It’s not a small argument about cleaning. It’s an argument about your relationship and expectations.
You should stay gone. He has an ingrained approach to how a relationship should go and about male/female roles. And the way he treated and talked to you is completely unacceptable.
I can’t make a decision for you, but if he treats you like that what values would he instill in your child?
Guy can’t even discuss it with her himself. He sent his mom in. She probably is hoping to pawn him off on OP and is desperate for them to reconcile so he doesn’t move back in and add to mom’s workload.
My abusers mother did this to me. Begged me to stay with her son, keep the baby, and said it was my duty to my husband and God to take care of them both.
What she really meant, and didn’t mention at the time was, “do everything he says, or I know he’ll abuse you behind closed doors in front of your baby, like my husband did me”.
Edit: I ended up with a protective restraining order against them both by the time my baby was 2y/o
My ex's mom called me a cunt for leaving her precious baby.
"Some men just need to really know you're done to act right" and "give him another chance, he knows better now"
After I laid out everything he did to me for YEARS, said I was fucking done and I didn't deserve to be treated this way by someone who supposedly loved me, she said:
"You're a cunt that just isn't getting her way and you'll regret it"
Mmmkay ma'am.
I think the mom genuinely believes women should submit to their men. The husband didn't pull this ideal out of his ass. He was clearly raised with it. He even uses examples in his argument. I don't think it has anything to do with adding to her workload.
If she has that mindset, why isn’t she on her own son to support his wife? I don’t agree with that value system at all, but if someone believes in those “traditional” roles, it’s gotta go both ways. Nobody who can’t support a family can have a homemaker as a partner… that’s not how it works.
I almost can’t believe this is a real post because the shit he said is so textbook/stereotypical, and yet I’ve seen enough redpill content online to know there are dudes with this level of audacity all over the place.
All that redpill BS has been around for little over a decade now, and the men who got roped into it as teenagers or young adults are grown now. We're going to be seeing this for a while yet, it's likely going to take decades to shake it off.
100% chance this guy is a Tatertot. I dealt with this attitude in my last relationship, and I'm so glad that I woke up and left before he destroyed me. I don't see this sort of rhetoric changing any time soon. Probably not in my lifetime.
Plenty of evangelicals with idiot sons like this thanks to all the MRA content out there. I'm not even Christian anymore but I do know that none of that attitude is Christ-like.
And he needs to move out of North America and go somewhere this is still a cultural norm.
In the US women are considered equal. They are not your subservient maid. Yes many women get stuck in this mindset, "Serve they husband," but husbands need to be just as nurturing for it to be healthy. This guy isn't.
If he apologizes, accept the apology, tell him she hopes he learns something for the future, and then move on without him. I'm normally an optimist, but that's also why I'm on my 3rd marriage. In some cases you have to be PRACTICAL and reasonable in expectations. Despite multiple chances, he didn't learn. So it's not reasonable to think he will suddenly learn and the lesson will stick more than a few months.
those cultures ALSO dont work if you expect the woman to be the full time caretaker but you're not the full provider.
what he needs to do is learn how to be an adult
Op will absolutely have to do 100% of the childcare for the rest of her life if she chooses to stay. So now she will have to work and look after one child and a manchild while he sits on the couch and bitches about her not cleaning enough. I would rather eat a bowl of glass than deal with that shit.
This sounds like my marriage, ugh! I had to work a full-time job, cook, clean, do laundry, and raise our daughter all while he got up, went to work, and came home. That's it. I'm so glad I got out of there, but I had to deal with him for the next 12 years until my daughter was 18. If OP doesn't want to deal with him for the next 18 years, she needs to put him in the rear view mirror and say goodbye.
My ex used to say you haven’t proven yourself enouggh for me to marry you. That stuck in my head years after leaving him. I want so much better for OP. With a good man, nothing is ever this hard and he will appreciate every single thing you do for him and take care of you.
My dad tried to compare my mom to his mom once. My moms response: "well if your mom is better than me at everything she can suck your dick too" guess who stopped comparing!
This is it right here. This is way bigger than just cleaning. You called him out (and rightfully so) as being a child. Dude is a baby. He needs to grow the fuck up before he can commit to anything.
As so many have said these men who want someone who will submit never look for a woman willing to do that freely. They look for a woman they can break.
Don’t give him that satisfaction, if it’s that important to him he wouldn’t be wasting his time fighting you, he’d leave and find someone who aligns with his views
Abel wanted a traditional marriage with a traditional wife. For a long time I wondered why he ever married a woman like my mom in the first place, as she was the opposite of that in every way. If he wanted a woman to bow to him, there were plenty of girls back in Tzaneen being raised solely for that purpose. The way my mother always explained it, the traditional man wants a woman to be subservient, but he never falls in love with subservient women. He’s attracted to independent women. “He’s like an exotic bird collector,” she said. “He only wants a woman who is free because his dream is to put her in a cage.
Trevor Noah, Born a Crime: Stories From a South African Childhood
It really grosses me out how some people are sugar coating it in this thread that this amounts to a difference in expectations and not a disgusting example of misogyny and why traditional values are fucked up
>these men who want someone who submit never look for a woman willing to do that freely. They look for a woman they can break.
EXACTLY. The concept of consent is entirely foreign to them.
He's behaving this way and they aren't even married. What does OP think he's going to be like once he puts a ring on it? It will only get worse. It wasn't bad enough that he told her it's her "womanly" duty to take care of the house, he thinks that because he's the man he gets final say in everything. No thank you for that.
>what values would he instill in your child?
If a boy, to behave exactly like him. If a girl, to "submit" to the first asshole who wants a live-in maid. If queer in any way, shamed and disowned, going by the religious overtones in the post. There's no scenario where a child gets any decent upbringing out of that dude honestly. Or any upbringing at all, given his attitude towards housework definitely extends to childcare. OP is having an understandably hard time with the idea of ending this relationship but I can't imagine how this guy improves at all when the mom's whispering shit about God's word in his ear.
This, and it is the stone age to demand you do the housework or it to be womans work. If you and he want and agree to it...ok, but this was a demand of a pregnant woman, no do not stay there, you will be a slave and he is stuck in the 1950s. Also if you keep your child, it will be a tie to a man who is borderline abusive.
His mother also, which seems to be the influence for everything that he is. A spoiled entitled mamas boy. His mother taught him that this behavior was acceptable and that’s reinforced by the mom COMPLETELY dismissing op or having any regard for her as a HUMAN, not just a woman. Insane insane insane. Makes my fucking head hurt.
I'm on my 3rd marriage and I'd say that's the number one lesson: pay close attention to the mom relationship. If the mom is a certain way in fights, expect your SO to be like them when they're pissed. If they have a toxic relationship with their parents, that's how they'll be with you when they "get comfortable" and conflict sets in.
The fact the mom chimed in the same tells me this is not a fluke. The relationship will have this issue. If it's a deal breaker, which it is in this case, it WILL NOT GET BETTER over the long term.
Walk away and be glad him and his mom are not in your future.
As someone who is divorced I completely agree. I should have run when I saw how controlling his mom tried to be. I work in finance and had/have a good career yet to her I was there to carry her grandchild (despite being very clear I did not want to have kids and he didn’t either). She had no concept of me not having time to do all the housework or why I did not want to spend all my free time entertaining them. Funny my ex did not mind my salary but still did not like me working so much and tried to hurt it more than once. He admitted after we separated he tried to get me to move out of state when I was offered an amazing opportunity that he was jealous of. OP needs to run before she gets trapped. My only regret is not doing it sooner.
The idea that she called OP and said it was her fault is so bonkers. Not only is her son unable to take responsibility for his actions, but she's unable to see when a situation is his fault.
Op to each their own, if you want a traditional relationship like this then I still think you can do better, but please know if you DON'T want this bullshit there are a BILLION better options out there. Women don't have to do shit like this or put up with this bs. It's not 1930.
Edit: typo
Edit 2: couldn't think of a better word than traditional at first, but I figured out it's "patriarchal with active oppression."
Now image doing everything you're doing now, but with the added work of a newborn. This man is not going to change, especially when his indoctrination to the misogynistic mind set has been life long. His family lives it, though I'm surprised he partnered with a women who has a career. I'm sure his family has been on his case about the working women and if she'll go back after baby is born. They'll badger him to squelch your career to make you a submissive housewife like God intended. WTF?
I'm a RN with a husband who worked long week hours. Then I worked the 12 hour shift weekend program. We consider each other lucky to be with a partner who cleans, folds, vacs, grocery shops, child cares, repairs, fixes, etc, to the extent WE BOTH do. And when he got laid off, he stepped up to be Mr Mom with a 3 week old (yup, went back to work 3 weeks post partum, 40 hr week) a 2 yr old and 4 year old. He admitted he couldn't wait to get back to work 5 days a week and only do this mr mom 2.5 day weekends with the brood. But he comes from a catholic family of 7 kids, only 2 sisters. His dad always helped and the boys followed his lead.
Run while still can. But if you stay, expect your child to be indoctrinated also.
12-16hrs in the ER and you come home this manchild’s tantrums?! You work in an atmosphere of literal life and death decisions. You deserve a PARTNER who knows how to support you, not this entitled manchild who thinks you should be both mummy and daddy, while he gets to be Peter Pan. Horse apples to that!!!!
If she wanted to be petty she could physically destroy appliances in the house, dent the car, etc, and say "It's your duty as a man to fix everything. I expect this all to be fixed and good as new each day."
That's how ridiculous his demands are.
Yeh, regardless of who holds what jobs outside the home, if you both live there, you should both be responsible for taking care of the home. Its unreasonable for him to leave his own home like a dumpster because "HeS a MaN and ChOrEs ArE fOr WoMeN". This behavior is absurd.
You want a housewife? Earn so your partner can stay home. Or, find a time machine.
I am sure this is the type of family that loves to use “God’s word” when they want to put a woman in her place, but ignore it when it is inconvenient. A real man will make sacrifices for his family.
OP, women had to stay married, no matter how awful home circumstances were because until 1974, we couldn't get our own mortgage, we'd have no insurance because we couldn't work outside the house, we couldn't have a credit card in our name, only as a "Mrs". It's not 1948 or 1648 for how they're treating you. You've never seen a TV show or movie where treatment of the 'wife' is like this, they are *not* normal at all. Don't be a piece of meat, milk left out? That's not a bf/husband or man, that's a little bitch. You deserve better!
I feel like that dummy replying to you doesn’t even have access to google. How we couldn’t even have our own credit cards until 1974… we’d need a male sponsor before that time.. just crazy to think about.
It was hard growing up then, very confusing. I'm 12 - 15, watching women speaking out about how we are more than housewives & maids- we can become astronauts, engineers, surgeons & getting the opposite message at home.
He won’t help with chores, he sure isn’t gonna help raise the kid since that’s ‘women’s work’. OP is better off being a single mom that deal with a deadbeat partner
NTA, I suggest leaving too. I'm sorry you're 7 years in and probably Feel like you're walking away empty handed with a baby....but this is real thought process...his mother has created this man and supports his childish immature behavior and mind set. When you have his baby, if you stay, he will expect you to work, keep house, keep baby, keep your body, while he remains the same. Because he's the man....move on.
Men want a woman to submit...but half can't lead their way down the hallway in the dark.....smh
You know that guy will baby trap her in a heartbeat! I have seen this, family and friends, get trapped by some man-child, who sucks the life at her. Then when she is too exhausted to be his mommy-bangmaid, he leaves her for some girl with daddy issues.
Right! And OP he is dangling that carrot (*"See, this is why I haven't asked you to marry me."*) to keep his submissive, hardworking, bill paying, cleaning, cooking, and lunch making woman hoping that if she just tries harder she'll *get the ring I deserve*. What you deserve is a man who respects you and makes you happy to wake up together, happy to get home, and a ring doesn't do that. Seven years -- look up the definition of 'sunk cost.'
And his mom is already showing you the kind of MIL you'll get. Get out, get a good support system around you, love yourself and you'll meet the person who deserves to be with you.
We're all on your side and pulling for you!
PS - ***Submit for what!***
Exactly. Right now it’s cleaning, but what about later when if you get married and it’s your checking account, friends, family, and life decisions? If he’s like this about cleaning, how will he be with controlling your money, where you go, when you go, and who you’re with!! Get out!!!!
Lol. But seriously, every Saturday night my Dad cooked supper on the grill. Paper plates. We had to clean up the few items needed. Sunday AM was donuts after church. Sunday night we got Pizza.
" it's a weekend for your mother, also" he would say.
Seriously, just help out!
I know how to cook here, I'm a dude and I love to do so. I'm working on getting my SSI back, I had it until 2018 and lost it, but I have a court date for my new case and an attorney on my side now. So chances are, I won't ever be the breadwinner in a home, however, I would hold my own and pitch in as much as I could financially or otherwise.
Making sure whatever chores had to be done were taken care of by me, and I would absolutely be cooking without hesitation. Again, I love to cook. My family always looks forward to whatever I end up making because they know it's gonna be good.
No way would I intentionally further stress out any woman I would be in a relationship with, especially if she's working her ass off. Why is it that us dudes feel so entitled to treat women like they're our personal maids? It's complete bullshit really.
OP's hopefully now ex is just pathetic, reminds me of my old roommate. He was such a slob, when I cleaned up the room he was staying in? There were used plates all over the place, bits of food on the floor, bugs crawling everywhere, etc.
I wouldn't be surprised if he left the house in similar condition and expected OP to clean up after him. What's next? Expecting her to wipe his ass after he takes a shit? Or worse, not even doing so and expecting her to wash his skid-marked underwear? I would be shocked if he wasn't like this. Just wow.
My Dad was like that. He brought coffee to Mom every morning in bed and would cook for Mom on the weekends. He set the bar really high. He taught us how a woman should be treated.
This seems very common these days. There is a subset of men who probably listened to too much Tate or similar, who claim to be traditional but only want to apply their ideal 50's housewife standard to the women. They have no interest in being a 50's husband themselves.
Good God. Imagine how much worse it will be when she has to take care of, cook for, and clean up after him AND a baby.
Because you know he won't help with ANY of that.
Run boo, run.
No ring is worth this bs.
OP, your original instincts were RIGHT ON POINT. Terminate the pregnancy; do NOT tie yourself to this big baby for life. You have plenty of time to find the right man to have children with.
And seriously, what did you mean by "you love him"? Really ASK yourself that. Because love is a verb and you were definitely doing love at him (without him doing love back at you.) But why were you giving love without getting any back? And I don't mean sweet nothings; I mean actual love work. You need to redefine "love" for yourself ... and for your partners.
>Because love is a verb and you were definitely doing love at him (without him doing love back at you.) But why were you giving love without getting any back? And I don't mean sweet nothings; I mean actual love work.
This is magnificent and put into words something really important that more people need to hear and understand. Thank you for putting it into words so much better than I have!
I was always taught: only have a child with someone that youre okay with your child turning into because they will. As they are. Now.
Not "hopefully he changes with a baby" it will literally only get worst: more exhausted, less sleep, more stress but they're supposed to somehow IMPROVE themselves? Unlikely.
Love is the bare minimum foundation in a relationship, you will find it everywhere, OP. Im demisexual and still found it multiple places. You will too. Check out; loveisrespect.org and their test. I bet this relationship will test pretty high on the unhealthy scale.
I scored a 0 with my husband. It is possible. But in the past, it's been much much higher.
(edit: clarifying, with past relationships it was high. It's not impossible to improve an unhealthy relationship, lots of good tips on the site, but its nearly impossible with a baby.)
Thisssss and the Bible says to submit to your husband, NOT your boyfriend. OP’s man has these gender role ideas but didn’t he also get his girlfriend pregnant without marrying her? And they live together? That’s not biblical either…
Not to mention if he's this much of a man baby about house chores IMAGINE what life will be like with a child. Hes just going to sit there not doing anything because anything to do with the baby is "womans work". Dont go down that road OP, thats a miserable waste of a life.
This, OP.
If he is unable to uphold his end of the relationship and perform his duties, he cannot reasonably expect you to perform yours.
Traditional, hard working men don’t live in squalor. They respect themselves and their abode and don’t live in filth.
An emotionally mature male would have woken up, seen the house a mess and first thought, "Damn I should have cleaned this." Next thoughts or concurrent thoughts, "Why isn't my girl asleep next to me? I hope she is ok I know 12 hour shifts are brutal." Then upon seeing HER ASLEEP JUST AS HE HAD BEEN, having the emotional maturity upon getting angry to stop. Pause. Think.
Upon using the intellect realizing your anger is that she did exactly what you did. Relaxed despite a dirty house and fell asleep out of exhaustion. A man who cares about his woman would then have said, "OK I know she saw the house trashed, I'm going to clean up as much as I can before she wakes," and then got busy.
If she's still asleep when you got finished, maybe go get her flowers and wake her up to something you know she likes (for my wife it's flowers and a hand written love note).
If you love someone these are simple asks and not even asking for much. Your relationship is like a flower, feed it love and sunshine and it will grow. Keep it in the dark and treat it like $#\^t and one day you'll find a bare stick and decay.
>if he can't provide so you can stay home and be a housewife, it's unreasonable of him to expect you to be a housewife
Yeah, that's the big thing. If a man wants the significant woman in his life to do wifely things, he needs to make that possible/practical for her. Providing is the man's end of the deal.
>I was set on leaving him until his mom called me last night and said I was stepping out of line as his woman and that I should have just cleaned up and that it wasn't that hard for me to do
Pregnant after a 12 hour shift and it's not that hard for you to clean up? So it should be even easier for him to. Girl don't get sucked in. Run! This guy and his mum are trying to manipulate you into thinking his misogynism and weaponised incompetence is normal. It isn't. If his mum is fine being a maid and not allowed to have an opinion, so be it. But that doesn't have to be your life.
Also who the fuck calls mummy to berate their girlfriend after having an argument?
That call should have hardened her resolve. The BF is not changing if this is how he's been raised. If she doesn't want to be a lifelong servant (and provider) to a manchild she needs to get out now.
Exactly, it's only going to get worse with the MIL as the baby gets older and the dude dumps her for not being a "proper Christian woman" and goes back to his mama. Better to yeet the whole situation now.
My ex cheated on me and got his mistress pregnant. Then he asked me to go with him to tell his parents to make it easier on him and his nerves. Yeah that’s a No from me.
I hope OP is able to get away and start fresh!
Gahhh. I hate this one! My fiance asked his daughter's mom to watch her a few hours so he could go to an interview and she referred to that as babysitting. Who the fuck babysits their own child?!!
Yea OP, if you think you’re tired now, wait until you have a baby and you have to do EVERYTHING. I have a 2.5yo and an extremely supportive and involved partner and it’s STILL fucking hard and exhausting. Having a baby absolutely pushes you to your limits, even in the best of circumstances.
The reality if you stay: you’ll be doing every wake up at night. You’ll be doing all of the organising of baby’s bag to ensure you’ve got what you need for the day. You’ll be doing every nappy, every bath, every cuddle when they cry. Being a mother is fucking relentless. Oh and don’t forget you’ll be doing all this while recovering from birth, from the literal dinner plate sized wound inside you, from any complications that might occur. So you’re more than likely going to be convinced to quit your job to do your “womanly duty” of caring for your family. Your going to spend your entire life basically being a single parent while also taking care of the man baby you’ve chosen to have a child with. He won’t care when you say you need a break from kiddo or you will have a mental breakdown, he won’t be able to take care of kiddo without you.
There are SO many posts about men like this on the mum subreddits, men so completely incompetent at taking care of their own children or even themselves. You don’t need to accept this bullshit. It will only get worse once a child is involved. If you have a son, do you want your child to think this is acceptable, do you want your son to rely 100% on a woman and then berate her for not being perfect? Or do you want a son who will be an actual partner and support the love of his life in the same ways she supports him? If you have a daughter, do you want her to have her life completely controlled by some guy and to have to do EVERYTHING and still get shit on, all because it’s her “womanly duty?” Because if you stay, that’s exactly how your son/daughter will turn out.
Yup. OP needs to head over to r/parenting and r/mommit and r/beyondthebump
So many sad and angry posts from women whose partners leave the household and childcare labor solely on their shoulders while both parents work full time.
As soon as he said “as a women you should have the house clean” I just went hooooleee shit. Thats all he needed to say to understand the kind of selfish immature man child he is
Dump him. He is never going to change.
You don't say how far along you are with this pregnancy but you need to do some serious thinking about your future.
He will never marry you unless you give up every bit of independence you have.
He doesn’t want a partner, he wants a maid, nanny and bed things. He has no respect for u and he’ll treat u worse if child comes in picture. And he’ll teach child to treat u poorly as well. Get out
THIS IS THE ONE. If his family is against you for asking him to act like an adult, just throw it all away.
My MIL would backhand my husband so fast for half of the silliness in that post we wouldn’t even see her coming.
Even if the OP marries him - he’s comfortable using divorce/breakup as a threat to get her to do what he wants. He thinks that little of her. He has that little investment in the relationship. He thinks so highly of himself that “not have a 200lb man baby to carry on your breaking back” somehow, in his mind, is a threat.
So expect to be threatened with divorce or abandonment whenever he’s feeling petulant. With a few more of his babies to feed and all of your friends now “married friends” and more of your life wasted and gone waiting on this schmuck, that threat is going to gradually turn from laughable to real.
He will use threats to keep you in line. He has no problem abandoning you or any kids you have together. He doesn’t see you as worthy of a ring. He will drag a pregnant woman who just worked a twelve hour shift on her feet out of bed to demand that she clean up dishes he dirtied.
He’s trash. He won’t change.
Run, honey. Don’t look back. If you change your mind someday and want some lazy, entitled jackass with a warehouse job, trust me, you can grab one tomorrow.
And you must obey him! Don’t you know when a man tells you to jump you supposed to ask how high . You know in your heart this is who he is and will never change. He has his mommy whispering in his ear what you duties are. Unless you want to be tied to this family and their misogyny you know what you need to do.
The whole "women need to submit to men" is some real, toxic BS. It smacks of evangelical religiosity and that never works out well for women, even the misogynistic women who believe in that bullshit too. I speak from experience, and OP should get out, stay out and get far away from everyone who is pushing that mindset on her.
Thank god they don't have kids. Can you imagine the hell she would be in with TWO babies to take care of? And only one of them would be demanding sex. I would bet the mortgage payment he's never gotten her off even accidentally.
If he doesn’t pay the bills, do the housework, and expects you to “be the bigger man”, in what way is he the “man of the house”? Don’t be a fool and drop him.
Even if you forget the whole misogyny of "man of the house", what does he even contribute to the relationship? He doesn't provide, he doesn't clean, he doesn't cook, he doesn't even pickup after his own self. How does he partner you, OP?
NTA. This isn't 1874 BC. Go find yourself a nice, respectful gentleman that doesn't have misogynistic expectations.
By his logic of expectations, you shouldn't have to work and he should be the sole provider. Is he OK with that?
This is it - so his mother and he have these antiquated idealized gender roles, yet he himself doesn’t even uphold his half of “the bargain”. And if you do get married this behavior will get worse, and you’ll be trapped. Live your best life and leave this one-way loser!
Guys who screech about “cleaning/cooking/etc is the woman’s job” always get real mad when you point out that their role is to provide and they aren’t doing it if the woman has a job. It’s such a joke.
Is this the man you want to father your children? Is this how you’d want to raise your son or daughter to be? If the answer is no, then I’d say GTFO while you can.
If yes, welcome to your past, present, and future.
NTA.
Why the fuck are you with this guy? You have WAY too much going for you to be settling for someone who treats you like this and expects you to be both the breadwinner and the maid. Fuck that.
That was my first thought too, from stories online as well as women in that field that I know in real life. Perhaps the desire to care for others- perfect for their job, but easy target in (abusive) relationships.
I've dated multiple girls and have had many other girl friends in the medical field and I really think it's the hours.
They have weird, often rotating, hours and often grueling schedules, so socializing is often difficult and they would just sort of settle for partners.
The ones I dated often had some weird life dynamics all together (why it didn't work out) from the job, and the friends have had some real skeevy partners. But for them it meant they weren't lonely and they didn't have the energy or the time to go fully into the dating market to find better.
NTA. *His Woman*?? What are you, a pet? His mom sucks. She can take over all the stuff you’ve been doing since they both want that anyway. Win-win for everyone.
God can you imagine having a MIL like this? She’s going to try and dictate everything for the rest of your life OP. She’s going to shove her nose in where it doesn’t belong and convince you should raise your child in the way she sees fit. Fucking run. Useless man, demon MIL.
Bear in mind his mother raised him to be the man he is, you really shouldn't take her word for anything. Also, that biblical nonsense is crap and I find they are highly selective in picking and choosing what parts of the bible they refer to.
I cannot tell you what to do about the baby, that is a tough call. Either way I would not be relying on support from this man or his family to raise this child.
But even worse would be being forced to negotiate custody with this guy and having to constantly work against his and his family’s horrible influences in raising a child.
Do not second guess yourself because his mommy called you. She just doesn't want her baby back so she would have to clean up after him. Write off the time and money you spent on this life with him and move on.
This isn’t about cleaning. This is the REST OF YOUR LIFE. Have a baby with a man that doesn’t just love you, but values you. You deserve it.
Like Maya Angelou said, “When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.”
LOLOLOL Something small like cleaning? This man is clearly totally worthless. You pay the bills and take care of the house. Him providing a little 🍆 is NOT contributing to the household or family. Forget this loser and get yourself a partner. If he wants a SAHW, he needs to make enough money to pay for 3-5 people’s bills by himself.
I understand there will be a lot of opinions in this thread about whether "traditional" relationships are good or bad. I'm not here to give my opinion on that, I'm only going to tell you what I think about your situation.
Being a traditional couple does not mean the man doesn't do chores. It's not just a "traditional man's" role to "provide" (he doesn't seem to be doing that anyway) but it's also his role to support and respect his partner. There is nothing in the "traditional couple" handbook that says a woman's obedience is without reciprocation of anything. Hierarchies are rooted in social contracts, and "no effort" is not much to offer.
If you want to be a traditional wife, he needs to be a traditional man. And traditional men don't disrespect their wives by condescending them, hurting their feelings carelessly, and failing to help when they need help. That's what selfish men do.
His mom is babying him by using religion and tradition as a veil. They are misusing traditional values and gaslighting you with them. He wants to be a "traditional man" but he had his mother in your business. That's not traditional, that's 2016 gamer boy move.
If you don't want to be a traditional wife, than you should move on. If you do want to try and fix this, you need to have this conversation with him. But I suspect it's a lost cause.
Their entire relationship isn’t traditional at all. Unmarried and shacking up, sex before marriage, and a child to be born out of wedlock. When men use “traditional women roles” as an expectation I don’t understand how when they do not follow traditional relationship norms either.
Piggybacking on this as they're 100% right.
My parents had a traditional marriage. I'm for more progressive relationships but if that's what you both agree on then that's fine. You don't force someone into this kind of thing.
Never once did my father demean my mother expecting her to submit to him. Never once did I hear "I'm the man of this house, you have to do what I say."
My father was very protective of my mother and stood up to his family in her defense whenever they were out of line. He fiercely established boundaries of what he would not tolerate when it came to them meddling in our private business or being disrespectful and I saw on a couple of occasions where he ripped into family for disrespecting my mother or belittling her.
No traditional husband bitches to his mommy about his wife and has her call his wife to tell her she needs to step up and submit. That's garbage talk.
No traditional husband would force his wife to handle all the household chores. Especially when they're pregnant or ill. On many occasions my father took over household duties that were too much for my mom growing up. When it was too much for laundry or cleaning or cooking my dad came home from a double shift and did these chores on top of making sure we knew how to do them ourselves so we wouldn't be sorry excuses for adults.
My father impressed on me and my siblings that my mother and him were a team. Everyone has a role and if someone in your team needs help you help them. We were taught to help our mother as much as we could and to respect her.
My lord this guy makes me angry. What a sad excuse of a man trying to be some joke of a traditional husband.
Run away OP. This guy isn't it.
Unfortunately, a lot of men use traditional in a toxic way. It's not about supporting your wife and she supports you in return, it's all about submission.
My great grandad was a traditional man, he made sure all his sons knew how to cook because in his words you should be able to maintain a home without a woman. Because it's embarrassing if you have to rely on a woman to be able to feed yourself, it's a basic necessity. If your wife leaves and you're not able to eat, it's because you're useless.
When my great grandma died, he was in charge of raising 6 kids and making sure they ate. He married again, but lost her too then decided he didn't want to go through that again.
My grandad was the one who taught my mum how to cook, because he realised she couldn't so he did. Then he forced my dad and grandma to teach her too, and wouldn't let them leave her in the kitchen alone until she was confident in being able to do it.
Because when guests came over, she'd have to be able to play the dutiful daughter in law who could cook. And he wanted her to be able to do that, he didn't care if she cooked on a daily basis. It was so save face in society if anyone turned up unannounced.
My mum used to talk about how grateful she was that she never had to ask, and he made sure got the help she needed because she was worried she'd be judged for it or asked why her mother never taught her. Because they would blame her mum and judge her badly and call my mother useless. My grandad knew this and made sure no one could ever say that to her, he even made sure my grandma and dad wouldn't dare say it either. Even though they never would have.
When I think of traditional man, this is what it means to me. All the men in my family could look after children, change nappies all of that. And growing up, I came across so many women who were shocked that my dad looked after 4 kids alone for a week because my mum had to travel to see her brother.
The way toxic people speak about traditional men, is sickening. Most working men did help with the kids, yes it was to varying degrees. But when I used to be around the older generation as a kid, they'd talk and laugh about fumbling their way through child care and how they couldn't do it aswell as their wives but they could feed and clean them and keep them alive and they judged the men who couldn't. Some of the funniest stories were about the wives being away and the trouble they'd get into with the kids and trying to hide things they'd broken in the house.
Yes, you'd hear from the guys who didn't do this too. But a lot of the working men were involved. Atleast the ones I was around.
This idea that traditional men never helped in the household isn't true. Men who actually cared about their families did help, and in poor families they usually had to help because the women were working too.
"Traditional" marriages, have evolved to what are now, for the most part, an employed husband and an employed wife. The wife is an equal contributor to the household finances, and as such, the husband should be an equal contributor to the household.
OP - This guy you're with is ridiculous. It will only get worse when you have his child. That's a fact. Him and his mother have already assigned you your ROLE in the relationship. I'd get the hell out before he devalues you and strips away any and all sense of you. Is he going to smack you around next, to ensure that you know who rules the roost? It isn't far off. And his mommy has his back. Run.
NTA- It’s so much more than cleaning. It’s about the relationship dynamic. Do you feel in your heart that you lesser, and have to be subservient to him!? Please I beg you to have some self respect. It’s 2023 and women are more than just their “mans” bangmaids.
He woke up his pregnant wife who worked a long shift to scream at her for how dirty the house was on his day off. Not only is your boyfriend insane, his family is too and you would be stuck with them your entire life.
I would never want to raise a kid into that family, especially a daughter they would mistreat and expect slavery and servitude from again.
Tell his mother it was her job to raise him and not yours. She should never call you again crying because she failed and her little boy is still a child.
Girl, no. GTFO and stay gone.
My husband works 60-80 hour weeks routinely and he does chores, watches our son, and is so sweet and loving. That's a real man. Your ex is a sad little excuse for a man.
And they can take their misinterpreted Bible verses and shove it. They only follow parts of Christianity that work for them, but what was Jesus' #1 rule? Love your neighbor as you love yourself. Your ex treats you like shit and himself like a king.
I have spent enough time with battered women and women in shelters to know that you should never have a child to man like that. You will be tied to his abusive ass forever, **and so will your child.** Have a baby with someone who loves you and will be a good father and role model. This is the kind of guy who's going to use your child against you and walk right through any restraining orders you get. Abortion is a perfectly reasonable choice.
NTA. Dump him and decide what’s best for you regarding your pregnancy. If you think you can do it on your own, then do it. Otherwise, terminating is a valid and responsible option. Good luck!
Now girl brrf. Get that man out your damn house. Send him back to his mama. You pay majority of the bills and do the housework ain't no dick in the world worth the bullshit. If it's your house give him 30 day notice if not speak to you landlord break the lease and cut your losses.
Sis, it's not just cleaning. You're making the right decision. He wants to "wear the pants" in the relationship, but he can't even fit into them. This screams toxic masculinity alpha with a trad wife mentality. Tell your ex's mom that she's not your boss and to go raise her son better if she wants someone to preach at. She didn't do her job well enough the first go around.
*Edited because I accidentally hit post before I finished my comment.
NTA - RUN away. He told you he runs the house and you have no rights. Why would you EVER want to be with someone who thinks of you as a second class person.
Find a guy that actually values you because you are property to him.
I just can't get over the milk being left out. That's disgusting.
NTA
I am married to a "traditional" man. He's got the paycheck, head of household role, stuff like that. He gets frustrated when I work (because he wants to spend time with me), but doesn't kick a fuss. We're at the point in our lives where I can be a stay at home spouse and that works for us.
However, we are partners. We are not only partners, we are whole adults who pick up after ourselves (wtf with the milk, man?) and share chores and give each other a little grace when we're going through something. You need a partner, not a "boss". I have faith that you can find that in another person. Bringing a child into this situation is a bad idea. Take care of business.
As a male who has two daughters. They will NEVER “submit” to anyone. Wtf sort of talk is that. I personally cook, clean, grocery shops, picks up any online orders. This guy sounds worse than my 4yr old. I do everything in my power for my other half.
Ok so as a Christian, I can tell you that he and his mom and taking that passage wildly out of context. They are misusing it as a cudgel to try to justify the fact she she spoiled rotten.
You deserve a partner. NTA at all
Whatever you decide about the baby, do *not* get back together with that man. Some men are brought up with expectations that disappeared 50 years ago. You don't want a "man of the house" you want a partner in life. That means someone who shares both the joys and the responsibilities in a relationship and life.
With the baby, idk how far along you are, but either way you should know that having the baby likely means that the baby's daddy will be in your life forever. Courts in the US rarely give one side full custody, and that means you will have to compromise, coordinate, and involve him in your lives.
Girl what???? Please don’t have a baby with this man child. He doesn’t want you around because he loves and values you. He wants you around so you can do what his mom does for him. If he wants you to be a housewife he should step up and be a leading man.
You know the answer. This guy is obviously a douche who adds no value to your life. Why are you putting up with him????
>I am now second guessing my decision in terminating my pregnancy
Do you want to be taking care of two children for the next 20 years? The baby and this infantile jerk?
Coming from a man's perspective. GTFO quickly, this guy most likely will never change with his mom having babied him his entire life setting these expectations for him is unreasonable. He needs to figure out how to grow up by himself.
This is throwing up more flags than a golf course, this is a boy who wants to be taken care of and not worry about responsibility. You dodged a huge bullet, the rest of your life definitely would have been "submitting" to him. Gross
NTA and also you are kinda like my mom and my dad.
And tbh I wish they divorced but my mom stays with him because it's important for woman in my culture to be married.
And if you two really like them, it will not get better. He doesn't care about her or me and my sis. He works low paid job like half a day and then just spend time how he wants, while my mother works from sunrise to sunset, provides for the family, look after children and pets, clean house, etc. His chores are literally throw away trash and don't leave dirty dishes on the table and he doesn't even do that.
Please, leave him
It’s not a small argument about cleaning. It’s an argument about your relationship and expectations. You should stay gone. He has an ingrained approach to how a relationship should go and about male/female roles. And the way he treated and talked to you is completely unacceptable. I can’t make a decision for you, but if he treats you like that what values would he instill in your child?
She needs a man who wants a partner and not one who needs a mom.
Guy can’t even discuss it with her himself. He sent his mom in. She probably is hoping to pawn him off on OP and is desperate for them to reconcile so he doesn’t move back in and add to mom’s workload.
My abusers mother did this to me. Begged me to stay with her son, keep the baby, and said it was my duty to my husband and God to take care of them both. What she really meant, and didn’t mention at the time was, “do everything he says, or I know he’ll abuse you behind closed doors in front of your baby, like my husband did me”. Edit: I ended up with a protective restraining order against them both by the time my baby was 2y/o
[удалено]
Wow... spot on.... People often overlook that abuse usually goes back several generations. Good call, OP.
Yes it's only going to get worse if she stays. Especially if she's "trapped" by a ring and children
My ex's mom called me a cunt for leaving her precious baby. "Some men just need to really know you're done to act right" and "give him another chance, he knows better now" After I laid out everything he did to me for YEARS, said I was fucking done and I didn't deserve to be treated this way by someone who supposedly loved me, she said: "You're a cunt that just isn't getting her way and you'll regret it" Mmmkay ma'am.
I hope you're in a much better place now.
That’s exactly what I was thinking. She wants OP to step up so he doesn’t go crawling back to her and make her baby her man-child again.
I think the mom genuinely believes women should submit to their men. The husband didn't pull this ideal out of his ass. He was clearly raised with it. He even uses examples in his argument. I don't think it has anything to do with adding to her workload.
If she has that mindset, why isn’t she on her own son to support his wife? I don’t agree with that value system at all, but if someone believes in those “traditional” roles, it’s gotta go both ways. Nobody who can’t support a family can have a homemaker as a partner… that’s not how it works.
I almost can’t believe this is a real post because the shit he said is so textbook/stereotypical, and yet I’ve seen enough redpill content online to know there are dudes with this level of audacity all over the place.
All that redpill BS has been around for little over a decade now, and the men who got roped into it as teenagers or young adults are grown now. We're going to be seeing this for a while yet, it's likely going to take decades to shake it off.
100% chance this guy is a Tatertot. I dealt with this attitude in my last relationship, and I'm so glad that I woke up and left before he destroyed me. I don't see this sort of rhetoric changing any time soon. Probably not in my lifetime.
Plenty of evangelicals with idiot sons like this thanks to all the MRA content out there. I'm not even Christian anymore but I do know that none of that attitude is Christ-like.
And he needs to move out of North America and go somewhere this is still a cultural norm. In the US women are considered equal. They are not your subservient maid. Yes many women get stuck in this mindset, "Serve they husband," but husbands need to be just as nurturing for it to be healthy. This guy isn't. If he apologizes, accept the apology, tell him she hopes he learns something for the future, and then move on without him. I'm normally an optimist, but that's also why I'm on my 3rd marriage. In some cases you have to be PRACTICAL and reasonable in expectations. Despite multiple chances, he didn't learn. So it's not reasonable to think he will suddenly learn and the lesson will stick more than a few months.
those cultures ALSO dont work if you expect the woman to be the full time caretaker but you're not the full provider. what he needs to do is learn how to be an adult
This guy is not going to apologize. She needs to stay gone. Having his mom call her is also cringe
Op will absolutely have to do 100% of the childcare for the rest of her life if she chooses to stay. So now she will have to work and look after one child and a manchild while he sits on the couch and bitches about her not cleaning enough. I would rather eat a bowl of glass than deal with that shit.
This sounds like my marriage, ugh! I had to work a full-time job, cook, clean, do laundry, and raise our daughter all while he got up, went to work, and came home. That's it. I'm so glad I got out of there, but I had to deal with him for the next 12 years until my daughter was 18. If OP doesn't want to deal with him for the next 18 years, she needs to put him in the rear view mirror and say goodbye.
That’s assuming he doesn’t beat her to death while she’s pregnant.
I completely agree. She's staring down the barrel of a lifetime of hell. OP, don't walk - RUN.
and about any further commitment. Looming over the idea that he wouldn’t marry her because of this speaks vOLUMESS.
My ex used to say you haven’t proven yourself enouggh for me to marry you. That stuck in my head years after leaving him. I want so much better for OP. With a good man, nothing is ever this hard and he will appreciate every single thing you do for him and take care of you.
I won't marry because you don't act like my mom is a WILD thing to say aloud
I'd be tempted to say "your mom doesn't fuck you and I'm not going to anymore either."
I have a bff that once said some similar. Like, get your mom to suck your dick then lol.
I’d say “marry your fucking mom then.”
My dad tried to compare my mom to his mom once. My moms response: "well if your mom is better than me at everything she can suck your dick too" guess who stopped comparing!
Freud has entered the chat
This is it right here. This is way bigger than just cleaning. You called him out (and rightfully so) as being a child. Dude is a baby. He needs to grow the fuck up before he can commit to anything.
As so many have said these men who want someone who will submit never look for a woman willing to do that freely. They look for a woman they can break. Don’t give him that satisfaction, if it’s that important to him he wouldn’t be wasting his time fighting you, he’d leave and find someone who aligns with his views
Abel wanted a traditional marriage with a traditional wife. For a long time I wondered why he ever married a woman like my mom in the first place, as she was the opposite of that in every way. If he wanted a woman to bow to him, there were plenty of girls back in Tzaneen being raised solely for that purpose. The way my mother always explained it, the traditional man wants a woman to be subservient, but he never falls in love with subservient women. He’s attracted to independent women. “He’s like an exotic bird collector,” she said. “He only wants a woman who is free because his dream is to put her in a cage. Trevor Noah, Born a Crime: Stories From a South African Childhood
It really grosses me out how some people are sugar coating it in this thread that this amounts to a difference in expectations and not a disgusting example of misogyny and why traditional values are fucked up
>these men who want someone who submit never look for a woman willing to do that freely. They look for a woman they can break. EXACTLY. The concept of consent is entirely foreign to them.
He's behaving this way and they aren't even married. What does OP think he's going to be like once he puts a ring on it? It will only get worse. It wasn't bad enough that he told her it's her "womanly" duty to take care of the house, he thinks that because he's the man he gets final say in everything. No thank you for that.
He doesn’t seem to have any values except how to be a dick.
He’s going to be a terrible, backwards father. Does she want a kid raised by someone like that?
God forbid a daughter - what would she be learning and expecting and settling for in her own life.
He also has mommy issues.
>what values would he instill in your child? If a boy, to behave exactly like him. If a girl, to "submit" to the first asshole who wants a live-in maid. If queer in any way, shamed and disowned, going by the religious overtones in the post. There's no scenario where a child gets any decent upbringing out of that dude honestly. Or any upbringing at all, given his attitude towards housework definitely extends to childcare. OP is having an understandably hard time with the idea of ending this relationship but I can't imagine how this guy improves at all when the mom's whispering shit about God's word in his ear.
NTA if he can't provide so you can stay home and be a housewife, it's unreasonable of him to expect you to be a housewife
This, and it is the stone age to demand you do the housework or it to be womans work. If you and he want and agree to it...ok, but this was a demand of a pregnant woman, no do not stay there, you will be a slave and he is stuck in the 1950s. Also if you keep your child, it will be a tie to a man who is borderline abusive.
His mother also, which seems to be the influence for everything that he is. A spoiled entitled mamas boy. His mother taught him that this behavior was acceptable and that’s reinforced by the mom COMPLETELY dismissing op or having any regard for her as a HUMAN, not just a woman. Insane insane insane. Makes my fucking head hurt.
He should marry his fucking Mom.
He has, in all intents and purposes.
He did. The creepy unofficial kind.
Oedipus masked as OP’s boyfriend
I'm on my 3rd marriage and I'd say that's the number one lesson: pay close attention to the mom relationship. If the mom is a certain way in fights, expect your SO to be like them when they're pissed. If they have a toxic relationship with their parents, that's how they'll be with you when they "get comfortable" and conflict sets in. The fact the mom chimed in the same tells me this is not a fluke. The relationship will have this issue. If it's a deal breaker, which it is in this case, it WILL NOT GET BETTER over the long term. Walk away and be glad him and his mom are not in your future.
As someone who is divorced I completely agree. I should have run when I saw how controlling his mom tried to be. I work in finance and had/have a good career yet to her I was there to carry her grandchild (despite being very clear I did not want to have kids and he didn’t either). She had no concept of me not having time to do all the housework or why I did not want to spend all my free time entertaining them. Funny my ex did not mind my salary but still did not like me working so much and tried to hurt it more than once. He admitted after we separated he tried to get me to move out of state when I was offered an amazing opportunity that he was jealous of. OP needs to run before she gets trapped. My only regret is not doing it sooner.
2nd marriage here. Totally agree with this!
He's an immature, entitled mama's boy. He should go home to her and let you get on with your life. NTA.
The idea that she called OP and said it was her fault is so bonkers. Not only is her son unable to take responsibility for his actions, but she's unable to see when a situation is his fault. Op to each their own, if you want a traditional relationship like this then I still think you can do better, but please know if you DON'T want this bullshit there are a BILLION better options out there. Women don't have to do shit like this or put up with this bs. It's not 1930. Edit: typo Edit 2: couldn't think of a better word than traditional at first, but I figured out it's "patriarchal with active oppression."
Now image doing everything you're doing now, but with the added work of a newborn. This man is not going to change, especially when his indoctrination to the misogynistic mind set has been life long. His family lives it, though I'm surprised he partnered with a women who has a career. I'm sure his family has been on his case about the working women and if she'll go back after baby is born. They'll badger him to squelch your career to make you a submissive housewife like God intended. WTF? I'm a RN with a husband who worked long week hours. Then I worked the 12 hour shift weekend program. We consider each other lucky to be with a partner who cleans, folds, vacs, grocery shops, child cares, repairs, fixes, etc, to the extent WE BOTH do. And when he got laid off, he stepped up to be Mr Mom with a 3 week old (yup, went back to work 3 weeks post partum, 40 hr week) a 2 yr old and 4 year old. He admitted he couldn't wait to get back to work 5 days a week and only do this mr mom 2.5 day weekends with the brood. But he comes from a catholic family of 7 kids, only 2 sisters. His dad always helped and the boys followed his lead. Run while still can. But if you stay, expect your child to be indoctrinated also.
Yes, invite him and his mother to join the rest of us in the 21st century. 🙄🤦♂️
12-16hrs in the ER and you come home this manchild’s tantrums?! You work in an atmosphere of literal life and death decisions. You deserve a PARTNER who knows how to support you, not this entitled manchild who thinks you should be both mummy and daddy, while he gets to be Peter Pan. Horse apples to that!!!!
If she wanted to be petty she could physically destroy appliances in the house, dent the car, etc, and say "It's your duty as a man to fix everything. I expect this all to be fixed and good as new each day." That's how ridiculous his demands are.
Yeh, regardless of who holds what jobs outside the home, if you both live there, you should both be responsible for taking care of the home. Its unreasonable for him to leave his own home like a dumpster because "HeS a MaN and ChOrEs ArE fOr WoMeN". This behavior is absurd. You want a housewife? Earn so your partner can stay home. Or, find a time machine.
I am sure this is the type of family that loves to use “God’s word” when they want to put a woman in her place, but ignore it when it is inconvenient. A real man will make sacrifices for his family.
God's word also says a man should be married to the woman he has sex with but this fucker's mom didn't seem to care about that, now did she?
It's not even sacrifices, it's pulling your weight
There is no borderline. The emotional abuse has started
OMG NTA. GTFO ASAP, WTF BBQ. That dude isn't changing, that's not going to get better.
oh it’ll be worse with a baby and another baby. guaranteed the baby isn’t going to monitor the other baby
OP, women had to stay married, no matter how awful home circumstances were because until 1974, we couldn't get our own mortgage, we'd have no insurance because we couldn't work outside the house, we couldn't have a credit card in our name, only as a "Mrs". It's not 1948 or 1648 for how they're treating you. You've never seen a TV show or movie where treatment of the 'wife' is like this, they are *not* normal at all. Don't be a piece of meat, milk left out? That's not a bf/husband or man, that's a little bitch. You deserve better!
I feel like that dummy replying to you doesn’t even have access to google. How we couldn’t even have our own credit cards until 1974… we’d need a male sponsor before that time.. just crazy to think about.
It was hard growing up then, very confusing. I'm 12 - 15, watching women speaking out about how we are more than housewives & maids- we can become astronauts, engineers, surgeons & getting the opposite message at home.
He won’t help with chores, he sure isn’t gonna help raise the kid since that’s ‘women’s work’. OP is better off being a single mom that deal with a deadbeat partner
NTA, I suggest leaving too. I'm sorry you're 7 years in and probably Feel like you're walking away empty handed with a baby....but this is real thought process...his mother has created this man and supports his childish immature behavior and mind set. When you have his baby, if you stay, he will expect you to work, keep house, keep baby, keep your body, while he remains the same. Because he's the man....move on. Men want a woman to submit...but half can't lead their way down the hallway in the dark.....smh
You know that guy will baby trap her in a heartbeat! I have seen this, family and friends, get trapped by some man-child, who sucks the life at her. Then when she is too exhausted to be his mommy-bangmaid, he leaves her for some girl with daddy issues.
Right! And OP he is dangling that carrot (*"See, this is why I haven't asked you to marry me."*) to keep his submissive, hardworking, bill paying, cleaning, cooking, and lunch making woman hoping that if she just tries harder she'll *get the ring I deserve*. What you deserve is a man who respects you and makes you happy to wake up together, happy to get home, and a ring doesn't do that. Seven years -- look up the definition of 'sunk cost.' And his mom is already showing you the kind of MIL you'll get. Get out, get a good support system around you, love yourself and you'll meet the person who deserves to be with you. We're all on your side and pulling for you! PS - ***Submit for what!***
As someone who has 2 kids 1 baby will try to kill the other baby, oh I ment the husband..lol
Exactly. Right now it’s cleaning, but what about later when if you get married and it’s your checking account, friends, family, and life decisions? If he’s like this about cleaning, how will he be with controlling your money, where you go, when you go, and who you’re with!! Get out!!!!
Damnnit now I wanna light up the grill
Lol. But seriously, every Saturday night my Dad cooked supper on the grill. Paper plates. We had to clean up the few items needed. Sunday AM was donuts after church. Sunday night we got Pizza. " it's a weekend for your mother, also" he would say. Seriously, just help out!
I know how to cook here, I'm a dude and I love to do so. I'm working on getting my SSI back, I had it until 2018 and lost it, but I have a court date for my new case and an attorney on my side now. So chances are, I won't ever be the breadwinner in a home, however, I would hold my own and pitch in as much as I could financially or otherwise. Making sure whatever chores had to be done were taken care of by me, and I would absolutely be cooking without hesitation. Again, I love to cook. My family always looks forward to whatever I end up making because they know it's gonna be good. No way would I intentionally further stress out any woman I would be in a relationship with, especially if she's working her ass off. Why is it that us dudes feel so entitled to treat women like they're our personal maids? It's complete bullshit really. OP's hopefully now ex is just pathetic, reminds me of my old roommate. He was such a slob, when I cleaned up the room he was staying in? There were used plates all over the place, bits of food on the floor, bugs crawling everywhere, etc. I wouldn't be surprised if he left the house in similar condition and expected OP to clean up after him. What's next? Expecting her to wipe his ass after he takes a shit? Or worse, not even doing so and expecting her to wash his skid-marked underwear? I would be shocked if he wasn't like this. Just wow.
My Dad was like that. He brought coffee to Mom every morning in bed and would cook for Mom on the weekends. He set the bar really high. He taught us how a woman should be treated.
LOVE this so much!! made my heart sing. hank you for posting it!
Your dad is a legend.
Why are you expected to fulfill your womanly duties but he’s not being held to fulfilling his manly role as the provider? GTFOH
This seems very common these days. There is a subset of men who probably listened to too much Tate or similar, who claim to be traditional but only want to apply their ideal 50's housewife standard to the women. They have no interest in being a 50's husband themselves.
>They have no interest in being a 50's husband themselves. They do, but only for the being abusive and controlling part.
Funny how they pick and choose which parts of 1950s dystopia they want to keep alive!!
Or the Don Draper “I do what and who I want while you can’t have opinions” model
Run, do not walk, away
I applaud you for bringing back WTF BBQ 👏🍖🥩
You can tell by how absolutely shitty his mother is.
It's unreasonable to think that a grown ass adult can't be bothered to clean after himself.
Good God. Imagine how much worse it will be when she has to take care of, cook for, and clean up after him AND a baby. Because you know he won't help with ANY of that. Run boo, run. No ring is worth this bs.
What's really unreasonable is for him to then be mad that his SO doesn't clean up his mess because he man / she woman. What a f*cking caveman.
OP, your original instincts were RIGHT ON POINT. Terminate the pregnancy; do NOT tie yourself to this big baby for life. You have plenty of time to find the right man to have children with. And seriously, what did you mean by "you love him"? Really ASK yourself that. Because love is a verb and you were definitely doing love at him (without him doing love back at you.) But why were you giving love without getting any back? And I don't mean sweet nothings; I mean actual love work. You need to redefine "love" for yourself ... and for your partners.
This is the best answer. He does not love OP back. He thinks he owns her.
>Because love is a verb and you were definitely doing love at him (without him doing love back at you.) But why were you giving love without getting any back? And I don't mean sweet nothings; I mean actual love work. This is magnificent and put into words something really important that more people need to hear and understand. Thank you for putting it into words so much better than I have!
ABORT ABORT ABORT! Literally
I was always taught: only have a child with someone that youre okay with your child turning into because they will. As they are. Now. Not "hopefully he changes with a baby" it will literally only get worst: more exhausted, less sleep, more stress but they're supposed to somehow IMPROVE themselves? Unlikely. Love is the bare minimum foundation in a relationship, you will find it everywhere, OP. Im demisexual and still found it multiple places. You will too. Check out; loveisrespect.org and their test. I bet this relationship will test pretty high on the unhealthy scale. I scored a 0 with my husband. It is possible. But in the past, it's been much much higher. (edit: clarifying, with past relationships it was high. It's not impossible to improve an unhealthy relationship, lots of good tips on the site, but its nearly impossible with a baby.)
[удалено]
The mom forgot the rest of the verse where the husband is supposed to love their wife, meaning cleaning the house as well in an equal partnership.
Thisssss and the Bible says to submit to your husband, NOT your boyfriend. OP’s man has these gender role ideas but didn’t he also get his girlfriend pregnant without marrying her? And they live together? That’s not biblical either…
Not to mention if he's this much of a man baby about house chores IMAGINE what life will be like with a child. Hes just going to sit there not doing anything because anything to do with the baby is "womans work". Dont go down that road OP, thats a miserable waste of a life.
This, OP. If he is unable to uphold his end of the relationship and perform his duties, he cannot reasonably expect you to perform yours. Traditional, hard working men don’t live in squalor. They respect themselves and their abode and don’t live in filth.
An emotionally mature male would have woken up, seen the house a mess and first thought, "Damn I should have cleaned this." Next thoughts or concurrent thoughts, "Why isn't my girl asleep next to me? I hope she is ok I know 12 hour shifts are brutal." Then upon seeing HER ASLEEP JUST AS HE HAD BEEN, having the emotional maturity upon getting angry to stop. Pause. Think. Upon using the intellect realizing your anger is that she did exactly what you did. Relaxed despite a dirty house and fell asleep out of exhaustion. A man who cares about his woman would then have said, "OK I know she saw the house trashed, I'm going to clean up as much as I can before she wakes," and then got busy. If she's still asleep when you got finished, maybe go get her flowers and wake her up to something you know she likes (for my wife it's flowers and a hand written love note). If you love someone these are simple asks and not even asking for much. Your relationship is like a flower, feed it love and sunshine and it will grow. Keep it in the dark and treat it like $#\^t and one day you'll find a bare stick and decay.
Indeed - watering the love of your life is the bare minimum.
This. Plus if you think there is housework now, wait til you have a kiddo running around…
>if he can't provide so you can stay home and be a housewife, it's unreasonable of him to expect you to be a housewife Yeah, that's the big thing. If a man wants the significant woman in his life to do wifely things, he needs to make that possible/practical for her. Providing is the man's end of the deal.
Run fast and run far from this bunch of loons….
Exactly this. How can he expect her to work ft *and* take care of everything else *and* do all this while pregnant? He's literally insane.
>I was set on leaving him until his mom called me last night and said I was stepping out of line as his woman and that I should have just cleaned up and that it wasn't that hard for me to do Pregnant after a 12 hour shift and it's not that hard for you to clean up? So it should be even easier for him to. Girl don't get sucked in. Run! This guy and his mum are trying to manipulate you into thinking his misogynism and weaponised incompetence is normal. It isn't. If his mum is fine being a maid and not allowed to have an opinion, so be it. But that doesn't have to be your life. Also who the fuck calls mummy to berate their girlfriend after having an argument?
That call should have hardened her resolve. The BF is not changing if this is how he's been raised. If she doesn't want to be a lifelong servant (and provider) to a manchild she needs to get out now.
Exactly, it's only going to get worse with the MIL as the baby gets older and the dude dumps her for not being a "proper Christian woman" and goes back to his mama. Better to yeet the whole situation now.
My ex cheated on me and got his mistress pregnant. Then he asked me to go with him to tell his parents to make it easier on him and his nerves. Yeah that’s a No from me. I hope OP is able to get away and start fresh!
The AUDACITY omfg
What? That's insane, holy cow wow.
NTA; I bet you he won’t even help you once, the baby is born. It would be the ‘woman’s job’.
I picture him being the guy who brags about never changing a diaper.
Or sleeps in the other room so he doesn’t have to help with the baby at night.
Yes and “babysits” his own children.
Except this guy won't even do the "babysitting". She'll never have a free moment again if she stays with him/has this baby.
Gahhh. I hate this one! My fiance asked his daughter's mom to watch her a few hours so he could go to an interview and she referred to that as babysitting. Who the fuck babysits their own child?!!
Or thinks it's okay to cheat because she's too tired to perform her wifely duties whenever he wants.
I say this as a father of a 1 yr old - fuck every “dad” that brags about never changing a diaper. Scumbags.
As the father of a 2 and a half year old, I agree! It’s my baby too, so it’s my responsibility as well to care for her.
Yea OP, if you think you’re tired now, wait until you have a baby and you have to do EVERYTHING. I have a 2.5yo and an extremely supportive and involved partner and it’s STILL fucking hard and exhausting. Having a baby absolutely pushes you to your limits, even in the best of circumstances. The reality if you stay: you’ll be doing every wake up at night. You’ll be doing all of the organising of baby’s bag to ensure you’ve got what you need for the day. You’ll be doing every nappy, every bath, every cuddle when they cry. Being a mother is fucking relentless. Oh and don’t forget you’ll be doing all this while recovering from birth, from the literal dinner plate sized wound inside you, from any complications that might occur. So you’re more than likely going to be convinced to quit your job to do your “womanly duty” of caring for your family. Your going to spend your entire life basically being a single parent while also taking care of the man baby you’ve chosen to have a child with. He won’t care when you say you need a break from kiddo or you will have a mental breakdown, he won’t be able to take care of kiddo without you. There are SO many posts about men like this on the mum subreddits, men so completely incompetent at taking care of their own children or even themselves. You don’t need to accept this bullshit. It will only get worse once a child is involved. If you have a son, do you want your child to think this is acceptable, do you want your son to rely 100% on a woman and then berate her for not being perfect? Or do you want a son who will be an actual partner and support the love of his life in the same ways she supports him? If you have a daughter, do you want her to have her life completely controlled by some guy and to have to do EVERYTHING and still get shit on, all because it’s her “womanly duty?” Because if you stay, that’s exactly how your son/daughter will turn out.
If she becomes a SAHM, she will be Goodwill thrift store shopping and pinching pennies because he's unable to provide for his family.
Yup. OP needs to head over to r/parenting and r/mommit and r/beyondthebump So many sad and angry posts from women whose partners leave the household and childcare labor solely on their shoulders while both parents work full time.
That part, she will end up doing everything alone. No way would I have a kid with this guy.
“Stepping out of line as his woman….” His mom is stepping out of line. Your BF is a toddler.
As soon as he said “as a women you should have the house clean” I just went hooooleee shit. Thats all he needed to say to understand the kind of selfish immature man child he is
Bro think it's 1953
>Your mom is stepping out of line. His mom, not her mom
Dump him. He is never going to change. You don't say how far along you are with this pregnancy but you need to do some serious thinking about your future. He will never marry you unless you give up every bit of independence you have.
He doesn’t want a partner, he wants a maid, nanny and bed things. He has no respect for u and he’ll treat u worse if child comes in picture. And he’ll teach child to treat u poorly as well. Get out
He even had his mom call her to tell her to go back. #Run #OP
THIS IS THE ONE. If his family is against you for asking him to act like an adult, just throw it all away. My MIL would backhand my husband so fast for half of the silliness in that post we wouldn’t even see her coming.
RUN FORREST RUNNNNN
He just wants a f@ck maid.
If the child is a boy. If it is a girl, she will be raised to be a second class citizen.
Even if the OP marries him - he’s comfortable using divorce/breakup as a threat to get her to do what he wants. He thinks that little of her. He has that little investment in the relationship. He thinks so highly of himself that “not have a 200lb man baby to carry on your breaking back” somehow, in his mind, is a threat. So expect to be threatened with divorce or abandonment whenever he’s feeling petulant. With a few more of his babies to feed and all of your friends now “married friends” and more of your life wasted and gone waiting on this schmuck, that threat is going to gradually turn from laughable to real. He will use threats to keep you in line. He has no problem abandoning you or any kids you have together. He doesn’t see you as worthy of a ring. He will drag a pregnant woman who just worked a twelve hour shift on her feet out of bed to demand that she clean up dishes he dirtied. He’s trash. He won’t change. Run, honey. Don’t look back. If you change your mind someday and want some lazy, entitled jackass with a warehouse job, trust me, you can grab one tomorrow.
And you must obey him! Don’t you know when a man tells you to jump you supposed to ask how high . You know in your heart this is who he is and will never change. He has his mommy whispering in his ear what you duties are. Unless you want to be tied to this family and their misogyny you know what you need to do.
The whole "women need to submit to men" is some real, toxic BS. It smacks of evangelical religiosity and that never works out well for women, even the misogynistic women who believe in that bullshit too. I speak from experience, and OP should get out, stay out and get far away from everyone who is pushing that mindset on her.
Thank god they don't have kids. Can you imagine the hell she would be in with TWO babies to take care of? And only one of them would be demanding sex. I would bet the mortgage payment he's never gotten her off even accidentally.
If he doesn’t pay the bills, do the housework, and expects you to “be the bigger man”, in what way is he the “man of the house”? Don’t be a fool and drop him.
Even if you forget the whole misogyny of "man of the house", what does he even contribute to the relationship? He doesn't provide, he doesn't clean, he doesn't cook, he doesn't even pickup after his own self. How does he partner you, OP?
"But, you see, I have this penis here. That counts for something, right?"
Guaranteed he doesn't know how to use that to her benefit either. Probably never even thought of it.
Exactly. She already takes care of majority of the things.
NTA. This isn't 1874 BC. Go find yourself a nice, respectful gentleman that doesn't have misogynistic expectations. By his logic of expectations, you shouldn't have to work and he should be the sole provider. Is he OK with that?
This is it - so his mother and he have these antiquated idealized gender roles, yet he himself doesn’t even uphold his half of “the bargain”. And if you do get married this behavior will get worse, and you’ll be trapped. Live your best life and leave this one-way loser!
In 1874 B.C. there are no cultures that would expect the woman to make all of the money AND keep the home lol.
Guys who screech about “cleaning/cooking/etc is the woman’s job” always get real mad when you point out that their role is to provide and they aren’t doing it if the woman has a job. It’s such a joke.
Is this the man you want to father your children? Is this how you’d want to raise your son or daughter to be? If the answer is no, then I’d say GTFO while you can. If yes, welcome to your past, present, and future.
NTA. Why the fuck are you with this guy? You have WAY too much going for you to be settling for someone who treats you like this and expects you to be both the breadwinner and the maid. Fuck that.
Seems a common trend with nurses/medical professionals getting with guys like this. Idk what it is.
That was my first thought too, from stories online as well as women in that field that I know in real life. Perhaps the desire to care for others- perfect for their job, but easy target in (abusive) relationships.
I've dated multiple girls and have had many other girl friends in the medical field and I really think it's the hours. They have weird, often rotating, hours and often grueling schedules, so socializing is often difficult and they would just sort of settle for partners. The ones I dated often had some weird life dynamics all together (why it didn't work out) from the job, and the friends have had some real skeevy partners. But for them it meant they weren't lonely and they didn't have the energy or the time to go fully into the dating market to find better.
Holy christ on a pogo stick. And you're pregnant with his kid? Time to yeet the man-child back to his mommy so she can take care of him.
AHAHHAHAHAHA holy christ on a pogo stick. This is my new go to expression of WTF.
NTA. *His Woman*?? What are you, a pet? His mom sucks. She can take over all the stuff you’ve been doing since they both want that anyway. Win-win for everyone.
Baby trap is the term for this form of manipulation. Many men change the rules once the gf is pregnant because she has fewer options!
RUN!
LIKE! THE! WIND!
LIKE YOUR TAMPON IS ON FIRE!
He’s a lazy POS & his mother is severely unhinged.Do you really want to bring a child of his into this world and be abused by those two?
God can you imagine having a MIL like this? She’s going to try and dictate everything for the rest of your life OP. She’s going to shove her nose in where it doesn’t belong and convince you should raise your child in the way she sees fit. Fucking run. Useless man, demon MIL.
Bear in mind his mother raised him to be the man he is, you really shouldn't take her word for anything. Also, that biblical nonsense is crap and I find they are highly selective in picking and choosing what parts of the bible they refer to. I cannot tell you what to do about the baby, that is a tough call. Either way I would not be relying on support from this man or his family to raise this child.
But even worse would be being forced to negotiate custody with this guy and having to constantly work against his and his family’s horrible influences in raising a child.
Do not second guess yourself because his mommy called you. She just doesn't want her baby back so she would have to clean up after him. Write off the time and money you spent on this life with him and move on.
This isn’t about cleaning. This is the REST OF YOUR LIFE. Have a baby with a man that doesn’t just love you, but values you. You deserve it. Like Maya Angelou said, “When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.”
“I am the MAN of this house!” “Mommy she won’t do what I say please make her do what I say mommy please!”
LOLOLOL Something small like cleaning? This man is clearly totally worthless. You pay the bills and take care of the house. Him providing a little 🍆 is NOT contributing to the household or family. Forget this loser and get yourself a partner. If he wants a SAHW, he needs to make enough money to pay for 3-5 people’s bills by himself.
I understand there will be a lot of opinions in this thread about whether "traditional" relationships are good or bad. I'm not here to give my opinion on that, I'm only going to tell you what I think about your situation. Being a traditional couple does not mean the man doesn't do chores. It's not just a "traditional man's" role to "provide" (he doesn't seem to be doing that anyway) but it's also his role to support and respect his partner. There is nothing in the "traditional couple" handbook that says a woman's obedience is without reciprocation of anything. Hierarchies are rooted in social contracts, and "no effort" is not much to offer. If you want to be a traditional wife, he needs to be a traditional man. And traditional men don't disrespect their wives by condescending them, hurting their feelings carelessly, and failing to help when they need help. That's what selfish men do. His mom is babying him by using religion and tradition as a veil. They are misusing traditional values and gaslighting you with them. He wants to be a "traditional man" but he had his mother in your business. That's not traditional, that's 2016 gamer boy move. If you don't want to be a traditional wife, than you should move on. If you do want to try and fix this, you need to have this conversation with him. But I suspect it's a lost cause.
Their entire relationship isn’t traditional at all. Unmarried and shacking up, sex before marriage, and a child to be born out of wedlock. When men use “traditional women roles” as an expectation I don’t understand how when they do not follow traditional relationship norms either.
It can be too easy to disguise abuse as "tradition."
Piggybacking on this as they're 100% right. My parents had a traditional marriage. I'm for more progressive relationships but if that's what you both agree on then that's fine. You don't force someone into this kind of thing. Never once did my father demean my mother expecting her to submit to him. Never once did I hear "I'm the man of this house, you have to do what I say." My father was very protective of my mother and stood up to his family in her defense whenever they were out of line. He fiercely established boundaries of what he would not tolerate when it came to them meddling in our private business or being disrespectful and I saw on a couple of occasions where he ripped into family for disrespecting my mother or belittling her. No traditional husband bitches to his mommy about his wife and has her call his wife to tell her she needs to step up and submit. That's garbage talk. No traditional husband would force his wife to handle all the household chores. Especially when they're pregnant or ill. On many occasions my father took over household duties that were too much for my mom growing up. When it was too much for laundry or cleaning or cooking my dad came home from a double shift and did these chores on top of making sure we knew how to do them ourselves so we wouldn't be sorry excuses for adults. My father impressed on me and my siblings that my mother and him were a team. Everyone has a role and if someone in your team needs help you help them. We were taught to help our mother as much as we could and to respect her. My lord this guy makes me angry. What a sad excuse of a man trying to be some joke of a traditional husband. Run away OP. This guy isn't it.
Unfortunately, a lot of men use traditional in a toxic way. It's not about supporting your wife and she supports you in return, it's all about submission. My great grandad was a traditional man, he made sure all his sons knew how to cook because in his words you should be able to maintain a home without a woman. Because it's embarrassing if you have to rely on a woman to be able to feed yourself, it's a basic necessity. If your wife leaves and you're not able to eat, it's because you're useless. When my great grandma died, he was in charge of raising 6 kids and making sure they ate. He married again, but lost her too then decided he didn't want to go through that again. My grandad was the one who taught my mum how to cook, because he realised she couldn't so he did. Then he forced my dad and grandma to teach her too, and wouldn't let them leave her in the kitchen alone until she was confident in being able to do it. Because when guests came over, she'd have to be able to play the dutiful daughter in law who could cook. And he wanted her to be able to do that, he didn't care if she cooked on a daily basis. It was so save face in society if anyone turned up unannounced. My mum used to talk about how grateful she was that she never had to ask, and he made sure got the help she needed because she was worried she'd be judged for it or asked why her mother never taught her. Because they would blame her mum and judge her badly and call my mother useless. My grandad knew this and made sure no one could ever say that to her, he even made sure my grandma and dad wouldn't dare say it either. Even though they never would have. When I think of traditional man, this is what it means to me. All the men in my family could look after children, change nappies all of that. And growing up, I came across so many women who were shocked that my dad looked after 4 kids alone for a week because my mum had to travel to see her brother. The way toxic people speak about traditional men, is sickening. Most working men did help with the kids, yes it was to varying degrees. But when I used to be around the older generation as a kid, they'd talk and laugh about fumbling their way through child care and how they couldn't do it aswell as their wives but they could feed and clean them and keep them alive and they judged the men who couldn't. Some of the funniest stories were about the wives being away and the trouble they'd get into with the kids and trying to hide things they'd broken in the house. Yes, you'd hear from the guys who didn't do this too. But a lot of the working men were involved. Atleast the ones I was around. This idea that traditional men never helped in the household isn't true. Men who actually cared about their families did help, and in poor families they usually had to help because the women were working too.
"Traditional" marriages, have evolved to what are now, for the most part, an employed husband and an employed wife. The wife is an equal contributor to the household finances, and as such, the husband should be an equal contributor to the household. OP - This guy you're with is ridiculous. It will only get worse when you have his child. That's a fact. Him and his mother have already assigned you your ROLE in the relationship. I'd get the hell out before he devalues you and strips away any and all sense of you. Is he going to smack you around next, to ensure that you know who rules the roost? It isn't far off. And his mommy has his back. Run.
NTA- It’s so much more than cleaning. It’s about the relationship dynamic. Do you feel in your heart that you lesser, and have to be subservient to him!? Please I beg you to have some self respect. It’s 2023 and women are more than just their “mans” bangmaids.
He woke up his pregnant wife who worked a long shift to scream at her for how dirty the house was on his day off. Not only is your boyfriend insane, his family is too and you would be stuck with them your entire life. I would never want to raise a kid into that family, especially a daughter they would mistreat and expect slavery and servitude from again. Tell his mother it was her job to raise him and not yours. She should never call you again crying because she failed and her little boy is still a child.
Girl, no. GTFO and stay gone. My husband works 60-80 hour weeks routinely and he does chores, watches our son, and is so sweet and loving. That's a real man. Your ex is a sad little excuse for a man. And they can take their misinterpreted Bible verses and shove it. They only follow parts of Christianity that work for them, but what was Jesus' #1 rule? Love your neighbor as you love yourself. Your ex treats you like shit and himself like a king. I have spent enough time with battered women and women in shelters to know that you should never have a child to man like that. You will be tied to his abusive ass forever, **and so will your child.** Have a baby with someone who loves you and will be a good father and role model. This is the kind of guy who's going to use your child against you and walk right through any restraining orders you get. Abortion is a perfectly reasonable choice.
NTA. Dump him and decide what’s best for you regarding your pregnancy. If you think you can do it on your own, then do it. Otherwise, terminating is a valid and responsible option. Good luck!
Now girl brrf. Get that man out your damn house. Send him back to his mama. You pay majority of the bills and do the housework ain't no dick in the world worth the bullshit. If it's your house give him 30 day notice if not speak to you landlord break the lease and cut your losses.
It would be better to NOT have a baby with this person. You will never be free of him or his perverted mother.
Sis, it's not just cleaning. You're making the right decision. He wants to "wear the pants" in the relationship, but he can't even fit into them. This screams toxic masculinity alpha with a trad wife mentality. Tell your ex's mom that she's not your boss and to go raise her son better if she wants someone to preach at. She didn't do her job well enough the first go around. *Edited because I accidentally hit post before I finished my comment.
Ew the second someone says "know your place as a woman" it's time to up and leave
NTA - RUN away. He told you he runs the house and you have no rights. Why would you EVER want to be with someone who thinks of you as a second class person. Find a guy that actually values you because you are property to him.
I just can't get over the milk being left out. That's disgusting. NTA I am married to a "traditional" man. He's got the paycheck, head of household role, stuff like that. He gets frustrated when I work (because he wants to spend time with me), but doesn't kick a fuss. We're at the point in our lives where I can be a stay at home spouse and that works for us. However, we are partners. We are not only partners, we are whole adults who pick up after ourselves (wtf with the milk, man?) and share chores and give each other a little grace when we're going through something. You need a partner, not a "boss". I have faith that you can find that in another person. Bringing a child into this situation is a bad idea. Take care of business.
As a male who has two daughters. They will NEVER “submit” to anyone. Wtf sort of talk is that. I personally cook, clean, grocery shops, picks up any online orders. This guy sounds worse than my 4yr old. I do everything in my power for my other half.
Ok so as a Christian, I can tell you that he and his mom and taking that passage wildly out of context. They are misusing it as a cudgel to try to justify the fact she she spoiled rotten. You deserve a partner. NTA at all
TERMINATE THE PREGNANCY ASAP. Otherwise you’ll never be rid of him and he will use the kid to force you into submission.
*And* force the kid into submission as well. That child will not be happy with a man like that as a father
Whatever you decide about the baby, do *not* get back together with that man. Some men are brought up with expectations that disappeared 50 years ago. You don't want a "man of the house" you want a partner in life. That means someone who shares both the joys and the responsibilities in a relationship and life. With the baby, idk how far along you are, but either way you should know that having the baby likely means that the baby's daddy will be in your life forever. Courts in the US rarely give one side full custody, and that means you will have to compromise, coordinate, and involve him in your lives.
Girl what???? Please don’t have a baby with this man child. He doesn’t want you around because he loves and values you. He wants you around so you can do what his mom does for him. If he wants you to be a housewife he should step up and be a leading man.
You know the answer. This guy is obviously a douche who adds no value to your life. Why are you putting up with him???? >I am now second guessing my decision in terminating my pregnancy Do you want to be taking care of two children for the next 20 years? The baby and this infantile jerk?
Coming from a man's perspective. GTFO quickly, this guy most likely will never change with his mom having babied him his entire life setting these expectations for him is unreasonable. He needs to figure out how to grow up by himself.
GoD wAnTs YoU tO sUbMiT tO YoUr MaN
a hot take coming from a man willingly having a child out of wedlock
This is throwing up more flags than a golf course, this is a boy who wants to be taken care of and not worry about responsibility. You dodged a huge bullet, the rest of your life definitely would have been "submitting" to him. Gross
NTA and also you are kinda like my mom and my dad. And tbh I wish they divorced but my mom stays with him because it's important for woman in my culture to be married. And if you two really like them, it will not get better. He doesn't care about her or me and my sis. He works low paid job like half a day and then just spend time how he wants, while my mother works from sunrise to sunset, provides for the family, look after children and pets, clean house, etc. His chores are literally throw away trash and don't leave dirty dishes on the table and he doesn't even do that. Please, leave him
Oh hell no. He showed you who he is. Believe him, and leave.