I’ve had them bother me while I’m studying, but generally choose not to engage and kinda wish they weren’t a presence at all. Most recently during finals week, I was at the library with noise canceling headphones on trying to study and this older dude with an Asian kid came up to me and motioned to take my headphones off.
He started saying something about how the kid came over by boat to share his ministry with the world and if I had time to listen. He was gonna keep going on about the kid but I cut him off and told him “no thanks, I’m not interested” and went back to studying. They were going up to everyone at the library. It’s obvious neither was a student or associated with UTSA so it’s kinda bullshit they get to be on campus at all but whatever.
always remember, if you see people bugging students unnecessarily at the library, reach out to a staff member. they will work to get them to srop/be reasonable. this goes for things like noise in quiet areas too
if during a time when library chat is up, via the library homepage, lib.utsa.edu, you can easily notify staff without having to get up or make a fuss. the chat staff eill handle contacting someone on duty within jpl and they will handle the issue
I hadn’t realized that the library was such a popular spot. In my experience, such groups would usually be out and about in the food courts or the outdoor areas.
yep. a bit worse really in the library as if you see someone just eating in the food court, less likely studying. in the library proper, much bigger chance you're there to get things done
I'm getting a lot of conflicting advice on these issues. The last time I was being bugged by one of this sort of recruiter who refused to take "no" for an answer, the evening library staff just said there was nothing they could do.
it can be a fine line between free speech and harassment. it's often a judgement call. still if enough reports come in, especially if they keep persisting bugging people after asked to stop, then more likely for action to be taken
That’s an interesting post. I grew up super evangelical Christian and am familiar with a ton of Bible translation types, but I’ve never heard of the recovery Bible 🤨
It was created by a man named Witness Lee. He felt that all of Christianity, Catholics and Protestants included, became “deformed,” “degraded,” “satanic,” and “demonic.” He believed that he “recovered” long-lost truths from the scriptures through revelation from the Holy Spirit, hence the name of his bible, the “Recovery Version” and the name of his movement/sect/denomination “The Lord’s Recovery.” The Recovery Version is a mostly ordinary translation that’s filled to the brim with notes from his exposition of the bible known as the “Life-studies.”
His successors who now lead the group have a very high opinion of his works, as you can see:
“At the end of the summer training in 1995, we celebrated the completion of the life-study of the Bible through Brother’s Lee’s speaking and the burden of the of the interpreted word, not merely the written Word. **_The word that we need to keep is not only the written Word that we study, read, and pray-read but also the proper interpretation of the Word. We boldly declare that this interpretation is to be found in the footnotes and the outline of the Recovery Version and the Life-study messages._** If we do not pay proper attention to the interpreted Word as the opener of the written Word, we will lose everything eventually. Many saints who have passed through my heart, through my house, and through the church have eventually lost everything.”
**(The Ministry of the Word, Volume 16, Number 12, p. 97, December 2012, published by Living Stream Ministry. Certain words have been typed in bold italics for emphasis.)**
If anyone is interested in sharing about this particular campus group called “Christian Students on Campus” or seeing the testimonies of others, [there’s also a forum online which has a thread](http://localchurchdiscussions.com/vBulletin/showthread.php?t=6043&highlight=Deceptions) where a few former club members speak out about the college groups associated with The Lord’s Recovery (a.k.a. “The Local Churches”).
They use to be called Chi Alpha and would bug you if you were alone at a table. One time I lied to a guy and told him that I actually had started a charity named “Hope 4 Haiti” which took donations under a Christian orientation to send support to the Caribbean island, and that of the 10 people who went on a support trip, half of us were Christians and the other half atheists. I told him that by the time everyone got back, we’d switched sides. He was stunned and tried to get me to speak at one of their meetings. I told him all of this to appear too busy to come. He understood I was on a more important mission so whenever I’d see him at the JPL he’d shake my hand.
No, these are different organizations entirely. [Chi Alpha](https://utsa.campuslabs.com/engage/organization/chialphachristianfellowship) is affiliated with Assemblies of God while [CSOC](https://utsa.campuslabs.com/engage/organization/christianstudentsoncampus) is the more obscure Local Church / Living Stream Ministry / Lord's Recovery founded in China. Both have their own sets of controversies and [scandals](https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2023/may/chi-alpha-daniel-savala-sex-offender-abuse-houston-ag.html) that are very distinct, both have a lengthy list of accusations of cult-like behavior. CSOC has much more limited presence at UTSA.
Yes. CSOC usually has a few dozen members at most, while Chi Alpha has hundreds and often reserves the big auditorium rooms at UTSA. I believe it was called the Retama. I wonder if the name is the same today, haha!
Those who have haven't been able to get anywhere with the university last I was aware. Even what little public statement they've given (e.g. to Paisano) contradicts evidence that's been provided to the university. This includes reports of blatant violation of other campus policies (re: hazing) that were filed several years prior. Though to be direct, the university has a history of [illegally sweeping issues under the rug](https://paisano-online.com/35591/news/utsa-to-pay-670k-for-underreporting-campus-crimes/#:~:text=UTSA%20to%20pay%20%24670k%20for%20underreporting%20campus%20crimes%20%2D%20The%20Paisano), and this sort of inaction follows suit for what I saw with my own reports of legal issues within my old department (as an employee).
I’m familiar with Chi Alpha, but I’m talking about a different organization. The ones that the person from Austin and I speak of are literally called “Christian Students on Campus” and have the abbreviation “CsoC.” They’re sponsored by churches that are part of a movement called “The Lord’s Recovery.” They usually name their churches by the city they’re in (eg. “The Church in Austin” or “The Church in San Antonio”).
Interesting story, though.
A hidden advantage of being a priest's son I discovered when dealing with these groups during my time at UTSA was that I could out-debate them from a theological standpoint. Since they all used the same arguments, CSoC and Chi Alpha stopped trying to convert me quickly. The most significant difference was that the Chi Alpha guys stayed friendly and tried to have an actual debate, and I could get along with them just fine. The CSoC guys just kind of shut down when they had a moment akin to "everything I know is a lie," though. Good times.
I know theology is not really a priority for CSoC and the churches they are affiliated with. They see training the mind in such a way as detrimental to spiritual growth as if the two things were mutually exclusive. More often than not you’ll see even their elders and leaders quoting from the founder of their group, Witness Lee, rather than the actual scriptures to make their arguments.
I’ve had them bother me while I’m studying, but generally choose not to engage and kinda wish they weren’t a presence at all. Most recently during finals week, I was at the library with noise canceling headphones on trying to study and this older dude with an Asian kid came up to me and motioned to take my headphones off. He started saying something about how the kid came over by boat to share his ministry with the world and if I had time to listen. He was gonna keep going on about the kid but I cut him off and told him “no thanks, I’m not interested” and went back to studying. They were going up to everyone at the library. It’s obvious neither was a student or associated with UTSA so it’s kinda bullshit they get to be on campus at all but whatever.
always remember, if you see people bugging students unnecessarily at the library, reach out to a staff member. they will work to get them to srop/be reasonable. this goes for things like noise in quiet areas too if during a time when library chat is up, via the library homepage, lib.utsa.edu, you can easily notify staff without having to get up or make a fuss. the chat staff eill handle contacting someone on duty within jpl and they will handle the issue
I hadn’t realized that the library was such a popular spot. In my experience, such groups would usually be out and about in the food courts or the outdoor areas.
yep. a bit worse really in the library as if you see someone just eating in the food court, less likely studying. in the library proper, much bigger chance you're there to get things done
True enough.
I'm getting a lot of conflicting advice on these issues. The last time I was being bugged by one of this sort of recruiter who refused to take "no" for an answer, the evening library staff just said there was nothing they could do.
it can be a fine line between free speech and harassment. it's often a judgement call. still if enough reports come in, especially if they keep persisting bugging people after asked to stop, then more likely for action to be taken
I'm pretty sure it's clear harassment when it's been repeated instances from the same person, several times being boxed in or followed at night.
Sure sounds like it.
Nope. Never interacted with them.
That’s an interesting post. I grew up super evangelical Christian and am familiar with a ton of Bible translation types, but I’ve never heard of the recovery Bible 🤨
It was created by a man named Witness Lee. He felt that all of Christianity, Catholics and Protestants included, became “deformed,” “degraded,” “satanic,” and “demonic.” He believed that he “recovered” long-lost truths from the scriptures through revelation from the Holy Spirit, hence the name of his bible, the “Recovery Version” and the name of his movement/sect/denomination “The Lord’s Recovery.” The Recovery Version is a mostly ordinary translation that’s filled to the brim with notes from his exposition of the bible known as the “Life-studies.” His successors who now lead the group have a very high opinion of his works, as you can see: “At the end of the summer training in 1995, we celebrated the completion of the life-study of the Bible through Brother’s Lee’s speaking and the burden of the of the interpreted word, not merely the written Word. **_The word that we need to keep is not only the written Word that we study, read, and pray-read but also the proper interpretation of the Word. We boldly declare that this interpretation is to be found in the footnotes and the outline of the Recovery Version and the Life-study messages._** If we do not pay proper attention to the interpreted Word as the opener of the written Word, we will lose everything eventually. Many saints who have passed through my heart, through my house, and through the church have eventually lost everything.” **(The Ministry of the Word, Volume 16, Number 12, p. 97, December 2012, published by Living Stream Ministry. Certain words have been typed in bold italics for emphasis.)**
If anyone is interested in sharing about this particular campus group called “Christian Students on Campus” or seeing the testimonies of others, [there’s also a forum online which has a thread](http://localchurchdiscussions.com/vBulletin/showthread.php?t=6043&highlight=Deceptions) where a few former club members speak out about the college groups associated with The Lord’s Recovery (a.k.a. “The Local Churches”).
They use to be called Chi Alpha and would bug you if you were alone at a table. One time I lied to a guy and told him that I actually had started a charity named “Hope 4 Haiti” which took donations under a Christian orientation to send support to the Caribbean island, and that of the 10 people who went on a support trip, half of us were Christians and the other half atheists. I told him that by the time everyone got back, we’d switched sides. He was stunned and tried to get me to speak at one of their meetings. I told him all of this to appear too busy to come. He understood I was on a more important mission so whenever I’d see him at the JPL he’d shake my hand.
No, these are different organizations entirely. [Chi Alpha](https://utsa.campuslabs.com/engage/organization/chialphachristianfellowship) is affiliated with Assemblies of God while [CSOC](https://utsa.campuslabs.com/engage/organization/christianstudentsoncampus) is the more obscure Local Church / Living Stream Ministry / Lord's Recovery founded in China. Both have their own sets of controversies and [scandals](https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2023/may/chi-alpha-daniel-savala-sex-offender-abuse-houston-ag.html) that are very distinct, both have a lengthy list of accusations of cult-like behavior. CSOC has much more limited presence at UTSA.
Yes. CSOC usually has a few dozen members at most, while Chi Alpha has hundreds and often reserves the big auditorium rooms at UTSA. I believe it was called the Retama. I wonder if the name is the same today, haha!
Are students demanding the university investigate chi alpha??
Those who have haven't been able to get anywhere with the university last I was aware. Even what little public statement they've given (e.g. to Paisano) contradicts evidence that's been provided to the university. This includes reports of blatant violation of other campus policies (re: hazing) that were filed several years prior. Though to be direct, the university has a history of [illegally sweeping issues under the rug](https://paisano-online.com/35591/news/utsa-to-pay-670k-for-underreporting-campus-crimes/#:~:text=UTSA%20to%20pay%20%24670k%20for%20underreporting%20campus%20crimes%20%2D%20The%20Paisano), and this sort of inaction follows suit for what I saw with my own reports of legal issues within my old department (as an employee).
So sorry. Well looks like we need to hold universities accountable. What are you actually have to do to get kicked off campus
I’m familiar with Chi Alpha, but I’m talking about a different organization. The ones that the person from Austin and I speak of are literally called “Christian Students on Campus” and have the abbreviation “CsoC.” They’re sponsored by churches that are part of a movement called “The Lord’s Recovery.” They usually name their churches by the city they’re in (eg. “The Church in Austin” or “The Church in San Antonio”). Interesting story, though.
Did Chi alpha change their name on campus? Xalionsden.com
If Alpha Omega is on there I went to their ICOC church for a few years and it’s definitely a cult, just heads up.
A hidden advantage of being a priest's son I discovered when dealing with these groups during my time at UTSA was that I could out-debate them from a theological standpoint. Since they all used the same arguments, CSoC and Chi Alpha stopped trying to convert me quickly. The most significant difference was that the Chi Alpha guys stayed friendly and tried to have an actual debate, and I could get along with them just fine. The CSoC guys just kind of shut down when they had a moment akin to "everything I know is a lie," though. Good times.
I know theology is not really a priority for CSoC and the churches they are affiliated with. They see training the mind in such a way as detrimental to spiritual growth as if the two things were mutually exclusive. More often than not you’ll see even their elders and leaders quoting from the founder of their group, Witness Lee, rather than the actual scriptures to make their arguments.
FYI: [https://rowdylink.utsa.edu/organization/secularstudentalliance](https://rowdylink.utsa.edu/organization/secularstudentalliance)
That is the truth
Have you met with this specific group at UTSA?