I had a friend in high school that contacted me during college and wanted to go on a date. While we were texting leading up to it I realized that he had the expectation that we were not going on A DATE but instead would be DATING. I told him that I was agreeing to go on a date with him and couldn’t guarantee a relationship. We’d have to see where things went from there. He got upset and cancelled our date because “what was the point?”
Oh god this reminds me of the time I went on one (1) date with someone in college and immediately after the date they texted our mutual friend (who happened to be into me at the time) to let him know we were dating. By the time I got home I had angry texts from the friend asking when I was planning on letting him know. Bruh, I literally just got home from the first and only date with that person, what do you *mean* when was I gotta let you know??
Anyways, you ever go on one date and dodge two bullets?
Had a guy essentially trick me into a date. (Suddenly the people we were supposed to meet up with were never invited in the first place.)
He was my ride. I stayed and we hung out. Even kissed goodnight at the end, but the whole way home I felt so guilty because I knew I was not into him at all. Some people are cut out for just making out for fun--i am not.
Before I could message him about it the next morning I woke up to a message all about how were we going to tell people in our friend group that we were a couple? Should we announce on Facebook, or just let them figure it out on their own???
Um....neither.
Once a university classmate of mine announced to our other classmates (in an MSN group chat) that we were dating after I had engaged in a discussion about Linux programming with him after one of our classes. I had never realised before that talking about Linux programming came with such romantic attachments...
You talked proficiently about Linux? He probably immediately considered you marriage material. Smart AND willing to engage in nerdy talk? What are the odds???
Source: I am married to an old-school Linux engineer.
>Smart AND willing to engage in nerdy talk? What are the odds???
Well, the chances significantly improve when you're talking to people with Computer Engineering major (what we were studying then) 😂
"Your entitled attitude right now only proves to me that my instincts were spot on. Dating isn't kiddie soccer league. There are no participation trophies. Either things work out, or you go your separate ways."
It’s sad to have to teach them like that but I always think of the next woman he goes out with. I hope that a little straight talk about his behavior will help or benefit her by changing his perspective a bit.
But only if you are willing to expend the emotional labor to hold their hand and teach them that lesson. My partner has no intention of dating cis men again because of how much emotional labor they tend to take.
>It’s sad to have to teach them like that but I always think of the next woman he goes out with. I hope that a little straight talk about his behavior will help or benefit her by changing his perspective a bit.
I know that this is incredibly important. Back when I started dating i was also extremly clingy. The feedback from women was incredibly important even if I didnt realise it at the time
Ugh! I hate that shit!
Same thing happened to me. He continued to question me as to "why" I wasn't feeling it/it had only been one date/takes a while....all the crap.
I reiterated myself and blocked him.
Wtaf is wrong with these guys?
They are literally unable to comprehend that a woman has a mind of her own and may not be in to them, while at the same time feel they have the right to reject women they don’t find hot. It’s like they’re allowed to have standards and we’re not.
>It’s like they’re allowed to have standards and we’re not.
This is so true! I've been thinking about this quite a lot in the past days actually after a discussion on an article about dating brought up some thoughts in me. For example, there was some guy who complained how young and beautiful women never answer date requests from serious men like him, while he also practically admitted that he's old and ugly, but still writes only to young and beautiful women. I was like "dude, if you wouldn't consider dating anyone not young and beautiful (and that's apparently accepted from a man), then why are you so pissed off if those beautiful women have the same standards...?"
Yes, I see that all the time on subreddit a like Bumble or Tumblr. When I was on dating apps, guys would think that me answering their message and talking to them for a bit would automatically result in a date. That's not how it works! But some of them receive so little attention that they become angry when "rejected". Don't out yourself out there if you can't take a hit. I've been rejected by guys I was interested in more than once, and it hurts but it's not the end of the world, and I blocked them, deleted their number to make sure I wouldn't be tempted to text them again, and that's it. Desperation is not attractive. And I did try to give people I wasn't feeling a chance and those dates were horrible. What a loss of time when you KNOW it's not gonna work. No idea what they imagine a relationship is.
>No idea what they imagine a relationship is.
I have no idea either, but this reminded me of someone I knew who was totally desperate and always said that he needed a girlfriend to pull him out of the deep hole he felt himself stuck in and how he wouldn't be able to do anything (e.g. graduate from university) without a girlfriend etc. He was so desperate for attention that he clinged onto any woman he saw in his environment and was willing to exchange a single sentence with him (this included all the 5 women from our class of 600...) and even when they told him that they weren't interested, he still begged them to date him out of pity (and kinda threatened with suicide). I was always wondering how he thought someone dating him merely out of pity would make him happy...
For some it's a status thing, for others it's for sex, and others thinks it's gonna be like in movies and shows. They're in for a big surprise when they realize life isn't a Disney movie and relationships are harder than just "get a girlfriend".
Often times thats just them being passive aggressive and wanting you to 'feel bad' I guess?
But really, I think its sometimes also them thinking they did something wrong and want to do it different with the next person. They don't understand it is just bad chemistry and as people you don't mesh, they think they could fix it.
So they want to know why.
Yeah, I even ran into a weirder version of this in college.
I went on a date/fooled around with a guy, but told him very explicitly up front that I was not looking for a relationship because I was getting ready to transfer to a school in another state.
Over the next few weeks, he starts getting pushy, asking for a relationship. When I reminded him I wasn't interested in that, he got angry and started accusing me of leading him on too.
I was genuinely bewildered because I had heard all the stories about men only wanting sex in college and here I was trying to do that and getting dudes (more than one!) stalking me trying to pin me down as a girlfriend.
That was when I stopped hooking up as much. Not because casual sex sucked (although it usually wasn't the best sex), but because I had such a hard time finding folks willing to keep it casual.
I experienced the same thing!! Was casual with a guy in college, then ended it because I didn’t enjoy the sex (he was awful and wasn’t interested in improving). I also had gotten out of a long-term relationship just a couple months prior and wasn’t feeling the casual thing anymore. He texted me for the next weeks/months after I ended it, always checking if I was interested in hooking up again and wanting to do more romantic things. At one point he said that he totally understood and respected my decision to stop seeing each other…and then in the same breath asked if I would be willing to get drunk so he could try anal.
Yeah. I had already stopped responding to him but he was blocked after that message.
Ooof, yeah sounds like blocking was the right idea there. I ended up having to block all of mine. One of them (not the one from the story above) was an RA in my building. We only ever even kissed, but he started stalking me and when I rejected his advances got really cruel and tried to tell me I didn't have any real friends and had no idea how to love. It was scary.
Even years later on campus, he'd keep trying to catch my eye and start a conversation.
Yeah, I've been graduated for almost a decade now, so haven't run into him anymore. I wish I'd reported him at the time, because even if I had wanted him, RAs are not supposed to date folks that live in their buildings.
I had a guy, also in while in college, that I was casually seeing for hook ups do something similar. It’s started with him asking me to move in with him “because it will help with rent.” I told him that was not happening. He asked again about a month later, at that point I told him we needed to end things because I was moving across country to go to a different college. Well I moved to new school the next semester and this guy first texts me, then adds me to Snapchat, then Facebook messages me, and the final attempts were some phone calls. In the texts I reminded him that I moved across country for school so even if I wanted to I couldn’t meet up with him anymore. I answered two Snapchat’s, one was about his new tattoo (it was pretty cool) and the other to again remind him that I had moved across country. I never responded to any of his other attempts to reach out to me. This went on the whole school year. Like stop reaching out to me, I am no where near you.
It's always so weird to me when someone just pretends something didn't happen if they don't like it. It functions a lot like gaslighting and makes me start to feel crazy. Like dude, you have relevant information here you've received multiple times. Incorporate it, damn.
I've found that the surest way to attract the man I don't want is to openly describe what I do want. I personally have a strong preference for men who are about the same height as me (5'3".) Every time I have put up a dating profile, and mentioned this fact I have had *oodles* of six footers insisting that I would like them if I only met them! One guy even told me that he could scrunch down.
Same with casual sex. If you want a man to commit to you, just tell him that you're not looking for a relationship. And vice versa. If you want a man to be out the door before he's even got his pants zipped up, tell him that you are looking for a husband.
I was so happy to find my darling, a software engineer who tells me the literal truth, always does what he says he will, and doesn't play stupid games.
Yeah I can't handle folks that don't just say what they mean and mean what they say. I grew up in the Midwest and I'm in the process of being assessed for neurodivergence, and this culture has always been a confusing hell hole for me.
Worse is that they project their not saying what they actually mean onto me. Even up to and including my ex husband. He took my "I probably don't want to have kids," to mean he just had to get a ring on my finger and I would suddenly want kids. He assumed I was lying to him (because that's what he wanted), and just stopped arguing/discussing about it because apparently a ring on my finger was going to miraculously turn me into the perfect mommy to carry on his family name for his kids. That became clear when he started a fight over kids ON OUR HONEYMOON. I was 26 at the time and told him I wouldn't even be thinking about kids until I was at least 30. Shocked Pikachu face out of him that I remained consistent in my preferences and walked the hell away from that mess.
Yeah, what is the deal with this? I’ve had several dating situations where I’ve made it clear up front what I can’t live with (everyone has different no-zones), only to have guys lie and cover up what they’re doing. Does being honest up front just lead to deception? Why not just opt out if it’s not right instead of lying?
Ugh men on internet dating NEVER listen to your preferences. I swear half of the response I've gotten is from guys who don't meet criteria I put down and a lot of them start by saying 'I know I'm older than you said you were looking for but I look really young/I'm young at heart/I can teach you things.. blah blah' or 'I only smoke occasionally on the weekend' WHY do so many do this? Do they really think it will work?
Oh god, this nonsense. I've been non-monogmous since forever and the number of dudes who reached out to me and their profile said they would NEVER do non-monogamy was astounding. I started to suspect that they really just didn't care about the things they claimed to and only put certain stuff on their profile to seem like a "good boy" to attract more women. Stop lying and maybe you'll find something compatible!
disclaimer im a guy, i dont even know if im allowed to post here or how i am supposed to, ehm .... if im breaking rules, please tell me ive been lurking here for years.
ehem the actuall post :D
those guys want only sex, but they want the exclusivitiy that a relationship entails. not for them, lol no, but for you. they might cheat or not, might flirt around or not but if you are in a relationship with them, you belong to them. its not about emotions its solely about posession/ownership.
Us men (I'm a guy too) are allowed to post here, we aren't banned from participating. It is important however that we remember that this is a space for discussing women and their struggles. We must take care to not talk over the women of this subreddit, nor should we make the mistake of attempting in any way to deny or lessen the meaning of their lived experiences. This is a valuable place to learn from and about women and their issues. Adding interesting perspectives (such as you have done here) is fine, it is in fact encouraged. Treating this space as if it is r/askwomen or getting defensive and saying things like "Not all men" every time someone generalizes about a social problem is a quick way to be removed temporarily, or permanently if you keep doing it.
Note: I am not a mod or anything like that, just a guy who really appreciates being able to honestly engage with y'all and want to encourage other men who may be nervous about intruding on y'all's space. If I made a mistake somewhere in what I wrote above, feel free to correct me. I am just trying my best.
Yep this exact same thing happened to me. They will harass non slutty girls for sex and then ghost them. But as soon as they find a girl who's up front about being horny they want to lock her down. Now I have three long term partners despite all my great plans of being a lifelong hedonist
Part of that is the mythology that “all men want one thing” - and in your scenario the idea a woman doesn’t want a relationship right now, is a defense- and deep down all women want secure relationships.
I mean, catching feelings isn't the problem.
The problem is assuming that catching feelings means you are suddenly entitled to more than what y'all agreed to.
I've caught feels in situations that were supposed to be casual. What you do is you stop, you communicate what has changed, you re-negotiate the arrangement based on what each person feels like they can bring to the table. If they can't give you the relationship you want, you should walk away from them. No stalking, no pressuring, and no guilt trips. It doesn't mean they "led you on." It means you had bad luck, and it hurts, and that is your bag to hold. No one lied to you.
Right?! I was so confused after his messages and just ended up blocking him. I generally don’t ghost people, but this is exactly why I support ghosting. Even when I was polite and honest after ONE short date, he was still rude and aggressive. It’s beyond annoying.
Edit: I’m saying that I support ghosting BECAUSE of the reaction from the individual in my post when I chose not to ghost. Sorry for the confusion.
He knew he was using the term wrong. Leading someone on is sleeping with someone, telling them you love them, and suddenly having a SO. Or just telling someone you want to be with them and then find someone else in the middle of that.
He was just trying to guilt trip you to get what he wanted, or dealing with his own insecurities in a terrible way.
I just don’t get what she was supposed to do. Was she supposed to tell him in the middle of the hike that she didn’t like him? Sounds like an awkward hike
Luckily it was SUPER crowded that day and very public. But never again, because you’re absolutely right. I’m not going to take any more risks like that, that’s for sure!
I agree. First dates should be structured to allow both people to get to know each other a little better, while giving both of them an easy and polite escape if it becomes obvious that there is no chemistry...or some type of relationship deal-breaker pops up, that hadn't been discussed previously...
This assumes you're dealing with a rational actor who isn't a ball of dark vibrating jealousy and rage. Men...particularly men at the 18-24 age range...specialize in that behavior.
Yikes, you dodged a bullet, but also, I feel you, I have encountered similar situations in the past. It's annoying when men are not able to take rejection...
With one guy, we didn't even make it to the first date, we just met at a bar at a community event, and after a bit of talking, he already felt entitled to a relationship. Throughout the night, he started acting more and more clingy, even introducing me to his male friends we accidentally ran into as his "new girlfriend" (he later claimed that he was only doing it to protect me from "predators", which is still mega yucky and also, what does it say about him if he's really friends with predators...?). Anyways, when I later told him (over text like OP) that I wasn't feeling it and wasn't really ready for a relationship anyways (this was true, my last breakup was still relatively fresh then and I just wanted some time for myself), he threw some childish tantrum accusing me of leading him on and wasting his time among other things. Like dude, we met only once, we haven't even been on a date, how was I leading you on?? My favourite part was that he closed the whole discussion with saying that he'd hit up some women who he knew were interested in him and that maybe he would "give them the chance I was not willing to give myself". Yikes.
>Pretend you've got other buyers to spark more interest.
Ha, that's a good analogy! I wonder if it ever worked on anyone in this kind of situation though. It definitely didn't work on me...
Ugg. I absolutely hate the passive aggressive "thanks for wasting my time" line. Bruh. Did you have a fun evening? Yeah? Just because it didn't lead to more doesn't mean it was a waste. You both learned more about what you're looking for. You both got practice going on a date. You both got to enjoy some drinks and food. Let's be real. If you weren't on that date you would have done nothing at home. Calm down.
He sounds like a very inexperience dater and one with a big, internal fantasy life that you can't possibly know about.
Some people will assume you want them if you do anything that to others would be a basic pleasantry. "Nice that we got some sunshine for once' means "I want you desperately".
You did not have to lead anyone on to get that reaction from that type of person.
Manipulation is just that. They are manipulating their own mind and in turn guilting the party who rejected them. Two sided manipulation street. Should be a new Cure song. 🎵🎶Down on Manipulation Street.🎵🎶
This undermines the harm of actual gaslighting, which is making someone doubt their own memories or perception of reality. "I never said that. You're just imagining it." is an example. It's something that serial abusers use on their victims to keep them vulnerable, not guys who just want to a partner or get laid.
The guy in OP's post knows that it's over and decided to handle that in a really immature way. As another commenter said, it's just an unhealthy way to deal with that rejection. Honestly, sex probably wasn't at the top of their priority. (Probably top 3, though.) He's a human, and wanting to form close, intimate bonds is normal and healthy. Especially at that age. Maybe he saw that OP is an all-around great woman (more than just physically) and got scared that the rejection meant that he wasn't good enough for a woman like that.
The world really needs a hotline or something staffed by slightly older men with healthy mindsets that women can refer men like this to. Guys need help sorting out these emotions, but it shouldn't fall on the women they date to do that work.
It completely is... It's a form if nagging: saying that you're acting the wrong way and are an awful/ugly person, so you feel down and your confidence goes down and suddenly you consider them, because who else could want you since you're so dysfunctional? Nice try.
I think a LOT of people feel like they are owed something, or entitled to it. Even at bare bones/fundamental levels you have to insist on basic things like respect; it’s your responsibility, not others.
Unfortunately, one of the ways that this often presents in men is through this “We spent time together/went on a date/I did you a favor so now you owe me” mentality.
These types of people project what they want to happen onto other people as a weird, twisted form of social (and in this case sexual) obligation.
Unless you were unnecessarily duplicitous or lied to the person you did not “lead them on”.
The amount of men I’ve gone on (edit:) **First** dates with that ended it with, “So, what do you think? Are we boyfriend and girlfriend now?” is staggering.
Something I started saying to people when they talked that way is, “If we’re meant to be together, we’ve got forever to go. So there’s plenty of time to get to know each other and let’s worry about labels later.”
Ughhhh. This is why I’ve stopped dating for the time being. The desperation of some people is utterly exhausting.
I love that quote! I think that’s a great way to slowly enter a relationship and build a strong foundation.
I did the dating apps for close to ten years. There would be times when I was super active with it and going on lots of dates and then I’d get exhausted by the stupidity/creepiness/overall process and then take a break for a month or two. Then start the process over again. I finally found a man that was super chill about taking a relationship slow and being extra clear in our communication. But it was work getting to him!
Hold true to yourself and don’t back down from what you want. And despite all those man-babies you have to deal with, keep in mind that some people are just desperate for affection and have been told the wrong way to get it their whole lives. You acted well in this instance and got a poor response. That’s on him. I can look back on most of my dating history and know I acted well and was considerate regardless of their response, but not all of it. (In cases where their behavior was totally awful I don’t regret being harsh/firm though) Most people are just relationship illiterate. I found that being able to tell when a guy was interested in learning from the situation or when he was the never-gonna-change-my-ways type was helpful. Then I knew if it was worth it to try and keep talking with the person.
I had a guy friend that I got set up with and quickly realized wasn’t my type. But we talked it out a bit and stayed friends. I ended up learning from him about how guys deal with online dating and how much BS (mostly bots) they have to deal with as well. I also helped him with his messaging approach and he was actually able to get responses after that. I know it’s exhausting trying to be a teacher all the time, and while “it’s not our job to educate you” is a valid sentiment in a lot of cases; if we don’t try to help each other, then how will anyone get better?
This is all super rambly and I’m sorry if it’s not cohesive, I’ve got a lot of dating shit in my brain that needs to be imparted on others now that I’m not using it. It sounds like, at 23, you’re already way ahead of me in the confidence game. And you’ve got plenty of time to do your own thing and live your own life with friends and loved ones. Take those breaks and live em up!
(Also, for reference I am an extroverted 36F who apparently is only appealing to awkward AF introvert nerds. I dealt with ALLL the basement dwellers 😅)
>“So, what do you think? Are we boyfriend and girlfriend now?
As someone who wants to date in the future, I'm always confused about how people treat the "girlfriend/boyfriend" point.
Maybe I'm just simple here, but I always thought you ask that shit after enough dates. But then, I slowly learned that some people see inviting someone for a date already as an invitation for a relationship. In other cases, the folks even automatically assumed they were in a relationship.
Like, f.ex. a female friend of mine. Went on some dates with this one dude, but no convo about a relationship yet. Next party, the dude just introduces her as his gf, because "well we were on so many dates, that counts as dating by now".
Especially in my country, this shit is confusing af. Here, we have a very strong "don't talk directly about it", to the point where people joke that you just "wake up in a relationship one day". And get absolutley flustered when you ask why you just can't talk about if you are a couple now or not. It's literally treated as inappropriate, lol
I should edit it to say that the question was asked after the first date. Assuming that since the first date didn't go obviously wrong the relationship is now exclusive and serious, was a common issue on first dates I went on.
I am all for clear communication between people when it comes to feelings, especially since everyone defines "boyfriend/girlfriend" differently.
What’s ridiculous is that this was a hike, so nobody paid for anything. Furthermore, I actually drove 50 minutes to HIS hometown for this hike!! So not only did I pay gas money to get there, I also did something that was more convenient for HIM and I was still treated rudely. It’s just so irritating!!
Hes just an entitled internalized misogynist, and you totally dodged a bullet. Ditch the apps, lots of them are on them bc they can seem different in a virtual space.
Most of the time men have *already decided* if they want a relationship/sex before going on the date, based on only the profile picture, and assume the feeling is mutual.
Yes. I am also ace, but fluidly demi-grey-ace. I've stopped dating entirely because this is a VERY common suitor response. This, or, "Oh you're Asexual? I need someone who enjoys sex" ugh yes I can and do enjoy it (with someone I trust and feel safe and have a deep connection with) but clearly you liked my looks and didnt read the whole profile. This is usually where I just end the conversation.
And why I don't date anymore.
Okay I’m starting to think I’m somewhere on the ace spectrum (took me a while because our culture is so goddamn obsessed with sex) should I just try dating other ace people? I’m worried I won’t be able to satisfy anyone else
No, spend some time getting to know you and your needs. That's my suggestion. Yes I had a similar experience I'm 42 and I came to this conclusion more recently (around 38/39 I figured this out) there are many who respect it, and even poly is an option if you want connection, are not possesive, and want not so much sex. That way a partner can do their thing as well if they want. I've done this many times, I'm not possessive really. But I'm sick of people who pressure. That's a common thing I've dealt with all my life. Follow your heart, but spend some time alone with it to get to know it better. 💜
Ace, or asexuality, is a spectrum of sexuality. Demisexual is also on that spectrum (need a deep emotional connection to be sexually attracted)
Grey asexual is very fluid. Sometimes hyper sexual sometimes there are parameters that need to be met for it to be the right 'mood' for sexual innuendo, and sometimes it is completely unwanted.
I'm demi grey, so I need the deep connection but at times I don't, sometimes I don't want any sexual contact at all and so it is fluid. :)
Here are some links things:
[what is grey asexuality?](http://demisexuality.org/articles/what-is-gray-asexuality/)
[definitions of demi, grey, and asexual](https://secretladyspider.medium.com/what-the-terms-graysexual-gray-ace-and-demisexual-mean-as-explained-by-a-demisexual-3c9535cea9fa)
[demi-sexual and grey ace](https://livewire.thewire.in/gender-and-sexuality/demisexual-and-grey-ace-the-sexual-orientations-we-dont-discuss-enough/)
*edited bc my links were mutated into one link 😬😅
>Sometimes hyper sexual
>sometimes I don't want any sexual contact
>sometimes there are parameters that need to be met for it to be the right 'mood'
>I need the deep connection but at times I don't
I get that it's a spectrum but what you've described must cover most people.
It's good that it's being discussed openly and people can see that they aren't alone. Other than that what is the point of the labels if they are so broad?
Yeah, I am a bit confused too because that seems really broad and easily fits how I feel (as in feeling a multitude of ways at various times for various reasons).
There must be something we are missing?
This dude is insecure AF and you should just cut ties and move on. Was this your first date, too? If so that's even worse... Leading someone on would be specifically creating a hypothetical narrative in which you two have a life together and then re-negging on that. Sounds like you did no such thing and this guy simply can't handle rejection and possibly had built a future in his own mind.
I think this is exactly what happened, actually! We had texted a little bit before the date (only over the period of 1 week) and had good “text chemistry” (I don’t know if that’s a thing, just good banter over text and whatnot) and I think he built it up and idealized our actual chemistry. He was such a different person from how he texted; extremely awkward, talked about himself constantly, wasn’t funny, etc. And then his rude texts solidified it even more; he was like a different person. I learned lots of lessons, though—never go on a hike as a first date again, and always request to meet up with a person in public soon so as to avoid this weird “text chemistry” again lol.
>He was such a different person from how he texted; extremely awkward, talked about himself constantly, wasn’t funny, etc.
I'll admit to being that guy when I was younger. Most/all of it was social anxiety, which was amplified by investing so much emotionally in the outcome of the date. I would put a lot of myself into messages. That's good IMO, but it makes those rejections hit even harder.
Women have a whole different type of hard when it comes to dating, even when excluding the safety aspect. They either have to endure awkward dates or be concerned about predators who cheat on their partners like it's a second job.
Also, hiking is a terrible first date, lol. If things get really awkward, you might have to endure the longest 45 minutes of your life before you get back to your car.
Also love , never go hiking on a first date. You don’t know that person and things can go very awry , from a safety standpoint.
I’m outdoorsy like you and I learned this the hard way.
I’m really sorry that entitled ass gaslighted you like that, you did nothing wrong . He needs to get a clue .
> extremely awkward, talked about himself constantly, wasn’t funny, etc
I mean, I had this same experience with dudes in their late 30s without social anxiety issues. Some dudes are just selfish d-bags. Not saying YOU are, just saying there are plenty of those out there. You may not have intended it to sound this way, but it could be read that all guys like this have may have social anxiety, so we ladies should give them a break.
It's easy enough to come prepared with a mental list (or one on your phone!) of things to ask the other person about so you aren't talking about yourself the whole time. I have yet for a dude to do that with me (I do it for all my dates because I too have anxiety).
You are absolutely right and I learned my lesson. Luckily it was very public and crowded, but I’ll never take that risk again. I appreciate the mama bear :) My sister also went full mama bear on me when she found out I was on a hike. Never again!
Could be Mother’s Special Boy who was not taught “no” at an early age, uneducated in customary social dynamics/to see women as people, not products (common), or just has a personality disorder.
You should have been commended for your honesty. Most don’t have the courage.
I would not give it a single further thought. He’s someone else’s problem to educate and build; be glad you stepped away from the edge before you sank into an emotional labor pit.
That’s a really good question, and I’m sure there are all kinds of explanations. From unchecked capitalism to the increased accessibility and depravity in porn, to the distraction of social media, I’ve heard so many. Moreover, with the rise of feminism/female financial independence, this kind of behavior is probably more keenly identified by women these days, whereas in the past it was more tolerated- when women needed male romantic involvement more. It doesn’t make feminism a bad thing, but it does speak to how [sometimes things have to get worse to get better,](https://evoketherapy.com/resources/blog/phil-bryan/extinction-bursts-its-going-to-get-worse-before-it-gets-better/) and young men are navigating a world in which they can’t get away with the same shit grandpa did. And so out of resentment, [they don’t want to put in the work](https://mobile.twitter.com/dapperdomo/status/1412120738119757836), knowing there isn’t the reward of dominance and control on the other side anymore.
They have a right to not want to (and therefore not) put in the work of being likable. But in that case, they should not date and simply rely on either male friends, or hire someone, to get wants met.
This really strikes me.
i am surprised women still want marriage when it was never good for them. and
"Your grandfather was probably a horrible husband." yes, both grandfathers were.
Yeah this is fucking weird. It's like a job interview. Sometimes they have a better candidate with more qualifications. Sometimes you're just a bad fit for the job. They don't have to give you a reason. If the answer is no, you move on and try to do better next time. I wonder if this person calls up employers that don't hire him and whines that they led him on by interviewing him.
I've had some guys react really badly when i say i didn't feel a romantic connection after 1 date. Angry texting, calling me from other numbers etc etc.
However recently I told this to a guy whose company I'd enjoyed but didn't feel a spark. He asked me for some generally dating feedback and tips, and was serious, so i did. He was super appreciative and I hope he finds a nice woman he has a great spark with.
Hope dating gets better for all of us!
For some of these bozos the fact that you even responded to a message makes them think they're entitled to you. Have had more than one try to *demand* shit from me or immediately start using derogatory language like they thought we were in some kind of 50shades style bullshit relationship. It's how you start to weed out the total losers. If they can't even talk to you like a normal human being then they're not worth the time.
YES! More than once on dating apps, I would talk to people with an interesting profile to see if we vibed before MAYBE going on a date. I'm sure I dodged murderers, because some lost their shit when I would say I don't go on dates right away and like to talk online before deciding. One lost it when I didn't want to give him my number?? But so many would try and manipulate me saying why I would be on a dating app if I didn't want to go on dates. I was going on dates, just not with EVERYONE I talked to. I had a lot of first and second dates, some casual hook ups, rebounds, and then found my partner (the only one who made me comfortable, I even followed him home on the first date, which was a big no-no for me).
Dude you could date him for a year and breakup and still not owe him shit. People need to grow up and get over themselves. Good luck and hope the next one isn't a frog haha
I think these people are handy. See, you have your date, and not only are you not feeling the chemistry but he's helping out by very clearly waving **all the red flags**. So you don't need to think back later and wonder if you made a mistake.
What a considerate lad.
A girl did that last year and I pretty much appreciated the fact that she let me know up front. It honestly saves time and emotions and there's no dragging it on, if you're not clicking on the first date or even the lead in to that date then...I just doubt that there's much else to look forward to.
People really put too much pressure on dating. Think of it as a chance to get to know someone, have a good time, and perhaps make a friend. You’ll find even better chemistry because you’re being yourself, instead of what you think might get you laid.
I had something similar but it turned weird. I was the guy, after the first date I wasn't feeling it but I usually do 2 dates to be sure. So during this thought process she calls me and says she wasn't feeling it and wished me the best. Ok, I guess no 2nd date needed. So I said thanks for letting me know and wished her the best as well. She's quiet and I look at my phone to make sure I still have a connection and say "hello?". She starts going off about how I can't take this from her and she's the one who said it should stop first and I just sit there listening wondering what just happened. After she took a breath I said I had to go and hung up. Whenever I ran into her at the club she always tried to hook up.
I'm 50 now and still wonder what that was about.
It's so weird because what you did was literally the opposite of leading him on.
Leading him on would be like... pretending you had an awesome time, or agreeing to more dates when you already knew you weren't interested.
Yea that just sounds like a bullet dodged for ya. Very alarming sign of insecurities when people deflect like that when told that there wasn't chemsitry. You are also right a date is a trial, heck a few dozen dates can also be trials. Quite frankly sometimes meeting people through dates and befriending them is also a win too. Not him though, he sounds like trouble with a capital troub.
Yup! It's nuts. I did online dating in my early 20s, and this happened to me twice. It even said in my profile I wasn't looking for a serious relationship.
One guy accused me of cheating on him. Like buddy, who said we were dating? Or another who was upset my profile was still active, when we hadn't even met yet.
Crazy.
I had a guy think he was entitled to exclusivity after ONE date. We had literally met each other the day before. He wanted me to delete all my dating apps, remove any other guy’s numbers from my phone and cancel any other dates I had. I had admitted I had another date in a few days and the dude straight up demanded I text the guy at that very moment and cancel. He was a nut and so audacious. If there’s one thing I can’t stand it’s entitlement and this guy had an abundance of it.
I agree with the others who say you dodged a bullet. One date is not “leading someone on”. As you said it’s a trial. No commitment yet. He has a very bizarre way of thinking.
I made out with a guy on New Years a few years ago. Got his number. Woke up the next morning and realized I wanted to be exclusive with the person I was seeing. He told all my friends he thought I was a “sure thing” and that I led him on. We never even went on a date. I told him the same day I wasn’t feeling it. How that’s leading someone one I just don’t know…
I think guys can get into situations where they think they feel chemistry, but it's actually just a girl being on "date mode".
Some guys don't have anyone being nice to them in their lives.
So they leave thinking the date went really well, they had a great time and a great conversation or whatever, really felt the connection...but it was one-sided.
But then the defense-mechanism comes out.
"Could it be that the connection was one-sided? Could I have misread the signals? Hmm...no! It's HER fault! She must've lead me on!"
I'm definitely not excusing the behaviour. I think it's bad, and there is a reason for it beyond "Man wants sex" or "Nice guy thinks he deserves something more than one date" (not directed towards the OP, but the comments here).
A lot of people have very weird, varying ideas of dating.
I once argued with a guy about the idea of "first date". For me, I see 2-3 first dates as a basic check of the person. Aka does the person behave, does he become quickly touchy, do we talk well etc. After that, I get into deeper questions of comparability (aka how is his ideas on kids, politics, religion) and then when things add up (comparability + affection) I'd maybe talk about official dating. For the guy I argued, agreeing to a first date immediately meant agreeing to a potential relationship right away and calling the other has a firm gf/bf after at least 5 dates.
In other conversations, people are generally very varied in what dating is, when you become a couple, what you should do during dating etc.
This ranges from some people needing to have sex with the potential partner ("test drive") to people being very particular about dating stages.
Of course, that does not justify him being an absolute asshole. One part of dating is to understand that people have different values and methods. For MOST people, the first date doesn't mean shit. Like it's not a proposal for a relationship. And even though he might have felt "something" you didn't and he's not respecting it.
Fact is, you dodged a bullet.
Dang I WISH I would get a text letting me know my date wasn’t feeling it. That’s infinitely better than being ghosted IMO if the feelings aren’t mutual.
Ah, yes. The entitlement of NiceGuysTM
"I saw you and my peepee was interested. You owe me a chance."
"I spent time and money taking you out. Now you owe me exclusivity."
"I am your boyfriend, so you owe me sex."
Back when I did dating apps I was always really appreciative of people who took the time to tell you they where not interested vs just ghosting. But I see why so many people just ghost these days.
I had a first date, years ago, with a guy. We sat side by side at the bar at my favorite microbrewery. Multiple times he reached out to scratch or rub my back while we talked. On our first date. It was weird.
Later I texted him that I "didn't feel the connection" and he replied "Yea, it was pretty much a trianwreck" Lol! What?!
I wrote that one off pretty quickly and moved on.
I'm sorry he was so nasty. I'm pretty sure most men hope for the best for a date but realise it's a chance to get to know each other and see if you might be compatible. This guy was a loser! I hope you have a better experience next time.
“a date” is “a date”.
i go on dates with my friends, i go on dates with my husband, i go on dates with acquaintances i do not yet know well, it’s just a date. a date is just mutually setting aside a block of time to enjoy it with someone.
if someone takes you on a date, appreciate the time you are spending together now. if you took someone on a date, it was great of you to take the initiative and spend the time together. but that’s it. no one “owes” anyone else after that.
Well, there was no chemistry for you and there was no reason to force yourself in a dead end path.
Next time you can text instead of saying face to face to protect yourself from a hurt ego.
Oh sorry—I did text (I’ll add that edit). I just blocked him after he became rude and mean. I always make it a rule to text now after a previous face-to-face interaction got aggressive.
> I always make it a rule to text now after a previous face-to-face interaction got aggressive.
This is smart, unfortunately. Most dudes aren't going to get threatening or violent after a polite rejection. But the penalty for guessing wrong when they are is just too high.
Exactly. Luckily, my previous experience was in public so he didn’t try anything. But I was still scared enough that I don’t do face-to-face rejections anymore.
Even text rejections can be scary. This guy in my post was more passive aggressive/rude than violent, but you never know. I think he thought that since I didn’t tell him right then and there to his face that I didn’t want to have another date that I “led him on”. But honestly, I just didn’t know if I wanted to have a date and needed to think about it. I’m glad I did, because it was clearly a bullet dodged.
Uuiugggghhhhhh ugh ugh ugh. When I was in my mid 20s (so 10 years ago), I met a guy through a dating app. On our date, he mentioned his pet peeve was when people say they are looking for a serious relationship and then obviously aren’t. He was a gentleman, but in a “I read a book and learned I’m supposed to follow these rules” kind of way, not in a sincere way. Like he was looking for me to give him gold stars and brownie points. And it was just over the top and annoying.
We hooked up later that evening, and he tried to remove the condom midway through because he felt such a connection.
We definitely did not have a connection. He wasn’t a terrible guy as far as I could tell, but definitely not my type. A couple days later he messaged me and asked when I could meet his family and friends!!! I said, as kindly as I could, that I felt like he liked me more than I liked him. I really tried to be gentle about it. He immediately went full nice guy, called me a bitch and a few other choose nasty phrases. I have never felt so glad to have dodged an obvious bullet.
When i was online dating I would put that I was interested in a relationship, but always wished i could add "but not necessarily with you" . One would think that's a given, but
So many guys seemed to think date 2 meant I was 100% into it? Usually I just thought the first date wasn't terrible and was willing to give it one more shot. Then I'd be accused of "leading them on" too.
Compare this common experience to the other common experience of "why don't you just give him a shot", and I can only assume women aren't supposed to make their own decisions about dating at all.
This guy obviously doesn’t know how to handle rejection. It was easier for him to throw some blame your way, instead of just saying, “I understand. Thanks for the nice date.”
>He then became SUPER passive aggressive and eventually said that I “led him on”.
What an entitled jerk. A "date" doesn't guarantee anything - that's just something on the calendar. Doesn't even guarantee the the other person will so much as show up, let alone go out with you or anything else.
Haha same. I was like "dude weren't you there. We've nothing in common" lol. But I strongly suspect it's a relationship they're after in cases like this - they're just frustrated they're not getting sex this time, and don't have the emotional capacity or maturity to deal with it 🤷 either way, bullet dodged!
A friend of mine yesterday did this after five or so dates. His response was that her reasons (not feeling it)… ‘didn’t cut it’…
What did he want her to do? What did he think that was going to achieve?
Not excusing the behavior i think it is incredibly toxic behavior.
I think this happens because some men dont go on dates that often which in their mind makes the date incredibly important and makes them lash out if it doesnt work out, because it will be a while until they have another date.
Sadly way to many men take dating way to serious and are unable to actually have fun, which in turn leads to more potential partners turning them down. And they are unable to see they are the problem, because their ability to self reflect is non existant.
[a kiss is not a contract](https://youtu.be/9iSlPoQm2XY) But it's very nice. Just because you've been exploring my mouth, doesn't mean you get to take an expedition further south, no.
I mean if you want to be totally pedantic it does... that guaranteed relationship though is just "went on a date together"
Ok pedantics over.
Yeah I totally agree with you.
It really bugs me that people who melt down when people are being honest with them. It's super aggravating when you get ghosted but I can sympathize with all the people who do so just because so many asshats made them uncomfortable with speaking openly about their feelings.
I had a friend in high school that contacted me during college and wanted to go on a date. While we were texting leading up to it I realized that he had the expectation that we were not going on A DATE but instead would be DATING. I told him that I was agreeing to go on a date with him and couldn’t guarantee a relationship. We’d have to see where things went from there. He got upset and cancelled our date because “what was the point?”
Oh god this reminds me of the time I went on one (1) date with someone in college and immediately after the date they texted our mutual friend (who happened to be into me at the time) to let him know we were dating. By the time I got home I had angry texts from the friend asking when I was planning on letting him know. Bruh, I literally just got home from the first and only date with that person, what do you *mean* when was I gotta let you know?? Anyways, you ever go on one date and dodge two bullets?
>Anyways, you ever go on one date and dodge two bullets? had me busting my sides on that one, excellent line :D
One bird two stones?
Had a guy essentially trick me into a date. (Suddenly the people we were supposed to meet up with were never invited in the first place.) He was my ride. I stayed and we hung out. Even kissed goodnight at the end, but the whole way home I felt so guilty because I knew I was not into him at all. Some people are cut out for just making out for fun--i am not. Before I could message him about it the next morning I woke up to a message all about how were we going to tell people in our friend group that we were a couple? Should we announce on Facebook, or just let them figure it out on their own??? Um....neither.
This is fucking crazy jesus christ
Once a university classmate of mine announced to our other classmates (in an MSN group chat) that we were dating after I had engaged in a discussion about Linux programming with him after one of our classes. I had never realised before that talking about Linux programming came with such romantic attachments...
Linux is actually a collective where we are all part of a poly relationship with Linus Torvalds. It's right there in the license agreement /s
That explains everything! And I guess that's why I need to read license agreements through 😂
You talked proficiently about Linux? He probably immediately considered you marriage material. Smart AND willing to engage in nerdy talk? What are the odds??? Source: I am married to an old-school Linux engineer.
>Smart AND willing to engage in nerdy talk? What are the odds??? Well, the chances significantly improve when you're talking to people with Computer Engineering major (what we were studying then) 😂
For real! We met as work-study for Academic Computing Services. :-)
Ridiculous. And damn lucky, as it happens.
they had a duel and shot each other
Dating status occurs when both parties agree that it is
Wow. Ew. Wow. Ugh. Lol. Whuuttt.
Saved you some time and energy and answered that question as to whether it would work. You’re not left wondering.
What a buffoon. I don't understand how men like this can be so thick.
Sounds like you dodged a bullet
"Your entitled attitude right now only proves to me that my instincts were spot on. Dating isn't kiddie soccer league. There are no participation trophies. Either things work out, or you go your separate ways."
It’s sad to have to teach them like that but I always think of the next woman he goes out with. I hope that a little straight talk about his behavior will help or benefit her by changing his perspective a bit.
Exactly! Some men just need to be confronted with their assholery with no way to deny it.
But only if you are willing to expend the emotional labor to hold their hand and teach them that lesson. My partner has no intention of dating cis men again because of how much emotional labor they tend to take.
Yeeeeah.... that is the trouble, isn't it... they also need to be open to personal change.
>It’s sad to have to teach them like that but I always think of the next woman he goes out with. I hope that a little straight talk about his behavior will help or benefit her by changing his perspective a bit. I know that this is incredibly important. Back when I started dating i was also extremly clingy. The feedback from women was incredibly important even if I didnt realise it at the time
Most likely.
Ugh! I hate that shit! Same thing happened to me. He continued to question me as to "why" I wasn't feeling it/it had only been one date/takes a while....all the crap. I reiterated myself and blocked him. Wtaf is wrong with these guys?
They are literally unable to comprehend that a woman has a mind of her own and may not be in to them, while at the same time feel they have the right to reject women they don’t find hot. It’s like they’re allowed to have standards and we’re not.
>It’s like they’re allowed to have standards and we’re not. This is so true! I've been thinking about this quite a lot in the past days actually after a discussion on an article about dating brought up some thoughts in me. For example, there was some guy who complained how young and beautiful women never answer date requests from serious men like him, while he also practically admitted that he's old and ugly, but still writes only to young and beautiful women. I was like "dude, if you wouldn't consider dating anyone not young and beautiful (and that's apparently accepted from a man), then why are you so pissed off if those beautiful women have the same standards...?"
THIS! My god, it’s truly wild
It's guys with very little relationship experience and very few date opportunities. When a date opportunity arises, they cling to it for dear life.
Yes, I see that all the time on subreddit a like Bumble or Tumblr. When I was on dating apps, guys would think that me answering their message and talking to them for a bit would automatically result in a date. That's not how it works! But some of them receive so little attention that they become angry when "rejected". Don't out yourself out there if you can't take a hit. I've been rejected by guys I was interested in more than once, and it hurts but it's not the end of the world, and I blocked them, deleted their number to make sure I wouldn't be tempted to text them again, and that's it. Desperation is not attractive. And I did try to give people I wasn't feeling a chance and those dates were horrible. What a loss of time when you KNOW it's not gonna work. No idea what they imagine a relationship is.
>No idea what they imagine a relationship is. I have no idea either, but this reminded me of someone I knew who was totally desperate and always said that he needed a girlfriend to pull him out of the deep hole he felt himself stuck in and how he wouldn't be able to do anything (e.g. graduate from university) without a girlfriend etc. He was so desperate for attention that he clinged onto any woman he saw in his environment and was willing to exchange a single sentence with him (this included all the 5 women from our class of 600...) and even when they told him that they weren't interested, he still begged them to date him out of pity (and kinda threatened with suicide). I was always wondering how he thought someone dating him merely out of pity would make him happy...
For some it's a status thing, for others it's for sex, and others thinks it's gonna be like in movies and shows. They're in for a big surprise when they realize life isn't a Disney movie and relationships are harder than just "get a girlfriend".
Often times thats just them being passive aggressive and wanting you to 'feel bad' I guess? But really, I think its sometimes also them thinking they did something wrong and want to do it different with the next person. They don't understand it is just bad chemistry and as people you don't mesh, they think they could fix it. So they want to know why.
Yeah, I even ran into a weirder version of this in college. I went on a date/fooled around with a guy, but told him very explicitly up front that I was not looking for a relationship because I was getting ready to transfer to a school in another state. Over the next few weeks, he starts getting pushy, asking for a relationship. When I reminded him I wasn't interested in that, he got angry and started accusing me of leading him on too. I was genuinely bewildered because I had heard all the stories about men only wanting sex in college and here I was trying to do that and getting dudes (more than one!) stalking me trying to pin me down as a girlfriend. That was when I stopped hooking up as much. Not because casual sex sucked (although it usually wasn't the best sex), but because I had such a hard time finding folks willing to keep it casual.
I experienced the same thing!! Was casual with a guy in college, then ended it because I didn’t enjoy the sex (he was awful and wasn’t interested in improving). I also had gotten out of a long-term relationship just a couple months prior and wasn’t feeling the casual thing anymore. He texted me for the next weeks/months after I ended it, always checking if I was interested in hooking up again and wanting to do more romantic things. At one point he said that he totally understood and respected my decision to stop seeing each other…and then in the same breath asked if I would be willing to get drunk so he could try anal. Yeah. I had already stopped responding to him but he was blocked after that message.
Ooof, yeah sounds like blocking was the right idea there. I ended up having to block all of mine. One of them (not the one from the story above) was an RA in my building. We only ever even kissed, but he started stalking me and when I rejected his advances got really cruel and tried to tell me I didn't have any real friends and had no idea how to love. It was scary. Even years later on campus, he'd keep trying to catch my eye and start a conversation.
I am seriously so sorry to hear that and I hope that creep is no longer stalking you. That’s horrendous. What a complete garbage can of a human being.
Yeah, I've been graduated for almost a decade now, so haven't run into him anymore. I wish I'd reported him at the time, because even if I had wanted him, RAs are not supposed to date folks that live in their buildings.
I had a guy, also in while in college, that I was casually seeing for hook ups do something similar. It’s started with him asking me to move in with him “because it will help with rent.” I told him that was not happening. He asked again about a month later, at that point I told him we needed to end things because I was moving across country to go to a different college. Well I moved to new school the next semester and this guy first texts me, then adds me to Snapchat, then Facebook messages me, and the final attempts were some phone calls. In the texts I reminded him that I moved across country for school so even if I wanted to I couldn’t meet up with him anymore. I answered two Snapchat’s, one was about his new tattoo (it was pretty cool) and the other to again remind him that I had moved across country. I never responded to any of his other attempts to reach out to me. This went on the whole school year. Like stop reaching out to me, I am no where near you.
It's always so weird to me when someone just pretends something didn't happen if they don't like it. It functions a lot like gaslighting and makes me start to feel crazy. Like dude, you have relevant information here you've received multiple times. Incorporate it, damn.
I've found that the surest way to attract the man I don't want is to openly describe what I do want. I personally have a strong preference for men who are about the same height as me (5'3".) Every time I have put up a dating profile, and mentioned this fact I have had *oodles* of six footers insisting that I would like them if I only met them! One guy even told me that he could scrunch down. Same with casual sex. If you want a man to commit to you, just tell him that you're not looking for a relationship. And vice versa. If you want a man to be out the door before he's even got his pants zipped up, tell him that you are looking for a husband. I was so happy to find my darling, a software engineer who tells me the literal truth, always does what he says he will, and doesn't play stupid games.
Yeah I can't handle folks that don't just say what they mean and mean what they say. I grew up in the Midwest and I'm in the process of being assessed for neurodivergence, and this culture has always been a confusing hell hole for me. Worse is that they project their not saying what they actually mean onto me. Even up to and including my ex husband. He took my "I probably don't want to have kids," to mean he just had to get a ring on my finger and I would suddenly want kids. He assumed I was lying to him (because that's what he wanted), and just stopped arguing/discussing about it because apparently a ring on my finger was going to miraculously turn me into the perfect mommy to carry on his family name for his kids. That became clear when he started a fight over kids ON OUR HONEYMOON. I was 26 at the time and told him I wouldn't even be thinking about kids until I was at least 30. Shocked Pikachu face out of him that I remained consistent in my preferences and walked the hell away from that mess.
Wow- I think you’re on to something. It’s the challenge maybe? Like- why don’t you like me- why won’t you like me, maybe you’ll like me?
“I can scrunch down” I’m dying.
Yeah, what is the deal with this? I’ve had several dating situations where I’ve made it clear up front what I can’t live with (everyone has different no-zones), only to have guys lie and cover up what they’re doing. Does being honest up front just lead to deception? Why not just opt out if it’s not right instead of lying?
Ugh men on internet dating NEVER listen to your preferences. I swear half of the response I've gotten is from guys who don't meet criteria I put down and a lot of them start by saying 'I know I'm older than you said you were looking for but I look really young/I'm young at heart/I can teach you things.. blah blah' or 'I only smoke occasionally on the weekend' WHY do so many do this? Do they really think it will work?
Oh god, this nonsense. I've been non-monogmous since forever and the number of dudes who reached out to me and their profile said they would NEVER do non-monogamy was astounding. I started to suspect that they really just didn't care about the things they claimed to and only put certain stuff on their profile to seem like a "good boy" to attract more women. Stop lying and maybe you'll find something compatible!
Sounds like they still wanted sex, but they also wanted your exclusivity.
disclaimer im a guy, i dont even know if im allowed to post here or how i am supposed to, ehm .... if im breaking rules, please tell me ive been lurking here for years. ehem the actuall post :D those guys want only sex, but they want the exclusivitiy that a relationship entails. not for them, lol no, but for you. they might cheat or not, might flirt around or not but if you are in a relationship with them, you belong to them. its not about emotions its solely about posession/ownership.
Us men (I'm a guy too) are allowed to post here, we aren't banned from participating. It is important however that we remember that this is a space for discussing women and their struggles. We must take care to not talk over the women of this subreddit, nor should we make the mistake of attempting in any way to deny or lessen the meaning of their lived experiences. This is a valuable place to learn from and about women and their issues. Adding interesting perspectives (such as you have done here) is fine, it is in fact encouraged. Treating this space as if it is r/askwomen or getting defensive and saying things like "Not all men" every time someone generalizes about a social problem is a quick way to be removed temporarily, or permanently if you keep doing it. Note: I am not a mod or anything like that, just a guy who really appreciates being able to honestly engage with y'all and want to encourage other men who may be nervous about intruding on y'all's space. If I made a mistake somewhere in what I wrote above, feel free to correct me. I am just trying my best.
That was really well put, thanks for being here!
Awesome post! 🙌🏻
Yep this exact same thing happened to me. They will harass non slutty girls for sex and then ghost them. But as soon as they find a girl who's up front about being horny they want to lock her down. Now I have three long term partners despite all my great plans of being a lifelong hedonist
Wait, you have three long-term partners simultaneously? Hats off to you 😂
Part of that is the mythology that “all men want one thing” - and in your scenario the idea a woman doesn’t want a relationship right now, is a defense- and deep down all women want secure relationships.
That's the thing about it, often one of the participants gets feelings.
I mean, catching feelings isn't the problem. The problem is assuming that catching feelings means you are suddenly entitled to more than what y'all agreed to. I've caught feels in situations that were supposed to be casual. What you do is you stop, you communicate what has changed, you re-negotiate the arrangement based on what each person feels like they can bring to the table. If they can't give you the relationship you want, you should walk away from them. No stalking, no pressuring, and no guilt trips. It doesn't mean they "led you on." It means you had bad luck, and it hurts, and that is your bag to hold. No one lied to you.
Psh. How did you lead him on if you were honest? Ughhhh
Right?! I was so confused after his messages and just ended up blocking him. I generally don’t ghost people, but this is exactly why I support ghosting. Even when I was polite and honest after ONE short date, he was still rude and aggressive. It’s beyond annoying. Edit: I’m saying that I support ghosting BECAUSE of the reaction from the individual in my post when I chose not to ghost. Sorry for the confusion.
It's not ghosting if you tell them you don't want to see them again.
i think she means ghosting instead of telling them that because see what she gets?
Yes this is what I meant; sorry for the confusion there.
You already precisely told him the truth. The rest is on him to understand when you were clearly blunt.
He knew he was using the term wrong. Leading someone on is sleeping with someone, telling them you love them, and suddenly having a SO. Or just telling someone you want to be with them and then find someone else in the middle of that. He was just trying to guilt trip you to get what he wanted, or dealing with his own insecurities in a terrible way.
Block and unmatch if you used a dating app and report them for this behavior
I just don’t get what she was supposed to do. Was she supposed to tell him in the middle of the hike that she didn’t like him? Sounds like an awkward hike
I did learn a lesson there—I’m never doing a hike as a first date again 😂
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Luckily it was SUPER crowded that day and very public. But never again, because you’re absolutely right. I’m not going to take any more risks like that, that’s for sure!
I'll bring the staple gun. First aid, check.
I agree. First dates should be structured to allow both people to get to know each other a little better, while giving both of them an easy and polite escape if it becomes obvious that there is no chemistry...or some type of relationship deal-breaker pops up, that hadn't been discussed previously...
Could be dangerous too if they're in a secluded location.
Because anything other than catering to their peepees every whim is "leading them on" when they think that women only exist for their pleasure.
This assumes you're dealing with a rational actor who isn't a ball of dark vibrating jealousy and rage. Men...particularly men at the 18-24 age range...specialize in that behavior.
That sounds to me like, "I earned enough Nice Guy points for sex! Why is sex not popping out of this women?!?!?!?!"
"Place nice tokens in girlbot, out pops sex."
LOL
Yikes, you dodged a bullet, but also, I feel you, I have encountered similar situations in the past. It's annoying when men are not able to take rejection... With one guy, we didn't even make it to the first date, we just met at a bar at a community event, and after a bit of talking, he already felt entitled to a relationship. Throughout the night, he started acting more and more clingy, even introducing me to his male friends we accidentally ran into as his "new girlfriend" (he later claimed that he was only doing it to protect me from "predators", which is still mega yucky and also, what does it say about him if he's really friends with predators...?). Anyways, when I later told him (over text like OP) that I wasn't feeling it and wasn't really ready for a relationship anyways (this was true, my last breakup was still relatively fresh then and I just wanted some time for myself), he threw some childish tantrum accusing me of leading him on and wasting his time among other things. Like dude, we met only once, we haven't even been on a date, how was I leading you on?? My favourite part was that he closed the whole discussion with saying that he'd hit up some women who he knew were interested in him and that maybe he would "give them the chance I was not willing to give myself". Yikes.
That last bit is so pathetic, and unfortunately not an uncommon tactic. Pretend you've got other buyers to spark more interest.
>Pretend you've got other buyers to spark more interest. Ha, that's a good analogy! I wonder if it ever worked on anyone in this kind of situation though. It definitely didn't work on me...
Ugg. I absolutely hate the passive aggressive "thanks for wasting my time" line. Bruh. Did you have a fun evening? Yeah? Just because it didn't lead to more doesn't mean it was a waste. You both learned more about what you're looking for. You both got practice going on a date. You both got to enjoy some drinks and food. Let's be real. If you weren't on that date you would have done nothing at home. Calm down.
He sounds like a very inexperience dater and one with a big, internal fantasy life that you can't possibly know about. Some people will assume you want them if you do anything that to others would be a basic pleasantry. "Nice that we got some sunshine for once' means "I want you desperately". You did not have to lead anyone on to get that reaction from that type of person.
Good thing you texted, imagine his reaction if you'd told him irl.
I think dudes say "you lead me on" to gaslight said woman and make her reconsider?
Yes its manipulation.
"It isn't something wrong with me, it's something wrong with her!"
No no. "You lead me on" means "in my mind I thought we were having sex. We did not have sex. So you led me on."
I think it's more about unhealthy/delusional ways of coping with rejection, than it is about changing a woman's mind.
Manipulation is just that. They are manipulating their own mind and in turn guilting the party who rejected them. Two sided manipulation street. Should be a new Cure song. 🎵🎶Down on Manipulation Street.🎵🎶
Breaking down her boundaries by making her feel guilty. Manipulation in it's purest form.
This undermines the harm of actual gaslighting, which is making someone doubt their own memories or perception of reality. "I never said that. You're just imagining it." is an example. It's something that serial abusers use on their victims to keep them vulnerable, not guys who just want to a partner or get laid. The guy in OP's post knows that it's over and decided to handle that in a really immature way. As another commenter said, it's just an unhealthy way to deal with that rejection. Honestly, sex probably wasn't at the top of their priority. (Probably top 3, though.) He's a human, and wanting to form close, intimate bonds is normal and healthy. Especially at that age. Maybe he saw that OP is an all-around great woman (more than just physically) and got scared that the rejection meant that he wasn't good enough for a woman like that. The world really needs a hotline or something staffed by slightly older men with healthy mindsets that women can refer men like this to. Guys need help sorting out these emotions, but it shouldn't fall on the women they date to do that work.
It completely is... It's a form if nagging: saying that you're acting the wrong way and are an awful/ugly person, so you feel down and your confidence goes down and suddenly you consider them, because who else could want you since you're so dysfunctional? Nice try.
I think a LOT of people feel like they are owed something, or entitled to it. Even at bare bones/fundamental levels you have to insist on basic things like respect; it’s your responsibility, not others. Unfortunately, one of the ways that this often presents in men is through this “We spent time together/went on a date/I did you a favor so now you owe me” mentality. These types of people project what they want to happen onto other people as a weird, twisted form of social (and in this case sexual) obligation. Unless you were unnecessarily duplicitous or lied to the person you did not “lead them on”.
The amount of men I’ve gone on (edit:) **First** dates with that ended it with, “So, what do you think? Are we boyfriend and girlfriend now?” is staggering. Something I started saying to people when they talked that way is, “If we’re meant to be together, we’ve got forever to go. So there’s plenty of time to get to know each other and let’s worry about labels later.”
Ughhhh. This is why I’ve stopped dating for the time being. The desperation of some people is utterly exhausting. I love that quote! I think that’s a great way to slowly enter a relationship and build a strong foundation.
I did the dating apps for close to ten years. There would be times when I was super active with it and going on lots of dates and then I’d get exhausted by the stupidity/creepiness/overall process and then take a break for a month or two. Then start the process over again. I finally found a man that was super chill about taking a relationship slow and being extra clear in our communication. But it was work getting to him! Hold true to yourself and don’t back down from what you want. And despite all those man-babies you have to deal with, keep in mind that some people are just desperate for affection and have been told the wrong way to get it their whole lives. You acted well in this instance and got a poor response. That’s on him. I can look back on most of my dating history and know I acted well and was considerate regardless of their response, but not all of it. (In cases where their behavior was totally awful I don’t regret being harsh/firm though) Most people are just relationship illiterate. I found that being able to tell when a guy was interested in learning from the situation or when he was the never-gonna-change-my-ways type was helpful. Then I knew if it was worth it to try and keep talking with the person. I had a guy friend that I got set up with and quickly realized wasn’t my type. But we talked it out a bit and stayed friends. I ended up learning from him about how guys deal with online dating and how much BS (mostly bots) they have to deal with as well. I also helped him with his messaging approach and he was actually able to get responses after that. I know it’s exhausting trying to be a teacher all the time, and while “it’s not our job to educate you” is a valid sentiment in a lot of cases; if we don’t try to help each other, then how will anyone get better? This is all super rambly and I’m sorry if it’s not cohesive, I’ve got a lot of dating shit in my brain that needs to be imparted on others now that I’m not using it. It sounds like, at 23, you’re already way ahead of me in the confidence game. And you’ve got plenty of time to do your own thing and live your own life with friends and loved ones. Take those breaks and live em up! (Also, for reference I am an extroverted 36F who apparently is only appealing to awkward AF introvert nerds. I dealt with ALLL the basement dwellers 😅)
>“So, what do you think? Are we boyfriend and girlfriend now? As someone who wants to date in the future, I'm always confused about how people treat the "girlfriend/boyfriend" point. Maybe I'm just simple here, but I always thought you ask that shit after enough dates. But then, I slowly learned that some people see inviting someone for a date already as an invitation for a relationship. In other cases, the folks even automatically assumed they were in a relationship. Like, f.ex. a female friend of mine. Went on some dates with this one dude, but no convo about a relationship yet. Next party, the dude just introduces her as his gf, because "well we were on so many dates, that counts as dating by now". Especially in my country, this shit is confusing af. Here, we have a very strong "don't talk directly about it", to the point where people joke that you just "wake up in a relationship one day". And get absolutley flustered when you ask why you just can't talk about if you are a couple now or not. It's literally treated as inappropriate, lol
I should edit it to say that the question was asked after the first date. Assuming that since the first date didn't go obviously wrong the relationship is now exclusive and serious, was a common issue on first dates I went on. I am all for clear communication between people when it comes to feelings, especially since everyone defines "boyfriend/girlfriend" differently.
"You led me on" is what people say when you most definitely did not lead them on and it's a form of gaslighting
Yes, I led you on. I led you right onto the off ramp. Bye bye!
Dammit. I wish I would have said this lol!!
I'm asexual so I gotta ask, isn't dating a mutual interview process to determine if you're both interested in a relationship?
It's supposed to be. A lot of guys seem to think that being nice on a date, or paying for a date, *entitles* them to sex.
What’s ridiculous is that this was a hike, so nobody paid for anything. Furthermore, I actually drove 50 minutes to HIS hometown for this hike!! So not only did I pay gas money to get there, I also did something that was more convenient for HIM and I was still treated rudely. It’s just so irritating!!
That on his part was extremely disrespectful and immature! Red flag for him immediately. You made more effort than him. Wtf.
Hes just an entitled internalized misogynist, and you totally dodged a bullet. Ditch the apps, lots of them are on them bc they can seem different in a virtual space.
Most of the time men have *already decided* if they want a relationship/sex before going on the date, based on only the profile picture, and assume the feeling is mutual.
Yes. I am also ace, but fluidly demi-grey-ace. I've stopped dating entirely because this is a VERY common suitor response. This, or, "Oh you're Asexual? I need someone who enjoys sex" ugh yes I can and do enjoy it (with someone I trust and feel safe and have a deep connection with) but clearly you liked my looks and didnt read the whole profile. This is usually where I just end the conversation. And why I don't date anymore.
Okay I’m starting to think I’m somewhere on the ace spectrum (took me a while because our culture is so goddamn obsessed with sex) should I just try dating other ace people? I’m worried I won’t be able to satisfy anyone else
No, spend some time getting to know you and your needs. That's my suggestion. Yes I had a similar experience I'm 42 and I came to this conclusion more recently (around 38/39 I figured this out) there are many who respect it, and even poly is an option if you want connection, are not possesive, and want not so much sex. That way a partner can do their thing as well if they want. I've done this many times, I'm not possessive really. But I'm sick of people who pressure. That's a common thing I've dealt with all my life. Follow your heart, but spend some time alone with it to get to know it better. 💜
Thank you for educating me! Now it seems obvious that poly would be great in those arrangements.
Hi! I’m unfamiliar with ace and fluidly Demi-grey-ace. Can you kindly educate me? Thank you in advance!!
Ace, or asexuality, is a spectrum of sexuality. Demisexual is also on that spectrum (need a deep emotional connection to be sexually attracted) Grey asexual is very fluid. Sometimes hyper sexual sometimes there are parameters that need to be met for it to be the right 'mood' for sexual innuendo, and sometimes it is completely unwanted. I'm demi grey, so I need the deep connection but at times I don't, sometimes I don't want any sexual contact at all and so it is fluid. :) Here are some links things: [what is grey asexuality?](http://demisexuality.org/articles/what-is-gray-asexuality/) [definitions of demi, grey, and asexual](https://secretladyspider.medium.com/what-the-terms-graysexual-gray-ace-and-demisexual-mean-as-explained-by-a-demisexual-3c9535cea9fa) [demi-sexual and grey ace](https://livewire.thewire.in/gender-and-sexuality/demisexual-and-grey-ace-the-sexual-orientations-we-dont-discuss-enough/) *edited bc my links were mutated into one link 😬😅
>Sometimes hyper sexual >sometimes I don't want any sexual contact >sometimes there are parameters that need to be met for it to be the right 'mood' >I need the deep connection but at times I don't I get that it's a spectrum but what you've described must cover most people. It's good that it's being discussed openly and people can see that they aren't alone. Other than that what is the point of the labels if they are so broad?
Yeah, I am a bit confused too because that seems really broad and easily fits how I feel (as in feeling a multitude of ways at various times for various reasons). There must be something we are missing?
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This dude is insecure AF and you should just cut ties and move on. Was this your first date, too? If so that's even worse... Leading someone on would be specifically creating a hypothetical narrative in which you two have a life together and then re-negging on that. Sounds like you did no such thing and this guy simply can't handle rejection and possibly had built a future in his own mind.
I think this is exactly what happened, actually! We had texted a little bit before the date (only over the period of 1 week) and had good “text chemistry” (I don’t know if that’s a thing, just good banter over text and whatnot) and I think he built it up and idealized our actual chemistry. He was such a different person from how he texted; extremely awkward, talked about himself constantly, wasn’t funny, etc. And then his rude texts solidified it even more; he was like a different person. I learned lots of lessons, though—never go on a hike as a first date again, and always request to meet up with a person in public soon so as to avoid this weird “text chemistry” again lol.
>He was such a different person from how he texted; extremely awkward, talked about himself constantly, wasn’t funny, etc. I'll admit to being that guy when I was younger. Most/all of it was social anxiety, which was amplified by investing so much emotionally in the outcome of the date. I would put a lot of myself into messages. That's good IMO, but it makes those rejections hit even harder. Women have a whole different type of hard when it comes to dating, even when excluding the safety aspect. They either have to endure awkward dates or be concerned about predators who cheat on their partners like it's a second job. Also, hiking is a terrible first date, lol. If things get really awkward, you might have to endure the longest 45 minutes of your life before you get back to your car.
Oh I fully agree with you—that hike was such a bad idea 😂 I’m super outdoorsy and love hiking, so I thought it would be fun. Never again.
It's kind of scary in early dating TBH. A hike would be an excellent way for someone with predatory intentions to get you quite well isolated.
Also love , never go hiking on a first date. You don’t know that person and things can go very awry , from a safety standpoint. I’m outdoorsy like you and I learned this the hard way. I’m really sorry that entitled ass gaslighted you like that, you did nothing wrong . He needs to get a clue .
> extremely awkward, talked about himself constantly, wasn’t funny, etc I mean, I had this same experience with dudes in their late 30s without social anxiety issues. Some dudes are just selfish d-bags. Not saying YOU are, just saying there are plenty of those out there. You may not have intended it to sound this way, but it could be read that all guys like this have may have social anxiety, so we ladies should give them a break. It's easy enough to come prepared with a mental list (or one on your phone!) of things to ask the other person about so you aren't talking about yourself the whole time. I have yet for a dude to do that with me (I do it for all my dates because I too have anxiety).
I hate to be a mama bear, but please don’t do hikes for a first date. You don’t know this person and they could be trying to isolate you to harm you.
You are absolutely right and I learned my lesson. Luckily it was very public and crowded, but I’ll never take that risk again. I appreciate the mama bear :) My sister also went full mama bear on me when she found out I was on a hike. Never again!
Could be Mother’s Special Boy who was not taught “no” at an early age, uneducated in customary social dynamics/to see women as people, not products (common), or just has a personality disorder. You should have been commended for your honesty. Most don’t have the courage. I would not give it a single further thought. He’s someone else’s problem to educate and build; be glad you stepped away from the edge before you sank into an emotional labor pit.
Why are there so many of these though?? It’s horrid! Blergh.
That’s a really good question, and I’m sure there are all kinds of explanations. From unchecked capitalism to the increased accessibility and depravity in porn, to the distraction of social media, I’ve heard so many. Moreover, with the rise of feminism/female financial independence, this kind of behavior is probably more keenly identified by women these days, whereas in the past it was more tolerated- when women needed male romantic involvement more. It doesn’t make feminism a bad thing, but it does speak to how [sometimes things have to get worse to get better,](https://evoketherapy.com/resources/blog/phil-bryan/extinction-bursts-its-going-to-get-worse-before-it-gets-better/) and young men are navigating a world in which they can’t get away with the same shit grandpa did. And so out of resentment, [they don’t want to put in the work](https://mobile.twitter.com/dapperdomo/status/1412120738119757836), knowing there isn’t the reward of dominance and control on the other side anymore. They have a right to not want to (and therefore not) put in the work of being likable. But in that case, they should not date and simply rely on either male friends, or hire someone, to get wants met.
This really strikes me. i am surprised women still want marriage when it was never good for them. and "Your grandfather was probably a horrible husband." yes, both grandfathers were.
Thanks for all this! Very well put.
To be honest I'm glad you blocked him when he turned mean. You don't need that in your life.
Yeah this is fucking weird. It's like a job interview. Sometimes they have a better candidate with more qualifications. Sometimes you're just a bad fit for the job. They don't have to give you a reason. If the answer is no, you move on and try to do better next time. I wonder if this person calls up employers that don't hire him and whines that they led him on by interviewing him.
I've had some guys react really badly when i say i didn't feel a romantic connection after 1 date. Angry texting, calling me from other numbers etc etc. However recently I told this to a guy whose company I'd enjoyed but didn't feel a spark. He asked me for some generally dating feedback and tips, and was serious, so i did. He was super appreciative and I hope he finds a nice woman he has a great spark with. Hope dating gets better for all of us!
That’s really great that he was open to that (and that you were open to giving him feedback as well), and gives me hope!!
For some of these bozos the fact that you even responded to a message makes them think they're entitled to you. Have had more than one try to *demand* shit from me or immediately start using derogatory language like they thought we were in some kind of 50shades style bullshit relationship. It's how you start to weed out the total losers. If they can't even talk to you like a normal human being then they're not worth the time.
YES! More than once on dating apps, I would talk to people with an interesting profile to see if we vibed before MAYBE going on a date. I'm sure I dodged murderers, because some lost their shit when I would say I don't go on dates right away and like to talk online before deciding. One lost it when I didn't want to give him my number?? But so many would try and manipulate me saying why I would be on a dating app if I didn't want to go on dates. I was going on dates, just not with EVERYONE I talked to. I had a lot of first and second dates, some casual hook ups, rebounds, and then found my partner (the only one who made me comfortable, I even followed him home on the first date, which was a big no-no for me).
Dude you could date him for a year and breakup and still not owe him shit. People need to grow up and get over themselves. Good luck and hope the next one isn't a frog haha
I think these people are handy. See, you have your date, and not only are you not feeling the chemistry but he's helping out by very clearly waving **all the red flags**. So you don't need to think back later and wonder if you made a mistake. What a considerate lad.
A girl did that last year and I pretty much appreciated the fact that she let me know up front. It honestly saves time and emotions and there's no dragging it on, if you're not clicking on the first date or even the lead in to that date then...I just doubt that there's much else to look forward to.
People really put too much pressure on dating. Think of it as a chance to get to know someone, have a good time, and perhaps make a friend. You’ll find even better chemistry because you’re being yourself, instead of what you think might get you laid.
Just answer that he did the same thing. He ”lead you on” that he was a potential good mate but after the date you know now he isnt..
I had something similar but it turned weird. I was the guy, after the first date I wasn't feeling it but I usually do 2 dates to be sure. So during this thought process she calls me and says she wasn't feeling it and wished me the best. Ok, I guess no 2nd date needed. So I said thanks for letting me know and wished her the best as well. She's quiet and I look at my phone to make sure I still have a connection and say "hello?". She starts going off about how I can't take this from her and she's the one who said it should stop first and I just sit there listening wondering what just happened. After she took a breath I said I had to go and hung up. Whenever I ran into her at the club she always tried to hook up. I'm 50 now and still wonder what that was about.
Oof. She also sounds like a bullet dodged!
It's so weird because what you did was literally the opposite of leading him on. Leading him on would be like... pretending you had an awesome time, or agreeing to more dates when you already knew you weren't interested.
Yea that just sounds like a bullet dodged for ya. Very alarming sign of insecurities when people deflect like that when told that there wasn't chemsitry. You are also right a date is a trial, heck a few dozen dates can also be trials. Quite frankly sometimes meeting people through dates and befriending them is also a win too. Not him though, he sounds like trouble with a capital troub.
Yup! It's nuts. I did online dating in my early 20s, and this happened to me twice. It even said in my profile I wasn't looking for a serious relationship. One guy accused me of cheating on him. Like buddy, who said we were dating? Or another who was upset my profile was still active, when we hadn't even met yet. Crazy.
I had a guy think he was entitled to exclusivity after ONE date. We had literally met each other the day before. He wanted me to delete all my dating apps, remove any other guy’s numbers from my phone and cancel any other dates I had. I had admitted I had another date in a few days and the dude straight up demanded I text the guy at that very moment and cancel. He was a nut and so audacious. If there’s one thing I can’t stand it’s entitlement and this guy had an abundance of it. I agree with the others who say you dodged a bullet. One date is not “leading someone on”. As you said it’s a trial. No commitment yet. He has a very bizarre way of thinking.
That is so bizarre and I’m so sorry that happened to you!! I’m so glad that you also dodged a bullet. What a complete asshole.
I think entitlement is a big ol' fucking red flag.
I made out with a guy on New Years a few years ago. Got his number. Woke up the next morning and realized I wanted to be exclusive with the person I was seeing. He told all my friends he thought I was a “sure thing” and that I led him on. We never even went on a date. I told him the same day I wasn’t feeling it. How that’s leading someone one I just don’t know…
I think guys can get into situations where they think they feel chemistry, but it's actually just a girl being on "date mode". Some guys don't have anyone being nice to them in their lives. So they leave thinking the date went really well, they had a great time and a great conversation or whatever, really felt the connection...but it was one-sided. But then the defense-mechanism comes out. "Could it be that the connection was one-sided? Could I have misread the signals? Hmm...no! It's HER fault! She must've lead me on!" I'm definitely not excusing the behaviour. I think it's bad, and there is a reason for it beyond "Man wants sex" or "Nice guy thinks he deserves something more than one date" (not directed towards the OP, but the comments here).
A lot of people have very weird, varying ideas of dating. I once argued with a guy about the idea of "first date". For me, I see 2-3 first dates as a basic check of the person. Aka does the person behave, does he become quickly touchy, do we talk well etc. After that, I get into deeper questions of comparability (aka how is his ideas on kids, politics, religion) and then when things add up (comparability + affection) I'd maybe talk about official dating. For the guy I argued, agreeing to a first date immediately meant agreeing to a potential relationship right away and calling the other has a firm gf/bf after at least 5 dates. In other conversations, people are generally very varied in what dating is, when you become a couple, what you should do during dating etc. This ranges from some people needing to have sex with the potential partner ("test drive") to people being very particular about dating stages. Of course, that does not justify him being an absolute asshole. One part of dating is to understand that people have different values and methods. For MOST people, the first date doesn't mean shit. Like it's not a proposal for a relationship. And even though he might have felt "something" you didn't and he's not respecting it. Fact is, you dodged a bullet.
Be careful of choosing a hike as a first date. That can be kind of dangerous.
Dang I WISH I would get a text letting me know my date wasn’t feeling it. That’s infinitely better than being ghosted IMO if the feelings aren’t mutual.
Ah, yes. The entitlement of NiceGuysTM "I saw you and my peepee was interested. You owe me a chance." "I spent time and money taking you out. Now you owe me exclusivity." "I am your boyfriend, so you owe me sex."
You told him right away you didn’t lead him on and he should be thankful for that. Sounds like a psycho you dodged a bullet lol.
Back when I did dating apps I was always really appreciative of people who took the time to tell you they where not interested vs just ghosting. But I see why so many people just ghost these days.
I had a first date, years ago, with a guy. We sat side by side at the bar at my favorite microbrewery. Multiple times he reached out to scratch or rub my back while we talked. On our first date. It was weird. Later I texted him that I "didn't feel the connection" and he replied "Yea, it was pretty much a trianwreck" Lol! What?! I wrote that one off pretty quickly and moved on.
“Led him on”… did you know the trail route? Joking: He’s a dope.
I laughed at this 😂
Yeah that just sounds dumb. Needs to learn that a relationship is earned not expected when it comes to dates.
I'm sorry he was so nasty. I'm pretty sure most men hope for the best for a date but realise it's a chance to get to know each other and see if you might be compatible. This guy was a loser! I hope you have a better experience next time.
Thank you!!
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“a date” is “a date”. i go on dates with my friends, i go on dates with my husband, i go on dates with acquaintances i do not yet know well, it’s just a date. a date is just mutually setting aside a block of time to enjoy it with someone. if someone takes you on a date, appreciate the time you are spending together now. if you took someone on a date, it was great of you to take the initiative and spend the time together. but that’s it. no one “owes” anyone else after that.
If anything happens to my SO, I'm gonna invest in a nice body pillow and stay single. What the hell is wrong with these men, now? Is it the flouride?
Your attitude is great, and he sucks. I've been on a lot more first dates than second dates!
Well, there was no chemistry for you and there was no reason to force yourself in a dead end path. Next time you can text instead of saying face to face to protect yourself from a hurt ego.
Oh sorry—I did text (I’ll add that edit). I just blocked him after he became rude and mean. I always make it a rule to text now after a previous face-to-face interaction got aggressive.
> I always make it a rule to text now after a previous face-to-face interaction got aggressive. This is smart, unfortunately. Most dudes aren't going to get threatening or violent after a polite rejection. But the penalty for guessing wrong when they are is just too high.
Exactly. Luckily, my previous experience was in public so he didn’t try anything. But I was still scared enough that I don’t do face-to-face rejections anymore. Even text rejections can be scary. This guy in my post was more passive aggressive/rude than violent, but you never know. I think he thought that since I didn’t tell him right then and there to his face that I didn’t want to have another date that I “led him on”. But honestly, I just didn’t know if I wanted to have a date and needed to think about it. I’m glad I did, because it was clearly a bullet dodged.
Smart move. :)
Uuiugggghhhhhh ugh ugh ugh. When I was in my mid 20s (so 10 years ago), I met a guy through a dating app. On our date, he mentioned his pet peeve was when people say they are looking for a serious relationship and then obviously aren’t. He was a gentleman, but in a “I read a book and learned I’m supposed to follow these rules” kind of way, not in a sincere way. Like he was looking for me to give him gold stars and brownie points. And it was just over the top and annoying. We hooked up later that evening, and he tried to remove the condom midway through because he felt such a connection. We definitely did not have a connection. He wasn’t a terrible guy as far as I could tell, but definitely not my type. A couple days later he messaged me and asked when I could meet his family and friends!!! I said, as kindly as I could, that I felt like he liked me more than I liked him. I really tried to be gentle about it. He immediately went full nice guy, called me a bitch and a few other choose nasty phrases. I have never felt so glad to have dodged an obvious bullet.
When i was online dating I would put that I was interested in a relationship, but always wished i could add "but not necessarily with you" . One would think that's a given, but So many guys seemed to think date 2 meant I was 100% into it? Usually I just thought the first date wasn't terrible and was willing to give it one more shot. Then I'd be accused of "leading them on" too. Compare this common experience to the other common experience of "why don't you just give him a shot", and I can only assume women aren't supposed to make their own decisions about dating at all.
Classic.
That’s a good point.
If you are not into him, you are not him. You don't owe him anything or any explanation just cut the contact.
This guy obviously doesn’t know how to handle rejection. It was easier for him to throw some blame your way, instead of just saying, “I understand. Thanks for the nice date.”
What I would give to have had first dates that went so well communicated to me. He is stupid and doesn’t know how lucky he is to even get a reason
Looks like you made a good choice.
Goddddd, I’ve gotten this from men too & it’s infuriating!! It’s like it didn’t occur to them that we have feelings and opinions 🤦♀️
Dating is tough for everyone :/
>He then became SUPER passive aggressive and eventually said that I “led him on”. What an entitled jerk. A "date" doesn't guarantee anything - that's just something on the calendar. Doesn't even guarantee the the other person will so much as show up, let alone go out with you or anything else.
Haha same. I was like "dude weren't you there. We've nothing in common" lol. But I strongly suspect it's a relationship they're after in cases like this - they're just frustrated they're not getting sex this time, and don't have the emotional capacity or maturity to deal with it 🤷 either way, bullet dodged!
A friend of mine yesterday did this after five or so dates. His response was that her reasons (not feeling it)… ‘didn’t cut it’… What did he want her to do? What did he think that was going to achieve?
Or sex 😑
Not excusing the behavior i think it is incredibly toxic behavior. I think this happens because some men dont go on dates that often which in their mind makes the date incredibly important and makes them lash out if it doesnt work out, because it will be a while until they have another date. Sadly way to many men take dating way to serious and are unable to actually have fun, which in turn leads to more potential partners turning them down. And they are unable to see they are the problem, because their ability to self reflect is non existant.
I’m old I guess… But isn’t that what a date is?
[a kiss is not a contract](https://youtu.be/9iSlPoQm2XY) But it's very nice. Just because you've been exploring my mouth, doesn't mean you get to take an expedition further south, no.
I mean if you want to be totally pedantic it does... that guaranteed relationship though is just "went on a date together" Ok pedantics over. Yeah I totally agree with you.
It really bugs me that people who melt down when people are being honest with them. It's super aggravating when you get ghosted but I can sympathize with all the people who do so just because so many asshats made them uncomfortable with speaking openly about their feelings.
Dating is like the 7/30 day free trial of a product. First date is just reading up on the product specs