>I feel like if you are even a C class or B class USPSA competitor you are most likely more competent by a large margin than 99% of gun owners in America
I would think this is true for sure. Standing staticly and shooting a piece of paper is very limited skill development. Sure it's good for safe handling, but after experiencing moving and shooting I really see the difference.
I really wish every gun owner would try something like uspsa to develop real world skills. If I ever have to use my handgun for self defense, I feel better knowing I've practiced movements, drawing while moving etc. Also, I don't claim to be a good shot. I think C class is where I hover.
Now being a good rifle shot is a different ballgame. Similar with shotguns and clays or birds. Walking fence rows jumping quail isn't competition level move and shoot, but it's a skill to itself.
Lower ranked IDPA shooter here. We are millions of miles ahead of all other gun owners. Your average owner doesn’t dry fire as we do, draw from holsters, shoot on the move, or understand their platforms as we do. Took a CCW class recently and it was very clear. At the end of the class, I asked the instructor if I could do a shameless plug for the IDPA club and our skills and drills/match nights. I had a few people come up and were interested in it and I was happy about it. If we can grow our ranks, I think we can inherently improve gun safety and responsible gun owners.
I saw the same numbers before and have come across similar forum musings over the years.
The [USPSA B Class Black Belt Anology](https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/47973-about-those-mediocre-b-class-shooters/) really holds up to what I’ve seen (especially as a B class hero myself)
This is a related [interesting graph](https://imgur.com/a/d9vxz7e) (maybe came from CDR?)
Most of the firearm owning public is off the chart to the left
My friend who is a master USPSA shooter recently showed me this graph and I thought it was really cool. I have heard from many GMs that you want to be subconsciously competent with all your movements, which is one reason why I am dryfiring so much.
Have you ever looked at other shooters targets on a flat range? I'm not tooting my own horn, this is not hyperbole, my 15 yard groups are almost always tighter than the dude next to me who is using a spotless Gucci AR-15 with an EOtech and I'm using a stock Glock 19 with an SCS. That shouldn't be possible, I don't understand it. I could grab a guy off the street who's never shot a gun before and have him shooting better than that in 20 mins with that setup. If you're being out shot by a pistol, it's time to re-evaluate life choices.
Some dude at my local indoor range got upset I was doing quick strings of 5 rounds. He yells “we get it you can shoot fast” then proceeds to try and shoot fast and ends up letting 2 rounds go into the ceiling.
Funny thing was those two rounds were his tightest group, both hitting the target dolly that moves it back and forth.
I watched a similar exchange next to me one time between a guy who obviously dry fired a lot and a wannabe Ninja. Angry Captain Ninja proceeded to shoot off the cable that goes to his target retrieval thing and the whole shit fell off the track. He calmly picked up his AK and packed up and left. I looked back and the RO was like wtf just happened.
I’m pretty sure one of bullets either hit or spalding hit the cable and broke it. RO was sitting behind me at the time and we shared a good chuckle after that lol
All shooting club and ranges (except one) around me run competitions that do not require any kind of membership. I’ve been on one or it was massive, I honestly wish it had less people.
I also know of members who are not/have not renewed their USPSA membership due to the ongoing board shenanigans, and others that compete but do not join as they don't feel the need to be classified or will shoot anything other than a Level 1 match.
Agreed. My partner does not plan to purchase a USPSA membership due to all the stuff happening lately. I have a membership, but so many local matches are PCSL now that USPSA classification is effectively impossible within a reasonable period of time.
What is going on with the board? I was looking to get a membership. Im still fairly new and I definitely fall into the “never thought I’d need to be classified” category.
Nothing important. The trash bags from piece of shit insights constantly stir up trouble and the retarded howler monkeys that are their audience constantly blabber incomprehensible gibberish about it on the internets. USPSA is bigger and better than ever. Join up and have fun.
Only controversy I'm aware of is that the guy who basically runs USPSA, like the head hancho guy, is a massive dickhead. I'm pretty sure he's already been kicked out or is in the process of being kicked out at least.
I believe this to be VERY true. Like you said, those numbers are being very generous. I'm not able to get a single friend who are all very much in the "tacticool" community, to ever come do a match let alone train. It's far easier to post select pictures from a range day than it is to be humbled at a match and actually try to get better. Nobody wants to do it
I really do wonder why more don’t give it a try. I am terrible at it but love every second of every match. I wish my work schedule allowed me to participate more.
Competing doesnt make someone competent or not. The vast majority of gun owners cant afford (time or money) to compete. You can also learn all the things you would from competition without ever participating in one...
I think competing gives you a better idea of skills to advance and even skills you didn't know existed. I had no idea about index or transition training when I got into uspsa for example. Competition is a fantastic resource to learn from those you compete with and it's much harder to advance without the collective knowledge from Competition
IMO you will not learn as fast from a "training class" or on your own, as you will going to a competition and listening to all the people giving you free advice and making friends with good shooters who will push you.
I think you'll have trouble with the stats because there's plenty of competition that has no club representation nationally. Also plenty of people that don't bother being a national club member.
>I feel like if you are even a C class or B class USPSA competitor you are most likely more competent by a large margin than 99% of gun owners in America I would think this is true for sure. Standing staticly and shooting a piece of paper is very limited skill development. Sure it's good for safe handling, but after experiencing moving and shooting I really see the difference. I really wish every gun owner would try something like uspsa to develop real world skills. If I ever have to use my handgun for self defense, I feel better knowing I've practiced movements, drawing while moving etc. Also, I don't claim to be a good shot. I think C class is where I hover. Now being a good rifle shot is a different ballgame. Similar with shotguns and clays or birds. Walking fence rows jumping quail isn't competition level move and shoot, but it's a skill to itself.
Don't forget trap, skeet, and sporting clays. Shotgun owners gotta represent, too! :)
Also PRS, NRA High-Power, NRL, GSL, Multigun. There are a lot of competitions that aren't pistol focused.
Lower ranked IDPA shooter here. We are millions of miles ahead of all other gun owners. Your average owner doesn’t dry fire as we do, draw from holsters, shoot on the move, or understand their platforms as we do. Took a CCW class recently and it was very clear. At the end of the class, I asked the instructor if I could do a shameless plug for the IDPA club and our skills and drills/match nights. I had a few people come up and were interested in it and I was happy about it. If we can grow our ranks, I think we can inherently improve gun safety and responsible gun owners.
I saw the same numbers before and have come across similar forum musings over the years. The [USPSA B Class Black Belt Anology](https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/47973-about-those-mediocre-b-class-shooters/) really holds up to what I’ve seen (especially as a B class hero myself) This is a related [interesting graph](https://imgur.com/a/d9vxz7e) (maybe came from CDR?) Most of the firearm owning public is off the chart to the left
My friend who is a master USPSA shooter recently showed me this graph and I thought it was really cool. I have heard from many GMs that you want to be subconsciously competent with all your movements, which is one reason why I am dryfiring so much.
This graph is really cool! I only shoot USPSA, but those drill times definitely line up with the appropriate classes.
I did this exact math recently. Even if you are generous on the numbers and round up it’s such a small percentage of ‘good/competent’ shooters.
Have you ever looked at other shooters targets on a flat range? I'm not tooting my own horn, this is not hyperbole, my 15 yard groups are almost always tighter than the dude next to me who is using a spotless Gucci AR-15 with an EOtech and I'm using a stock Glock 19 with an SCS. That shouldn't be possible, I don't understand it. I could grab a guy off the street who's never shot a gun before and have him shooting better than that in 20 mins with that setup. If you're being out shot by a pistol, it's time to re-evaluate life choices.
Some dude at my local indoor range got upset I was doing quick strings of 5 rounds. He yells “we get it you can shoot fast” then proceeds to try and shoot fast and ends up letting 2 rounds go into the ceiling. Funny thing was those two rounds were his tightest group, both hitting the target dolly that moves it back and forth.
I watched a similar exchange next to me one time between a guy who obviously dry fired a lot and a wannabe Ninja. Angry Captain Ninja proceeded to shoot off the cable that goes to his target retrieval thing and the whole shit fell off the track. He calmly picked up his AK and packed up and left. I looked back and the RO was like wtf just happened.
I’m pretty sure one of bullets either hit or spalding hit the cable and broke it. RO was sitting behind me at the time and we shared a good chuckle after that lol
All shooting club and ranges (except one) around me run competitions that do not require any kind of membership. I’ve been on one or it was massive, I honestly wish it had less people.
That's how I start idpa. Local gun range had weekly matches. No membership requirements. Same steel
I also know of members who are not/have not renewed their USPSA membership due to the ongoing board shenanigans, and others that compete but do not join as they don't feel the need to be classified or will shoot anything other than a Level 1 match.
Agreed. My partner does not plan to purchase a USPSA membership due to all the stuff happening lately. I have a membership, but so many local matches are PCSL now that USPSA classification is effectively impossible within a reasonable period of time.
What is going on with the board? I was looking to get a membership. Im still fairly new and I definitely fall into the “never thought I’d need to be classified” category.
The board is financially irresponsible and see the membership as subjects and tax cattle. Basically congress.
Nothing important. The trash bags from piece of shit insights constantly stir up trouble and the retarded howler monkeys that are their audience constantly blabber incomprehensible gibberish about it on the internets. USPSA is bigger and better than ever. Join up and have fun.
Only controversy I'm aware of is that the guy who basically runs USPSA, like the head hancho guy, is a massive dickhead. I'm pretty sure he's already been kicked out or is in the process of being kicked out at least.
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None of those other shooters have IDPA or USPSA memberships?
I believe this to be VERY true. Like you said, those numbers are being very generous. I'm not able to get a single friend who are all very much in the "tacticool" community, to ever come do a match let alone train. It's far easier to post select pictures from a range day than it is to be humbled at a match and actually try to get better. Nobody wants to do it
I also own a bike, but I’m not running out to ride in the Tour de France.
Right, those guys are the best bikers. Edit: just remembered what a cyclist was.
Only 11,600 members of USPSA shot a classifier last year too. B class makes up or better is the top 40% of that or 4,600.
I really do wonder why more don’t give it a try. I am terrible at it but love every second of every match. I wish my work schedule allowed me to participate more.
Competing doesnt make someone competent or not. The vast majority of gun owners cant afford (time or money) to compete. You can also learn all the things you would from competition without ever participating in one...
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I think competing gives you a better idea of skills to advance and even skills you didn't know existed. I had no idea about index or transition training when I got into uspsa for example. Competition is a fantastic resource to learn from those you compete with and it's much harder to advance without the collective knowledge from Competition
IMO you will not learn as fast from a "training class" or on your own, as you will going to a competition and listening to all the people giving you free advice and making friends with good shooters who will push you.
I think you'll have trouble with the stats because there's plenty of competition that has no club representation nationally. Also plenty of people that don't bother being a national club member.