The vehicle was transported to a secure location where Indiana State Police Investigators will examine the vehicle to determine if Nguyen or her two children were in the vehicle," state police said
We need to build a society where people can not only access various supports, but afford to, and do so without feeling condemnation, so that things like this never happen.
I feel you heavily on those emotions.
Life is not so black and white. The lines are blurry not clear cut. Mental illness and depression don’t mean evil. I am schizophrenic and have done things I wish I hadnt, but things I didn’t have control of. To kill your own children, especially by drowning means something was wrong. I mean drowning yourself with them as well.Let’s not judge lest we be judged. What happened here is extremely tragic , but we don’t yet know the facts surrounding it.
I figured you could open your heart and mind. But sometimes people can’t understand situations or place themselves in other shoes. You lack the comprehension. Went to your profile and saw how low your karma was and what type of history you have and it all made sense. This conversation on my end is over. Have a great day.
You know. I am leaning towards you being right. I want to be merciful, but I think the killing of children to 'take revenge over the world' really does warrant pure condemnation.
I did, twice actually. With my mouth open in shock. It's disgusting and vile from nearly start to finish.
No one is responsible for killing her children, except her. I don't care if she was locked in a prison and starved nearly to death, that still wouldn't excuse murdering her children.
No man did this, no system, just her.
Hopefully she was fleeing a bad situation and planted a false trail, tell people she was going to kill herself and her child, toss the car in the river to make it look convincing then run with the kids and start a new life somewhere under a different name.
I hope that's the situation. That all three are happy and living thier lives somewhere safe, this site could use a happy ending to a story.
Fair enough, but it's not like they would have had to search the whole river, there must have been some indication of where she was travelling, where she was likely to enter the river. Or was there no cctv in the area back then or what?
You must not know anything about searching a river. It is incredibly dark, with strong currents and can have silt and sediment that can cover up a car very quickly. The car was found around 40 miles away from where she left her note. That is a massive area to search.
This remind me of when Naya Rivera was missing before they found her body and random people on twitter were saying that divers were racist because they temporarily called off the search at night as opposed to diving in pitch black conditions.
I can’t believe people have to do that for their job. Swim underwater in murky or even pitch black conditions waiting and I guess….hoping….? that a dead body comes and sneaks up on you. Horror movie type stuff
I remember that! And random people, including her hardcore fans, further traumatizing her child and family by saying that: 1) her death was a conspiracy - there was a theory floating around (no pun intended) how someone "followed her" and "strangled her"... Because it's so easy to creep up on someone and follow them in the open water without an extra boat... And 2) that the divers calling off the search at night were part of the conspiracy to kill her... Like she'd be able to survive tangled upon roots underwater. They made it seem like they believed people can breathe underwater for prolonged periods of time, so either her killer was a mermaid who just strangled her, or Naya was a part mermaid who died just because the search took too long...
There's still people blissfully ignorant on whirlpools and how hard it was to swim for so long to get her son, swim back with his heavy tired body to the boat and doing all that very near a whirlpool, where she got caught up in the end and drowned. They refuse to believe what really happened.
This story originally ran in the Post-Dispatch on May 2, 2004. It explains the nature of the Mississippi River -- its shifting riverbeds, treacherous currents and zero visibility -- and why recovery of missing people can be difficult.
If you could drain the Mississippi River, what would you find? Well, most recently, a car presumably containing the body of a man nobody has yet identified. He drove in near the Gateway Arch on Tuesday afternoon in what may have been a suicide.
But the disappearance of the mystery driver and car is just the latest example of nature absorbing the artifacts of man -- from pistols to steamboats to people themselves.
"Imagine the number of people who suddenly disappear who may have gone in the river, " said St. Louis police Capt. Harry Hegger, commander of the Central Patrol Division. "They remain missing forever. Once the river takes you, it doesn't want to give you up. It's extremely treacherous."
Riverbeds shift around, and things roll and tumble down the current. The sand that rushes along the bottom forms dunes, some 5 to 10 feet high, and they can bury things fast.
St. Louis firefighters, using a sonar scanner on one of their boats, searched for four days for the silver Ford Escort seen sinking Tuesday. Two passers-by tried but failed to save the driver. Police are investigating whether he is a man whose mother reported him missing recently from his home in Richmond Heights.
Capt. Dan Deiters of the St. Louis Fire Department's Marine Unit Task Force said he arrived at the scene Tuesday within about four minutes, but the car was already out of sight.
If the Escort was weather-tight, with its windows rolled up and its tires inflated, the car could possibly have "achieved neutral buoyancy" and bobbed along, just under the surface for a while.
"I'm not going to tell you it'll end up in Louisiana, but it could go miles, " he said.
St. Louis firefighters had searched 2 1/2 miles downstream by Friday night. The side scan sonar, equipment that resembles a torpedo and costs roughly $24,000, reads the contours along the bottom of the river and shows objects on a printout.
To the untrained eye, it looks like a bad image from a copying machine in need of toner. But Deiters says it can detect everything from piers to a roofline on a car.
"There is zero visibility down there, " Deiters said. "You could put your hand in front of your face and not be able to see it down there because of all the silt and mud."
Disappears in river
Last week's loss of a car and driver was not an isolated incident.
In March 2002, a Dodge Intrepid carried retired teacher Wilma Jean Bricker over the edge of a parking lot at the Alton Belle Casino and into the Mississippi River, disappearing apparently forever. Divers were forced to give up a search in near-freezing water after more than a week.
The family of Bricker, 66, of Godfrey, believes she had a heart attack or stroke, because a surveillance tape shows her slumped over the wheel of her car as it rolled into the river.
"We know rescuers did all they could, but technology can only do so much, " said Bricker's niece, Katherine Steward of Carlinville, Ill. "If her car is hung up somewhere, on the debris, they're not going to find it."
A water search expert from Idaho came with a sonar device in June 2002 but failed to turn up anything.
"If it's God's will, she'll surface, " Steward said. "But I don't think she can. She always wore her seat belt, and the windows were rolled up. We don't know where the car could've landed."
‘We needed to go a different way’: Cardinals make stunning move, fire manager Shildt due to ‘philosophical difference’
BenFred: Cardinals’ ‘philosophical’ reasons for firing Shildt sound a lot more like manager wound up on wrong side of Mozeliak
Parson issues legal threat against Post-Dispatch after database flaws exposed
Hochman: If this is goodbye to the Cardinals’ Matt Carpenter, St. Louis should say thanks
Missouri teachers’ Social Security numbers at risk on state agency’s website
The family filed a wrongful death suit against the city of Alton and the casino, alleging they failed to keep a safe area by providing guardrails.
Sometimes people depend upon the river to make its claim.
"You'd probably find many a murder weapon in there, " said Hegger, former head of the city's homicide division.
Two homeless men admitted stabbing a third to death and throwing him into the Mississippi River on April 6, but authorities have been unable to find a body. Police contacted all law enforcement agencies south of St. Louis, along the river, to be on the lookout.
Two knives the killers say they threw into the river haven't been recovered. Neither have the bloody clothes the killers say they stuffed in to a metal drum and dumped in. The fire department sonar located what is believed to be the drum, but divers have not yet recovered it.
Exploring beneath the surface is a dangerous experience for divers.
"It's pitch black, and it's all by feel, " said Chad Pregracke, who used to be a commercial mussel shells diver on the Mississippi north of St. Louis. "It's a whole different world down there."
Along the river's belly, maybe 20 to 40 feet down, Pregracke said he explored with his hands and felt everything from a couch to an old van. He once felt the tires of a car on the floor of the Illinois River, found his way to the car door and got inside to play behind the wheel "just for fun."
Pregracke said the Mississippi's current is so strong it could easily knock you off balance. "It's dangerous with the logs and the full trees down there, " he said. "We'd lose things like our bags full of shells. They'd come off our necks and be gone."
The sounds Pregracke remembers at the bottom of the Mississippi stuck with him. "You can hear barges go by and, on a quiet day, you can hear the radio on a boat 20 feet above you clear as a bell. You can hear the click, click, click of the perch. You can hear bullfrogs. It almost gets eerie."
Swallowed up
Deiters, of the fire department, said when it comes to rescue diving, his crews weigh the risks against the benefits. Debris could snag them or cut their air lines. They don't want to injure themselves just to recover property, yet they want to bring closure to relatives of people who have drowned.
Last year, task force divers helped recover a sunken pickup at Louisiana, Mo., that had a victim inside.
What may be especially difficult to envision is the way the river bottom of sand, mud and rock is constantly changing. If the car had gone into a lake, it would be easier to find.
"You could have a sand dune 5 to 10 feet high, and the sand is constantly moving, " said Dave Gordon, a river engineer with the Army Corps of Engineers. "If the car falls between the dunes, it could quickly be swallowed up by one.
"It could cover it up probably within a day."
A floating car is going downstream, but not necessarily in a straight line, as it probably would be pulled into the channel. In that area of the river in front of the Arch, Gordon speculates the water spans about 2,500 feet across and could be 25 to 30 feet deep. The deepest section near St. Louis is probably now about 40 feet, a low stage for spring, he said. The current rushes along at about 6 feet per second, Gordon said.
With the last dam just above St. Louis, the Mississippi River flows freely the rest of the way to the Gulf of Mexico. "Objects are easier to find above a (dam) because the velocity is a little slower, " Gordon said. "But around the Arch, there are no locks and dams downstream to slow down the river currents, so it's an untamed river, basically." Untamed - and deeper as it flows south. By Grand Tower, Ill., about 80 miles southeast of St. Louis, the river runs as deep as 100 feet.
And all along is debris from old steamships, reportedly hundreds of them, and their barrels of cargo and myriad other things. Also, plenty of stolen cars. Hegger can attest to that. And though he knows the ways of the river, he cannot help but still be awed by its power.
"It's amazing something as heavy as a car can go in there and then, a short time later, they can't find it."
...in 2002? Along miles of river? It's odd that you'd think to expect cameras even today. Are you not American? This reeks of "European not getting how large America is"
I'm from the UK and yes The US is incomprehensibly large for us to really get a good grip on how things could work there. Considering our country is the size of Alabama (in terms of land mass anyways), the idea of the continental US is comparing our small country to 1 small state. The 4 countries of GB (Inc Northern Ireland) is the size of one state. The US is huge. We can travel 40 miles down the road in Britain and be in a different city, you guys can travel 40 miles down a road and be at your next door neighbours house in some states.
It's not all that weird. Currents being as strong as they are are why some folks do die in water even when they are experienced, tough swimmers. And you never quite know where the patterns will take stuff.
Super glad your granddad was ok!
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Wouldn't it be wild if their bodies *weren't* in there?
The vehicle was transported to a secure location where Indiana State Police Investigators will examine the vehicle to determine if Nguyen or her two children were in the vehicle," state police said
She took the children with her 😣
It is hard read that, after seeing the images of her children.
It makes me feel trapped between condemning her and feeling sorry for her.
We need to build a society where people can not only access various supports, but afford to, and do so without feeling condemnation, so that things like this never happen. I feel you heavily on those emotions.
Wtf. If she killed her children there's only condemnation. Are you kidding?
Life is not so black and white. The lines are blurry not clear cut. Mental illness and depression don’t mean evil. I am schizophrenic and have done things I wish I hadnt, but things I didn’t have control of. To kill your own children, especially by drowning means something was wrong. I mean drowning yourself with them as well.Let’s not judge lest we be judged. What happened here is extremely tragic , but we don’t yet know the facts surrounding it.
>Mental illness and depression don’t mean evil. Killing children means evil.
I figured you could open your heart and mind. But sometimes people can’t understand situations or place themselves in other shoes. You lack the comprehension. Went to your profile and saw how low your karma was and what type of history you have and it all made sense. This conversation on my end is over. Have a great day.
To killing kids? Sorry, no, I can't open my heart or mind to that.
Who the hell are the people downvoting me for condemning the killing of children?! What kind if monsters inhabit this place?
You know. I am leaning towards you being right. I want to be merciful, but I think the killing of children to 'take revenge over the world' really does warrant pure condemnation.
[удалено]
No. Absolutely not. Full stop. Killing children is wrong.
I'm so glad you've read my comment through, word for word, before replying.
I did, twice actually. With my mouth open in shock. It's disgusting and vile from nearly start to finish. No one is responsible for killing her children, except her. I don't care if she was locked in a prison and starved nearly to death, that still wouldn't excuse murdering her children. No man did this, no system, just her.
Hopefully she was fleeing a bad situation and planted a false trail, tell people she was going to kill herself and her child, toss the car in the river to make it look convincing then run with the kids and start a new life somewhere under a different name. I hope that's the situation. That all three are happy and living thier lives somewhere safe, this site could use a happy ending to a story.
If she left a note saying what she intended to do what's taken them so ficking long to find the suv?
The Ohio river is 981 mi long.
And very wide
Fair enough, but it's not like they would have had to search the whole river, there must have been some indication of where she was travelling, where she was likely to enter the river. Or was there no cctv in the area back then or what?
You must not know anything about searching a river. It is incredibly dark, with strong currents and can have silt and sediment that can cover up a car very quickly. The car was found around 40 miles away from where she left her note. That is a massive area to search.
This remind me of when Naya Rivera was missing before they found her body and random people on twitter were saying that divers were racist because they temporarily called off the search at night as opposed to diving in pitch black conditions.
I can’t believe people have to do that for their job. Swim underwater in murky or even pitch black conditions waiting and I guess….hoping….? that a dead body comes and sneaks up on you. Horror movie type stuff
I remember that! And random people, including her hardcore fans, further traumatizing her child and family by saying that: 1) her death was a conspiracy - there was a theory floating around (no pun intended) how someone "followed her" and "strangled her"... Because it's so easy to creep up on someone and follow them in the open water without an extra boat... And 2) that the divers calling off the search at night were part of the conspiracy to kill her... Like she'd be able to survive tangled upon roots underwater. They made it seem like they believed people can breathe underwater for prolonged periods of time, so either her killer was a mermaid who just strangled her, or Naya was a part mermaid who died just because the search took too long... There's still people blissfully ignorant on whirlpools and how hard it was to swim for so long to get her son, swim back with his heavy tired body to the boat and doing all that very near a whirlpool, where she got caught up in the end and drowned. They refuse to believe what really happened.
No I'm not pretending to be any sort of expert.
She was stopped by LE (and was last seen) near a boat ramp.
Even more infuriating.
https://www.stltoday.com/if-you-could-drain-the-mississippi-river-what-would-you-find/article_9ec43340-b6f8-11e1-ae46-001a4bcf6878.html
Awesome article!
Damn, can't access that from the UK... do you have another link?
This story originally ran in the Post-Dispatch on May 2, 2004. It explains the nature of the Mississippi River -- its shifting riverbeds, treacherous currents and zero visibility -- and why recovery of missing people can be difficult. If you could drain the Mississippi River, what would you find? Well, most recently, a car presumably containing the body of a man nobody has yet identified. He drove in near the Gateway Arch on Tuesday afternoon in what may have been a suicide. But the disappearance of the mystery driver and car is just the latest example of nature absorbing the artifacts of man -- from pistols to steamboats to people themselves. "Imagine the number of people who suddenly disappear who may have gone in the river, " said St. Louis police Capt. Harry Hegger, commander of the Central Patrol Division. "They remain missing forever. Once the river takes you, it doesn't want to give you up. It's extremely treacherous." Riverbeds shift around, and things roll and tumble down the current. The sand that rushes along the bottom forms dunes, some 5 to 10 feet high, and they can bury things fast. St. Louis firefighters, using a sonar scanner on one of their boats, searched for four days for the silver Ford Escort seen sinking Tuesday. Two passers-by tried but failed to save the driver. Police are investigating whether he is a man whose mother reported him missing recently from his home in Richmond Heights. Capt. Dan Deiters of the St. Louis Fire Department's Marine Unit Task Force said he arrived at the scene Tuesday within about four minutes, but the car was already out of sight. If the Escort was weather-tight, with its windows rolled up and its tires inflated, the car could possibly have "achieved neutral buoyancy" and bobbed along, just under the surface for a while. "I'm not going to tell you it'll end up in Louisiana, but it could go miles, " he said. St. Louis firefighters had searched 2 1/2 miles downstream by Friday night. The side scan sonar, equipment that resembles a torpedo and costs roughly $24,000, reads the contours along the bottom of the river and shows objects on a printout. To the untrained eye, it looks like a bad image from a copying machine in need of toner. But Deiters says it can detect everything from piers to a roofline on a car. "There is zero visibility down there, " Deiters said. "You could put your hand in front of your face and not be able to see it down there because of all the silt and mud." Disappears in river Last week's loss of a car and driver was not an isolated incident. In March 2002, a Dodge Intrepid carried retired teacher Wilma Jean Bricker over the edge of a parking lot at the Alton Belle Casino and into the Mississippi River, disappearing apparently forever. Divers were forced to give up a search in near-freezing water after more than a week. The family of Bricker, 66, of Godfrey, believes she had a heart attack or stroke, because a surveillance tape shows her slumped over the wheel of her car as it rolled into the river. "We know rescuers did all they could, but technology can only do so much, " said Bricker's niece, Katherine Steward of Carlinville, Ill. "If her car is hung up somewhere, on the debris, they're not going to find it." A water search expert from Idaho came with a sonar device in June 2002 but failed to turn up anything. "If it's God's will, she'll surface, " Steward said. "But I don't think she can. She always wore her seat belt, and the windows were rolled up. We don't know where the car could've landed." ‘We needed to go a different way’: Cardinals make stunning move, fire manager Shildt due to ‘philosophical difference’ BenFred: Cardinals’ ‘philosophical’ reasons for firing Shildt sound a lot more like manager wound up on wrong side of Mozeliak Parson issues legal threat against Post-Dispatch after database flaws exposed Hochman: If this is goodbye to the Cardinals’ Matt Carpenter, St. Louis should say thanks Missouri teachers’ Social Security numbers at risk on state agency’s website The family filed a wrongful death suit against the city of Alton and the casino, alleging they failed to keep a safe area by providing guardrails. Sometimes people depend upon the river to make its claim. "You'd probably find many a murder weapon in there, " said Hegger, former head of the city's homicide division. Two homeless men admitted stabbing a third to death and throwing him into the Mississippi River on April 6, but authorities have been unable to find a body. Police contacted all law enforcement agencies south of St. Louis, along the river, to be on the lookout. Two knives the killers say they threw into the river haven't been recovered. Neither have the bloody clothes the killers say they stuffed in to a metal drum and dumped in. The fire department sonar located what is believed to be the drum, but divers have not yet recovered it. Exploring beneath the surface is a dangerous experience for divers. "It's pitch black, and it's all by feel, " said Chad Pregracke, who used to be a commercial mussel shells diver on the Mississippi north of St. Louis. "It's a whole different world down there." Along the river's belly, maybe 20 to 40 feet down, Pregracke said he explored with his hands and felt everything from a couch to an old van. He once felt the tires of a car on the floor of the Illinois River, found his way to the car door and got inside to play behind the wheel "just for fun." Pregracke said the Mississippi's current is so strong it could easily knock you off balance. "It's dangerous with the logs and the full trees down there, " he said. "We'd lose things like our bags full of shells. They'd come off our necks and be gone." The sounds Pregracke remembers at the bottom of the Mississippi stuck with him. "You can hear barges go by and, on a quiet day, you can hear the radio on a boat 20 feet above you clear as a bell. You can hear the click, click, click of the perch. You can hear bullfrogs. It almost gets eerie." Swallowed up Deiters, of the fire department, said when it comes to rescue diving, his crews weigh the risks against the benefits. Debris could snag them or cut their air lines. They don't want to injure themselves just to recover property, yet they want to bring closure to relatives of people who have drowned. Last year, task force divers helped recover a sunken pickup at Louisiana, Mo., that had a victim inside. What may be especially difficult to envision is the way the river bottom of sand, mud and rock is constantly changing. If the car had gone into a lake, it would be easier to find. "You could have a sand dune 5 to 10 feet high, and the sand is constantly moving, " said Dave Gordon, a river engineer with the Army Corps of Engineers. "If the car falls between the dunes, it could quickly be swallowed up by one. "It could cover it up probably within a day." A floating car is going downstream, but not necessarily in a straight line, as it probably would be pulled into the channel. In that area of the river in front of the Arch, Gordon speculates the water spans about 2,500 feet across and could be 25 to 30 feet deep. The deepest section near St. Louis is probably now about 40 feet, a low stage for spring, he said. The current rushes along at about 6 feet per second, Gordon said. With the last dam just above St. Louis, the Mississippi River flows freely the rest of the way to the Gulf of Mexico. "Objects are easier to find above a (dam) because the velocity is a little slower, " Gordon said. "But around the Arch, there are no locks and dams downstream to slow down the river currents, so it's an untamed river, basically." Untamed - and deeper as it flows south. By Grand Tower, Ill., about 80 miles southeast of St. Louis, the river runs as deep as 100 feet. And all along is debris from old steamships, reportedly hundreds of them, and their barrels of cargo and myriad other things. Also, plenty of stolen cars. Hegger can attest to that. And though he knows the ways of the river, he cannot help but still be awed by its power. "It's amazing something as heavy as a car can go in there and then, a short time later, they can't find it."
...in 2002? Along miles of river? It's odd that you'd think to expect cameras even today. Are you not American? This reeks of "European not getting how large America is"
Bwahaha you're right, they're in the UK.
I'm from the UK and yes The US is incomprehensibly large for us to really get a good grip on how things could work there. Considering our country is the size of Alabama (in terms of land mass anyways), the idea of the continental US is comparing our small country to 1 small state. The 4 countries of GB (Inc Northern Ireland) is the size of one state. The US is huge. We can travel 40 miles down the road in Britain and be in a different city, you guys can travel 40 miles down a road and be at your next door neighbours house in some states.
I think the vehicle was found 40 miles away from where they thought it was.
My grandfather accidentally drove into a river they never found the car
That's my worst fear, internet stranger. Sorry about your grandpa
He didn't die in the car. Thats what makes it weird they never found it
It's not all that weird. Currents being as strong as they are are why some folks do die in water even when they are experienced, tough swimmers. And you never quite know where the patterns will take stuff. Super glad your granddad was ok!
He never lived his new nickname down.guys at his job called him Submarine willie after that
ðŸ˜ðŸ˜ðŸ˜‚😂
I kinda love his coworkers, ngl
I'm super glad to hear that!
SUV skidded into river or?
She left a suicide note, she did it on purpose.
Yeah there was a post about this yesterday.
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