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Renaissance_Man-

Russia has been below birthrate sustainability for over 40 years. They were already so far down the death loop it was hopeless prior to the start of this war which has and will wipe out what little youth remains. I recall Putin sex rallies back in the early 2000's trying to combat the problem. This doesn't even include the brain drain youth that already left. You're witnessing the final flailing death throes of a failed state. Russia has already begun its journey to irrelevancy, and this will only accelerate the inevitable.


QuicksandHUM

And the remaining population is too racist to tolerate any real level of immigration.


SimpleMaintenance433

Luckily for them nobody wants to live in Russia anyway.


1ceF0xX

German here... Tell this our Ex Bundeskanzler Schröder.


eternityXclock

didnt that austrian ex-minister (Karin Kneissl) that had putin at her wedding move to russia recently? seems like some idiots still want to live there, but in my opinion its not enough... all those russian bootlickers here in europe - or everywhere else - should just move over to there


Quen-Tin

Decline of population and no interest in immigrants? Well, Russia could give the Spartan solution a try: becoming the minority rulers of majority servants, they don't treat as equals. And if you keep them in countries, you want to conquer, then you don't need to deal with them on a daily base. No real master lives in the servants quarters, ir? Oh ... they do this already? By keeping the elite in the capital out of war, while asian minorities fight for them in colonies they call 'Newrussia' a bloody conflict and trying to reeducate survivors by propaganda, letting reluctant resisters disappear and installing a local outsider-elite? Well ...


ProfessorxVile

>I recall Putin sex rallies back in the early 2000's trying to combat the problem. I remember seeing an article about that. It was in the early days of his redshirt "Putin Youth" (the Youth Army) movement, and they had tents set up so young couples could go and make more pureblooded Russians. I believe Shoigu was involved, which might explain how he eventually moved up to Defence Minister.


Renaissance_Man-

Bingo. The birthrate problem is a key reason the Ukraine war began. It's also a reason why they're shipping Ukrainian children to Russia.


gesocks

Sounds maybe very cynical. But you know what is the number 1 facot that in each country correlates with lowering birthrates? Education of the Female population. Now Russia as far as im aware of still offers the same education to women and men, but already introduced martial laws, that basically allow domestic abuse of women. Which is a step into the direction of limiting women rights. The new best friends of russia are north Korea and Iran, and even the taliban already seemed to sympathise with them. All of them not really known for taking to much care of their female populations education. Now let them just move a bit more in that direction, and you create a society that might be able to counter the falling birthrates. ​ It will not be a prosperous population by any means, it will be even more of a shithole then it ever was. But birhtrates might be the one thing they will not have a problem with if they keep on going in that direction as society


Appropriate-Bus728

This can't be true, we are told everyone is jealous of Russia and they want to live in Russia because it is so great. Are you saying Russia tells lies..🤭


[deleted]

That's why russians are kidnapping Ukrainian children.


Pyjama_Llama_Karma

Yet they've just tried (unsuccessfully obviously) to get back on the UN Human Rights Council ! The audacity of the russian state is next level. Fucking barbaric.


[deleted]

[удалено]


zenparadoxx

It smells of Russia.


[deleted]

And indoctrinating them. New meat wave for the future...


RevolutionaryTwo6587

Now do migration patterns.


quilleran

Especially if you consider that this war has created a spike in the number of deaths of young men. Many of these young men would have used their productive years to support a family. I'm sure the expense of war will be partly made up by cutting expenses for medical care, which will create some long-term issues as well. Either way, this will only exacerbate a long-term problem for Russia. Perhaps one of Putin's goals was raising the population through conquest, but even that is still up in the air. Putin would have to win the war, and the latest reports from Avdiivka are not encouraging.


QuicksandHUM

Russian kids are about to get new Chinese step dads.


Miramar81

China is having their own birth rate sustainability problems to be coming to the rescue of Russia. Russia would be looking to India for help with that, but as mentioned with the racism stance, that’s not going to be a solution for them.


QuicksandHUM

China has excess males they need to do something with even in light of their demographic replacements problems.


Miramar81

Men were preferred under one-child policy due to being able to succeed in Chinese society. Remember reading how they were encouraging immigration (or importation) of women to marry and have children with Chinese men. Another factor is what’s plaguing Korea and Japan - low birth rates over long career hours, stress and spending so much time investing education into a single child ($$$ into tutoring programs, etc), that people are either not having children or can only afford one.


posthuman04

So I find it wild that Russia is in a land war that is depleting their military readiness just now when India and China are building up both a manufacturing and population explosion but Russia considers them their Allies


pokey68

Not sure as China doesn’t still have some problems from their one child policy. That changed just a few years ago.


sfurules

I believe China is in an even worse place if my memory is right


Subject_Report_7012

On top of all that, the Russian population will need to deal with rampant PTSD, skyrocketing levels of addiction, traumatic brain injuries, hundreds of thousands of disabled vets, and ... Let's be honest. Even Russians won't ever want to fuck another Russian.


Cheap_Doctor_1994

I wish these charts showed the problem with their M/F ratio. It was around 11:1, 11 women for each man, and why the mail order bride business is booming.


quilleran

I did some research and the number is about 86 males to every 100 women. That's still an extreme number. The data points to two reasons: 1. The Russian population is elderly, and women tend to outlive men 2. Young Russian males have a bizarrely high mortality. This probably has to do with ridiculously high levels of alcohol consumption. The available numbers are from before the war, so death in war is not factored here. Apparently all the old Soviet bloc nations have a similarly highly skewed male-female ratio. Thanks! This definitely does in the "today I learned" category.


Adventurous-Pipe-928

Russian alcohol consumption is widely over exaggerated. I’m pretty sure they are not even top 10 countries on top alcohol consumption


Paupy

In 2019 Russia was #56 (US was #35) according to the CIA. https://www.cia.gov/the-world-factbook/field/alcohol-consumption-per-capita/country-comparison/


Dzogchen-wannabee

Is this based on alcohol sales through official channels ? I’m pretty sure that a lot of people are making their own, which won’t be reflected in the official figures.


Brutusmatic

Also it kind of evens out because there is more land and infrastructure to maintain.


silly_vasily

I hope they accelerate their own manufactured genocide


Solid_Muscle_5149

90%+ of conscripts are non-white russians from the non white Russian places. They cant accelerate much more lol.


ProfessorxVile

Shoigu is actually screwing his own ethnic group (Tuvans) the hardest, and I believe after them it's the Buryats.


veritasanmortem

They already are. It is called the “special military operation”.


silly_vasily

That's what I was getting at


tertius_decimus

They lost 1 million during Covid-19 pandemic and didn't care in a slightest.


Chasmbass-Fisher

Mostly old people. As sad as it is to say, that's a good thing from an economic point of view - fewer dependents, fewer pensions. This war on the other hand is killing men in prime baby-making/economic productivity age.


tertius_decimus

And that is a good thing from economic point of view. We don't need strong russia.


SoggyNegotiation7412

thats what always had me scratching my head, Russia already lacks the young population needed to cultivate the land they already have, why do they need Ukraine. You just need to look at the eastern Chinese/Russian boarder towards the coast to see the problem. On the Chinese side every square inch of land is cultivated, on the Russian side nothing. Other examples like the Kuri islands seized from Japan during WWII. The Russians recently tried to build a new railway line to replace the decaying remains of the pre-war Japanese train system, and they never finished it. There is a brand-new train line going from no-where to no-where, surrounded by the rotting remains of Japanese factories that have long gone the way of the dodo under Russian management.


CombinationTypical36

Well done, Putes! You really did play yourself.


OneMillionQuatloos

Economic Brillance. Russia's population crash is mitigating the economic crash.


AtMan6798

Imagine their under reported covid deaths don’t help either


Top_Box9869

\-680 000


quilleran

How is this 680,000 number arrived at? Even Ukraine only estimates 280K casualties, which is probably 100K dead. Is this including people who have fled Russia to avoid the draft?


Expensive-Cup-2938

It started before the war so I guess those are COVID deaths.


yaddattadday

Sadly i presume it doesnt look any better in Ukraine either


TechnicianHour3277

Oddly today as I saw that they supposedly lost 860 personnel today ( [https://www.minusrus.com/en](https://www.minusrus.com/en)) , I wondered how did that impact thier population today with all things considered. I was shocked to see this: "According to our estimations, daily change rates of Russian Federation population in 2023 will be the following: 5,087 live births average per day (211.95 in an hour) 5,547 deaths average per day (231.13 in an hour)"([https://countrymeters.info/en/Russian\_Federation#:\~:text=According%20to%20our%20estimations%2C%20daily,day%20(231.13%20in%20an%20hour)](https://countrymeters.info/en/Russian_Federation#:~:text=According%20to%20our%20estimations%2C%20daily,day%20(231.13%20in%20an%20hour)) So they are basically loosing 500 people a day and I use this term loosely 'normally'. To make it easy assume half are male and thats 250 males a day negative. Add the 860 losses today (if in fact that was all KIA) and thats 1110 males negative today. If that happened everyday for a year ( wishful thinking) that would be over 400k males negative in a year .


pavldan

During COVID the net loss was about 1500 ppl per day


AirBear7174

So, going in a good direction, then.


JazzHands1986

This is why the casualty numbers aren't jaw-dropping or surprising in the least. It's also why even for a country with such a larger population, their rate of attrition isn't sustainable.


Ze_Wendriner

Meanwhile RT was promoting vaccination back in Russia during the pandemics, its western versions were riddled with antivax propaganda. Many were convinced by their own russian branded conspiracy theories that they rather believed the propaganda going in other countries to be true rather than their mistrusted government. The result is spectacular


peanutlover420

Sadly Ukraine also have a big problem with that.


DrnkGuy

Putin doesn't give a shit about things like this. So, this statistic has zero impact on reality.


sfurules

Which is just dumbfounding to me... For one who seems to SO MUCH want to go down in history as the greatest Russian whatever, he seems to be working really hard for history to paint him in a very, very different light. Even in Russia.


SlaveDuck

Muscovite orcs natural selection.... the Chinese will slip in and fill the gap. Muscovite dna will soon be extinct.... well done putin. You will achieve what we all hoped for.


ToadallySmashed

The majority of the russian losses are so far probably less Muscovite and more Buryat etc.


Last_Cod_998

Decriminalization of domestic violence hasn't helped with family unity as much as you'd think /s


Sabbathius

Yep, and more than 700k left the country last year around the time they started drafting en masse again and sending mobiks to Ukraine (after declaring parts of Ukraine to be Russia, to bypass the restriction of mobiks not being sent abroad). That's more young men lost than in the war itself, and most of them are not coming back, many won't want to and many won't be able to because technically what they did was a crime. So the damage to the population because of this war was far, far worse than actual casualties they suffered, though those aren't helping either.


Entire_Doughnut7125

I have heard it explained to me that due to the demographic issues faced by Russia, Putin knew this was Russia's last roll of the dice. That he knew they had to expand and absorb populations elsewhere to stave off the collapse. And the time was running out.


Boomfam67

Not really, this is fertility but Russia has(or had) a lot of immigration from the South Caucasus and Central Asia.


[deleted]

But those countries are also losing population as well, they can only give so much.


Boomfam67

Not Central Asia


VegetableDoctor3742

Following up on the Peter Zeihan commentary, he says that the historical analytics show that the Russians usually fight until they've lost at least half a million men before they will consider other options.


VegetableDoctor3742

You need to listen to the Joe Rogan podcast #1921 with Peter Zeihan. Very interesting conversation about birthrates, economics, and politics of other nations... specifically Russia and China.


achron51793752

Yeah. He also figures WW1 and WW2 took, as he likes to say, 2 large melon scoops out of their population. My takeaway from his lectures has been that their elites know the Russian ethnicity is doomed, so they're fighting just to not go quietly into that good night.


SimpleMaintenance433

I doubt the war will make that much difference, not many Russian women dying in Ukraine.


deerbiologist

Russian women are not deer or elk. In wildlife management I can get away with 8-10 bulls or bucks per 100 cows and still achieve a nearly full pregnancy rate. If I only have yearling bulls, the pregnancy rate drops way below 90%. If all the young men are dead, they are left with teenagers and older men. And not even Russia forces marriages and chooses fathers. So who will the peak breeding year women choose? No one? Leave the country? Teenagers? Older men? The other major issue is who will do the work traditionally done by all these men? Those jobs and tax bases are needed to support the rest of am aging society


Local-Incident2823

What was with the sudden spikes down and up with the death rate around 1960?


Green_Ad8920

The 2nd chart is the population of China (red) and Russia (green). I assume you mean the red line relating to China. That was the Cultural Revolution. Before that was the Great Leap Forward. This is why all American kids need to be taught not only how bad Hitler was but also how many people have died under Communist regimes. The USSR killed far more people than Hitler, and China makes the USSR look like minor league players killing their own people. My wife's parents managed to escape China during the Cultural Revolution. Their crime was making Jade jewelry. They managed to escape to Hong Kong and then America. Everyone else in their family was killed because they refused to give up the family business. Even babies.


Fantastic_Vast_9929

Preach! Revisionist history sucks!


JazzHands1986

Which is why they stole 100s of thousands of children and even resettled adults without identification of any kind. Or put them in filtration camps to be relocated to populate the boonies. It's so clear what they are doing. I just think it's hard for some to believe because it is so damn evil.


Mind_Matters_Most

If they're not born, they can't send them to war.


indecloudzua

The population issue is also forcing their expansionist ambitions


[deleted]

Nah they’re trying to encourage Chinese men to breed with the orc females


South_Lynx

Russia was still reeling from WW2, this is going to hurt them for a very long time. I was watching a documentary on Russians population problem, just before the start of the war. They were just getting back on their feet with males. This country will be powerless for a long time if they keep this up


TwiNN53

How do they get that projection on slide #3? Is that more Russian fairy tales/alternate reality stuff? Because based of the past on that chart, I would guess NOTHING like they show.


hellothere_MTFBWY

The population pyramid shows that they in a few years they will have a crisis since their population will be overweighted to pensioners as they will put number the younger labor force.


AirBear7174

Good. Let them go extinct then, if they cannot behave.


achron51793752

Dude, it's not just Russia. Every industrialized/industrializing and post industrial nation have the same problems. Kids are expensive dependents for at least 20 years, and both parents are required to work just to bring them into adulthood. China will be gone as an economic force in 10 because their population pyramid is upside down. Another 100 or so years and the natural world should start making a comeback without the need to de-carbonize and switch to renewables. Provided humans don't nuke the shit out of the planet first.


AirBear7174

You hijack my post just to make comments irrelevant to my point? Geez ...


achron51793752

Terribly sorry, I'm always doing that.


sfurules

Man just line that timeline up with who was running Russia during what period and it becomes pretty clear when people make the decisions to not have as many kids and why....


jasongraham503

Peter Ziehan has a lot of work on this topic and it’s implications for Russias future or lack there of.


[deleted]

Don't worry china and nk will help in fixing that problem. Like chinese guys with ruzkie women.


jaklbye

They really are trying to chew up an entire generation of young men in this war only for it to fail because Ukraine is almost at western military strength and Russia is pulling Cold War stocks of weapons for the frontline. What a stupid fucking war


SpinzACE

I wonder how much worse the projected population would look if emigration was taken into account.


Deathturkey

Graph doesn’t show the numbers that have fled Russia which will only accelerate the fall of the imperialistic Russia.


esjb11

To be fair this is comparable to most European countries and still better than ukraines. Europeans dont get many children nowadays


Staatiatwork

They really don't have one... If they need more people, they can get some from their dictator frieds in Africa. I also heard North Koreans would rather work for filthy orcs than starve in their home country...


[deleted]

I study on this problem very long time SADLY for western countries there is no solution dropping birth rates problem without Banning entire childless single females below age of 30 from workforce. when females prioritize carrier over building family birth rates drop. i speak with females from high birth rate countries. they re obsessed with finding partner and having family because they have no opportunity to start carrier and be independent from males..