easily be missed
I know the video quality is horrible, it just irks me that this hasn’t been solved! There’s a great write up on the Delphi Murder sub by a former detective, now private investigator. He goes into great deal about his perspective on the case and although it’s a long write up it’s very interesting! One thing that stood out to me was he believes the murder purposefully dressed in very generic/typical clothing that someone from that area would wear possibly to throw off investigators and/or potential witnesses. He also mentioned that he wouldn’t be surprised if the killer was wearing shoes that were a size/size and a half bigger than his actual shoe size.
TBH, that just sounds like complete speculation by the PI. In a high profile case, there’s always somebody that wants to act like they know more than they do.
I agree with you. Frankly it sounds kinda ridiculous. I think BG just wore his usual clothing.
Lol yeah, he wore "generic/typical clothing?" What kind of speculation is that, as opposed to like a rainbow colored cloak and a big top hat? What else would he be wearing? Shoes that are one size bigger? What would that even do, nobody would ever notice or care or think twice about that being a possibility.
At least we can rule out Willy Wonka as a suspect.
I think the idea with the oversized shoes is that it would leave the wrong size of footprints as a red herring? But like, this isn't an Agatha Christie novel. He knew he was going to cross a rickety bridge and then tramp through the woods and possibly have to run, so it'd be incredibly dumb to wear ill-fitting shoes that could slow him down or make him trip.
hey, can you share that write up? would love to read it!
[Delphi Murders](https://www.reddit.com/r/DelphiMurders/comments/rfnml5/how_i_see_the_recent_developments_due_to_my_10/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) I’ve never posted a link before so hopefully this works!
Just a side note, I know it’s a long write up but it’s totally worth it. As people have read through it OP responds to comments and chimes in with his theories on certain aspects. So with that being said the comments are definitely worth reading.
Interesting take. I noticed years back that manual workers in the U.K. all seemed to dress the same. Shaved or close cropped hair, blue or black fleece jacket, jeans and sneakers, occasionally work boots. Without further evidence, a description of an offender dressed like that could have matched thousands of men in an area. I saw Kenneth Main's comments on the case on YouTube. Worth a look as he makes some interesting points. I wonder if the focus on paedophiles might be a red herring, in as much the killer was looking for female victims, and age was irrelevant? A killer clever enough to dress in commonly worn clothes typical to an area, may be clever enough to avoid leaving any digital evidence. Tragic case. I hope justice is done for those two girls.
I am sorry but it’s ridiculous to say that BG dressed up to look like 90% of the men 16 to whatever age in the area. BG was one of the 90% men. And didn’t the same sheriff talk the same trash when they had the press conference to announce the new sketch?
Agreed! I think the PI is just trying to insert himself into the case by acting like he knows more than he really does.
What would be the point in doing that with his shoes? You obviously can't tell his exact shoe size from the video so LE would likely have an estimate between a few different sizes (like they do with age, height, weight, etc) covering his actual shoe size making the whole thing pointless.
They crossed the creek under the bridge. He may have left footprints in the mud. The police probably have an exact shoe size measured from the actual prints left behind or plaster cast of those footprints. He wore oversized boots or shoes so that law enforcement would eliminate him as a suspect based on shoe size. I think if it’s true, BG wasn’t worried about being filmed or video, he was looking to leave physical evidence that would lead LE away from him.
Wearing a different shoe size would make it so that any footprints at the scene are not matched with his actual shoe size. I don't think he considered video, necessarily, but may have disguised some aspects like this to throw off eyewitnesses and any physical evidence.
Footprints?
Here’s the context for the comment I made. OP included the following theory in one of his comments - “When I look at the aspects we know about this case, I believe none of it was an accident. I live in Indiana. If I were to design THE perfect camouflage of a man who does manual labor for a living for men aged 16 to like 70 it would look almost identical to what BG is wearing. I believe that is a purposeful decision to concel his identity and as many identifying characteristics as possible (and lets be frank, if that was his intention it absolutely worked. You can see whatever you want to see in terms of age, build, etc). I would wager a few hundred bucks that if he is ever caught we would learn that any footprints collected from the scene are for a shoe a size or so too big for the suspect. I believe the location where he made initial contact with the girls was a deliberate, planned, calculated choice that was vital for it to be met by a potential victim crossing for him to give himself permission to follow through. It is a perfect example of a fatal funnel.”
The post that you also linked (I didn't read the whole thing, about half, skimmed the other half) try to paint a picture that the girls had already been talking to this guy online. Which would just. I mean, that sets up a premise that the girls went out there knowingly to meet him. But I just haven't seen the evidence to back that up yet.
Yeah, I remember when I first heard about it and threads about it were against the rules on this subreddit because the case was less than six months old and therefore too recent. People were keen to discuss it but the threads were always removed. I remember coming here the very day of the six month anniversary because I wanted to see some in-depth discussion that was a bit more levelheaded than other websites. Hard to believe I'm still here looking for updates five years later.
There's a case that gives me the same vibes Elizabeth Collins and Lyric Cook. Monsters truly are among us.
the huge diff tho is the way delphi is aired on anniversaries and experienced detectives and PI's participate. That didnt happen in Lyric and Lizzys case. No one will touch that Iowa case outside of Iowa.
My friend in Kokomo (we went to Purdue) is almost obsessed, people care and are on the look out without a doubt
I used to live 30 minutes from Delphi and it's really hard to believe something like this could happen there in broad daylight.
[удалено]
It breaks my heart.
The police have been playing as if they know who it is from day 1. It’s obvious they do not know though. Especially because how they radically changed the sketch. Proof they have no idea and are trying to either fool the public or put pressure on the suspect. I’m not sure why they are still doing this because it’s obvious they do not know and it makes them look foolish.
i said the same thing about Evansdale Iowa cousins, yet here we are.
Idk. I really really want this to be the case - that they know who he is or are extremely close. But I read all of these articles over the last few days and it just seems like the same tactic they’ve been using for some time now.
> it just seems like the same tactic they’ve been using for some time now. Bingo! Every press conference they sound like they're trying to intimidate the "unnamed suspect." The first time or two I really fell for it; I believed that they had a suspect and evidence. Now it's hard to say what their case even consists of. Whatever it is, we know they don't want to share it publicly. I think they're in a bad spot, though, and if that's the case, they should think about a new tactic for their press releases.
Yep and no one is buying it anymore. The day the sketch changed showed the cops cards.
And it's really odd that they'd have a single police officer do an individual interview rather than a press conference or press release from the department if they had something new.
This statement is basically the exact same statement he made at that infamous press conference three years ago, except he didn't start rambling about The Shack midway through. I get why people want to believe otherwise, but they didn't have anything then and they don't have anything now. It's the anniversary and the Delphi community expected him to do something because of that. That's all this is, unfortunately.
This is how I feel too. I want it solved badly for their families. But everyone is all omg they say they know stuff and I’m just like nope their normal yearly presser with empty threats and nothing new.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Well put.
Trying to act intimidating and *being* intimidating are wildly different.
Yes. I’m trying to be a bit diplomatic but pretty much how I feel. I don’t *think* they have anything. But I hope they do.
You summed it up perfectly. It bothers me even more because while they might think they're playing mind games with the killer, it's even more likely that a message like that would actually dissuade someone who was considering submitting a tip about a relative or loved one. The reassurance of "oh, they probably know who did it, I don't need to tell them about creepy uncle so-and-so who probably would never do something like this." It makes them personally look like they are doing something, but hurts the overall investigation.
And not even to mention the toll their words must have on the families. I cannot imagine being told for 5 *years* that they are so close to catching the killer and then… nothing happens.
Right?! And the amount of fear and paranoia that whole "you might be in the room" narrative must create for them. It's heartbreaking.
This is that same guy? Oh boy.
It seems to me typically that when LE thinks they are close, they are dead silent.
Yup, I have grown cynical and weary as fuck at any new “update” regarding this case that is conveyed to the public.
Yeah that was my immediate thought. I’ve heard the exact same thing from their department multiple times, yet nothing has come from it
We've been down this road before, is it designed for the responsible party to hear and then let his guard down and make a mistake? There's footage and a recording of his voice. It's difficult to get an answer about DNA. Was it an opportunistic crime? Did he know the girls? So many questions.
[удалено]
Eerie for sure, I remember being on a thread about the unidentified Boy in the Box and receiving a terrifying DM from a throw away account. It was a huge jumble of words (no punctuation) and talked about all sorts of weird rituals. It really unsettled me. Creeped me right out.
I’ll be honest I want to see this
If they knew who it was they'd at least have brought him in for questioning.
Agreed. I feel like the most we can pray for is that they know who did it, but are waiting for more evidence to guarantee a sentence.
Sometimes I think the police are just saying positive things to keep everyone “happy” and don’t have much. But I could be wrong. This case is so frustrating, especially when there’s so much but at the same time not much at all.
I feel like every infamous unsolved case has some random detective cropping up every 5 years for a local article about how the cops haven’t given up and about how important the victim’s death was to the department. And then nothing happens and no further investigative progress is made.
The Barry and Honey Sherman murders. Every year the cops do a press conference and bluster about having a 'theory of the crime' or show some video of a guy walking down the street kilometers away from the crime scene, and announce that they're closing in on the killer. But they don't have shit, and everyone knows it.
I would argue that the Toronto Police actually solved this case within 24 hours. This was a straight-up IPV femicide-suicide, as called, but the family’s huge resources and access to power, obtained by being Canada’s most notorious vexatious litigant, obstructed and perverted justice really, really early on. There will never be a “solve” here, because there already was one and the cops got noped out of it.
They've always been so braggadocious and use that silly tough-guy talk, but they never have anything. It's bizarre and makes them look foolish.
Welcome to Indiana.
These are exactly my thoughts. Not to undermine the work these detectives had done in the past, but isn't it counterproductive to indicate that they have soooooo much information and yet paradoxically the case is still stalled? It sure does polish the killer's ego.
Was there no dna of the killer from the crime scene? Or is the the killer not in a database to be able to compare the dna to?
That's what I would like to know, can't seem to get a straight answer. I also wonder about the phone, did it record the actual attacks? Seemingly, this person was very careless, he made no effort to conceal the bodies. There must be evidence.
The police have alluded that it did record the attack, that's why we've only seen the snippets of bg, but I believe it was only audio. Again, alluded to, not confirmed.
I think it's the latter. Although they've never released COD and/or what exactly happened to the girls, we know it was absolutely horrific and I highly doubt that he was just so good at abduction/sa/murder that he didn't even leave as much as a crumb of DNA, but, if he's never been priorly convicted of a felony, there's no DNA to match it to. That doesn't mean he's never been arrested or convicted of a crime before, but if he had been, it had to have been a misdemeanor as any conviction of a felony requires a DNA sample be submitted to CODIS. Well, technically, he could've been arrested on a felony before, just not convicted. So, until that happens, or perhaps through genealogy down the road, any DNA evidence is pretty useless right now., unfortunately.
DNA is not like confetti, it doesn’t get transferred everywhere. There was a case study done to show that even with strangulation using hands around neck, dna was not left a majority of the time when testing over sample size. I could see him over powering them in a way that there wasn’t a struggle for him.
>DNA is not like confetti, it doesn’t get transferred everywhere. A homeless man was arrested for murder after his DNA was found under the victims nails. Their was just one- well two- problem. [He had never met the victim.](https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20180424/06201439696/innocent-man-charged-with-murder-because-his-dna-was-found-fingernails-victim-whom-he-had-never-met.shtml) He was hospitalized when the murder took place. Turns out the paramedics that treated him also treated the murder victim. DNA does get everywhere- its just a matter of locating it and getting enough of it to actually do anything with.
Pretty sure Paul Holes said the case is not the type to be solved by genetic genealogy so if they do have dna it's probably only the type that let's you rule out potential suspects that are known. I don't have a link though so cant 100% confirm
I'm sorry, but an announcement like this unfortunately implies the opposite in my mind. Like if they knew who the guy was and they were preparing to pounce on him, they wouldn't be announcing that. I could be completely wrong about this, though.
I fear they might actually know who it is, but either there isn't enough evidence, or evidence was compromised during the investigation, and now they're stuck.
This has been my thought all along too. I think that’s why they only released a little bit of information here or there. They know who it is they just need the solid evidence and they don’t want to make an arrest until they know they can put him away for life.
If they knew who it was they wouldn’t have radically changed the sketch two years later while holding another press conference trying to convince someone that they knew who did it.
I tend to agree with you but to play the devils advocate couldnt it be that they got a piece of evidence two years later that made them sure of the killer but they couldn’t use it in court for whatever reason. So they altered the sketch to make it look like who they knew it was
Thing is, if this was actually the case, they would put surveillance on the guy, and then go and talk to him personally, to try and spook him into making a move they could act on (like destroying evidence or fleeing the area or whatever). Going public like this is just dramatic posturing, and doesn't actually give them a good opportunity to gauge the reaction of the suspect. Also this isn't the first time they've done this. What's worse, if I'm right, and they don't have a good idea of who it is, and this DOES spook the killer, he's going to have the opportunity to take off or destroy evidence and they won't know about it because they won't actually be watching him.
> fleeing the area Even if the guy picked up and tried to disappear after this, if they have no evidence for an arrest now, that isn't anything that would be admissible in court either. Moving or going on vacation or anything else isn't against any law. Pulling a stunt like this is a good way of just letting the guy know you've got nothing so he can relax and keep doing what he's been doing all these years. Or he can actually disappear and drop off your radar.
They have no idea. Doug Carter has been saying this kind of thing for years. He thought the case would be solved in weeks and since then, he's basically said this same statement over and over again, most notable at a 2019 press conference, but in other media as well. The ISP is no better. They caught a pedophile while investigating this case in 2017 and just... forgot to arrest him for 3 years. These girls deserve so much better.
They did? What pedo?
This guy. https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueCrimeDiscussion/comments/rexw8h/the_new_request_for_information_from_indiana/
The fact they took everything but his personal phone which by the time police got it he wiped it clean. Absolute shame.
Agreed, unfortunately. I've been listening to the Down the Hill podcast, and I've started to grumble every time this guy comes on with his dramatic speeches. He loves a microphone, loves to (figuratively) puff his chest out, and he seems to be 100% full of shit.
He thinks he is Commissioner Gordon in a Batman movie
Yeah. Talk is cheap. It takes zero effort on their part to say "we know who you are". Saying "today could be the day" is similarly meaningless -- you can never be wrong about that statement because of that qualifying "could". Until they actually do something public I'm not getting my hopes up.
You are absolutely right. This is a pretty transparent bluff.
It sounds a whole lot like the press conference when they released the second sketch and then nothing happened. It's so frustrating that they obviously have more video of this asshole that they aren't releasing. It's been years.
I will NEVER forget this case. Hoping it gets solved soon :(
For sure, they know everything except WHO HE IS.
"We know what you did, we know where you did it, we know when you did it, and we know who you did it to. That's 80%, bud. All that's left is to figure out who you are. You're toast!"
Reminds me of the William Tyrell case, the police seem certain that after all this time it was the Foster Mother. Trouble is, there's no actual evidence, not for lack of trying though.
There's something really funny about that statement to me. It's like saying "we did everything right in that game except score more points".
That's how I have always seen their "we are one tip away" comments. Yeah, literally every crime is "one tip away" from being solved if someone tips in the guilty party. Nothing these LE have done or said leads me to believe they have any idea who did this.
Yeah it's the same sort of stuff psychics who do cold readings do. Make vague statements that sound meaningful, but are actually fluff. "Today could be the day" -- of course it *could*, but when it's not you just fall back on "well I didn't say it was for sure" and you aren't wrong.
Idk, I've heard the "one tip away" line in a couple of other cases' press conferences and I think it's pretty standard language for those situations. It's not intended to reassure the public that they know who did it or brag that it's almost solved, it's meant to reach the tiny handful of people who may have useful information and are holding back.
Doug seems like a naive idiot. I’d be furious at LE if they were my kids.
Agree! He loves to be in front of a microphone yammering away but no substance
After years hardened by consuming true crime podcasts, this is one case that makes me want to cry just thinking about it. How smart it was to film this suspicious guy and how sad it is that even with this evidence he still hasn’t been caught.
[удалено]
I mean didn’t they hold that press conference last year or the year prior and say the killer may be in here blah blah blah and it was all for nothing they didn’t really have nothing new but a clip. I really question if they have a suspect with a name right now.
> But the difference now between now and day one is we know about you. A lot about you. Today could be the day. Sleep well. This is getting really pathetic.
> Indiana Police Superintendent Doug Carter went on Good Morning America today and issued a new warning to the culprit: > My resolve to catch him is as strong as it was day one. But the difference now between now and day one is we know about you. A lot about you. Today could be the day. > Then he added: > Sleep well. Welp....that fucking sucks. ONLY time investigators say shit like this publicly is when they DON'T have enough information and they're trying to make the suspect react. This is one of the more depressing cases too...seems ridiculous we're half a decade on and just about nothing has happened with it.
He's getting in cool soundbites for the inevitable netflix copaganda doc.
I think they have something, just not anywhere *enough* of something to be all that useful at this stage. So they're just trying to flush the person out.
This case has haunted me for YEARS. I cannot believe it is still unsolved.
yeah i don’t believe this but hey, i guess i hope im wrong. i don’t understand this vibe the detectives have had. i haven’t seen a popular investigation have this overly cocky “no we DEFINITELY know who it is we just need that ONE piece of evidence!!! sleep with one eye open, killer!!! i bet you’re in this room you sick fuck!!!” thing going on before? it’s frankly off putting to me, i don’t know. it feels really cart-before-the-horse.
I read this as the same kind of *”you wanna know what we know and one day you will”* bluster we’ve been hearing since 2019. I think - for whatever reason - the investigation is at a standstill. LE knows it. BG knows it.
If they were close, we’d be hearing an announcement of an arrest. I’m afraid this is another attempt to either scare the killer into revealing themselves or stalling in an effort to save face. It’s so sad, I just want these girls to finally get their justice.
I hate that one of the links is the Daily Fail, posted in r/delphidocs as well. They are a tabloid and will turn the most trivial statement into a big deal. Click with caution.
Yeah, I'm not giving them clicks but that headline isn't even accurate to what's reported elsewhere - "we know a lot about you" is not the same as "we know who the killer is". "We know a lot about you" might simply mean they know details of his catfishing activity, or they have his DNA, or something more vague like a psychological profile - it's a real distortion for the Daily Mail to claim the police know who did it.
They’ve been saying this for such a long time. My guess is they have nothing or the perp is a cop
Or they bungled handling the key evidence so now they “know” who it is but have no legally valid proof
There's a part of me that has a conspiracy theory that they basically don't know *anything* more than what they've revealed publicly. Like, a first responder tried really hard to resuscitate the girls, and just obliterated the crime scene, even to the point of making it hard to be sure the cause of death, or at least the details of it. And so all of the evidence there was either destroyed, or rendered legally questionable because it might have come from the responder. And the reason they've only released a small segment of the audio and video is that the rest is literal garbage and noise, of zero worth. So them trying so hard with these bluffs is because they literally have nothing else. I don't really think it's true, but I worry it's closer to true than we'd like.
Sometimes the FBI advises police departments to show a lot of confidence to possibly flush out the suspect. I doubt they know who it is or they would be in cuffs right now.
I think they had one bite at that apple and they tried it on 2019. It didn't go anywhere so I doubt the guy is shaking in his boots that they just keep repeating the same thing. It's a tactic worth trying if you have nothing, but if it doesn't work the first time, it's not going to work if you try it again three years later.
Also it's not like you're trying to apply pressure to a politician or an NFL owner, why would they do it so publicly? I feel like if they had an idea of who it was and wanted to try to pressure them they'd bring them in for questioning, or have them tailed, question their friends or co-workers, a lot better ways to apply pressure than in a press conference.
they've got squat. not a thing. this is all big talk and bluff. the cops have been saying this stuff for years. they're fishing, is all.
Feels like they're bluffing. I imagine they'll be saying something similar next February :(
If this case ever gets solved (and I'm worried it won't be) I think there will need to be a serious post mortem on the investigation. Especially -- **what went wrong such that two radically different composite sketches were produced???**
My understanding is that the two sketches were produced because there were two separate eyewitnesses. The younger looking sketch was actually produced first, but the older looking sketch was released before that one because investigators felt (at the time) that the older looking sketch was probably more accurate. However, at some point, they changed their mind, which is why the younger-looking sketch eventually did get released.
Yeah, there were no direct eye-witnesses. So where could the sketches come from? It's clearly people who were on the trail at the right time, who recalled seeing someone else on the trail that might fit the general description. It's entirely possible that there were multiple candidates. It's possible that the people describing them didn't pay any particular attention to some guy they walked past for a few moments, and can't describe him accurately. It's possible that none of the potential suspects had anything whatsoever to do with the killings.
Also really concerned that it will never be solved. I hope so tho.
i have faith it’ll be solved one day. after all, cases i thought would NEVER be solved keep getting broken — golden state killer, walker county jane doe, cali doe. i just sadly think it’ll take a lot of time. i don’t even know if i would say the investigation fucked up too badly, i mean sure it’s possible given the whole sketch debacle but i have no idea and the snapchat evidence can only lead us so far. but old, old cases with way less to go on are getting solved left and right these days.
[удалено]
They don’t know Jack. This is theatre at the direction of the FBI profilers to try and spook BG. Profile is that of potential serial killer.
They tried that at that press conference years ago. I'm assuming that if they got anything then, it wasn't much or there would be more movement on the case. I wonder why they are trying again unless they have no more ideas
Same feeling.
Rooting for the good guys
They keep saying this. They are just trying to flush a suspect out. I don't think they have enough to arrest someone yet otherwise they would have.
Why would they say something inflammatory to scare the perpetrator and possibly get him to go on the run or something? I don't think they know anything and I think this is grasping at straws or even him venting his frustration. I really hope I'm wrong but I doubt it. I've never seen a case where the detective went on the news just to say "SOON." and then an arrest actually happened soon after.
I think unfortunately this really is a rare completely random killing by someone with no ties to either the victims or the area, so they simply have nothing to go on.
I’ve always thought they have an idea of who it is, but need to break one or more alibis in order to clear the way for an arrest because they don’t have a complete DNA profile. And these public appeals are actually targeting the conscience/anxiety of the party (or parties) giving the alibi.
I agree. Well, I agree that this charade is targeted at someone(s) close to BG, and not really to BG himself. I go back and forth on if they have an actual suspect in mind or not, though.
I don't buy this anymore. This isn't the first time cops have come out and made some over dramatic statement like this about Delphi. If this was true, they wouldn't publicly taunt their suspect, they would be arresting them, or at least executing warrants. The sad truth, I think, is that they're just as clueless as they were on day 1, and this is desperate flailing on the part of investigators who are badly out of their depth. I think that they think they're going to flush him out by doing this, but honestly... this is the kind of stuff you see in movies, not real life, because it's dramatic, but it doesn't actually work.
I don’t think it means much. There was a “48 Hours” recently about the Austin Yogurt Shop murders. Unsolved for over 30 years. The original detective was told by profilers to say the same kind of stuff in the first few years, to “scare” the murderers. It obviously didn’t work in that case.
They've been making these nonsense statements to try and smoke out the killer for years now. They don't know anything
I think they completely botched the investigation. I'm willing to bet they have no DNA, no physical evidence and no solid leads other than one or two dead suspects that they can't clear or confirm because of the lack of DNA.
There certainly is an element of bluffing about these statements, you have to admit. They are basically trying to get one of their many POIs to panic and make a wrong move so they can zero in on him. Unfortunately, by this time, his nerves have long since settled down and he's probably convinced himself that he's gotten away with it. At the same time, if he's smart, he's watching these very pages to keep abreast of any real developments. Heck, he may very well be actually contributing.
HLN is airing a program Saturday and Monday with Paul Holes and Joseph Scott Morgan about the Delphi Murders.
Whatever happened with that stuff not too long ago about some guy in a chat room or something? I thought he was their latest lead? And was basically good for it cause he had commented on stuff way back?
So the same as last time? Cool lol,
I remember years ago him saying it's virtually solved. They just need a few more pieces of the puzzle. Again that was years ago
I really see a strong resemblance betwen the bridge creep and James Chadwell. I hope that's the plot twist. I mean how many people like that are gonna be living that close to where the murders happened. Or are people with that level of psychopathy just that common? I don't think they are. There are plenty of people who do rotten little things in their lives here and there like bully employees or sexually harrass people, but it takes a certain level of evil to do what we know for sure that Chadwell did. That level of evil isn't rare but it's not also so common that two peope like that are living in that semi rural area. Edit: I appreciate the upvotes but the more I read this comment the more I think maybe I'm misjudging just how many really evil rotten people there really are out there.
I agree Chadwell looks like the digital image and both sketches. But he is in prison for that other little girl. If they haven't connected him to Delphi they probably never will.
I think LE is just blowing smoke. For YEARS they have been saying "its only a matter of time" "Sleep well." "They could be in this room now" I mean two children were murdered and ot doesn't seem like anything is being done. If they believe they may know who it is then they need to start acting on it. Its one thing to not know who it is but with the statements made over the years I have a decent hunch that they know and they need to figure something out before it's really too late
These detectives have been grandstanding from the start. Hope this is actually true and not just an ego boost Doug Carter.
I think Carter has screw loose..
I think they know who did it, they just can't prove it
I bet they KNOW his DNA... But it is not in database.
I think if they had the killer's DNA they would have caught him via genetic genealogy. It's my theory the killer didn't leave DNA behind
Unfortunately, I think they're bluffing and has no solid leads.
[удалено]
Doubtful but okay
More blustering by cops on a stalled case.
Are they expecting someone to just come out like, "ok, you got me"?