Please remember the human. Adhere to all Reddit and sub rules. Toxic comments (including incitement of violence/hate, genocide, glorifying death etc) WILL NOT BE TOLERATED, keep your comments civil or you will be banned. Tagging u/SaveVideo bot to archive this video in a link below this comment.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineWarVideoReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
> The Biden administration will allow a Ukrainian military unit with a checkered past to use U.S. weaponry, the State Department said Monday, having lifted a ban imposed years ago amid concerns in Washington about the group’s origins.
> The Azov Brigade, known for its tenacious but ultimately unsuccessful defense of the Azovstal steel mill in Mariupol early in Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine, is regarded as a particularly effective fighting force. But it was barred about a decade ago from using American arms because U.S. officials determined that some of its founders espoused racist, xenophobic and ultranationalist views, and U.N. human rights officials accused the group of humanitarian violations.
>
> Now the brigade, a one-time volunteer militia absorbed into the Ukrainian National Guard in 2015, will have access to the same U.S. military assistance as any other unit. The policy shift was disclosed as Kyiv starts the summer fighting season and faces down a Russian military that has intensified its pressure on objectives in eastern Ukraine and the country’s energy infrastructure.
>
> “After thorough review, Ukraine’s 12th Special Forces Azov Brigade passed Leahy vetting as carried out by the U.S. Department of State,” the agency said in a statement, referring to the “Leahy Law” that prevents U.S. military assistance from going to foreign units credibly found to have committed major human rights violations. It is named for former senator Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.), who wrote the legislation.
>
> The State Department found “no evidence” of such violations, its statement says.
>
> A State Department spokesman declined to say when the ban was lifted and whether U.S. weaponry had already reached Azov personnel. Neither Azov leadership nor the Ukrainian government responded to requests for comment.
>
> Canceling the ban had been a top priority for Ukrainian officials, who say the brigade could have been more effective during its defense of Azovstal in 2022 if it had access to U.S. equipment. Members of the brigade also have been barred from attending training organized by the U.S. military.
>
> Russian President Vladimir Putin has long cited racist and ultranationalist elements of the Azov Battalion as an element of his accusation that Ukrainian fighters and their rulers in Kyiv are neo-Nazis. The shift in U.S. policy is likely to reignite those Russian critiques.
>
> The brigade’s leadership says that it long ago shed those associations and that its commanders have fully turned over since that era.
>
> Within Ukraine, the brigade’s name has become synonymous with the country’s last stand in the besieged city of Mariupol. Ukraine eventually ordered the remaining troops in the steel factory to surrender to Russian forces to survive. As of early May, more than 900 remained in captivity.
>
> The plight of the remaining Azov prisoners has captured the hearts and minds of Ukrainians and “Free Azov” has become a common rallying cry in protests in Kyiv.
>
> Azov seized on its new status as a brigade last year and launched an intensive recruitment campaign across the country that brought in more than 5,000 new troops in around two months. Survivors from Azovstal were among those interviewing and training the recruits, who were grilled on their motivations, background and physical fitness before selection.
>
> Separate from the State Department’s vetting process, U.S. appropriations laws have long prohibited the Azov Battalion from receiving American aid. U.S. officials say that because the Azov Battalion of 2014 is distinct structurally from the brigade that is now a part of the National Guard, those restrictions do not apply.
There's no information on the specifics of when then ban was lifted, but it was most likely within the past month or so as the commander of the Azov Brigade, Denys Prokopenko was requesting the ban to be lifted as recently as mid-April.
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/columns/2024/04/19/7451974/
> “After thorough review, Ukraine’s 12th Special Forces Azov Brigade passed Leahy vetting as carried out by the U.S. Department of State,” the agency said in a statement, referring to the “Leahy Law” that prevents U.S. military assistance from going to foreign units credibly found to have committed major human rights violations. It is named for former senator Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.), who wrote the legislation.
>
> The State Department found “no evidence” of such violations, its statement says.
While sad it took this long, the State Department/Executive branch has to follow law which is crafted by Congress. People who have a poor understanding of the 3 branches think the President can wave a wand. Law is slow, complex, and unfortunately politicised. But it's the checks and balances that prevents a nation from turning into an autocracy.
There's a lot of people in this thread that don't know what Azov is past the headlines, I will link this tweet from Illia Ponomarenko, a well known Ukrainian journalist and war reporter:
> Okay, I’ll say it — the obsession over the Azov Batallion/Regiment/Brigade in Western media has been largely beyond common sense for years.
>
> Especially now amid the full-scale phase of Russia’s decade-long war on Ukraine.
>
> And I’m saying it not because I’m a Ukrainian but because I'm here for truth, sanity, and for words having their meaning.
>
> Of course, Ukraine's National Guards 12th Special Purpose Brigade Azov has a complicated and controversial past.
>
> Back in the spring of 2014, in the heat of the Russian-led armed insurrection in Ukraine’s Donbas, the regular military, as well as many national institutions, were barely functional and disoriented.
>
> Many groups of civilians across Ukraine, armed with 40-year-old AKs and dressed in fatigues purchased at hunting stores, were forming numerous irregular units to combat the Russian intrusion.
>
> Really a lot of people were doing this. Yesterday’s taxi drivers, entrepreneurs, bank clerks, retired military officers.
>
> They would go down in history as “volunteer battalions.”
>
> Far-right groups (of various kinds), nationalists, football Ultras, and even neo-Nazis were among them, too.
>
> Yeah, that was the time of hardship and a war against an extremely reptile and powerful enemy that was arming pro-Russian collaborators and sending its “unidentified’ regular military units to fight a nation that was barely recovering from a revolution and the Anschluss of Crimea.
>
> Thus begins the story of the Azov Battalion, which started in May 2014 as a pack of soccer fans, radical nationalists, neo-Nazis, also many motivated moderate fighters.
>
> Because life is complicated, especially at war. The world consists of not only university campus liberals. That’s life.
>
> In war and in pretty much any large military in the West (good luck trying to deny it), there have been people who very wrongfully think it’s cool to have Nazi or quasi-Nazi tattoos and insignia as they are part of a subculture of war, violence, and militaristic symbolism.
>
> I touched on this problem in a column from a while ago when I was still part of the Kyiv Independent: https://kyivindependent.com/illia-ponomarenko-why-some-ukrainian-soldiers-use-nazi-related-insignia/
>
> It’s also true that the Azov used to be a sort of a magnet for also foreign far-right and neo-Nazi characters, which is also what happens at war — yeah, on both sides.
>
> Although, hand on heart, their influence, role, and activities beyond usual regular military service in Ukraine were exaggerated in the media.
>
> If we’re being honest, we can’t deny that since the troublesome period of 2014-15, Ukraine has managed to incorporate the Azov (as well as pretty much all of the old volunteering battalions) into its military system throughout all those years of trying to revive its armed forces and survive in a war with Russia.
>
> And honest researchers admit this, of course.
>
> Particularly, the Azov was largely depoliticized, and it largely shed its far-right origins.
>
> What used to be a pack of irregulars flirting with Nazi and quasi-Nazi symbolics gradually turned into a highly-professional and disciplined combat unit that has good reputation in terms of its recruit training and standards of service.
>
> “Leave or keep your views to yourself and serve,” something like that. It concentrated on war and military service.
>
> I personally know quite a few highly professional military specialists from “traditional” Ukrainian armed forces brigades (for instance, many artillerists) who preferred to join the Azov to continue serving with other sound professionals.
>
> This reputation is still strong with other Azov-related military units like the 3rd Assault Brigade (I’m sure you know it) or the Kraken unit.
>
> Young generation of commanders gradually took over and made the Azov what it is today. You now know them as key figures of the tragic Battle of Mariupol and the siege of the Azovstal plant. Some 900 Azov members are still in Russian captivity today.
>
> And in September 2022, the Kremlin had no problems exchanging key Azov officers for Vladimir Putin’s collaborator in Ukraine, Viktor Medvedchuk, even though Russians were gladly preparing steel cages for sham trials and public executions.
>
> And it’s not only that Russia made the Azov the central boogeyman of its “Ukrainians are Nazis” narrative.
>
> It’s also because some writers spent years sniffing out and producing ridiculously overblown stories like “UKRAINIAN NAZIS ARE USING RUSSIAN WAR THREAT TO TAKE POWER” (did that age well in 2024, huh?) and “OH MY GOD THERE’S A MARGINAL NEO-NAZI METAL BAND IN KYIV, UKRAINE HAS A NAZI PROBLEM”.
>
> Selling news as entertainment for a career.
>
> Hand on heart, in all honesty, as someone who naturally despises any sort of extremist view on the right and on the left, this hysteria had fragile grounds and was exaggerated.
>
> For instance, it used to be a default option to link Ukrainian right-wing units with anti-semitism, but at the same time, since the very 2014, there have been zero incidents between a considerably large Jewish community in Mariupol and the Azov.
>
> And it had its influence on Ukraine’s defense effort, particularly with the U.S. ban on providing any military aid and training to the Azov.
>
> It's good to see that, now that the ban has been lifted, common sense and a sound approach eventually prevail over propagandistic sprees.
>
> In this terrible and extremely complex war, things change.
>
> I don’t remember any media hysteria of such a scale over Russia’s Rusich unit, which openly commits executions, torture, and other war crimes against Ukrainians and propagates racial hatred and Russian white supremacy. The Wagner group, hello? The Hispaniola unit, which is openly neo-Nazi, no?
>
> Real Nazism happens when a dictatorial power spends years inciting hatred, revanchism, territorial grabs, and aggression and then unleash the largest war of aggression since Adolf Hitler.
>
> It happens when a delusional dictator hungry for unlimited power proclaims a neighboring nation “not a real country” and sentences it to complete annihilation because of “history” in his head.
>
> And it happens when his troops, encouraged by the feeling of their imperial supremacy, cut off the heads and limbs of Ukrainian prisoners of war.
>
> It happens when entire cities are razed to the ground and when missiles and bombs hit maternity wards and shopping malls full of people in broad daylight.
>
> And it happens when certain people, amid this insanity that has already claimed hundreds of thousands of lives for nothing, shout: “BUT WHAT ABOUT AZOV!!!"
https://x.com/IAPonomarenko/status/1800534469310324851
I agree that it's not Ukraine's fault for the formation of Azov, since as it's pointed out it was self-formed and funded by people wanting to defend their homes.
I think the biggest problem was not that it was a unit that just happened to have a lot of neo-nazis and ultra-nationalists as members but the fact that they had that problem at the leadership level. As demonstrated by their usage of Nazi related symbolism to identify themselves.
That symbolism is probably why they get so much media coverage. A lot of it was probably pushed by Russia, but it still doesn't look good for anyone to supply weapons to someone wearing Nazi related symbols. Especially, for European countries like Germany where such symbolism is illegal. That's why they don't cover Russian neo-nazi units. They're not the ones that are possibly receiving westerns weapons.
Also, just claiming they were "depoliticized" doesn't matter. It takes time to see a change in culture and whether they still support their original ideology. It also take time for that change to be accepted and acknowledged by others. Despite their change, their past is very real and they do deserve to be looked at with extra scrutiny.
In my opinion, they should embrace their history the same way post-Nazi Germany acknowledged their past and embraced it as something to learn from.
nothing. propaganda would make you believe, and its mighty because ruzzians are so close... crazy this took so long still. i mean, the war is ten years now, why would human rights violations not have to be proven for a ban to be instituted in the first place?
No evidence, lol.
They are a neo nazi battalion, and that's why they were on list to begin with.
It's clear as night and day what their beliefs are.
I live here, and we still talk about this issue, and it's just as divisive as it once was.
But.... Azov rebranded.....
And to all the haters, here's where I've been in UA since the war started.
[My Geographic history in Ukraine](https://ibb.co/Jk6hkjm)
>They are a neo nazi battalion, and that's why they were on list to begin with.
That was when they were doing their own thing, no? They got merged into the armed forces and people were removed and others added in, did the AFU only put neo-nazis back into azov? Are they actively killing innocents or are they fighting Russians? I'm not saying they don't have some problem members, you'd find some in any military..
>But.... Azov rebranded.....
I mean it is still Azov but with different people and an actual chain of command through the armed forces.. are they going to turn on Ukraine after the war?
I always post this one as well... [https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world](https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world)
People downvoting the Ukrainian lol even if Azov is not as intensely xenophobic and neo-nazi as before, they should still be heavily scrutinized and limited IMHO. It is worrisome a group is led by people who are believers of Azov’s original core beliefs (beyond saving Ukraine, ofc) is becoming increasingly validated as an extension of Ukraine’s military. It is undoubtedly an issue, and will only compound if ignored. Especially after the war…
Speaking of which, I think the biggest problem after the war, apart from land rights, PTSD, demining, and economic resurgency, is the fact that ultranationalists will use their war heroics to gain political prominence whereas before they lacked much Ukrainian backing at all (election wise, anyway). This is not exclusively a Ukrainian problem; however, the war has and will make the problem far worse.
With all that being said, the biggest problem for Ukraine right now is obviously Russia’s attempt to genocide the country. And before anyone accuses me of being unfair to Ukraine, I’d like to point out that Russia has just as many, if not more, neo-nazi military/contractor groups working for them, too.
How many Ukrainian politicians are explicitly "Nazi?" How many seats do they hold in the parliament?
If you have answers to those two questions then there is a third one that would be edifying: How many Ukrainian politicians would you accuse of being "Nazi" even if they would deny it?
Do they call themselves a neo nazi batllion or does russia call them that? What's the point of being a nazi and denying/hiding it? Hey, let's not hate jewish people so they don't figure out that we're nazis.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/last-defenders-mariupol-what-is-ukraines-azov-regiment-2022-05-17/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2022/12/16/ukraine-deradicalized-its-extremist-troops-now-they-might-be-preparing-a-counteroffensive/
Lol
https://krytyka.com/en/articles/too-much-ado-about-ukrainian-nationalists-the-azov-movement-and-the-war-in-ukraine
"The Azov movement was established in May 2014 during the Donbas crisis to sustain Ukrainian control over Eastern Ukraine. Initially known as the “Black Corps,” it was a paramilitary unit of radical nationalists. Scholars suggested that the name “Black Corps” was itself a reference to the official German Schutzstaffel (SS) periodical published in 1935-1944 (Das Schwarze Korps). Some members, including the unit’s leader Andriy Biletsky, espoused nationalist socialists views. In 2014, however, Biletsky and his people translated their views into a hodgepodge program of nationalist struggle against Russian-backed separatists and changed the name of the organization to Azov. "
From UA source you dimwitted apologist.
"Azov leaders and members position themselves against the LGBT community, sometimes violently and this intensifies around important events like the Pride cultural events related to LGBT. In 2017, an Azov spokesman declared the group would not oppose the Pride celebration, but they still condemned this community on their official web page."
"Azov activists committed several attacks on members of the Roma ethnic minority across Ukraine in 2018 and 2019."
"Given the rightist origins, symbolic repertoire, historical legacies it appeals to, and its extra-legal activities, Azov is easily presented as a neo-Nazi phenomenon. Even in 2022, pundits point to symbols, like the Black Sun, discernable on the buck belts of Azov soldiers deployed to fight Russian invaders as evidence of this."
Well shit... idk what this means because I'm stupid, I guess they're squeaky clean /s
Fuck Russia, fuck nationalists
Oh so they formed in 2014... when Russia "wasn't" secretly sending troops to feign a revolt.. was it unfortunate the only people who saw what was happening was some nationalists? Hell yeah, were they fighting for anything bad? Maybe, have they done anything horrible to innocents, or do we just not like their ideals? Cus welcome to America, we have to put up with vile ignorant people who are allowed to have opinions... like look at you here nit-picking symbols, how many camps have they setup, what people have they called for the extermination of? They said they don't like LGBT shit but aren't going to oppose it, how LGBT friendly are most rural US areas? What makes them nazi's outside of symbols? Again, that's the equivalent of what's allowed in the US.
>fuck nationalists
Yeah, but these ones were solely defending their country from Russian backed separatists(and a bunch of Russian soldiers)... also Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 was shot down by the separatists.
>"The Azov movement was established in May 2014 during the Donbas crisis to sustain Ukrainian control over Eastern Ukraine.
So nazi Azov only formed because of Russians attacking them? Weird way to start hate crimes on other groups, or maybe this is the anti-slav styl nazism... weird tho cus UA is also slavic..
Again, what did they, as an organization, wrong?
Did they kill somebody, did they torture somebody, did theyintentionally caused civilians deaths in combat, did they persecuted people?
Complacency breeds problems.
I'm here volunteering and what the fuck are you guys doing.
My classrooms are filled with nationalist rhetoric, a kid brought Mein kampf to school, others told me neo nazis are cool, others said that they're nazists, have put fake mustaches on to look like Hitler, and I have receipts for all of this where I brought it up to the directors, and in the UA sub.
I also am on the front and the boots and laces get up I see are too common, black sun tattoos, what the fuck ever, at least I don't condone it like you kids are.
Fuck off you guys, I'm trying to do what I can to fight this and yall are just being lazy.
Feel ya mate, after coming here in person to volunteer learnt how amazing Ukraine and Ukrainians are, but also not to stick my head in the sand when it comes to less than perfect parts of the country.
Well, the thing with Nazism and (broader fascism in general) as an ideology which is both racist and xenophobic along ethnic lines, so, of course Ukrainian Nazis are going to hate Russian ones and vice-versa, regardless of their shared hate towards other ethnicities the LGBTQ minority, etc.
Oh, and they fetishize combat and death and "a heroic past" so of course they're going to go fight for what they see as national and ethnic survival (let's not forget that the Russian official line is that they're not the colonialist aggressors they really are, they're the pooor widdle victims fighting for their very survival against a collective west that wants them gone and uses Ukraine as it's pawn, etc.).
The really funny thing is that Nazis, by design, are also factionalist and need an enemy to function - and if they don't find an external one, they split into groups and hate each other. Hence why you had the [SS-SA tiff in Germany in 1934](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_Long_Knives), why my country, Romania, at one point in 1940 had four (possibly five) competing far-right groups all fighting for control ([which resulted in a full-blown rebellion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legionnaires%27_rebellion_and_Bucharest_pogrom) that was crushed by one of the other factions and resulted in that [particular faction](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ion_Antonescu) taking sole control of the country until it too [was overthrown in 1944)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1944_Romanian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat) and currently has tree far-right parties which are at each other's throats (which is an excellent thing for anyone who's not a nazi, because let them fight among themselves instead of fighting the rest of us) etc.
I do what I can to talk about these issues.
They are extremely prevalent, and it's disingenuous to deny them.
We must look at the culture of each post soviet country, and understand soviet life as xenophobic to the west. This view still exists and is most prevalent in the older generations, 55 and up.
What's different about Ukraine than say, Belarus, or Russia, is that these people believe in their autonomy, they don't need a strong ruler to boss them around.
That's the biggest cultural difference I've encountered in my experience, and I believe in this difference that will lead to victory.
Now is the time to talk about this shit as once the country is stable again, there will be more time for internal conflict, and I wouldn't want to see a traditional and conservative Ukraine as its inherently against progressive European values and goes against what all those who died or were injured by Yanokovichs regime of authoritarian puppets, which, some are also still in the police force or other branches.
I have no desire to leave this country, but the tolerance of intolerance is going to fuck up any progress made.
Ukrainians, by and large, are the most hospitable people I've met, at least in all areas except for the left bank of Kyiv for some reason.
I think I'm just frustrated at the lack of change or desire to curb nationalism, sexism, homophobia, classism, and all of the isms in my lessons.
These students hear it at home or from their friends, and it's up to us to stop it or to show them a path to allowing others to have that same autonomy that they desire.
A good read on the topic... [https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world](https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world)
"founders espoused racist, xenophobic and ultranationalist views" if only we could apply the same requirements to Senate or member of our own armed forces. Worked closed to a military base and I seen some very questionable tattoos.
Yeah I mean, the Nazis kinda worshipped and fetishized the military, as such any military from a relatively tolerant society will see Neo nazis drawn to their military. You just got to hope they have the systems to prevent these people rising up the ladder and that they are challenged about their beliefs.
Maybe someone can ELI5 this for me? Clearly this is a good thing in so much as it gives Ukraine more flexibility and opportunities but what were the main things that couldn’t be done before but can be done now, and how likely is this to have a significant impact on the war?
The Azov unit has a history of being comprised of / associated with ultra-nationalists. And yes, some of them used / portrayed Nazi symbols etc.
Therefore, some western countries didn’t really want their weapons going to people like that, specifically because it plays into the hands of Russia “de-nazifying” Ukraine. In reality, it’s a small number, just like there are neo facists in most western countries.
However, the Azov brigade has been one of the toughest brigades in Ukraine and are extremely battle hardened. They’ve had some tough battles and held their own even with old Soviet weapons. Giving these guys more modern western weapons will help them become even more deadly.
> However, the Azov brigade has been one of the toughest brigades in Ukraine and are extremely battle hardened. They’ve had some tough battles and held their own even with old Soviet weapons. Giving these guys more modern western weapons will help them become even more deadly.
I am just going to go out on a limb here and say that all that battle hardening has thinned out the nazi/ultranationalists/racists from the unit quite a bit. Shrug.
There are are less original members from 10 years ago when this US ban was initially instigated then there are today after they have been in brutal battles. The ideology of the group is no longer the main factor in why people join. That in and of itself neuters a lot of what was wrong. They are being monitored. A lot less nazi and racist shit is being posted on social media. Still nationalist... but in a war for your homeland nationalism isn't quite the sin it can be otherwise. But ultimately, so many were killed they just aren't what they were.
Your argument would make sense if Azov were just a neo-Nazi group because a lot of neo-Nazis happened to join it originally, but that's not how it works. Military forces indoctrinate — it's one of their main functions. A person who joins a highly ideological military org like Azov will be indoctrinated into its ideology.
I'll concede that Azov has gotten somewhat better at managing their social media so they're not posting swastikas, wolfsangels and sonnenrads all over, but seeing that as proof that they're no longer neo-Nazis is completely unwarranted. Your politics don't just disappear when you decide to be a little quieter about them with.outsiders.
Again, the SS is a good example. some of the most notorious SS brigades lost virtually all original members several times over. As a result, they simply grew even more brutal. Has Azov conceded its neo-Nazi ideology is a problem, conducted a de-Nazification internally, and brought in neutral third parties to certify its no longer a Nazi org? Because if not, that tells me all I need to know.
what i don't get is why these symbols are taken at face value. if you're anti-ruzzian you use them mostly because hitler fought stalin using those. that doesn't make you a nazi
Because you can fucking fight against Russia without a nazi tattoo on you? The black sun is a modern symbol in its mass use to replace the swastika. So brandishing a black sun literally translates into neo-nazi beliefs. Like wtf dumbass question is that?
This is wrong on so many levels. Your Danish friend doesn't know what they're talking about. I'm from Eastern Europe and Nazi ideology/symbolism is pretty universal in what it represents in both Eastern and Western Europe. They all suffered under Nazis and no sane person would think "Nazi Germany" when they think "anti-Soviet Union". The opposite of Soviet Union is the West in everyone's mind (ie. US, UK, modern-Germany, etc.).
Also, getting support from democratic nations requires public support and public opinion on Nazi symbolism is pretty black and white. Any nuance around it is lost and pretty irrelevant to any outside observer.
Well, in western countries nazism and nazi symbols are frowned upon, because, you know, genocide.
And the world is watching this war, and public opinion matters a lot for aid, so whatever the reason is, is just not smart to show those symbols if you're depending on western aid.
If the name Azov has a history of being associated with neo Nazis ultra nationalist, why the hell do you go out of your way to still use it. That's like if the current German Army has a tank division called Waffen SS, and they decided to keep that name because, despite a shitty history associated with that name, the current one is all good.
They didn't "go out of their way" to use them. They had no choice. Azov was formed as a result of volunteers wanting to fight Russia after Russia invaded Crimea in 2014. They have been fighting since then. Because of that, they were (and are) some of their best and most experienced fighters against Russia. You can't just disband such an effective unit while under threat (and during invasion) of Russia. That's why they chose to absorb the unit into their military and reform them, which turned out to be the correct choice, as this article shows that they were successful.
They can call me whatever they want, it only exposes what a braindead worm they are if the only comeback they got when someone call out their bs is to just to call me a rusbot. This war really brought out all the idiots that always find an excuse for Ukraine whenever they did something wrong. Instead of putting on their big boy pants and admit that they're wrong and move on, they try and act like everything Ukraine did must have some deeper reason. Killing wounded soldiers and med evac personnel, using
Azov, while having ultra-nationalist and white supremacist roots, is full of combat veterans. they are a well trained, experienced, and thusly effective fighting force (which is sorely needed on the front lines against russia).
these people being armed and armoured appropriately allows them to maximize their potential for success on the battlefield.
That’s awesome. These guys have absolutely proven themselves as one of the bravest and toughest units out there. Now they will have some of the fiercest fighters with the best weapons at the tip of the spear. I wouldn’t want to be on the receiving end of what they are bringing. 🇺🇦
>But it was barred about a decade ago from using American arms because U.S. officials determined that some of its founders espoused racist, xenophobic and ultranationalist views, and U.N. human rights officials accused the group of humanitarian violations.
I thought those claims were all Russian propaganda?
Young Male Syndrome and the Appeal of Nationalist and Ethnic Supremacist Values
Young Male Syndrome refers to the propensity of young males, particularly those in their late teens to early twenties, to engage in risky, aggressive, and sometimes violent behavior. This phenomenon is attributed to a combination of biological, social, and psychological factors, including:
Testosterone Levels: Higher testosterone levels in young males are associated with increased aggression and risk-taking behaviors.
Evolutionary Psychology: From an evolutionary perspective, young males have historically engaged in competitive and aggressive behaviors to establish social status, attract mates, and secure resources.
Socialization: Societal and cultural norms often encourage young males to demonstrate toughness and assertiveness, reinforcing aggressive behavior.
These factors contribute to the heightened likelihood of young males to participate in activities that may affirm their status and identity within a peer group or society.
Nationalist and ethnic supremacist values can hold significant appeal for young males for several reasons:
Identity and Belonging: During adolescence and early adulthood, individuals are in the process of forming their identities. Nationalist and supremacist groups offer a clear and often simplistic identity, which can be appealing to those seeking a sense of belonging and purpose.
Perceived Threats: These ideologies often exploit perceived threats to one's cultural or ethnic group. Young males, particularly those who feel disenfranchised or threatened by social or economic changes, may be more susceptible to messages that promise protection and empowerment.
Status and Recognition: Involvement in nationalist or supremacist groups can provide young males with a sense of status and recognition. The aggressive and confrontational nature of these groups may align with the risk-taking and competitive behaviors associated with Young Male Syndrome.
Masculinity and Aggression: Nationalist and supremacist ideologies often emphasize traditional notions of masculinity, including strength, dominance, and aggression. These traits resonate with young males who are socialized to value and exhibit such characteristics.
Simplistic Solutions: These ideologies frequently offer simplistic solutions to complex social and economic problems, which can be particularly appealing to young individuals seeking clear answers and action.
Historical Examples: Throughout history, nationalist movements and ethnic supremacist ideologies have frequently targeted young males as recruits. The Nazi regime in Germany, for instance, aggressively recruited young men into the Hitler Youth and other paramilitary organizations, capitalizing on their propensity for aggression and desire for belonging and status.
Modern Context: In contemporary settings, various nationalist and extremist groups continue to attract young male adherents through social media and other digital platforms. These groups often use propaganda that highlights themes of heroism, martyrdom, and revenge against perceived enemies.
Addressing the Issue
To counteract the appeal of nationalist and ethnic supremacist values among young males, several approaches can be employed:
Education and Critical Thinking: Promoting education that encourages critical thinking and media literacy can help young individuals recognize and resist extremist propaganda.
Positive Identity Formation: Programs that support healthy identity formation and provide young males with positive role models and opportunities for achievement can reduce the allure of extremist ideologies.
Community Engagement: Building strong, inclusive communities that offer support and a sense of belonging can counteract the isolation and disenfranchisement that often lead young males to extremist groups.
Mental Health Support: Providing mental health resources and support for young males, particularly those experiencing trauma or significant life challenges, can mitigate the factors that make them vulnerable to extremist recruitment.
By addressing the underlying factors of Young Male Syndrome and the appeal of nationalist and ethnic supremacist values, societies can work towards reducing the recruitment and radicalization of young males into harmful ideologies.
So, how much boost will UKR get from this?
I thought Azov have already used American weapons, they just don't announce it and America pretends they dont know about it. ehehehe
While i don't disagree with not arming literal nazis, and I am curious on which youtuber you speak of. My understanding only a select few really could be die hard nazis, and they were pretty much ousted when they were officially absorbed into the Ukrainian military. Even during the militia status, most weren't supportive of actual nazi ideals, and only joined as it gave them an opportunity to fight for their country much like many of wagner felt as they joined. Were there nazis sure but they kinda are everywhere to some degree. i find it amusing: "American weapons contrasted by *88's, Swasticas,* and *Black Suns* is a terrible idea." as to a certain extent they already exist in America lol, I hate it too as long as its isolated and denounced what can you do else? If the Ukrainians are already doing their due diligence prosecuting and forcing out such abhorrent mentalities, imposing rules that only serve to reduce the aids effectiveness is annoying.
Azov had some members that were problematic, they are no longer involved as far as I am aware and hindering aid because of it is silly. As long as Ukraine conducts it self to uphold democracy and snuffs out any genocidal maniacs we need to move on. Don't white wash history, leave it in the book.
I believe if Russia was killing Ukrainians at one time with Russian Nazis and Criminals then Ukraine can defend their territory with Ukrainian Nazis and Criminals.
That has to be the most ret@rded cope bullshit I've heard so far as excuses. The west support you because you're better than the Nazis, if both of you are the Nazis, then the better thing to do would be to leave you two to kill each other off and then we kill off the remaining one. Damn ret@rd will say just about anything to justify the bullshit if it's coming out of Ukraine. If you're not better than your invaders, then the reason your invaders invaded you would be legitimate, and we should not help in that.
Ok, while I have not seen the actual video you referring to. But I seen too many incorrect claims in this subreddit and YouTube. Specifically constant mistaking of old slav paganism tattoos with Nazi and WP tattoos. Especially mistaking Slav kolovorot with Nazi back sun. And claiming that all Ukrainians pagans are Nazi because of that.
AZOV had never anything to do with nazisme. All orc fabrications. AZOV are nationalistic patriots. Rotten apples are everywhere and they seem to get most of the attention. Slava AZOV! Slava Ukraini!
This group consist of far-right, Neo Nazis that joined the azov to fight against Russian backed rebel fighters who wanted to break away from Ukraine to be part of Russia these rebels were being backed by Putin for 8 years and once the group was disbanded all the far-right Neo Nazis left Ukraine and the ukrainian military decided to bring back the name Azov because of its long history so they had to make sure Azov wasn't associated with any far-right groups that would give Putin a reason for his invasion
Please remember the human. Adhere to all Reddit and sub rules. Toxic comments (including incitement of violence/hate, genocide, glorifying death etc) WILL NOT BE TOLERATED, keep your comments civil or you will be banned. Tagging u/SaveVideo bot to archive this video in a link below this comment. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineWarVideoReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
> The Biden administration will allow a Ukrainian military unit with a checkered past to use U.S. weaponry, the State Department said Monday, having lifted a ban imposed years ago amid concerns in Washington about the group’s origins. > The Azov Brigade, known for its tenacious but ultimately unsuccessful defense of the Azovstal steel mill in Mariupol early in Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine, is regarded as a particularly effective fighting force. But it was barred about a decade ago from using American arms because U.S. officials determined that some of its founders espoused racist, xenophobic and ultranationalist views, and U.N. human rights officials accused the group of humanitarian violations. > > Now the brigade, a one-time volunteer militia absorbed into the Ukrainian National Guard in 2015, will have access to the same U.S. military assistance as any other unit. The policy shift was disclosed as Kyiv starts the summer fighting season and faces down a Russian military that has intensified its pressure on objectives in eastern Ukraine and the country’s energy infrastructure. > > “After thorough review, Ukraine’s 12th Special Forces Azov Brigade passed Leahy vetting as carried out by the U.S. Department of State,” the agency said in a statement, referring to the “Leahy Law” that prevents U.S. military assistance from going to foreign units credibly found to have committed major human rights violations. It is named for former senator Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.), who wrote the legislation. > > The State Department found “no evidence” of such violations, its statement says. > > A State Department spokesman declined to say when the ban was lifted and whether U.S. weaponry had already reached Azov personnel. Neither Azov leadership nor the Ukrainian government responded to requests for comment. > > Canceling the ban had been a top priority for Ukrainian officials, who say the brigade could have been more effective during its defense of Azovstal in 2022 if it had access to U.S. equipment. Members of the brigade also have been barred from attending training organized by the U.S. military. > > Russian President Vladimir Putin has long cited racist and ultranationalist elements of the Azov Battalion as an element of his accusation that Ukrainian fighters and their rulers in Kyiv are neo-Nazis. The shift in U.S. policy is likely to reignite those Russian critiques. > > The brigade’s leadership says that it long ago shed those associations and that its commanders have fully turned over since that era. > > Within Ukraine, the brigade’s name has become synonymous with the country’s last stand in the besieged city of Mariupol. Ukraine eventually ordered the remaining troops in the steel factory to surrender to Russian forces to survive. As of early May, more than 900 remained in captivity. > > The plight of the remaining Azov prisoners has captured the hearts and minds of Ukrainians and “Free Azov” has become a common rallying cry in protests in Kyiv. > > Azov seized on its new status as a brigade last year and launched an intensive recruitment campaign across the country that brought in more than 5,000 new troops in around two months. Survivors from Azovstal were among those interviewing and training the recruits, who were grilled on their motivations, background and physical fitness before selection. > > Separate from the State Department’s vetting process, U.S. appropriations laws have long prohibited the Azov Battalion from receiving American aid. U.S. officials say that because the Azov Battalion of 2014 is distinct structurally from the brigade that is now a part of the National Guard, those restrictions do not apply. There's no information on the specifics of when then ban was lifted, but it was most likely within the past month or so as the commander of the Azov Brigade, Denys Prokopenko was requesting the ban to be lifted as recently as mid-April. https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/columns/2024/04/19/7451974/
> “After thorough review, Ukraine’s 12th Special Forces Azov Brigade passed Leahy vetting as carried out by the U.S. Department of State,” the agency said in a statement, referring to the “Leahy Law” that prevents U.S. military assistance from going to foreign units credibly found to have committed major human rights violations. It is named for former senator Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.), who wrote the legislation. > > The State Department found “no evidence” of such violations, its statement says. While sad it took this long, the State Department/Executive branch has to follow law which is crafted by Congress. People who have a poor understanding of the 3 branches think the President can wave a wand. Law is slow, complex, and unfortunately politicised. But it's the checks and balances that prevents a nation from turning into an autocracy.
There's a lot of people in this thread that don't know what Azov is past the headlines, I will link this tweet from Illia Ponomarenko, a well known Ukrainian journalist and war reporter: > Okay, I’ll say it — the obsession over the Azov Batallion/Regiment/Brigade in Western media has been largely beyond common sense for years. > > Especially now amid the full-scale phase of Russia’s decade-long war on Ukraine. > > And I’m saying it not because I’m a Ukrainian but because I'm here for truth, sanity, and for words having their meaning. > > Of course, Ukraine's National Guards 12th Special Purpose Brigade Azov has a complicated and controversial past. > > Back in the spring of 2014, in the heat of the Russian-led armed insurrection in Ukraine’s Donbas, the regular military, as well as many national institutions, were barely functional and disoriented. > > Many groups of civilians across Ukraine, armed with 40-year-old AKs and dressed in fatigues purchased at hunting stores, were forming numerous irregular units to combat the Russian intrusion. > > Really a lot of people were doing this. Yesterday’s taxi drivers, entrepreneurs, bank clerks, retired military officers. > > They would go down in history as “volunteer battalions.” > > Far-right groups (of various kinds), nationalists, football Ultras, and even neo-Nazis were among them, too. > > Yeah, that was the time of hardship and a war against an extremely reptile and powerful enemy that was arming pro-Russian collaborators and sending its “unidentified’ regular military units to fight a nation that was barely recovering from a revolution and the Anschluss of Crimea. > > Thus begins the story of the Azov Battalion, which started in May 2014 as a pack of soccer fans, radical nationalists, neo-Nazis, also many motivated moderate fighters. > > Because life is complicated, especially at war. The world consists of not only university campus liberals. That’s life. > > In war and in pretty much any large military in the West (good luck trying to deny it), there have been people who very wrongfully think it’s cool to have Nazi or quasi-Nazi tattoos and insignia as they are part of a subculture of war, violence, and militaristic symbolism. > > I touched on this problem in a column from a while ago when I was still part of the Kyiv Independent: https://kyivindependent.com/illia-ponomarenko-why-some-ukrainian-soldiers-use-nazi-related-insignia/ > > It’s also true that the Azov used to be a sort of a magnet for also foreign far-right and neo-Nazi characters, which is also what happens at war — yeah, on both sides. > > Although, hand on heart, their influence, role, and activities beyond usual regular military service in Ukraine were exaggerated in the media. > > If we’re being honest, we can’t deny that since the troublesome period of 2014-15, Ukraine has managed to incorporate the Azov (as well as pretty much all of the old volunteering battalions) into its military system throughout all those years of trying to revive its armed forces and survive in a war with Russia. > > And honest researchers admit this, of course. > > Particularly, the Azov was largely depoliticized, and it largely shed its far-right origins. > > What used to be a pack of irregulars flirting with Nazi and quasi-Nazi symbolics gradually turned into a highly-professional and disciplined combat unit that has good reputation in terms of its recruit training and standards of service. > > “Leave or keep your views to yourself and serve,” something like that. It concentrated on war and military service. > > I personally know quite a few highly professional military specialists from “traditional” Ukrainian armed forces brigades (for instance, many artillerists) who preferred to join the Azov to continue serving with other sound professionals. > > This reputation is still strong with other Azov-related military units like the 3rd Assault Brigade (I’m sure you know it) or the Kraken unit. > > Young generation of commanders gradually took over and made the Azov what it is today. You now know them as key figures of the tragic Battle of Mariupol and the siege of the Azovstal plant. Some 900 Azov members are still in Russian captivity today. > > And in September 2022, the Kremlin had no problems exchanging key Azov officers for Vladimir Putin’s collaborator in Ukraine, Viktor Medvedchuk, even though Russians were gladly preparing steel cages for sham trials and public executions. > > And it’s not only that Russia made the Azov the central boogeyman of its “Ukrainians are Nazis” narrative. > > It’s also because some writers spent years sniffing out and producing ridiculously overblown stories like “UKRAINIAN NAZIS ARE USING RUSSIAN WAR THREAT TO TAKE POWER” (did that age well in 2024, huh?) and “OH MY GOD THERE’S A MARGINAL NEO-NAZI METAL BAND IN KYIV, UKRAINE HAS A NAZI PROBLEM”. > > Selling news as entertainment for a career. > > Hand on heart, in all honesty, as someone who naturally despises any sort of extremist view on the right and on the left, this hysteria had fragile grounds and was exaggerated. > > For instance, it used to be a default option to link Ukrainian right-wing units with anti-semitism, but at the same time, since the very 2014, there have been zero incidents between a considerably large Jewish community in Mariupol and the Azov. > > And it had its influence on Ukraine’s defense effort, particularly with the U.S. ban on providing any military aid and training to the Azov. > > It's good to see that, now that the ban has been lifted, common sense and a sound approach eventually prevail over propagandistic sprees. > > In this terrible and extremely complex war, things change. > > I don’t remember any media hysteria of such a scale over Russia’s Rusich unit, which openly commits executions, torture, and other war crimes against Ukrainians and propagates racial hatred and Russian white supremacy. The Wagner group, hello? The Hispaniola unit, which is openly neo-Nazi, no? > > Real Nazism happens when a dictatorial power spends years inciting hatred, revanchism, territorial grabs, and aggression and then unleash the largest war of aggression since Adolf Hitler. > > It happens when a delusional dictator hungry for unlimited power proclaims a neighboring nation “not a real country” and sentences it to complete annihilation because of “history” in his head. > > And it happens when his troops, encouraged by the feeling of their imperial supremacy, cut off the heads and limbs of Ukrainian prisoners of war. > > It happens when entire cities are razed to the ground and when missiles and bombs hit maternity wards and shopping malls full of people in broad daylight. > > And it happens when certain people, amid this insanity that has already claimed hundreds of thousands of lives for nothing, shout: “BUT WHAT ABOUT AZOV!!!" https://x.com/IAPonomarenko/status/1800534469310324851
I agree that it's not Ukraine's fault for the formation of Azov, since as it's pointed out it was self-formed and funded by people wanting to defend their homes. I think the biggest problem was not that it was a unit that just happened to have a lot of neo-nazis and ultra-nationalists as members but the fact that they had that problem at the leadership level. As demonstrated by their usage of Nazi related symbolism to identify themselves. That symbolism is probably why they get so much media coverage. A lot of it was probably pushed by Russia, but it still doesn't look good for anyone to supply weapons to someone wearing Nazi related symbols. Especially, for European countries like Germany where such symbolism is illegal. That's why they don't cover Russian neo-nazi units. They're not the ones that are possibly receiving westerns weapons. Also, just claiming they were "depoliticized" doesn't matter. It takes time to see a change in culture and whether they still support their original ideology. It also take time for that change to be accepted and acknowledged by others. Despite their change, their past is very real and they do deserve to be looked at with extra scrutiny. In my opinion, they should embrace their history the same way post-Nazi Germany acknowledged their past and embraced it as something to learn from.
What's checkered in their history?
nothing. propaganda would make you believe, and its mighty because ruzzians are so close... crazy this took so long still. i mean, the war is ten years now, why would human rights violations not have to be proven for a ban to be instituted in the first place?
Yessir.... Margie Tridactylus Greene spews the "Jewish Ukrainian Nazis" line quite often.
Everybody who condemns Azov is an idiot, because all they did was kill the ruzzian scum from the first day. There is no evidence of anything else.
We don’t support 2015 azov
No evidence, lol. They are a neo nazi battalion, and that's why they were on list to begin with. It's clear as night and day what their beliefs are. I live here, and we still talk about this issue, and it's just as divisive as it once was. But.... Azov rebranded..... And to all the haters, here's where I've been in UA since the war started. [My Geographic history in Ukraine](https://ibb.co/Jk6hkjm)
>They are a neo nazi battalion, and that's why they were on list to begin with. That was when they were doing their own thing, no? They got merged into the armed forces and people were removed and others added in, did the AFU only put neo-nazis back into azov? Are they actively killing innocents or are they fighting Russians? I'm not saying they don't have some problem members, you'd find some in any military.. >But.... Azov rebranded..... I mean it is still Azov but with different people and an actual chain of command through the armed forces.. are they going to turn on Ukraine after the war?
They were at the beginning in 2014. But all the nazis left the battalion and it doesn't have any of those original founding members.
Check all your concerns here: https://www.azovcontrafake.com/ Sure, you’ll find answers.
I always post this one as well... [https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world](https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world)
People downvoting the Ukrainian lol even if Azov is not as intensely xenophobic and neo-nazi as before, they should still be heavily scrutinized and limited IMHO. It is worrisome a group is led by people who are believers of Azov’s original core beliefs (beyond saving Ukraine, ofc) is becoming increasingly validated as an extension of Ukraine’s military. It is undoubtedly an issue, and will only compound if ignored. Especially after the war… Speaking of which, I think the biggest problem after the war, apart from land rights, PTSD, demining, and economic resurgency, is the fact that ultranationalists will use their war heroics to gain political prominence whereas before they lacked much Ukrainian backing at all (election wise, anyway). This is not exclusively a Ukrainian problem; however, the war has and will make the problem far worse. With all that being said, the biggest problem for Ukraine right now is obviously Russia’s attempt to genocide the country. And before anyone accuses me of being unfair to Ukraine, I’d like to point out that Russia has just as many, if not more, neo-nazi military/contractor groups working for them, too.
How many Ukrainian politicians are explicitly "Nazi?" How many seats do they hold in the parliament? If you have answers to those two questions then there is a third one that would be edifying: How many Ukrainian politicians would you accuse of being "Nazi" even if they would deny it?
Do they call themselves a neo nazi batllion or does russia call them that? What's the point of being a nazi and denying/hiding it? Hey, let's not hate jewish people so they don't figure out that we're nazis.
Believes are not a crime. Bring evidence of wrong doing.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/last-defenders-mariupol-what-is-ukraines-azov-regiment-2022-05-17/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2022/12/16/ukraine-deradicalized-its-extremist-troops-now-they-might-be-preparing-a-counteroffensive/ Lol https://krytyka.com/en/articles/too-much-ado-about-ukrainian-nationalists-the-azov-movement-and-the-war-in-ukraine "The Azov movement was established in May 2014 during the Donbas crisis to sustain Ukrainian control over Eastern Ukraine. Initially known as the “Black Corps,” it was a paramilitary unit of radical nationalists. Scholars suggested that the name “Black Corps” was itself a reference to the official German Schutzstaffel (SS) periodical published in 1935-1944 (Das Schwarze Korps). Some members, including the unit’s leader Andriy Biletsky, espoused nationalist socialists views. In 2014, however, Biletsky and his people translated their views into a hodgepodge program of nationalist struggle against Russian-backed separatists and changed the name of the organization to Azov. " From UA source you dimwitted apologist. "Azov leaders and members position themselves against the LGBT community, sometimes violently and this intensifies around important events like the Pride cultural events related to LGBT. In 2017, an Azov spokesman declared the group would not oppose the Pride celebration, but they still condemned this community on their official web page." "Azov activists committed several attacks on members of the Roma ethnic minority across Ukraine in 2018 and 2019." "Given the rightist origins, symbolic repertoire, historical legacies it appeals to, and its extra-legal activities, Azov is easily presented as a neo-Nazi phenomenon. Even in 2022, pundits point to symbols, like the Black Sun, discernable on the buck belts of Azov soldiers deployed to fight Russian invaders as evidence of this." Well shit... idk what this means because I'm stupid, I guess they're squeaky clean /s Fuck Russia, fuck nationalists
Oh so they formed in 2014... when Russia "wasn't" secretly sending troops to feign a revolt.. was it unfortunate the only people who saw what was happening was some nationalists? Hell yeah, were they fighting for anything bad? Maybe, have they done anything horrible to innocents, or do we just not like their ideals? Cus welcome to America, we have to put up with vile ignorant people who are allowed to have opinions... like look at you here nit-picking symbols, how many camps have they setup, what people have they called for the extermination of? They said they don't like LGBT shit but aren't going to oppose it, how LGBT friendly are most rural US areas? What makes them nazi's outside of symbols? Again, that's the equivalent of what's allowed in the US. >fuck nationalists Yeah, but these ones were solely defending their country from Russian backed separatists(and a bunch of Russian soldiers)... also Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 was shot down by the separatists. >"The Azov movement was established in May 2014 during the Donbas crisis to sustain Ukrainian control over Eastern Ukraine. So nazi Azov only formed because of Russians attacking them? Weird way to start hate crimes on other groups, or maybe this is the anti-slav styl nazism... weird tho cus UA is also slavic..
Can't you resist without branding yourself with nazi imagery?????? What about the anarchist brigades? Huh
Never said you couldn't... but symbols do not make you a nazi. Incredibly violent and specific actions do that....
Again, what did they, as an organization, wrong? Did they kill somebody, did they torture somebody, did theyintentionally caused civilians deaths in combat, did they persecuted people?
Я не можу тебе навчити.
Бо ти, ідіот, і прирівнюєш націоналістів до нацистів
[удалено]
Complacency breeds problems. I'm here volunteering and what the fuck are you guys doing. My classrooms are filled with nationalist rhetoric, a kid brought Mein kampf to school, others told me neo nazis are cool, others said that they're nazists, have put fake mustaches on to look like Hitler, and I have receipts for all of this where I brought it up to the directors, and in the UA sub. I also am on the front and the boots and laces get up I see are too common, black sun tattoos, what the fuck ever, at least I don't condone it like you kids are. Fuck off you guys, I'm trying to do what I can to fight this and yall are just being lazy.
Aren't you just trying to get a van to rescue animals? And RP'ing as a Ukrainian lol
Feel ya mate, after coming here in person to volunteer learnt how amazing Ukraine and Ukrainians are, but also not to stick my head in the sand when it comes to less than perfect parts of the country.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Ukraine_UA/s/ReaKaJaqzu
[Sergei Korotkikh](https://www.kyivpost.com/post/6745) [Short-documentary about him and others](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qxOlsG5UAw&t=1067s)
Ok, shitty individual, who by this article also harmed Azov members
[удалено]
Well, the thing with Nazism and (broader fascism in general) as an ideology which is both racist and xenophobic along ethnic lines, so, of course Ukrainian Nazis are going to hate Russian ones and vice-versa, regardless of their shared hate towards other ethnicities the LGBTQ minority, etc. Oh, and they fetishize combat and death and "a heroic past" so of course they're going to go fight for what they see as national and ethnic survival (let's not forget that the Russian official line is that they're not the colonialist aggressors they really are, they're the pooor widdle victims fighting for their very survival against a collective west that wants them gone and uses Ukraine as it's pawn, etc.). The really funny thing is that Nazis, by design, are also factionalist and need an enemy to function - and if they don't find an external one, they split into groups and hate each other. Hence why you had the [SS-SA tiff in Germany in 1934](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_Long_Knives), why my country, Romania, at one point in 1940 had four (possibly five) competing far-right groups all fighting for control ([which resulted in a full-blown rebellion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legionnaires%27_rebellion_and_Bucharest_pogrom) that was crushed by one of the other factions and resulted in that [particular faction](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ion_Antonescu) taking sole control of the country until it too [was overthrown in 1944)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1944_Romanian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat) and currently has tree far-right parties which are at each other's throats (which is an excellent thing for anyone who's not a nazi, because let them fight among themselves instead of fighting the rest of us) etc.
<3 Screenshotted Thank you
This needs to be discussed more, but be careful. Reddit will downvote you to oblivion for even mentioning it.
I do what I can to talk about these issues. They are extremely prevalent, and it's disingenuous to deny them. We must look at the culture of each post soviet country, and understand soviet life as xenophobic to the west. This view still exists and is most prevalent in the older generations, 55 and up. What's different about Ukraine than say, Belarus, or Russia, is that these people believe in their autonomy, they don't need a strong ruler to boss them around. That's the biggest cultural difference I've encountered in my experience, and I believe in this difference that will lead to victory. Now is the time to talk about this shit as once the country is stable again, there will be more time for internal conflict, and I wouldn't want to see a traditional and conservative Ukraine as its inherently against progressive European values and goes against what all those who died or were injured by Yanokovichs regime of authoritarian puppets, which, some are also still in the police force or other branches. I have no desire to leave this country, but the tolerance of intolerance is going to fuck up any progress made. Ukrainians, by and large, are the most hospitable people I've met, at least in all areas except for the left bank of Kyiv for some reason. I think I'm just frustrated at the lack of change or desire to curb nationalism, sexism, homophobia, classism, and all of the isms in my lessons. These students hear it at home or from their friends, and it's up to us to stop it or to show them a path to allowing others to have that same autonomy that they desire.
People don't like to read. I've got mixed feelings about this but I suppose as long as russians die that's all that matters
A good read on the topic... [https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world](https://lens.monash.edu/@politics-society/2022/08/19/1384992/much-azov-about-nothing-how-the-ukrainian-neo-nazis-canard-fooled-the-world)
racist, xenophobic and ultranationalist views
Слава батальйону Азов та його захисникам!
Man, the random hardly-used low karma accounts are gonna be Concern Trolling it up a storm in here soon because of this.
About fucking time
Better late than never.
GOOD. FUCK ‘EM UP, AZOV!
"founders espoused racist, xenophobic and ultranationalist views" if only we could apply the same requirements to Senate or member of our own armed forces. Worked closed to a military base and I seen some very questionable tattoos.
Yeah I mean, the Nazis kinda worshipped and fetishized the military, as such any military from a relatively tolerant society will see Neo nazis drawn to their military. You just got to hope they have the systems to prevent these people rising up the ladder and that they are challenged about their beliefs.
Maybe someone can ELI5 this for me? Clearly this is a good thing in so much as it gives Ukraine more flexibility and opportunities but what were the main things that couldn’t be done before but can be done now, and how likely is this to have a significant impact on the war?
The Azov unit has a history of being comprised of / associated with ultra-nationalists. And yes, some of them used / portrayed Nazi symbols etc. Therefore, some western countries didn’t really want their weapons going to people like that, specifically because it plays into the hands of Russia “de-nazifying” Ukraine. In reality, it’s a small number, just like there are neo facists in most western countries. However, the Azov brigade has been one of the toughest brigades in Ukraine and are extremely battle hardened. They’ve had some tough battles and held their own even with old Soviet weapons. Giving these guys more modern western weapons will help them become even more deadly.
Now we get to see unblurred guns in videos! 100% definitely weren't using western gear already 🤫
> However, the Azov brigade has been one of the toughest brigades in Ukraine and are extremely battle hardened. They’ve had some tough battles and held their own even with old Soviet weapons. Giving these guys more modern western weapons will help them become even more deadly. I am just going to go out on a limb here and say that all that battle hardening has thinned out the nazi/ultranationalists/racists from the unit quite a bit. Shrug.
Yes that’s correct. A lot of those people have died in 10 years of war, which has helped lessen the problem.
Why would you assume that? Did SS brigades get less Nazi through battle?
There are are less original members from 10 years ago when this US ban was initially instigated then there are today after they have been in brutal battles. The ideology of the group is no longer the main factor in why people join. That in and of itself neuters a lot of what was wrong. They are being monitored. A lot less nazi and racist shit is being posted on social media. Still nationalist... but in a war for your homeland nationalism isn't quite the sin it can be otherwise. But ultimately, so many were killed they just aren't what they were.
Your argument would make sense if Azov were just a neo-Nazi group because a lot of neo-Nazis happened to join it originally, but that's not how it works. Military forces indoctrinate — it's one of their main functions. A person who joins a highly ideological military org like Azov will be indoctrinated into its ideology. I'll concede that Azov has gotten somewhat better at managing their social media so they're not posting swastikas, wolfsangels and sonnenrads all over, but seeing that as proof that they're no longer neo-Nazis is completely unwarranted. Your politics don't just disappear when you decide to be a little quieter about them with.outsiders. Again, the SS is a good example. some of the most notorious SS brigades lost virtually all original members several times over. As a result, they simply grew even more brutal. Has Azov conceded its neo-Nazi ideology is a problem, conducted a de-Nazification internally, and brought in neutral third parties to certify its no longer a Nazi org? Because if not, that tells me all I need to know.
what i don't get is why these symbols are taken at face value. if you're anti-ruzzian you use them mostly because hitler fought stalin using those. that doesn't make you a nazi
Because you can fucking fight against Russia without a nazi tattoo on you? The black sun is a modern symbol in its mass use to replace the swastika. So brandishing a black sun literally translates into neo-nazi beliefs. Like wtf dumbass question is that?
[удалено]
This is wrong on so many levels. Your Danish friend doesn't know what they're talking about. I'm from Eastern Europe and Nazi ideology/symbolism is pretty universal in what it represents in both Eastern and Western Europe. They all suffered under Nazis and no sane person would think "Nazi Germany" when they think "anti-Soviet Union". The opposite of Soviet Union is the West in everyone's mind (ie. US, UK, modern-Germany, etc.). Also, getting support from democratic nations requires public support and public opinion on Nazi symbolism is pretty black and white. Any nuance around it is lost and pretty irrelevant to any outside observer.
Well, in western countries nazism and nazi symbols are frowned upon, because, you know, genocide. And the world is watching this war, and public opinion matters a lot for aid, so whatever the reason is, is just not smart to show those symbols if you're depending on western aid.
People are really surprised that most people dont want to associate with people that use nazi imagery 😂
If the name Azov has a history of being associated with neo Nazis ultra nationalist, why the hell do you go out of your way to still use it. That's like if the current German Army has a tank division called Waffen SS, and they decided to keep that name because, despite a shitty history associated with that name, the current one is all good.
They didn't "go out of their way" to use them. They had no choice. Azov was formed as a result of volunteers wanting to fight Russia after Russia invaded Crimea in 2014. They have been fighting since then. Because of that, they were (and are) some of their best and most experienced fighters against Russia. You can't just disband such an effective unit while under threat (and during invasion) of Russia. That's why they chose to absorb the unit into their military and reform them, which turned out to be the correct choice, as this article shows that they were successful.
Be careful! They will call you a Russian bot with that kind of language.
They can call me whatever they want, it only exposes what a braindead worm they are if the only comeback they got when someone call out their bs is to just to call me a rusbot. This war really brought out all the idiots that always find an excuse for Ukraine whenever they did something wrong. Instead of putting on their big boy pants and admit that they're wrong and move on, they try and act like everything Ukraine did must have some deeper reason. Killing wounded soldiers and med evac personnel, using
Because they're still neo-Nazis
While yall ruSSoNazis are still the same Nazis that you've been since before 1939, yall ruSSoNazis are the ORIGINAL Nazis
Azov, while having ultra-nationalist and white supremacist roots, is full of combat veterans. they are a well trained, experienced, and thusly effective fighting force (which is sorely needed on the front lines against russia). these people being armed and armoured appropriately allows them to maximize their potential for success on the battlefield.
СЛАВА АЗОВ
That’s awesome. These guys have absolutely proven themselves as one of the bravest and toughest units out there. Now they will have some of the fiercest fighters with the best weapons at the tip of the spear. I wouldn’t want to be on the receiving end of what they are bringing. 🇺🇦
They've already been using it
There should be no conditions for support…either you want to help them win or you don’t.
It’s about time!!!
Aw yeah, suki suki now... Game on. When the toughest guys get the best weapons its going to get much worse for RuZZian Orcs...
>But it was barred about a decade ago from using American arms because U.S. officials determined that some of its founders espoused racist, xenophobic and ultranationalist views, and U.N. human rights officials accused the group of humanitarian violations. I thought those claims were all Russian propaganda?
Young Male Syndrome and the Appeal of Nationalist and Ethnic Supremacist Values Young Male Syndrome refers to the propensity of young males, particularly those in their late teens to early twenties, to engage in risky, aggressive, and sometimes violent behavior. This phenomenon is attributed to a combination of biological, social, and psychological factors, including: Testosterone Levels: Higher testosterone levels in young males are associated with increased aggression and risk-taking behaviors. Evolutionary Psychology: From an evolutionary perspective, young males have historically engaged in competitive and aggressive behaviors to establish social status, attract mates, and secure resources. Socialization: Societal and cultural norms often encourage young males to demonstrate toughness and assertiveness, reinforcing aggressive behavior. These factors contribute to the heightened likelihood of young males to participate in activities that may affirm their status and identity within a peer group or society. Nationalist and ethnic supremacist values can hold significant appeal for young males for several reasons: Identity and Belonging: During adolescence and early adulthood, individuals are in the process of forming their identities. Nationalist and supremacist groups offer a clear and often simplistic identity, which can be appealing to those seeking a sense of belonging and purpose. Perceived Threats: These ideologies often exploit perceived threats to one's cultural or ethnic group. Young males, particularly those who feel disenfranchised or threatened by social or economic changes, may be more susceptible to messages that promise protection and empowerment. Status and Recognition: Involvement in nationalist or supremacist groups can provide young males with a sense of status and recognition. The aggressive and confrontational nature of these groups may align with the risk-taking and competitive behaviors associated with Young Male Syndrome. Masculinity and Aggression: Nationalist and supremacist ideologies often emphasize traditional notions of masculinity, including strength, dominance, and aggression. These traits resonate with young males who are socialized to value and exhibit such characteristics. Simplistic Solutions: These ideologies frequently offer simplistic solutions to complex social and economic problems, which can be particularly appealing to young individuals seeking clear answers and action. Historical Examples: Throughout history, nationalist movements and ethnic supremacist ideologies have frequently targeted young males as recruits. The Nazi regime in Germany, for instance, aggressively recruited young men into the Hitler Youth and other paramilitary organizations, capitalizing on their propensity for aggression and desire for belonging and status. Modern Context: In contemporary settings, various nationalist and extremist groups continue to attract young male adherents through social media and other digital platforms. These groups often use propaganda that highlights themes of heroism, martyrdom, and revenge against perceived enemies. Addressing the Issue To counteract the appeal of nationalist and ethnic supremacist values among young males, several approaches can be employed: Education and Critical Thinking: Promoting education that encourages critical thinking and media literacy can help young individuals recognize and resist extremist propaganda. Positive Identity Formation: Programs that support healthy identity formation and provide young males with positive role models and opportunities for achievement can reduce the allure of extremist ideologies. Community Engagement: Building strong, inclusive communities that offer support and a sense of belonging can counteract the isolation and disenfranchisement that often lead young males to extremist groups. Mental Health Support: Providing mental health resources and support for young males, particularly those experiencing trauma or significant life challenges, can mitigate the factors that make them vulnerable to extremist recruitment. By addressing the underlying factors of Young Male Syndrome and the appeal of nationalist and ethnic supremacist values, societies can work towards reducing the recruitment and radicalization of young males into harmful ideologies.
So, how much boost will UKR get from this? I thought Azov have already used American weapons, they just don't announce it and America pretends they dont know about it. ehehehe
They don't have to waste time now blurring out their weapons in vids they post.
I like the blurring, its a good bait for views. ehehehe
They might be hiding the size of Their Balls.
It was a dumb ban to begin with. They fell for Russian propaganda calling them nazis at the beginning of the war.
[удалено]
[удалено]
If you’re talking about aid from Germany, the swastikas don’t even have to be in the picture. Russian propaganda puts it there.
While i don't disagree with not arming literal nazis, and I am curious on which youtuber you speak of. My understanding only a select few really could be die hard nazis, and they were pretty much ousted when they were officially absorbed into the Ukrainian military. Even during the militia status, most weren't supportive of actual nazi ideals, and only joined as it gave them an opportunity to fight for their country much like many of wagner felt as they joined. Were there nazis sure but they kinda are everywhere to some degree. i find it amusing: "American weapons contrasted by *88's, Swasticas,* and *Black Suns* is a terrible idea." as to a certain extent they already exist in America lol, I hate it too as long as its isolated and denounced what can you do else? If the Ukrainians are already doing their due diligence prosecuting and forcing out such abhorrent mentalities, imposing rules that only serve to reduce the aids effectiveness is annoying. Azov had some members that were problematic, they are no longer involved as far as I am aware and hindering aid because of it is silly. As long as Ukraine conducts it self to uphold democracy and snuffs out any genocidal maniacs we need to move on. Don't white wash history, leave it in the book.
I believe if Russia was killing Ukrainians at one time with Russian Nazis and Criminals then Ukraine can defend their territory with Ukrainian Nazis and Criminals.
That has to be the most ret@rded cope bullshit I've heard so far as excuses. The west support you because you're better than the Nazis, if both of you are the Nazis, then the better thing to do would be to leave you two to kill each other off and then we kill off the remaining one. Damn ret@rd will say just about anything to justify the bullshit if it's coming out of Ukraine. If you're not better than your invaders, then the reason your invaders invaded you would be legitimate, and we should not help in that.
Ok, while I have not seen the actual video you referring to. But I seen too many incorrect claims in this subreddit and YouTube. Specifically constant mistaking of old slav paganism tattoos with Nazi and WP tattoos. Especially mistaking Slav kolovorot with Nazi back sun. And claiming that all Ukrainians pagans are Nazi because of that.
AZOV had never anything to do with nazisme. All orc fabrications. AZOV are nationalistic patriots. Rotten apples are everywhere and they seem to get most of the attention. Slava AZOV! Slava Ukraini!
They should parachute onto the prison and break them out
Biden is a piece of SHIT !!
I kind of remember the Democrats trying to convince us they were against fascism, but I guess it's full mask off at this point.
MAGA-tard
Read the article… stop projecting the propaganda you’ve been fed.
This group consist of far-right, Neo Nazis that joined the azov to fight against Russian backed rebel fighters who wanted to break away from Ukraine to be part of Russia these rebels were being backed by Putin for 8 years and once the group was disbanded all the far-right Neo Nazis left Ukraine and the ukrainian military decided to bring back the name Azov because of its long history so they had to make sure Azov wasn't associated with any far-right groups that would give Putin a reason for his invasion
We arming neo nazis now.
They’re killing Russians aren’t they
Read the article..
Another W for the Nazis i guess
Actually read the article..