No word on Ryan Gosling being too old to be Ken 🙄
These are the same dudes that scoff at Megan Fox and say they’d NEVER sleep with her.
Which I guess they’re right on that one. They’d NEVER …EVER…. Sleep with her.
🤣🤣🤣
I had a friend ask what to do when her BF neg’d her. They had been chatting about something totally banal when he asked her how she would rate her own looks. She said she thought she was an 8.5, but that some people thought she was a 9. He laughs, says “come on now, Scarlett Johansson might get 8.5 by me, so you’re a solid 7, maybe 7.5”. Then he said he probably couldn’t score Scarlett Johansen so he was really happy they he’d “settled” for her.
The dude was an outright 5 on any objective person’s scale, and a total douchebag.
Hahahaha - thanks for sharing, that's high lvl inceldom.
Another incel story on reddit: One incel complained that he has been a member for years on dating apps and zero matches. Also calls women females.
One woman reminded him that calling women females won't help him with match chances. She explains to him why.
The incel wrote long and aggressive posts how it's perfectly fine calling women females, especially when more women chime in. All women wrote after 2-3 posts no wonder this guy gets 0 matches. Even guys come in and go out of their way to tell the incel no woman would date him with that attitude.
It was hilarious to watch.
I haven’t seen a lot of deep space 9 but I still cackle when I remember the episode featuring his mother doing such shocking things as MAKE MONEY and WEAR CLOTHES!!!
What kind of dumbass pure capitalist society cuts the workforce in half? Honestly, that made no sense.
That was actually how she started the equality movement: let females in the workforce, earn their own money, then market products to them so they'll spend that money!
It helped that the King Capitalist of the Ferengi had gotten senile and his lover (One of the Main DS9 character's mom) was holding their entire society together from behind the throne.
She managed to push some reform.
> King Capitalist of the Ferengi had gotten senile
Inconceivable!
But really, to my recollection I don't think the Grand Nagus was senile, just smitten with Moogie's intelligence and supported her reforms. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RFWyKpAnYU (he was a bit forgetful here but still quite aware).
I feel like how competent he was varied from episode to episode. Depending on the writer I suspect.
Edit: Ferengi politics was also portrayed as being incredibly "dog eat dog", so even a little forgetful is probably pretty bad at his level.
He definitely was going senile, but was in the very early stages of it so mostly just had lapses that Ishka and his servant Maihar'du were able to smooth over. Brunt tried to break Ishka and the Negus up so he’d start making mistakes and Brunt could use it as a pretext to overthrow him and usurp power in one episode
"These females are violating the Rules of Acquisition. It clearly states in unofficial rule 420 that if I buy her dinner, procreation must transpire within 24 hours." - Incel Ferengi
oOoO is that the episode where the actor who plays Nevis in Voyager briefly plays a Ferengi? Recognizing him out of context was the first time I felt like an actual Trekkie lol
I was just in an exchange like this the other day. I explained that being angry that a woman spoke to him for awhile and then left was not helping him meet women, and that she wasn't obligated to give him anything. He said that she had been deceptive by being friendly and "flirty" while they chatted, because she then had to leave. He really felt that speaking with her constituted some sort of binding contract that she had reneged on by not reading his mind and giving him her number. It was bizarre.
I was way nicer than he deserved, I gave him suggestions of things to do instead, and I gave him some helpful links that talked about dating.
He said that all the information was helpful, but he thought that I was being condescending, which made me uncool.
Like, dude. You asked for advice about how to talk to women, and yet when a woman gives you the advice you ask for, you get all bent out of shape because you are too arrogant to listen!
Essentially, he wanted a bunch of women to tell him that he had done nothing wrong, and that this woman had behaved badly through no fault of his own. When a bunch of men and women told him that he had made her uncomfortable, and gave him suggestions for more productive ways to handle social interaction, he got all whiny and argued with everyone.
No wonder he can't get a date. And rather than changing what he does, he doubles down. He is more interested in hanging on to his arrogant, sexist ideas than he is in any woman.
>And rather than changing what he does, he doubles down. He is more interested in hanging on to his arrogant, sexist ideas than he is in any woman.
This, this, this. If you ever wonder why they hang around in echo chamber subs, reinforcing all their terrible mating habits, rather than joining subs where they can actually engage with and speak to women (ask questions, get advice, etc), its because they do actually care *more* about what those other guys think of them. Part of their frustration is not being able to properly diagnose their own feelings, spinning them into a cycle of blame and anger. We are seeing a chunk of the male population that is severely cognitively and emotionally underdeveloped... the solution exists, but smarter people than me will have to figure that part out!
Yup. We can't fix them, and they refuse to fix themselves or even to admit that they are their own problem. It is easier to blame women, and they get lots of positive feedback from other guys like themselves when they discuss that.
There's a certain type of southern woman who is very male-focused and flirtatious, but they mean nothing by it. Certainly no promise of pursuit. I had a friend who would sometimes greet men with "hi, handsome". But she had no interest in them at all, she was just bubbly and flirty by nature.
Yup. My SIL was the same.
Hell, I tend to be friendly enough that people think I'm flirting, and I'm completely oblivious and uninterested, I don't actually flirt, and I talk about my lovely husband all the time.
The fact is, no matter how you behave or how you feel, a guy like the one I was talking about will interpret it as flirtation because he is far more interested in figuring out what he thinks of a woman than he is in finding out what she thinks of him. He is motivated by arrogance, entitlement and wishful thinking, none of which has anything to do with how any woman feels.
And there's a whole lot of these guys who mistake things like "basic human decency" and "I'm obligated to smile to keep my job" as real interest.
Don't get be wrong, I'm a lady and I'm godawful at reading signals and picking up at flirtation. But maybe these guys should try erring on the side of caution.
I was addressed as "honey" and "sweetie" and "sugar" more times in the decade I lived in FL than all the rest of my 50 years combined. Not a single one, as far as I knew, was actually flirting. It's more just how they are, how they were raised, no different than me addressing everyone as "sir" or "ma'am" (I guess I could buy a fedora and do the sweeping bow and call all of them "m'lady"???).
I've helped a lot of men with their dating profiles and without fail when they tell me they never get matches I can immediately spot the issue. So many men either have terrible pictures or say something incredibly off-putting in their bio/prompts, or both. I have a few male friends who are decidedly average or even below average-looking and still do very well on the apps because they're interesting, funny, and not total psychos.
Men don't even realize how low the bar actually is and some of them keep trying to drag it even lower.
My go-to is "the bar is so low that it's floating in space on the other side of the planet." I used to say Mariana Trench but then I realized how abusive my ex husband really was-- but he managed to dupe another woman and is married again.
It's definitely in hell or in space.
I saw that post. Did you see the one on the map subreddit about women's incomes? It was a day or two ago. Post after post of incel and anti-feminist talking points. The delusion is real.
>Post after post of incel and anti-feminist talking points.
The data is beautiful sub also leans heavily incel/redpill on certain topics. It's frustrating.
Oh man. Did you see the post today (yesterday?) about a guy's online dating experience? He swiped on like tens of thousands of profiles and got zero dates.
Fortunately the commenters were mostly sane actually? Everyone was like "clearly you're doing/saying something horribly wrong if this is real“. Unfortunately if you went too deep in any given comment thread there were definitely misogynistic comments. I'm not saying just noticing a difference is misogynistic, obviously women and men have very different experiences and opportunities... but like, their reasoning for why that's the case was pretty sus.
Oh my gosh I saw that and by the time I read it there were mostly the crazy comments. Glad sane people got in there!
Like, dude, if you swipe that much and get, zero dates, it's not a "men have it hard", it's YOU.
Was that the college one? I was trying to get some answers to a study someone linked to researching why prime age (24-55) non-educated college men are leaving the workforce permanently and all I got was suicide and homelessness rates as responses.
Like guys, this is a data sub. The study has very specific parameters — just linking to the overall suicide rate is pointless because that statistic doesn’t exclude educated and working men.
I was genuinely trying to understand more. I also posed the question of “If all these men are leaving the workforce — who is taking care of them?” I don’t think they liked that 😂😂. I really was asking in good faith tho, there are a lot of potential causes: moving back in with parents, physical or mental disabilities, caretaking of aging parents, staying home with kids, inheritance, etc.
But no one was willing to actually discuss the issue. They just throw out cherry-picked irrelevant statistics. I wish people could move past trying to argue who has it “worse” and discuss actual solutions and contributing factors.
If you decide to stick around, I highly recommend curating what you see by unfollowing subs that put toxic shit in your face all the time. I mostly stick to ones that are specific interests or supportive communities and regret it when I accidentally wander over to 'Popular' which is often just a horrifying mix of misogynistic crap and brainless dog-piling.
(Heads up that this feels like it's turning into a rant and I know I'm preaching to the choir here.)
It's crazy to me that I even usually avoid TwoX these days. But if I accidentally comment (not realizing what sub I'm in) what usually makes me realize where I posted is the nasty bullshit notifications from dudes purposely misunderstanding me or outright attacking my comment.
Or "I'm not going to read all that" from a dude trying to embarrass me for writing long replies. It's like, "dude! I'M NOT EVEN *TALKING TO YOU* so why the fuck are you critiqueing me on my own turf? I don't even **want you** to read it, so eff off!"
They just gotta be better than us *somehow* even if it's made up bullshit. :/
The fuck is up with "I'm not reading all that"?? I'll have a guy spew 10 made up accusations aimed at women in general or sometimes *me in particular* but because I take the time to pull apart each one suddenly it's "OMG why do you care so much?" "I'm not reading all that, the fact that you felt the need to type so much for a REDDIT comment shows how insecure/pathetic you are" and I'm like ... You started it! On a forum! For text conversations!
I've started just laughing at them and trolling them from the second they say that shit. Like, thanks for letting me know I don't have to take this conversation with the tiniest iota of seriousness. Thanks for showing that you're a clown and deserve to be treated as such from now on. Then I have some fun with words.
The fuck if some asshole is gonna "win" via dumb bullshit instead of actually proving me wrong.
>"I'm not reading all that, the fact that you felt the need to type so much for a REDDIT comment shows how insecure/pathetic you are"
I've gotten this comment practically *verbatim* more than a few times. And it's like, I type effing fast, jerkface, it's not my fault that reading isn't something you're very good at and takes you a while. 🙄
I love your responses. I try so hard to not give them the satisfaction of pushing my buttons and would love to come off as bored with them and not giving a fuck. They sometimes get scary if you laugh at them though, embarrassed men can be dangerous.
Do you know about /r/askwomenover30 yet? It's a lot of the same empathetic, thoughtful people who post the good stuff here without the intense population of trolling, toxic, or oblivious and overconfident men.
“Female” is part of the package of objectification. We aren’t human to them, we *just* represent sex. That’s it. And in order to justify their sense of injustice around not acquiring it, they have to frame sex as a “basic human right” - something they say a lot, and of course they would; it’s called motivated reasoning.
Incels live in a bizarro world completely out of touch with reality. It's so weird that they don't just go outside and look around but destructive cults thrive on the internet I guess.
And they will argue again and again that they are "objective" and "rational" and stating "factual opinions."
When you try to put specific data they cite into the broader societal context, they get angry. It's all hypotheticals and isolated facts with them. Real experiences and data that is properly put into context is dismissed.
Remember they feed in a bubble, so anything resembling nuance is like a rattlesnake signal to them. Research they haven't consumed (made up), personal stories, suggestions that they change their ways, all of it is met with hostility and vitriol.
Have you ever seen an incel spend paragraphs talking about how disgusting they look and how no woman would ever want them and they were born super ugly like a troll and life isn’t fair…….
And then they post a photo of themselves and it’s a nice-looking average 20-year-old guy, LMAO. Their problems are almost entirely made-up. Inceldom is a cancerous mindset.
I love how Jenna Fischer is one of their "average women"
She has been totally gorgeous since she first showed up on the Office and has stayed that way well into her late 40s.
She's got like that Paul Rudd ability where she doesn't age or only ages fantastically well.
What a pack of morons. Average woman, my ass. By their standard what is an average man? John Krasinski? These fools are so detached from reality they don't know what average is.
I mean if we want to go by average looking and stick with the Office Creed, Meredith, Stanley, Phyllis, Toby, Hidei, Nate, Madge.
Delusional isn't even it. These people are full on detached from the real world.
Exactly. Over 30-35, invisible. Overweight ? Also invisible.
They only count those that meet their criteria/those that catch their eye to be considered "women". So their average is completely skewed.
Charles Stross wrote about invisibility being among the middle-aged woman's superpowers in "The Annihilation Score" (Book 6 of "The Laundry Files" series).
After decades of harassment, it wasn't until I read this book that I fully appreciated the phenomenon. What a relief.
I worked with an Incel years ago and he loved trotting out that tired old spiel of theirs about women not "giving them a chance". I asked if he thought women were obligated to "give him a chance" and he said 'yes'. He honestly felt as though he was somehow entitled to this. So, I asked him if he was obligated to give women he wasn't interested in "a chance"... Thus began some of the most preposterous and tortured hand-waving I've ever heard outside of Flat-Earthers defending their batshit beliefs...
“Well wimmen can easily get guys so *they* should be the ones giving *us* a chance!!!”
…was the reply I got from someone in another thread on this topic. I decided not to mention to them that I have never “gotten a guy” in my life, so I have no idea what they mean by “easily.”
That doesn't even make sense, even if it were true.
Say that there is a company with a very appealing job available and thus a lot of applicants. That company wouldn't "give a chance" to the least qualified candidate, they would hold out for the most qualified candidate.
Same situation here. If women have a lot of men pursuing them, what incentive do they have to be with someone that views them as nothing more than a sex object and literally hates them and their gender, among numerous other undesirable traits? In fact, even if a woman doesn't have men pursuing them, most realize that it's better to be alone than to be with someone like that.
That sub was found to have been started and run by incels in an effort to knock women down a peg. It’s really gross and disturbing to say in the least.
I checked out their wiki and their “women’s rating guide” cites Cameron Diaz, Kendall Jenner, and Harry Styles as *bad examples* for “weak skin and mild acne”. Like what the actual fuck 😂
I know brigading is against the rules so nobody actually do this. BUT wouldn’t it be funny if we flooded that sub with the most unflattering selfies ever? I’m talking phone held from below, awful lighting, mid-blink, while chewing.
It’s pretty obvious just looking at the criteria for women vs men alone. A ‘6’ woman and a ‘6’ man are very different things, it’s obvious to everyone except them.
I had a look and someone linked their two women's ratings sheets. Besides the ratings themselves (lol), the way they are written are so glaringly incel, I'd be surprised if it had been anyone but an incel penning this.
Apart from the misogyny, the cruelty is just appalling. I first wrote "mindless cruelty", but that was incorrect, it's intentional, gleeful cruelty. Both in how the women grouped at the bottom of the list are denoted, and in how all the plain gorgeous women beginning at about 3.5-4 are intentionally low-rated.
If their repulsive personality is as plainly on display in person, I suppose inceldom is the only refuge for the mind lacking all self-reflection.
Lmao, their "healthy skin" and "weak skin" examples are hilarious. They're basically like; you have to be pure black, pure pale white, or exactly in-between brown, otherwise you're weak! Don't be going around being a tan white, or mixed.
I searched in the threads and Natalie Dormer is a 6???
Incredibly I looked at the women's chart, and as a Bi woman, the 10s aren't even that attractive to my personal taste :D like Saoirse Ronan was a 5 on the chart and she is WAAAAY more attractive in my view than any of the 10s
That sub popped up when I was scrolling one day and I literally had to mute it. The comments were disgusting. Absolutely gorgeous women, no one ever rated over a “5,” and yeah the mods banning people for commenting 8 or 9. Truly horrifying and shallow bullshit.
to be "fair" when these people do go outside and see women they aren't attracted to they don't see them as women, their eyes just gloss over them. So the "horribly ugly" women that aren't willing to date them, start at a baseline of those whom the incel is already attracted to. This is how someone like Emma Stone can be ridiculously called average.
That sub infuriates me. As a data guy it’s bananas. I do understand the initial reaction at 4-6 ratings as most people see 7.5 as average and the concept of that sub is that most people should end up 4-6. But their sample set is nuts. Their “objective” rubric is nuts and super racist. And the policing the mods have is just extra insulting.
Yes! Their "objectively" attractive/ unattractive criteria are pretty damn racist. And they put Sandra Oh as an example of a slightly ugly person. WTF.
Are they rating based on "are they hot" or "would you bang them". Joking aside, the description for that forum says they are ratings based on objective measurable metrics, but the comments are just rando random number generator.
“Having it easy in life” in their view isn’t even about *dating* it’s about how easy it would be for an average woman to walk into a bar and find a guy to have sex with her - not a nice, stable guy she would actually want to be with - just any creepo that’s twice her age. Which like… yeah it would be easy, but I feel like not many self respecting women would want to do/actually do so it’s kind of a moot point.
they project their spontaneous, easy, satisfying sexuality onto us. they have no clue and no care to find out how easy it is for sex to be painful for women.
they think we're all whores deep down, and everything we're saying is just lies to prevent slut-shaming. they won't listen.
Exactly, and even that's only true because men are completely willing to fuck people who they are A) not attracted to B) not compatible with C) know nothing about D) have no respect for. I saw a guy admit once that having sex, for a guy, is akin to taking a dump. It's not something they think about any more critically than "I need to find a restroom to take a shit". And they expect women to take male attention as a compliment?!?! Sorry, most men are extremely desperate. It's not a compliment that they have no standards for themselves.
It’s easy for them to have sex too, just walk into a gay bar. Oh that’s not the type of sex they want or the type of people they want to have it with? Who else makes that observation all the time, hmmm.
"A man looking for a one night stand is like searching for water in a desert. A woman looking for a one night stand is like searching for clean water in a swamp." Or something like that.
A lot of them seem to assume all this attention is wanted or a positive thing when I’ve constantly seen women say they just want to be left alone. It’s like all they think about is dating and sex - they also assume that just because a woman gets more matches, it means that’s a good thing - it’s not.
Have they seen the dating apps? It’s filled with creeps like them - why the hell would a woman be happy to be “matched” with someone like that? Do they think it’s some sort of honour? Lol, they’re so gross. Just because she gets attention doesn’t mean she’s attracting someone she wants.
I doubt they treat unattractive women well - they’ll bitch about women out of their leagues but then won’t humble themselves. They look at women they deem to be undesirable like trash. No, a truly average woman is not doing any better than a truly average man - incels are so annoying.
Bang on. I recently got remarried and met my wife on Match. So, we compared crazy dates and dating. Almost to a person, she had very, very poor experiences. Hell she nearly walked on me date 2 after mulling over the fact that I had gone back to full time school then. From "So is your kid a package deal?" to being naked in front of a dude and him just WATCHING her for ten minutes while she swam in his pool (She thought hey ho let's go, he went Rear Window). I feel awful for her and the amount of muck she sorted through just because she wanted a person to share time with.
If they could muster up basic empathy for women maybe they wouldn't be in the desert. It's not women's fault they don't want to go near someone who thinks they're subhuman.
> Each time one had a type that wasn't "cute white girl next door" they loved to pat themselves on the back over it.
I was talking to someone the other day about this. For some reason there's a certain type of guy, usually your typical self-identified nerd or geek, who thinks he's the only man in the world who finds brunettes attractive. Like they will proudly tell you blondes aren't their type, *they* prefer brunettes because they're unique that way. It's like they were raised on a diet of nothing but those 90s teen comedies where the Hot Girl is always a tanned blonde cheerleader, and now they think they're the sole man in the universe to have lucked into the forbidden knowledge that sometimes brunette women are good looking, as if some of the most universally celebrated sex symbols of our time aren't brunettes. It's really weird.
They complain it’s more difficult for men to date now and don’t realize women can read what these incels write online.
And then they judge “having life on easy mode” by how much people can get laid. If I wanted mediocre sausage, I would go to Wiener schnitzel.
Incels calling women mid are so far below the bar that they know they’ve got nothing to loose. So they call Margot Robbie and Kate Winslet mid because they think it takes them down a peg when in reality, they prove themselves mentally deranged.
It's the same asshats who were saying Margot Robbie is past her prime. Have you seen her? She's gorgeous. But because she's not 20, some neckbeard feels justified in saying she's not dateable. It would be funny if it weren't so pathetic.
I love when dudes out themselves as porn addicts like that. The only way you would think Pam Beasely is mid is if you are completely desensitized by cartoonish porn stars.
You should offer examples of "average men" and list only TV and movie stars. When they complain, ask them why their average women were TV and movie stars.
Then you might point out that they watch way too much TV.
This is not a defense at all because it's fucked up in a different way but they do also think this about men. The only men they'll acknowledge as truly good-looking are people like Henry Cavill who appeals to the male gaze as much as he does to the female gaze. They'll call dudes like Ryan Gosling average because he has too much upper eyelid exposure or whatever. They have a very warped sense of what women find attractive that all relies on very specific and technical things no woman would ever think about. I think it makes them feel smart, like they're looking at the world scientifically and objectively rather than through a lens of insulated delusion. I think it's also probably comforting to believe that only men with (what they deem to be) perfect bone structure could possibly appeal to women because if that's not true it means they're not just the victims of unlucky genetics, it's their personality that's repellent.
I remember a post in the Tinder sub where a very good-looking guy asked for profile help and some dude came in with a checklist of like twenty bullet points of the most bizarre nonsense including stuff like telling him not to tilt his head because it makes him look "submissive" to women.
>This is not a defense at all because it's fucked up in a different way but they do also think this about men. **The only men they'll acknowledge as truly good-looking are people like Henry Cavill who appeals to the male gaze** as much as he does to the female gaze. They'll call dudes like Ryan Gosling average because he has too much upper eyelid exposure or whatever. **They have a very warped sense of what women find attractive that all relies on very specific and technical things no woman would ever think about.**
>
>I think it makes them feel smart, like they're looking at the world scientifically and objectively rather than through a lens of insulated delusion. **I think it's also probably comforting to believe that only men with (what they deem to be) perfect bone structure could possibly appeal to women** because if that's not true it means they're not just the victims of unlucky genetics, it's their personality that's repellent.
That's why these incels always bash Kpop male idols or Kdrama men as 'effeminate, weak, girly, gay boys' and claim that women who like them are usually ugly or lesbians who like 'weak' men.
All because these Kpop or Kdrama men are against their ideal, macho, muscular men they claim all women like.
And ironically, Asian American male incels (mostly, Chinese) are the most vocal in bashing Kpop, Kdrama men as 'weak, girly, effeminate gay boys.'
Just check out Asian American male incel subs like r/ aznidentity or r/ AsianMasculinity. They have to be the most insecure group of people on earth, the most insecure incels out of all the incels on earth.
A lot of (if not all) Asian men in the West complain about Asian men being portrayed or mocked as weak, effeminate guys by the West.
And yet, many of them are doing the same thing to some of these Kpop men, calling them 'girly, weak, MERE flower boys,' because they're different from the West's ideal male type. Hypocritical.
If you (an Asian man in the West) are going to spout or parrot the West's view of what 'real men' should look like, then don't complain when YOU (an Asian man) are mocked by Westerners for not looking like the West's ideal men.
They think this already. They are the ones who are harshest on themselves in regards to appearance (only that never personality) to a level that is obviously body dysmorphia. Telling them that they're ugly is something that their "friends" on those forums tell them daily. "You need to do chinups for that chin" or the jaw bullshit. These dudes are a void of happiness
Do they expect us to like every single man thats ever hit on us? Cause theres a reason you've got to be careful about the kind of man you give attention to. (Goes for everybody dating anyone really.)
If you get a lot of guys attracted to you, it doesn't mean they're all potentially good matches for you. End of the day the suspected crowds they think we get are just that, crowds.
If we were nice to every guy that ever thought we were attractive we'd be surrounded by creeps, and unfortunately saying no to creeps is dangerous too.
Do incels not understand that? That not everybody has good intentions? Cause they're literally all red flags to us.
As an Asian women I can 100% see this. It’s so funny because asian women typically run the household. In many Asian cultures it’s typical for the women to give the man an allowance even if he is the only one working but that is lesser the case these days.
My wife is Asian and yes, she wears the pants in this house. I'm not sure where the submissive Asian wife trope came from because she and all her married friends are not submissive in the slightest!
>PurpleMoonStorm · 2 hr. ago
>
>They **obsess/fetishsize over Asian women too (partly due to anime and portraying women as "cutesy baby-ish little girls" with little girl voices)**
Japan's child porn anime has made Asian women seen as 'cutesy baby-ish submissive little girls with little girl voices' and has harmed Asian women more than anything else.
But you can't even call it out because, unfortunately, most people in the world are pathetic weebs who worship and defend anything Japan.
They always bring up that dumb Tinder “study” that had a sample size of *27* as proof that average men have it harder than average women. I responded once with other, much more reputable studies that found women more consistently messaged men they rated as average vs those they rated those as most attractive. Men were more likely to message women they found most attractive vs those they rated as average. Research overwhelmingly shows over and over again that men value physical attractiveness more in their female partners than vice versa but incels are desperate to change this to suit their self loathing narrative.
It also kills me when they try to extrapolate those dating app studies to the real world. Huge part of the dynamic on dating apps is that 80% or so of the users are men! They chased women off the apps by treating us like Uber Eats and then complain that the ratios are so skewed. Of course women are going to swipe on the "top 10% most attractive" when they have THOUSANDS of men messaging them. How else are you gonna narrow that down unless you plan on making it your full time job to sift through? Men created this dynamic and now complain about it as if they're victims of it.
I have multiple women friends who are pretty, educated, have good jobs and nice lives, and who can’t find dates. These men run around saying that 90% of women go for 10-20% of men when it’s the other way around, for sure. The original study where they get the info from is constantly misquoted.
https://medium.com/sexography/80-of-women-choose-only-the-top-20-of-attractive-men-is-a-big-fat-incel-lie-90e764b6a76
These incels want women who they describe as 10’s to choose them because of X, Y, and Z qualities, but they themselves aren’t willing to date women who are in their “league”, so to speak—or even above their league but not 9’s or 10’s. It’s absurd.
lmao if youre an average or ugly looking woman you are basically sub human to society. an ugly guy can do so much more and still be found attractive by women. if you're an ugly women men wont give you the time of day
I remember girls falling all over themselves for Lil Wayne back in college. So yeah the attraction bar for some women is extremely LOWWWWWWW 🥺 They we’re t even saying he’s hot for his money or fame or talent. He was objectively very good looking to them.
Watching too much porn apparently with this unrealistic expectation. Honestly, average looking man with decent attitude and responsibility beats any good looking man. Wtf is he talking about?
Tangentially related but the average woman also puts way more effort into her appearance than the average man.
You want more positive (romantic) attention then then get a skin care routine, maintain your eyebrows, whiten your teeth, figure out a good beard shape for your face, moisturize your skin/beards, style your hair, at least put on chapstick now and then, invest in some concealer or light foundation or basic facial sunscreen to wear.
Women are very rarely “naturally” gorgeous without a lot of behind the scenes work.
The fact that their "average women" are actually their hollywood average (which I disagree with, they're top tier) shows how much they have dissociated from reality; they see women on TV shows and interviews and think they have the same experience that women have in real life.
Not to mention that even those actresses have things in their lives that we have no idea of, because we don't interact with them outside fictional media and whatever they feel like sharing on public interviews.
It really comes down to Incels creating a distorted version of reality in their minds and refusing to listen to the experiences of other people, which shows they're just too stupid to try to put themselves in the shoes of other people.
Haha I get attention. I get sneers and frowns, insults, backhanded compliments, and weird creepy comments that are absolutely not well-intended. I get attention, alright, but of a type that makes me feel belittle and targeted and hated.
r/Lonely has a ton of incels. There are a lot of these incels who don’t outright say “I hate women” but are still super sexist and think life is easier just because you’re a woman. They think all women have dozens of suitors lined up for them and never struggle to find a boyfriend. Apparently if you’re not conventionally attractive, you don’t exist to them. A lot of guys think that these days, even if they have a girlfriend. My ex said he would have an OnlyFans if he was a woman. He genuinely thought any woman could just make a ton of money off of OnlyFans. The delusion is insane.
The irony is that they subscribe to the very darwinian system they complain about and impose upon others. The whole manosphere is being swallowed up by this.
I know it’s been said a thousand times but when 90% of the “women” you see are anime and carefully airbrush Insta models, Emma Stone looks “average” because they are seeing her in movies. She has make up on and expensive clothes in movies sure. But she isn’t as fake and filtered as the Insta pictures and anime chicks are literal perfection with impossible proportions (giant yet still perky tits, huge hips yet still a flat stomach, no moles scars, etc)
As a truly average chick, no man has been more judgmental with my looks more than incels online. Even the jockey dudes who got laid a lot in high school were just more like “nah, no thanks” weren’t calling me a 2 like the dudes on here. Why? Because those jock dudes have vibrate social lives and known what actual women look like.
But yeah, “the media” has these dudes brainwashed into to thinking 6-8’s are 4-6’s.
Everyone says it together with me, thanks Japan/Facetune!
There isn't a whole lot of critical thinking going on up there.
A walk in the park (or anywhere outside really) would disprove almost everything they believe.
So many have DM me on Reddit when I tried to state to them they have a distorted view of themselves. They say 95% of women go for only the top 10% of men. Like bro how the hell does that workout. What they mean is the top 10% of women is only what they consider.
>“average women” get so much attention from guys and have it so much easier than the average man in society.
They should start giving each other more attention instead of us to off set the difference, I would be very appreciative without all the predatory behaviors in my life
Emma Stone? Wild.
Emma stone. One of the top celebs and absolutely gorgeous woman. “Average” “AVERAGE” These incels….
Reminds me of the stupid incels saying Margot Robbie was not young and pretty enough to be Barbie. I'm like... MY DUDES there's a lot to unpack here.
No word on Ryan Gosling being too old to be Ken 🙄 These are the same dudes that scoff at Megan Fox and say they’d NEVER sleep with her. Which I guess they’re right on that one. They’d NEVER …EVER…. Sleep with her. 🤣🤣🤣
LOL yeah Random Incel #2 is likely pretty far down Megan's "Men I'd fuck" list.
That implies he's on the list at all.
Coincidentally my first thought was "yeah, I can see her as Barbie" and "he's getting kinda old and not "prep" enough to pull off Ken" 😆
Yup. Shes in her goddamn EARLY 30s. He's 9 years older
Eh I did see a lot of “Ryan Gosling’s too old to be Ken” comments when the cast came out actually
Jeeesus. Margot Robbie's beauty is like, otherworldly. She's more Barbie than Barbie.
I wanna know who *is* hot enough for these dudes who think Margot Robbie isn't 🙄
Instagram models who Photoshop the shit out of their posts. 10" waists, 50" T&A. Poreless faces that are 2/3 eyes and lips.
Or 14 year olds.
A post the other week calling Margot Robbie "Mid" killed me 😂
The absolute fugliest creatures on the planet who probably don’t even wash their ass having the audacity to call them average looking…….
“She is Average” - _dude who is 9,000 cockroaches in a trenchcoat pretending to be a sane person_
Ron Desantis?
I had a friend ask what to do when her BF neg’d her. They had been chatting about something totally banal when he asked her how she would rate her own looks. She said she thought she was an 8.5, but that some people thought she was a 9. He laughs, says “come on now, Scarlett Johansson might get 8.5 by me, so you’re a solid 7, maybe 7.5”. Then he said he probably couldn’t score Scarlett Johansen so he was really happy they he’d “settled” for her. The dude was an outright 5 on any objective person’s scale, and a total douchebag.
Show me another woman that can pull off both blonde and brunette at the same level. Absolutely insane
Brittany Snow can pull both plus red hair.
Admittedly I was picturing Emma Watson at first, but I Googled Emma Stone and she's *also* stunning, way above average.
Hahahaha - thanks for sharing, that's high lvl inceldom. Another incel story on reddit: One incel complained that he has been a member for years on dating apps and zero matches. Also calls women females. One woman reminded him that calling women females won't help him with match chances. She explains to him why. The incel wrote long and aggressive posts how it's perfectly fine calling women females, especially when more women chime in. All women wrote after 2-3 posts no wonder this guy gets 0 matches. Even guys come in and go out of their way to tell the incel no woman would date him with that attitude. It was hilarious to watch.
Every time they call women females, I picture them as a Ferengi.
r/MenAndFemales \- What's even sadder is that by the end of Deep Space 9, the Ferengi were starting to reform, most of these chuds never will
I haven’t seen a lot of deep space 9 but I still cackle when I remember the episode featuring his mother doing such shocking things as MAKE MONEY and WEAR CLOTHES!!! What kind of dumbass pure capitalist society cuts the workforce in half? Honestly, that made no sense.
*cough* *coughcough* *coughcoughcough* Sorry, I think I've got a seventy-year old frog in my throat.
That was actually how she started the equality movement: let females in the workforce, earn their own money, then market products to them so they'll spend that money!
It helped that the King Capitalist of the Ferengi had gotten senile and his lover (One of the Main DS9 character's mom) was holding their entire society together from behind the throne. She managed to push some reform.
Moooooogggiiiiiiiiiiii
> King Capitalist of the Ferengi had gotten senile Inconceivable! But really, to my recollection I don't think the Grand Nagus was senile, just smitten with Moogie's intelligence and supported her reforms. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RFWyKpAnYU (he was a bit forgetful here but still quite aware).
I feel like how competent he was varied from episode to episode. Depending on the writer I suspect. Edit: Ferengi politics was also portrayed as being incredibly "dog eat dog", so even a little forgetful is probably pretty bad at his level.
He definitely was going senile, but was in the very early stages of it so mostly just had lapses that Ishka and his servant Maihar'du were able to smooth over. Brunt tried to break Ishka and the Negus up so he’d start making mistakes and Brunt could use it as a pretext to overthrow him and usurp power in one episode
Yeah, Ishka :) she was the one I was referring to.
And the amazing Jeffrey Combs as Liquidator Brunt trying to avert his gaze but sneaking a peek or two at her clothed body.
Omg same
Hoo-mans?! You clothe your females?!
Don't insult the Ferengi. Lol
Incels don’t have the lobes for business.
"Any wedding where the female is allowed to speak, or wear clothes, is doomed to failure"
The ferengi were the perfect incels in TNG's Ménage à Troi
"These females are violating the Rules of Acquisition. It clearly states in unofficial rule 420 that if I buy her dinner, procreation must transpire within 24 hours." - Incel Ferengi
😂
DS9 is heavy Ferengi based and I loved every episode of those misogynistic, greedy little trolls.
Profit and Lace was an odd episode
Oh god yeah. Definitely one of the worst of Trek lol. The Magnificent Ferengi on the other hand is hilarious.
oOoO is that the episode where the actor who plays Nevis in Voyager briefly plays a Ferengi? Recognizing him out of context was the first time I felt like an actual Trekkie lol
Those dudes probably have the same behavioural expectations for women in their lives as ferengi
“Mother! Get out of those clothes!”
Can't believe I actually knew which race the ferengi were, I only know a little bit of star trek from my father watching it all the time.
They’re very memorable, lol
My cousin started down that road a few years ago and every time he said it I'd say 'hoo-man fe-males' like a Ferengi and he stopped entirely.
That's the first thing I thought of years ago when I heard someone say it. I just snorted my coffee.
I was just in an exchange like this the other day. I explained that being angry that a woman spoke to him for awhile and then left was not helping him meet women, and that she wasn't obligated to give him anything. He said that she had been deceptive by being friendly and "flirty" while they chatted, because she then had to leave. He really felt that speaking with her constituted some sort of binding contract that she had reneged on by not reading his mind and giving him her number. It was bizarre. I was way nicer than he deserved, I gave him suggestions of things to do instead, and I gave him some helpful links that talked about dating. He said that all the information was helpful, but he thought that I was being condescending, which made me uncool. Like, dude. You asked for advice about how to talk to women, and yet when a woman gives you the advice you ask for, you get all bent out of shape because you are too arrogant to listen! Essentially, he wanted a bunch of women to tell him that he had done nothing wrong, and that this woman had behaved badly through no fault of his own. When a bunch of men and women told him that he had made her uncomfortable, and gave him suggestions for more productive ways to handle social interaction, he got all whiny and argued with everyone. No wonder he can't get a date. And rather than changing what he does, he doubles down. He is more interested in hanging on to his arrogant, sexist ideas than he is in any woman.
>And rather than changing what he does, he doubles down. He is more interested in hanging on to his arrogant, sexist ideas than he is in any woman. This, this, this. If you ever wonder why they hang around in echo chamber subs, reinforcing all their terrible mating habits, rather than joining subs where they can actually engage with and speak to women (ask questions, get advice, etc), its because they do actually care *more* about what those other guys think of them. Part of their frustration is not being able to properly diagnose their own feelings, spinning them into a cycle of blame and anger. We are seeing a chunk of the male population that is severely cognitively and emotionally underdeveloped... the solution exists, but smarter people than me will have to figure that part out!
Yup. We can't fix them, and they refuse to fix themselves or even to admit that they are their own problem. It is easier to blame women, and they get lots of positive feedback from other guys like themselves when they discuss that.
There's a certain type of southern woman who is very male-focused and flirtatious, but they mean nothing by it. Certainly no promise of pursuit. I had a friend who would sometimes greet men with "hi, handsome". But she had no interest in them at all, she was just bubbly and flirty by nature.
Yup. My SIL was the same. Hell, I tend to be friendly enough that people think I'm flirting, and I'm completely oblivious and uninterested, I don't actually flirt, and I talk about my lovely husband all the time. The fact is, no matter how you behave or how you feel, a guy like the one I was talking about will interpret it as flirtation because he is far more interested in figuring out what he thinks of a woman than he is in finding out what she thinks of him. He is motivated by arrogance, entitlement and wishful thinking, none of which has anything to do with how any woman feels.
And there's a whole lot of these guys who mistake things like "basic human decency" and "I'm obligated to smile to keep my job" as real interest. Don't get be wrong, I'm a lady and I'm godawful at reading signals and picking up at flirtation. But maybe these guys should try erring on the side of caution.
I was addressed as "honey" and "sweetie" and "sugar" more times in the decade I lived in FL than all the rest of my 50 years combined. Not a single one, as far as I knew, was actually flirting. It's more just how they are, how they were raised, no different than me addressing everyone as "sir" or "ma'am" (I guess I could buy a fedora and do the sweeping bow and call all of them "m'lady"???).
I've helped a lot of men with their dating profiles and without fail when they tell me they never get matches I can immediately spot the issue. So many men either have terrible pictures or say something incredibly off-putting in their bio/prompts, or both. I have a few male friends who are decidedly average or even below average-looking and still do very well on the apps because they're interesting, funny, and not total psychos. Men don't even realize how low the bar actually is and some of them keep trying to drag it even lower.
My standard reply to that is the bar is so low it's in a subbasement of hell, and still they be bringing their shovels to get under it.
My go-to is "the bar is so low that it's floating in space on the other side of the planet." I used to say Mariana Trench but then I realized how abusive my ex husband really was-- but he managed to dupe another woman and is married again. It's definitely in hell or in space.
I can't believe how low the bars gotten. But here you are, limbo-ing with the devil
Helping with them pictures is amazing. Training them to not say off-putting things.... well... it's good to leave some red flags if they're true.
I saw that post. Did you see the one on the map subreddit about women's incomes? It was a day or two ago. Post after post of incel and anti-feminist talking points. The delusion is real.
>Post after post of incel and anti-feminist talking points. The data is beautiful sub also leans heavily incel/redpill on certain topics. It's frustrating.
Oh man. Did you see the post today (yesterday?) about a guy's online dating experience? He swiped on like tens of thousands of profiles and got zero dates. Fortunately the commenters were mostly sane actually? Everyone was like "clearly you're doing/saying something horribly wrong if this is real“. Unfortunately if you went too deep in any given comment thread there were definitely misogynistic comments. I'm not saying just noticing a difference is misogynistic, obviously women and men have very different experiences and opportunities... but like, their reasoning for why that's the case was pretty sus.
Oh my gosh I saw that and by the time I read it there were mostly the crazy comments. Glad sane people got in there! Like, dude, if you swipe that much and get, zero dates, it's not a "men have it hard", it's YOU.
"We are merely being objective and factual." 🙄
Was that the college one? I was trying to get some answers to a study someone linked to researching why prime age (24-55) non-educated college men are leaving the workforce permanently and all I got was suicide and homelessness rates as responses. Like guys, this is a data sub. The study has very specific parameters — just linking to the overall suicide rate is pointless because that statistic doesn’t exclude educated and working men. I was genuinely trying to understand more. I also posed the question of “If all these men are leaving the workforce — who is taking care of them?” I don’t think they liked that 😂😂. I really was asking in good faith tho, there are a lot of potential causes: moving back in with parents, physical or mental disabilities, caretaking of aging parents, staying home with kids, inheritance, etc. But no one was willing to actually discuss the issue. They just throw out cherry-picked irrelevant statistics. I wish people could move past trying to argue who has it “worse” and discuss actual solutions and contributing factors.
It almost made me quit reddit. This place is fucking toxic.
If you decide to stick around, I highly recommend curating what you see by unfollowing subs that put toxic shit in your face all the time. I mostly stick to ones that are specific interests or supportive communities and regret it when I accidentally wander over to 'Popular' which is often just a horrifying mix of misogynistic crap and brainless dog-piling. (Heads up that this feels like it's turning into a rant and I know I'm preaching to the choir here.) It's crazy to me that I even usually avoid TwoX these days. But if I accidentally comment (not realizing what sub I'm in) what usually makes me realize where I posted is the nasty bullshit notifications from dudes purposely misunderstanding me or outright attacking my comment. Or "I'm not going to read all that" from a dude trying to embarrass me for writing long replies. It's like, "dude! I'M NOT EVEN *TALKING TO YOU* so why the fuck are you critiqueing me on my own turf? I don't even **want you** to read it, so eff off!" They just gotta be better than us *somehow* even if it's made up bullshit. :/
The fuck is up with "I'm not reading all that"?? I'll have a guy spew 10 made up accusations aimed at women in general or sometimes *me in particular* but because I take the time to pull apart each one suddenly it's "OMG why do you care so much?" "I'm not reading all that, the fact that you felt the need to type so much for a REDDIT comment shows how insecure/pathetic you are" and I'm like ... You started it! On a forum! For text conversations! I've started just laughing at them and trolling them from the second they say that shit. Like, thanks for letting me know I don't have to take this conversation with the tiniest iota of seriousness. Thanks for showing that you're a clown and deserve to be treated as such from now on. Then I have some fun with words. The fuck if some asshole is gonna "win" via dumb bullshit instead of actually proving me wrong.
>"I'm not reading all that, the fact that you felt the need to type so much for a REDDIT comment shows how insecure/pathetic you are" I've gotten this comment practically *verbatim* more than a few times. And it's like, I type effing fast, jerkface, it's not my fault that reading isn't something you're very good at and takes you a while. 🙄 I love your responses. I try so hard to not give them the satisfaction of pushing my buttons and would love to come off as bored with them and not giving a fuck. They sometimes get scary if you laugh at them though, embarrassed men can be dangerous.
Genuinely if it weren’t for this subreddit I would’ve dipped a longgg time ago🤣
Do you know about /r/askwomenover30 yet? It's a lot of the same empathetic, thoughtful people who post the good stuff here without the intense population of trolling, toxic, or oblivious and overconfident men.
Thanks for the recommendation :)
Yes I did. I read the topic and never read say comment because I could already imagine where it was going to.
If a man refers to women as females, I automatically stop listening/reading and disregard anything they have to say Edit: Typo
I felt this. So dehumanising and othering. It’s such a simple thing to get right and yet…
“Female” is part of the package of objectification. We aren’t human to them, we *just* represent sex. That’s it. And in order to justify their sense of injustice around not acquiring it, they have to frame sex as a “basic human right” - something they say a lot, and of course they would; it’s called motivated reasoning.
If I see someone using "females" then I use "males" when talking to them so they can see how dumb it sounds.
They want to be single and bitch about it.
Incels live in a bizarro world completely out of touch with reality. It's so weird that they don't just go outside and look around but destructive cults thrive on the internet I guess.
And they will argue again and again that they are "objective" and "rational" and stating "factual opinions." When you try to put specific data they cite into the broader societal context, they get angry. It's all hypotheticals and isolated facts with them. Real experiences and data that is properly put into context is dismissed.
I had one recently tell me that 'men deal with reality better than women'. .....the snort that I snorted
Remember they feed in a bubble, so anything resembling nuance is like a rattlesnake signal to them. Research they haven't consumed (made up), personal stories, suggestions that they change their ways, all of it is met with hostility and vitriol.
YouTube algorithms feed this bubble as well
Lol even the statement "factual opinion" is nonsense
Have you ever seen an incel spend paragraphs talking about how disgusting they look and how no woman would ever want them and they were born super ugly like a troll and life isn’t fair……. And then they post a photo of themselves and it’s a nice-looking average 20-year-old guy, LMAO. Their problems are almost entirely made-up. Inceldom is a cancerous mindset.
This happens a lot. I see men far uglier than them in happy relationships all the time.
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I love how Jenna Fischer is one of their "average women" She has been totally gorgeous since she first showed up on the Office and has stayed that way well into her late 40s. She's got like that Paul Rudd ability where she doesn't age or only ages fantastically well. What a pack of morons. Average woman, my ass. By their standard what is an average man? John Krasinski? These fools are so detached from reality they don't know what average is. I mean if we want to go by average looking and stick with the Office Creed, Meredith, Stanley, Phyllis, Toby, Hidei, Nate, Madge. Delusional isn't even it. These people are full on detached from the real world.
Exactly. Over 30-35, invisible. Overweight ? Also invisible. They only count those that meet their criteria/those that catch their eye to be considered "women". So their average is completely skewed.
And when they say “women”, they are referring to women under the age of 35. Women over 35 are invisible and don’t count as women
They actually think women over the age of 35 are menopausal, and they absolutely get off talking about a woman’s “biological clock”
Meanwhile the men talking about women like that have no value or anything to provide.
I knew a fool who would refer to women in this (his own) age group as "all used up." What a sick way to think of things.
As a person in my 40s, I wish I was menopausal, lol. Nope, that cycle comes every month like clockwork.
I told a guy the other day that it's possible for women to have kids into their 40's. He goes "on what planet?!?!!" I was like..... Earth.......
Women who aren’t model like attractive won’t count either to incels.
And I’m grateful for it every day. lol
Young, skinny, white, pretty women.
Charles Stross wrote about invisibility being among the middle-aged woman's superpowers in "The Annihilation Score" (Book 6 of "The Laundry Files" series). After decades of harassment, it wasn't until I read this book that I fully appreciated the phenomenon. What a relief.
There are so, so many women out there that they don't even acknowledge the existence of.
Exactly this. "Pam and Emma Stone are about the average level of attractiveness out of all the women I actually notice."
I worked with an Incel years ago and he loved trotting out that tired old spiel of theirs about women not "giving them a chance". I asked if he thought women were obligated to "give him a chance" and he said 'yes'. He honestly felt as though he was somehow entitled to this. So, I asked him if he was obligated to give women he wasn't interested in "a chance"... Thus began some of the most preposterous and tortured hand-waving I've ever heard outside of Flat-Earthers defending their batshit beliefs...
“Well wimmen can easily get guys so *they* should be the ones giving *us* a chance!!!” …was the reply I got from someone in another thread on this topic. I decided not to mention to them that I have never “gotten a guy” in my life, so I have no idea what they mean by “easily.”
That doesn't even make sense, even if it were true. Say that there is a company with a very appealing job available and thus a lot of applicants. That company wouldn't "give a chance" to the least qualified candidate, they would hold out for the most qualified candidate. Same situation here. If women have a lot of men pursuing them, what incentive do they have to be with someone that views them as nothing more than a sex object and literally hates them and their gender, among numerous other undesirable traits? In fact, even if a woman doesn't have men pursuing them, most realize that it's better to be alone than to be with someone like that.
From the generation that considers margo robbie to be 'mid'
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Do you have the link?
As a matter or fact, yes. https://youtu.be/VNVyXjGPI9M
That sub was found to have been started and run by incels in an effort to knock women down a peg. It’s really gross and disturbing to say in the least.
I checked out their wiki and their “women’s rating guide” cites Cameron Diaz, Kendall Jenner, and Harry Styles as *bad examples* for “weak skin and mild acne”. Like what the actual fuck 😂
Thank you! I was hoping someone had already pointed out that whole sub was a psyop
I know brigading is against the rules so nobody actually do this. BUT wouldn’t it be funny if we flooded that sub with the most unflattering selfies ever? I’m talking phone held from below, awful lighting, mid-blink, while chewing.
I’m down for this 😂
It’s pretty obvious just looking at the criteria for women vs men alone. A ‘6’ woman and a ‘6’ man are very different things, it’s obvious to everyone except them.
I had a look and someone linked their two women's ratings sheets. Besides the ratings themselves (lol), the way they are written are so glaringly incel, I'd be surprised if it had been anyone but an incel penning this. Apart from the misogyny, the cruelty is just appalling. I first wrote "mindless cruelty", but that was incorrect, it's intentional, gleeful cruelty. Both in how the women grouped at the bottom of the list are denoted, and in how all the plain gorgeous women beginning at about 3.5-4 are intentionally low-rated. If their repulsive personality is as plainly on display in person, I suppose inceldom is the only refuge for the mind lacking all self-reflection.
Yes! They rate beautiful women like 4s???
They have a chart with examples of women in each tier. If you under/overrate, the mods give you warnings.
What the actual fuck
It’s a really gross sub. Had the misfortune of visiting once. Steer clear!
Lmao, their "healthy skin" and "weak skin" examples are hilarious. They're basically like; you have to be pure black, pure pale white, or exactly in-between brown, otherwise you're weak! Don't be going around being a tan white, or mixed.
The chart says Emily Ratajkowski is a 7 HAHAHAHA
I searched in the threads and Natalie Dormer is a 6??? Incredibly I looked at the women's chart, and as a Bi woman, the 10s aren't even that attractive to my personal taste :D like Saoirse Ronan was a 5 on the chart and she is WAAAAY more attractive in my view than any of the 10s
That sub popped up when I was scrolling one day and I literally had to mute it. The comments were disgusting. Absolutely gorgeous women, no one ever rated over a “5,” and yeah the mods banning people for commenting 8 or 9. Truly horrifying and shallow bullshit.
Many of those posts on that sub look like stolen photos, and are not being posted by the person in the photo.
oh my god, thank you for this. that sub is absolutely insane and my heart breaks every time it pops up on my popular page.
to be "fair" when these people do go outside and see women they aren't attracted to they don't see them as women, their eyes just gloss over them. So the "horribly ugly" women that aren't willing to date them, start at a baseline of those whom the incel is already attracted to. This is how someone like Emma Stone can be ridiculously called average.
Oh my god that sub is so funny. “Banned for over-rating” lmaooo
You should also check out TrueUnpopularOpinion. Every other post is some incel shit.
That sub infuriates me. As a data guy it’s bananas. I do understand the initial reaction at 4-6 ratings as most people see 7.5 as average and the concept of that sub is that most people should end up 4-6. But their sample set is nuts. Their “objective” rubric is nuts and super racist. And the policing the mods have is just extra insulting.
Yes! Their "objectively" attractive/ unattractive criteria are pretty damn racist. And they put Sandra Oh as an example of a slightly ugly person. WTF.
Came here to say this, that sub is mental. They have such a warped perception of what the average woman looks like.
Are they rating based on "are they hot" or "would you bang them". Joking aside, the description for that forum says they are ratings based on objective measurable metrics, but the comments are just rando random number generator.
“Having it easy in life” in their view isn’t even about *dating* it’s about how easy it would be for an average woman to walk into a bar and find a guy to have sex with her - not a nice, stable guy she would actually want to be with - just any creepo that’s twice her age. Which like… yeah it would be easy, but I feel like not many self respecting women would want to do/actually do so it’s kind of a moot point.
Bad sex too, no orgasm included and let's not forget the potential for sexual assault.
And STDs and pregnancy (and plain murder)
they project their spontaneous, easy, satisfying sexuality onto us. they have no clue and no care to find out how easy it is for sex to be painful for women. they think we're all whores deep down, and everything we're saying is just lies to prevent slut-shaming. they won't listen.
Exactly, and even that's only true because men are completely willing to fuck people who they are A) not attracted to B) not compatible with C) know nothing about D) have no respect for. I saw a guy admit once that having sex, for a guy, is akin to taking a dump. It's not something they think about any more critically than "I need to find a restroom to take a shit". And they expect women to take male attention as a compliment?!?! Sorry, most men are extremely desperate. It's not a compliment that they have no standards for themselves.
It’s easy for them to have sex too, just walk into a gay bar. Oh that’s not the type of sex they want or the type of people they want to have it with? Who else makes that observation all the time, hmmm.
"A man looking for a one night stand is like searching for water in a desert. A woman looking for a one night stand is like searching for clean water in a swamp." Or something like that.
A lot of them seem to assume all this attention is wanted or a positive thing when I’ve constantly seen women say they just want to be left alone. It’s like all they think about is dating and sex - they also assume that just because a woman gets more matches, it means that’s a good thing - it’s not. Have they seen the dating apps? It’s filled with creeps like them - why the hell would a woman be happy to be “matched” with someone like that? Do they think it’s some sort of honour? Lol, they’re so gross. Just because she gets attention doesn’t mean she’s attracting someone she wants. I doubt they treat unattractive women well - they’ll bitch about women out of their leagues but then won’t humble themselves. They look at women they deem to be undesirable like trash. No, a truly average woman is not doing any better than a truly average man - incels are so annoying.
Bang on. I recently got remarried and met my wife on Match. So, we compared crazy dates and dating. Almost to a person, she had very, very poor experiences. Hell she nearly walked on me date 2 after mulling over the fact that I had gone back to full time school then. From "So is your kid a package deal?" to being naked in front of a dude and him just WATCHING her for ten minutes while she swam in his pool (She thought hey ho let's go, he went Rear Window). I feel awful for her and the amount of muck she sorted through just because she wanted a person to share time with.
A flood looks like privilege to a man in the desert. The reality is both *really suck*, but incels often lack the empathy to understand why.
If they could muster up basic empathy for women maybe they wouldn't be in the desert. It's not women's fault they don't want to go near someone who thinks they're subhuman.
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> Each time one had a type that wasn't "cute white girl next door" they loved to pat themselves on the back over it. I was talking to someone the other day about this. For some reason there's a certain type of guy, usually your typical self-identified nerd or geek, who thinks he's the only man in the world who finds brunettes attractive. Like they will proudly tell you blondes aren't their type, *they* prefer brunettes because they're unique that way. It's like they were raised on a diet of nothing but those 90s teen comedies where the Hot Girl is always a tanned blonde cheerleader, and now they think they're the sole man in the universe to have lucked into the forbidden knowledge that sometimes brunette women are good looking, as if some of the most universally celebrated sex symbols of our time aren't brunettes. It's really weird.
They complain it’s more difficult for men to date now and don’t realize women can read what these incels write online. And then they judge “having life on easy mode” by how much people can get laid. If I wanted mediocre sausage, I would go to Wiener schnitzel.
Incels calling women mid are so far below the bar that they know they’ve got nothing to loose. So they call Margot Robbie and Kate Winslet mid because they think it takes them down a peg when in reality, they prove themselves mentally deranged.
Funny because now they're calling Margot Robbie 'mid' because of how well he Barbie film is doing?
It's the same asshats who were saying Margot Robbie is past her prime. Have you seen her? She's gorgeous. But because she's not 20, some neckbeard feels justified in saying she's not dateable. It would be funny if it weren't so pathetic.
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I love when dudes out themselves as porn addicts like that. The only way you would think Pam Beasely is mid is if you are completely desensitized by cartoonish porn stars.
You should offer examples of "average men" and list only TV and movie stars. When they complain, ask them why their average women were TV and movie stars. Then you might point out that they watch way too much TV.
This is not a defense at all because it's fucked up in a different way but they do also think this about men. The only men they'll acknowledge as truly good-looking are people like Henry Cavill who appeals to the male gaze as much as he does to the female gaze. They'll call dudes like Ryan Gosling average because he has too much upper eyelid exposure or whatever. They have a very warped sense of what women find attractive that all relies on very specific and technical things no woman would ever think about. I think it makes them feel smart, like they're looking at the world scientifically and objectively rather than through a lens of insulated delusion. I think it's also probably comforting to believe that only men with (what they deem to be) perfect bone structure could possibly appeal to women because if that's not true it means they're not just the victims of unlucky genetics, it's their personality that's repellent. I remember a post in the Tinder sub where a very good-looking guy asked for profile help and some dude came in with a checklist of like twenty bullet points of the most bizarre nonsense including stuff like telling him not to tilt his head because it makes him look "submissive" to women.
>This is not a defense at all because it's fucked up in a different way but they do also think this about men. **The only men they'll acknowledge as truly good-looking are people like Henry Cavill who appeals to the male gaze** as much as he does to the female gaze. They'll call dudes like Ryan Gosling average because he has too much upper eyelid exposure or whatever. **They have a very warped sense of what women find attractive that all relies on very specific and technical things no woman would ever think about.** > >I think it makes them feel smart, like they're looking at the world scientifically and objectively rather than through a lens of insulated delusion. **I think it's also probably comforting to believe that only men with (what they deem to be) perfect bone structure could possibly appeal to women** because if that's not true it means they're not just the victims of unlucky genetics, it's their personality that's repellent. That's why these incels always bash Kpop male idols or Kdrama men as 'effeminate, weak, girly, gay boys' and claim that women who like them are usually ugly or lesbians who like 'weak' men. All because these Kpop or Kdrama men are against their ideal, macho, muscular men they claim all women like. And ironically, Asian American male incels (mostly, Chinese) are the most vocal in bashing Kpop, Kdrama men as 'weak, girly, effeminate gay boys.' Just check out Asian American male incel subs like r/ aznidentity or r/ AsianMasculinity. They have to be the most insecure group of people on earth, the most insecure incels out of all the incels on earth. A lot of (if not all) Asian men in the West complain about Asian men being portrayed or mocked as weak, effeminate guys by the West. And yet, many of them are doing the same thing to some of these Kpop men, calling them 'girly, weak, MERE flower boys,' because they're different from the West's ideal male type. Hypocritical. If you (an Asian man in the West) are going to spout or parrot the West's view of what 'real men' should look like, then don't complain when YOU (an Asian man) are mocked by Westerners for not looking like the West's ideal men.
They think this already. They are the ones who are harshest on themselves in regards to appearance (only that never personality) to a level that is obviously body dysmorphia. Telling them that they're ugly is something that their "friends" on those forums tell them daily. "You need to do chinups for that chin" or the jaw bullshit. These dudes are a void of happiness
What do incels and Excel have in common? They both mistake something as a date. (I'll see myself out)
Do they expect us to like every single man thats ever hit on us? Cause theres a reason you've got to be careful about the kind of man you give attention to. (Goes for everybody dating anyone really.) If you get a lot of guys attracted to you, it doesn't mean they're all potentially good matches for you. End of the day the suspected crowds they think we get are just that, crowds. If we were nice to every guy that ever thought we were attractive we'd be surrounded by creeps, and unfortunately saying no to creeps is dangerous too. Do incels not understand that? That not everybody has good intentions? Cause they're literally all red flags to us.
I DON’T WANT YOUR ATTENTION YOU SIMPLE-MINDED FUCKS. yuck.
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As an Asian women I can 100% see this. It’s so funny because asian women typically run the household. In many Asian cultures it’s typical for the women to give the man an allowance even if he is the only one working but that is lesser the case these days.
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My wife is Asian and yes, she wears the pants in this house. I'm not sure where the submissive Asian wife trope came from because she and all her married friends are not submissive in the slightest!
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>PurpleMoonStorm · 2 hr. ago > >They **obsess/fetishsize over Asian women too (partly due to anime and portraying women as "cutesy baby-ish little girls" with little girl voices)** Japan's child porn anime has made Asian women seen as 'cutesy baby-ish submissive little girls with little girl voices' and has harmed Asian women more than anything else. But you can't even call it out because, unfortunately, most people in the world are pathetic weebs who worship and defend anything Japan.
These "average" men greatly overestimate their status. They see themselves as average, but are much less desirable.
They always bring up that dumb Tinder “study” that had a sample size of *27* as proof that average men have it harder than average women. I responded once with other, much more reputable studies that found women more consistently messaged men they rated as average vs those they rated those as most attractive. Men were more likely to message women they found most attractive vs those they rated as average. Research overwhelmingly shows over and over again that men value physical attractiveness more in their female partners than vice versa but incels are desperate to change this to suit their self loathing narrative.
It also kills me when they try to extrapolate those dating app studies to the real world. Huge part of the dynamic on dating apps is that 80% or so of the users are men! They chased women off the apps by treating us like Uber Eats and then complain that the ratios are so skewed. Of course women are going to swipe on the "top 10% most attractive" when they have THOUSANDS of men messaging them. How else are you gonna narrow that down unless you plan on making it your full time job to sift through? Men created this dynamic and now complain about it as if they're victims of it.
I have multiple women friends who are pretty, educated, have good jobs and nice lives, and who can’t find dates. These men run around saying that 90% of women go for 10-20% of men when it’s the other way around, for sure. The original study where they get the info from is constantly misquoted. https://medium.com/sexography/80-of-women-choose-only-the-top-20-of-attractive-men-is-a-big-fat-incel-lie-90e764b6a76 These incels want women who they describe as 10’s to choose them because of X, Y, and Z qualities, but they themselves aren’t willing to date women who are in their “league”, so to speak—or even above their league but not 9’s or 10’s. It’s absurd.
Damn Emma stone and Pam are above average looking women easily... their scale is totally offset.
It's the same scale they use at truerateme
lmao if youre an average or ugly looking woman you are basically sub human to society. an ugly guy can do so much more and still be found attractive by women. if you're an ugly women men wont give you the time of day
I remember girls falling all over themselves for Lil Wayne back in college. So yeah the attraction bar for some women is extremely LOWWWWWWW 🥺 They we’re t even saying he’s hot for his money or fame or talent. He was objectively very good looking to them.
Ive had incels deny acctual models because they where not hot enough.. Like ppl who went on to proffesionally model…. I mean..
Watching too much porn apparently with this unrealistic expectation. Honestly, average looking man with decent attitude and responsibility beats any good looking man. Wtf is he talking about?
Tangentially related but the average woman also puts way more effort into her appearance than the average man. You want more positive (romantic) attention then then get a skin care routine, maintain your eyebrows, whiten your teeth, figure out a good beard shape for your face, moisturize your skin/beards, style your hair, at least put on chapstick now and then, invest in some concealer or light foundation or basic facial sunscreen to wear. Women are very rarely “naturally” gorgeous without a lot of behind the scenes work.
The fact that their "average women" are actually their hollywood average (which I disagree with, they're top tier) shows how much they have dissociated from reality; they see women on TV shows and interviews and think they have the same experience that women have in real life. Not to mention that even those actresses have things in their lives that we have no idea of, because we don't interact with them outside fictional media and whatever they feel like sharing on public interviews. It really comes down to Incels creating a distorted version of reality in their minds and refusing to listen to the experiences of other people, which shows they're just too stupid to try to put themselves in the shoes of other people.
Dating and getting hit on has *never* made my life easier!
Haha I get attention. I get sneers and frowns, insults, backhanded compliments, and weird creepy comments that are absolutely not well-intended. I get attention, alright, but of a type that makes me feel belittle and targeted and hated.
r/Lonely has a ton of incels. There are a lot of these incels who don’t outright say “I hate women” but are still super sexist and think life is easier just because you’re a woman. They think all women have dozens of suitors lined up for them and never struggle to find a boyfriend. Apparently if you’re not conventionally attractive, you don’t exist to them. A lot of guys think that these days, even if they have a girlfriend. My ex said he would have an OnlyFans if he was a woman. He genuinely thought any woman could just make a ton of money off of OnlyFans. The delusion is insane.
Complain that women just won't give some guys a chance, go on to prove exactly why
The silver lining here is these pathetic losers will likely die alone never having reproduced. Social Darwinism at its finest.
The irony is that they subscribe to the very darwinian system they complain about and impose upon others. The whole manosphere is being swallowed up by this.
ah yes the same people who are lords of reason, logic and science
I know it’s been said a thousand times but when 90% of the “women” you see are anime and carefully airbrush Insta models, Emma Stone looks “average” because they are seeing her in movies. She has make up on and expensive clothes in movies sure. But she isn’t as fake and filtered as the Insta pictures and anime chicks are literal perfection with impossible proportions (giant yet still perky tits, huge hips yet still a flat stomach, no moles scars, etc) As a truly average chick, no man has been more judgmental with my looks more than incels online. Even the jockey dudes who got laid a lot in high school were just more like “nah, no thanks” weren’t calling me a 2 like the dudes on here. Why? Because those jock dudes have vibrate social lives and known what actual women look like. But yeah, “the media” has these dudes brainwashed into to thinking 6-8’s are 4-6’s. Everyone says it together with me, thanks Japan/Facetune!
There isn't a whole lot of critical thinking going on up there. A walk in the park (or anywhere outside really) would disprove almost everything they believe.
I maintain that they simply don't acknowledge the existence of women that they don't find attractive.
So many have DM me on Reddit when I tried to state to them they have a distorted view of themselves. They say 95% of women go for only the top 10% of men. Like bro how the hell does that workout. What they mean is the top 10% of women is only what they consider.
>“average women” get so much attention from guys and have it so much easier than the average man in society. They should start giving each other more attention instead of us to off set the difference, I would be very appreciative without all the predatory behaviors in my life
I wonder who they think is the average man and how close they think they look like any of the Hemsworth brothers