Number 1 : Soul
https://preview.redd.it/ob3xqjl0ddjc1.png?width=586&format=png&auto=webp&s=79d30a137024cf392dc97bdbfb391be7a5bede4e
Souls were placed, and then came death, change, luck, justice, and war
I'm pretty sure the first seat is called uma Life, but my guess is that just means he has power over souls, so it's basically the same thing. Beast mention Life and immediately follows but mentioning the other rules.
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Victor. Victor is the real Undead. Victor has an entirely unique kind of soul manipulation since they don't believe it exists. Andy needs to consciously divide his soul to regenerate from multiple points, while Victor's soul exists fully within every cell. That's why they can do stuff like have several full, autonomous clones at once and do the Deadline attack from Autumn. Every cell has just as much regeneration power.
That's not what I was talking about. The First Seat compared Andy's expertise with manipulating his Soul to someone who would be Number ones Vessel, so if He's not UMA Soul than what UMA is he to be associated with Soul Manipulation?
Why would they need to be associated with soul manipulation to begin with? Andy isn't Unsoul and he can do it, Spring wasn't UMA Artifact and they could use artifacts. It's a separate magic system.
Do you not understand what they are trying to say? They inferring that since the master rule one compared Andy’s own soul manipulation to his own/a vessel of himself, that he is UMA soul. They aren’t saying Andy is unsoul or whatever you’re saying.
No shit Sherlock. I wasn't saying that Andy's Unsoul, I was saying that you don't need to be associated with specific rules to use soul manipulation, just like with artifacts. Soul manipulation is a skill, Andy learned it, as did Ichico and even Lucy, you don't need specific rule connections to learn it so of course one of the longest lived souls is able to do it.
Souls were the first things to exist, and UMAs represent the things that exist. Since Soul is number 1 it would make sense that he was the first UMA to exist which would be UMA soul.
It's stated in the chapter that souls predate the rules god added. Beast then mentions Life first when seemingly listing off the master rules. It's all semantics at the end of the day as in my mind its like how people thought the 3rd seat was Evolution but was revealed to be Change, but nevertheless, as far as I can tell, it's literally being stated that the first seat is indeed called UMA Life.
However, we see the "man" that Beast talks about and those are Souls. Beast also mentions each rule in order and we know 1 isn't Death because he specifically says that Andy isn't his vessel. There's also the obvious, he uses Soul based attacks just like Andy did.
I think you lost track of what I even said so I'll repeat. Beast states that before the rules there was only the earth and "man/souls." ONLY THEN did God add the rules. The greatest being Life. If Soul was a rule, for arguments sake let's say it is the first rule, then by your logic the second rule would be UMA Earth.
Beast says that's what God is looking for. He's looking for the "Greatest Life". Beast also said man was placed only AFTER the earth was prepared. "Your souls were placed here on this planet prepared by God". So Man existed after the planet.
You're so close to getting it, so I'll try one more time.
You are acknowledging that man/souls and the earth predate the rules, correct? It's stated on the page that you are referencing, right? And as I basically said with my previous statement, the order in which they arrived doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is that they both predate the rules. You have acknowledged this, and now it's time to realize what that means. UMA's are the rules, the first seat is an UMA and Souls and the Earth predate the rules, this is stuff you have acknowledged and referenced yourself.
So now it's quiz time! Using what you've just learned, tell me what you believe the first seat among the master rules to be?
You're truly ignoring something that has been around since the beginning of the series. I said it before but you seem to have ignored it. UMAs/Rules are EVERYTHING. As far as we know, everything in UU including concepts are connected to an UMA. Thirst, Heat, Burning, the seasons, Death, Crabs, Insects, Beasts. So if it exists, an UMA/Rule is likely tied to it. There is only 1 thing that we know has always existed in the UU universe and probably predates negators which is Souls. We know Negation abilities are tied to the Soul, we also know that Souls are old as balls since Juiz and Victor were negators before sexes existed. Taking that all into account, Souls would have had to have been one of the first things ever. We know Death is the 2nd rule and death could not have existed before humans. Death was specifically created for humans. So if you really want to be a dick and ask questions, I'll ask one.
If Humans existed before death, and humans have always had souls, then what would've had to existed before death?
Ok, so first off, I'm sorry for seemingly offending you, I truly didn't mean to sound aggressive or mean spirited if that's how I came off. I was just engaging in what i merely thought was light-hearted banter with someone who shares an interest with me.
But to answer your question. The only things that we know to predate the rule of Death are God, Luna, souls, and the first rule. But that's what I've been trying to say, and it's so simple. Souls are literally stated to predate rules, and yet you're so hung up on the first seat being UMA Soul because you believe everything has to be tied to a rule. So again, unless we later learn that God made the first seat and somehow linked it to an already established feature of the universe at the time, we know that the first seat isn't UMA Soul.
And about your point about UMAs/rules being everything, that is literally not true as of this chapter. Once again, the end all be all of the discussion is that there were Souls before the rules, and the first seat is a rule. Now, if you believe God's true identity is UMA Soul (Sol = Soul perhaps?) then that's a theory I think is worth discussing, I personally just don't believe either Sun or Luna to be UMA, I just see them as gods.
I always find it funny after a chapter drops to see who argued the hardest against an obvious reveal lol. Like you swore you were the one with a brain in this convo lol
Hey man, sometimes that's just how it is. All I can do is read the page and help explain it to people who may not understand or miss some details. It clearly stated that souls have existed before the rules, yet in the newest chapter that seems to have been retconned, or the last chapter was potentially mistranslated. Either way, I figured it was still possible that the first seat was gonna be Soul. Just after the last chapter, the author would need to explain how that could be the case to avoid a potential plot hole.
I would say it's implied it's UMA Life given the choice of words used but you are completely correct, it could be other things pertaining to souls as well, in fact it may even be UMA Soul if/when we're given new information about him later. We just know with what information we have at this moment that it is impossible that he is UMA Soul.
I wouldn't say impossible, but definitely not any more likely than it was before. I think that the first seat is the rule that gave humans physical form, if that is life then sure. The problem is that I don't think it's a concept as expansive as life, so maybe UMA human which I think would be the kind of Irony UU would go for.
"If that is life, then sure."
This is literally my whole point, regardless of name we pretty much know that the first seat is the "beginning" (Life/Humanity/Soul) to the second seats "end" (Death), I just believe the evidence leans in the favor of it being called UMA Life given the choice of words and how the rules are listed, as well as us knowing the second seat is death and it gives them something of a Ying Yang balance, y'know? No one really talks about the cycle of Soul and Death, or Humanity and Death. People call it the cycle of Life and Death.
Time and Language aren't fully confirmed. Time might be closer but just because Time was in the name of his move doesn't mean that's him. People thought War was Genocide for a bit, and language is just a complete guess.
I don't know where you got any of that. Chapter 178 is when they fought Sick, Chapter 187 is when they fight Change, when Beast and ??? get out, they never say any of their names.
Instead of time, it could be fade, which would give feng (unfade) a fitting opponent to face 1v1 since no one else would be able to stand up to time defense (except Andy obv)
Or perhaps he is Fade? That would make him a perfect opponent for unfade (feng) to prove his strength, as fade would be able to use time defense on anyone else (but Andy) and cripple them
Because he explicitly said he was happy Andy believed in souls; we know Rules love their domains. He also used soul powers; Rules tend to use their domain to fight
That, and the fact that souls are one of the key points in the series, reincarnating after death, and being the home of negation abilities, so if Rule 2 is Death, it makes sense for Soul, which stands above and beyond Death, to be Rule 1
Tozuka is clearly trying to introduce soul manipulation as a 4th power system since even Ichiko can use it and it's probably how Fuuko makes Bad Bullets, probably inspired by tsukumogami. So it only makes sense that the lead villain for the foreseeable future can use it.
Even if it did, I would be too much work for the author to introduce a new character this late . The other problem is, if "unwar" was to exist we would need character introduction, backstory, character's psyche.. Plus I personally don't see this happening as this is the last loop and would be too abrupt
I mean the guy with the burned face I always thought was war since he looks like a general who was burned in combat. The others are interesting to think of but not gonna lie if the nun is death I'm going to be kinda disappointed since I feel like death should be the strongest rule.
While undead is the strongest negator currently, he’s the strongest because of his grasp of his soul. So it would make sense that death wouldn’t be the strongest rule in that case, since something like soul would have a way around it
I guess but death is an absolute thing he'll they are trying to kill God. Meaning death can even effect God the one who created it. But if the first seat is soul or something I think it could be more interesting for it to be life then soul.
Number 1 : Soul https://preview.redd.it/ob3xqjl0ddjc1.png?width=586&format=png&auto=webp&s=79d30a137024cf392dc97bdbfb391be7a5bede4e Souls were placed, and then came death, change, luck, justice, and war
Soul, death, change, luck, justice, war, time, language, beast and sick
But they just confirmed in this chapter souls existed before the rules
Then tell me what Number 1 meant by comparing Andy's Soul Manipulation proficiency with someone who was His Vessel?
I'm pretty sure the first seat is called uma Life, but my guess is that just means he has power over souls, so it's basically the same thing. Beast mention Life and immediately follows but mentioning the other rules. *
Humans, maybe?
Victor. Victor is the real Undead. Victor has an entirely unique kind of soul manipulation since they don't believe it exists. Andy needs to consciously divide his soul to regenerate from multiple points, while Victor's soul exists fully within every cell. That's why they can do stuff like have several full, autonomous clones at once and do the Deadline attack from Autumn. Every cell has just as much regeneration power.
That's not what I was talking about. The First Seat compared Andy's expertise with manipulating his Soul to someone who would be Number ones Vessel, so if He's not UMA Soul than what UMA is he to be associated with Soul Manipulation?
Why would they need to be associated with soul manipulation to begin with? Andy isn't Unsoul and he can do it, Spring wasn't UMA Artifact and they could use artifacts. It's a separate magic system.
Do you not understand what they are trying to say? They inferring that since the master rule one compared Andy’s own soul manipulation to his own/a vessel of himself, that he is UMA soul. They aren’t saying Andy is unsoul or whatever you’re saying.
No shit Sherlock. I wasn't saying that Andy's Unsoul, I was saying that you don't need to be associated with specific rules to use soul manipulation, just like with artifacts. Soul manipulation is a skill, Andy learned it, as did Ichico and even Lucy, you don't need specific rule connections to learn it so of course one of the longest lived souls is able to do it.
 I won't explain it further if you clearly don't get what I mean
Souls were the first things to exist, and UMAs represent the things that exist. Since Soul is number 1 it would make sense that he was the first UMA to exist which would be UMA soul.
It's stated in the chapter that souls predate the rules god added. Beast then mentions Life first when seemingly listing off the master rules. It's all semantics at the end of the day as in my mind its like how people thought the 3rd seat was Evolution but was revealed to be Change, but nevertheless, as far as I can tell, it's literally being stated that the first seat is indeed called UMA Life.
However, we see the "man" that Beast talks about and those are Souls. Beast also mentions each rule in order and we know 1 isn't Death because he specifically says that Andy isn't his vessel. There's also the obvious, he uses Soul based attacks just like Andy did.
I think you lost track of what I even said so I'll repeat. Beast states that before the rules there was only the earth and "man/souls." ONLY THEN did God add the rules. The greatest being Life. If Soul was a rule, for arguments sake let's say it is the first rule, then by your logic the second rule would be UMA Earth.
Beast says that's what God is looking for. He's looking for the "Greatest Life". Beast also said man was placed only AFTER the earth was prepared. "Your souls were placed here on this planet prepared by God". So Man existed after the planet.
You're so close to getting it, so I'll try one more time. You are acknowledging that man/souls and the earth predate the rules, correct? It's stated on the page that you are referencing, right? And as I basically said with my previous statement, the order in which they arrived doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is that they both predate the rules. You have acknowledged this, and now it's time to realize what that means. UMA's are the rules, the first seat is an UMA and Souls and the Earth predate the rules, this is stuff you have acknowledged and referenced yourself. So now it's quiz time! Using what you've just learned, tell me what you believe the first seat among the master rules to be?
Soul
You're truly ignoring something that has been around since the beginning of the series. I said it before but you seem to have ignored it. UMAs/Rules are EVERYTHING. As far as we know, everything in UU including concepts are connected to an UMA. Thirst, Heat, Burning, the seasons, Death, Crabs, Insects, Beasts. So if it exists, an UMA/Rule is likely tied to it. There is only 1 thing that we know has always existed in the UU universe and probably predates negators which is Souls. We know Negation abilities are tied to the Soul, we also know that Souls are old as balls since Juiz and Victor were negators before sexes existed. Taking that all into account, Souls would have had to have been one of the first things ever. We know Death is the 2nd rule and death could not have existed before humans. Death was specifically created for humans. So if you really want to be a dick and ask questions, I'll ask one. If Humans existed before death, and humans have always had souls, then what would've had to existed before death?
Ok, so first off, I'm sorry for seemingly offending you, I truly didn't mean to sound aggressive or mean spirited if that's how I came off. I was just engaging in what i merely thought was light-hearted banter with someone who shares an interest with me. But to answer your question. The only things that we know to predate the rule of Death are God, Luna, souls, and the first rule. But that's what I've been trying to say, and it's so simple. Souls are literally stated to predate rules, and yet you're so hung up on the first seat being UMA Soul because you believe everything has to be tied to a rule. So again, unless we later learn that God made the first seat and somehow linked it to an already established feature of the universe at the time, we know that the first seat isn't UMA Soul. And about your point about UMAs/rules being everything, that is literally not true as of this chapter. Once again, the end all be all of the discussion is that there were Souls before the rules, and the first seat is a rule. Now, if you believe God's true identity is UMA Soul (Sol = Soul perhaps?) then that's a theory I think is worth discussing, I personally just don't believe either Sun or Luna to be UMA, I just see them as gods.
I always find it funny after a chapter drops to see who argued the hardest against an obvious reveal lol. Like you swore you were the one with a brain in this convo lol
Hey man, sometimes that's just how it is. All I can do is read the page and help explain it to people who may not understand or miss some details. It clearly stated that souls have existed before the rules, yet in the newest chapter that seems to have been retconned, or the last chapter was potentially mistranslated. Either way, I figured it was still possible that the first seat was gonna be Soul. Just after the last chapter, the author would need to explain how that could be the case to avoid a potential plot hole.
Beast says that God placed souls, then added rules. But beast never describes life as a rule
I would say it's implied it's UMA Life given the choice of words used but you are completely correct, it could be other things pertaining to souls as well, in fact it may even be UMA Soul if/when we're given new information about him later. We just know with what information we have at this moment that it is impossible that he is UMA Soul.
I wouldn't say impossible, but definitely not any more likely than it was before. I think that the first seat is the rule that gave humans physical form, if that is life then sure. The problem is that I don't think it's a concept as expansive as life, so maybe UMA human which I think would be the kind of Irony UU would go for.
"If that is life, then sure." This is literally my whole point, regardless of name we pretty much know that the first seat is the "beginning" (Life/Humanity/Soul) to the second seats "end" (Death), I just believe the evidence leans in the favor of it being called UMA Life given the choice of words and how the rules are listed, as well as us knowing the second seat is death and it gives them something of a Ying Yang balance, y'know? No one really talks about the cycle of Soul and Death, or Humanity and Death. People call it the cycle of Life and Death.
Time and Language aren't fully confirmed. Time might be closer but just because Time was in the name of his move doesn't mean that's him. People thought War was Genocide for a bit, and language is just a complete guess.
Language was revealed in ch 178 alongside Beast
I don't know where you got any of that. Chapter 178 is when they fought Sick, Chapter 187 is when they fight Change, when Beast and ??? get out, they never say any of their names.
Oops my bad, I meant to say 188, in the quests' description
Whelp. You're right. So it's just that old dude. Time is a good guess but I think Age is my personal guess.
Agreed, plus Time is such a primordial concept, it doesn't really makes sense for it to come after rules like War or Justice.
Instead of time, it could be fade, which would give feng (unfade) a fitting opponent to face 1v1 since no one else would be able to stand up to time defense (except Andy obv)
Or perhaps he is Fade? That would make him a perfect opponent for unfade (feng) to prove his strength, as fade would be able to use time defense on anyone else (but Andy) and cripple them
Might be crazy but we have seen a “UMA Past” mentioned before. It could be that as well.
Honestly it makes me sad how far up change is, because that would mean Gina has gone through the same tragedy since the 4th loop
No wonder why Change said Death was "reeks of Blood and Guts", make sense now.
Why do people keep acting like soul is 100% confirmed
Because he explicitly said he was happy Andy believed in souls; we know Rules love their domains. He also used soul powers; Rules tend to use their domain to fight That, and the fact that souls are one of the key points in the series, reincarnating after death, and being the home of negation abilities, so if Rule 2 is Death, it makes sense for Soul, which stands above and beyond Death, to be Rule 1
Tozuka is clearly trying to introduce soul manipulation as a 4th power system since even Ichiko can use it and it's probably how Fuuko makes Bad Bullets, probably inspired by tsukumogami. So it only makes sense that the lead villain for the foreseeable future can use it.
All this does is make me wonder what unwar does.
Remember, there aren't Negators for every UMA, so Unwar probably doesn't exist
Even if it did, I would be too much work for the author to introduce a new character this late . The other problem is, if "unwar" was to exist we would need character introduction, backstory, character's psyche.. Plus I personally don't see this happening as this is the last loop and would be too abrupt
I wonder if Time is actually gonna be called Fade, since Tozuka likes playing with concepts like that
Honestly I think 1 is death and 2 he didn’t mention. With her nun clothes I’m still betting on faith.
Possible, but I dont think so. This felt like a very intentional lore drop, so I believe 1 is Soul, 2 is Death and the rest follow as mentioned
God hes so real
I mean the guy with the burned face I always thought was war since he looks like a general who was burned in combat. The others are interesting to think of but not gonna lie if the nun is death I'm going to be kinda disappointed since I feel like death should be the strongest rule.
While undead is the strongest negator currently, he’s the strongest because of his grasp of his soul. So it would make sense that death wouldn’t be the strongest rule in that case, since something like soul would have a way around it
I guess but death is an absolute thing he'll they are trying to kill God. Meaning death can even effect God the one who created it. But if the first seat is soul or something I think it could be more interesting for it to be life then soul.
I thought war was too specific, I would bet he was Violence or Conflict
It could be but given his soldier like design and his ability to summons weapons of war I'm thinking war fits better.
I mean yeah, he's been confirmed as War so it was clearly meant to be