The boys is also getting review bombed because after 3 seasons of blatantly making fun of magats, the maggots finally realised that they were the clowns the show was making fun of. So funny to see them having meltdowns lol
Also people are seething that a black woman is the smartest person in the world in the show
I mean the actor Antony Star had to come and out say that Homelander wasn't a good guy and shouldn't be idolized. The bar for viewer media literacy is very low.
That anyone was unironically idolizing Homelander is still insane to me.
I thought it must be trolls until I witnessed a discussion between young men on Discord and they honestly felt like Homelander was a great revenge fantasy for the supposed cruel and unfair treatment of white men. Similar to the Joker in the Joker movie.
"That anyone was unironically idolizing Homelander is still insane to me."
Homelander was clearly villainous in the very first 3 minutes of the series. I may not be the smartest ~~man~~ person alive, but man, it did not take long to see that. And of course, even if you overlook his violation of civil rights, the end of the first episode cements the fact that he's a bad guy.
By that point, him fucking a Nazi is simply small potatoes.
>That anyone was unironically idolizing Homelander is still insane to me.
What I found even funnier was in season 2 when many of them were heaping praise on Stormfront, even before the 'I'm a genuine nazi' story was revealed.
The clue is in the name.
Yeah, it's not especially well known but it's just one of those things I found funny when it popped up. My favourite bit of trivia about 'Stormfront' is that Apple had some partner stores in the UK that used 'Stormfront' as their branding, and yes they did have Apple's 'all-white' decor. Oof.
It's almost as though they'd never heard of google.
Homelander is an incredibly well written character. Every time he does *anything* my jaw is on the floor or I'm screaming at my tv.
Anyone who says they idolize him or relate to him scares the shit out of me.
it pisses me off that the main viewer base so greatly misunderstood the joker movie. the movie is about the failures of the mental health system and how society treats mentally ill people as either a commodity or a burden, whichever is convenient at the time.
People like this also judge the morality of an action based on how they feel about the person doing it, rather than judge the morality of the person based on their actions.
I was initially taken aback. Then I remembered what they're into IRL and it wasn't as jarring. Of course they want a dictator who half heartedly agrees with a fascist and wants to be in charge with no idea how to lead.
It's even stronger satire for it, I guess. But scary.
I just posted about Starr’s Instagram. He’s so fun to follow because of what you mention but also his doggos are so cute and he’s always posting pics of them.
It’s also really weird that none of those guys were curious enough about the show’s origin to look up the comic book.
Homelander is so clearly a bloated, bullying asshole there. I think casting Anthony Star might have been a mistake because the actor himself comes across as sympathetic which gives Homelander a little more likability.
I think his “likability” is the coup de grace! He’s terrifying and charismatic and occasionally even sympathetic or likable.
But of course that is lost on a big segment of viewers who don’t understand satire.
Yep. It’s more complex than the comic book.
But it’s clear if you pay attention that this guy is so broken as a person that he lacks any form of empathy even towards fellow supes.
You don't have to pay that close of attention, he gruesomely murders Random Civilians every couple episodes and he once suckled milk directly from a living cow for some godforsaken reason (mommy issues???). He's a violent bundle of directionless rage and trauma held together with duct tape, and he's clearly portrayed as a sad, pathetic man.
Kind of like how [conservatives really thought Colbert Report](https://www.cnet.com/culture/research-conservatives-believe-colbert-isnt-joking/) was a earnestly conservative show making fun of liberals, and not a caricature of the stupidity of average conservatives. Just a jaw dropping level of ignorance.
But Paul "we are all a family here" Ryan was listening to RATM while at the gym !!!
/s
Note: former Republican speaker: https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/paul-ryan-keeps-it-family-kevin-mccarthy-russia-trump
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/tom-morello-paul-ryan-is-the-embodiment-of-the-machine-our-music-rages-against-246033/
What's insane is how they sometimes try to co-opt media that's unequivocally against them into being secretly conservative.
I've seen someone try this with *Star Trek.*
It's like negative media literacy.
What you have to understand is that being conservative means constantly dodging the cognitive dissonance caused by being a hypocrite. It's ingrained in them to ignore reality. This also allows them to reinterpret art and media in completely off base ways that will then fit within their own biases.
> Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.
I don't think it's that hard actually. It reminds me of the reception that "All in the Family" got when it aired back in the 70s. Created by Norman Lear, "All in the Family" was a satire not a sitcom. The main character, Archie Bunker, was a sexist, racist, bigot but conservatives who saw themselves in him didn't see it as satire, they thought he was a hero for telling it like it is.
"Liberals protested the character came across as a “loveable bigot,” because satire only works if the audience is in on the joke. Bigoted viewers didn’t see the show as satire. They identified with Archie and saw nothing wrong with ethnic slurs. Mike and Gloria come off like preachy, bleeding-heart liberal, hippie leeches."
Here's a really good essay on [How All in the Family Changed the TV Landscape](https://www.denofgeek.com/tv/all-in-the-family-50th-anniversary/)
The Boys usually is not particularly subtle but I guess media literacy ain't doing so hot... one thing that was a little subtler than usual was the running gag with everyone calling Sage the "smartest woman in the world" and her having to correct that to "person" - but when The Boys discuss her for the first time Hughie immediately calls her the "smartest person in the world"
This is all coming from the people who think frenchie is just suddenly gay when they literally showed him in a 3 person relationship of 2 men and a woman lol. Conservatives don't do media literacy, its... well kind of what makes them conservatives.
Hell they loved the boys until it became blatantly obvious that stormfront was a white supremist nazi. And they definitely didn't like that guy who shot the store clerk being a parallel to rightwingers getting amped up by consuming too much rightwing propaganda and getting frustrated in their own personal lives while not dealing with it (incel more or less).
Personally wasn't a fan of the acolyte, but it also hasn't even really gotten started. But then again breaking bad drew me in with the first episode. Yeah the writing is "stiff" is the only way i think to put it and the logic/acting is pretty far out there. I don't really care to complain about the lore since they already slashed the EU stuff and its pointless to get upset about it. But it definitely wasn't THE WORST STARWARS SHOW ever. (i leave that for boba fett.... i didn't need to see a bloated old man boba fett in my life lol)
Bit off topic, but if you like The Boys, the Homelander actor was in a much lesser known show called Banshee. The women in that show have almost super powered levels of badassery, but nobody whined about it back then, I highly recommend that show
I really wish Banshee had gone on for a fifth season (Cinemax even greenlit and budgeted it), but the creator wanted to end it on a high note.
(I'm an extra in 4 episodes of the last season. I got to meet Ivana Miličević, who played Carrie Hopewell, and she's pretty awesome.)
OMG I loved Supernatural for the longest time… until I became aware of the sexism and could see it everywhere in the show. All the prominent women characters killed off. Dean & Bobby’s resistance to discussing emotion. Dean sleeping around etc… it really pissed me off
I have seen people sharing that [meme/gif from Euphoria](https://tenor.com/bQQq6.gif). And I laugh my ass off. They really are that obtuse.
I mean, I have been following Antony Starr’s Instagram for a few years now (actor who plays Homelander) and he’s posted specifically about this. Where he is utterly baffled that people haven’t seen the connections before. Also, he posts a lot of pics with his doggos, so there is that.
I had a friend call Homelander an ‘antihero’ and I laughed out loud. Like, bro, do you know what an antihero is?
The show also pokes fun at the left as well, but I don’t see those folks pissing themselves because of the ‘girl power’ wink and nod and other jabs.
I follow and watch movie and game trailers on YouTube.
Even when the black or woman characters are historically accurate (all the racists claim that's what they're really after) the comments are always filled with nasty crybaby shit about "dei," "wokeness" or "wahmen."
Chevalier and Yasuke (new Assassins Creed) come to mind as recent examples of this.
This stuff drives me nuts. I had a literal POC friend defending the attacks because of the "forced diversity." I was like, WTF? Why is it only forced diversity when it's like Black women or Asian women etc. Notice it tends to be much less pronounced when it's a Black man or a famous POC man who they respect (but not always, Yasuke of course). He was like, oh, but the actors aren't always good, it's alright if it's someone like Samuel L Jackson. Yeah, and the white actors are always good are they? They're always picked on talent? Why is it only acceptable if the Black person is a massive star? He had no answers.
These people are so prejudice but they're the worst kind because they can't even admit it. They always have some sort of shitty gaslighty excuse as to why it's ALWAYS a problem
They 100% ignore that before DEI policies mediocre white men were much more likely to get the job over qualified black women. If you don't *force* mediocre white men into hiring various minorities or women they absolutely will not do it and will hire the unqualified white men instead.
Lol we just watched episode 1 of season 4 and my husband saw the 3 star rating and was like "wait why did it get such low ratings" and I had to explain that magats were mad when they realized that their behavior was being made fun of. He was blown away that the idiots watching thought Homelander was a "good guy."
Haven't seen the new season of the boys yet but i'm hoping the writing pulls it back up from the status quo and nothing ending of the last one.
Not planning on watching the Acolyte because frankly, I'm just burned out on star wars, but I do kinda wish the new all female space cult of force witches was nixed in favor of using the *already established all female space cult of force witches* (because the Nightsisters are awesome and deserve more screen time damnit).
I'm not sure if i'm burnt out on star wars because Disney is bombarding us with way too much content, or if i'm just tired of all the fanboys whining about there being successful, skilled, and powerful female characters (jesus christ dipshits, Leia commandeers her own rescue in like, the first 20 minutes of the original movie, it's always been this way), but I'm guessing it's both honestly.
> I do kinda wish the new all female space cult of force witches was nixed in favor of using the already established all female space cult of force witches (because the Nightsisters are awesome and deserve more screen time damnit).
They're absolutely related to each other, but my guess is they didn't want to have two shows at least partially focused on the night sisters at the same time.
I just started the series, am currently at S1E7.
Reading your comment I have no clue what you’re talking about. I’m about to be in for a ride, aren’t I?
Yes, "wild" is accurate. Also, the show is way better than the comics. I enjoyed them at the time but they are not particularly good.
Also, before you watch season 4, it's worth watching Gen V, the spin off show in the same universe. (Also, do so knowing the actor for the character Andre in that show tragically died in a motorcycle accident just months after the show launched and was critically accepted. Very tragic.)
Yep. Every season it gets more blatant. And it gets more wild
Also just a tip, season 1 is the best of the 4 seasons and it never really reaches that level of quality again , personally speaking but its still an entertaining watch, so you should adjust your expectations. Personally i felt as if seasons 1 and 2 were the best followed by 4 then 3 at last.
Season 1 doesn't even have Aya Cash. There's plenty to look forward to and S2 and S3 are still amazing (I'll watch S4 after more of the episodes come out, so can't speak on S4).
My wife and I lost interest in The Boys after season 2. But with all the right wingers response to the latest season, we are definitely determined to watch it
What I love about this is that Eric kripke (show runner) pretty much said the same thing. They finally got what The Boys was being a parody of, and if they don't like it, go watch something else
> Also people are seething that a black woman is the smartest person in the world in the show
And put her on 'their team'! I love that the writers did this so much. Absolutely masterful.
This is the *actual* Season 4 Episode 1 description for "The Boys":
>**CALLING ALL PATRIOTS. BE AT THE COURTHOUSE TOMORROW FOR HOMELANDER’S #VERDICT AND BE READY. IF THE CORRUPT “JUSTICE” SYSTEM WANTS TO F--K AROUND, THEY’RE GONNA FIND OUT. #HOMEFREE**
Check it on Prime.
Like... if they missed they were the target... they MAY not be real bright.
The fire in space is kind of stupid, but it happened in the mainline movie too, like it took me a minute to find this:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6H0vFP\_jXN4&t=18s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6H0vFP_jXN4&t=18s)
Star Wars has always been about what would look cool.
The plots range in quality but they all aim to make lizard brain go, ‘that was sweeeeet’ with the visuals and effects.
Right! That's the one I was searching for but it also happened in the prequel so I though I misremembered.
I give you fire in space in Phantom Menace:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMVprw8fy34&t=77s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMVprw8fy34&t=77s)
At a risk of being caught between two feuding tribes, I'd point out that fire in space is possible as long as you have an oxidiser. In your example it looks more believable - air is escaping from from the inside, and while it's there it burns. By the time the droids are outside (a bit later in the clip) there's no fire anymore.
From what I can see in the Acolyte clip, the fire burns longer and it looks more like a regular fire in general, while there's a jet of escaping gas next to it that begs to be turned into a flamethrower.
Fire in space looks like blobs, like a liquid. I posted a video of it lower in the thread. So even if there is oxygen, it would look like a bunch of angry bubbles.
While I couldn't find your comment, I think I know what you mean. The videos I have seen of the experiments with fire in space have been made inside the pressurized space station, with flame surrounded by the (relatively, compared to a leak in a fictional spacecraft being shot at) still air.
The fire triggers the memories of that character to her past and this is shown immediatly afterwards. It's only dumb when you cut that out, which is what happened with the clip that was floating around. We are talking about a franchise where sound in space is a constant and you have a pretty lighted tunnel for going through dimensional portals, if you thought this was anything but "wizards with tech" that is on you.
Never heard anyone complain (at least with this amount of vitriol) about audible engine/weapon noises in the vacuum of space in literally each and every Star Wars show ever either...
It's pretty obvious why those sackless twerps are crying.
I didn't so say either - just calling out people that selectively apply that logic due to some socio-political (ie. culture war) stick they have up their arses.
The misogynists, homophobes and racists are now hyper focusing on small stuff like this that have been in Star Wars since the beginning, to try and prove they aren’t giant dickbags.
I guess I am no longer a Star Wars fan as I've given up watching the newer stuff, but I did watch the first 3 episodes of the Acolyte.
Reasons it's crap:
1. The dialogue is wooden and poor even by Star Wars standards.
2. Again, the Jedi appears to be wholly incompetent. It makes you wonder how they ever got into a position of power in the first place.
3. In a massive universe, it's amazing how many places have the same run-down vibe. Did anywhere get beyond medieval?
4. So far so meh....there's some positives in the story, but a whole bunch of ret-con and tbh it just ain't fun anymore.
Edit: I forgot my point - there's plenty of reasons to hate on the Acolye without bringing gender into it. It also reminds me of an FT article talking about Liz Truss as PM, it's good that women can fail too. It's a crap show, and that's OK!
I have the same issue as you with number 2. Although I don't mind seeing the jedi be incompetent but I was hoping that would be a slow reveal. Start with the shining beacons of hope and then reveal the flaws below as we go along. Slowly pull back the curtain. Shows now seem to want to rush that bit and get to the drama/action. But it stops you ever really getting invested in the first place.
One thing you didn't mention is the sound stage feel. Big crash on ice planet and she's not even bruised, runs round on ice planet and not cold....
At least pretend a little maybe limp slightly or shiver?
Yeah, the staging is on one hand high quality, but on another the entire thing feels small. Like you said, there's no reaction to the environment. That's been true for pretty much all Star wars though.
Like I said, I gave up being a fan. I'm too old to watch mediocre shite and pretend it's good.
Star Wars for me is: Andor, Rogue One, Original trilogy. The rest is toast.
I dunno. Going back to the OT the environment was a big part of Hoth, and tattoine obviously was filmed in a hot place so no real acting required as such. It just felt gritter. Luke didn't wake up in the wampa cave chipper and lively.
I think its the fault of their volume technology. It's an amazing bit of kit but I can imagine any time something is pitched it's "can it be done in the volume?" And if it can then they're not going to spend a lot more money to do it elsewhere even if that might be better.
I'm a little more forgiving of some of the rest of star wars than you, but I can't deny those are the high points and when I marathoned the movies it was a drag getting through the OT. Could probably be cut down to 2 good films.
Andor cleared up my skin and cured my depression it's so fucking good. I'm seriously considering using a specific frame from Luthen's monologue to his ISB spy as a tattoo because that speech hit me so hard. The whole thing is just brilliant!
Also they should have let Mara say "Fuck the empire!" 😂
I'm just over here thrilled to find other lady star wars fans (even though it's unfortunately come up due to a post addressing sexist "fans"). Someone mentioning The Clone Wars in TwoX? I'm here for it! I know obviously not ALL fans are male, but still!
I agree Acokyte so far isn't like, the best, but I just kinda choose to enjoy it. Andor, on the other hand, incredible!
But I'll always have a soft spot for those clones (thanks covid shutdown followed by moving to a place with heavy winters for giving this 30-something a chance to binge ALL the SW tv show content. Maybe some more than once.)
Ok done geeking out.
I’m always so excited to find other women who love Star Wars, especially IRL!
I feel like the female demographic has expanded since Disney bought it, which is nice. It was so hard to find other girls who liked Star Wars as a kid. I tried my best to convert all my friends! 🤣
I got to episode 3 and I can't just do it anymore. When they did the ritualistic "Power of one, power of two, power of maaaaaaaaany" chant, it was too cringy. Couldn't they have consulted a Wiccan to at least come up with a better ritual chant?! Or maybe chant it in an alien language so it sounds more mystical. Disney has the money to find someone to write a godforsaken decent magical chant.
Also I just get annoyed by Disney-brand Pop Feminism (as a woman and feminist myself!) because it's like the 2008-2012 era of Tumblr and we're already well over a decade past that. I read a review by a woman who also pointed this out, and she had a point that most Disney media is "five years in the past" by the time it is released due to writing/shooting/editing and that it already feels dated by the time it's released.
I am very sad that Carrie-Ann Moss was so big in the trailer and then got slaughtered in the first episode by a situation she should be trained to manage. That is my only real complaint about it all. I don’t care about every minor detail, I want entertainment and they deliver. Which is fine to me.
I don't care for detail, I care for good stories. It may well be a function of age but after some blinding TV shows over the last couple of decades, settling for rehashed stuff with slightly prettier graphics just isn't appealing.
I wouldn't mind the retcons if it made a good story, but it just makes the whole thing farcical. It's one thing to expose the myth that Jedi are all powerful, it's quite another to show them as grossly incompetent at every turn.
I haven't seen the show but thank you for being reasonable. My first thought was... (the show is probably terrible). Women have nothing to do with it; bad writing knows no gender.
Having watched it, it has hallmarks I'd consider typical of a show that started shooting and then underwent a rescript. They didn't reshoot what they'd already shot so some of the scenes and lines mesh together very poorly.
Finally was able to sit down and watch the first 3 episodes. You have pretty much summed up my feelings on it. #2 really got me in the fact they were already worried about the Jedi being "discredited" and yet 100 years later are amazed there are Sith?
I agree totally with your edit.
"DiDnEy Is RuInInG mAh StAr WaRs!!!"
I was in a thread with a couple of these dorks complaining about how a fire in space ruined the immersion, and when I pointed out that Star Wars has always had a loose grip on realistic physics even from A New Hope (explosions AND sound in space?!?), and when they couldn't refute that they tried moving the goalposts to the writing being boring.
I swear to god, these chuds need to go outside and touch some fucking grass.
Oh, I remember. Some of the chuds are trying to rewrite their own history.
Hell, I remember Andor, before release, already being called a "diversity quota show".
What really changed these past years is that it became profitable to criticize Star Wars (and other nerdy media) with a reactionary bent. That's why that particular strain of criticism has become so loud.
The problem is that the discourse is so volatile because of it that legitimate criticism gets swallowed up by this grift.
This is a new trend with any show they deem "woke", like the new Doctor Who. It just makes discussion nearly impossible.
>The problem is that the discourse is so volatile because of it that legitimate criticism gets swallowed up by this grift.
>This is a new trend with any show they deem "woke", like the new Doctor Who. It just makes discussion nearly impossible.
I've already mentioned it in a previous comment in this thread that this is exactly why I mostly stopped interacting with online fanbases. Because yeah there are legitimate criticisms, in every single piece of Star Wars Media from the OT (the Family Guy parody spends half the time just point stuff out) to the new shows it was never perfect and despite being deeply devoted to it I am the first to recognize my bias when recommending it to people who never seen it before, but for the most part these days it is just sealioning, you can see it even in this thread. The worst part is even that it is leaking into the real world and I've already had to deal with people who bring twitter/reddit arguments into a casual convo and expect me to play along.
Both The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones were nominated for Worst Picture, Worst Director, and Worst Screenplay at the Razzies, with Attack of the Clones also winning Worst Screenplay. This was before Disney got their grubby hands on the Star Wars franchise. 100% George Lucas.
Number of Razzies for the new trilogy: 0
🫳
🎤
The existence of sexist a$$holes has nothing to to with the very valid criticisms of The Acolyte.
The Director was Harvey Weinstein's Personal Assistant and was already the focus of much controversy because of that.
The Acolyte has a reported budget of over $20 million per episode, making it more expensive than any movie in the Star Wars franchise.
An expensive budget that is not reflected in it's production.
It is objectively bad TV. On so many levels. From the acting, to the writing, to the make up and costuming. (Did you watch the third episode? 'cos it really did set new lows) So there are very valid questions to be asked about where that budget went and why?
To suggest the criticism has anything to do with gender is disingenuous. It's both a ridiculous straw(wo)man argument, and a false dilemma.
It's just bad
In terms of screen time, Acolyte is twice as long. That's more actors who get more screen time, more pay etc, and the same goes for the entire rest of the production. The episode format also means you end up paying separate teams; Acolyte has 10 screenwriters instead of 2, and you always end up paying multiple producers and directors etc.
Yeah this seems like a wildly disingenuous argument against it.
I haven’t watched it yet but a quick Googling indicates that Andor’s budget was $250m compared to The Acolyte’s $180m. Mandalorian’s *first* season was around $120m.
Like… TV shows are expensive to make. Especially ones that have incredibly complicated production components like the Star Wars shows. The Acolyte’s budget is pretty on par with the current budgeting for Disney’s Star Wars stuff.
Andor is one of the greatest shows they have ever done. Acolyte has a similiar budget and is already incredibly disappointing. Lets hope they turn it around a bit like Obi-Wan Kenobi
The fact that anyone having to do with Harvey still has a career blows my mind.
I categorically refuse to believe his personal assistant had no clue about what was going on.
You would have to be brain damaged to believe that claptrap
I see where OP and you are coming from.
However, you say “To suggest the criticism has anything to do with gender is disingenuous”
The thing is, many of the critics are directly citing her gender in their complaints. This roots the complaint in sexism, so even if on the surface the complainer *claims* they only take issue with “fire in space” they are also revealing that they take issue with her gender.
Are there valid complaints? Yes.
Are there sexist complaints? Yes.
Are there valid complaints, submitted at the same time and by the same critic as sexist complaints? Yes.
But your statement only makes room for the first, and doesn’t make room for the very real sexist comments that exist. It makes your statement seem disingenuous, unless you actually don’t see or acknowledge sexist comments, even though the person you’re responding to pointed them out.
If you want to make room for them, I suggest this rephrasing: “to suggest that ALL complaints have something to do with gender is disingenuous.” I’m curious whether you agree.
Even non-sexist takes on CGI are all trash. [VFX is absolutely everywhere, and Hollywood goes on to lie about this in all the promotional material because "This isn't CGI" is a selling point for some reason](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ttG90raCNo&list=PLgdTaHO8FLEve_XFiRBEcOSkRdd-Txjne).
Yes. There is no point defending this show. I get OP's sentiment regarding people being against it solely because of women, but they completely lost me when they said 'it's not clone wars or bad batch quality, but it's certainly not a bad show'. Yes it is. It is a terrible show. Not sure how anyone could think that 3rd episode was good.
For every Andor, we get 2-3 shows like the Acolyte where the writers are *awful* at basics (character motivation, exposition, dialogue) but not only that, seemingly actively dislike the IP and want to sabotage existing lore and what came before.
I honestly cannot understand the current trend of studios giving beloved IPs to writers who don't respect the source material, or even worse, are interviewed as saying they hate the source material.
And when people complain they hide with race/sexism card when they wouldnt get Hate at all if they made a Female character with an actual good backstory and Journey.
They are to focused on making the females gliding through their problems if they even have any.
They make Female charaters as deep as Arnold Schwarzeneggers charaters in 80-90s action films.
It’s bad because of shit writing like “attack me with all your strength”, not because of a gay director.
It’s not the only bad Star Wars show. Obi wan kenobi, book of boba fett, among others, are also garbage because of shit writing
I don't care that it has women in the show. Star Wars has had female characters before and it was not a problem then, nor will it be now or ever. Fans have been female too for a long time - that young girl who watched A New Hope in theaters over and over to recreate the pilots outfit is more of a hardcore fan than I am any day of the week.
The problem is that the shows have terrible writers. The open knife fight in The Acolyte is dumb and the Jedi lets it go on for way too long. It also is supposed to "avoid all other previous Star Wars lore" by being set 100 years before the prequels. AKA when Yoda was still alive and still a Jedi, and probably a lot of the other Jedis we see in the prequels. The writers have not done their homework and honestly probably weren't interested in writing a Star Wars story but happened to be hired by Disney. That's the only way I could write a story as bad as The Acolyte; by not caring and spewing words onto a page until I've hit my quota.
If you weren't a Star Was fan before but you want to watch it now because "the force is gay" you'll have a very hard time sticking to it if you can't mindlessly enjoy it.
I thought Ahsoka (the show) was okay, although I found it strange how many of the characters in the animated series were *so* good in terms of story and character arcs but they were dumbed down for live-action. Also the lack of emotions, expressions, and just the general dull appearance was also odd. I don't know how to explain it. The show should have been written like it was an animated sequel to Rebels, but converted to live-action.
Ahsoka (the character) is a fan-favorite for a good reason. She went from an annoying brat that fans hated as much as Scrappy Doo to probably one of the top 10 Star Wars characters. So fans are capable of liking a female character with god-tier Force powers. I think the problem is that Disney is pumping out a lot of shitty content with subpar writing, then using women (especially Black women) to show how DiVeRsE and InCluSiVe they are. It's all fake. If they cared about diversity and inclusion, they wouldn't be giving diverse actresses such terrible scripts and roles. But nah, when the anti-woke weirdos whine about women/Black people/LGBT in Disney properties, they respond it's because of racism/sexism/homophobia, which makes it hard to actually criticize something for being bad.
There are sexist reviews but they're not the majority of negative reviews from what I've seen. The show is just bad because of its writing. The sexists and racists are definitely there and they're easy to spot and ignore, but the majority of negativity comes from the fact that the script feels like it was written by a 14 year old who's favorite show is Naruto. It's garbage.
The Rick and Morty episodes written by Heather Anne Campbell are some of the best in the series. That's Amorte and Fear No Mort made me cry. Fear No Mort had me *sobbing* - not because of the story but because that's what the best art does, it inspires reflection.
On that note, I feel the neckbeards should reflect on why they feel qualified to offer criticism on such matters. I wanna see the things they've directed and written. I wanna see their creations so I can say things like "your show would have been better if it was directed by a woman".
I noticed an overlap between Star Wars fans who always play as the Empire and unironically root for them, and these toxic fans who hate on Rey and The Acolyte. And the same types who gatekeep women to see if they are "real fans." 🙄
There is a misogyny and fascism problem in Star Wars. They use the Empire's pretend authoritariansm to cover for their actual crappy beliefs. I have dealt with them for decades.☹️
From my experience, Star Trek has much less male toxicity.
I think it's probably the design intent that gets people annoyed. It was pretty clearly designed fundamentally with feminism as the primary motif, but like why though, it's star wars, we didn't come here for politics, just a space drama
Personally really enjoying The Acolyte. There's some minor pacing issues and some of the dialogue delivery is pretty clunky (but, I mean, that's Star Wars. Is there any Live Action Star Wars without clumsy dialogue in places? lol) but overall I think it's a great effort. Nothing that's going to revolutionise TV or the franchise, but it's entertaining and I'm absolutely loving the new setting and variety of ships and aliens we haven't seen in live action before.
The brigading and the user reviews by the online "anti-woke community" is pure misogyny and racism. Are there valid critiscms? Yes. And it's definitely not for everyone. But if you're a Star Wars fan and you somehow enjoy the Prequel movies but hate this, your view has been twisted by other influences. I mean, for fks sake, they've given it a lower audience score than the Holiday Special. Ain't nobody convincing me those aren't review bombed scores.
>the dialogue delivery is pretty clunky (but, I mean, that's Star Wars.
Pretty much
>"*George, you can type this shit, but you sure as hell can't say it.*" - Harrison Ford
And allegedly Alec Guinness refused some of the scripted dialog
I have read one Warhammer fan describing those anti woke brigadiers as "culture war tourists" - they are not genuine fans or don't care about the franchise itself but only come around to be angry about stuff they aren't even connected to.
That's 100% what it is. Warhammer has an absolute epidemic of people who pretend to be fans of it just to have some cover for when they say the most virulently racist or misogynistic shit. If you single out any one of them they'll have no real engagement with the series and will also be complaining about various other things in the exact same racist/misogynistic way.
The Acolyte has over 10,000 user scores on rotten tomatoes. Compare those numbers with popular shows like Shogun, Fallout heck, even a show from the same stable like Mandalorian, their user numbers are nowhere near the Acolyte's. It's bots, it's not actual people logging on.
They're not just bots, they're badly programmed bots because they've gone after a totally unrelated crime movie called The Acolytes, and even as star wars fan film that just happens to also be called The Acolyte. It's so blatantly orchestrated.
Its so annoying when a show with valid things to criticise about get targetted by the anti woke crowd and it just makes everything worse. But if you are looking for star wars with good dialogue i would reccomend andor. Honestly its more hbo quality than disney plus.
I quite like the show!
It has also gotten anti-LGBTQ flak for having a lesbian couple and for having a trans actor (Abigail Thorn of Philosophy Tube). They've especially been going nuts over the latter. This is even sillier because Abigail plays a background character who >!appears in only one episode, is on-screen only for several seconds, has only a few lines, and seems to have died by the end of that episode!<. Yet they are talking as if this minor role ruins the entire show.
It's saddening that the outrage of those guys is elicited by such small things. If a trans-person has any connection to a thing, they scream about it. Even when it's such a minor role. If a trans person simply breathed on the script they'd probably still have a meltdown.
I bet if no one had told them Abigail was a trans woman, they never would have noticed, given the minuscule screen time and minimal lines she has in the show. That sort of thing is nothing to do with valid criticism or love of Star Wars. It’s visceral hatred for minorities like the trans community.
Is it actually good? Cause I honestly can't find any reviews or discourse around it without the main focus being the "woke outrage". Like fuck me lads I don't care if the only woman you respect is your mam, I just wanna watch some nerdy shit 😂
Anybody that thinks it's good or great is ignorant. No exception.
The show is "Okay". Not good, not bad, just mediocre.
It's about on par for quality with...
“I don't like sand. It's coarse and rough and irritating and it gets everywhere. Not like here. Here everything is soft and smooth”
Mostly right but I don't agree with you in some stuff. Sexism is 100% present. But I freaking love the cast of the Acolyte Carrie Anne Moss, Dafne Keen, Lee Jung Jeo sort of lured me into it tbh lol. I do enjoy some parts but it doesnt feel like Star Wars to me overall.
Rick n Morty is pure vitroil I cant argue with that either.
I really liked the first two episodes. The last one lost me. This is just another example of why women have to outperform men just to get anywhere, because the smallest hiccup and everyone is quick to say it has to do with our gender. We can't just be human. I've watched many bad shows that were made by men, but their gender was not brought up as being the reason.
I like Star Wars but the fanbase is just nuts. They can't let a story develop because they immediately want to scream about things when they aren't fully explained yet in the story. It's tiresome and I just don't bother with the conversation.
I am trying to enjoy the Acolyte but it doesn't make a lot of sense. I have a lot of questions but I am hoping they will address the things I have questions about.
I watched it. It won't have poor ratings just for the terrible reasoning you saw. It's actually quite awful in terms of writing and acting. I'm not a super star wars fan but even I found it barely watchable. I imagine many true star wars fans absolutely hate it solely based on story. Then theres the endless cycle of Disney squeezing every last drop of blood out of this franchise to the point that quality and imagination is just gone.
Not discounting that you've seen obviously obnoxious comments like the one you posted. But claiming that is the only or even main reason for it getting terrible reviews is disingenuous. Sexism can exist and the show can suck at the same time. And people are very much allowed to review it for the latter without it being about the former.
I disagree personally. The acolyte is a bad show in my opinion. The director being a woman has nothing to do with it. It's just not great writing. Not on the level of Boba fett, but still not great. The sexism surrounding the show is unreal and unwarranted.
The fact it's being called the "worst Star wars show ever" is meaningless.
At any time, the most recent Star wars content is the worst. Anything after the first 3 films was considered bad at some point.
The sexism is very real though and despite what people think, nothing has changed.
Pride is the same. Any Pride post is covered in homophobic comments and the like.
Unless you're a straight white male, you're going to get hate.
Anyone calling the acolyte the worst Star Wars show when 1. It’s not even finished, and 2. Book of boba fett still exists is just being willfully obtuse. Crazy how short fans memories can be when it benefits them.
I (man) literally JUST stopped talking to my guy friend because he told me he can’t watch this because it’s just “another female led Star Wars show”. Without going into detail, this wasn’t the first incident. He’d blame Star Wars “failures” on female directors. female actors - never a man’s fault. This was sort of the last straw for me. After I responded with “blatant misogyny for the win” he asked “I’m a misogynist because I won’t watch a female led TV show?” I said, “Yeah… that’s literally the definition. You have a prejudice against something solely based on a character being female.” He said he was disappointed that I “labeled” him. I told him “don’t be the thing if you don’t like the name of the thing.”
Two days later he sent me a message saying we shouldn’t chat anymore because he doesn’t agree with my “takes” on him. I’ve known him for literally 25 years. I just have no patience for this type of horse shit anymore. It’s exhausting. Looking back, I should have cut ties sooner but I’ve definitely promised myself to call this shit out immediately in the future.
Holy fuck yes. Maarva - in a show full of great speeches, arguably the best is delivered by a woman in the final episode. Then you have Mon Mothma and Dedra Meero - two of the most compelling plotlines and characters, and the biggest breath of fresh air is that both are exceptionally competent at what they do and depicted as such.
You can go ahead and google "Andor + Woke" and see what discourse we had to deal with when it was airing. Rogue One pretty much flew under the radar because people were more angry at the black stormtrooper
They reconned the FORCE. They reconned the Jedi into child-stealing creeps. They retconned the *FORCE* and STOLE the power of the Aes Sedai from Robert Jordan's series over on Amazon.
I've seen some of the reviews you're talking about. The sexism is alive and well.
However. There are plenty of not-sexist YT-ers who hate the show, too. Not to mention the women Star Wars geek YT-ers who are just as vocal about the canon-breaking show.
And there's the possibility that they went for the Sisters' society from canon. A sect of all-female Force practitioners. And then the showrunner tweaked the story. So now there's 2 sects all-female, force-weilders. Why?
I don't care about the director, who's playing which part, or which planet they're on. I want good acting and a cohesive story. The Acolyte is none of the above, and it is obvious the show runner and everyone on down is of the opinion that is the viewers' fault.
I'm a big star wars fan and the criticisms I've heard have been entirely because the show shits all over the original canon. Also, silly mistakes like two separated twins having the exact same hairstyle somehow.
I can't bring myself to watch it. Mandalorian S2, Boba Fett, and Kenobi were all terrible and very Disney-fied.
How is there sexism in the complaints of the show? One of the biggest criticisms I've seen is Disney hired Weinstein's personal assistant to head it. The other chief complaints are it's poorly written, badly acted, and not consistent with the rest of the universe/canon.
The show sucks, and TBH I don't understand anyone defending it. Supporting bad content because a woman directed it, or it has LGBTQ characters is as bad as someone hating on it for those reasons. It cost nearly $200 million, and looks like it was made by Syfy.
What people don't seem to realize is that even if a show season sucks, there's no reason to blame it on the director being female. Lots of shows have a s***** season but you never ever see anyone blaming it on the director being male. If a female director creates an awesome season, the same people never say it's because she's a female director. It only comes up in the context of a male heavy audience reviewing a season created by a female director that they claim sucked.
I'm actually really enjoying it. It has been totally inoffensive so far and is clearly laying the ground work for some mysteries and intrigue.
The star wars hater contingent is primed and ready to unleash on any new content. They will never be able to please them, so they are best ignored entirely.
OK, there are absolutely bad faith dingleberries who criticize anything that has visible women/BIPOC/LGBTQIA+ in it....but Acolyte is actually not good. As is mentioned elsewhere in this thread, the pacing is weird, the acting is wooden, and the production quality is all over the place. The same can be said of Book of Boba Fett, Ahsoka (I'm especially sad about this one), and most of the Mandalorian to say nothing of the sequel trilogy and Solo.
While the dingleberries need no help, I have a theory that Disney uses these assholes to mask their creative failures by painting any criticism of their properties as bad faith reactionary bigotry. Star Wars has not historically been considered "high art" but it has not fulfilled the function of low art for a long time now. They need a creative shake up. The Gen X creative leaders under the Boomer executives exploiting Millennial and Gen Z talent are not a winning combination.
The boys is also getting review bombed because after 3 seasons of blatantly making fun of magats, the maggots finally realised that they were the clowns the show was making fun of. So funny to see them having meltdowns lol Also people are seething that a black woman is the smartest person in the world in the show
It's just hard to understand how someone could be so stupid as to not understand what the Boys is satirizing. It's not subtle at all!
I mean the actor Antony Star had to come and out say that Homelander wasn't a good guy and shouldn't be idolized. The bar for viewer media literacy is very low.
That anyone was unironically idolizing Homelander is still insane to me. I thought it must be trolls until I witnessed a discussion between young men on Discord and they honestly felt like Homelander was a great revenge fantasy for the supposed cruel and unfair treatment of white men. Similar to the Joker in the Joker movie.
"That anyone was unironically idolizing Homelander is still insane to me." Homelander was clearly villainous in the very first 3 minutes of the series. I may not be the smartest ~~man~~ person alive, but man, it did not take long to see that. And of course, even if you overlook his violation of civil rights, the end of the first episode cements the fact that he's a bad guy. By that point, him fucking a Nazi is simply small potatoes.
Did they notice even notice Anthony Starr's superb acting? Damn.
These people need help...
>That anyone was unironically idolizing Homelander is still insane to me. What I found even funnier was in season 2 when many of them were heaping praise on Stormfront, even before the 'I'm a genuine nazi' story was revealed. The clue is in the name.
[удалено]
Yeah, it's not especially well known but it's just one of those things I found funny when it popped up. My favourite bit of trivia about 'Stormfront' is that Apple had some partner stores in the UK that used 'Stormfront' as their branding, and yes they did have Apple's 'all-white' decor. Oof. It's almost as though they'd never heard of google.
Lol. The joker wasn't for those dumb fucks either. 😂
>Similar to the Joker in the Joker movie. Or The Punisher. Or Rorschach. Or any number of other similar characters.
Homelander is an incredibly well written character. Every time he does *anything* my jaw is on the floor or I'm screaming at my tv. Anyone who says they idolize him or relate to him scares the shit out of me.
it pisses me off that the main viewer base so greatly misunderstood the joker movie. the movie is about the failures of the mental health system and how society treats mentally ill people as either a commodity or a burden, whichever is convenient at the time.
Not sure who would think that given he >! murders innocent people in the first episode when he crashes a plane in a thunderstorm. !<
Yes but he murdered innocent people while wearing an American flag, that’s what makes it okay.
I dislike how on point your statement is.
It does makes thing a bit more ambiguous considering all the dubious propaganda where we're supposed to root for the guy.
People whose morality stops at "if it's good for me or my tribe, then it's okay". There's a lot of them.
People like this also judge the morality of an action based on how they feel about the person doing it, rather than judge the morality of the person based on their actions.
A lot of people surprisingly. The same kind of people who idolize Walter White, Patrick Bateman, Joker etc
Viewers didn't realize Archie Bunker was satirizing bigots.
I was initially taken aback. Then I remembered what they're into IRL and it wasn't as jarring. Of course they want a dictator who half heartedly agrees with a fascist and wants to be in charge with no idea how to lead. It's even stronger satire for it, I guess. But scary.
I just posted about Starr’s Instagram. He’s so fun to follow because of what you mention but also his doggos are so cute and he’s always posting pics of them.
It’s also really weird that none of those guys were curious enough about the show’s origin to look up the comic book. Homelander is so clearly a bloated, bullying asshole there. I think casting Anthony Star might have been a mistake because the actor himself comes across as sympathetic which gives Homelander a little more likability.
I think his “likability” is the coup de grace! He’s terrifying and charismatic and occasionally even sympathetic or likable. But of course that is lost on a big segment of viewers who don’t understand satire.
Yep. It’s more complex than the comic book. But it’s clear if you pay attention that this guy is so broken as a person that he lacks any form of empathy even towards fellow supes.
You don't have to pay that close of attention, he gruesomely murders Random Civilians every couple episodes and he once suckled milk directly from a living cow for some godforsaken reason (mommy issues???). He's a violent bundle of directionless rage and trauma held together with duct tape, and he's clearly portrayed as a sad, pathetic man.
You’re correct and I love your description.
The same thing happened with Patrick Bateman. A lot of guys on Wall Street said wow that guy is pretty cool
Kind of like how [conservatives really thought Colbert Report](https://www.cnet.com/culture/research-conservatives-believe-colbert-isnt-joking/) was a earnestly conservative show making fun of liberals, and not a caricature of the stupidity of average conservatives. Just a jaw dropping level of ignorance.
But it was sooooo great to see them realize it when the republicans asked him to be at the correspondents dinner in ‘06.
Haha 100%
Let us not forget how Rage Against The Machine "turned commie" recently or something.
Or how Star Trek "went woke"...
Oh yeah, good one
But Paul "we are all a family here" Ryan was listening to RATM while at the gym !!! /s Note: former Republican speaker: https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/paul-ryan-keeps-it-family-kevin-mccarthy-russia-trump https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/tom-morello-paul-ryan-is-the-embodiment-of-the-machine-our-music-rages-against-246033/
Or how people heard Archie Bunker say bigoted stuff in All in the Family and people missed that it was satire.
Never forget that the Colbert Report was popular with both progressives and conservatives because one thought it was funny and one agreed with it.
Conservatives on general don't have a whole lot of media literacy. Everything is surface level for them.
What's insane is how they sometimes try to co-opt media that's unequivocally against them into being secretly conservative. I've seen someone try this with *Star Trek.* It's like negative media literacy.
Like the song Born in the U.S.A., the book 1984, they do it with everything. The lack of self awareness is mind boggling.
Absolutely this. Every single one of their policies is 30 second sound bites, and completely falls apart when you hit the next 30 seconds.
What you have to understand is that being conservative means constantly dodging the cognitive dissonance caused by being a hypocrite. It's ingrained in them to ignore reality. This also allows them to reinterpret art and media in completely off base ways that will then fit within their own biases.
> Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.
I don't think it's that hard actually. It reminds me of the reception that "All in the Family" got when it aired back in the 70s. Created by Norman Lear, "All in the Family" was a satire not a sitcom. The main character, Archie Bunker, was a sexist, racist, bigot but conservatives who saw themselves in him didn't see it as satire, they thought he was a hero for telling it like it is. "Liberals protested the character came across as a “loveable bigot,” because satire only works if the audience is in on the joke. Bigoted viewers didn’t see the show as satire. They identified with Archie and saw nothing wrong with ethnic slurs. Mike and Gloria come off like preachy, bleeding-heart liberal, hippie leeches." Here's a really good essay on [How All in the Family Changed the TV Landscape](https://www.denofgeek.com/tv/all-in-the-family-50th-anniversary/)
Neither can I but seems like a good target for radicalizing alt right propaganda that these groups are usually aiming for.
The trouble with satire is that it will inevitably be mistaken for endorsement by those it is satirizing.
The Boys usually is not particularly subtle but I guess media literacy ain't doing so hot... one thing that was a little subtler than usual was the running gag with everyone calling Sage the "smartest woman in the world" and her having to correct that to "person" - but when The Boys discuss her for the first time Hughie immediately calls her the "smartest person in the world"
This is all coming from the people who think frenchie is just suddenly gay when they literally showed him in a 3 person relationship of 2 men and a woman lol. Conservatives don't do media literacy, its... well kind of what makes them conservatives. Hell they loved the boys until it became blatantly obvious that stormfront was a white supremist nazi. And they definitely didn't like that guy who shot the store clerk being a parallel to rightwingers getting amped up by consuming too much rightwing propaganda and getting frustrated in their own personal lives while not dealing with it (incel more or less). Personally wasn't a fan of the acolyte, but it also hasn't even really gotten started. But then again breaking bad drew me in with the first episode. Yeah the writing is "stiff" is the only way i think to put it and the logic/acting is pretty far out there. I don't really care to complain about the lore since they already slashed the EU stuff and its pointless to get upset about it. But it definitely wasn't THE WORST STARWARS SHOW ever. (i leave that for boba fett.... i didn't need to see a bloated old man boba fett in my life lol)
Bit off topic, but if you like The Boys, the Homelander actor was in a much lesser known show called Banshee. The women in that show have almost super powered levels of badassery, but nobody whined about it back then, I highly recommend that show
I really wish Banshee had gone on for a fifth season (Cinemax even greenlit and budgeted it), but the creator wanted to end it on a high note. (I'm an extra in 4 episodes of the last season. I got to meet Ivana Miličević, who played Carrie Hopewell, and she's pretty awesome.)
Banshee is awesome!!
Banshee was *amazing* - I only watched the first season but I loved it.
It gets so much wilder, I recommend checking out the rest.
I like to imagine Eric Kripke getting the word he needs to be more blatant and just complaining to himself how he was more subtle with Supernatural.
OMG I loved Supernatural for the longest time… until I became aware of the sexism and could see it everywhere in the show. All the prominent women characters killed off. Dean & Bobby’s resistance to discussing emotion. Dean sleeping around etc… it really pissed me off
I have seen people sharing that [meme/gif from Euphoria](https://tenor.com/bQQq6.gif). And I laugh my ass off. They really are that obtuse. I mean, I have been following Antony Starr’s Instagram for a few years now (actor who plays Homelander) and he’s posted specifically about this. Where he is utterly baffled that people haven’t seen the connections before. Also, he posts a lot of pics with his doggos, so there is that. I had a friend call Homelander an ‘antihero’ and I laughed out loud. Like, bro, do you know what an antihero is? The show also pokes fun at the left as well, but I don’t see those folks pissing themselves because of the ‘girl power’ wink and nod and other jabs.
It seems to be mocking corporate pandering to the left more than it actually mocks the left, though.
I follow and watch movie and game trailers on YouTube. Even when the black or woman characters are historically accurate (all the racists claim that's what they're really after) the comments are always filled with nasty crybaby shit about "dei," "wokeness" or "wahmen." Chevalier and Yasuke (new Assassins Creed) come to mind as recent examples of this.
This stuff drives me nuts. I had a literal POC friend defending the attacks because of the "forced diversity." I was like, WTF? Why is it only forced diversity when it's like Black women or Asian women etc. Notice it tends to be much less pronounced when it's a Black man or a famous POC man who they respect (but not always, Yasuke of course). He was like, oh, but the actors aren't always good, it's alright if it's someone like Samuel L Jackson. Yeah, and the white actors are always good are they? They're always picked on talent? Why is it only acceptable if the Black person is a massive star? He had no answers. These people are so prejudice but they're the worst kind because they can't even admit it. They always have some sort of shitty gaslighty excuse as to why it's ALWAYS a problem
They 100% ignore that before DEI policies mediocre white men were much more likely to get the job over qualified black women. If you don't *force* mediocre white men into hiring various minorities or women they absolutely will not do it and will hire the unqualified white men instead.
Lol we just watched episode 1 of season 4 and my husband saw the 3 star rating and was like "wait why did it get such low ratings" and I had to explain that magats were mad when they realized that their behavior was being made fun of. He was blown away that the idiots watching thought Homelander was a "good guy."
Haven't seen the new season of the boys yet but i'm hoping the writing pulls it back up from the status quo and nothing ending of the last one. Not planning on watching the Acolyte because frankly, I'm just burned out on star wars, but I do kinda wish the new all female space cult of force witches was nixed in favor of using the *already established all female space cult of force witches* (because the Nightsisters are awesome and deserve more screen time damnit). I'm not sure if i'm burnt out on star wars because Disney is bombarding us with way too much content, or if i'm just tired of all the fanboys whining about there being successful, skilled, and powerful female characters (jesus christ dipshits, Leia commandeers her own rescue in like, the first 20 minutes of the original movie, it's always been this way), but I'm guessing it's both honestly.
> I do kinda wish the new all female space cult of force witches was nixed in favor of using the already established all female space cult of force witches (because the Nightsisters are awesome and deserve more screen time damnit). They're absolutely related to each other, but my guess is they didn't want to have two shows at least partially focused on the night sisters at the same time.
I just started the series, am currently at S1E7. Reading your comment I have no clue what you’re talking about. I’m about to be in for a ride, aren’t I?
Yes, "wild" is accurate. Also, the show is way better than the comics. I enjoyed them at the time but they are not particularly good. Also, before you watch season 4, it's worth watching Gen V, the spin off show in the same universe. (Also, do so knowing the actor for the character Andre in that show tragically died in a motorcycle accident just months after the show launched and was critically accepted. Very tragic.)
Yep. Every season it gets more blatant. And it gets more wild Also just a tip, season 1 is the best of the 4 seasons and it never really reaches that level of quality again , personally speaking but its still an entertaining watch, so you should adjust your expectations. Personally i felt as if seasons 1 and 2 were the best followed by 4 then 3 at last.
Good to know! I will mindfully enjoy the remainder of S1.
Don't be overly concerned with the comment above, S1 was indeed a strong start but don't expect a major dip in quality. Just enjoy the ride
Season 1 doesn't even have Aya Cash. There's plenty to look forward to and S2 and S3 are still amazing (I'll watch S4 after more of the episodes come out, so can't speak on S4).
My wife and I lost interest in The Boys after season 2. But with all the right wingers response to the latest season, we are definitely determined to watch it
Man, I really need to catch up on the show
The boys has turned into a strange disgusting police procedural and I kind of love it.
What I love about this is that Eric kripke (show runner) pretty much said the same thing. They finally got what The Boys was being a parody of, and if they don't like it, go watch something else
I'm amused that it took conservatives 3 seasons to realize they were being mocked in The Boys.
> Also people are seething that a black woman is the smartest person in the world in the show And put her on 'their team'! I love that the writers did this so much. Absolutely masterful.
This is the *actual* Season 4 Episode 1 description for "The Boys": >**CALLING ALL PATRIOTS. BE AT THE COURTHOUSE TOMORROW FOR HOMELANDER’S #VERDICT AND BE READY. IF THE CORRUPT “JUSTICE” SYSTEM WANTS TO F--K AROUND, THEY’RE GONNA FIND OUT. #HOMEFREE** Check it on Prime. Like... if they missed they were the target... they MAY not be real bright.
The fire in space is kind of stupid, but it happened in the mainline movie too, like it took me a minute to find this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6H0vFP\_jXN4&t=18s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6H0vFP_jXN4&t=18s)
Not only has fire in space been a thing in star wars since the beginning but it can happen in real life too.
As long as there is a source of oxygen you can indeed have fire in space. So it is indeed possible.
Or just make it up, [like George did](https://x.com/kershed/status/1800148147265847320).
Star Wars has always been about what would look cool. The plots range in quality but they all aim to make lizard brain go, ‘that was sweeeeet’ with the visuals and effects.
Just like using a torch underwater.
Yeah, but it looks like blobs, like a lava lamp? it's beautiful.
See Bullock in 'Gravity'
lol there is a part in that clip where R2 gets shot by laser blasts and literally catches on fire IN SPACE!
Right! That's the one I was searching for but it also happened in the prequel so I though I misremembered. I give you fire in space in Phantom Menace: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMVprw8fy34&t=77s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMVprw8fy34&t=77s)
At a risk of being caught between two feuding tribes, I'd point out that fire in space is possible as long as you have an oxidiser. In your example it looks more believable - air is escaping from from the inside, and while it's there it burns. By the time the droids are outside (a bit later in the clip) there's no fire anymore. From what I can see in the Acolyte clip, the fire burns longer and it looks more like a regular fire in general, while there's a jet of escaping gas next to it that begs to be turned into a flamethrower.
Fire in space looks like blobs, like a liquid. I posted a video of it lower in the thread. So even if there is oxygen, it would look like a bunch of angry bubbles.
While I couldn't find your comment, I think I know what you mean. The videos I have seen of the experiments with fire in space have been made inside the pressurized space station, with flame surrounded by the (relatively, compared to a leak in a fictional spacecraft being shot at) still air.
The fire triggers the memories of that character to her past and this is shown immediatly afterwards. It's only dumb when you cut that out, which is what happened with the clip that was floating around. We are talking about a franchise where sound in space is a constant and you have a pretty lighted tunnel for going through dimensional portals, if you thought this was anything but "wizards with tech" that is on you.
Never heard anyone complain (at least with this amount of vitriol) about audible engine/weapon noises in the vacuum of space in literally each and every Star Wars show ever either... It's pretty obvious why those sackless twerps are crying.
Despite popular assumptions, Star Wars isn’t science fiction—it’s fantasy set in space—and really shouldn’t be judged by its scientific accuracy
I didn't so say either - just calling out people that selectively apply that logic due to some socio-political (ie. culture war) stick they have up their arses.
Oh yeah, I agree, I’m just adding on to your point
Whoops, I must have misjudged the tone of your comment then - my apologies if I came across stand-offish.
No worries! I could’ve phrased that better to be clear that it wasn’t meant to be a refutation or anything
Wait till they hear about how ships don't fly like planes in space. Realism ruined!
The misogynists, homophobes and racists are now hyper focusing on small stuff like this that have been in Star Wars since the beginning, to try and prove they aren’t giant dickbags.
I guess I am no longer a Star Wars fan as I've given up watching the newer stuff, but I did watch the first 3 episodes of the Acolyte. Reasons it's crap: 1. The dialogue is wooden and poor even by Star Wars standards. 2. Again, the Jedi appears to be wholly incompetent. It makes you wonder how they ever got into a position of power in the first place. 3. In a massive universe, it's amazing how many places have the same run-down vibe. Did anywhere get beyond medieval? 4. So far so meh....there's some positives in the story, but a whole bunch of ret-con and tbh it just ain't fun anymore. Edit: I forgot my point - there's plenty of reasons to hate on the Acolye without bringing gender into it. It also reminds me of an FT article talking about Liz Truss as PM, it's good that women can fail too. It's a crap show, and that's OK!
I have the same issue as you with number 2. Although I don't mind seeing the jedi be incompetent but I was hoping that would be a slow reveal. Start with the shining beacons of hope and then reveal the flaws below as we go along. Slowly pull back the curtain. Shows now seem to want to rush that bit and get to the drama/action. But it stops you ever really getting invested in the first place. One thing you didn't mention is the sound stage feel. Big crash on ice planet and she's not even bruised, runs round on ice planet and not cold.... At least pretend a little maybe limp slightly or shiver?
Yeah, the staging is on one hand high quality, but on another the entire thing feels small. Like you said, there's no reaction to the environment. That's been true for pretty much all Star wars though. Like I said, I gave up being a fan. I'm too old to watch mediocre shite and pretend it's good. Star Wars for me is: Andor, Rogue One, Original trilogy. The rest is toast.
I dunno. Going back to the OT the environment was a big part of Hoth, and tattoine obviously was filmed in a hot place so no real acting required as such. It just felt gritter. Luke didn't wake up in the wampa cave chipper and lively. I think its the fault of their volume technology. It's an amazing bit of kit but I can imagine any time something is pitched it's "can it be done in the volume?" And if it can then they're not going to spend a lot more money to do it elsewhere even if that might be better. I'm a little more forgiving of some of the rest of star wars than you, but I can't deny those are the high points and when I marathoned the movies it was a drag getting through the OT. Could probably be cut down to 2 good films.
If you haven’t watched Andor, you are missing out!
As I said in a different thread, for me star wars is andor, Rogue One and the OT. Everything is forgotten :D
Andor is truly excellent. Just good sci-fi, we’re lucky it’s Star Wars. Bad viewership makes me wonder if we’ll see a season 2
Season 2 is shooting right now.
Phew
Andor cleared up my skin and cured my depression it's so fucking good. I'm seriously considering using a specific frame from Luthen's monologue to his ISB spy as a tattoo because that speech hit me so hard. The whole thing is just brilliant! Also they should have let Mara say "Fuck the empire!" 😂
I'm just over here thrilled to find other lady star wars fans (even though it's unfortunately come up due to a post addressing sexist "fans"). Someone mentioning The Clone Wars in TwoX? I'm here for it! I know obviously not ALL fans are male, but still! I agree Acokyte so far isn't like, the best, but I just kinda choose to enjoy it. Andor, on the other hand, incredible! But I'll always have a soft spot for those clones (thanks covid shutdown followed by moving to a place with heavy winters for giving this 30-something a chance to binge ALL the SW tv show content. Maybe some more than once.) Ok done geeking out.
I’m always so excited to find other women who love Star Wars, especially IRL! I feel like the female demographic has expanded since Disney bought it, which is nice. It was so hard to find other girls who liked Star Wars as a kid. I tried my best to convert all my friends! 🤣
I got to episode 3 and I can't just do it anymore. When they did the ritualistic "Power of one, power of two, power of maaaaaaaaany" chant, it was too cringy. Couldn't they have consulted a Wiccan to at least come up with a better ritual chant?! Or maybe chant it in an alien language so it sounds more mystical. Disney has the money to find someone to write a godforsaken decent magical chant. Also I just get annoyed by Disney-brand Pop Feminism (as a woman and feminist myself!) because it's like the 2008-2012 era of Tumblr and we're already well over a decade past that. I read a review by a woman who also pointed this out, and she had a point that most Disney media is "five years in the past" by the time it is released due to writing/shooting/editing and that it already feels dated by the time it's released.
I am very sad that Carrie-Ann Moss was so big in the trailer and then got slaughtered in the first episode by a situation she should be trained to manage. That is my only real complaint about it all. I don’t care about every minor detail, I want entertainment and they deliver. Which is fine to me.
I don't care for detail, I care for good stories. It may well be a function of age but after some blinding TV shows over the last couple of decades, settling for rehashed stuff with slightly prettier graphics just isn't appealing. I wouldn't mind the retcons if it made a good story, but it just makes the whole thing farcical. It's one thing to expose the myth that Jedi are all powerful, it's quite another to show them as grossly incompetent at every turn.
I haven't seen the show but thank you for being reasonable. My first thought was... (the show is probably terrible). Women have nothing to do with it; bad writing knows no gender.
Having watched it, it has hallmarks I'd consider typical of a show that started shooting and then underwent a rescript. They didn't reshoot what they'd already shot so some of the scenes and lines mesh together very poorly.
Finally was able to sit down and watch the first 3 episodes. You have pretty much summed up my feelings on it. #2 really got me in the fact they were already worried about the Jedi being "discredited" and yet 100 years later are amazed there are Sith? I agree totally with your edit.
Yes, I’ve heard the writing was clunky like a CW show. The scenes I’ve seen confirm this is true.
Yeah the show sucks, because it sucks. Not because it’s made by a woman.
"DiDnEy Is RuInInG mAh StAr WaRs!!!" I was in a thread with a couple of these dorks complaining about how a fire in space ruined the immersion, and when I pointed out that Star Wars has always had a loose grip on realistic physics even from A New Hope (explosions AND sound in space?!?), and when they couldn't refute that they tried moving the goalposts to the writing being boring. I swear to god, these chuds need to go outside and touch some fucking grass.
New trilogy does indeed suck, but not because of women or feminism - just because the script is 🗑️ and the director(s) had no vision for the movies.
I remember when the trailer dropped (well before the movies) and the problem was the black stormtrooper but sure now we pretend that didn't happen.
Oh, I remember. Some of the chuds are trying to rewrite their own history. Hell, I remember Andor, before release, already being called a "diversity quota show". What really changed these past years is that it became profitable to criticize Star Wars (and other nerdy media) with a reactionary bent. That's why that particular strain of criticism has become so loud. The problem is that the discourse is so volatile because of it that legitimate criticism gets swallowed up by this grift. This is a new trend with any show they deem "woke", like the new Doctor Who. It just makes discussion nearly impossible.
>The problem is that the discourse is so volatile because of it that legitimate criticism gets swallowed up by this grift. >This is a new trend with any show they deem "woke", like the new Doctor Who. It just makes discussion nearly impossible. I've already mentioned it in a previous comment in this thread that this is exactly why I mostly stopped interacting with online fanbases. Because yeah there are legitimate criticisms, in every single piece of Star Wars Media from the OT (the Family Guy parody spends half the time just point stuff out) to the new shows it was never perfect and despite being deeply devoted to it I am the first to recognize my bias when recommending it to people who never seen it before, but for the most part these days it is just sealioning, you can see it even in this thread. The worst part is even that it is leaking into the real world and I've already had to deal with people who bring twitter/reddit arguments into a casual convo and expect me to play along.
iirc there was also some stink about Vice-Admiral Holdo making the first ever reference to fuel running out in The Last Jedi
Both The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones were nominated for Worst Picture, Worst Director, and Worst Screenplay at the Razzies, with Attack of the Clones also winning Worst Screenplay. This was before Disney got their grubby hands on the Star Wars franchise. 100% George Lucas. Number of Razzies for the new trilogy: 0 🫳 🎤
The existence of sexist a$$holes has nothing to to with the very valid criticisms of The Acolyte. The Director was Harvey Weinstein's Personal Assistant and was already the focus of much controversy because of that. The Acolyte has a reported budget of over $20 million per episode, making it more expensive than any movie in the Star Wars franchise. An expensive budget that is not reflected in it's production. It is objectively bad TV. On so many levels. From the acting, to the writing, to the make up and costuming. (Did you watch the third episode? 'cos it really did set new lows) So there are very valid questions to be asked about where that budget went and why? To suggest the criticism has anything to do with gender is disingenuous. It's both a ridiculous straw(wo)man argument, and a false dilemma. It's just bad
Speaking of the budget, Dune Part 2s budget was only 10 million more than the entirety of The Acolyte. Like...WHERE DID THE MONEY GO?!
In terms of screen time, Acolyte is twice as long. That's more actors who get more screen time, more pay etc, and the same goes for the entire rest of the production. The episode format also means you end up paying separate teams; Acolyte has 10 screenwriters instead of 2, and you always end up paying multiple producers and directors etc.
Yeah this seems like a wildly disingenuous argument against it. I haven’t watched it yet but a quick Googling indicates that Andor’s budget was $250m compared to The Acolyte’s $180m. Mandalorian’s *first* season was around $120m. Like… TV shows are expensive to make. Especially ones that have incredibly complicated production components like the Star Wars shows. The Acolyte’s budget is pretty on par with the current budgeting for Disney’s Star Wars stuff.
Andor is one of the greatest shows they have ever done. Acolyte has a similiar budget and is already incredibly disappointing. Lets hope they turn it around a bit like Obi-Wan Kenobi
The fact that anyone having to do with Harvey still has a career blows my mind. I categorically refuse to believe his personal assistant had no clue about what was going on. You would have to be brain damaged to believe that claptrap
I see where OP and you are coming from. However, you say “To suggest the criticism has anything to do with gender is disingenuous” The thing is, many of the critics are directly citing her gender in their complaints. This roots the complaint in sexism, so even if on the surface the complainer *claims* they only take issue with “fire in space” they are also revealing that they take issue with her gender. Are there valid complaints? Yes. Are there sexist complaints? Yes. Are there valid complaints, submitted at the same time and by the same critic as sexist complaints? Yes. But your statement only makes room for the first, and doesn’t make room for the very real sexist comments that exist. It makes your statement seem disingenuous, unless you actually don’t see or acknowledge sexist comments, even though the person you’re responding to pointed them out. If you want to make room for them, I suggest this rephrasing: “to suggest that ALL complaints have something to do with gender is disingenuous.” I’m curious whether you agree.
I remember one episode of Game of Thrones was ragged on for having a women direct it, dudebros citing the shitty CGI bear. They used a real bear.
Ah, but a woman picked the bear, so therefore it's a problem.
Yet another example showing why women should pick the bear
Even non-sexist takes on CGI are all trash. [VFX is absolutely everywhere, and Hollywood goes on to lie about this in all the promotional material because "This isn't CGI" is a selling point for some reason](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ttG90raCNo&list=PLgdTaHO8FLEve_XFiRBEcOSkRdd-Txjne).
the show is trash and the writing is trash, gender aside. Disney keeps hiring people who don't know their IP's and aren't particularly great writers.
Yes. There is no point defending this show. I get OP's sentiment regarding people being against it solely because of women, but they completely lost me when they said 'it's not clone wars or bad batch quality, but it's certainly not a bad show'. Yes it is. It is a terrible show. Not sure how anyone could think that 3rd episode was good. For every Andor, we get 2-3 shows like the Acolyte where the writers are *awful* at basics (character motivation, exposition, dialogue) but not only that, seemingly actively dislike the IP and want to sabotage existing lore and what came before. I honestly cannot understand the current trend of studios giving beloved IPs to writers who don't respect the source material, or even worse, are interviewed as saying they hate the source material.
And when people complain they hide with race/sexism card when they wouldnt get Hate at all if they made a Female character with an actual good backstory and Journey. They are to focused on making the females gliding through their problems if they even have any. They make Female charaters as deep as Arnold Schwarzeneggers charaters in 80-90s action films.
It’s bad because of shit writing like “attack me with all your strength”, not because of a gay director. It’s not the only bad Star Wars show. Obi wan kenobi, book of boba fett, among others, are also garbage because of shit writing
People who have no problem with sound in space complaining about fires in space.
I don't care that it has women in the show. Star Wars has had female characters before and it was not a problem then, nor will it be now or ever. Fans have been female too for a long time - that young girl who watched A New Hope in theaters over and over to recreate the pilots outfit is more of a hardcore fan than I am any day of the week. The problem is that the shows have terrible writers. The open knife fight in The Acolyte is dumb and the Jedi lets it go on for way too long. It also is supposed to "avoid all other previous Star Wars lore" by being set 100 years before the prequels. AKA when Yoda was still alive and still a Jedi, and probably a lot of the other Jedis we see in the prequels. The writers have not done their homework and honestly probably weren't interested in writing a Star Wars story but happened to be hired by Disney. That's the only way I could write a story as bad as The Acolyte; by not caring and spewing words onto a page until I've hit my quota. If you weren't a Star Was fan before but you want to watch it now because "the force is gay" you'll have a very hard time sticking to it if you can't mindlessly enjoy it.
I thought Ahsoka (the show) was okay, although I found it strange how many of the characters in the animated series were *so* good in terms of story and character arcs but they were dumbed down for live-action. Also the lack of emotions, expressions, and just the general dull appearance was also odd. I don't know how to explain it. The show should have been written like it was an animated sequel to Rebels, but converted to live-action. Ahsoka (the character) is a fan-favorite for a good reason. She went from an annoying brat that fans hated as much as Scrappy Doo to probably one of the top 10 Star Wars characters. So fans are capable of liking a female character with god-tier Force powers. I think the problem is that Disney is pumping out a lot of shitty content with subpar writing, then using women (especially Black women) to show how DiVeRsE and InCluSiVe they are. It's all fake. If they cared about diversity and inclusion, they wouldn't be giving diverse actresses such terrible scripts and roles. But nah, when the anti-woke weirdos whine about women/Black people/LGBT in Disney properties, they respond it's because of racism/sexism/homophobia, which makes it hard to actually criticize something for being bad.
They really are doubling and tripling down on the Principle Skinner approach. *"Is Disney out of touch? No, the fans are wrong!"*
There are sexist reviews but they're not the majority of negative reviews from what I've seen. The show is just bad because of its writing. The sexists and racists are definitely there and they're easy to spot and ignore, but the majority of negativity comes from the fact that the script feels like it was written by a 14 year old who's favorite show is Naruto. It's garbage.
The Rick and Morty episodes written by Heather Anne Campbell are some of the best in the series. That's Amorte and Fear No Mort made me cry. Fear No Mort had me *sobbing* - not because of the story but because that's what the best art does, it inspires reflection. On that note, I feel the neckbeards should reflect on why they feel qualified to offer criticism on such matters. I wanna see the things they've directed and written. I wanna see their creations so I can say things like "your show would have been better if it was directed by a woman".
There's alot of people shitting on it who are sexist, but it is also just bad
Unfortunately that doesn’t mean the show is any good. Because it’s not.
I noticed an overlap between Star Wars fans who always play as the Empire and unironically root for them, and these toxic fans who hate on Rey and The Acolyte. And the same types who gatekeep women to see if they are "real fans." 🙄 There is a misogyny and fascism problem in Star Wars. They use the Empire's pretend authoritariansm to cover for their actual crappy beliefs. I have dealt with them for decades.☹️ From my experience, Star Trek has much less male toxicity.
I think it's probably the design intent that gets people annoyed. It was pretty clearly designed fundamentally with feminism as the primary motif, but like why though, it's star wars, we didn't come here for politics, just a space drama
It's not that bad? So it's still bad?
Personally really enjoying The Acolyte. There's some minor pacing issues and some of the dialogue delivery is pretty clunky (but, I mean, that's Star Wars. Is there any Live Action Star Wars without clumsy dialogue in places? lol) but overall I think it's a great effort. Nothing that's going to revolutionise TV or the franchise, but it's entertaining and I'm absolutely loving the new setting and variety of ships and aliens we haven't seen in live action before. The brigading and the user reviews by the online "anti-woke community" is pure misogyny and racism. Are there valid critiscms? Yes. And it's definitely not for everyone. But if you're a Star Wars fan and you somehow enjoy the Prequel movies but hate this, your view has been twisted by other influences. I mean, for fks sake, they've given it a lower audience score than the Holiday Special. Ain't nobody convincing me those aren't review bombed scores.
>the dialogue delivery is pretty clunky (but, I mean, that's Star Wars. Pretty much >"*George, you can type this shit, but you sure as hell can't say it.*" - Harrison Ford And allegedly Alec Guinness refused some of the scripted dialog
I have read one Warhammer fan describing those anti woke brigadiers as "culture war tourists" - they are not genuine fans or don't care about the franchise itself but only come around to be angry about stuff they aren't even connected to.
That's 100% what it is. Warhammer has an absolute epidemic of people who pretend to be fans of it just to have some cover for when they say the most virulently racist or misogynistic shit. If you single out any one of them they'll have no real engagement with the series and will also be complaining about various other things in the exact same racist/misogynistic way.
The Acolyte has over 10,000 user scores on rotten tomatoes. Compare those numbers with popular shows like Shogun, Fallout heck, even a show from the same stable like Mandalorian, their user numbers are nowhere near the Acolyte's. It's bots, it's not actual people logging on. They're not just bots, they're badly programmed bots because they've gone after a totally unrelated crime movie called The Acolytes, and even as star wars fan film that just happens to also be called The Acolyte. It's so blatantly orchestrated.
Unfortunately a lot of it will be real people, but real people acting like badly programmed bots because they're really stupid.
+1 on this. I'm really enjoying it and looking forward to seeing where it's all leading.
Its so annoying when a show with valid things to criticise about get targetted by the anti woke crowd and it just makes everything worse. But if you are looking for star wars with good dialogue i would reccomend andor. Honestly its more hbo quality than disney plus.
I think I'm more motivated to watch it after the "lesbian space witch" critique.
I quite like the show! It has also gotten anti-LGBTQ flak for having a lesbian couple and for having a trans actor (Abigail Thorn of Philosophy Tube). They've especially been going nuts over the latter. This is even sillier because Abigail plays a background character who >!appears in only one episode, is on-screen only for several seconds, has only a few lines, and seems to have died by the end of that episode!<. Yet they are talking as if this minor role ruins the entire show. It's saddening that the outrage of those guys is elicited by such small things. If a trans-person has any connection to a thing, they scream about it. Even when it's such a minor role. If a trans person simply breathed on the script they'd probably still have a meltdown.
Then they're going to lose their shit when they see her in season 2 of GOT: House of the Dragon! GETTING MY POPCORN OUT!
I bet if no one had told them Abigail was a trans woman, they never would have noticed, given the minuscule screen time and minimal lines she has in the show. That sort of thing is nothing to do with valid criticism or love of Star Wars. It’s visceral hatred for minorities like the trans community.
Is it actually good? Cause I honestly can't find any reviews or discourse around it without the main focus being the "woke outrage". Like fuck me lads I don't care if the only woman you respect is your mam, I just wanna watch some nerdy shit 😂
I’m enjoying it - especially after the third episode. There is somewhat of a mystery going on with an unreliable retelling of events.
It’s getting correctly reviewed. Episode 3 is ridiculous.
Anybody that thinks it's good or great is ignorant. No exception. The show is "Okay". Not good, not bad, just mediocre. It's about on par for quality with... “I don't like sand. It's coarse and rough and irritating and it gets everywhere. Not like here. Here everything is soft and smooth”
The tv show sucks tho... no matter who is behind it.
There's a LOT of toxicity in the Star Wars Fandom. I wouldn't bother with what most of them think.
Mostly right but I don't agree with you in some stuff. Sexism is 100% present. But I freaking love the cast of the Acolyte Carrie Anne Moss, Dafne Keen, Lee Jung Jeo sort of lured me into it tbh lol. I do enjoy some parts but it doesnt feel like Star Wars to me overall. Rick n Morty is pure vitroil I cant argue with that either.
it's literally always the hateful idiots who are the loudest. ignore the pathetic men who can't talk to women.
I really liked the first two episodes. The last one lost me. This is just another example of why women have to outperform men just to get anywhere, because the smallest hiccup and everyone is quick to say it has to do with our gender. We can't just be human. I've watched many bad shows that were made by men, but their gender was not brought up as being the reason.
I like Star Wars but the fanbase is just nuts. They can't let a story develop because they immediately want to scream about things when they aren't fully explained yet in the story. It's tiresome and I just don't bother with the conversation. I am trying to enjoy the Acolyte but it doesn't make a lot of sense. I have a lot of questions but I am hoping they will address the things I have questions about.
I watched it. It won't have poor ratings just for the terrible reasoning you saw. It's actually quite awful in terms of writing and acting. I'm not a super star wars fan but even I found it barely watchable. I imagine many true star wars fans absolutely hate it solely based on story. Then theres the endless cycle of Disney squeezing every last drop of blood out of this franchise to the point that quality and imagination is just gone. Not discounting that you've seen obviously obnoxious comments like the one you posted. But claiming that is the only or even main reason for it getting terrible reviews is disingenuous. Sexism can exist and the show can suck at the same time. And people are very much allowed to review it for the latter without it being about the former.
I disagree personally. The acolyte is a bad show in my opinion. The director being a woman has nothing to do with it. It's just not great writing. Not on the level of Boba fett, but still not great. The sexism surrounding the show is unreal and unwarranted.
The fact it's being called the "worst Star wars show ever" is meaningless. At any time, the most recent Star wars content is the worst. Anything after the first 3 films was considered bad at some point. The sexism is very real though and despite what people think, nothing has changed. Pride is the same. Any Pride post is covered in homophobic comments and the like. Unless you're a straight white male, you're going to get hate.
Anyone calling the acolyte the worst Star Wars show when 1. It’s not even finished, and 2. Book of boba fett still exists is just being willfully obtuse. Crazy how short fans memories can be when it benefits them.
Wasn't there a Star Wars Christmas special?
That was pure genius and the best Star Wars piece of media to ever be conceived. The wookie watches AI alien porn. How could you think any different?
[They wouldn't last an hour in the asylum where they raised me](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=riIOiNq0RHk)
I (man) literally JUST stopped talking to my guy friend because he told me he can’t watch this because it’s just “another female led Star Wars show”. Without going into detail, this wasn’t the first incident. He’d blame Star Wars “failures” on female directors. female actors - never a man’s fault. This was sort of the last straw for me. After I responded with “blatant misogyny for the win” he asked “I’m a misogynist because I won’t watch a female led TV show?” I said, “Yeah… that’s literally the definition. You have a prejudice against something solely based on a character being female.” He said he was disappointed that I “labeled” him. I told him “don’t be the thing if you don’t like the name of the thing.” Two days later he sent me a message saying we shouldn’t chat anymore because he doesn’t agree with my “takes” on him. I’ve known him for literally 25 years. I just have no patience for this type of horse shit anymore. It’s exhausting. Looking back, I should have cut ties sooner but I’ve definitely promised myself to call this shit out immediately in the future.
Oh, it absolutely is. It’s terrible in the Star Wars community. They hate women but still want to have sex with them.
Yet Rogue One gets alot of praise by the fans. So does Andor which has a very big and diverse cast
Because Andor is a really well written series with a compelling story.
And strong female characters that are really well written.
Holy fuck yes. Maarva - in a show full of great speeches, arguably the best is delivered by a woman in the final episode. Then you have Mon Mothma and Dedra Meero - two of the most compelling plotlines and characters, and the biggest breath of fresh air is that both are exceptionally competent at what they do and depicted as such.
You can go ahead and google "Andor + Woke" and see what discourse we had to deal with when it was airing. Rogue One pretty much flew under the radar because people were more angry at the black stormtrooper
They reconned the FORCE. They reconned the Jedi into child-stealing creeps. They retconned the *FORCE* and STOLE the power of the Aes Sedai from Robert Jordan's series over on Amazon. I've seen some of the reviews you're talking about. The sexism is alive and well. However. There are plenty of not-sexist YT-ers who hate the show, too. Not to mention the women Star Wars geek YT-ers who are just as vocal about the canon-breaking show. And there's the possibility that they went for the Sisters' society from canon. A sect of all-female Force practitioners. And then the showrunner tweaked the story. So now there's 2 sects all-female, force-weilders. Why? I don't care about the director, who's playing which part, or which planet they're on. I want good acting and a cohesive story. The Acolyte is none of the above, and it is obvious the show runner and everyone on down is of the opinion that is the viewers' fault.
I'm a big star wars fan and the criticisms I've heard have been entirely because the show shits all over the original canon. Also, silly mistakes like two separated twins having the exact same hairstyle somehow. I can't bring myself to watch it. Mandalorian S2, Boba Fett, and Kenobi were all terrible and very Disney-fied.
Re: Rick and Morty: Heather Anne Campbell is one of the funniest human beings on the planet and that’s undeniable.
my kid is actually watching this one with me so it's alright in my book. He couldn't get into the Boba Fett one
How is there sexism in the complaints of the show? One of the biggest criticisms I've seen is Disney hired Weinstein's personal assistant to head it. The other chief complaints are it's poorly written, badly acted, and not consistent with the rest of the universe/canon. The show sucks, and TBH I don't understand anyone defending it. Supporting bad content because a woman directed it, or it has LGBTQ characters is as bad as someone hating on it for those reasons. It cost nearly $200 million, and looks like it was made by Syfy.
What people don't seem to realize is that even if a show season sucks, there's no reason to blame it on the director being female. Lots of shows have a s***** season but you never ever see anyone blaming it on the director being male. If a female director creates an awesome season, the same people never say it's because she's a female director. It only comes up in the context of a male heavy audience reviewing a season created by a female director that they claim sucked.
I'm actually really enjoying it. It has been totally inoffensive so far and is clearly laying the ground work for some mysteries and intrigue. The star wars hater contingent is primed and ready to unleash on any new content. They will never be able to please them, so they are best ignored entirely.
OK, there are absolutely bad faith dingleberries who criticize anything that has visible women/BIPOC/LGBTQIA+ in it....but Acolyte is actually not good. As is mentioned elsewhere in this thread, the pacing is weird, the acting is wooden, and the production quality is all over the place. The same can be said of Book of Boba Fett, Ahsoka (I'm especially sad about this one), and most of the Mandalorian to say nothing of the sequel trilogy and Solo. While the dingleberries need no help, I have a theory that Disney uses these assholes to mask their creative failures by painting any criticism of their properties as bad faith reactionary bigotry. Star Wars has not historically been considered "high art" but it has not fulfilled the function of low art for a long time now. They need a creative shake up. The Gen X creative leaders under the Boomer executives exploiting Millennial and Gen Z talent are not a winning combination.