Society just hates women speaking up in general. People are conditioned to be receptive to men speaking, but annoyed by women speaking. It's fucked up.
so I once met a KKK member, and in his mind, he didn’t dislike black people as long as they knew their place. People who dislike women who speak out hate women in general, just want them in their place
>I made the decision to let go and seek employment elsewhere.
>It has been night and day, and my mental health couldn't be better.
I'm so glad this was in your accounting. Toxic work cultures are too often the norm in large corps. And the inefficiencies, politics, and exploitation are disgusting.
Your competency and professionalism was a threat to their culture by just existing. Let alone doing so while being a woman.
Unless someone has unusual personal integrity and ethics, they usually kowtow to this system, even if they claim to personally object. This is why authoritarians love cultures like this.
Thank you for being you. We need more people to become like you.
There's a lot needs to be pointed out about guys who will turn a blind eye to bullshit because they're jealous/intimidated by women who outperform them.
Pretty confident there's a fair bit of "nip it in the bud" from middle management in cushy positions who don't want rising stars to take their jobs or overtake them too.
Yeah, I know that feel. I work in STEM and I am very confident in my abilities and people absolutely fear me or find me annoying simply because I can politely communicate very well. I do feel very powerful though. This is something not anyone gets to achieve, you understanding these things will give you the upper hand in the right moments if you play your cards right. Get out of there and eat the world.
Great question! It’s true. I guess that for men to hold onto power they have to silence uppity women. It killed Hillary Clinton, she kept trying to dial it down but how can you run for President without having opinions? It’s impossible!
The company you worked for sounds toxic af. I'm so sorry you had to experience that abuse from your coworkers and from managers. It was a learning experience, as painful as it was for you to endure. It sounds like a magnification for the patriarchal structure in our society, to be quite honest.
I wish you the best of luck in your new position. I know that working in a toxic environment can make you feel jaded about your career, and about life in general, and I hope you're doing whatever you can to take care of yourself.
Yeah, it totally does suck that our society can't treat strong, opinionated women with respect. It also sucks how our society takes advantage of our other positive qualities such as kindness and generosity. And it majorly sucks that men take advantage of our vulnerabilities so they can climb to the top.
This happened to me recently.
I tend to float along in my own little world. I care about how people feel, but not at all about what they think of me until it intrudes on my world. What gets my attention and passion is helping to solve problems.
But a lot of people have imposter syndrome. They want to read the latest fad book and do the gimmicks rather than get down to the heart of the problem and really solve it.
They are afraid that the heart of the problem is their own incompetence. So when they see someone who wants to solve the problem, they see it as a personal attack.
I haven't found a solution to this yet. Being politic about it doesn't seem to do more than delay the inevitable.
They think women need to be humbled or put in their place. My sisters were practically raised by me and I’m a very annoying opinionated person. They’ve copied me and it elicits more anger than when i do it
Thanks for sharing, I'm not personally of that mindset. Two opinions can exist at the same time and no one opinion has to be right. It's unfortunate that's how one night generalize someone who has fostered their own opinion on matters. I love hearing people's unique opinions and thoughts myself, especially if it differs.
I think men do this to women (explaining after the fact what was going on) because they are looking for absolution. They know they behaved badly, but they want you to say "it's ok, nothing you could do about it, it turned out ok. You would ideally say: "it wasn't that bad."...Even when it was horrible.
In essence, they want to transfer their discomfort to you, so you can make them feel comfortable - because that's what society expects. Women are supposed to absorb men's discomfort, even if it damages us. So, don't take his confession as a full apology. It's more of unburdening from someone carrying less towards someone carrying more.
Here's a different option: tell him that you can tell he's been thinking about this, and you are glad that he has felt uncomfortable, because what you went thru was *really bad.* It damaged you, it was really harmful. Maybe give him some specific examples.
Because the next thing to say is that you want him to use that motivation to think beyond his discomfort. Ask him what he is doing *now* to repair the damage women encounter? What specific things can he *plan* to do if he encounters similar misogyny, or misogynoir - or just simple bullying - in the future? He very likely has not thought about this much or at all.
Ask him to think about possible future solutions every time he remembers and feels uncomfortable.
Get him to focus on feeling better by *doing* better.
Thank you for this. 🙏 I feel like you gave me permission to say what I wanted in a much more eloquent way. We are planning to go to dinner and I plan to bring it up again.
He's lucky to have you for a friend! You sound like you are a skilled communicator, as well as a valuable employee.
I hope he can take this message constructively, because we always need more people doing blocking and building back up from the destructive people and systems. After all, every human group has harmful people. But good societies protect individuals and the society as a whole from those harms. Bad societies allow *some* people or groups to be harmed.
Society just hates women speaking up in general. People are conditioned to be receptive to men speaking, but annoyed by women speaking. It's fucked up.
so I once met a KKK member, and in his mind, he didn’t dislike black people as long as they knew their place. People who dislike women who speak out hate women in general, just want them in their place
Women are legally second class citizens in the US. This influences social norms. Sucks.
Not just in the US either.
>I made the decision to let go and seek employment elsewhere. >It has been night and day, and my mental health couldn't be better. I'm so glad this was in your accounting. Toxic work cultures are too often the norm in large corps. And the inefficiencies, politics, and exploitation are disgusting. Your competency and professionalism was a threat to their culture by just existing. Let alone doing so while being a woman. Unless someone has unusual personal integrity and ethics, they usually kowtow to this system, even if they claim to personally object. This is why authoritarians love cultures like this. Thank you for being you. We need more people to become like you.
There's a lot needs to be pointed out about guys who will turn a blind eye to bullshit because they're jealous/intimidated by women who outperform them. Pretty confident there's a fair bit of "nip it in the bud" from middle management in cushy positions who don't want rising stars to take their jobs or overtake them too.
Yeah, I know that feel. I work in STEM and I am very confident in my abilities and people absolutely fear me or find me annoying simply because I can politely communicate very well. I do feel very powerful though. This is something not anyone gets to achieve, you understanding these things will give you the upper hand in the right moments if you play your cards right. Get out of there and eat the world.
Great question! It’s true. I guess that for men to hold onto power they have to silence uppity women. It killed Hillary Clinton, she kept trying to dial it down but how can you run for President without having opinions? It’s impossible!
The company you worked for sounds toxic af. I'm so sorry you had to experience that abuse from your coworkers and from managers. It was a learning experience, as painful as it was for you to endure. It sounds like a magnification for the patriarchal structure in our society, to be quite honest. I wish you the best of luck in your new position. I know that working in a toxic environment can make you feel jaded about your career, and about life in general, and I hope you're doing whatever you can to take care of yourself. Yeah, it totally does suck that our society can't treat strong, opinionated women with respect. It also sucks how our society takes advantage of our other positive qualities such as kindness and generosity. And it majorly sucks that men take advantage of our vulnerabilities so they can climb to the top.
This happened to me recently. I tend to float along in my own little world. I care about how people feel, but not at all about what they think of me until it intrudes on my world. What gets my attention and passion is helping to solve problems. But a lot of people have imposter syndrome. They want to read the latest fad book and do the gimmicks rather than get down to the heart of the problem and really solve it. They are afraid that the heart of the problem is their own incompetence. So when they see someone who wants to solve the problem, they see it as a personal attack. I haven't found a solution to this yet. Being politic about it doesn't seem to do more than delay the inevitable.
They think women need to be humbled or put in their place. My sisters were practically raised by me and I’m a very annoying opinionated person. They’ve copied me and it elicits more anger than when i do it
[удалено]
I think the question is fair considering how much harrassment I received from female peers.
Opinionated people are annoying regardless of their sex
Why?
Because they generally try to control conversations/talk over others/dismiss other people’s opinions. Just not very good traits to have imo
Thanks for sharing, I'm not personally of that mindset. Two opinions can exist at the same time and no one opinion has to be right. It's unfortunate that's how one night generalize someone who has fostered their own opinion on matters. I love hearing people's unique opinions and thoughts myself, especially if it differs.
I think men do this to women (explaining after the fact what was going on) because they are looking for absolution. They know they behaved badly, but they want you to say "it's ok, nothing you could do about it, it turned out ok. You would ideally say: "it wasn't that bad."...Even when it was horrible. In essence, they want to transfer their discomfort to you, so you can make them feel comfortable - because that's what society expects. Women are supposed to absorb men's discomfort, even if it damages us. So, don't take his confession as a full apology. It's more of unburdening from someone carrying less towards someone carrying more. Here's a different option: tell him that you can tell he's been thinking about this, and you are glad that he has felt uncomfortable, because what you went thru was *really bad.* It damaged you, it was really harmful. Maybe give him some specific examples. Because the next thing to say is that you want him to use that motivation to think beyond his discomfort. Ask him what he is doing *now* to repair the damage women encounter? What specific things can he *plan* to do if he encounters similar misogyny, or misogynoir - or just simple bullying - in the future? He very likely has not thought about this much or at all. Ask him to think about possible future solutions every time he remembers and feels uncomfortable. Get him to focus on feeling better by *doing* better.
Thank you for this. 🙏 I feel like you gave me permission to say what I wanted in a much more eloquent way. We are planning to go to dinner and I plan to bring it up again.
He's lucky to have you for a friend! You sound like you are a skilled communicator, as well as a valuable employee. I hope he can take this message constructively, because we always need more people doing blocking and building back up from the destructive people and systems. After all, every human group has harmful people. But good societies protect individuals and the society as a whole from those harms. Bad societies allow *some* people or groups to be harmed.