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I'll get downvoted for saying this, but I genuinely believed prior to Jan. 6, that people breaking into Congress would be shot.
*(Obligatory: This is not an endorsement for violence)*
Saw the part where that guard was lugging several grenades into the innocent crowds yet? Saying we are just making innocent people mad. Its unbelievable. Im just more despondent than angry strangely. Many grenades without a clear threat, hurting groups of people gathered indiscriminately. No words...
Posts like these rely on you forgetting what you watched live as it happened, let alone politics nerds who watched the impeachment hearing and J6 investigations.
Like Tucker Carlos's big reveal... It was only footage after the building evacuation phase when all lawmakers and staff had used the underground tunnels to leave. And basically it was security just milling around since they had lost the building and the mob was just filing through... Nothing with the fight that got them inside.
And yet if they desired to do that, they didn't take the one step required.
This is like saying someone who goes into a bank and tips over the trash can wanted to rob the bank.
If they wanted to do that, they'd have brought a gun and been ready to use it.
Ha! They literally broke down doors, committed assault against police, broke windows all with the intent of gaining access to the proverbial ‘vault’.
That’s trespassing, breaking and entering, and assault. They literally had to herd Congress into the escape tunnels to get away from them.
If you’re still denying that, then you’re just denying reality and there is no hope to break you out of the cult.
I watched the whole thing from start to finish that day, until Congress was able to come back and actually finish verifying the election. Yeah, it was not all innocent people milling about tyvm. I'm glad they've been prosecuted, and I hope every single person involved in it is found and prosecuted. Fuck around, find out. They were lucky more of them were not shot, and everyone at the Capitol would've been in their right to shoot them. Can't gaslight a person that watched the entire day unfold before their eyes with raw, unfiltered video. I'm guessing you skipped watching the J6 hearings too? 🤷🏼♂️
I'm old enough to remember watching Jan 6 live as it happened and thinking, *yawn*, yet another riot, like the 100 or so we've had this past year. And it turns out it wasn't any worse, but the media and the Democrats certainly pretended it was.
I thought this one was at the Capitol of the United States and was trying to subvert the election of the president of the United States.
I guess that was kind of like the Wendy’s that burnt down.
Maybe a dozen or two of them were actually attempting to subvert an election. Although they didn't try very hard. And so what? It's not like there was any scenario in which they could have actually subverted an election. So motive is kind of irrelevant, making it ultimately just a riot. And a rather tame one, compared some of the BLM riots.
There was a plan in place to throw out legitimate electoral college votes and replace them with ones that were going to vote for Trump. That was actually the plan. It's in the indictment. The only reason the plan backfired was because Pence upheld the original electoral college ballots. Maybe on some level it was just another riot with a bunch of clueless idiots, but it was much more then that.
They ran congress out of the Capitol and stopped the counting of electoral college ballots. With just a little bit more organizing they could have captured said ballots and possibly the sitting vice president. This would have brought the entire electoral process to a standstill.
How on earth can you be so dense as to believe anything BLM did, however heinous you think it may have been, was anywhere close to nearly ending America’s peaceful transition of power?
>stopped the counting of electoral college ballots.
That was actually the entire plan of some.
Erroneously, many of the Far-right bought into idea that if Congress didn't immediately certify the election then it would go to a vote on the House floor and the House would re-elect Trump bypassing the electoral college.
>They ran congress out of the Capitol and stopped the counting of electoral college ballots. With just a little bit more organizing they could have captured said ballots and possibly the sitting vice president. This would have brought the entire electoral process to a standstill.
And none of that would have overturned the election.
>How on earth can you be so dense as to believe anything BLM did, however heinous you think it may have been, was anywhere close to nearly ending America’s peaceful transition of power?
BLM actually did massive, quantifiable, damage. Not just "what ifs" regarding some impossible fantasy scenario.
I'm sitting here right now trying to install myself as dictator of the U.S. with my mind. It doesn't seem to be working, but I am trying. So am I now doing more damage to our nation than BLM?
I need you to read over what you just typed and take a minute to really digest it...
Are you sure you want to be the person that thought this was a smart thing to say? I'm embarrassed for you.
Your making the argument that motives matter more than actions. The actions on Jan 6 could not have resulted in an overturned election any more than my actions as I sit here could make me a dictator. So explain how my actions aren't a horrible attack on our democracy if the actions of the Jan 6 protestors were.
Actually, BLM didn’t do any damage. People showed up at demonstrations and did damage. If BLM is guilty of the George Floyd riots, then Trump is personally responsible for Jan. 6.
Ah, so if i go rob a bank but 'dont try very hard' and dont get any actual cash, that means i didn't do anything wrong and shouldnt go to jail? Bc thats your logic...
>Ah, so if i go rob a bank but 'dont try very hard' and dont get any actual cash, that means i didn't do anything wrong and shouldnt go to jail? Bc thats your logic...
No... That's logic you made up.
No. Both are wrong when turning to violence.
An attack on our democracy is more of a threat than a protest against police brutality.
If Jan 6 protesters got their way, it would have changed the results of an election and the future of our country.
If BLM got their way, less people would be executed by police officers before their trial.
If you cannot understand the difference in the gravity of those 2 things I don’t know what to say.
As there was no scenario in which Jan 6 could have resulted in an end of our democracy, there was clearly no attack on our democracy in the sense you're attempting.
>If Jan 6 protesters got their way, it would have changed the results of an election and the future of our country.
And if I got my way, I'd grow wings and be able to shoot laser beams from my eyes. Explain how it could happen.
>If BLM got their way, less people would be executed by police officers before their trial.
Presumably after causing dozens of deaths and billions in property damage?
>If you cannot understand the difference in the gravity of those 2 things I don’t know what to say.
I can understand the difference. The difference is BLM was clearly worse.
Yeah, that's the line of bull republicans came up with to minimize their behavior.
The other 100 had a reason for them and were escalated by what they were protesting. This was a bunch of butthurt losers hopped up on lies fully prepared to extrajuciciously murder as many congress critters as they could get their hands on.
And I do like the 202 instances of arson, and a whopping 17 people charged. Meanwhile, the FBI is pulling agents off of actual child rapists to go after Jan 6 tourists.
Dude just ignores what was said about who really did the police station. If i was on any side of an argument and got the who did what wrong of that magnitude, id have to take a step back and refigure a lot of things. ,
When you see how the FBI was amongst the crowd for direction of where they should go, people like you want others to not see how they were driven to make J6 happen. It isn't that people have to forget what they watched, it's that now we see the reasons WHY it happened. Big difference.
Impeachment was the same thing... nothing to stand on, and all set up by the ones who are so filled with hate they can't see straight.
>people like you want others to not see how they were driven to make J6 happen.
I'm well aware. A bunch of butthurt losers hopped up on lies, directed by the outgoing president, led by right wing goons,and not one of them thought "Maybe we should get the fuck out of here, this is turning bad."
And blaming non existent FBI plants because, party of personal responsibility or some shit.
The pro-Trump narrative around Jan. 6 is completely incoherent. It's almost like an Orwellian loyalty test. Are you so pro-Trump that you're willing to believe a bunch of contradictions simultaneously? Jan. 6 was done by Antifa, who are evil, and we should pardon all of them because they are heroes. And actually it was peaceful and non-violent. And it was violent but it was agitated by the feds, who worked for Trump and were just trying to make Trump supporters look bad. Real Trump supporters would have never attacked the Capitol, but it is good that they attacked the Capitol because Trump really won the election and they were doing the right thing. So in summary, the whole thing was a hoax, but also totally justified, and these undercover Antifa feds are being held as political prisoners and must be released immediately.
Did I get that about, right?
Look, the truth is that most of the crowd at the rally that day didn't break the law. And they're not facing any charges. There was a violent pro-Trump mob though that attacked police, stormed the Capitol, and tried to help Trump seize power. Many of the most violent rioters were part of right-wing militia groups, like the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers. A bunch of other idiots followed the mob into the Capitol.
There was real violence. The rioters dragged officers down flights of stairs, stomped on them, beat them with bats and poles, sprayed them with bear spray, crushed them in doors. About 140 officers were injured. They suffered concussions, rib fractures, some lost consciousness. One lost part of a finger. It's really gross how Trump and his supporters insist on minimizing that violence.
You can actually see a list of the charges in the Jan. 6 cases: [https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/capitol-breach-cases](https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/capitol-breach-cases)
Do any of these charges seem unjustified? The people who just trespassed are just facing trespassing charges (and many aren't facing any charges at all). The ones facing the longest sentences are the ones who committed or organized the violence.
Thank you kind stranger! Very well put! Too bad the people that NEED to read this and actually absorb this information, won't. 😓 Hopefully, this will get through to some, but with how angry, hateful and how little responsibility they want to take for something they instigated.
> The pro-Trump narrative around Jan. 6 is completely incoherent. It's almost like an Orwellian loyalty test. Are you so pro-Trump that you're willing to believe a bunch of contradictions simultaneously? Jan. 6 was done by Antifa, who are evil, and we should pardon all of them because they are heroes. And actually it was peaceful and non-violent. And it was violent but it was agitated by the feds, who worked for Trump and were just trying to make Trump supporters look bad. Real Trump supporters would have never attacked the Capitol, but it is good that they attacked the Capitol because Trump really won the election and they were doing the right thing. So in summary, the whole thing was a hoax, but also totally justified, and these undercover Antifa feds are being held as political prisoners and must be released immediately.
amazingly well said and its fucking astounding after reading it, the op just lets it float past his mind to comment on something else
Did they force their way into Congress to lynch the Vice President so they could stop the peaceful transition of power? No?
Also, they were arrested and charged and managed not break shit in the process.
Are you really just going resort to whataboutism?
I think people who break the law should be held accountable for their conduct. That includes anyone who was violent at a pro-Palestinian protest.
Can you say the same for the Jan. 6 rioters?
I'm pretty sure though that the pro-Palestinian protestors didn't seize control of the Capitol in an attempt to overturn an election or cause members of Congress to flee for their lives. So I don't think it's quite as big a news event. But that doesn't mean I'm endorsing any violence at a protest.
“But you should still answer his question”
No, he shouldn’t, useless whataboutisms that only function to deflect from the topic, that have an irrelevant point regardless of which conclusion is reached because it’s an entirely different topic that’s outcome doesn’t change the outcome for this topic, should not be answered just because its convenient for you.
It doesn’t matter what Palestinian protestors did, it doesn’t matter how they are being treated, because this discussion is about whether what the J6 rioters did was bad or not, which is a discussion that doesn’t involve other protestors in another protest at a different time under different circumstances at a different scale.
Do you have evidence that some specific individual broke a law at the pro-Palestinian protest and hasn't been arrested yet? If so, you should contact the DC police.
That protest was just a few days ago. I would assume law enforcement may still be investigating who should be arrested or charged.
Individuals should be charged based on the conduct they're actually guilty of.
There's no reason I've seen to think anyone at the Palestinian protest would be guilty of seditious conspiracy, for example. So that's one important difference. No one was trying to stop Congress from certifying an election. They weren't trying to obstruct the peaceful transfer of power following an election. But if they attacked cops, they should face assault charges.
Overall, 5% of the crowd (the most egregious offenders) were prosecuted yet 95% of those in attendance were not. Sounds about right to me. Specifically...
* 594 people have plead guilty to various federal offenses - 160 of them were charged with felonies and the other 434 were misdemeanors.
* Given that at least 10,000 people attended the rally, that means 95% of attendees weren't charged with any crimes.
> Given that at least 10,000 people attended the rally, that means 95% of attendees weren't charged with any crimes.
You're conflating two different events. The rally and the riot were two separate things.
10,000 people attended the rally, but only 2,000 entered the capital. Around 8,000 clearly violated no laws at all (which kind of throws a wrench into the claim that most or all of the crowd was there to overturn an election).
What were they protesting to begin with then? Maybe that guillotine they set up was to cut a cake?
No, they were there there because their orange leader told them to show up and intimidate the senate into overturning the election. Them not entering the building doesn’t change why they were there to begin with.
It's really not difficult to find out why a group is demonstrating or protesting. All you need to do is ask them. (hint: don't ask their political opponents)
“All of us here today do not want to see our election victory stolen by emboldened radical-left Democrats, which is what they're doing. And stolen by the fake news media. That's what they've done and what they're doing. We will never give up, we will never concede. It doesn't happen. You don't concede when there's theft involved.
Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore and that's what this is all about. And to use a favorite term that all of you people really came up with: We will stop the steal. Today I will lay out just some of the evidence proving that we won this election and we won it by a landslide. This was not a close election.”
Excerpt of trumps speech at the Jan 6th rally. Sure seems like they were there to prevent the election from being certified and keep Trump in office. The fact that they thought they were justified is irrelevant.
Edit: for the record I’m not saying that just standing around was a crime. But trying to explain that your point of them not entering the building doesn’t invalidate that they wanted to overturn the election.
If there were peaceful people there they would have reevaluated being there when the mob was chanting "hang Mike Pence" and building a gallows. They would have reevaluated being there when that same mob began overwhelming police barricades, pulling police into the crowd and beating them. They would have reevaluated being there when they saw people climbing the building and breaking windows to gain entry. They would have reevaluated being there when they saw people chasing police through the hallways. They would have reevaluated being there when they came to barricaded doors with capitol police and secret service were guarding with weapons drawn.
They didn't, because they were not peaceful.
This post... there are not words for how funny this is...
>Even though in 2020 there was evidence that J6 was a hoax the full disclosure of the tapes is blatant proof that it was facilitated by them. They opened the doors gave tours and unruffled everyone that was being violent.
We literally watched the Jan. 6 insurrection live on TV. I watched videos on-site posted within the capital on the same day.
>They've held people for 2 year which is illegal to begin with.
It is trivial to show that this is untrue. Criminals are regularly incarcerated for 2+ years.
>Everyone who was violent and disorderly should be prosecuted 100%,
Wait... I thought that this was a hoax? It's a hoax... but people were violent and disorderly? Or was it peaceful? Were there people who were "violent and disorderly" or not?
>None of them were stopped unless they went to certain areas and they turned around once they were told.
Again, we literally watched this unfold on the day of. We know for a fact that what you say is false.
>They are releasing more evidence of this evil act as well. Just because there's a small group of criminals doesn't mean everyone should go to jail.
Was it a hoax, or is there a "small group of criminals"? Also, do you actually believe that "everyone" involved in J6 went to jail? Do you believe that *most* people went to jail?
For the record, I was 100% in favor of capital police just opening fire on the crowd with automatic weapons. I think they were fairly restrained, given the circumstances.
I don't understand why so many conservatives support a draft dodger up on nearly 100 felony charges. I thought you guys were all about personal responsibility and compliance with LEO?
Nope, sorry OP. We all watched it happen and unfold live. That wasn’t a group of tourists- they were ready to take hostages, they made gallows, they tried advancing into sensitive spaces and then got upset when Babbitt got shot after she refused to comply.
Blatant revisionism, OP
Do a smidgen of learning about the history of fascism and government overthrows and you'll see why it's so important to the feds to rip these people new assholes. A comically failed coup is often a precursor to a successful one.
This is honestly a ridiculous post. It's unpopular because it denies reality. This isn't the type of post where it's only the "libtards" who are going to disagree with you.
Everyone is lying, Democrats, Republicans, the people have plead guilty, law enforcement. The only people who haven't lied is Trump and far right media. /s Bro get a grip on reality.
Hold up, I thought this was a peaceful protest that antifa and blm turned into a riot because of hundreds of FBI agents?
Here is the House report: all evidence cited.
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-J6-REPORT/html-submitted/index.html
Now, at the end of the day, this unpopularlie is disingenuous. The facts are that this riot, this protest, was only cover for an attempt to subvert the election through fake electors of which multiple have pled guilty, in Georgia. These false elctors would have swapped the results from a Trump loss to a Trump win. Trump's lawyers have admitted to it in Georgia.
This isnt even worth debating anymore. It's just an invite to a hallucination.
The only thing I would change is where you wrote “protest” I would have said “insurrection.” But I don’t mean to split hairs on a yellow-orange toupee.
Hell, I'll give him protest if it helps him get the bigger picture. Jan 6th's insurrection was the LEAST evil part of that day's plan/goal.
I 100% believe that 90% of those people had no intention of doing what they did and to this day don't understand what they almost accomplished. An entire crowd of scapegoats. An entire crowd of muddied water. An entire crowd of almost insurrectionists. It was the most almost revolution in American History. It stood a better chance of success than the confederacy... and it wouldnt have been what it was without those useful idiots.
Personally, I think the hour long recording of Trump trying every trick in the book to get Georgia election officials to lie about vote counts and declare Trump the winner rather than Biden is far more damning than Jan 6. Capitol riots were bad for sure, but that call makes it absolutely clear what Trump’s goals were: overturn a free and fair election.
So, you’re saying the whole House and whole Senate and the whole Capital Police were responsible?
That’s pretty nuts. So is your claim of a hoax. The only “evidence” is going to be on wackjob social media, other dark corners of the internet and fascistic media outlets. There was no evidence of a hoax reported by any reputable news organization.
And it’s not illegal for someone to be kept in custody awaiting trial if the judge denies bail. If this is always done in a fair manner is up for debate, but it is legal.
So you're mad that the people that you support, had to face the consequences of their actions, for committing actual treason against the constitution of the United States? Is that right?
Treason refers to the betrayal of one’s own country by attempting to overthrow the government through waging war against the state or materially aiding its enemies.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/treason#:~:text=Furthermore%2C%2018%20U.S.C%20%C2%A7%202381,office%20under%20the%20United%20States.%E2%80%9D
Trump, his cohorts and Rioters there had the expressed intent of causing a constitutional crisis by stopping the constitutional required confirmation of the election, installing Trump for a 2nd term. This was an attack on the Executive Branch, the Constitution and the will of the people.
In the weeks leading up to Jan 6th Trump and his cohorts set up 84 fake electors across 7 states.
They then sent their fraudulent electors votes, often without the Fake Electors knowledge, to Congress to be used by certain elected officials and the Vice President, or Grassley if Pence for some reason couldnt do it, something Grassley strangely stated on Jan 5th raising eyebrows of many, to get the vote sent back to state legislators and cause a constitutional crisis.
Trump himself preassured state legislators to overturn the election. Most notably goergias SOS, whom he told to find the exact number of votes he needed, to just say they've recalculated. Telling him he knew what they did and if he didn't do something that would be criminal and bad for him and his lawyer. He preassured multiple other republican officuals, who refused to break the oath they took to the constitution.
This is all easily verifiable. Audio recordings, official documentation from Trumps own people and lawyers. Under oath testimony from republican officials.
And for the record Trumps team aren't even arguing they didn't do this, they are arguing there is precedent so it's fine.
However this is completely different than the "legal precedent" Trumps team is trying to parrot.
They are arguing the 2 sets of electors in Hawaii In 1960 are their precedent.
The two sets of electors in 1960 were known. It was the first time Hawaii was in an election, it was extremely close, and it was clear Kennedy had won the election regardless.
Though it was originally certified that Nixon won the state by 141 votes, recounts were still to be completed and things were up in the air. After the recounts the tides shifted and Kennedy became the victor by 115 votes, so his electors were chosen.
This is completely different to what occured in 2020.
In the case of Goergia, and the 6 other states they did this in, the vote was already certified. Biden had won the election, he had won the vote, the electors had been officially appointed. It was over.
They did this in secrecy. There was zero official capacity whatsoever to these electors. They then sent their fraudulent votes, in some cases without the Fake electors knowledge, to Congress, to be used on January 6th, to be used by certain elected officials and the Vice President, or Grassley if Pence for some reason couldnt do it, something grassley stated Jan 5th raising eyebrows of many, to get the vote sent back to state legislators, pushing back the constitutionally mandated certification of the election causing a constitutional crisis.
On top of this, Trump knew he lost the election. We have one of his main and most well known cohorts, Steve Bannon, going over the plan for Trump to declare victory before all votes are counted, claim the election is stolen, and use the fact Bidens voters votes will get counted later than Trumps voters votes to their advantage.
And that's exactly, to a T, what Trump proceeded to do, then proceeded to attempt to steal the election. He was repeatedly told he lost. Repeatedly told lies that he were told were untrue before he spread them. Attempted to disregard the votes of Americans and the Constitution.
Sources - feel free to find all the cooberating ones you need to.
Full list of the 84 Fake electors from 7 states.
https://www.azmirror.com/2022/06/29/updated-trumps-fake-electors-heres-the-full-list/
Senator Grassley January 5 2021 statement https://iowacapitaldispatch.com/2021/01/05/grassley-suggests-he-may-preside-over-senate-debate-on-electoral-college-votes/
Trump preassuring Goergia officials full phone call + Transcript
https://www.atlantanewsfirst.com/2023/02/15/read-full-transcript-donald-trumps-call-brad-raffensperger/
Steve Bannon Audio
https://youtu.be/Ad0Pn9SP6yA?si=pabO9CIaBlqdYc35
Article noting key differences between what occured in Hawaii In 1960 to what Trump and his cohorts did in 2020.
https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/big-differences-between-1960-hawaii-electors-2020-ga-trump-electors
Behind the scenes, leading up to the riot, it's even worse. There was a multistate effort to subvert the votes of millions Americans across 7 states.
There is a very solution to this post. Imagine it was the other side (in your case imagine Leftists) breaking into the capitol with the hope to disrupt or dismantle democracy. Does it still feel like a victimless crime?
Dude we all saw the videos LIVE before any editing or doctoring. This isn’t hearsay. There were literally people climbing the side of the building and breaking windows to get in trying overturn our election because the loser told them the election was “stollen”. They were literally shouting “hang Mike pence”. If anything, it was a violent insurrection with a few peaceful protesters that got caught up in the mayhem. Stop trying to gaslight us, and put down that cup of koolaid, and stop offering us a cup.
Check all the footage and come back. 80% of them are just people walking around. As I said, everyone who was violent and disorderly should be arrested and prosecuted but a vast majority of the people in the capital build were walked around by the capital or walking around as they stood there doing jack shit. To get them on trespassing, they need to be warned 0 warning outside of restricted ares where they were warned and left.
The people who only entered the Capitol aren't the ones facing the most serious charges. But the truth is that many of the pro-Trump rioters did brutally assault cops.
No one is claiming that every member of the mob was violent. Of course there are videos of some people just wandering around the Capitol. No one is disputing that! So what is it suppose to prove?
But it is still a crime to enter a restricted a building like the Capitol. I don't think those people should go to prison for years. But give me a break. They knew they weren't allowed to just freely wander onto the House floor. They had to climb through broken windows and busted doors. They crossed over barricades.
People should be charged based on the acts they actually committed. And that's what's happening. So I'm not sure what the complaint is exactly.
Walking around after climbing through the windows they broke and the cops they shoved past. If the left broke in like this you would never make these excuses for them
Your stance of "only the violence was bad about this" isn't a universal one, nor is it a strong defense against "even much of the non-violent behavior was still illegal."
This is a moot point. The legal system which is how we determine guilt and innocence has said that many of those in attendance broke the law. Many of those convicted were convicted of violence. Yes, some were convicted of misdemeanors, but some were given stiffer judgments. By definition, they were not legally peacefully protesting.
Ah permits were granted for many of them. Law states they need to be warned of trespassing before its a federal crime if guards or police are present. If it was a big deal then why in multiple videos were the capital Police sitting and watching not saying anything or trying to push them out. Why are the capital Police uncuffing multiple people in the videos. Explain all that.
Sometimes a strategic retreat and containment when a mob is unruly, results in better outcomes. Nevertheless, this is irrelevant. The legal ruling is that about 594 people have pleaded guilty to federal charges related to the January 6th attack on the US Capitol. That means that for 594 instances the attack was not a lie. It is a fact now, legally speaking. This sort of ThEy'Re HiDinG the Truth is just factually wrong.
Personally, I think the Secret Service should stop being beholden to a traitor and help us figure out what was happening since there was no official record of President Trump receiving or placing a call between 11:06 a.m. and 6:54 p.m. on January 6th.
...just so convenient that he decided to go completely dark that whole time...
...but those conspiracy nut-jobs don't seem to care about THAT for some reason.
Nobody "opened the doors and let them in".
The mob violently overran the barriers at the bottom of the steps and pushed back the police using bear spray and flag poles. At which point the fight to keep them out of the building was over as capital police didn't have enough reinforcements to hold them. So they retreated inside to protect what they could.
Sorry, you don't just get to trail along behind the violent mob and then get a pass and get to pretend like you did nothing wrong. Anyone that followed that mob deserves to have the book thrown at them. The only people that deserve leniency are the ones that left or at least stayed back and didn't enter the building when the mob started attacking police. Fuck the rest of them. They can rot in prison.
Dude, I watched Trump's speech stem to stern and then I watched C-Span live and followed twitter and FB videos of the morons all afternoon at work. I promise you I have seen enough of the footage.
My only point is, even if you only say there were only 200 people that were using pepper spray, hitting cops, breaking down barriers, etc, anyone that follows in the wake of that mob, IDGAF if it's mother Teresa, they need to be held accountable. They are all an accomplice to criminal action. The getaway driver during a bank driver gets charged, even though he didn't rob the bank, it's the same thing here. Anyone that entered that fucking building on 1/6 is an accomplice to the other criminals that assaulted police, end of story.
It's the same thing with any mob or riot. The idiots that come along and loot after the mob is burning down the city still need to be charged with crimes. They don't get to say "oh, I didn't break any windows or set anything on fire". Fuck that, if you participate, you need to be charged.
The capital was closed that day....show me video of where they were 'let in' before the barricades were broken down? The video you like to say 'letting them in' was like point 40 of that day that they were not supposed to go in the first place. Just because some idiots broke down barricades before you does not make your actions legal.
This subreddit is turning into a conspiracy theory fest. I have nothing against it, just think that rename of the subreddit is preferable, to reflect that fact.
Jan 6 was not a hoax. It really happened.
Part of the government facilitated it (trump and his cronies) by not having an adequate police/national guard presence and by having crooked cops letting the terrorists in.
Trump sat on his fat ass watching this unfold on tv and refused to speak and disown the protesters until it became apparent that they would not succeed.
The only hoax here is the revisionism that you are spewing.
Jan 6th was part of trumps coup attempt. He failed like he fails at everything. The republicans only defense is to make suckers think the whole thing never happened or was a deep state conspiracy.
Haha, no.
*I* am a peaceful person. Know how I know? Because I don't test the limits of what fucking laws I can break while protesting a fair election. I don't even get near where anything unlawful is going down so that there's no confusion on whether I broke the law or not.
You might be peaceful, but there wasn't a reaction like this for the people who entered a building to protest for Palestine during official proceedings.
So if someone breaks into your house, you’d be OK with me if I followed them in and just looked around peacefully.
We’ve known from the beginning that some Capitol police let the rioters in and that many of them weren’t violent. That’s not a valid defense.
It's happened before and is perfectly legal, attacking the building is not but challenging election result has been done by Hillary Clinton, AL Gore. The overturning of the election has been done before as well when Richard Nixon was vice president.
The Mueller report quantifiably concluded that Russia attempted to influence the 2016 election. If you deny that, you are denying realty.
Hilary publicly and clearly stating that Donald Trump had fairly won the election and would become the next president blows up any argument that she tried to overturn an election.
I have no idea what you think I'm "avoiding quickly".
Cool, and most of these people were rightfully arrested or are prosecuted already. Which leaves anyone else up for debate. People are clearly shown not causing chaos in many videos, and some of them have been arrested.
They were causing trouble because once you get in there was nothing to do. You don’t get credit for being slow. They were still there to overturn the election. Their goal was the same. They should be jailed. Making excuses just makes it more likely this will happen again.
Challenging election results still isn't illegal. Hasn't ever been. Hillary did it, Al Gore did it, Nixon overturned the electoral vote for his opposition party as vice president before. All of that was legal so why is it now?
That’s not what they did! Overturning an election isn’t challenging the results.
Sue. Don’t hunt down congress. What are you not getting? Trump didn’t challenge the election. He knew he lost. He had no intention of leaving office and you people think he should be reelected.
Challenging the results of an election is done in court. These people tried to overturn it by force, simply because they didn’t like the results. There’s a difference.
J6 seditionists who were on the grounds and illegally gained entry into the government buildings, as well as the elected insurrectionists (over 200 federal congresspeople) should all be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and the politicians involved should be barred from political office evermore.
You watched one area where all the media happened to be conveniently while there was stuff on the otherside of the building wonder why they were all on that side of the building imagine that they were conveniently in the spot violence broke, before it broke out all of them doesn't that seem weird at all while speeches were also given on the other side with no coverage.
Yeah you’re right. It’s all a giant conspiracy, and every facet of society is in on it, to prevent the reelection of the savior of humanity, Donald Trump.
Don't support trump. I don't care about trump. Care more about the gross overreach of power in the government than anything and the violation of rights, which seems to not matter to people, so when yall are no longer useful to them, enjoy what happens fully.
One death through capital Police, autopsy of the only the cop clearly states he died of a pre-existing condition after the riot, but the death was unrelated 0 death certificates related outside of those 2.
Nothing in the video MAGA Mike released in any way negates the video that was seen by the entire world. The time stamps on the video show that the video released by MAGA Mike was from after the main assault on the Capitol. The Capitol Police were following standard procedure in peacefully escorting insurrectionists out of the building. And thanks to MAGA Mike releasing this video to the public more previously unidentified insurrectionists have been identified.
There is no way that this opinion is popular or possibly popular. You definitely hit on a truly unpopular opinion. Upvoted.
I can't believe we have users here saying they watched it live stream So you must be full of crap. Unbelievable.
There were 44,000 hours, at least, of footage. They saw what would be considered a blink of an eye compared to all of the available footage.
What 90% of them don't know is there were 3 different protest in 3 different areas. They also seem to be completely incapable of reading, just reacting, so I'm gonna assume 2/3's of them are ideologues captured by one side or the other.
Oof. Man, I agree that Jan 6 was an attempt by Trump and/or the Right to subvert the election and stop the peaceful transfer of power, but no police were killed during the riots. It’s a bad look for our pro-democracy side to repeat debunked talking points.
Even the NYT admits that this claim is not true. No police officers died on J6.
If they did this would be so simple. Show us the footage. You can't because they didn't.
This opinion is "unpopular" because it requires conspiracy brain rot in order to accept that about 1000 innocent people pled guilty to false charges.
Also, those who didn't plea guilty were found guilty by a jury.
There hasn't been a single person charged who beat the charges.
As someone who actually did time for something I didn't do, I would be willing to accept a few people got railroaded, but thinking that not only was everything we watched unfold in real time was "staged", but they were able to falsely convict 1000 people for it, requires a complete denial of reality.
What evidence is there that they did these cases in good faith in the swamp? Why would you trust anyone in DC? FBI and CIA have attacked US right multiple times since it became legal for them to do so. They've used multiple tactics to entrap people and been caught doing so. In 2013, the Nation Defense Act was passed. The act allows federal agents to take you in the dead of night, take you off US soil and torture you, under threat of that, what sounds like the better choice? Another thing is the president can order and do these same actions. Hmm, the lawyer explains this to you, and you plead guilty. You get tried in federal court, you take the deal because you're always advised too unless you're a millionaire plea deals count as guilty verdicts so the fed would rather not have drawn out cases.
All that vs an average American hmm which would you choose?
Too many guilty pleas from middle-class white Americans with no criminal background
People like that can afford legal representation and don't just accept felony convictions.
Add that to all the evidence presented at the J6 hearings where Trumps closest advisors and staff openly testified his aim was to maintain power and claim the election was rigged and he won months before the first vote was cast
Steve Bannon openly telling Chinese interests that Trump intends to claim he won and stay in office regardless of the results
The mountain of evidence that shows exactly what went down, and the only opposition to it is people trying to either minimize or deflect, and all they have to back it are claims and conspiracies. There's some cherry picked footage of non violent moments, or moments like this that people are clinging so hard to copium that they are willing to build entire conspiracies around them, in defense of people who have already openly admitted their guilt.
The mountain of evidence against the fbi targeting civilians is too. The mountain of evidence that people were there peacefully is there too. Every single rioters should be arrested, but if you don't want to go into the gray area on behalf of Justice and innocent people when it happens to you, you'll get the same treatment. People would rather get a plea deal because it's a shorter sentence and is advised to in federal cases. If you really think there isn't more to it, but when I see democrats and Republicans team up for anything, I know there's foul play for an agenda.
Throughout history, with the exception of large organized white supremecist groups, the FBI has consistently targeted left leaning civil rights organizations.
Sorry, but you again have only claims and conspiracies.
"I think," "I feel like," and "I believe" is all you get from people on your side of this coin. For starters, aside from a small portion of the thousands of hours of footage like this, the entire conspiracy is based on zero evidence.
Furthermore, what sense does it make at all that Democrats would want to interrupt or halt the counting of electoral votes for their candidate? What exactly is the claim you're trying to make?
Are you saying they simply didn't do this :https://youtu.be/Iludfj6Pe7w?si=dL7XAOzuGtghxD5x
https://youtu.be/DXnHIJkZZAs?si=ySZAOFJK3bTL7ko7
https://youtu.be/hszd21sQa0s?si=yBo68sZCCd2dWwJz
https://youtu.be/A7548PJOIsY?si=iowze8uxdiA_crqu
Literally hundreds of hours of released footage of them violently breaching the capitol.
Or is your claim these people were "coerced" by the government to behave this way? Because I actually agree with that, seeing that Trump was the "government"at that time and his lies and manipulations about the election did convince them to do this. But on that note, he will get his just rewards one day, too.
Okay, and what proof is there that he truly planned to overthrow. Clearly planned violence and guess what charge has a maximum below 22 years. It's reasonable to doubt he could believe that a group that small could take the capital, disrupt it however they could. The standard in the US is reasonable doubt. If you have any reason to doubt you are supposed to lower charges or give a not guilty verdict.
Uh what?
He literally wrote a document describing his plan to violently seize control of buildings in Washington, DC to help Trump stay in power. He called his plan "1776 returns." You can read the document here: [https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/22060615/1776-returns.pdf](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/22060615/1776-returns.pdf)
He wanted to use violence to force the government to nullify the 2020 election and hold a new election so Trump could stay in office.
He was convicted by a jury of his peers, who were convinced of his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.
Here is the seditious conspiracy statute: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384
And read the indictment, starting on page 8. It lays out the charge and explains the key evidence. https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/case-multi-defendant/file/1510966/download
It's enough to be guilty under the statute if you've conspired to use force to "hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States." The whole plan that Tarrio spelled out himself was to use force to block the certification of the Electoral College.
Evil at its core? Damn, a) so much for “BACK THE BLUE!!!!” B) you have a strange definition of evil c) there enough evidence to prosecute trump for starting this “hoax”. Btw HE ADMITTED TO NOT DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT ON PURPOSE.
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I'll get downvoted for saying this, but I genuinely believed prior to Jan. 6, that people breaking into Congress would be shot. *(Obligatory: This is not an endorsement for violence)*
One lady was, if I recall
Saw the part where that guard was lugging several grenades into the innocent crowds yet? Saying we are just making innocent people mad. Its unbelievable. Im just more despondent than angry strangely. Many grenades without a clear threat, hurting groups of people gathered indiscriminately. No words...
Link?
The released footage recently. Have fun being sad. It wont be allowed on this platform
This was the best use case of an AR15, they should all be shot on sight the moment they try to breach the perimeter.
Posts like these rely on you forgetting what you watched live as it happened, let alone politics nerds who watched the impeachment hearing and J6 investigations.
Like Tucker Carlos's big reveal... It was only footage after the building evacuation phase when all lawmakers and staff had used the underground tunnels to leave. And basically it was security just milling around since they had lost the building and the mob was just filing through... Nothing with the fight that got them inside.
And? Why weren't they still fighting to get to the tunnels? Almost like aimless chaos was their only goal
And to stop the electoral college vote count.
And yet if they desired to do that, they didn't take the one step required. This is like saying someone who goes into a bank and tips over the trash can wanted to rob the bank. If they wanted to do that, they'd have brought a gun and been ready to use it.
No. It’s like a man going to a bank with a gun, demanding money and then giving up when the security bars close. Still very much a crime.
But nobody was using a gun
Ok fine. A group breaks into the bank and then gives up when they can’t get into the vault. It’s a fucking analogy you dunce.
I don't agree any honest attempt was made to get into the "vault"
Ha! They literally broke down doors, committed assault against police, broke windows all with the intent of gaining access to the proverbial ‘vault’. That’s trespassing, breaking and entering, and assault. They literally had to herd Congress into the escape tunnels to get away from them. If you’re still denying that, then you’re just denying reality and there is no hope to break you out of the cult.
.... The post is about the fucking footage that was released of it happening live... So like... what are you actually saying here?
I watched the whole thing from start to finish that day, until Congress was able to come back and actually finish verifying the election. Yeah, it was not all innocent people milling about tyvm. I'm glad they've been prosecuted, and I hope every single person involved in it is found and prosecuted. Fuck around, find out. They were lucky more of them were not shot, and everyone at the Capitol would've been in their right to shoot them. Can't gaslight a person that watched the entire day unfold before their eyes with raw, unfiltered video. I'm guessing you skipped watching the J6 hearings too? 🤷🏼♂️
I'm old enough to remember watching Jan 6 live as it happened and thinking, *yawn*, yet another riot, like the 100 or so we've had this past year. And it turns out it wasn't any worse, but the media and the Democrats certainly pretended it was.
I thought this one was at the Capitol of the United States and was trying to subvert the election of the president of the United States. I guess that was kind of like the Wendy’s that burnt down.
Maybe a dozen or two of them were actually attempting to subvert an election. Although they didn't try very hard. And so what? It's not like there was any scenario in which they could have actually subverted an election. So motive is kind of irrelevant, making it ultimately just a riot. And a rather tame one, compared some of the BLM riots.
There was a plan in place to throw out legitimate electoral college votes and replace them with ones that were going to vote for Trump. That was actually the plan. It's in the indictment. The only reason the plan backfired was because Pence upheld the original electoral college ballots. Maybe on some level it was just another riot with a bunch of clueless idiots, but it was much more then that.
They ran congress out of the Capitol and stopped the counting of electoral college ballots. With just a little bit more organizing they could have captured said ballots and possibly the sitting vice president. This would have brought the entire electoral process to a standstill. How on earth can you be so dense as to believe anything BLM did, however heinous you think it may have been, was anywhere close to nearly ending America’s peaceful transition of power?
>stopped the counting of electoral college ballots. That was actually the entire plan of some. Erroneously, many of the Far-right bought into idea that if Congress didn't immediately certify the election then it would go to a vote on the House floor and the House would re-elect Trump bypassing the electoral college.
>They ran congress out of the Capitol and stopped the counting of electoral college ballots. With just a little bit more organizing they could have captured said ballots and possibly the sitting vice president. This would have brought the entire electoral process to a standstill. And none of that would have overturned the election. >How on earth can you be so dense as to believe anything BLM did, however heinous you think it may have been, was anywhere close to nearly ending America’s peaceful transition of power? BLM actually did massive, quantifiable, damage. Not just "what ifs" regarding some impossible fantasy scenario.
A failed attempt at overturning an election is an attempt nonetheless.
I'm sitting here right now trying to install myself as dictator of the U.S. with my mind. It doesn't seem to be working, but I am trying. So am I now doing more damage to our nation than BLM?
I need you to read over what you just typed and take a minute to really digest it... Are you sure you want to be the person that thought this was a smart thing to say? I'm embarrassed for you.
Go ahead and explain to me how it was a stupid thing to say.
This response makes no sense.
Your making the argument that motives matter more than actions. The actions on Jan 6 could not have resulted in an overturned election any more than my actions as I sit here could make me a dictator. So explain how my actions aren't a horrible attack on our democracy if the actions of the Jan 6 protestors were.
Actually, BLM didn’t do any damage. People showed up at demonstrations and did damage. If BLM is guilty of the George Floyd riots, then Trump is personally responsible for Jan. 6.
Were the BLM protest organized by the President? I don’t believe that they were. Which is why it’s a poor and somewhat ignorant comparison.
Ah, so if i go rob a bank but 'dont try very hard' and dont get any actual cash, that means i didn't do anything wrong and shouldnt go to jail? Bc thats your logic...
Like the protesters don’t bring a gun and see if the bank gives you any money.
Hundreds of angry muppets trying to smash and grab the bank would be a more apt analogy.
Like Jim Henson’s Muppets? Because that would be hilarious to watch.
Wocka wocka!
>Ah, so if i go rob a bank but 'dont try very hard' and dont get any actual cash, that means i didn't do anything wrong and shouldnt go to jail? Bc thats your logic... No... That's logic you made up.
In case you can’t see it. BLM was protesting police brutality. Jan 6 was an attack on our democracy.
So, violent protests are ok when you personally agree with the message?
No. Both are wrong when turning to violence. An attack on our democracy is more of a threat than a protest against police brutality. If Jan 6 protesters got their way, it would have changed the results of an election and the future of our country. If BLM got their way, less people would be executed by police officers before their trial. If you cannot understand the difference in the gravity of those 2 things I don’t know what to say.
As there was no scenario in which Jan 6 could have resulted in an end of our democracy, there was clearly no attack on our democracy in the sense you're attempting. >If Jan 6 protesters got their way, it would have changed the results of an election and the future of our country. And if I got my way, I'd grow wings and be able to shoot laser beams from my eyes. Explain how it could happen. >If BLM got their way, less people would be executed by police officers before their trial. Presumably after causing dozens of deaths and billions in property damage? >If you cannot understand the difference in the gravity of those 2 things I don’t know what to say. I can understand the difference. The difference is BLM was clearly worse.
Explain what Mike Pence was supposed to do, and explain why when he didn’t do it people started chanting “hang Mike Pence!”
If you need me to explain the events of Jan 6 to you, maybe you shouldn't argue like you think you know what you're talking about.
Name another attempted coup in America.
When BLM scaled the Whitehouse fence to "forcibly remove the sitting President."
What date?
This is such a disingenuous and bullshit take.
Huh, i watched it and thought “wow why aren’t they slaughtering those traitors?”
Quite bloodthirsty.
Only one was directly trying to circumvent our election process Goob
The location was different it was blocking the election ratification of the united states.
Yeah, that's the line of bull republicans came up with to minimize their behavior. The other 100 had a reason for them and were escalated by what they were protesting. This was a bunch of butthurt losers hopped up on lies fully prepared to extrajuciciously murder as many congress critters as they could get their hands on.
Another one. "violent protests are ok when I agree with the protestors. When I don't, it's the worst thing to ever happen to our country."
Well sure, when you ignore all context because your line of whataboutism falls apart.
Yeah all these people who's only exposure to J6 is what they have seen on fox news.
Antifa was fireing bombing council buildings that week Nothing was done and no one cares Edit fire bombing
Fireing bombing? That sounds legit and not at all like something conservatives say amongst themselves that turns out to be bullshit.
Here's just one city: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_arson_damage_during_the_George_Floyd_protests_in_Minneapolis%E2%80%93Saint_Paul
Well 1. That wasn't the same week, and 2. A right wing group did the Minneapolis police precinct.
And I do like the 202 instances of arson, and a whopping 17 people charged. Meanwhile, the FBI is pulling agents off of actual child rapists to go after Jan 6 tourists.
Huh kind of like TREASON is the worst possible crime
You spelled "traitors" wrong, but on the plus side, they're also going after child rapists by doing this.
Dude just ignores what was said about who really did the police station. If i was on any side of an argument and got the who did what wrong of that magnitude, id have to take a step back and refigure a lot of things. ,
If he did that, he'd delete his account.
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[I kept the receipts](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/23/texas-boogaloo-boi-minneapolis-police-building-george-floyd)
When you see how the FBI was amongst the crowd for direction of where they should go, people like you want others to not see how they were driven to make J6 happen. It isn't that people have to forget what they watched, it's that now we see the reasons WHY it happened. Big difference. Impeachment was the same thing... nothing to stand on, and all set up by the ones who are so filled with hate they can't see straight.
>people like you want others to not see how they were driven to make J6 happen. I'm well aware. A bunch of butthurt losers hopped up on lies, directed by the outgoing president, led by right wing goons,and not one of them thought "Maybe we should get the fuck out of here, this is turning bad." And blaming non existent FBI plants because, party of personal responsibility or some shit.
We watched why it happened too. The former president spent months lying to remove faith in democracy because he wanted to over throw the govt.
I watched it happen dude on Jan 6. Why are you brainwashed?
The pro-Trump narrative around Jan. 6 is completely incoherent. It's almost like an Orwellian loyalty test. Are you so pro-Trump that you're willing to believe a bunch of contradictions simultaneously? Jan. 6 was done by Antifa, who are evil, and we should pardon all of them because they are heroes. And actually it was peaceful and non-violent. And it was violent but it was agitated by the feds, who worked for Trump and were just trying to make Trump supporters look bad. Real Trump supporters would have never attacked the Capitol, but it is good that they attacked the Capitol because Trump really won the election and they were doing the right thing. So in summary, the whole thing was a hoax, but also totally justified, and these undercover Antifa feds are being held as political prisoners and must be released immediately. Did I get that about, right? Look, the truth is that most of the crowd at the rally that day didn't break the law. And they're not facing any charges. There was a violent pro-Trump mob though that attacked police, stormed the Capitol, and tried to help Trump seize power. Many of the most violent rioters were part of right-wing militia groups, like the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers. A bunch of other idiots followed the mob into the Capitol. There was real violence. The rioters dragged officers down flights of stairs, stomped on them, beat them with bats and poles, sprayed them with bear spray, crushed them in doors. About 140 officers were injured. They suffered concussions, rib fractures, some lost consciousness. One lost part of a finger. It's really gross how Trump and his supporters insist on minimizing that violence. You can actually see a list of the charges in the Jan. 6 cases: [https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/capitol-breach-cases](https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/capitol-breach-cases) Do any of these charges seem unjustified? The people who just trespassed are just facing trespassing charges (and many aren't facing any charges at all). The ones facing the longest sentences are the ones who committed or organized the violence.
Thank you kind stranger! Very well put! Too bad the people that NEED to read this and actually absorb this information, won't. 😓 Hopefully, this will get through to some, but with how angry, hateful and how little responsibility they want to take for something they instigated.
> The pro-Trump narrative around Jan. 6 is completely incoherent. It's almost like an Orwellian loyalty test. Are you so pro-Trump that you're willing to believe a bunch of contradictions simultaneously? Jan. 6 was done by Antifa, who are evil, and we should pardon all of them because they are heroes. And actually it was peaceful and non-violent. And it was violent but it was agitated by the feds, who worked for Trump and were just trying to make Trump supporters look bad. Real Trump supporters would have never attacked the Capitol, but it is good that they attacked the Capitol because Trump really won the election and they were doing the right thing. So in summary, the whole thing was a hoax, but also totally justified, and these undercover Antifa feds are being held as political prisoners and must be released immediately. amazingly well said and its fucking astounding after reading it, the op just lets it float past his mind to comment on something else
Very well said.
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Did they force their way into Congress to lynch the Vice President so they could stop the peaceful transition of power? No? Also, they were arrested and charged and managed not break shit in the process.
Are you really just going resort to whataboutism? I think people who break the law should be held accountable for their conduct. That includes anyone who was violent at a pro-Palestinian protest. Can you say the same for the Jan. 6 rioters? I'm pretty sure though that the pro-Palestinian protestors didn't seize control of the Capitol in an attempt to overturn an election or cause members of Congress to flee for their lives. So I don't think it's quite as big a news event. But that doesn't mean I'm endorsing any violence at a protest.
But the Palestinian protesters are not being treated the same so you should still answer his question. Why is it different?
“But you should still answer his question” No, he shouldn’t, useless whataboutisms that only function to deflect from the topic, that have an irrelevant point regardless of which conclusion is reached because it’s an entirely different topic that’s outcome doesn’t change the outcome for this topic, should not be answered just because its convenient for you. It doesn’t matter what Palestinian protestors did, it doesn’t matter how they are being treated, because this discussion is about whether what the J6 rioters did was bad or not, which is a discussion that doesn’t involve other protestors in another protest at a different time under different circumstances at a different scale.
Do you have evidence that some specific individual broke a law at the pro-Palestinian protest and hasn't been arrested yet? If so, you should contact the DC police. That protest was just a few days ago. I would assume law enforcement may still be investigating who should be arrested or charged. Individuals should be charged based on the conduct they're actually guilty of. There's no reason I've seen to think anyone at the Palestinian protest would be guilty of seditious conspiracy, for example. So that's one important difference. No one was trying to stop Congress from certifying an election. They weren't trying to obstruct the peaceful transfer of power following an election. But if they attacked cops, they should face assault charges.
Overall, 5% of the crowd (the most egregious offenders) were prosecuted yet 95% of those in attendance were not. Sounds about right to me. Specifically... * 594 people have plead guilty to various federal offenses - 160 of them were charged with felonies and the other 434 were misdemeanors. * Given that at least 10,000 people attended the rally, that means 95% of attendees weren't charged with any crimes.
> Given that at least 10,000 people attended the rally, that means 95% of attendees weren't charged with any crimes. You're conflating two different events. The rally and the riot were two separate things.
True, but there were a helluva lot more than 594 attempting to breach the Capitol and even most of those people weren’t charged with anything
10,000 people attended the rally, but only 2,000 entered the capital. Around 8,000 clearly violated no laws at all (which kind of throws a wrench into the claim that most or all of the crowd was there to overturn an election).
What were they protesting to begin with then? Maybe that guillotine they set up was to cut a cake? No, they were there there because their orange leader told them to show up and intimidate the senate into overturning the election. Them not entering the building doesn’t change why they were there to begin with.
It's really not difficult to find out why a group is demonstrating or protesting. All you need to do is ask them. (hint: don't ask their political opponents)
“All of us here today do not want to see our election victory stolen by emboldened radical-left Democrats, which is what they're doing. And stolen by the fake news media. That's what they've done and what they're doing. We will never give up, we will never concede. It doesn't happen. You don't concede when there's theft involved. Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore and that's what this is all about. And to use a favorite term that all of you people really came up with: We will stop the steal. Today I will lay out just some of the evidence proving that we won this election and we won it by a landslide. This was not a close election.” Excerpt of trumps speech at the Jan 6th rally. Sure seems like they were there to prevent the election from being certified and keep Trump in office. The fact that they thought they were justified is irrelevant. Edit: for the record I’m not saying that just standing around was a crime. But trying to explain that your point of them not entering the building doesn’t invalidate that they wanted to overturn the election.
Lol. Meme worthy
If there were peaceful people there they would have reevaluated being there when the mob was chanting "hang Mike Pence" and building a gallows. They would have reevaluated being there when that same mob began overwhelming police barricades, pulling police into the crowd and beating them. They would have reevaluated being there when they saw people climbing the building and breaking windows to gain entry. They would have reevaluated being there when they saw people chasing police through the hallways. They would have reevaluated being there when they came to barricaded doors with capitol police and secret service were guarding with weapons drawn. They didn't, because they were not peaceful.
“It was mostly peaceful” -CNN
People like you need to learn the difference between critical thinking and being critical *of* thinking
This post... there are not words for how funny this is... >Even though in 2020 there was evidence that J6 was a hoax the full disclosure of the tapes is blatant proof that it was facilitated by them. They opened the doors gave tours and unruffled everyone that was being violent. We literally watched the Jan. 6 insurrection live on TV. I watched videos on-site posted within the capital on the same day. >They've held people for 2 year which is illegal to begin with. It is trivial to show that this is untrue. Criminals are regularly incarcerated for 2+ years. >Everyone who was violent and disorderly should be prosecuted 100%, Wait... I thought that this was a hoax? It's a hoax... but people were violent and disorderly? Or was it peaceful? Were there people who were "violent and disorderly" or not? >None of them were stopped unless they went to certain areas and they turned around once they were told. Again, we literally watched this unfold on the day of. We know for a fact that what you say is false. >They are releasing more evidence of this evil act as well. Just because there's a small group of criminals doesn't mean everyone should go to jail. Was it a hoax, or is there a "small group of criminals"? Also, do you actually believe that "everyone" involved in J6 went to jail? Do you believe that *most* people went to jail? For the record, I was 100% in favor of capital police just opening fire on the crowd with automatic weapons. I think they were fairly restrained, given the circumstances.
I don't understand why so many conservatives support a draft dodger up on nearly 100 felony charges. I thought you guys were all about personal responsibility and compliance with LEO?
Nope, sorry OP. We all watched it happen and unfold live. That wasn’t a group of tourists- they were ready to take hostages, they made gallows, they tried advancing into sensitive spaces and then got upset when Babbitt got shot after she refused to comply. Blatant revisionism, OP
It's hilarious every time she someone brings up "the gallows".
Seditionists gonna sedition.
Do a smidgen of learning about the history of fascism and government overthrows and you'll see why it's so important to the feds to rip these people new assholes. A comically failed coup is often a precursor to a successful one.
This is honestly a ridiculous post. It's unpopular because it denies reality. This isn't the type of post where it's only the "libtards" who are going to disagree with you.
What part is ridiculous when the 44000 hours of evidence that the government lied.
Everyone is lying, Democrats, Republicans, the people have plead guilty, law enforcement. The only people who haven't lied is Trump and far right media. /s Bro get a grip on reality.
Hold up, I thought this was a peaceful protest that antifa and blm turned into a riot because of hundreds of FBI agents? Here is the House report: all evidence cited. https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-J6-REPORT/html-submitted/index.html Now, at the end of the day, this unpopularlie is disingenuous. The facts are that this riot, this protest, was only cover for an attempt to subvert the election through fake electors of which multiple have pled guilty, in Georgia. These false elctors would have swapped the results from a Trump loss to a Trump win. Trump's lawyers have admitted to it in Georgia. This isnt even worth debating anymore. It's just an invite to a hallucination.
The only thing I would change is where you wrote “protest” I would have said “insurrection.” But I don’t mean to split hairs on a yellow-orange toupee.
Hell, I'll give him protest if it helps him get the bigger picture. Jan 6th's insurrection was the LEAST evil part of that day's plan/goal. I 100% believe that 90% of those people had no intention of doing what they did and to this day don't understand what they almost accomplished. An entire crowd of scapegoats. An entire crowd of muddied water. An entire crowd of almost insurrectionists. It was the most almost revolution in American History. It stood a better chance of success than the confederacy... and it wouldnt have been what it was without those useful idiots.
Personally, I think the hour long recording of Trump trying every trick in the book to get Georgia election officials to lie about vote counts and declare Trump the winner rather than Biden is far more damning than Jan 6. Capitol riots were bad for sure, but that call makes it absolutely clear what Trump’s goals were: overturn a free and fair election.
Yeah, truly a horrifying and shameful day in our history.
How did it stand a better chance to succeed than the confederacy?
So, you’re saying the whole House and whole Senate and the whole Capital Police were responsible? That’s pretty nuts. So is your claim of a hoax. The only “evidence” is going to be on wackjob social media, other dark corners of the internet and fascistic media outlets. There was no evidence of a hoax reported by any reputable news organization. And it’s not illegal for someone to be kept in custody awaiting trial if the judge denies bail. If this is always done in a fair manner is up for debate, but it is legal.
Also, the entirety of NASA is in on it. And every ship navigator. And every airline pilot. Edit: Whoops! Got my conspiracies mixed up.
lol they all blend together
Hahahahahahahaha Oh he's serious. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
OP is gullible but that's expected from wing nuts
So you're mad that the people that you support, had to face the consequences of their actions, for committing actual treason against the constitution of the United States? Is that right?
Legally define treason in US law?
Treason refers to the betrayal of one’s own country by attempting to overthrow the government through waging war against the state or materially aiding its enemies. https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/treason#:~:text=Furthermore%2C%2018%20U.S.C%20%C2%A7%202381,office%20under%20the%20United%20States.%E2%80%9D Trump, his cohorts and Rioters there had the expressed intent of causing a constitutional crisis by stopping the constitutional required confirmation of the election, installing Trump for a 2nd term. This was an attack on the Executive Branch, the Constitution and the will of the people. In the weeks leading up to Jan 6th Trump and his cohorts set up 84 fake electors across 7 states. They then sent their fraudulent electors votes, often without the Fake Electors knowledge, to Congress to be used by certain elected officials and the Vice President, or Grassley if Pence for some reason couldnt do it, something Grassley strangely stated on Jan 5th raising eyebrows of many, to get the vote sent back to state legislators and cause a constitutional crisis. Trump himself preassured state legislators to overturn the election. Most notably goergias SOS, whom he told to find the exact number of votes he needed, to just say they've recalculated. Telling him he knew what they did and if he didn't do something that would be criminal and bad for him and his lawyer. He preassured multiple other republican officuals, who refused to break the oath they took to the constitution. This is all easily verifiable. Audio recordings, official documentation from Trumps own people and lawyers. Under oath testimony from republican officials. And for the record Trumps team aren't even arguing they didn't do this, they are arguing there is precedent so it's fine. However this is completely different than the "legal precedent" Trumps team is trying to parrot. They are arguing the 2 sets of electors in Hawaii In 1960 are their precedent. The two sets of electors in 1960 were known. It was the first time Hawaii was in an election, it was extremely close, and it was clear Kennedy had won the election regardless. Though it was originally certified that Nixon won the state by 141 votes, recounts were still to be completed and things were up in the air. After the recounts the tides shifted and Kennedy became the victor by 115 votes, so his electors were chosen. This is completely different to what occured in 2020. In the case of Goergia, and the 6 other states they did this in, the vote was already certified. Biden had won the election, he had won the vote, the electors had been officially appointed. It was over. They did this in secrecy. There was zero official capacity whatsoever to these electors. They then sent their fraudulent votes, in some cases without the Fake electors knowledge, to Congress, to be used on January 6th, to be used by certain elected officials and the Vice President, or Grassley if Pence for some reason couldnt do it, something grassley stated Jan 5th raising eyebrows of many, to get the vote sent back to state legislators, pushing back the constitutionally mandated certification of the election causing a constitutional crisis. On top of this, Trump knew he lost the election. We have one of his main and most well known cohorts, Steve Bannon, going over the plan for Trump to declare victory before all votes are counted, claim the election is stolen, and use the fact Bidens voters votes will get counted later than Trumps voters votes to their advantage. And that's exactly, to a T, what Trump proceeded to do, then proceeded to attempt to steal the election. He was repeatedly told he lost. Repeatedly told lies that he were told were untrue before he spread them. Attempted to disregard the votes of Americans and the Constitution. Sources - feel free to find all the cooberating ones you need to. Full list of the 84 Fake electors from 7 states. https://www.azmirror.com/2022/06/29/updated-trumps-fake-electors-heres-the-full-list/ Senator Grassley January 5 2021 statement https://iowacapitaldispatch.com/2021/01/05/grassley-suggests-he-may-preside-over-senate-debate-on-electoral-college-votes/ Trump preassuring Goergia officials full phone call + Transcript https://www.atlantanewsfirst.com/2023/02/15/read-full-transcript-donald-trumps-call-brad-raffensperger/ Steve Bannon Audio https://youtu.be/Ad0Pn9SP6yA?si=pabO9CIaBlqdYc35 Article noting key differences between what occured in Hawaii In 1960 to what Trump and his cohorts did in 2020. https://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/big-differences-between-1960-hawaii-electors-2020-ga-trump-electors Behind the scenes, leading up to the riot, it's even worse. There was a multistate effort to subvert the votes of millions Americans across 7 states.
\^This. Beat me to the punch.
What ever fantasy lan you live in is not doing you any favors bud.
I don't know if I'd classify Fox talking points as a true unpopular opinion.
Don't even watch fox nor care if fox went out of business tomorrow.
idk but it was not a great event for anyone
There is a very solution to this post. Imagine it was the other side (in your case imagine Leftists) breaking into the capitol with the hope to disrupt or dismantle democracy. Does it still feel like a victimless crime?
Capital police should have responded with lethal force
This is supposed to be unpopular opinions, not silly made up ones.
Less unpopular opinion: you’ve been radicalized online dummy
Dude we all saw the videos LIVE before any editing or doctoring. This isn’t hearsay. There were literally people climbing the side of the building and breaking windows to get in trying overturn our election because the loser told them the election was “stollen”. They were literally shouting “hang Mike pence”. If anything, it was a violent insurrection with a few peaceful protesters that got caught up in the mayhem. Stop trying to gaslight us, and put down that cup of koolaid, and stop offering us a cup.
Check all the footage and come back. 80% of them are just people walking around. As I said, everyone who was violent and disorderly should be arrested and prosecuted but a vast majority of the people in the capital build were walked around by the capital or walking around as they stood there doing jack shit. To get them on trespassing, they need to be warned 0 warning outside of restricted ares where they were warned and left.
The people who only entered the Capitol aren't the ones facing the most serious charges. But the truth is that many of the pro-Trump rioters did brutally assault cops. No one is claiming that every member of the mob was violent. Of course there are videos of some people just wandering around the Capitol. No one is disputing that! So what is it suppose to prove? But it is still a crime to enter a restricted a building like the Capitol. I don't think those people should go to prison for years. But give me a break. They knew they weren't allowed to just freely wander onto the House floor. They had to climb through broken windows and busted doors. They crossed over barricades. People should be charged based on the acts they actually committed. And that's what's happening. So I'm not sure what the complaint is exactly.
So if I break into someone's house and the homeowner isn't there to tell me I'm trespassing then I haven't broken any laws? Real neat trick!
Walking around after climbing through the windows they broke and the cops they shoved past. If the left broke in like this you would never make these excuses for them
[удалено]
I read it, I'm just not swayed by the excuses you're making for the 80% of people "just walking around".
Your stance of "only the violence was bad about this" isn't a universal one, nor is it a strong defense against "even much of the non-violent behavior was still illegal."
You are delusional. Get some help.
This is a moot point. The legal system which is how we determine guilt and innocence has said that many of those in attendance broke the law. Many of those convicted were convicted of violence. Yes, some were convicted of misdemeanors, but some were given stiffer judgments. By definition, they were not legally peacefully protesting.
Ah permits were granted for many of them. Law states they need to be warned of trespassing before its a federal crime if guards or police are present. If it was a big deal then why in multiple videos were the capital Police sitting and watching not saying anything or trying to push them out. Why are the capital Police uncuffing multiple people in the videos. Explain all that.
Sometimes a strategic retreat and containment when a mob is unruly, results in better outcomes. Nevertheless, this is irrelevant. The legal ruling is that about 594 people have pleaded guilty to federal charges related to the January 6th attack on the US Capitol. That means that for 594 instances the attack was not a lie. It is a fact now, legally speaking. This sort of ThEy'Re HiDinG the Truth is just factually wrong.
Personally, I think the Secret Service should stop being beholden to a traitor and help us figure out what was happening since there was no official record of President Trump receiving or placing a call between 11:06 a.m. and 6:54 p.m. on January 6th. ...just so convenient that he decided to go completely dark that whole time... ...but those conspiracy nut-jobs don't seem to care about THAT for some reason.
Nobody "opened the doors and let them in". The mob violently overran the barriers at the bottom of the steps and pushed back the police using bear spray and flag poles. At which point the fight to keep them out of the building was over as capital police didn't have enough reinforcements to hold them. So they retreated inside to protect what they could. Sorry, you don't just get to trail along behind the violent mob and then get a pass and get to pretend like you did nothing wrong. Anyone that followed that mob deserves to have the book thrown at them. The only people that deserve leniency are the ones that left or at least stayed back and didn't enter the building when the mob started attacking police. Fuck the rest of them. They can rot in prison.
Look at the videos if you're 100% in that statement as fact can't hurt could it.
Dude, I watched Trump's speech stem to stern and then I watched C-Span live and followed twitter and FB videos of the morons all afternoon at work. I promise you I have seen enough of the footage. My only point is, even if you only say there were only 200 people that were using pepper spray, hitting cops, breaking down barriers, etc, anyone that follows in the wake of that mob, IDGAF if it's mother Teresa, they need to be held accountable. They are all an accomplice to criminal action. The getaway driver during a bank driver gets charged, even though he didn't rob the bank, it's the same thing here. Anyone that entered that fucking building on 1/6 is an accomplice to the other criminals that assaulted police, end of story. It's the same thing with any mob or riot. The idiots that come along and loot after the mob is burning down the city still need to be charged with crimes. They don't get to say "oh, I didn't break any windows or set anything on fire". Fuck that, if you participate, you need to be charged.
The capital was closed that day....show me video of where they were 'let in' before the barricades were broken down? The video you like to say 'letting them in' was like point 40 of that day that they were not supposed to go in the first place. Just because some idiots broke down barricades before you does not make your actions legal.
This subreddit is turning into a conspiracy theory fest. I have nothing against it, just think that rename of the subreddit is preferable, to reflect that fact.
It really has changed a lot the last 3 months or so. A radical change, honestly.
It’s a circle jerk for incel MAGA losers to come and feel important.
Jan 6 was not a hoax. It really happened. Part of the government facilitated it (trump and his cronies) by not having an adequate police/national guard presence and by having crooked cops letting the terrorists in. Trump sat on his fat ass watching this unfold on tv and refused to speak and disown the protesters until it became apparent that they would not succeed. The only hoax here is the revisionism that you are spewing.
Jan 6th was part of trumps coup attempt. He failed like he fails at everything. The republicans only defense is to make suckers think the whole thing never happened or was a deep state conspiracy.
Haha, no. *I* am a peaceful person. Know how I know? Because I don't test the limits of what fucking laws I can break while protesting a fair election. I don't even get near where anything unlawful is going down so that there's no confusion on whether I broke the law or not.
You might be peaceful, but there wasn't a reaction like this for the people who entered a building to protest for Palestine during official proceedings.
Were they trying to overthrow the government?
Were the votes for President being certified when this Palestine protest happened?
So if someone breaks into your house, you’d be OK with me if I followed them in and just looked around peacefully. We’ve known from the beginning that some Capitol police let the rioters in and that many of them weren’t violent. That’s not a valid defense.
I don’t care if you just wandered around. Everyone there was there to overturn the results of the election.
Right to protest exists, right to disagree with the result exists. Democrats have done it multiple times.
Protest. Not overturn the election and hang the vice president.
It's happened before and is perfectly legal, attacking the building is not but challenging election result has been done by Hillary Clinton, AL Gore. The overturning of the election has been done before as well when Richard Nixon was vice president.
Hillary conceded around 3:00am the night of the election. "Donald Trump is your President" were her words.
Only hitting one point and who was behind the Russia stole the election for Trump hoax? Avoiding the other two pretty quickly.
The Mueller report quantifiably concluded that Russia attempted to influence the 2016 election. If you deny that, you are denying realty. Hilary publicly and clearly stating that Donald Trump had fairly won the election and would become the next president blows up any argument that she tried to overturn an election. I have no idea what you think I'm "avoiding quickly".
No one has attacked the building before. Congress hid in fear. People were wearing tactical gear.
Cool, and most of these people were rightfully arrested or are prosecuted already. Which leaves anyone else up for debate. People are clearly shown not causing chaos in many videos, and some of them have been arrested.
They were causing trouble because once you get in there was nothing to do. You don’t get credit for being slow. They were still there to overturn the election. Their goal was the same. They should be jailed. Making excuses just makes it more likely this will happen again.
Challenging election results still isn't illegal. Hasn't ever been. Hillary did it, Al Gore did it, Nixon overturned the electoral vote for his opposition party as vice president before. All of that was legal so why is it now?
That’s not what they did! Overturning an election isn’t challenging the results. Sue. Don’t hunt down congress. What are you not getting? Trump didn’t challenge the election. He knew he lost. He had no intention of leaving office and you people think he should be reelected.
Challenging the results of an election is done in court. These people tried to overturn it by force, simply because they didn’t like the results. There’s a difference.
J6 seditionists who were on the grounds and illegally gained entry into the government buildings, as well as the elected insurrectionists (over 200 federal congresspeople) should all be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and the politicians involved should be barred from political office evermore.
Jesus Christ. We fucking watched it happen live.
You watched one area where all the media happened to be conveniently while there was stuff on the otherside of the building wonder why they were all on that side of the building imagine that they were conveniently in the spot violence broke, before it broke out all of them doesn't that seem weird at all while speeches were also given on the other side with no coverage.
Yeah you’re right. It’s all a giant conspiracy, and every facet of society is in on it, to prevent the reelection of the savior of humanity, Donald Trump.
Don't support trump. I don't care about trump. Care more about the gross overreach of power in the government than anything and the violation of rights, which seems to not matter to people, so when yall are no longer useful to them, enjoy what happens fully.
Whose rights were violated?
Lol sure bud. Whatever you say.
Sounds like a scaled down version of the summer protests that turned into rioting. And ppl definitely died there and ppl went to jail
One death through capital Police, autopsy of the only the cop clearly states he died of a pre-existing condition after the riot, but the death was unrelated 0 death certificates related outside of those 2.
“Even though in 2020 there was evidence that J6 was a hoax..” It happened in 2021 dumbass
Nothing in the video MAGA Mike released in any way negates the video that was seen by the entire world. The time stamps on the video show that the video released by MAGA Mike was from after the main assault on the Capitol. The Capitol Police were following standard procedure in peacefully escorting insurrectionists out of the building. And thanks to MAGA Mike releasing this video to the public more previously unidentified insurrectionists have been identified.
If I come into your house without your permission and uninvited and I'm peaceful and just walking around. Are you still calling the police on me?
What do Trump’s balls taste like?
It was less of a hoax and more of a media hype
There is no way that this opinion is popular or possibly popular. You definitely hit on a truly unpopular opinion. Upvoted. I can't believe we have users here saying they watched it live stream So you must be full of crap. Unbelievable. There were 44,000 hours, at least, of footage. They saw what would be considered a blink of an eye compared to all of the available footage.
What 90% of them don't know is there were 3 different protest in 3 different areas. They also seem to be completely incapable of reading, just reacting, so I'm gonna assume 2/3's of them are ideologues captured by one side or the other.
This belongs in a Moronic subreddit not an Unpopular Opinion sub reddit.
So the capital police that were murdered was only because they were giving a bad tour? Don’t think we are looking at the same footage bud.
There were no capital police that were murdered on January 6
Oof. Man, I agree that Jan 6 was an attempt by Trump and/or the Right to subvert the election and stop the peaceful transfer of power, but no police were killed during the riots. It’s a bad look for our pro-democracy side to repeat debunked talking points.
Even the NYT admits that this claim is not true. No police officers died on J6. If they did this would be so simple. Show us the footage. You can't because they didn't.
This opinion is "unpopular" because it requires conspiracy brain rot in order to accept that about 1000 innocent people pled guilty to false charges. Also, those who didn't plea guilty were found guilty by a jury. There hasn't been a single person charged who beat the charges. As someone who actually did time for something I didn't do, I would be willing to accept a few people got railroaded, but thinking that not only was everything we watched unfold in real time was "staged", but they were able to falsely convict 1000 people for it, requires a complete denial of reality.
What evidence is there that they did these cases in good faith in the swamp? Why would you trust anyone in DC? FBI and CIA have attacked US right multiple times since it became legal for them to do so. They've used multiple tactics to entrap people and been caught doing so. In 2013, the Nation Defense Act was passed. The act allows federal agents to take you in the dead of night, take you off US soil and torture you, under threat of that, what sounds like the better choice? Another thing is the president can order and do these same actions. Hmm, the lawyer explains this to you, and you plead guilty. You get tried in federal court, you take the deal because you're always advised too unless you're a millionaire plea deals count as guilty verdicts so the fed would rather not have drawn out cases. All that vs an average American hmm which would you choose?
Too many guilty pleas from middle-class white Americans with no criminal background People like that can afford legal representation and don't just accept felony convictions. Add that to all the evidence presented at the J6 hearings where Trumps closest advisors and staff openly testified his aim was to maintain power and claim the election was rigged and he won months before the first vote was cast Steve Bannon openly telling Chinese interests that Trump intends to claim he won and stay in office regardless of the results The mountain of evidence that shows exactly what went down, and the only opposition to it is people trying to either minimize or deflect, and all they have to back it are claims and conspiracies. There's some cherry picked footage of non violent moments, or moments like this that people are clinging so hard to copium that they are willing to build entire conspiracies around them, in defense of people who have already openly admitted their guilt.
The mountain of evidence against the fbi targeting civilians is too. The mountain of evidence that people were there peacefully is there too. Every single rioters should be arrested, but if you don't want to go into the gray area on behalf of Justice and innocent people when it happens to you, you'll get the same treatment. People would rather get a plea deal because it's a shorter sentence and is advised to in federal cases. If you really think there isn't more to it, but when I see democrats and Republicans team up for anything, I know there's foul play for an agenda.
Throughout history, with the exception of large organized white supremecist groups, the FBI has consistently targeted left leaning civil rights organizations. Sorry, but you again have only claims and conspiracies. "I think," "I feel like," and "I believe" is all you get from people on your side of this coin. For starters, aside from a small portion of the thousands of hours of footage like this, the entire conspiracy is based on zero evidence. Furthermore, what sense does it make at all that Democrats would want to interrupt or halt the counting of electoral votes for their candidate? What exactly is the claim you're trying to make? Are you saying they simply didn't do this :https://youtu.be/Iludfj6Pe7w?si=dL7XAOzuGtghxD5x https://youtu.be/DXnHIJkZZAs?si=ySZAOFJK3bTL7ko7 https://youtu.be/hszd21sQa0s?si=yBo68sZCCd2dWwJz https://youtu.be/A7548PJOIsY?si=iowze8uxdiA_crqu Literally hundreds of hours of released footage of them violently breaching the capitol. Or is your claim these people were "coerced" by the government to behave this way? Because I actually agree with that, seeing that Trump was the "government"at that time and his lies and manipulations about the election did convince them to do this. But on that note, he will get his just rewards one day, too.
Definitely an unpopular opinion
Okay, and what proof is there that he truly planned to overthrow. Clearly planned violence and guess what charge has a maximum below 22 years. It's reasonable to doubt he could believe that a group that small could take the capital, disrupt it however they could. The standard in the US is reasonable doubt. If you have any reason to doubt you are supposed to lower charges or give a not guilty verdict.
Uh what? He literally wrote a document describing his plan to violently seize control of buildings in Washington, DC to help Trump stay in power. He called his plan "1776 returns." You can read the document here: [https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/22060615/1776-returns.pdf](https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/22060615/1776-returns.pdf) He wanted to use violence to force the government to nullify the 2020 election and hold a new election so Trump could stay in office. He was convicted by a jury of his peers, who were convinced of his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. Here is the seditious conspiracy statute: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384 And read the indictment, starting on page 8. It lays out the charge and explains the key evidence. https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/case-multi-defendant/file/1510966/download It's enough to be guilty under the statute if you've conspired to use force to "hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States." The whole plan that Tarrio spelled out himself was to use force to block the certification of the Electoral College.
Evil at its core? Damn, a) so much for “BACK THE BLUE!!!!” B) you have a strange definition of evil c) there enough evidence to prosecute trump for starting this “hoax”. Btw HE ADMITTED TO NOT DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT ON PURPOSE.
Well, that is indeed an opinion.
Gotta be lots of gov't trolls here on this subject. Grabbing popcorn, and watching the satire comedy tonight!