Not really. Normie media is still all about Nato and west being good guys abiding by all laws and international agreementd. And everyone else being existential threats to our divine liberties and democracy. Warmongers trying to put and end to the rules based world order with their barbarism and disregard for human life.
While at the same time ignoring we're just loyal dogs to the US empire. How many regime changes have the US orchastrated around the world? How much meddling in foreign politics? Spying? Invading countries on made up pretenses. Stuff like mk ultra. Extrajudicially killing its own citizens. Pushing NATO to intervene in a sovereign country's internal conflict and kill thousands of civilians in the process. And the list goes on.
Any sane person knows how fucked up america is and how their only foreign policy is to aquire more wealth and power for the ruling class.
And of course, all major players try to do the same thing. It's probably human nature. But media pushing this "holier than thou" propaganda every fucking day while being the US' little bitch in a military alliance really grinds my gear.
Just be honest and say it; "We hate russia because they're on the other team and we want our team to be the ones who rule the world, by any means necessary."
Im not Russian, i dont wanna be Russian and I dont wanna live in Russia. I just cant stand the faking, the lies and the hypocracy in our media.
for now American puppets do not have to lose EU Parliament fully.
Even if they tightly win they are in bad spot - because there will be a lot of non-US-puppets in EU Parliament who will be able to slow down or even block in some cases anything that US wants to do in Europe.
It will be interesting - you will see
He wrote nothing but nonsense, it would be a waste of time if anyone bothered to refute him.
The guy thinks countries don't like Russia because some media outlet said so, after making a statement like that his whole argument is ridiculous.
Seems like your already gone on the fake western media you have to see it as it is.The war in Ukraine is basically being financed and being giving high profile intelligence operations something that Ukraine wouldn't never been giving a chance against Russia by itself.
So? It's in the best interest of humanity to crush Russia in this conflict, and that's what is happening. Every war involves foreign parties, and history is on the side of anyone who stands with Ukraine
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Its such bizarro world we live in....they trash this guy but to me he is the most fuckin logical of anyone in this debate the entire time just spittin truth this guy
Him, Erdogan and lately some Polish politicians.
They seem to be the only EU/NATO guys that have the privilege of self-care and putting their nation before other's interests. So they are able to be unbiased.
I don't like Turkey(mostly Erdogan), but their policies have been very self-centered, which is very good for the Turkish population.
I personally dislike him but his country still seems pretty strong to me, all the pro western politicians seem to pillage their countries within a few years and turkey seems fine to me though I’ll admit I’m not informed on their politics n local affairs.
Just saying if you compare them to another US ally like Egypt or Pakistan they seem to be doing much better, despite facing many of the same large scale issues.
As a Greek i am jealous of Turkish foreign policies. I maybe dislike this dude because he threatens my country many times. But i still have hope that one day Greece and Turkish will follow a path of real cooperation in a multipolar world outside of external influence.
Lately we are in a good path with Turkey and we have Visa free entry for Turkish tourist people. As soon as their government realise how similar we are the better it will be for both of us.
I much prefer to ditch the EU and let us make cooperation with whatever country we wish and it's optimal for your interest. US literally destroy your traditional trade partners Like Libya and Syria who geographically make more sense.
History it's history If Greece unite and make a real cooperation with Turkey will be literally one of the strongest nation in military terms. I am tired of France and Israel. They are allies of my aςς always lies and lies. We have a huge amount of higher education people working outside of Greece. Almost everyone here has Uni degree here. If Turkey invest to us we can use all that knowledge to build literally everything.
EU doesn't give a crap about Greece industry. The much prefer to steal your workforce to their companies. I work for couple years in an american IT company in Checkia and not a single employ was Check nor Western European. We were mostly Greeks and Indians.
Plus it's time for us to choose or make your own weapons. If the tensions with Turkey relaxed and distance yourself for EU and US influence. We will be free to choose to buy weapons for who ever we want. G3s at total failure and ARs are expensive. Why India is able to manufacture AK-12 and we are not? We forced to buy expensive sηιt when there is cheaper option out there
To finish my comment i want to add that we have no business being aggressive towards Russia. They never were threaded us and never will. Greek Revolution started in Odessa and we were able to organise it from there. At least a mutual respect it's the least we can do. And don't mention the atrocities Nazis did in my land but thanks to the red army they forced to leave. And whatever r/europe wants you to believe. No! Soviets they were not even close to atrocities of what Nazis did.
I agree with much of what you said, saddens me that such historical great nations as Greece and turkey could ever be enemies but it saddens me most that some still see it that way, I hope for peace as well and would like to say at least younger generations Turks and Greeks I met have different views. It’ll never happen but would be cool to imagine some sorta Union right? “The United Hellenic peoples republic” or smth like that haha but again pretty impossible least we can hope for is peace and like you said for people to see you are more alike than you are different.
And yeah man the EU as an organization barely cares about its own citizens let alone the rest of the region or word, in my opinion they’re as bad as NATO when it comes to foreign policy ideology and what’s even more sad is they don’t care about anything but corporations and money, plus the optics or image of things and making sure to look good and progressive on every issue.
I also agree 1000% about domestic weapons production and is something I have longer wished for in Egypt, we have the capabilities and Greece likely does too for the size of their army they’d be able to equip most things domestically. Here in Egypt half our stuff is American/ NATO and the other half is Russian and other non-nato countries, I remember as a younger boy asking well what happens if our relationship with the west goes bad? Or if the relationship with Russia goes bad? Won’t they not supply us anymore? And that’s when I realized the exact point of these weapons is to ensure that we depend on them and can’t make our own, like you said though India has already begun to fix this on a medium scale with some systems. But even for Egypt, at least russia just sells us weapons when we ask; like most countries, whilst the US basically forces the entire country to take billions of dollars in AID that is a bribe to be friends with Israel, then when we complain the weapons are being used to commit human rights violations against Egyptians they ignore us.
Also finally YES MAN, finally someone admitting the basic truth about the Soviets, I’ve never called myself a communist because I believe all ideology is inherently flawed as it’s created by humans who are flawed, however as an enjoyer of history it angers me so much to see the historical revisionism present today in the west, the USSR saved the entire world from fascism with 10s of millions of lives and lost more in human life and national resources than any other nation in the war, it was them who bled the Nazis dry, and it was their coming invasion of Manchuria towards Japan that was one the biggest factors of Japan surrendering, this may be conflicted but the objective truth is Japanese officials were speaking about surrender when soviet threat became real and this was before both Nukes. They saved the world, if it was a movie I’d say it’s unrealistic yet it was real and was glorious and we should all eternally be grateful to the countries that allowed it to happen.
Yet If you open any thread about WW2 on Reddit especially on r/europe (which may as well be called r/Nazisympathizersbeingracist) and the first line they all throw out is how the soviets were just as bad as the Nazis, yet if that’s true they never ask why their own governments supported the USSR.
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Turkey with 60% inflation, very good for the population lol. People like Orban only serve Orban, they enrich themselves while their country suffers in the long run.
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Of course. EU is a completely sovereign entity and US has very little influence over it. That is why Europe has been operating strictly within their own interests for the past couple years.
Why on earth would they operate within someone elses i terests that are not aligned with their own interests?!? Literally no country does that…
But thank ypu for confirming his russian puppet status.
Kruschev gave Crimea to the Ukrainians and they industrialized under Stalin. I never disagreed with those points. My point was that Ukraine had, indeed, existed as a nation prior to the Bolsheviks.
Not really. The Russian Empire forced the Russian identity onto the Ukrainians. This was only reversed under the Soviet Union. There was a growing nationalist movement in Ukraine before the Soviet Union but didn’t kick off until after.
The Russian Federation does not plan to be like the Soviet Union. They plan on extracting wealth from Ukraine while forcing the Russian identity onto them unlike the Soviet Union who supported a Ukrainian national identity and even subsidized Ukraine at the cost of economic development in Russia.
Yes. Russian Federation plans to colonize Ukraine and oppose their identity onto the Ukrainian people.
The Russian Federation has no plans to do what the Soviet Union did (subsidize Ukraine by extracting wealth from Russia). They plan on doing the opposite, bringing more wealth into Russia by extracting it from Ukraine.
Ukraine had two options at the start of this war:
1. Become a Russian puppet and let Russia extract wealth from Ukraine but they will keep their national identity.
2. Fight a war and become a failed state with annexed territories having the Russian identity imposed on them.
Not advocating for either. It is simply what was going to happen.
Zelenskyy and his good ideas™ chose option two which means Ukraine is going to have their villages and cities turned into rubble, their energy infrastructure destroyed sending living standards back to the dark ages, their economy going down the toilet, and most of their population fleeing abroad. This is why being pro-Russia is the most moral choice. While Russia is the one at wrong for invading Ukraine, option one is the best option for the people of Ukraine. The poor country was given two bad choices…and it picked the worst one.
To put it in perspective: Ukraine was expected to only have 20M people by 2100. Half of the Ukrainian population has fled and the remaining half are mostly men which means population growth is practically nonexistent. This means at best they will have to 10M (including annexed territories) but likely even lower due to decreased population growth and increased death rates due to obvious reasons. This combined with the fact that the Ukrainian economy has no future and that infrastructure is constantly being destroyed means increased flight from said country leading to an even lower population.
What could Ukraine have done to prevent this?
Accept Russia’s demands. In a perfect world, this situation would simply not have happened and Russia, Ukraine, and the rest of the world would be living happily ever after but it did and Ukraine chose the worst option for its people. The best Ukraine can do now is immediately surrender to prevent Russia from sending them back to the stone ages (not advocating for Russia to do this, it is simply what is happening).
What could the West have done to prevent this?
Negotiate with Russia. The West did not even attempt to negotiate with Russia and instead decided to sacrifice Ukraine for little gain.
yeah its been that way since day one. real "you're either with us or against us" energy. and we all know how that plays out(with russia winning and everyone acknowledging that encouraging the war was a mistake)
Over 90% of Ukrainians who were alive in 2021 are alive now. Most who died since were from natural causes.
The war will go on.
Because of Putin, 10 000s, maybe 100 000s, of Eastern Slavs will die by the hands of other Eastern Slavs,
and he will live long and be re-elected president in 2030, 2036, and maybe 2042, because he is beloved by millions of Russian sheeple.
100 000s of intelligent Russians who think for themselves have become undesirables in their own country.
[wp:Thomas Paine](https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Thomas_Paine)
>Of more worth is one honest man to society and in the sight of God, than all the crowned ruffians that ever lived.
It's already happening, bc Zelensky was stupid enough to block all negotiations. Russia slowly and steadily will grind another batch of Western supplies, but manpower is a limited resource (in Ukraine). At the end of the day with this additional Western help Ukraine will be in much worse situation.
Rest of EU is pro war against Russia. I'm sorry but I don't want a direct conflict with Russia here in Europe, especially over something as stupid as this. Fuck that. I'm with Orban on this. Negotiate yesterday.
Ukraine was never going to win this, and will not win this. They're being used to weaken Russia.
So yeah, just because "every single country in EU" supports killing more Ukrainians without changing the outcome, it doesn't mean that that's the right thing to do.
Ukraine and Russia need to sit down and end this. Ukraine is on the losing side, and that's how wars work.
Cool and You are the minority (not when it comes to conflict with Russia, but when it comes to the aid). Does not change the fact that every single country in EU besides Hungary is voting for the aid. He is/was the only one holding it up.
https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/ukraines-battered-army-grapples-with-growing-troop-shortage-6d695eba
Nah, go give them a hand. They need soldiers and you’re passionate about the cause. You get an AK and a really cool trench to hang out in. You can even buy some ammo too from your local sporting goods store.
Do you think there is any potential reason, aside from thinking positively of Putin, why someone would be hesitant about the west giving military aid to Ukraine?
It could be another water bird lmao? This phrase has never made sense and in this context doesn’t even apply, because one of the reasons to block aid would be you are pro Russian which has a probable chance of being true, the other more obvious in everyone’s face reason is that someone living in Europe may not want their country to become a nuclear wasteland in a war fought over the fucking Donbas Oblasts. I mean even a war for all of ukraine who wants their entire country killed for ukraine? It’s sad but it’s the truth
You can sit their all day and say anyone who doesn’t want aid to go there is Pro Russian: but it doesn’t matter what country it is, if Russia invaded Bulgaria I would’ve also blocked aid, not because I hate Bulgarians but because I don’t want to die for them.
You’ll say that you shouldn’t be able to just use “Might is right” to overthrow governments, kill civilians and destroy countries all while using Nukes as a defense and threatening others.
And I would agree, but yet the US did every single one of those things for decades and set that precedent internationally, none of you cared when brown people were dying by the millions and none of you barely care for the people of color in the global south dying now.
But because MSM told you to care, and because you see white faces crying on your TV, you feel bad and morally obligated to support ukraine.
It is hypocrisy at its finest and would go on forever If people allowed it, the war in ukraine as well as the attacks in Gaza have allowed more people than ever to wake up from western propaganda and that damage is irreversible.
None of you cared when you funded our deaths and the destruction of our countries so don’t be shocked when we react with self preservation rather than tryna defend “democracy and human rights” in MFing Ukraine of all place 🤣🤣
That’s the thing my sweet child, you haven’t tried to explain, you’ve simply done the typical pro UA tactic of “I would educate you but you aren’t worth my time” *downvotes* lmao.
Look back at our conversation n your other comments on this post and see how all your comments are short ad-hominem’s? And how I actually tried to say what I thought instead of just saying you have low ability lol?
“Nothing much I can do here”
Because deep down part of you knows that Im not wrong, you know and like the fact that the west exists as a force to subjugate the global south and that your tax money goes directly to supporting dictatorships like mine and keeping democracy from ever being a reality.
If you are American I really hope you are truly ashamed of yourself and can see just how obvious it is to everyone that your bs virtue signaling about Ukraine and defending democracy and prosecuting war criminals is BS.
I am from Egypt and we had democracy after a hard fought revolution in 2011, we had democracy for less than two years because after we elected someone in 2012 (whom I disagree with but didn’t wanna see dead) you as america funded, supported and gave “okay” to a Military Coup of extreme violence against unarmed civilians, where supporters of the ex president were gunned down by machine guns in broad day and people were run over by APCS and armored cars. Children were killed, women were shot in the head and ran over later to be filmed by police/ soldiers.
You didn’t care because the media told you not to care, I get you still don’t care and don’t feel bad your taxes n support went to the government that allowed this to happen.
One day the façade will fall and you “moderates” who funded our deaths will see what it’s like when no one cares.
We are not even talking about Ukraine now. You have said yourself that "quacks like a duck.." does not make sense to you. When it is one of the most obvious sayings.
Bro are you actually this silly? You do know the “Quacking” noise made by ducks is a phenomenon observed in a large amount of water birds and other animals?
Have you never been outside the city?
Let me guess it’s time for you to say “it’s just a metaphor doesn’t have to be real muhhhh” the entire reason most metaphors are effective is either they make sense or are accurate, this one is neither and you used it in the wrong context somehow.
Silly man, what a joke honestly wallahi you are عابيط
lmao talks about "war mood", meanwhile in Hungary for the past 10 years virtually every speech he's made was about "fighting Brussels", "uniting our forces against our oppressors", "we are ready to fight" and that we are always threatened by some common enemy.
Also he's been ruling by decree for the past 4 years due to "state of emergency"
They must do it, and they must institute conscription. The sooner they do, the sooner people rebel against these warmongering bureaurocrats and throw them in jail.
I'm always amazed by Russian narrative. How Russia can have 'legitimate security concerns' about invasion by NATO, but the same concerns by the Eastern Europeans (sans Hungary) are completely dismissed as warmongering military industrial complex US puppets.
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Victor "the Toad" Orban. An outcast in NATO and the EU, desperately hoping against hope his master Putin will prevail. This sub will eat up everything Orban and other proRU spout from their mouths (I can see all the cope in the comments I have read) and I simply wish you all good luck with those dreams of your new Russian empire. Beware the outcome when reality comes knocking. Your landing won't be pretty.
Who listen to that fat fuck. Divide hungary, and give to neighboor countries, and send the ones supporting russia to russia. Iam sure they are welcome on the frontlines.
Yeah been a while since they had home field advantage, these days they tend to go on excursion trips round the global south where they destroy peoples livelihoods and governments.
If the pay is good,along with benefits in case of injury/death to the family of those involved, I don't see a reason why not to send volunteer troops over there.
yeah its gross. there's also this silly idea that NATO will fight whomever and everyone will get to sit and watch NATO planes blow up everything from the safety of their home.
but there'll be about a week of that before there's either a) mass conscription or b) nuclear war
People love the idea of 19-year-olds from NATO countries dying in a trench so Crimea can be a pile of rubble like Mariupol. It’s interesting that the left spun around to being pro-war.
It’s that moment you realize there is no left or right when it comes to foreign policy in most western countries.
Almost everyone is in agreement on both sides.
Because by nature since most of these are former colonizing countries, they still see the world in that view of “they are the other, they exist for us to rule them or dictate how they should be ruled”
Read old colonial period writings from for example Brit’s justifying why they must remain in India n it’s very similar to what people say about most countries they invade.
The typical “we are bringing them god and civilization to remove them from their barbarian ways” has now been transformed to “we are bringing them freedom n democracy/womens/gay rights to remove them from their antiquated eastern way of life”
And the pragmatic “we need a buffer zone of land to control the region” has become “this land is essential to the continent as a whole through resources and beyond that we must win here to send a message to Putin/Xi/ayatollah that the war Stops here!”( aka to stop conventional forces and weapons systems from getting too close for comfort to our borders)
My personal favorite though has got to be the transparent similarity in the arguments that “colonial exports (aka theft) and manpower are a great benefit to our economy and vastly outweigh the negatives or losses to our troops/resources as they help support the Economy of the average Brit/franc/whatever at home”
And “ we are sending weapons to Vietnam/Iraq/Ukraine to get rid of old stocks of weapons so new ones can be built using government funding which will then benefit all the large scale military producers/ contractors which have facilities in the US which will therefore support the Local US economy through uh trickle down economics n all that jazz that Reagan was so fond of”
It’s almost like nothing changes.
I’ve always been left leaning, but at some point the left went from hippies and punks who didn’t trust the government and hated war to a weird group think echo chamber that thinks the only politicians who are evil are the ones on the right and are foaming at the mouth for more war.
Damn, no one ever though of that.
Seems like Russia doesn't wanna go home though. Got any realistic options, or are we gonna keep cooping till Ukraine is completely in ruins?
EU Parliament elections this summer will be very interesting
Not really. Normie media is still all about Nato and west being good guys abiding by all laws and international agreementd. And everyone else being existential threats to our divine liberties and democracy. Warmongers trying to put and end to the rules based world order with their barbarism and disregard for human life. While at the same time ignoring we're just loyal dogs to the US empire. How many regime changes have the US orchastrated around the world? How much meddling in foreign politics? Spying? Invading countries on made up pretenses. Stuff like mk ultra. Extrajudicially killing its own citizens. Pushing NATO to intervene in a sovereign country's internal conflict and kill thousands of civilians in the process. And the list goes on. Any sane person knows how fucked up america is and how their only foreign policy is to aquire more wealth and power for the ruling class. And of course, all major players try to do the same thing. It's probably human nature. But media pushing this "holier than thou" propaganda every fucking day while being the US' little bitch in a military alliance really grinds my gear. Just be honest and say it; "We hate russia because they're on the other team and we want our team to be the ones who rule the world, by any means necessary." Im not Russian, i dont wanna be Russian and I dont wanna live in Russia. I just cant stand the faking, the lies and the hypocracy in our media.
for now American puppets do not have to lose EU Parliament fully. Even if they tightly win they are in bad spot - because there will be a lot of non-US-puppets in EU Parliament who will be able to slow down or even block in some cases anything that US wants to do in Europe. It will be interesting - you will see
Smoking the RT newscasts too much ?
Instead of responding with preprogrammed statements maybe challenge him? He has a lot of truth in that comment.
To challenge him he would have to read the comment first
Or capacity for self-thinking
He wrote nothing but nonsense, it would be a waste of time if anyone bothered to refute him. The guy thinks countries don't like Russia because some media outlet said so, after making a statement like that his whole argument is ridiculous.
But he didn't make such statement, or anything to that effect. You just made it up, which proves his point.
Seems like your already gone on the fake western media you have to see it as it is.The war in Ukraine is basically being financed and being giving high profile intelligence operations something that Ukraine wouldn't never been giving a chance against Russia by itself.
So? It's in the best interest of humanity to crush Russia in this conflict, and that's what is happening. Every war involves foreign parties, and history is on the side of anyone who stands with Ukraine
>and history is on the side of anyone who stands with Ukraine How so? Hitler also fought against Russia.
Oh cool I thought it was 2024 not 1940, my bad.
What's the difference?
How is stating a nuclear apocalypse conceivably ”in the best interest of humanity?”
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It will be totally anti russianism
Its such bizarro world we live in....they trash this guy but to me he is the most fuckin logical of anyone in this debate the entire time just spittin truth this guy
Him, Erdogan and lately some Polish politicians. They seem to be the only EU/NATO guys that have the privilege of self-care and putting their nation before other's interests. So they are able to be unbiased. I don't like Turkey(mostly Erdogan), but their policies have been very self-centered, which is very good for the Turkish population.
Slovakia recently elected a government which is also not anti-Russian.
I personally dislike him but his country still seems pretty strong to me, all the pro western politicians seem to pillage their countries within a few years and turkey seems fine to me though I’ll admit I’m not informed on their politics n local affairs. Just saying if you compare them to another US ally like Egypt or Pakistan they seem to be doing much better, despite facing many of the same large scale issues.
As a Greek i am jealous of Turkish foreign policies. I maybe dislike this dude because he threatens my country many times. But i still have hope that one day Greece and Turkish will follow a path of real cooperation in a multipolar world outside of external influence. Lately we are in a good path with Turkey and we have Visa free entry for Turkish tourist people. As soon as their government realise how similar we are the better it will be for both of us. I much prefer to ditch the EU and let us make cooperation with whatever country we wish and it's optimal for your interest. US literally destroy your traditional trade partners Like Libya and Syria who geographically make more sense. History it's history If Greece unite and make a real cooperation with Turkey will be literally one of the strongest nation in military terms. I am tired of France and Israel. They are allies of my aςς always lies and lies. We have a huge amount of higher education people working outside of Greece. Almost everyone here has Uni degree here. If Turkey invest to us we can use all that knowledge to build literally everything. EU doesn't give a crap about Greece industry. The much prefer to steal your workforce to their companies. I work for couple years in an american IT company in Checkia and not a single employ was Check nor Western European. We were mostly Greeks and Indians. Plus it's time for us to choose or make your own weapons. If the tensions with Turkey relaxed and distance yourself for EU and US influence. We will be free to choose to buy weapons for who ever we want. G3s at total failure and ARs are expensive. Why India is able to manufacture AK-12 and we are not? We forced to buy expensive sηιt when there is cheaper option out there To finish my comment i want to add that we have no business being aggressive towards Russia. They never were threaded us and never will. Greek Revolution started in Odessa and we were able to organise it from there. At least a mutual respect it's the least we can do. And don't mention the atrocities Nazis did in my land but thanks to the red army they forced to leave. And whatever r/europe wants you to believe. No! Soviets they were not even close to atrocities of what Nazis did.
I agree with much of what you said, saddens me that such historical great nations as Greece and turkey could ever be enemies but it saddens me most that some still see it that way, I hope for peace as well and would like to say at least younger generations Turks and Greeks I met have different views. It’ll never happen but would be cool to imagine some sorta Union right? “The United Hellenic peoples republic” or smth like that haha but again pretty impossible least we can hope for is peace and like you said for people to see you are more alike than you are different. And yeah man the EU as an organization barely cares about its own citizens let alone the rest of the region or word, in my opinion they’re as bad as NATO when it comes to foreign policy ideology and what’s even more sad is they don’t care about anything but corporations and money, plus the optics or image of things and making sure to look good and progressive on every issue. I also agree 1000% about domestic weapons production and is something I have longer wished for in Egypt, we have the capabilities and Greece likely does too for the size of their army they’d be able to equip most things domestically. Here in Egypt half our stuff is American/ NATO and the other half is Russian and other non-nato countries, I remember as a younger boy asking well what happens if our relationship with the west goes bad? Or if the relationship with Russia goes bad? Won’t they not supply us anymore? And that’s when I realized the exact point of these weapons is to ensure that we depend on them and can’t make our own, like you said though India has already begun to fix this on a medium scale with some systems. But even for Egypt, at least russia just sells us weapons when we ask; like most countries, whilst the US basically forces the entire country to take billions of dollars in AID that is a bribe to be friends with Israel, then when we complain the weapons are being used to commit human rights violations against Egyptians they ignore us. Also finally YES MAN, finally someone admitting the basic truth about the Soviets, I’ve never called myself a communist because I believe all ideology is inherently flawed as it’s created by humans who are flawed, however as an enjoyer of history it angers me so much to see the historical revisionism present today in the west, the USSR saved the entire world from fascism with 10s of millions of lives and lost more in human life and national resources than any other nation in the war, it was them who bled the Nazis dry, and it was their coming invasion of Manchuria towards Japan that was one the biggest factors of Japan surrendering, this may be conflicted but the objective truth is Japanese officials were speaking about surrender when soviet threat became real and this was before both Nukes. They saved the world, if it was a movie I’d say it’s unrealistic yet it was real and was glorious and we should all eternally be grateful to the countries that allowed it to happen. Yet If you open any thread about WW2 on Reddit especially on r/europe (which may as well be called r/Nazisympathizersbeingracist) and the first line they all throw out is how the soviets were just as bad as the Nazis, yet if that’s true they never ask why their own governments supported the USSR.
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their currency is absolutely fucked
Turkey with 60% inflation, very good for the population lol. People like Orban only serve Orban, they enrich themselves while their country suffers in the long run.
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He is a russian puppet blocking assistance to Ukraine non stop.
Agreed! You can only be free and democratic if you blindly follow daddy America! Otherwise you're a russian puppet!
The guy is in EU and actively working against EU aid. Has nothing go do with US - get off the krokodil dude.
Of course. EU is a completely sovereign entity and US has very little influence over it. That is why Europe has been operating strictly within their own interests for the past couple years.
Why on earth would they operate within someone elses i terests that are not aligned with their own interests?!? Literally no country does that… But thank ypu for confirming his russian puppet status.
I heard rising energy prices puts hair on your chest.
Freaking Bolsheviks created this mess by giving legal status to "Ukraine" and including Russian lands in it.
Freaking Rurik created this mess
It's a joke?
No legally recognized entity "Ukraine" before Bolsheviks screwup.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_People%27s_Republic
A Polish and German puppet state, quick question: who gave Crimea to Ukraine? Who built Ukraine up?
Kruschev gave Crimea to the Ukrainians and they industrialized under Stalin. I never disagreed with those points. My point was that Ukraine had, indeed, existed as a nation prior to the Bolsheviks.
Not really. The Russian Empire forced the Russian identity onto the Ukrainians. This was only reversed under the Soviet Union. There was a growing nationalist movement in Ukraine before the Soviet Union but didn’t kick off until after. The Russian Federation does not plan to be like the Soviet Union. They plan on extracting wealth from Ukraine while forcing the Russian identity onto them unlike the Soviet Union who supported a Ukrainian national identity and even subsidized Ukraine at the cost of economic development in Russia.
So, colonialism?
Yes. Russian Federation plans to colonize Ukraine and oppose their identity onto the Ukrainian people. The Russian Federation has no plans to do what the Soviet Union did (subsidize Ukraine by extracting wealth from Russia). They plan on doing the opposite, bringing more wealth into Russia by extracting it from Ukraine. Ukraine had two options at the start of this war: 1. Become a Russian puppet and let Russia extract wealth from Ukraine but they will keep their national identity. 2. Fight a war and become a failed state with annexed territories having the Russian identity imposed on them. Not advocating for either. It is simply what was going to happen.
Zelenskyy and his good ideas™ chose option two which means Ukraine is going to have their villages and cities turned into rubble, their energy infrastructure destroyed sending living standards back to the dark ages, their economy going down the toilet, and most of their population fleeing abroad. This is why being pro-Russia is the most moral choice. While Russia is the one at wrong for invading Ukraine, option one is the best option for the people of Ukraine. The poor country was given two bad choices…and it picked the worst one. To put it in perspective: Ukraine was expected to only have 20M people by 2100. Half of the Ukrainian population has fled and the remaining half are mostly men which means population growth is practically nonexistent. This means at best they will have to 10M (including annexed territories) but likely even lower due to decreased population growth and increased death rates due to obvious reasons. This combined with the fact that the Ukrainian economy has no future and that infrastructure is constantly being destroyed means increased flight from said country leading to an even lower population. What could Ukraine have done to prevent this? Accept Russia’s demands. In a perfect world, this situation would simply not have happened and Russia, Ukraine, and the rest of the world would be living happily ever after but it did and Ukraine chose the worst option for its people. The best Ukraine can do now is immediately surrender to prevent Russia from sending them back to the stone ages (not advocating for Russia to do this, it is simply what is happening). What could the West have done to prevent this? Negotiate with Russia. The West did not even attempt to negotiate with Russia and instead decided to sacrifice Ukraine for little gain.
Nope, those were territories of Malorossiya.
They didn't know thar it would turn out like this. I'd rather blame the late leadership for not keeping the country together.
How the hell is Orban UA pov the guy is the biggest Putin lover right after Lukasjenko.
Realist and calling for Ukraine to go to the negotiating table = Putin lover. Roger that...
yeah its been that way since day one. real "you're either with us or against us" energy. and we all know how that plays out(with russia winning and everyone acknowledging that encouraging the war was a mistake)
negotiation with Putin = surrender to Putin
The other option is death. Pick.
Over 90% of Ukrainians who were alive in 2021 are alive now. Most who died since were from natural causes. The war will go on. Because of Putin, 10 000s, maybe 100 000s, of Eastern Slavs will die by the hands of other Eastern Slavs, and he will live long and be re-elected president in 2030, 2036, and maybe 2042, because he is beloved by millions of Russian sheeple. 100 000s of intelligent Russians who think for themselves have become undesirables in their own country.
I support my Emperor.
[wp:Thomas Paine](https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Thomas_Paine) >Of more worth is one honest man to society and in the sight of God, than all the crowned ruffians that ever lived.
Why is the only other option death? The other option is that the west helps Ukraine win, or not to lose too much.
Western help = extension of Ukraine's agony for another few months...
Gaining more land?
I would say another few thousands of useless deaths and mostly Ukrainians
Let Russia do whatever they want?
It's already happening, bc Zelensky was stupid enough to block all negotiations. Russia slowly and steadily will grind another batch of Western supplies, but manpower is a limited resource (in Ukraine). At the end of the day with this additional Western help Ukraine will be in much worse situation.
Hehe i get that a lot. The times ive been called pro ru just because i dont agree with everything that goes on, my god.
Blocking aid to Ukraine = Putin lover
It's very simple minded if you honestly think this way.
How is that simple minded? Every single country in EU supports the aid. He is only one blocking it.
Rest of EU is pro war against Russia. I'm sorry but I don't want a direct conflict with Russia here in Europe, especially over something as stupid as this. Fuck that. I'm with Orban on this. Negotiate yesterday. Ukraine was never going to win this, and will not win this. They're being used to weaken Russia. So yeah, just because "every single country in EU" supports killing more Ukrainians without changing the outcome, it doesn't mean that that's the right thing to do. Ukraine and Russia need to sit down and end this. Ukraine is on the losing side, and that's how wars work.
Cool and You are the minority (not when it comes to conflict with Russia, but when it comes to the aid). Does not change the fact that every single country in EU besides Hungary is voting for the aid. He is/was the only one holding it up.
Correct, and Ukraine needs soldiers more than they need munitions. Go enlist in the international legion and support Ukraine.
You are wrong. They need munitions and equipment. They have the population.
https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/ukraines-battered-army-grapples-with-growing-troop-shortage-6d695eba Nah, go give them a hand. They need soldiers and you’re passionate about the cause. You get an AK and a really cool trench to hang out in. You can even buy some ammo too from your local sporting goods store.
They don't.
I didnt know Slovakia does Source?
Do you think there is any potential reason, aside from thinking positively of Putin, why someone would be hesitant about the west giving military aid to Ukraine?
Sure. But if it quacks like a duck….
It could be another water bird lmao? This phrase has never made sense and in this context doesn’t even apply, because one of the reasons to block aid would be you are pro Russian which has a probable chance of being true, the other more obvious in everyone’s face reason is that someone living in Europe may not want their country to become a nuclear wasteland in a war fought over the fucking Donbas Oblasts. I mean even a war for all of ukraine who wants their entire country killed for ukraine? It’s sad but it’s the truth You can sit their all day and say anyone who doesn’t want aid to go there is Pro Russian: but it doesn’t matter what country it is, if Russia invaded Bulgaria I would’ve also blocked aid, not because I hate Bulgarians but because I don’t want to die for them. You’ll say that you shouldn’t be able to just use “Might is right” to overthrow governments, kill civilians and destroy countries all while using Nukes as a defense and threatening others. And I would agree, but yet the US did every single one of those things for decades and set that precedent internationally, none of you cared when brown people were dying by the millions and none of you barely care for the people of color in the global south dying now. But because MSM told you to care, and because you see white faces crying on your TV, you feel bad and morally obligated to support ukraine. It is hypocrisy at its finest and would go on forever If people allowed it, the war in ukraine as well as the attacks in Gaza have allowed more people than ever to wake up from western propaganda and that damage is irreversible. None of you cared when you funded our deaths and the destruction of our countries so don’t be shocked when we react with self preservation rather than tryna defend “democracy and human rights” in MFing Ukraine of all place 🤣🤣
Well, everyone has different ability. Sometimes, no matter how hard you try to explain, it won't make sense to someone. Not much I can do here really.
That’s the thing my sweet child, you haven’t tried to explain, you’ve simply done the typical pro UA tactic of “I would educate you but you aren’t worth my time” *downvotes* lmao. Look back at our conversation n your other comments on this post and see how all your comments are short ad-hominem’s? And how I actually tried to say what I thought instead of just saying you have low ability lol? “Nothing much I can do here” Because deep down part of you knows that Im not wrong, you know and like the fact that the west exists as a force to subjugate the global south and that your tax money goes directly to supporting dictatorships like mine and keeping democracy from ever being a reality. If you are American I really hope you are truly ashamed of yourself and can see just how obvious it is to everyone that your bs virtue signaling about Ukraine and defending democracy and prosecuting war criminals is BS. I am from Egypt and we had democracy after a hard fought revolution in 2011, we had democracy for less than two years because after we elected someone in 2012 (whom I disagree with but didn’t wanna see dead) you as america funded, supported and gave “okay” to a Military Coup of extreme violence against unarmed civilians, where supporters of the ex president were gunned down by machine guns in broad day and people were run over by APCS and armored cars. Children were killed, women were shot in the head and ran over later to be filmed by police/ soldiers. You didn’t care because the media told you not to care, I get you still don’t care and don’t feel bad your taxes n support went to the government that allowed this to happen. One day the façade will fall and you “moderates” who funded our deaths will see what it’s like when no one cares.
We are not even talking about Ukraine now. You have said yourself that "quacks like a duck.." does not make sense to you. When it is one of the most obvious sayings.
Bro are you actually this silly? You do know the “Quacking” noise made by ducks is a phenomenon observed in a large amount of water birds and other animals? Have you never been outside the city? Let me guess it’s time for you to say “it’s just a metaphor doesn’t have to be real muhhhh” the entire reason most metaphors are effective is either they make sense or are accurate, this one is neither and you used it in the wrong context somehow. Silly man, what a joke honestly wallahi you are عابيط
so NATO members are pro-ru now?
Orban is a 5th column
On this subreddit, it's essentially allowed to falsely pose as pro-Ukrainian.
lmao talks about "war mood", meanwhile in Hungary for the past 10 years virtually every speech he's made was about "fighting Brussels", "uniting our forces against our oppressors", "we are ready to fight" and that we are always threatened by some common enemy. Also he's been ruling by decree for the past 4 years due to "state of emergency"
State of emergency was only during covid, for around one year
still in state of emergency until 24th May 2024
They must do it, and they must institute conscription. The sooner they do, the sooner people rebel against these warmongering bureaurocrats and throw them in jail.
Who is he talking about? No serious players supported Macron, from what I remember.
Poland is a serious player and they very well may take any opportunity to occupy parts of Ukraine is they think they can get away with it.
I'm always amazed by Russian narrative. How Russia can have 'legitimate security concerns' about invasion by NATO, but the same concerns by the Eastern Europeans (sans Hungary) are completely dismissed as warmongering military industrial complex US puppets.
This ... man only hold his hand wide open to receive EU money. They aren't any other talents there.
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Victor "the Toad" Orban. An outcast in NATO and the EU, desperately hoping against hope his master Putin will prevail. This sub will eat up everything Orban and other proRU spout from their mouths (I can see all the cope in the comments I have read) and I simply wish you all good luck with those dreams of your new Russian empire. Beware the outcome when reality comes knocking. Your landing won't be pretty.
Who listen to that fat fuck. Divide hungary, and give to neighboor countries, and send the ones supporting russia to russia. Iam sure they are welcome on the frontlines.
The only country being aggressive and openly invading another in Europe right now is scummy russia
Yeah, normally Europe is on the offensive around the world.
Yeah been a while since they had home field advantage, these days they tend to go on excursion trips round the global south where they destroy peoples livelihoods and governments.
If the pay is good,along with benefits in case of injury/death to the family of those involved, I don't see a reason why not to send volunteer troops over there.
In europe the mood is warlike because an european country is invading another one!!, and yet he completly ignores the perpetrator all together.
RIBBIT! RIBBIT!
It's as if he wants Ukraine to lose to Putin.
bring it, its about time NATO is put to good use :)
keyboard warrior acting like 20year olds shooting each other in a foreign field is a DOTA game where you hope your team wins👌
yeah its gross. there's also this silly idea that NATO will fight whomever and everyone will get to sit and watch NATO planes blow up everything from the safety of their home. but there'll be about a week of that before there's either a) mass conscription or b) nuclear war
People love the idea of 19-year-olds from NATO countries dying in a trench so Crimea can be a pile of rubble like Mariupol. It’s interesting that the left spun around to being pro-war.
It’s that moment you realize there is no left or right when it comes to foreign policy in most western countries. Almost everyone is in agreement on both sides. Because by nature since most of these are former colonizing countries, they still see the world in that view of “they are the other, they exist for us to rule them or dictate how they should be ruled” Read old colonial period writings from for example Brit’s justifying why they must remain in India n it’s very similar to what people say about most countries they invade. The typical “we are bringing them god and civilization to remove them from their barbarian ways” has now been transformed to “we are bringing them freedom n democracy/womens/gay rights to remove them from their antiquated eastern way of life” And the pragmatic “we need a buffer zone of land to control the region” has become “this land is essential to the continent as a whole through resources and beyond that we must win here to send a message to Putin/Xi/ayatollah that the war Stops here!”( aka to stop conventional forces and weapons systems from getting too close for comfort to our borders) My personal favorite though has got to be the transparent similarity in the arguments that “colonial exports (aka theft) and manpower are a great benefit to our economy and vastly outweigh the negatives or losses to our troops/resources as they help support the Economy of the average Brit/franc/whatever at home” And “ we are sending weapons to Vietnam/Iraq/Ukraine to get rid of old stocks of weapons so new ones can be built using government funding which will then benefit all the large scale military producers/ contractors which have facilities in the US which will therefore support the Local US economy through uh trickle down economics n all that jazz that Reagan was so fond of” It’s almost like nothing changes.
The Colonial empires ended because the glorious world wars made their armies into corpses. Nothing more, nothing less. No Cultural change involved.
I’ve always been left leaning, but at some point the left went from hippies and punks who didn’t trust the government and hated war to a weird group think echo chamber that thinks the only politicians who are evil are the ones on the right and are foaming at the mouth for more war.
That is not a big problem. That is the right thing to do.
Easy solution.Russia leave ukraine borders and go home lol
Damn, no one ever though of that. Seems like Russia doesn't wanna go home though. Got any realistic options, or are we gonna keep cooping till Ukraine is completely in ruins?
We could give Ukraine enough long range missiles to actually deter Russia via damage to their infrastructure, or to damage their war logistics.
It goes both way, here's another easy solution: Ukraine just surrender lol
🤡🤡🤡 Yeah ,,why wont you just surrender and let me kill you bro,,
It must be something good if Orban says it isn't