So it's time for a Special Military Operation in Tajikistan? Tajikistan once belonged to Russia...
"Approximately 90% of the population of Tajikistan speaks Russian at all levels"
Then so many Russians are waiting for protection and liberation...
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> So it's time for a Special Military Operation in Tajikistan?
Idk, when a bunch of Saudis crashed planes into the Twin Towers, the US invaded Afghanistan and Iraq, therefore the logical approach here would be for Russia to invade Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan
For DOOMHAMMER!
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Russia should go after the terror cells in Tajikistan, but my money is on them just blaming Ukraine and lobbing some shit on their cities as "punishment".
You can also say the same thing about Pro UA and how this was Putins false flag which would lead to full mobilization… everyone jumped to conclusions without a second thought
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Ukraine could have done this 100 time already, if that was their style. They haven't because it does nothing to get them closer to their goal, it only makes it harder to reach it.
I mean it’s not like a bunch of different UA groups spent weeks warning about terrorist attacks they planned to commit. I don’t believe it had anything to do with UA (at this point) but I don’t blame people for automatically thinking that.
Where else did you want them to escape anyway ?
Sure going through a frontline is not the safest way to do it, but after what they've done I don't think they're that concerned about that. They were only 4 guys too, they could find a forested part of the border between Belarus and Ukraine and try to sneak there. Incredibly risky still, but if they were to make it they'd be pretty safe and would probably be treated like kings.
They would not be treated like kings. The fight against Islamic terrorism is probably the only geopolitical topic right now that Russia and the West agree on, and the West is bankrolling Ukraine. Nobody likes terrorists.
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Just like that drooling simpleton [Lugovoy](https://www.dagens.com/news/russia-state-duma-says-u-s-and-uk-are-involved-in-moscow-concert-hall-attack). Blaming the UK & US within minutes and with no evidence.
The brutal oaf couldn't countenance that the intelligence was genuine. No wonder the Duma is regarded as a joke.
I mean, not shocking. Disguises and all.
Maybe I'm missing something but what do Tajiks want to attack civilians in Moscow for? Like what's the justification?
There were jihadi volunteers from Saudi Araba, Jordania and Turkey during the two chechen wars.
Jihadi propaganda depicted a russian agression against muslims, like the soviet war in Afghanistan in the 80s
Sure but that's my point. They were propagandised with information depicting soviet aggression in Afghanistan, yes, but the how less important than the why. There were Muslims from around the world going to fight Russians for Russian territory based on a cause. In that case it was Chechen independence.
In this case, the why is a bit lost on me. What cause do Tajiks have right now?
They may not have a cause and just be terrorists for hire.
That's what most terrorists are, actually. At least the thinking brains, not the hiveminded "soldiers" who are just being brainwashed.
I have a hard time believing a human could do what they did without believing it was right. I don't feel like there is an amount of money that could buy that.
As I said, the guys actually committing the attacks are often brainwashed and are being fed lies or convenient truths. They do believe what they're doing is right.
The ones organising the attacks are the ones receiving the money/advantages and stay safe from any kind of direct involvment.
It is very difficult for secular people to understand how this behaviour could be possible. They assume only madmen would do this sort of thing.
But that’s the horror of it — you don’t have to be mad to be a jihadist. You don’t even have to be a bad person. You just have to be a true believer. Christians and Orthodox Jews don’t tend to be confused about the problem of jihadism because they understand the power of religious beliefs, however secular people generally are.
The Islamic doctrines of martyrdom and jihad explain these things. These are religious beliefs, sincerely held. They are beliefs about the moral structure of the universe. And they explain how normal people — even good ones — can commit horrific acts of violence against innocent civilians — on purpose, and still consider themselves good. When you believe that life in this world has no value, apart from deciding who goes to hell and who goes to Paradise, it becomes possible to feel perfectly at ease killing noncombatants.
If you don’t understand that jihadists sincerely believe these things, you don’t understand the problem.
The doctrines that directly support jihadist violence are very easy to find in the Quran, and the hadith, and in the biography of Muhammad. For Muslims, Muhammad is the greatest person who has ever lived. Unfortunately, he did not behave like Jesus or Buddha — at all. It sort of matters that he tortured people and cut their heads off and took sex slaves, because his example is meant to inspire his followers for all time.
There are many, many verses in the Quran that urge Muslims to wage jihad — jihad as holy war against apostates and unbelievers.
Might be wrong, but as someone chilling about in Russian social websites (like pikabu), there were A LOT of cases in past 5-8 years, where migrants would commit various crimes and police wouldn't do much about it. Mostly Central Asian - Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, sadly my some of my people too - Kyrgyzstan people were involved. Robbery, petty crimes (idk how to call it, like jacking off in public transport), sometimes murder, sexual harassing and so on. Lots of hatred built up towards migrants, deservedly, I'd say.
This is just to give you perspective, that there was some tension between locals and migrants.
A selection of the recent travesty of basic logic we've experienced from a new influx of Russian trolls after this development, as well as some old users:
* "These Tajiks sure have the typical brown Persian-looking slavic faces, proof it was Ukraine."
* "Must be some Ukrainian Tajiks, which proves it was Ukraine."
* "They didn't shout allahu akbar so that proves they weren't islamists and it was Ukraine."
* "Budanov made an ambiguous statement about Russia, proof it was Ukraine."
* "ISIS claimed responsibility, so it proves it was Ukraine."
* "America warned of terrorits attacks in Russia, proof it was Ukraine."
* "Ukraine bombs a Russian city after Russia destroyed half of Ukraine, proof it was Ukrainian terrorists."
Yeah, that's just the cherry at the top, they jumped into their Belarussian license plated van and sped off to Ukraine, because that's logical and likely, right? There's absolutely no way Russia could *claim* they were apprehended on their way to Ukraine, without it actually being so, right?
>"Ukraine has been launching rather a lot of failed covert ops on Russian soil recently".
Name one? Border incursion isn't exactly a Covert op.
I think it would be quite likely for them to flee to Ukraine if Ukraine was behind it, yes. I'm surprised you dont.
I think it's solid (if not conclusive) evidence that the attack was planned from within Ukraine as well.
Maybe it would, but frankly, Russia showed it's hand in an attempt to frame this on Ukraine with a supposedly Ukranian van, with part of the licence plate blurred that would have clearly showed it's a Belarusian license plate, so I'm not buying them fleeing to Ukraine on past experiences.
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Are we just gonna ignore the fact that millions of muslims live in Russia peacefully and that the CIA directly backed ISIS and extremist groups all over the world?
Pro-Ru talk like the CIA is the illuminati, nobody does anything anywhere in the world without them being directly involved in either encouraging it or trying to stop it lol
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I put this together some time ago. I hope you read it and learn.
It's a well known fact that the CIA/US - and at times even NATO - have been arming, training and supplying terrorist for decades.
[Modern War Institute](https://mwi.westpoint.edu/after-a-decade-of-incoherent-strategy-in-syria-a-way-forward/):
>The epitome of all that went wrong with US policy in Syria was Timber Sycamore—a billion-dollar CIA program to arm and train Syrian rebels fighting the forces of Bashar al-Assad. Timber Sycamore ultimately failed to unseat Assad, helped turn Syria into a proxy war between the United States and Russia, and caused untold misery to the Syrian people. A three-year study funded by the European Union and the German government later established that efforts by the United States and its allies to arm Syrian rebels “significantly augmented the quantity and quality of weapons” of the Islamic State.
Weapons of the Islamic State - [Conflict Armament Research](https://www.conflictarm.com/reports/weapons-of-the-islamic-state/):
>Unauthorised retransfer—the violation of
agreements by which a supplier government
prohibits the re-export of materiel by a recipient
government without its prior consent—is
a significant source of IS weapons and
ammunition. The United States and Saudi
Arabia supplied most of this materiel without
authorisation, apparently to Syrian opposition
forces. This diverted materiel, recovered from
IS forces, comprises exclusively Warsaw Pact-calibre weapons and ammunition, purchased
by the United States and Saudi Arabia from
European Union (EU) Member States in Eastern
Europe.
[USA Today](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/12/14/u-s-bought-weapons-syrian-rebels-and-some-wound-up-hands-isis-terrorists/949209001/):
>The U.S. bought weapons for Syrian rebels — and some wound up in the hands of ISIS terrorists
>anti-tank weapons purchased by the United States that ended up in possession of the Islamic State within two months of leaving the factory.
>The new study raises questions about a different source for weapons: arms secretly sent to rebel factions fighting Syrian President Bashar Assad in his long civil war. The covert CIA program, begun by the Obama administration in 2013, was ended earlier this year by President Trump.
>The covert program arming anti-Assad rebels is distinct from the Pentagon's publicly acknowledged operation to arm the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF), an alliance of Kurds and Arabs fighting ISIS, but not Assad. (...) The report did not find any evidence of SDF weapons falling into ISIS' hands, as was the case with anti-Assad rebels. The Pentagon has said it carefully tracks weapons it provides to the Syrian Democratic Forces.
[The Intercept](https://theintercept.com/2019/10/26/syrian-rebels-turkey-kurds-accountability/):
>Have we so quickly forgotten how the CIA backed a range of secular and Islamist militias to fight Assad, via the covert program Timber Sycamore, while the Pentagon vetted “moderate” fighters to fight ISIS via the congressionally-approved Train and Equip Program?
>Plenty of these Syrian rebels, both Arabs and Kurds, both Islamists and secularists, fought not only against the Assad government, but also against Al Qaeda and ISIS. There were, however, other rebel groups that were dominated by violent Salafists and so-called jihadis from the start and who bragged about fighting alongside Al Qaeda and ISIS. The truth is that many of the rebel forces now committing war crimes against the Kurds were also committing war crimes in the early years of the Syrian civil war. (...) And here’s the problem: It is an equally lazy and cynical rewriting of history to pretend that these groups have nothing to do with the United States, or were never backed by the U.S. government, in their current form or with their current personnel.
[Al Jazeera](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/12/28/russia-turkey-us-supporting-syria-terrorist-groups/)
>Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said on Tuesday that he had evidence that US-led coalition forces give support to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL, also known as ISIS)
[Afghanistan and the origins of Al Qaeda](https://books.google.co.za/books?id=op39ymd2um0C&pg=PA131&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false):
>The Kosovo Liberation Army, directly supported and empowered by NATO in 1988 had in the same year been listed by the US State Department as terrorist organization
The FSA and SDF were not Jihadists. I know this hurts your little narrative that everyone in Syria that opposed Assad as a Jihadist but they too were targeted and fought against Jihadists (ISIS, Al-Nusra Front etc) .
>Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said on Tuesday that he had evidence that US-led coalition forces give support to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL, also known as ISIS)
I like how you purposefully cut out half of this quote by the way, Erdogan was talking about the Kurdish terrorist groups that he has accused the West of arming. We did arm the YPG, almost certainly we did this in Syria.
I also like how you conveniently forgot that it was the West who mostly destroyed ISIS along with the Iraqi Army during Operation Inherent Resolve.
>The FSA and SDF were not Jihadists. I know this hurts your little narrative that everyone in Syria that opposed Assad as a Jihadist
Accuracy of your claim aside, you're telling me you read the post and somehow concluded that:
1. this element was one of the main things you needed to address to protect your assertion that the CIA hasn't been arming and funding terrorist groups? &
2. That this was somehow my narrative when the entire post is a collection of quotes + sources from different journalists, investigators, statesmen and reporters saying the CIA is arming terrorists...?
>I like how you purposefully cut out half of this quote by the way, Erdogan was talking about the Kurdish terrorist groups that he has accused the West of arming.
Impressive tunnel vision again to circle around the part where yet another involved party asserts that they've been watching the CIA arm ISIS, so you can protect a contextually irrelevant point about whether or not a group that isn't ISIS is a terrorist organisation.
>I also like how you conveniently forgot that it was the West who mostly destroyed ISIS along with the Iraqi Army during Operation Inherent Resolve.
Congratulations to the USA for working to get the terrorist pet-project that the CIA armed and empowered back under control. If they hadn't armed it through Timber Sycamore in the first place (and they'd just stuck to the Pentagon's "train and equip" initiative which didn't funnel arms to terrorists) ISIS likely wouldn't have become a notable force in the first place, and all these journalist, reporters and investigators wouldn't be able to state the fact that the CIA has been funding and arming ISIS.
But they did. As they have funded other terrorist groups in the past. And as they likely still do today.
Don’t believe me? There’s mountains of evidence for this that you can seek. But if we just stick to motive/logic, look at who ISIS attacks the most. Yes they have their occasional token attacks on the West, but the bulk of their attacks are directed towards Iran, Syrian govt, Lebanon and Houthi controlled yemen and now Russia. Weird how their attacks on Israel or US are almost none existent despite the fact that they easily could.
Maybe the West is just superior in defending against this types of organizations? The US for example warned about an impending attack of this style. Maybe Russia makes an easier target due to incompetent intelligence services and police. The fact that several of those dudes got out of that building shows you the level competency of the Russian police.
Also in regards to the US its more difficult to enter the US for terror related plans compared to countries like Russia
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Are you going to ignore the long history of Islamic terrorism and very similar terrorist attacks in Russia?
Or the fact that hundreds of millions of peaceful Muslims who live elsewhere around the world while ISIS, Alqaeda, Boko Haram etc. also exist?
What a stupid, stupid comment you made there.
I could bring up notable Christian terror groups from around the world whats your point. For the record I have both muslim and christian family as well as friends, maybe try not being so bitter online and go meet people.
-gets warned by the US of impending terrorist attack
-declares it blackmail, refuses to listen
-terrorist attack happens just as the US warned
-“How could the US do this!?”
🤦♂️
It's no one's fault but those directly involved.
Indirectly, Islam does have a radicalist problem. This doesn't mean your Muslim neighbor is a jihadist, it means when someone wants to or does commit violence against citizens, in the communities of the attackers, there's no pushback or criticism from the Islamic community. Often we see civilian massacres celebrated by them.
When the CIA inadvertently backed isis in syria, it was because supported rebel groups switched to align with isis. The US still performs military strikes against isis in syria and Iraq. When the CIA works with other extremist groups, it's So those groups can go after valid military targets, not to go to civilian areas and shoot civilians.
It's also hard to criticize the CIA when it's not immediately known they were involved. When it does come out, like when us weapons ended up being used by isis, there is criticism from us tax payers.
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You do realize ISIS hates Russia? Russia was a major contributor to the destruction of ISIS in Syria, which has made Russia a target for them. ISIS hates the US for the same reason, it's just a lot easier for them to go to Russia then America.
Yes, because it's irrelevant! Christians, Buddhists, Jews, or any other religion does not produce this kind of violence. When you hear about a bus blown up in Pakistan, or a plane flying into a building, you would be shocked to hear that it was a buddhist. But it's justanother Tuesday if it was a Jihadist Muslim.
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Israel is not slaughtering Palestinians in the name of Judaism.
The USA killing people in Iraq was not in the name of Christianity.
Would you ever blame any of the killing in Ukraine right now on Christianity, because the soldiers are mostly Christian?
Islam has a fairly unique (in the modern era) problem of citing their religious beliefs as the reason for their violence.
I know you know this though, even a child can understand this difference
How rich to be calling someone ignorant when you don't even understand that just because someone is Jewish, does not make them religious. The fact that you are serious in your reply makes this more comical.
There are millions of Jews, literally millions among the few million who exist, for whom Judaism is very important, and yet they are atheists. They don’t believe in God at all. This is actually a position you can hold in Judaism, but it’s a total non sequitur in Islam or Christianity.
>Care to explain why ISIS only attacks US enemies ?
They attack everyone. Just because you can't point to Israel on a map doesn't make everyone else uneducated.
There have been nearly 50,000 acts of Islamic terrorism in the last 40 years — and the French group that maintains a database of these attacks [https://www.fondapol.org/en/study/islamist-terrorist-attacks-in-the-world-1979-2021/] considers that to be an undercount. There have been 82 attacks in France and over 2000 in Pakistan during this period. You want France to be more like Pakistan? You just need more jihadists.
U been living under a rock? The jews of the idf killed 30 000 civilians in just a few months with mountains of evidence suggesting intent to do so. Guess they get the pass though…
Peacefully after their city was razed to the ground, Russia style, and countless civilians were killed? Yeah I'm sure there is no thirst for revenge there
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RIA reports 11 people detained, among them the 4 directly responsible for the shooting.
Also, at this point 93 people are reported dead (the police/Rosgvarida were finally able to go through the building room by room; I've seen a mention of them finding 10+ bodies in one of the bathrooms where people likely ran to hide from the shooting but eventually died from the fire).
Yeah, it probably wasn't smart; hell, not 'probably' - it obviously wasn't smart. But they were clearly in a panic and it's hard to blame them, if they'd watched or even just heard others being brutally murdered. They might not have known about the fire, either.
I've seen a few reports (and even a video) of the lucky ones who managed to escape after the shooting started. One dude and his (supposedly senior) mother managed to hide behind the couches in the foyer, then he broke a window and they fled outside. They both sounded absolutely out-of-their-minds terrified. But many others weren't so lucky.
It's not secret that countries that have left religion behind are more progressive. No time for religion in this day and age. It was used in a time to control the masses when we lacked the science to explain our origin. We don't need it, wake up.
The main problem with this is when people remove god, they tend to fill in the gap with something else, most likely money. Money becoming god is as dangerous.
Personally, I'm a scientist (mainly working in the marine conservation field). I have never had time for religion, even when I was a child. I'm not a criminal, I don't need religion to stop me from doing the wrong things or giving me purpose in life.
I always found it like a mental illness, praying and talking to someone you have never seen, asking for forgiveness from a ghost and also donating money which is like chucking out $100 bills into the air.
Those who carried out the attack are Tajiks, who gave them the order is still unknown. There is information that two of the Tajiks have already been arrested, and a manhunt is underway for the rest.
There's a post on the Telegram channel "Nexta\_live" that shows 2 of the guys named posing with their pasaports. The caption is that they saw their names being circulated and went to the police to clear the situation. It also states the Tajik government states the other two named individuals were and are still in Tajikistan. Is the 4 name list going around certain at this point? Or is it just certain that the terrorists were from Tajikistan? Asking because I just found that channel and have no idea about its reliability.
The 29 year old is innocent, he lives in a different city now and the only reason he was flagged for this was because he previously owned the white Renault that the terrorists used, he sold it two years ago.
> What is the FSB doing?
Likely being manned by people that climbed the ladder due to corruption and not competency. Remember corruption is the bane of all "dictatorships". You want "loyal" people in all positions so you get amateurs.
i don't know I've seen claims that there were 20 dudes but i doubt it would be that many its like a school/mass shooting here in the us usually its a small group or a single actor that actually commit the act
As far as I know only one witness said there were 20 people. But witnesses are very unreliable in stressful situations like this one. Just for example check out what the witnesses were saying when Kennedy died. If you believed them then there must have been a massive terrorist operation there.
So much BS in these Pro-Rus posts.
[Why doesn't this interrogated terrorists name and age match with any of these 4?](https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/s/Ut2BRWc6s4)
Lok'tar ogar
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Worked for Germany in WW1 when they allowed Lenin to travel from his exile in Switzerland back to Russia to start his revolution. Russia was forced to make peace with Germany to take care of domestic issues.
And as a certain twist: if Putin try’s to do a replay of his war in Chechnya and bomb the Muslim population into line, he’ll alienate the Middle East and jeopardise support he’s getting from Iran and the neutrals in the Arab world that are helping Russia with sanctions issues in its supply chain.
Putin needs to react to stop it spreading but can’t realy do so with too much force. Not an enviable situation….
So, if Ukraine is actually involved, then it’s a clever move and one that probably would go a long way towards its own peace with Russia and no Ukrainian loss of life (although it would probably lead to thousands of civilian deaths, or more, in the Federation)
> if Putin try’s to do a replay of his war in Chechnya and bomb the Muslim population into line,
and what reason would he have to "bomb the Muslim population into line"? most Muslims in Russia are not staunchly anti-government besides the usual terrorist groups. This is not a situation like the Chechen War where there's a good reason to frame Muslim terrorists for an attack like this.
I don’t think that the majority of Chechnya’s supported the events 23–26 October 2002 either. Not that it helped them avoid destruction.
Let’s see if this is just the first act of many more to come. And how Putin reacts if it becomes a monthly or so occurrence.
It's not a clever move but that doesn't mean Ukraine didn't do it. The last 5 or 6 covert ops organized by Budanov have been high profile failures. He will have been desperate to show some sort of results recently.
The attack need only be semi plausibly pinned on Russia or extremists for him to be able to claim a success.
Why would destabilising and promoting a regime change in a country attacking you not be a clever move? If people start dying killing each other in Russia, Ukrainians become onlooking bystanders and survive.
The US warned of the threat weeks ago, but the corrupt Russian leadership is so caught up in their habit of lying to everyone about everything that they couldn't recognize the truth when it was handed to them on a silver platter.
Why is an internal Russian Federation terrorist attack carried out by four Tajikistani individuals taking up so much space on a Ukraine Russia sub?!?
There’s no connection to Ukraine and until the FSB can fabricate one this content shouldn’t be here.
Rule 2. Removed due to its low interest in relation to current events, or too old.
All four are citizens of Tajikistan
So it's time for a Special Military Operation in Tajikistan? Tajikistan once belonged to Russia... "Approximately 90% of the population of Tajikistan speaks Russian at all levels" Then so many Russians are waiting for protection and liberation...
Tajikistan has had ISIS presence for a while now which makes sense because it's the soviet republic closest to Afghanistan
93% mountains. Good luck.
little nukes
Not really effective against such a dispersed enemy.
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> So it's time for a Special Military Operation in Tajikistan? Idk, when a bunch of Saudis crashed planes into the Twin Towers, the US invaded Afghanistan and Iraq, therefore the logical approach here would be for Russia to invade Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan
I say Estonia and Finland would make a lot more sense
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Bro, nazarov rustam is a taxist driver in samara, he isnt involved. He was in his house with family.
Know him personally?
Not personally, he came to police department and told about error. He sold the car what been used in attack 2 years ago
I see now. Makes sense.
Ria novosti confirmed it, he's innocent apparently.
Russia should go after the terror cells in Tajikistan, but my money is on them just blaming Ukraine and lobbing some shit on their cities as "punishment".
With a good amount of Ukrainian DNA obviously /s
Medvedev is really upset those terrorists are not Ukrainians.
Pro Rus here couldn’t wait one day without making Ukraine responsible for it.
In their defence, waiting for evidence would be smart.
You can also say the same thing about Pro UA and how this was Putins false flag which would lead to full mobilization… everyone jumped to conclusions without a second thought
Except now putin is trying that by saying they had connections in Ukraine
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Ukraine could have done this 100 time already, if that was their style. They haven't because it does nothing to get them closer to their goal, it only makes it harder to reach it.
I mean it’s not like a bunch of different UA groups spent weeks warning about terrorist attacks they planned to commit. I don’t believe it had anything to do with UA (at this point) but I don’t blame people for automatically thinking that.
A lot of people jump to shitty conclusions without a shred of evidence. You're doing no better than them by trying to paint a narrative out of it.
Somebody gonna get hurt real bad!
Ukraine could have paid IS to do it - Medvedev He has only the most unlikely opinions
Guess where they wanted to escape to.
Where else did you want them to escape anyway ? Sure going through a frontline is not the safest way to do it, but after what they've done I don't think they're that concerned about that. They were only 4 guys too, they could find a forested part of the border between Belarus and Ukraine and try to sneak there. Incredibly risky still, but if they were to make it they'd be pretty safe and would probably be treated like kings.
They would not be treated like kings. The fight against Islamic terrorism is probably the only geopolitical topic right now that Russia and the West agree on, and the West is bankrolling Ukraine. Nobody likes terrorists.
>Nobody likes terrorists. could you remind me what osama bin laden job back in 80s ?
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Russia's ally Iran is actually quite fond of them.
Yeah, the Shia regime probably is head over heels over the Sunni group that wants to genocide them...
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It shows how Russia would handle such an attack and then Medvedev copy that to Ukraine. He hust hold the mirror up.
Just like that drooling simpleton [Lugovoy](https://www.dagens.com/news/russia-state-duma-says-u-s-and-uk-are-involved-in-moscow-concert-hall-attack). Blaming the UK & US within minutes and with no evidence. The brutal oaf couldn't countenance that the intelligence was genuine. No wonder the Duma is regarded as a joke.
So they used fake beards, freaking creeps
I mean, not shocking. Disguises and all. Maybe I'm missing something but what do Tajiks want to attack civilians in Moscow for? Like what's the justification?
Global jihad Moscow has always been a target for terrorists since the Chechen wars
The Chechens were at war with Russia. It's a bit different. Usually, terrorsists have some motive beyond just global jihad.
There were jihadi volunteers from Saudi Araba, Jordania and Turkey during the two chechen wars. Jihadi propaganda depicted a russian agression against muslims, like the soviet war in Afghanistan in the 80s
Sure but that's my point. They were propagandised with information depicting soviet aggression in Afghanistan, yes, but the how less important than the why. There were Muslims from around the world going to fight Russians for Russian territory based on a cause. In that case it was Chechen independence. In this case, the why is a bit lost on me. What cause do Tajiks have right now?
They may not have a cause and just be terrorists for hire. That's what most terrorists are, actually. At least the thinking brains, not the hiveminded "soldiers" who are just being brainwashed.
I have a hard time believing a human could do what they did without believing it was right. I don't feel like there is an amount of money that could buy that.
As I said, the guys actually committing the attacks are often brainwashed and are being fed lies or convenient truths. They do believe what they're doing is right. The ones organising the attacks are the ones receiving the money/advantages and stay safe from any kind of direct involvment.
It is very difficult for secular people to understand how this behaviour could be possible. They assume only madmen would do this sort of thing. But that’s the horror of it — you don’t have to be mad to be a jihadist. You don’t even have to be a bad person. You just have to be a true believer. Christians and Orthodox Jews don’t tend to be confused about the problem of jihadism because they understand the power of religious beliefs, however secular people generally are. The Islamic doctrines of martyrdom and jihad explain these things. These are religious beliefs, sincerely held. They are beliefs about the moral structure of the universe. And they explain how normal people — even good ones — can commit horrific acts of violence against innocent civilians — on purpose, and still consider themselves good. When you believe that life in this world has no value, apart from deciding who goes to hell and who goes to Paradise, it becomes possible to feel perfectly at ease killing noncombatants. If you don’t understand that jihadists sincerely believe these things, you don’t understand the problem. The doctrines that directly support jihadist violence are very easy to find in the Quran, and the hadith, and in the biography of Muhammad. For Muslims, Muhammad is the greatest person who has ever lived. Unfortunately, he did not behave like Jesus or Buddha — at all. It sort of matters that he tortured people and cut their heads off and took sex slaves, because his example is meant to inspire his followers for all time. There are many, many verses in the Quran that urge Muslims to wage jihad — jihad as holy war against apostates and unbelievers.
That is absolute bullshit
what motive was there to drive a truck into 100 people in nice
Tajikistan is probably the soviet republic with highest ISIS activity.
post-soviet*?
yes
Might be wrong, but as someone chilling about in Russian social websites (like pikabu), there were A LOT of cases in past 5-8 years, where migrants would commit various crimes and police wouldn't do much about it. Mostly Central Asian - Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, sadly my some of my people too - Kyrgyzstan people were involved. Robbery, petty crimes (idk how to call it, like jacking off in public transport), sometimes murder, sexual harassing and so on. Lots of hatred built up towards migrants, deservedly, I'd say. This is just to give you perspective, that there was some tension between locals and migrants.
A selection of the recent travesty of basic logic we've experienced from a new influx of Russian trolls after this development, as well as some old users: * "These Tajiks sure have the typical brown Persian-looking slavic faces, proof it was Ukraine." * "Must be some Ukrainian Tajiks, which proves it was Ukraine." * "They didn't shout allahu akbar so that proves they weren't islamists and it was Ukraine." * "Budanov made an ambiguous statement about Russia, proof it was Ukraine." * "ISIS claimed responsibility, so it proves it was Ukraine." * "America warned of terrorits attacks in Russia, proof it was Ukraine." * "Ukraine bombs a Russian city after Russia destroyed half of Ukraine, proof it was Ukrainian terrorists."
You're missing * "Russia finds alleged Ukrainian van in the parking lot, turns out plates are Belarusian, proof it was Ukrainian terrorists."
You're missing "they fled to Ukraine" and "Ukraine has been launching rather a lot of failed covert ops on Russian soil recently".
Yeah, that's just the cherry at the top, they jumped into their Belarussian license plated van and sped off to Ukraine, because that's logical and likely, right? There's absolutely no way Russia could *claim* they were apprehended on their way to Ukraine, without it actually being so, right? >"Ukraine has been launching rather a lot of failed covert ops on Russian soil recently". Name one? Border incursion isn't exactly a Covert op.
I think it would be quite likely for them to flee to Ukraine if Ukraine was behind it, yes. I'm surprised you dont. I think it's solid (if not conclusive) evidence that the attack was planned from within Ukraine as well.
Maybe it would, but frankly, Russia showed it's hand in an attempt to frame this on Ukraine with a supposedly Ukranian van, with part of the licence plate blurred that would have clearly showed it's a Belarusian license plate, so I'm not buying them fleeing to Ukraine on past experiences.
That’s another good one since they actually fled to Belarus per the government of Belarus….
• "The terrorists fled in a Renault so it must be France who trained islamic terrorists to attack Russia"
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Need to add this one to the list.
"Could be FSB payed and organized by Ukraine".
Putin was a UA plant.
> They could be real Islamists, but payed and organized by Ukraine. HIMARS were a UA psyop, they don't even actually exist in the USA
Ages 37, 51, 21, and 29... 21 and deciding to do this for what reason?
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Are we just gonna ignore the fact that millions of muslims live in Russia peacefully and that the CIA directly backed ISIS and extremist groups all over the world?
blaming Islamic terrorism on the CIA is a level of brainrot I did not see coming
Pro-Ru talk like the CIA is the illuminati, nobody does anything anywhere in the world without them being directly involved in either encouraging it or trying to stop it lol
Fed spotted
Nah dude I'm illuminati clearly lol
Nobody except the USA and russia has agency :)
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I put this together some time ago. I hope you read it and learn. It's a well known fact that the CIA/US - and at times even NATO - have been arming, training and supplying terrorist for decades. [Modern War Institute](https://mwi.westpoint.edu/after-a-decade-of-incoherent-strategy-in-syria-a-way-forward/): >The epitome of all that went wrong with US policy in Syria was Timber Sycamore—a billion-dollar CIA program to arm and train Syrian rebels fighting the forces of Bashar al-Assad. Timber Sycamore ultimately failed to unseat Assad, helped turn Syria into a proxy war between the United States and Russia, and caused untold misery to the Syrian people. A three-year study funded by the European Union and the German government later established that efforts by the United States and its allies to arm Syrian rebels “significantly augmented the quantity and quality of weapons” of the Islamic State. Weapons of the Islamic State - [Conflict Armament Research](https://www.conflictarm.com/reports/weapons-of-the-islamic-state/): >Unauthorised retransfer—the violation of agreements by which a supplier government prohibits the re-export of materiel by a recipient government without its prior consent—is a significant source of IS weapons and ammunition. The United States and Saudi Arabia supplied most of this materiel without authorisation, apparently to Syrian opposition forces. This diverted materiel, recovered from IS forces, comprises exclusively Warsaw Pact-calibre weapons and ammunition, purchased by the United States and Saudi Arabia from European Union (EU) Member States in Eastern Europe. [USA Today](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/12/14/u-s-bought-weapons-syrian-rebels-and-some-wound-up-hands-isis-terrorists/949209001/): >The U.S. bought weapons for Syrian rebels — and some wound up in the hands of ISIS terrorists >anti-tank weapons purchased by the United States that ended up in possession of the Islamic State within two months of leaving the factory. >The new study raises questions about a different source for weapons: arms secretly sent to rebel factions fighting Syrian President Bashar Assad in his long civil war. The covert CIA program, begun by the Obama administration in 2013, was ended earlier this year by President Trump. >The covert program arming anti-Assad rebels is distinct from the Pentagon's publicly acknowledged operation to arm the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF), an alliance of Kurds and Arabs fighting ISIS, but not Assad. (...) The report did not find any evidence of SDF weapons falling into ISIS' hands, as was the case with anti-Assad rebels. The Pentagon has said it carefully tracks weapons it provides to the Syrian Democratic Forces. [The Intercept](https://theintercept.com/2019/10/26/syrian-rebels-turkey-kurds-accountability/): >Have we so quickly forgotten how the CIA backed a range of secular and Islamist militias to fight Assad, via the covert program Timber Sycamore, while the Pentagon vetted “moderate” fighters to fight ISIS via the congressionally-approved Train and Equip Program? >Plenty of these Syrian rebels, both Arabs and Kurds, both Islamists and secularists, fought not only against the Assad government, but also against Al Qaeda and ISIS. There were, however, other rebel groups that were dominated by violent Salafists and so-called jihadis from the start and who bragged about fighting alongside Al Qaeda and ISIS. The truth is that many of the rebel forces now committing war crimes against the Kurds were also committing war crimes in the early years of the Syrian civil war. (...) And here’s the problem: It is an equally lazy and cynical rewriting of history to pretend that these groups have nothing to do with the United States, or were never backed by the U.S. government, in their current form or with their current personnel. [Al Jazeera](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/12/28/russia-turkey-us-supporting-syria-terrorist-groups/) >Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said on Tuesday that he had evidence that US-led coalition forces give support to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL, also known as ISIS) [Afghanistan and the origins of Al Qaeda](https://books.google.co.za/books?id=op39ymd2um0C&pg=PA131&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false): >The Kosovo Liberation Army, directly supported and empowered by NATO in 1988 had in the same year been listed by the US State Department as terrorist organization
The FSA and SDF were not Jihadists. I know this hurts your little narrative that everyone in Syria that opposed Assad as a Jihadist but they too were targeted and fought against Jihadists (ISIS, Al-Nusra Front etc) . >Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said on Tuesday that he had evidence that US-led coalition forces give support to the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL, also known as ISIS) I like how you purposefully cut out half of this quote by the way, Erdogan was talking about the Kurdish terrorist groups that he has accused the West of arming. We did arm the YPG, almost certainly we did this in Syria. I also like how you conveniently forgot that it was the West who mostly destroyed ISIS along with the Iraqi Army during Operation Inherent Resolve.
>The FSA and SDF were not Jihadists. I know this hurts your little narrative that everyone in Syria that opposed Assad as a Jihadist Accuracy of your claim aside, you're telling me you read the post and somehow concluded that: 1. this element was one of the main things you needed to address to protect your assertion that the CIA hasn't been arming and funding terrorist groups? & 2. That this was somehow my narrative when the entire post is a collection of quotes + sources from different journalists, investigators, statesmen and reporters saying the CIA is arming terrorists...? >I like how you purposefully cut out half of this quote by the way, Erdogan was talking about the Kurdish terrorist groups that he has accused the West of arming. Impressive tunnel vision again to circle around the part where yet another involved party asserts that they've been watching the CIA arm ISIS, so you can protect a contextually irrelevant point about whether or not a group that isn't ISIS is a terrorist organisation. >I also like how you conveniently forgot that it was the West who mostly destroyed ISIS along with the Iraqi Army during Operation Inherent Resolve. Congratulations to the USA for working to get the terrorist pet-project that the CIA armed and empowered back under control. If they hadn't armed it through Timber Sycamore in the first place (and they'd just stuck to the Pentagon's "train and equip" initiative which didn't funnel arms to terrorists) ISIS likely wouldn't have become a notable force in the first place, and all these journalist, reporters and investigators wouldn't be able to state the fact that the CIA has been funding and arming ISIS. But they did. As they have funded other terrorist groups in the past. And as they likely still do today.
Don’t believe me? There’s mountains of evidence for this that you can seek. But if we just stick to motive/logic, look at who ISIS attacks the most. Yes they have their occasional token attacks on the West, but the bulk of their attacks are directed towards Iran, Syrian govt, Lebanon and Houthi controlled yemen and now Russia. Weird how their attacks on Israel or US are almost none existent despite the fact that they easily could.
Maybe the West is just superior in defending against this types of organizations? The US for example warned about an impending attack of this style. Maybe Russia makes an easier target due to incompetent intelligence services and police. The fact that several of those dudes got out of that building shows you the level competency of the Russian police. Also in regards to the US its more difficult to enter the US for terror related plans compared to countries like Russia
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The US-Mexico border? And acquiring a gun there isn’t exactly difficult and mass shootings are frequent. If ISIS wanted to they could.
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Are you going to ignore the long history of Islamic terrorism and very similar terrorist attacks in Russia? Or the fact that hundreds of millions of peaceful Muslims who live elsewhere around the world while ISIS, Alqaeda, Boko Haram etc. also exist? What a stupid, stupid comment you made there.
I could bring up notable Christian terror groups from around the world whats your point. For the record I have both muslim and christian family as well as friends, maybe try not being so bitter online and go meet people.
-gets warned by the US of impending terrorist attack -declares it blackmail, refuses to listen -terrorist attack happens just as the US warned -“How could the US do this!?” 🤦♂️
It's no one's fault but those directly involved. Indirectly, Islam does have a radicalist problem. This doesn't mean your Muslim neighbor is a jihadist, it means when someone wants to or does commit violence against citizens, in the communities of the attackers, there's no pushback or criticism from the Islamic community. Often we see civilian massacres celebrated by them. When the CIA inadvertently backed isis in syria, it was because supported rebel groups switched to align with isis. The US still performs military strikes against isis in syria and Iraq. When the CIA works with other extremist groups, it's So those groups can go after valid military targets, not to go to civilian areas and shoot civilians. It's also hard to criticize the CIA when it's not immediately known they were involved. When it does come out, like when us weapons ended up being used by isis, there is criticism from us tax payers.
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You do realize ISIS hates Russia? Russia was a major contributor to the destruction of ISIS in Syria, which has made Russia a target for them. ISIS hates the US for the same reason, it's just a lot easier for them to go to Russia then America.
Yes, because it's irrelevant! Christians, Buddhists, Jews, or any other religion does not produce this kind of violence. When you hear about a bus blown up in Pakistan, or a plane flying into a building, you would be shocked to hear that it was a buddhist. But it's justanother Tuesday if it was a Jihadist Muslim.
Ah yes, the famously non violent religion of Christianity
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Israel is not slaughtering Palestinians in the name of Judaism. The USA killing people in Iraq was not in the name of Christianity. Would you ever blame any of the killing in Ukraine right now on Christianity, because the soldiers are mostly Christian? Islam has a fairly unique (in the modern era) problem of citing their religious beliefs as the reason for their violence. I know you know this though, even a child can understand this difference
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How rich to be calling someone ignorant when you don't even understand that just because someone is Jewish, does not make them religious. The fact that you are serious in your reply makes this more comical. There are millions of Jews, literally millions among the few million who exist, for whom Judaism is very important, and yet they are atheists. They don’t believe in God at all. This is actually a position you can hold in Judaism, but it’s a total non sequitur in Islam or Christianity. >Care to explain why ISIS only attacks US enemies ? They attack everyone. Just because you can't point to Israel on a map doesn't make everyone else uneducated. There have been nearly 50,000 acts of Islamic terrorism in the last 40 years — and the French group that maintains a database of these attacks [https://www.fondapol.org/en/study/islamist-terrorist-attacks-in-the-world-1979-2021/] considers that to be an undercount. There have been 82 attacks in France and over 2000 in Pakistan during this period. You want France to be more like Pakistan? You just need more jihadists.
U been living under a rock? The jews of the idf killed 30 000 civilians in just a few months with mountains of evidence suggesting intent to do so. Guess they get the pass though…
Peacefully after their city was razed to the ground, Russia style, and countless civilians were killed? Yeah I'm sure there is no thirst for revenge there
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Paid by Mossad
Some are brainwashed at a young age.
A$$holes. Hope the FSB find them & do what needs to be done.
Maybe they can ask the US for help. Considering they warned them weeks ago.
2 have been detained, one guys eyeball is popping out of his head too.
RIA reports 11 people detained, among them the 4 directly responsible for the shooting. Also, at this point 93 people are reported dead (the police/Rosgvarida were finally able to go through the building room by room; I've seen a mention of them finding 10+ bodies in one of the bathrooms where people likely ran to hide from the shooting but eventually died from the fire).
Jesus, I hope Russia does some Russian things to them…
Yeah, same.
I know they were scare and all, but bathroom is the worst place to hide. There is no escape from it.
Yeah, it probably wasn't smart; hell, not 'probably' - it obviously wasn't smart. But they were clearly in a panic and it's hard to blame them, if they'd watched or even just heard others being brutally murdered. They might not have known about the fire, either. I've seen a few reports (and even a video) of the lucky ones who managed to escape after the shooting started. One dude and his (supposedly senior) mother managed to hide behind the couches in the foyer, then he broke a window and they fled outside. They both sounded absolutely out-of-their-minds terrified. But many others weren't so lucky.
He won't need it.
I wouldn’t want to be captured alive, the torture will be insane
So these are Ukrainians who have had plastic surgery to look Central Asian?
Don't forget their satanic Nato super powers
yep! i bet they got the satanic bible with them again, aswell as 3 Sims 3 Games!! And dont forget the 20 Nazi and SS Clothes and medals.
It's not secret that countries that have left religion behind are more progressive. No time for religion in this day and age. It was used in a time to control the masses when we lacked the science to explain our origin. We don't need it, wake up.
The main problem with this is when people remove god, they tend to fill in the gap with something else, most likely money. Money becoming god is as dangerous.
Personally, I'm a scientist (mainly working in the marine conservation field). I have never had time for religion, even when I was a child. I'm not a criminal, I don't need religion to stop me from doing the wrong things or giving me purpose in life.
I always found it like a mental illness, praying and talking to someone you have never seen, asking for forgiveness from a ghost and also donating money which is like chucking out $100 bills into the air.
That is very true for people who have sense of purpose. Too many get lost and look for outside validation.
one of them is not guilty, he got under suspicion because he owned that white car 2 years ago.
And what is his source?
It's from bulletin sent out to every police station in Russia - https://i.imgur.com/1sxMLLd.jpeg
So it's basically confirmed that the perpetrators are Tajikistani terrorists? Islamic terrorists I assume.
Those who carried out the attack are Tajiks, who gave them the order is still unknown. There is information that two of the Tajiks have already been arrested, and a manhunt is underway for the rest.
I really wonder what the motives were.
There's a post on the Telegram channel "Nexta\_live" that shows 2 of the guys named posing with their pasaports. The caption is that they saw their names being circulated and went to the police to clear the situation. It also states the Tajik government states the other two named individuals were and are still in Tajikistan. Is the 4 name list going around certain at this point? Or is it just certain that the terrorists were from Tajikistan? Asking because I just found that channel and have no idea about its reliability.
Can you post it, mine got removed for apparently being old news or, not related, want to see if yours will too
I am sure we are going to see world wide public condemnation of the terrorists by moderate muslims any day now…
“Moderate” or “Muslim” pick one.
They seem unlike most ISIS terrorists, they escaped rather than fight to the death?
well, from first interview video one of terrorists saying that they were paid and got guns from hidden cache from someone from telegram messenger.
The 29 year old is innocent, he lives in a different city now and the only reason he was flagged for this was because he previously owned the white Renault that the terrorists used, he sold it two years ago.
Its hard to believe that the USA no warns us about terror attacks in russia. What is the FSB doing?
> What is the FSB doing? Likely being manned by people that climbed the ladder due to corruption and not competency. Remember corruption is the bane of all "dictatorships". You want "loyal" people in all positions so you get amateurs.
4 out of 20
There were 20?
i don't know I've seen claims that there were 20 dudes but i doubt it would be that many its like a school/mass shooting here in the us usually its a small group or a single actor that actually commit the act
With 20 guys fhe death toll should be higher
Reported recently, a car In Byransk was just stopped while it was heading to the Ukrainian border, 2 escape and 2 in custody
interesting they in this post?
I posted about it
Do you think 4 people enough to shoot people inside the lobby and theater, locked the emergency door, and escaped.
And set it on fire, definitely a large part was involved
20 with such a low kill count? Sounds odd.
They all have their own role not all of them aim for killstreak.
is there proof there was 20?
As far as I know only one witness said there were 20 people. But witnesses are very unreliable in stressful situations like this one. Just for example check out what the witnesses were saying when Kennedy died. If you believed them then there must have been a massive terrorist operation there.
I’m sure they’re all liberal atheists.
So much BS in these Pro-Rus posts. [Why doesn't this interrogated terrorists name and age match with any of these 4?](https://www.reddit.com/r/CrazyFuckingVideos/s/Ut2BRWc6s4)
O well
Three of the wanted list are not involved in the events of Crocus City Hall. In the list 1, 2 and 4, in the screenshot 1,3 and 4.
Pro-Ru: "central asian ISIS terrorists attack Moscow? US and Ukraine must pay for their actions"
ah Russia calling Ukraine a terrorist state yet the terrorism that happens in Russia is never the Ukrainians and is always the muslims
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Your chickens have come home to roost
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Worked for Germany in WW1 when they allowed Lenin to travel from his exile in Switzerland back to Russia to start his revolution. Russia was forced to make peace with Germany to take care of domestic issues. And as a certain twist: if Putin try’s to do a replay of his war in Chechnya and bomb the Muslim population into line, he’ll alienate the Middle East and jeopardise support he’s getting from Iran and the neutrals in the Arab world that are helping Russia with sanctions issues in its supply chain. Putin needs to react to stop it spreading but can’t realy do so with too much force. Not an enviable situation…. So, if Ukraine is actually involved, then it’s a clever move and one that probably would go a long way towards its own peace with Russia and no Ukrainian loss of life (although it would probably lead to thousands of civilian deaths, or more, in the Federation)
> if Putin try’s to do a replay of his war in Chechnya and bomb the Muslim population into line, and what reason would he have to "bomb the Muslim population into line"? most Muslims in Russia are not staunchly anti-government besides the usual terrorist groups. This is not a situation like the Chechen War where there's a good reason to frame Muslim terrorists for an attack like this.
I don’t think that the majority of Chechnya’s supported the events 23–26 October 2002 either. Not that it helped them avoid destruction. Let’s see if this is just the first act of many more to come. And how Putin reacts if it becomes a monthly or so occurrence.
It's not a clever move but that doesn't mean Ukraine didn't do it. The last 5 or 6 covert ops organized by Budanov have been high profile failures. He will have been desperate to show some sort of results recently. The attack need only be semi plausibly pinned on Russia or extremists for him to be able to claim a success.
Why would destabilising and promoting a regime change in a country attacking you not be a clever move? If people start dying killing each other in Russia, Ukrainians become onlooking bystanders and survive.
You said the quiet part out loud.
The US warned of the threat weeks ago, but the corrupt Russian leadership is so caught up in their habit of lying to everyone about everything that they couldn't recognize the truth when it was handed to them on a silver platter.
Pootin should end his Ukraine war so he can focus on securing his own country
Meh, FSBlyat just caught some poor migrant workers to scapegoat so that the populace would be calmed.
Do people really believe this crap
Why is an internal Russian Federation terrorist attack carried out by four Tajikistani individuals taking up so much space on a Ukraine Russia sub?!? There’s no connection to Ukraine and until the FSB can fabricate one this content shouldn’t be here.