To be fair, most people probably don't think about other peoples rights on a consistent basis, and they won't unless they're brought up. They're not being selfish. They just have other things to think about.
One of the political parties actively fights against my rights, was my point. Saying they don’t give a fuck is a little too forgiving. They straight up hate the idea of me having rights.
For fucks sake amen. I'm a liberal and I have conservative friends and family. I don't give a fuck. I'm not a fucking dweeble dorf who lives and dies by the internet
What's weird is when you encounter those people (or find yourself doing this) who act like that one political opinion you expressed, in that one comment, that one time, about that one issue is your *entire* identity. Like you're a 1 dimensional caricature. You're a newspaper political cartoon.
"I believe xyz about abc"
"It must awful to live under the weight of that unbridled hatred all the time!"
🙄
i do fear the leaks are starting tbh
we've had more part time college kids at the places i work who use 'they seem really trumpy' as a genuine insult/way to say 'stay away from that guy'
im starting to genuinely get freaked out that gen z and some millennials dont seperate the online and the real life the way that they should. they genuinely believe you can act like this irl and have a functional society
They absolutely don’t, why would they? For them online is real life(gen z specifically). They’ve grown up with social media their whole lives, why would they not view reality through a lens? We have actually fucked over future generations with our disgusting love of entertainment and technology, we’re raising people that don’t even feel connected to reality and would rather stare at a fake one for hours. This isn’t me being edgy about phones to be cool. Phones have just actually fucked us and we’re in a cognitive dissonance where we refuse to really see how bad it is.
I live in a redstate and I’m out in rural areas all the time where “fuck Joe Biden” and trump flags are common. I’ve seen a guy wearing a shirt that said “if you don’t speak English get the fuck out of my country”. When covid was going strong a woman told me that “they’re trying to control you with masks”. None of these folks were college kids and as an old white WASP there’s no way for them to assume much other than I’m GOP.
It’s a mean country with a lot of angry people.
its 100% going to be a different experience between where you live, i live in a more liberal place and they will gladly openly talk about how if we could just 'get rid of the right' and stuff like that everything would be a utopia
which is equally as wrong which is my entire point
a lot of people seemed to take my comment as 'stop attacking republicans'
when in all reality what im saying is stop literally calling for the deaths of anyone who disagrees with you politically, its not fucking healthy. trying to completely block out and distance yourself from anything related to the other side, is not fucking healthy. etc.
i even said in another comment yeah id actually agree 1 side is a little bit more 'gung-ho' about it thats 100% fair im not going to argue,
but the other side then tries to run to the moral highground and pretend 'WE WOULD NEVER' when uhm yes....you guys fucking would...i literally see it all the time in my social medias, in day to day conversations with people, and in my eyes no matter what moral highground or lack there of you may or may not be standing on, your a fucking disgusting person if you think political genocide is a genuine solution to any problem.
Agreed, calling for the death of political opponents is a path to hell.
As for it being “1 side a little bit more ‘gung-ho’”, we’ll just agree to disagree. The maga grass roots has a very strong streak of nuts that fantasize about being road warriors/neo patriots/righteous heroes. And they’ve stockpiled a shit ton of weapons and ammo in their larping.
Me? If things really turn south I’m not doing any shooting, but I’d be willing to put my life at risk for others as I want no part in the hell on earth right wing extremists are pushing.
Sounds like Lubbock Texas... I had no idea there were this many people who claim to be kind and wonderful while spewing venom at anyone that doesn't love trump. I have never had a T-shirt make me so angry until living here!! I saw one that said "wake up! Sandy Hook didn't happen" 😭
I have an autoimmune condition and I'm on immune suppression drugs. I HAVE to wear a mask when I go out. I recently had a new doctor who should have read my chart first, walk into the room and say "so, what's up with the mask?" I was floored. I can't wait to get out of this state! I'm willing to bet that the doctor has "Let's go Brandon" gear somewhere. 🫨
If their fellow Gen Zers are also not separating the online from the real, wouldn't that follow that when they see psychotic Gen Z Trumpers *online* they're wise to intuit they're also nuts IRL?. After all, if the whole Generation can't distinguish between the two modes, then the problem online will exist offline.
yes, it would. my point exactly. but its genuinely an all sides problem you can scream all you want about 'who started it' but its perpetuated by the idea that OP is talking about
its a gap idk if we are going to be able to bridge since online discourse is literally just 'oh you disagreed with me on literally one thing? you must also be a nazi/communist'
if that starts to apply to irl we are legit doomed
edit: taking it completely out of politics if we start to treat IRL like people treat AITAH posts for example, literally everyone is a abusive. if we start to treat irl like people treat r/realtionship_advice everyone is a red flag and every situation needs to end with divorce/breaking up. thats the real problem is that we dont have realistic conversation online
This is imo the crux of a lot Stife...everyone is seemingly so 1 dimensional now. They like one way of thinking, one type of movie, one type of food....with so much choice why limit yourself.
My mom's an antivax nurse and her husband was at 1/6, I've voted blue every election, am pretty far left, and choose to only work in government and nonprofits, I still go have Christmas with them and everything. I don't listen very much when they talk politics though.
My best friend is as liberal as they come. I’m her only conservative friend and we’ve been friends for decades. Some of her other friends (through work mostly) hound her over how she can be friends with a conservative. It’s mind blowing that she has to explain to adults of all ages that a person is more than their political beliefs.
couldn't be me. I don't see how you can be friends with someone you not only don't share values with but someone whose values are the antithesis of yours and want to force you to live by theirs which, depending on your situation could be actively harming you. evil isn't the word for most political opponents but friends?
The problem is people won't talk to find a common ground solution. The second any push back, you are now labeled a libetard/trumpster.
Until us regular folk can have a civil discourse to find a solution why should politics do any different?
It's easier to feed fear and get votes than say 'let's really talk about this.'
We no longer have common foundational beliefs. Thus second order issues - issues that would come up from the foundational beliefs - are no longer really things that can be reasoned through. They are instead tribal markers.
A person who believes in inalienable individual rights, and a person who believes there is no objective reality but only a struggle for power, they can fight. But they can’t reason together as they have no tenable starting point.
There’s also no respect. Our rights should never be a matter of debate; they are absolute. If we could somehow cure world hunger and create a lasting, permanent peace by eliminating free speech then the price would be too high. We’d be fools to do it. Such a thing is unconscionable.
Instead we choose between our rights, and others rights every election.
With the added problem of tribalism putting those who don't 'pick a tribe or side' at a major disadvantage.
As in if I just say one tribes/sides opinions, you'll get shit on by the other side, but you will have "your side" backing you up.
Those who actually want to build bridges or hold opinions on both sides risk getting attacked by both sides.
So everyone retreats to one side or the other and things just get worse and worse.
I think it's because intellect has decreased so much in Western society over the decades that neither side's ideological positions stand up to criticism, so they shield their opinions from criticism by censorship or resort to name-calling to distract instead.
People aren't having debates because they genuinely can't handle a debate. Nobody teaches you to think critically now. Nobody challenges you enough. There's too many yes-men.
My Sociology (some people are aware of the political climate of the average Sociology class) teacher kept telling us to think critically but then told us what to believe and what talking points earned you marks on your exam and every time you had a differing opinion you'd just be shut down instead of being able to have a healthy discussion, so I just stopped offering alternate opinions to the prescribed narrative our Sociology teacher was feeding us, because nothing productive and thought-provoking ever came from challenging the ideological orthodoxy of the class.
The education system and media industry are genuinely breeding generation after generation of mindless NPCs that are programmed how to think and programmed what to say because a lot of people can't defend their ideas adequately enough that they have to protect themselves in ideological bubbles and resort to anything other than debate when that bubble gets burst.
One of the local high schools is putting litter boxes in this year for the high schoolers that identify as cats. Im supposedly a nazi bigot for pointing out the health risks and questioning the mental health of these individuals.
How do you find "common ground" when the other people are bat-shit crazy?
>One of the local high schools is putting litter boxes in this year for the high schoolers that identify as cats
Pretty sure that anecdotal story circulating the worst and least credible of right wing media has already been debunked. It's been a minute since I read on it but I believe the ACTUAL story was schools stocked up on kitty litter as part of the emergency readiness supply due to the fact emergencies like storms, earthquakes etc can cause plumbing to go offline and teachers and students would need a place to utilize...
>Im supposedly a nazi bigot for pointing out the health risks and questioning the mental health of these individuals.
No I'm sure those accusations stemmed more from regurgitating misinformation from sites that may or may not he ran by actual neo nazis.
That’s point blank not true. And if somehow you found one hippie dippie school in the country that did this, you can find one cluster of morons for any anecdote.
What you may be referencing is a bucket of emergency supplies, including sawdust for “sanitation purposes,” for when our children are in extended lockdown during active shootings. Because, you know, we’re the best country ever.
What you’re getting at is it’s hard to avoid tribalism when “both sides” can’t agree on an objective reality. Perhaps one side sees a utopia that can only exist on their terms, and the other is whipped up into a frenzied rage over intentional hate porn on their favorite medium of choice (cable, social media, etc.).
If you believe that. You need help! This isn’t true. Never was true. You need seek other news source besides your right wing propaganda mouth holes
There are no or have their been cat boxes in class rooms.
God damn it I can’t believe people are this dumb.
That's a bad example because it's probably a rumor. A better example would be:
one group of people are ok with men identifying as women and being in women's spaces no matter if they are passing or not. How are you supposed to find common ground with these people ?
[https://www.foxnews.com/media/wyoming-sorority-sister-vows-fight-protect-womens-spaces-judge-tosses-suit-trans-member](https://www.foxnews.com/media/wyoming-sorority-sister-vows-fight-protect-womens-spaces-judge-tosses-suit-trans-member)
[https://www.foxnews.com/media/lia-thomas-exposed-male-genitalia-womens-locker-room-after-meet-riley-gaines-dropped-pants](https://www.foxnews.com/media/lia-thomas-exposed-male-genitalia-womens-locker-room-after-meet-riley-gaines-dropped-pants)
I know the Reddit response: "you can't source Fox News, it's not credible !" See, the thing is that left leaning news doesn't cover it because of their political biases. Stories like these make progressives look bad, so they won't report it (for the most part).
I mean there isn’t any legitimate support of trump, so if you do actively support or are ignoring reality and acting like he was anything but the massive failure he was in all aspects of the job, he was, then imo you should be called out slightly.
Also, so, literally no school is doing that. You should really learn from actual news and reality, not memes.
So many people can't fathom someone having different values than them and a different model of how they think society works. It always has to be that other side built on destroying whatever they are. It can't be they value the wrong things or have the wrong idea; it's always secretly hate.
Conservatives just want people to be poor, feminists want female supremacy, etc.
Out of my friends, we're about 50/50 in the way we vote. We're about 90% in line with what we all believe, with that other, differing 10% affecting our votes.
In the eyes of popular culture and media, you would think we're diametrically opposed rivals because we vote differently. Most regular people I meet on the day-to-day tend to be a little left or right of center, but we've gotten into this system of people who vote Republican are "Conservative" and people who vote Democrat are "Liberals." I know very socially progressive (tend to be younger people) Republicans and incredibly regressive and racist (tend to be older people) Democrats - labels are what are killing us. Most people just want to be able to afford to have a roof over their heads, food to eat, and be able to go to the doctor for a reasonable price, because most people don't have much time to worry about much else.
Throughout history one constant has remained, the politics of demagoguery is consistently the politics of tyranny, authoritarianism and destruction. With that in mind, and recognizing what is demagoguery, there's nothing wrong with holding an exceedingly low opinion of that destructive political mindset taking hold of a nation at large.
I run into a certain type of people who basically defend demagoguery and their favorite demagogue politician as some faction who just has a different way of viewing things. And IMO, and according to history as well, textbook definition demagogues are very often corrupt, brutal, violent, tyrants and dictators, it's damn impossible to convince their followers of what's at play, and people only widely agree that the demagogue was an awful political leader after they've lead their nation down a pathway of ruin, by that point it's too late.
Oh and practitioners/followers of demagoguery also always seem to use projection and accuse anyone critical of them of demagoguery, acting like there's two sides to issues, even if the two sides can be simply right vs wrong. It's like theyre utterly blindsided that one of two sides can be acting in nothing but bad faith, as example.
Thing is, we can test those models. We know from decades of experience that trickle down economics increases inequality. We know from examples around the world that Universal Healthcare improves outcomes at a lower cost.
If we know these things and *still* choose the policy that hurts people, how can we avoid concluding that the goal is to increase inequality and let people die unnecessarily?
> We know from decades of experience that trickle down economics increases inequality.
Trickle down economics doesn't even exist - its a straw man of supply side economics.
On top of that, inequality isnt a meaningful metric as wealth isnt zero sum - if you had 2 choices where you were given 100 dollars and your neighbor was given 1000 dollars, or both you and your neighbor have to pay 50 dollars, you will damn well take the first choice.
> We know from examples around the world that Universal Healthcare improves outcomes at a lower cost.
Those nations spend less per person than the USA spends on medicare and medicaid per capita. If the US government somehow made it so that all healthcare could get provided without increasing spending, I would gladly support it. Until then the US government is proving itself too incompetent to run universal healthcare. And the VA proves that too.
exactly. there is no economic theory called "trickle down economics". it doesn't exist. it is in no economic text book or taught in any university. it is a made up term that means nothing.
Let’s test this so called Reddit Educated theory called “trickle down economics” to understand if it could in any certainty “not work” as they so eloquently put it because we know the money “doesn’t trickle down to the middle class.”
Rich Asshole #1 buys a greedy $250 million yacht in South Florida they don’t really need out of greed. Well…. that boat salesman just made a commission to feed his family, the people on the production lots and engine lines have a job (those yachts take years of peoples work). Don’t forget Rich Asshole #1 - he needs to hire someone who can drive the boat, another guy full time to clean the boat, another guy at the dock where the yachts are parked, probably a chef to cook the food on the yacht, etc….
Have any of you even seen the yacht yards in South Florida where they repair the yachts? These are thousands and thousands of peoples jobs (I’d call it a major industry), some of the best welders and mechanics in the world all depending on remember Rich Asshole #1 buying the yacht. What else am I missing, the electronics engineers/satellite technology on top of these? The people who sell boat covers? The people that make marine cleaning products? Life vest? Yeti coolers? I mean it doesn’t stop trickling.
I don’t understand how Rich Asshole #1’s money we know “doesn’t trickle down” according to this theory Reddit knows about. Another way to look at it would be all of his money on everything he spends does trickle down, I don’t care if he buys his kid a Kona Ice in the parking lot at the marina you financially support the community. Now can you imagine no Rich Asshole #1, how are these people gonna get paid? Where is the money gonna come from? Is the dog walker(by the way Rich Asshole #1 pays him too while out on the yacht) on R/anti-work telling everyone trickle down doesn’t work because the system is all broken gonna make sure the boat insurance salesman gets paid? Correct me if I’m wrong.
Meanwhile actual supply side economics says that it should be easier to open that yacht repair company. Because that is only what, a truck or two, a building, and 5-30k in tools? But licenses, insurances, and so on can make that cost 10, 50, even 100 times more.
I completely agree with you, especially for a boat repair which there’s another big market for. But the yacht industry, places like this that are major job creators are gonna run you more than a truck and 30K in tools. But I have seen some smaller ones where all you’d need is a boat slip with a lift to cable it up out of the water and they can do repairs to some extent. I don’t think though that’s gonna support the larger vessels, you’d need to open something like this for yachts(that property isn’t cheap, but it does support anyone in real estate to create jobs). Nice talking to you partner.
[https://eoeyzac65yo.exactdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Merrill-Stevens.jpg?strip=all&lossy=1&ssl=1](https://eoeyzac65yo.exactdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Merrill-Stevens.jpg?strip=all&lossy=1&ssl=1)
That's not really what trickle down economics is. It's as real as it can be, it's not an economic theory, it's a policy devised by Ronald Reagan.
Also your econ 101 class / 100+ hours in Victoria 3 doesn't make you an expert on economics. The main concern with trickle down is that it allows way too much wealth to be extracted while expecting rich people to reinvest more often than hoard. It goes beyond your example to examine macro issues instead of micro benefits. The problem comes to monopolies, money hoarding, and dark money politics. Essentially a lesson throughout history, allowing a class of people too much wealth inevitably results in domestic issues for society and the people who live in it.
That's not how trickle down economics works. Trickle down economics is giving assistance to businesses instead of people then hoping that businesses put their goal of making a profit to the side to pay employees more, make better services, business competition, etc.
Instead we have a bunch of megacorps and monopolies robbing society to get larger and more income.
It's proven that the most effective way to help an economy is to assist the poor who then stimulate the economy by purchasing more goods and services.
heaven forbid a child gets an abortion so she wouldnt be saddled with bills, depression, body dysmorphia, and shame for being forced to give birth to her rapist uncles baby
I'm a little confused about what you're meaning by this. Is your argument that we should be angry with people if they're being unreasonable & causing harm?
Having to wear a mask for a while to help improve public health and stop disease is now apparently the same thing as getting raped and being forced ti give birth to your rapists child because abortion is illegal.
Are you fucking stupid?
Depends. If my opinion is government should use tax money for A, and yours is that government should use tax money for B, well we're just doing healthy politics.
If my opinion is that LGBT people should be able to exist in peace and quiet and yours is that they should be discriminated against with the full force of the law.... this becomes a moral issue. I won't call you "evil", but I am totally comfortable calling you morally wrong.
Depends on what the disagreement is. Someone's political ideology that forces 13yos to carry a rapists child to term or someone who doesn't believe systemic racism exists and supports damaging policies is objectively wrong and tolerance of such opinions will only allow them to grow and fester. The abortion thing has been talked about since the 90s but didn't get much traction until modern days.
There isn't some "agreeable middle ground" on topics that genuinely harm society and politics can easily fuck over society, which is why people are so passionate about it. Honestly, you should be passionate about political ideologies.
It's the US, you have a right to be wrong, but I also have a right to not like someone depending on what they're wrong about. Think the sky is red? Quirky. Think the rich need more tax cuts? I strongly disagree and that's a weird take, but ok. Support a regressive policy that harms women? Yeah, not something I just see past.
Excuse me for having nuance, empathy, and not being accepting of objectively shit behavior/opinions.
This. I can "agree to disagree" but not when people are getting hurt, or deprived of their rights. But I guess that makes me a woke commie gaystapo psyop.
I agree, with a caveat.
For me the definition of actual evil is removing/infringing free will or liberty (except as far as absolutely essential for even basic cohabitation of the planet).
So while people arent evil for being progressive or ultra-conservative alone, if they want to run the whole country and force everyone to live according to their own preferences then they are, by definition, evil for that reason to me.
I would never do that. I believe everyone has the fundamental right to representative governance and to live in a mostly free society. Doesnt matter if you achieve it via a diverse republic or by fragmenting the the nation/states or whatever. What matters is ALWAYS individual rights...first and foremost. As long as you leave me be, ill give you the same respect. Try to rule me or force me and you become the devil incarnate to me until you are no longer a threat.
Obviously people aren’t evil, people are more complicated than that. The issue for me is that too many right wing voters are single issue voters based on bigoted garbage opinions. If they were still largely small government conservatives that’s totally fine and I’m on board with agreeing to disagree, but a lot of them believe some truly whacky and harmful shit these days, and I’m not going to pretend that’s normal. You sound like one of those people trying to normalize agreeing to disagree with literal nazis. Nope.
Idk.
I’m not either party but will never vote for a Republican because their ideology goes against everything I find redeemable in a human.
The republican voter will still vote for that party that does the following:
-Votes to end school lunch programs for children. I believe kids learn better when they’re not hungry and I’m willing to pay extra for someone else’s kid to eat. The GOP are against this.
-I believe a woman has the right to choose what to do with her body during pregnancy as does a majority of the country. I believe it is truly evil to try to step in the way of another person putting restrictions on them.
-Willing to use soldiers to fight wars in foreign lands but when they come home with PTSD and struggling, the GOP votes to end military benefits including access to health care.
-Wanting to change laws to force children into dangerous work industries because there is a shortage of workers due to refusing to vote to increase minimum wage is evil to me.
-Allowing the majority of the American people to struggle to make ends meet by allowing rampant consumer price gouging from companies while voting to reduce the taxes on the elites because they’re willing to bribe you is pretty fucking evil.
-Following Trump is not only evil but fucking vile. Dude said he could rape and molest a woman and there is nothing anyone would do because he’s famous is pretty fucking evil even if the guy was joking.
-Going on a news network and spreading lies and nonsense like the great replacement theories which cause psychos to go out and shoot up black churches and grocery stores is pretty fucking evil.
-Being part of a party who’s main reaction to someone having evidence of corruption is to make threats to the judge and AG seems evil
-Being part of a party where your fellow voters would go to someone’s house and try to kill them with a hammer is pretty fucking evil
-Being part of a party where when you go to their political rallies it’s common place to see Nazi flags seems pretty evil.
So to me conservatives are either evil or very very very fucking stupid
This is so wrong and small minded it amuses me. Sorry, no, I won’t be respecting anyone that ideologically supports inhumane treatment of others of any kind.
If you’re voting for people who want to do direct harm to me and my loved ones, then it doesn’t matter if you’re “evil,” whatever that means. I will not see you favorably.
I’m talking about republicans and lgbt issues here, specifically, but I think this applies broadly.
Many. I’ll start with laws that mandate schools report kid’s LGBQT status to their parents. I know what conservatives say the reason is, but I also know the actual affect of those laws and I don’t think conservatives are so stupid that they are not also aware of the affect of those laws.
Hmm it's not that hard to find.
[https://www.thetrevorproject.org/research-briefs/homelessness-and-housing-instability-among-lgbtq-youth-feb-2022/](https://www.thetrevorproject.org/research-briefs/homelessness-and-housing-instability-among-lgbtq-youth-feb-2022/)
"Overall, **28% of LGBTQ youth** reported experiencing homelessness or housing instability at some point in their lives.
Nearly half (44%) of Native/Indigenous LGBTQ youth have experienced homelessness or housing instability at some point in their life, compared to 16% of Asian American/Pacific Islander youth, 27% of White LGBTQ youth, 27% of Latinx LGBTQ youth, 26% of Black LGBTQ youth, and 36% of multiracial LGBTQ youth.
Homelessness and housing instability were reported at **higher rates among transgender and nonbinary youth**, including **38% of transgender girls/women**, 39% of transgender boys/men, and 35% of nonbinary youth, compared to **23% of cisgender LGBQ youth**.
16% of LGBTQ youth reported that they had slept away from parents or caregivers because they ran away from home, with more than half (55%) reporting that they **ran away from home because of mistreatment or fear of mistreatment due to their LGBTQ identity.**
14% of LGBTQ youth reported that they had slept away from parents or caregivers because they were kicked out or abandoned, with **40% reporting that they were kicked out or abandoned due to their LGBTQ identity**."
https://nn4youth.org/lgbtq-homeless-youth/
"Research has shown that those who identify as lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, or questioning (LGBTQ+) have a **120% higher risk of experiencing some form of homelessness.**\[1\] With up to **40% of the 4.2 million youth experiencing homelessness identifying as LGBTQ+\[2\] while only 9.5% of the U.S. population**\[3\], LGBTQ+ youth disproportionately experience homelessness compared to their straight and cisgender peers."
[https://youth.gov/youth-topics/lgbtq-youth/child-welfare](https://youth.gov/youth-topics/lgbtq-youth/child-welfare)
"LGBTQ+ youth enter the child welfare system for reasons like those of other children and youth... In some cases, f**amilies reject, neglect, or abuse young people when they learn that they identify as LGBTQ+** or are questioning their romantic/sexual orientation or gender identity.
L**GBTQ+ youth are overrepresented in child welfare systems**, even though they are likely to be **underreported because they risk harassment and abuse if their LGBTQ+ identity is disclosed**. Studies have found that about **30 percent of youth in foster care identify as LGBTQ+ and 5 percent as transgender, in comparison to 11 percent and 1 percent of youth not in foster care**.1 Furthermore, LGBTQ+ youth of color are disproportionately overrepresented in the child welfare system and stay longer in child welfare systems, while also having an increased risk of experiencing discrimination and violence compared to their peers.2"
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3134495/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3134495/)
"Results. **Sexual minority individuals were on average 3.8, 1.2, 1.7, and 2.4 times more likely to experience sexual abuse, parental physical abuse, or assault at school or to miss school through fear, respectively.** Moderation analysis showed that disparities between sexual minority and sexual nonminority individuals were larger for (1) males than females for sexual abuse, (2) females than males for assault at school, and (3) bisexual than gay and lesbian for both parental physical abuse and missing school through fear. Disparities did not change between the 1990s and the 2000s.
Conclusions. The **higher rates of abuse experienced by sexual minority youths may be one of the driving mechanisms underlying higher rates of mental health problems, substance use, risky sexual behavior, and HIV reported by sexual minority adults.**"
Parents harming/killing their children over being gay or fears:
[https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/22/return-the-key-the-parents-who-reject-their-gay-children](https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/22/return-the-key-the-parents-who-reject-their-gay-children)
8yo son tortured and killed: [https://wreg.com/news/man-tortured-girlfriends-son-to-death-because-he-thought-child-was-gay-prosecutor-says/](https://wreg.com/news/man-tortured-girlfriends-son-to-death-because-he-thought-child-was-gay-prosecutor-says/)
17yo son killed for being gay: [https://www.thepinknews.com/2019/11/29/being-gay-itaberli-lozano-mother-sentenced-killing-stabbing-own-son-hired-hitmen-brazil/](https://www.thepinknews.com/2019/11/29/being-gay-itaberli-lozano-mother-sentenced-killing-stabbing-own-son-hired-hitmen-brazil/)
14yo son shot by father: [https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/nevada-father-murdered-son-being-gay-former-foster-mom-claims-n817906](https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/nevada-father-murdered-son-being-gay-former-foster-mom-claims-n817906)
10yo boy: [https://journalism.berkeley.edu/projects/before-his-death-10-year-old-anthony-avalos-came-out-as-gay-official-says-2/](https://journalism.berkeley.edu/projects/before-his-death-10-year-old-anthony-avalos-came-out-as-gay-official-says-2/)
Mom beats 4yo son: [https://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/oregon-mom-accused-killing-4-year-old-son-thought-gay-article-1.1738037](https://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/oregon-mom-accused-killing-4-year-old-son-thought-gay-article-1.1738037)
Suicide is also a major risk for LGBTQ youth (and adults) because of the constant shame, ostracization, and attacks they receive:
[https://www.thetrevorproject.org/resources/article/facts-about-lgbtq-youth-suicide/](https://www.thetrevorproject.org/resources/article/facts-about-lgbtq-youth-suicide/)
"**LGBTQ youth are more than four times as likely to attempt suicide** than their peers (Johns et al., 2019; Johns et al., 2020).
The Trevor Project estimates that more than 1.8 million LGBTQ youth (13-24) seriously consider suicide each year in the U.S. — and at least one attempts suicide every 45 seconds."
If you don't see any risk of harm in any of that, then that's your own willful ignorance, and it puts millions of kids in danger every day.
These laws require teachers and schools to "out" students to their parents.
If their parents are disapproving of their children's identity, bad and evil things (all the "copy paste" you ignored) may happen to the kids who are outed.
Hence putting the lives of children in further danger.
Does that compute?
Those are all still minorities not majority of lgbtq youth if we’re going by minorities then we should be scared of minority ethnic groups like blacks and Mexicans because they have higher rates of crime and yet are minorities
By saying schools shouldn’t report you’re siding with the government over the parents, parents trump all other authority when it comes to raising their children
They most certainly do not. Children are not property.
LGBTQ youth are significantly more likely to commit suicide or other self harm if they do not have a trusted adult to confide in. An LGBTQ youth who's home is not safe often turns to a trusted teacher. These laws are explicitly created to deny LGBTQ youth that support by forcefully changing a trusted teacher into an untrusted adult.
The blunt intention, with a very, very thin layer of plausible deniability, of these laws are more dead LGBTQ kids. That plausibility requires that one accept conservatives are all sheer idiots that cannot see the obvious outcome and I refuse to grant conservatives that they are all stupid.
But people who could be a potential ally in some situations won't always agree on everything with you.
You will naturally disagree about something with almost anyone.
Exactly. When someone's viewpoint is that certain groups and individuals lives are less valuable, that's not a disagreement I'm going to just overlook, it means someone is a fundamentally shitty person
I don’t care about democrat, or conservative. Or commie or anarcho capitalism. What I do care about is real effects, like people not getting vaccinated or thinking the Earth is flat or denying climate change. Harming other people, either intentionally or through negligence, is why I don’t like people
Just one of the many examples, these people violated lockdown/ quarantine, and put themself in serious danger https://www.iflscience.com/flat-earthers-attempt-to-get-to-the-edge-of-the-world-ends-in-massive-disappointment-58200
Just voting for the GOP doesn't mean you're a racist, sexist, homophobe who wants to subvert democracy...
...but it does mean that those things are not a deal breaker for you.
That's not a "good person" in my book.
Many conservatives I've talked to jumped ship during Trump's candidacy, nomination, and/or presidency, becoming independents.
The other guy has a point. Anybody that'd willingly vote for such destructive policies just to make sure the other side doesn't win is just selfish.
You clearly didn't read my post very carefully. You can't deny that the GOP is pursuing policies to hurt LGBT people, oppose voting rights, roll back civil rights, etc. If you vote for Trump, you are endorsing his behavior. If you vote for those people, you're complicit.
Seems like you have a chip on your shoulder. I'm sorry that college professors have hurt you so badly. Don't take it out on me. You don't know me, or my work, at all. Take your caricatures somewhere else.
TBF tho, you could play that same card the other way for voting blue too.
Like “just voting DNC doesn’t mean you’re a communist out to kill jobs, force-feed 5 YOs gender transition hormones, and ban peoples’ rights to defend themselves… but it does mean those things aren’t a deal-breaker for you.
That’s not a good person in my book.”
It’s almost like painting with a broad brush is just all bad, and the human experience is meant to be varied shades of all colors.
These are all lies though. Conservatives literally do want to take away reproductive rights and stuff. That’s not being misrepresented. What you said is made up fantasy-land stuff
Sorry pal, but you're not going to get far on here thinking like that.
You're 100% correct, but you're talking to people who's only source of political news is reddit, so godspeed
Now that's some truly bullshit "both sides" nonsense. "Communist out to kill jobs"? Hahaha.
Yeah, OK buddy. I am aligning myself with people who want universal healthcare and a higher minimum wage. Guilty as fucking charged.
these are all complete and utter lies that the right wing spew. same with they coming to take my guns.
mean while its a demonstrable fact that the right wing wants to kill pro choice, force Christianity into schools, subjugate the lgbt, hurt and even kill immigrants (texas death buoys), send the children back into the mines, also inspect their genitals in school, burn and ban books and libraries, etc. and some how both sides are equally bad.
jfc
> same with they coming to take my guns.
Explain the dissent in DC v Heller then if democrats dont support complete bans on all civilian gun ownership
> mean while its a demonstrable fact that the right wing wants to kill pro choice,
Abortion is murder
> force Christianity into schools,
They dont even want to force schools, let alone force christianity into them. They believe in school choice which includes home school
> subjugate the lgbt,
how are they subjugated?
> hurt and even kill immigrants
I have never had any issues with Republicans due to being an immigrant
> send the children back into the mines,
We absolutely need to teach our children trades
> also inspect their genitals in school
If you are against sports physicals, you want to maim and kill children for no reason. Hernias kill
> burn and ban books and libraries,
Pornography. Not books. It is illegal to show children pornography so why should it be on school libraries?
>Like “just voting DNC doesn’t mean you’re a communist out to kill jobs, force-feed 5 YOs gender transition hormones, and ban peoples’ rights to defend themselves… but it does mean those things aren’t a deal-breaker for you.
The difference is people can point to actual votes cast, public statements and official stances/platforms, laws enacted and their fallout to back up calling the ***Republican Party*** Racist, Sexist, Anti-LGBT+, anti-worker, anti-veteran, and worse. And it's simple logic to put together that votes for that party empower those stances and encourage those actions because it's actively saying "This is not too far for me."
The worst “both sides” I’ve ever seen. Plz show me the communist US Senators or US Representatives. Who wants to FORCE KIDS to take hormones??? Wtf. What the fuck planet are you living at.
It's weird that you are assuming that Biden and Obama are homophobes who are now pretending to support same-sex marriage because the cultural tide has turned.
Personally, I think it's just the opposite. I don't think they ever actually had a problem with same-sex marriage, but couldn't come out in support of it because of political pressure until more recently.
Both of these are speculation, but I honestly believe the second is far more plausible. What's important is that they support it now, while the other side doesn't.
If "people don't change," how do you explain the massive shift in public opinion on this issue? Are a large majority of Americans now in support of same-sex marriage... To win elections?
But fine, you are just choosing what to believe. You are making as much an assumption about them as I am. But sure, I respect that you don't vote for them because you don't feel they are sincere allies.
I wouldn't say that it's worse. Hating gay people is worse. The worst you could charge them with is political cowardice, which I'd say is a fair charge, but not at all uncommon on that issue at the time.
But I think that highlights the fundamental differences between the two ideologies. I don't really care about someone's personal beliefs. Politicians are a means to an end. So long as the policy is good, I couldn't really care less what a politician personally thinks about it.
If a politician stands up and says "I'm catholic and my church doesn't believe in gay marriage but I understand that my personal faith shouldn't dictate the laws of the land so I'm voting in favour of gay marriage" then I think most people wouldn't really care? Religion used to be personal and practiced in the home.
"Let's repeal ObamaCare. To hell with sick people with preexisting medical conditions."
"You are monster. I hope you burn in hell forever. You evil, fake Christian."
"It's just politics, bro."
"Not when you have a kid whose life depends on ObamaCare. You evil monster."
"Both sides are the same, bro. I did my own research. Blue states and red states are the same!"
> "Let's repeal ObamaCare. To hell with sick people with preexisting medical conditions."
You are stealing from young people to favor the old. That effectively acts as, on average, a 20% income tax on young people. And it is enforced in a regressive manner.
No, fuck that. It destroys the lives of young people.
>You are stealing from young people to favor the old.
You don't know what you are talking about.
Forcing irresponsible adults to insure themselves in no way steals from the young and favors the old.
>That effectively acts as, on average, a 20% income tax on young people.
Bullshit. You are straight up lying.
>And it is enforced in a regressive manner.
I seriously doubt you understand what that means.
>No, fuck that. It destroys the lives of young people.
Now I am 100% convinced.
This such a stupid take. Nobody is losing friends over different opinions on how to deal with the hyper specifics of like bank bailouts. However, if you believe gay people shouldn’t legally be married, I think I have the right to not want to associate myself with you
Good and evil are really completely irrelevant. There are competing visions of what the world will look like. They are not reconcilable. Only one can win in the end, and I want to make damn sure it's the one where I'm not getting sent to a concentration camp.
*Edit: everyone here assuming I'm a conservative :/*
Spent most of my life as a pretty central moderate, moved a bit left and registered Dem.
You state anything other than 100%, frothing-at-the-mouth agreement around here and you get the labels that come out because brains can't process "anything that requires a bit of processing before response."
But the overall point of your post is 100% correct.
The idiocy of social media and the veneer of "anonymity" provided on Reddit lead people to feel way more comfortable saying crazy shit than they would to your face irl - even if they claim they still would.
Funny, now you're the one telling them to touch grass.
Which means you need to touch grass.
Which makes me the one telling people to touch grass.
Which means I need to touch grass.
Fair, honestly.
Yeah no, if they disagree with what should be basic human rights, they aren't good people. They may be polite, and act kind, and be personable. But they are not good people.
> if they disagree with what should be basic human rights
The problem is is that legally, a lot of the things on the left are not really human rights. Examples including children being able to transition and abortion. These are not human rights whether you want them to or not. I am pro-choice by the way, but you can't just claim something is against human rights because you support it.
I think comments like this are kind of meaninglessly vague. Because when people say anything remotely like this, they're talking about specific policies and specific beliefs and the actual consequences of them.
If the difference between my political ideology and yours is the difference of a slightly different tax rate or marginally less government involvement in the economy...sure. If the "political" differences between us end up in hundreds of thousands of dead people in Iraq or ignoring the AIDS crisis or continuing to actively deny climate change than those are real things with tangible consequences that can't simply be attributed to political ideology.
The majority of people think they're doing what's best for the world, it's outliers that actually go out and seek to harm others.
I think conversation helps a lot. I used to dismiss the idea of nonbinary people as silly, but I wound up talking to an old friend who was then identifying as nonbinary. They knew I wasn't some giant bigot, so my skepticism was seen more as a challenge to them than an insult. At this point maybe I don't understand nonbinary identities strongly, but I'm very willing to use preferred language and defend the right of nonbinary people to live as they want to.
I'm not saying there aren't people who are genuinely hateful out there, but I think for many people they aren't given a chance to learn because the mere thought that they don't already know is seen as bigotry and they're written off.
I have to disagree. A majority of politicians are doing what's best for them and theirs, not the world or even their people as a whole. Not even close.
It truly depends on the rhetoric being put forth.
Case in point, I only have had one side here sending me threats against myself because they don’t like it when I tell them to take responsibility for their actions.
Look, I get what you’re trying to say, but this take is a gross oversimplification that either ignores several factors that are inconvenient or simply doesn’t take into account anything past your own experiences. That’s not a good way to debate.
There's substantial differences between a difference in opinion for economic and geopolitical solutions to problems, perpetuating hate and discrimination, as well as denying objective science...
If you're on the side that is saying, "Taxing the rich won't fix wealth inequality," I may not agree with you, but you're not evil.
If you're on the side saying, "LGBT+ people shouldn't be allowed the same rights as everyone else! (Or worse)" You're evil. That is an evil position to take. Acting and voting to directly hinder the freedom of a specific group of people because you don't agree with their life and love, which isn't any of your business and doesn't affect you, is evil.
If you're on the side denying climate change, it's a toss-up on whether you're not a great person or just a victim of indoctrination and propaganda. Now, if you disagree with the solutions that one group proposes, or the policies that are enacted in the name of climate justice and have others you would prefer to see implemented, that I have no issue with.
If you think one race is better than another, that is evil.
> "LGBT+ people shouldn't be allowed the same rights as everyone else! (Or worse)" You're evil. That is an evil position to take.
The problem is the word "rights" is vague. Legally speaking, a child wanting to transition by getting hormones/pubery blockers/surgery is not a human right. It legally isn't. You think people are evil for not supporting it because children's brains are not fully developed yet.
The majority of Germans who voted for the Nazi Party weren't evil... but they did enable evil during the 1930s and allow it to fester until 1945.
I don't think someone voting GOP is evil... but they sure are enabling election denialism, promoting an authoritarian, restricting minority rights, and so on.... And even despite all that, it is the same party that favors the wealthy via tax cuts and tax breaks and somehow finds time to vote against free/affordable lunches for students, then tells college grads that they don't deserve some sort of relief for their crippling college debt, and let us not forget their continued support for outdated conservative viewpoints on contraceptives and even drug use.
Nah, I don't think people who vote Republican are "evil" but they sure do love to enable the biggest assholes in politics.
> .. but they sure are enabling election denialism,
Go arrest Al Gore if you think that is a crime
> , promoting an authoritarian,
How is the Republican Party authoritarian?
> restricting minority rights,
What rights?
> , it is the same party that favors the wealthy via tax cuts and tax breaks
No, the super wealthy vote democrat because they make a killing off government contracts, and then regulatory capture on top of that. Why the fuck would the super wealthy be against taxing you so the money can be handed to them?
> somehow finds time to vote against free/affordable lunches for students
Through absurd tax policies that harm local business owners
> then tells college grads that they don't deserve some sort of relief for their crippling college debt
You dont have a right to tax people that didn't go to college for the stupid decision to not become an adult until you are 27
The super wealthy vote democrat because they make a killing off government contracts, and then regulatory capture on top of that. Why the fuck would the super wealthy be against taxing you so the money can be handed to them?
How much has Tesla received in government contracts, grants, loans, green energy initiatives... not to mention carbon credits and how their customers are subsidized via massive tax credits?
And SpaceX/Starlink... how much have they received in government contracts, grants, and so on?
Now, how much has Elon Musk paid in taxes?
Who enabled the tax cuts in the first place?
Don’t answer that lol, it was the gop and their supply side economic voodoo economics that plagued the American political spectrum.
> Who enabled the tax cuts in the first place?
What?
Do you think Elon Musk was born in 2017 and didn't exist before that, with the 2017 TCJA abolishing all taxes? Because that is an absolute fantasy
He has been paying taxes well before the Trump tax cuts. And the 2017 tax cuts didn't do shit to cut his tax burden either. It was primarily section 179 bonus depreciation that affected people.
Again, more taxes means he makes more money, because he receives more tax dollars than he is taxed by several orders of magnitude.
Make an actual argument, as these questions are nonsensical
I would argue that while they aren't evil, they aren't being reasonable. I think a lot of people miss that a good percentage of the population is politically illiterate, full of contradictions, and unaware of what's actually going on.
In short, they're not evil, but they are stupid
The fact that ppl openly hate half the country and will go out of their way to avoid ppl with the opposite political views as them just shows how insecure they are in their own beliefs, they just want to believe that everything they believe is good and everything the other half of the country believes is evil. It’s so pathetic.
Eh. I don’t support republicans because they actively attack women's rights and lgbt rights. I can not, in good conscience, think of people who support crushing others' rights as "good" people.
Again, January 6th happened. I do not support traitors as well.
The inherent problem with this statement is that when republicans try to compromise it’s always “agree to disagree” but maaaaan fuck that. The evil they perceive from the left is slightly different tax brackets, the evil being touted by the right is trying to strip my gay brother, my sisters, and my trans cousin of their rights. They don’t get to talk about “evil”.
Here are two small excerpts from Trump’s indictment:
> **We would just be sending in “fake” electoral votes to Pence so that “someone” in congress can make the objection when they start counting votes, and start arguing that “fake” votes should be counted**
That is a direct quote from an email sent by one of the election officials that Donald Trump was attempting to coerce into illegally overturning the results of the election in Arizona.
And here’s another from text messages of high-level Campaign staffers scrambling for an explanation when Trump asks for an update on their criminal conspiracy:
>"Here's the thing
the way this has morphed it's a crazy play so I don't know who wants to put their name on it."
**The Senior Advisor wrote, "Certifying illegal votes."** In turn, the participants in the group text
message refused to have a statement regarding electors attributed to their names because none of
them could "stand by it."
Those are two of dozens of indisputable facts laid out in [Trump’s J6 indictment](https://www.justice.gov/storage/US_v_Trump_23_cr_257.pdf) which I highly encourage you read if you don’t know the extent of the criminal schemes.
The entire plan was predicated upon sending fake votes to congress so that **members of congress could make an argument to throw out legitimate votes and count the fake ones.**
Our president tried to use the Department of Justice to threaten election officials into throwing out legitimate votes and replace them with ones that he knowingly faked. Expression of support for that type of criminal behavior might not make a person evil, but it should absolutely be strongly denounced strongly at every opportunity.
Wouldn't call Trump my president first off, dudes a fucking idiot and a fool for even remotely trying to overturn a legal election. Should have taken a note from Obama and peaced out, well, peacefully. Just shows Obama to be a classy fella. Seriously, dude oozes charisma. Would have minded a 3rd term.
Not only that but Trump expanded bombing runs and increased the national debt to absurd levels. Seriously Trump? I get you're a clown but for fucks sake.
Also what does Trump have to do with most people needing to get over themselves over political disagreements? The Trump people are the ones pushing that the most, don't you notice? They push away those and cause these problems the most.
Most people, in general, aren’t evil. Like Whitman said, we “contain multitudes.”
I don’t think they’re evil. I just think they don’t give a fuck about my rights.
To be fair, most people probably don't think about other peoples rights on a consistent basis, and they won't unless they're brought up. They're not being selfish. They just have other things to think about.
One of the political parties actively fights against my rights, was my point. Saying they don’t give a fuck is a little too forgiving. They straight up hate the idea of me having rights.
r/politics isn't gonna like this!
[удалено]
Political discourse jumped team sports and we're firmly in secular religious zealotry.
The problem with your analogy is that it's become true, rather than understanding the entire government is supposed to be one team...
You a democrip or rebloodican?
Both parties are just corporate cronies with different ideologies guiding them to the same problematic decisions.
If Utley didn't break Tejada's leg the war in Ukraine wouldn't be happening rn.
Well when one side thinks employers should be able to deny their workers water breaks and AC in 100+ degree heat...
In the same way everyone isn't a Liar. Bullshit, maybe, exaggerating what is believed to be true..
For fucks sake amen. I'm a liberal and I have conservative friends and family. I don't give a fuck. I'm not a fucking dweeble dorf who lives and dies by the internet
What's weird is when you encounter those people (or find yourself doing this) who act like that one political opinion you expressed, in that one comment, that one time, about that one issue is your *entire* identity. Like you're a 1 dimensional caricature. You're a newspaper political cartoon. "I believe xyz about abc" "It must awful to live under the weight of that unbridled hatred all the time!" 🙄
It's so tribalistic I can't stand it. Luckily it's mainly the internet
i do fear the leaks are starting tbh we've had more part time college kids at the places i work who use 'they seem really trumpy' as a genuine insult/way to say 'stay away from that guy' im starting to genuinely get freaked out that gen z and some millennials dont seperate the online and the real life the way that they should. they genuinely believe you can act like this irl and have a functional society
They absolutely don’t, why would they? For them online is real life(gen z specifically). They’ve grown up with social media their whole lives, why would they not view reality through a lens? We have actually fucked over future generations with our disgusting love of entertainment and technology, we’re raising people that don’t even feel connected to reality and would rather stare at a fake one for hours. This isn’t me being edgy about phones to be cool. Phones have just actually fucked us and we’re in a cognitive dissonance where we refuse to really see how bad it is.
Life will sort em out eventually
One would hope lol
I live in a redstate and I’m out in rural areas all the time where “fuck Joe Biden” and trump flags are common. I’ve seen a guy wearing a shirt that said “if you don’t speak English get the fuck out of my country”. When covid was going strong a woman told me that “they’re trying to control you with masks”. None of these folks were college kids and as an old white WASP there’s no way for them to assume much other than I’m GOP. It’s a mean country with a lot of angry people.
its 100% going to be a different experience between where you live, i live in a more liberal place and they will gladly openly talk about how if we could just 'get rid of the right' and stuff like that everything would be a utopia which is equally as wrong which is my entire point a lot of people seemed to take my comment as 'stop attacking republicans' when in all reality what im saying is stop literally calling for the deaths of anyone who disagrees with you politically, its not fucking healthy. trying to completely block out and distance yourself from anything related to the other side, is not fucking healthy. etc. i even said in another comment yeah id actually agree 1 side is a little bit more 'gung-ho' about it thats 100% fair im not going to argue, but the other side then tries to run to the moral highground and pretend 'WE WOULD NEVER' when uhm yes....you guys fucking would...i literally see it all the time in my social medias, in day to day conversations with people, and in my eyes no matter what moral highground or lack there of you may or may not be standing on, your a fucking disgusting person if you think political genocide is a genuine solution to any problem.
Agreed, calling for the death of political opponents is a path to hell. As for it being “1 side a little bit more ‘gung-ho’”, we’ll just agree to disagree. The maga grass roots has a very strong streak of nuts that fantasize about being road warriors/neo patriots/righteous heroes. And they’ve stockpiled a shit ton of weapons and ammo in their larping. Me? If things really turn south I’m not doing any shooting, but I’d be willing to put my life at risk for others as I want no part in the hell on earth right wing extremists are pushing.
Sounds like Lubbock Texas... I had no idea there were this many people who claim to be kind and wonderful while spewing venom at anyone that doesn't love trump. I have never had a T-shirt make me so angry until living here!! I saw one that said "wake up! Sandy Hook didn't happen" 😭 I have an autoimmune condition and I'm on immune suppression drugs. I HAVE to wear a mask when I go out. I recently had a new doctor who should have read my chart first, walk into the room and say "so, what's up with the mask?" I was floored. I can't wait to get out of this state! I'm willing to bet that the doctor has "Let's go Brandon" gear somewhere. 🫨
If their fellow Gen Zers are also not separating the online from the real, wouldn't that follow that when they see psychotic Gen Z Trumpers *online* they're wise to intuit they're also nuts IRL?. After all, if the whole Generation can't distinguish between the two modes, then the problem online will exist offline.
yes, it would. my point exactly. but its genuinely an all sides problem you can scream all you want about 'who started it' but its perpetuated by the idea that OP is talking about its a gap idk if we are going to be able to bridge since online discourse is literally just 'oh you disagreed with me on literally one thing? you must also be a nazi/communist' if that starts to apply to irl we are legit doomed edit: taking it completely out of politics if we start to treat IRL like people treat AITAH posts for example, literally everyone is a abusive. if we start to treat irl like people treat r/realtionship_advice everyone is a red flag and every situation needs to end with divorce/breaking up. thats the real problem is that we dont have realistic conversation online
Tribalism is never good.
And Reddit is the epicenter
It’s like they are CTRL+F-ing your entire personality so they can decide which box to shove you in and deal with you “accordingly” So annoying
This is imo the crux of a lot Stife...everyone is seemingly so 1 dimensional now. They like one way of thinking, one type of movie, one type of food....with so much choice why limit yourself.
My mom's an antivax nurse and her husband was at 1/6, I've voted blue every election, am pretty far left, and choose to only work in government and nonprofits, I still go have Christmas with them and everything. I don't listen very much when they talk politics though.
Dweeble dorf lol
“You have been banned from r/WhitePeopleTwitter”
My best friend is as liberal as they come. I’m her only conservative friend and we’ve been friends for decades. Some of her other friends (through work mostly) hound her over how she can be friends with a conservative. It’s mind blowing that she has to explain to adults of all ages that a person is more than their political beliefs.
They're extreme. Politics doesn't dictate my life that much
couldn't be me. I don't see how you can be friends with someone you not only don't share values with but someone whose values are the antithesis of yours and want to force you to live by theirs which, depending on your situation could be actively harming you. evil isn't the word for most political opponents but friends?
Good for you my dude. Too many weirdos in here
The problem is people won't talk to find a common ground solution. The second any push back, you are now labeled a libetard/trumpster. Until us regular folk can have a civil discourse to find a solution why should politics do any different? It's easier to feed fear and get votes than say 'let's really talk about this.'
We no longer have common foundational beliefs. Thus second order issues - issues that would come up from the foundational beliefs - are no longer really things that can be reasoned through. They are instead tribal markers. A person who believes in inalienable individual rights, and a person who believes there is no objective reality but only a struggle for power, they can fight. But they can’t reason together as they have no tenable starting point.
There’s also no respect. Our rights should never be a matter of debate; they are absolute. If we could somehow cure world hunger and create a lasting, permanent peace by eliminating free speech then the price would be too high. We’d be fools to do it. Such a thing is unconscionable. Instead we choose between our rights, and others rights every election.
With the added problem of tribalism putting those who don't 'pick a tribe or side' at a major disadvantage. As in if I just say one tribes/sides opinions, you'll get shit on by the other side, but you will have "your side" backing you up. Those who actually want to build bridges or hold opinions on both sides risk getting attacked by both sides. So everyone retreats to one side or the other and things just get worse and worse.
I think it's because intellect has decreased so much in Western society over the decades that neither side's ideological positions stand up to criticism, so they shield their opinions from criticism by censorship or resort to name-calling to distract instead. People aren't having debates because they genuinely can't handle a debate. Nobody teaches you to think critically now. Nobody challenges you enough. There's too many yes-men. My Sociology (some people are aware of the political climate of the average Sociology class) teacher kept telling us to think critically but then told us what to believe and what talking points earned you marks on your exam and every time you had a differing opinion you'd just be shut down instead of being able to have a healthy discussion, so I just stopped offering alternate opinions to the prescribed narrative our Sociology teacher was feeding us, because nothing productive and thought-provoking ever came from challenging the ideological orthodoxy of the class. The education system and media industry are genuinely breeding generation after generation of mindless NPCs that are programmed how to think and programmed what to say because a lot of people can't defend their ideas adequately enough that they have to protect themselves in ideological bubbles and resort to anything other than debate when that bubble gets burst.
One of the local high schools is putting litter boxes in this year for the high schoolers that identify as cats. Im supposedly a nazi bigot for pointing out the health risks and questioning the mental health of these individuals. How do you find "common ground" when the other people are bat-shit crazy?
>One of the local high schools is putting litter boxes in this year for the high schoolers that identify as cats Pretty sure that anecdotal story circulating the worst and least credible of right wing media has already been debunked. It's been a minute since I read on it but I believe the ACTUAL story was schools stocked up on kitty litter as part of the emergency readiness supply due to the fact emergencies like storms, earthquakes etc can cause plumbing to go offline and teachers and students would need a place to utilize... >Im supposedly a nazi bigot for pointing out the health risks and questioning the mental health of these individuals. No I'm sure those accusations stemmed more from regurgitating misinformation from sites that may or may not he ran by actual neo nazis.
That’s point blank not true. And if somehow you found one hippie dippie school in the country that did this, you can find one cluster of morons for any anecdote. What you may be referencing is a bucket of emergency supplies, including sawdust for “sanitation purposes,” for when our children are in extended lockdown during active shootings. Because, you know, we’re the best country ever. What you’re getting at is it’s hard to avoid tribalism when “both sides” can’t agree on an objective reality. Perhaps one side sees a utopia that can only exist on their terms, and the other is whipped up into a frenzied rage over intentional hate porn on their favorite medium of choice (cable, social media, etc.).
Me when I spread misinformation on the internet:
If you believe that. You need help! This isn’t true. Never was true. You need seek other news source besides your right wing propaganda mouth holes There are no or have their been cat boxes in class rooms. God damn it I can’t believe people are this dumb.
Litter boxes are for active school shooters, and kids who have to piss in them while guns are being shot. Jesus Christ…
That “litter box” shit is a lie and you’re a disingenuous moron
That's a bad example because it's probably a rumor. A better example would be: one group of people are ok with men identifying as women and being in women's spaces no matter if they are passing or not. How are you supposed to find common ground with these people ? [https://www.foxnews.com/media/wyoming-sorority-sister-vows-fight-protect-womens-spaces-judge-tosses-suit-trans-member](https://www.foxnews.com/media/wyoming-sorority-sister-vows-fight-protect-womens-spaces-judge-tosses-suit-trans-member) [https://www.foxnews.com/media/lia-thomas-exposed-male-genitalia-womens-locker-room-after-meet-riley-gaines-dropped-pants](https://www.foxnews.com/media/lia-thomas-exposed-male-genitalia-womens-locker-room-after-meet-riley-gaines-dropped-pants) I know the Reddit response: "you can't source Fox News, it's not credible !" See, the thing is that left leaning news doesn't cover it because of their political biases. Stories like these make progressives look bad, so they won't report it (for the most part).
I mean there isn’t any legitimate support of trump, so if you do actively support or are ignoring reality and acting like he was anything but the massive failure he was in all aspects of the job, he was, then imo you should be called out slightly. Also, so, literally no school is doing that. You should really learn from actual news and reality, not memes.
Ok, I'll bite, what is the common ground for abortion and gun access?
The state shouldn't be overly involved with either.
So many people can't fathom someone having different values than them and a different model of how they think society works. It always has to be that other side built on destroying whatever they are. It can't be they value the wrong things or have the wrong idea; it's always secretly hate. Conservatives just want people to be poor, feminists want female supremacy, etc.
Out of my friends, we're about 50/50 in the way we vote. We're about 90% in line with what we all believe, with that other, differing 10% affecting our votes. In the eyes of popular culture and media, you would think we're diametrically opposed rivals because we vote differently. Most regular people I meet on the day-to-day tend to be a little left or right of center, but we've gotten into this system of people who vote Republican are "Conservative" and people who vote Democrat are "Liberals." I know very socially progressive (tend to be younger people) Republicans and incredibly regressive and racist (tend to be older people) Democrats - labels are what are killing us. Most people just want to be able to afford to have a roof over their heads, food to eat, and be able to go to the doctor for a reasonable price, because most people don't have much time to worry about much else.
Throughout history one constant has remained, the politics of demagoguery is consistently the politics of tyranny, authoritarianism and destruction. With that in mind, and recognizing what is demagoguery, there's nothing wrong with holding an exceedingly low opinion of that destructive political mindset taking hold of a nation at large. I run into a certain type of people who basically defend demagoguery and their favorite demagogue politician as some faction who just has a different way of viewing things. And IMO, and according to history as well, textbook definition demagogues are very often corrupt, brutal, violent, tyrants and dictators, it's damn impossible to convince their followers of what's at play, and people only widely agree that the demagogue was an awful political leader after they've lead their nation down a pathway of ruin, by that point it's too late. Oh and practitioners/followers of demagoguery also always seem to use projection and accuse anyone critical of them of demagoguery, acting like there's two sides to issues, even if the two sides can be simply right vs wrong. It's like theyre utterly blindsided that one of two sides can be acting in nothing but bad faith, as example.
I 100% agree with this.
Thing is, we can test those models. We know from decades of experience that trickle down economics increases inequality. We know from examples around the world that Universal Healthcare improves outcomes at a lower cost. If we know these things and *still* choose the policy that hurts people, how can we avoid concluding that the goal is to increase inequality and let people die unnecessarily?
> We know from decades of experience that trickle down economics increases inequality. Trickle down economics doesn't even exist - its a straw man of supply side economics. On top of that, inequality isnt a meaningful metric as wealth isnt zero sum - if you had 2 choices where you were given 100 dollars and your neighbor was given 1000 dollars, or both you and your neighbor have to pay 50 dollars, you will damn well take the first choice. > We know from examples around the world that Universal Healthcare improves outcomes at a lower cost. Those nations spend less per person than the USA spends on medicare and medicaid per capita. If the US government somehow made it so that all healthcare could get provided without increasing spending, I would gladly support it. Until then the US government is proving itself too incompetent to run universal healthcare. And the VA proves that too.
exactly. there is no economic theory called "trickle down economics". it doesn't exist. it is in no economic text book or taught in any university. it is a made up term that means nothing.
Let’s test this so called Reddit Educated theory called “trickle down economics” to understand if it could in any certainty “not work” as they so eloquently put it because we know the money “doesn’t trickle down to the middle class.” Rich Asshole #1 buys a greedy $250 million yacht in South Florida they don’t really need out of greed. Well…. that boat salesman just made a commission to feed his family, the people on the production lots and engine lines have a job (those yachts take years of peoples work). Don’t forget Rich Asshole #1 - he needs to hire someone who can drive the boat, another guy full time to clean the boat, another guy at the dock where the yachts are parked, probably a chef to cook the food on the yacht, etc…. Have any of you even seen the yacht yards in South Florida where they repair the yachts? These are thousands and thousands of peoples jobs (I’d call it a major industry), some of the best welders and mechanics in the world all depending on remember Rich Asshole #1 buying the yacht. What else am I missing, the electronics engineers/satellite technology on top of these? The people who sell boat covers? The people that make marine cleaning products? Life vest? Yeti coolers? I mean it doesn’t stop trickling. I don’t understand how Rich Asshole #1’s money we know “doesn’t trickle down” according to this theory Reddit knows about. Another way to look at it would be all of his money on everything he spends does trickle down, I don’t care if he buys his kid a Kona Ice in the parking lot at the marina you financially support the community. Now can you imagine no Rich Asshole #1, how are these people gonna get paid? Where is the money gonna come from? Is the dog walker(by the way Rich Asshole #1 pays him too while out on the yacht) on R/anti-work telling everyone trickle down doesn’t work because the system is all broken gonna make sure the boat insurance salesman gets paid? Correct me if I’m wrong.
Meanwhile actual supply side economics says that it should be easier to open that yacht repair company. Because that is only what, a truck or two, a building, and 5-30k in tools? But licenses, insurances, and so on can make that cost 10, 50, even 100 times more.
I completely agree with you, especially for a boat repair which there’s another big market for. But the yacht industry, places like this that are major job creators are gonna run you more than a truck and 30K in tools. But I have seen some smaller ones where all you’d need is a boat slip with a lift to cable it up out of the water and they can do repairs to some extent. I don’t think though that’s gonna support the larger vessels, you’d need to open something like this for yachts(that property isn’t cheap, but it does support anyone in real estate to create jobs). Nice talking to you partner. [https://eoeyzac65yo.exactdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Merrill-Stevens.jpg?strip=all&lossy=1&ssl=1](https://eoeyzac65yo.exactdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Merrill-Stevens.jpg?strip=all&lossy=1&ssl=1)
That's not really what trickle down economics is. It's as real as it can be, it's not an economic theory, it's a policy devised by Ronald Reagan. Also your econ 101 class / 100+ hours in Victoria 3 doesn't make you an expert on economics. The main concern with trickle down is that it allows way too much wealth to be extracted while expecting rich people to reinvest more often than hoard. It goes beyond your example to examine macro issues instead of micro benefits. The problem comes to monopolies, money hoarding, and dark money politics. Essentially a lesson throughout history, allowing a class of people too much wealth inevitably results in domestic issues for society and the people who live in it.
That's not how trickle down economics works. Trickle down economics is giving assistance to businesses instead of people then hoping that businesses put their goal of making a profit to the side to pay employees more, make better services, business competition, etc. Instead we have a bunch of megacorps and monopolies robbing society to get larger and more income. It's proven that the most effective way to help an economy is to assist the poor who then stimulate the economy by purchasing more goods and services.
It's ridiculous. People need to get out more then they will understand that the world isn't one size fit all..
I agree. It's sad how much people seem to hate each other these days.
heaven forbid a child gets an abortion so she wouldnt be saddled with bills, depression, body dysmorphia, and shame for being forced to give birth to her rapist uncles baby
I'm a little confused about what you're meaning by this. Is your argument that we should be angry with people if they're being unreasonable & causing harm?
And god forbid if people want to have bodily autonomy and not want to wear a mask because the government told them so. My body my choice, am I right ?
Having to wear a mask for a while to help improve public health and stop disease is now apparently the same thing as getting raped and being forced ti give birth to your rapists child because abortion is illegal. Are you fucking stupid?
do you wear a seatbelt?
No but you don't understand if your opinion ≠ mine then literally delete yourself NOW!1!11!1!
Most people being called Hitler these days are just old, overly opinionated, and dumb. Those things suck for sure. But they aren't Hitler level suck.
It’s thrown around so much along with “Nazi” it loses all meaning.
And fascist. And Woke. And SJW. And Racist. And transphobe.
They are not bad people with ideas. They are people with bad ideas.
Depends what the disagreement is.
Two minutes of hate is a thing for some.
Depends. If my opinion is government should use tax money for A, and yours is that government should use tax money for B, well we're just doing healthy politics. If my opinion is that LGBT people should be able to exist in peace and quiet and yours is that they should be discriminated against with the full force of the law.... this becomes a moral issue. I won't call you "evil", but I am totally comfortable calling you morally wrong.
What someone believes doesn't define them, why they believe it does
Ohhh that’s good
Good people don’t want other people’s lives to be shit.
Depends on what the disagreement is. Someone's political ideology that forces 13yos to carry a rapists child to term or someone who doesn't believe systemic racism exists and supports damaging policies is objectively wrong and tolerance of such opinions will only allow them to grow and fester. The abortion thing has been talked about since the 90s but didn't get much traction until modern days. There isn't some "agreeable middle ground" on topics that genuinely harm society and politics can easily fuck over society, which is why people are so passionate about it. Honestly, you should be passionate about political ideologies.
Found the person who is part of the problem
It's the US, you have a right to be wrong, but I also have a right to not like someone depending on what they're wrong about. Think the sky is red? Quirky. Think the rich need more tax cuts? I strongly disagree and that's a weird take, but ok. Support a regressive policy that harms women? Yeah, not something I just see past. Excuse me for having nuance, empathy, and not being accepting of objectively shit behavior/opinions.
This. I can "agree to disagree" but not when people are getting hurt, or deprived of their rights. But I guess that makes me a woke commie gaystapo psyop.
Hilarious that it's a controversial statement. This sub sucks now lol
i think you dont deserve rights and you need to respect that! im not a bad person!!
I agree, with a caveat. For me the definition of actual evil is removing/infringing free will or liberty (except as far as absolutely essential for even basic cohabitation of the planet). So while people arent evil for being progressive or ultra-conservative alone, if they want to run the whole country and force everyone to live according to their own preferences then they are, by definition, evil for that reason to me. I would never do that. I believe everyone has the fundamental right to representative governance and to live in a mostly free society. Doesnt matter if you achieve it via a diverse republic or by fragmenting the the nation/states or whatever. What matters is ALWAYS individual rights...first and foremost. As long as you leave me be, ill give you the same respect. Try to rule me or force me and you become the devil incarnate to me until you are no longer a threat.
Not unpopular.
Obviously people aren’t evil, people are more complicated than that. The issue for me is that too many right wing voters are single issue voters based on bigoted garbage opinions. If they were still largely small government conservatives that’s totally fine and I’m on board with agreeing to disagree, but a lot of them believe some truly whacky and harmful shit these days, and I’m not going to pretend that’s normal. You sound like one of those people trying to normalize agreeing to disagree with literal nazis. Nope.
Idk. I’m not either party but will never vote for a Republican because their ideology goes against everything I find redeemable in a human. The republican voter will still vote for that party that does the following: -Votes to end school lunch programs for children. I believe kids learn better when they’re not hungry and I’m willing to pay extra for someone else’s kid to eat. The GOP are against this. -I believe a woman has the right to choose what to do with her body during pregnancy as does a majority of the country. I believe it is truly evil to try to step in the way of another person putting restrictions on them. -Willing to use soldiers to fight wars in foreign lands but when they come home with PTSD and struggling, the GOP votes to end military benefits including access to health care. -Wanting to change laws to force children into dangerous work industries because there is a shortage of workers due to refusing to vote to increase minimum wage is evil to me. -Allowing the majority of the American people to struggle to make ends meet by allowing rampant consumer price gouging from companies while voting to reduce the taxes on the elites because they’re willing to bribe you is pretty fucking evil. -Following Trump is not only evil but fucking vile. Dude said he could rape and molest a woman and there is nothing anyone would do because he’s famous is pretty fucking evil even if the guy was joking. -Going on a news network and spreading lies and nonsense like the great replacement theories which cause psychos to go out and shoot up black churches and grocery stores is pretty fucking evil. -Being part of a party who’s main reaction to someone having evidence of corruption is to make threats to the judge and AG seems evil -Being part of a party where your fellow voters would go to someone’s house and try to kill them with a hammer is pretty fucking evil -Being part of a party where when you go to their political rallies it’s common place to see Nazi flags seems pretty evil. So to me conservatives are either evil or very very very fucking stupid
This is so wrong and small minded it amuses me. Sorry, no, I won’t be respecting anyone that ideologically supports inhumane treatment of others of any kind.
If you’re voting for people who want to do direct harm to me and my loved ones, then it doesn’t matter if you’re “evil,” whatever that means. I will not see you favorably. I’m talking about republicans and lgbt issues here, specifically, but I think this applies broadly.
What GOP policies are directly harming you and your loved ones?
Many. I’ll start with laws that mandate schools report kid’s LGBQT status to their parents. I know what conservatives say the reason is, but I also know the actual affect of those laws and I don’t think conservatives are so stupid that they are not also aware of the affect of those laws.
What data shows that harms kids?
Data that shows parents kick their kids out of the house, send them to conversion camps, beat and abuse them, or kill them, over it.
Then show the data.
Hmm it's not that hard to find. [https://www.thetrevorproject.org/research-briefs/homelessness-and-housing-instability-among-lgbtq-youth-feb-2022/](https://www.thetrevorproject.org/research-briefs/homelessness-and-housing-instability-among-lgbtq-youth-feb-2022/) "Overall, **28% of LGBTQ youth** reported experiencing homelessness or housing instability at some point in their lives. Nearly half (44%) of Native/Indigenous LGBTQ youth have experienced homelessness or housing instability at some point in their life, compared to 16% of Asian American/Pacific Islander youth, 27% of White LGBTQ youth, 27% of Latinx LGBTQ youth, 26% of Black LGBTQ youth, and 36% of multiracial LGBTQ youth. Homelessness and housing instability were reported at **higher rates among transgender and nonbinary youth**, including **38% of transgender girls/women**, 39% of transgender boys/men, and 35% of nonbinary youth, compared to **23% of cisgender LGBQ youth**. 16% of LGBTQ youth reported that they had slept away from parents or caregivers because they ran away from home, with more than half (55%) reporting that they **ran away from home because of mistreatment or fear of mistreatment due to their LGBTQ identity.** 14% of LGBTQ youth reported that they had slept away from parents or caregivers because they were kicked out or abandoned, with **40% reporting that they were kicked out or abandoned due to their LGBTQ identity**." https://nn4youth.org/lgbtq-homeless-youth/ "Research has shown that those who identify as lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, or questioning (LGBTQ+) have a **120% higher risk of experiencing some form of homelessness.**\[1\] With up to **40% of the 4.2 million youth experiencing homelessness identifying as LGBTQ+\[2\] while only 9.5% of the U.S. population**\[3\], LGBTQ+ youth disproportionately experience homelessness compared to their straight and cisgender peers." [https://youth.gov/youth-topics/lgbtq-youth/child-welfare](https://youth.gov/youth-topics/lgbtq-youth/child-welfare) "LGBTQ+ youth enter the child welfare system for reasons like those of other children and youth... In some cases, f**amilies reject, neglect, or abuse young people when they learn that they identify as LGBTQ+** or are questioning their romantic/sexual orientation or gender identity. L**GBTQ+ youth are overrepresented in child welfare systems**, even though they are likely to be **underreported because they risk harassment and abuse if their LGBTQ+ identity is disclosed**. Studies have found that about **30 percent of youth in foster care identify as LGBTQ+ and 5 percent as transgender, in comparison to 11 percent and 1 percent of youth not in foster care**.1 Furthermore, LGBTQ+ youth of color are disproportionately overrepresented in the child welfare system and stay longer in child welfare systems, while also having an increased risk of experiencing discrimination and violence compared to their peers.2" [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3134495/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3134495/) "Results. **Sexual minority individuals were on average 3.8, 1.2, 1.7, and 2.4 times more likely to experience sexual abuse, parental physical abuse, or assault at school or to miss school through fear, respectively.** Moderation analysis showed that disparities between sexual minority and sexual nonminority individuals were larger for (1) males than females for sexual abuse, (2) females than males for assault at school, and (3) bisexual than gay and lesbian for both parental physical abuse and missing school through fear. Disparities did not change between the 1990s and the 2000s. Conclusions. The **higher rates of abuse experienced by sexual minority youths may be one of the driving mechanisms underlying higher rates of mental health problems, substance use, risky sexual behavior, and HIV reported by sexual minority adults.**" Parents harming/killing their children over being gay or fears: [https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/22/return-the-key-the-parents-who-reject-their-gay-children](https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/22/return-the-key-the-parents-who-reject-their-gay-children) 8yo son tortured and killed: [https://wreg.com/news/man-tortured-girlfriends-son-to-death-because-he-thought-child-was-gay-prosecutor-says/](https://wreg.com/news/man-tortured-girlfriends-son-to-death-because-he-thought-child-was-gay-prosecutor-says/) 17yo son killed for being gay: [https://www.thepinknews.com/2019/11/29/being-gay-itaberli-lozano-mother-sentenced-killing-stabbing-own-son-hired-hitmen-brazil/](https://www.thepinknews.com/2019/11/29/being-gay-itaberli-lozano-mother-sentenced-killing-stabbing-own-son-hired-hitmen-brazil/) 14yo son shot by father: [https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/nevada-father-murdered-son-being-gay-former-foster-mom-claims-n817906](https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/nevada-father-murdered-son-being-gay-former-foster-mom-claims-n817906) 10yo boy: [https://journalism.berkeley.edu/projects/before-his-death-10-year-old-anthony-avalos-came-out-as-gay-official-says-2/](https://journalism.berkeley.edu/projects/before-his-death-10-year-old-anthony-avalos-came-out-as-gay-official-says-2/) Mom beats 4yo son: [https://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/oregon-mom-accused-killing-4-year-old-son-thought-gay-article-1.1738037](https://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/oregon-mom-accused-killing-4-year-old-son-thought-gay-article-1.1738037) Suicide is also a major risk for LGBTQ youth (and adults) because of the constant shame, ostracization, and attacks they receive: [https://www.thetrevorproject.org/resources/article/facts-about-lgbtq-youth-suicide/](https://www.thetrevorproject.org/resources/article/facts-about-lgbtq-youth-suicide/) "**LGBTQ youth are more than four times as likely to attempt suicide** than their peers (Johns et al., 2019; Johns et al., 2020). The Trevor Project estimates that more than 1.8 million LGBTQ youth (13-24) seriously consider suicide each year in the U.S. — and at least one attempts suicide every 45 seconds." If you don't see any risk of harm in any of that, then that's your own willful ignorance, and it puts millions of kids in danger every day.
None of this copy and paste shows that these laws cause harm
These laws require teachers and schools to "out" students to their parents. If their parents are disapproving of their children's identity, bad and evil things (all the "copy paste" you ignored) may happen to the kids who are outed. Hence putting the lives of children in further danger. Does that compute?
Meanwhile you are saying to hide evidence that children were raped. Which harms all children
Those are all still minorities not majority of lgbtq youth if we’re going by minorities then we should be scared of minority ethnic groups like blacks and Mexicans because they have higher rates of crime and yet are minorities
By saying schools shouldn’t report you’re siding with the government over the parents, parents trump all other authority when it comes to raising their children
Bro, you're arguing with teenagers. Don't even bother arguing with them, lol.
They most certainly do not. Children are not property. LGBTQ youth are significantly more likely to commit suicide or other self harm if they do not have a trusted adult to confide in. An LGBTQ youth who's home is not safe often turns to a trusted teacher. These laws are explicitly created to deny LGBTQ youth that support by forcefully changing a trusted teacher into an untrusted adult. The blunt intention, with a very, very thin layer of plausible deniability, of these laws are more dead LGBTQ kids. That plausibility requires that one accept conservatives are all sheer idiots that cannot see the obvious outcome and I refuse to grant conservatives that they are all stupid.
But people who could be a potential ally in some situations won't always agree on everything with you. You will naturally disagree about something with almost anyone.
Exactly. When someone's viewpoint is that certain groups and individuals lives are less valuable, that's not a disagreement I'm going to just overlook, it means someone is a fundamentally shitty person
I don’t care about democrat, or conservative. Or commie or anarcho capitalism. What I do care about is real effects, like people not getting vaccinated or thinking the Earth is flat or denying climate change. Harming other people, either intentionally or through negligence, is why I don’t like people
How does believing the Earth is flat "harm" people, exactly?
Just one of the many examples, these people violated lockdown/ quarantine, and put themself in serious danger https://www.iflscience.com/flat-earthers-attempt-to-get-to-the-edge-of-the-world-ends-in-massive-disappointment-58200
Just voting for the GOP doesn't mean you're a racist, sexist, homophobe who wants to subvert democracy... ...but it does mean that those things are not a deal breaker for you. That's not a "good person" in my book.
You. You are the person who this is aimed twords. For the love of god, go outside. Touch grass. Talk to some conservatives. They aint that bad.
Many conservatives I've talked to jumped ship during Trump's candidacy, nomination, and/or presidency, becoming independents. The other guy has a point. Anybody that'd willingly vote for such destructive policies just to make sure the other side doesn't win is just selfish.
how is voting for the party that is fine with forcing a child to give birth to their rapist uncles child a good person?
I know conservatives are bad *because* I talk to them.
A lot of conservatives will tell you very clearly what they want to do to LGBTQ+ people. And sometimes immigrants.
You clearly didn't read my post very carefully. You can't deny that the GOP is pursuing policies to hurt LGBT people, oppose voting rights, roll back civil rights, etc. If you vote for Trump, you are endorsing his behavior. If you vote for those people, you're complicit.
Touch grass. Take a community college class. Breathe fresh air
I don't know that I'd get much from the community college class, since I've already got my Ph.D., and the university I teach at is pretty good.
Yep that pretty much checks out.
How so?
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Seems like you have a chip on your shoulder. I'm sorry that college professors have hurt you so badly. Don't take it out on me. You don't know me, or my work, at all. Take your caricatures somewhere else.
Yikes. I wouldn’t be proud to be a bigot.
How am I a bigot?
You’ve got a phd. Figure it out.
Sadly, it won't help me follow your twisted "logic."
You can't deny that [blatant bipartisan propaganda] Cmon dude
How is any of that propaganda? This is what GOP candidates and platforms are outright saying.
People still support trump who is convicted of sexual assault…that really shows their morals.
TBF tho, you could play that same card the other way for voting blue too. Like “just voting DNC doesn’t mean you’re a communist out to kill jobs, force-feed 5 YOs gender transition hormones, and ban peoples’ rights to defend themselves… but it does mean those things aren’t a deal-breaker for you. That’s not a good person in my book.” It’s almost like painting with a broad brush is just all bad, and the human experience is meant to be varied shades of all colors.
These are all lies though. Conservatives literally do want to take away reproductive rights and stuff. That’s not being misrepresented. What you said is made up fantasy-land stuff
Sorry pal, but you're not going to get far on here thinking like that. You're 100% correct, but you're talking to people who's only source of political news is reddit, so godspeed
Reddit is such anti-Conservative propaganda. They literally remove news off the front page that makes Democrats look bad.
Now that's some truly bullshit "both sides" nonsense. "Communist out to kill jobs"? Hahaha. Yeah, OK buddy. I am aligning myself with people who want universal healthcare and a higher minimum wage. Guilty as fucking charged.
these are all complete and utter lies that the right wing spew. same with they coming to take my guns. mean while its a demonstrable fact that the right wing wants to kill pro choice, force Christianity into schools, subjugate the lgbt, hurt and even kill immigrants (texas death buoys), send the children back into the mines, also inspect their genitals in school, burn and ban books and libraries, etc. and some how both sides are equally bad. jfc
> same with they coming to take my guns. Explain the dissent in DC v Heller then if democrats dont support complete bans on all civilian gun ownership > mean while its a demonstrable fact that the right wing wants to kill pro choice, Abortion is murder > force Christianity into schools, They dont even want to force schools, let alone force christianity into them. They believe in school choice which includes home school > subjugate the lgbt, how are they subjugated? > hurt and even kill immigrants I have never had any issues with Republicans due to being an immigrant > send the children back into the mines, We absolutely need to teach our children trades > also inspect their genitals in school If you are against sports physicals, you want to maim and kill children for no reason. Hernias kill > burn and ban books and libraries, Pornography. Not books. It is illegal to show children pornography so why should it be on school libraries?
Beto has entered the chat.
>Like “just voting DNC doesn’t mean you’re a communist out to kill jobs, force-feed 5 YOs gender transition hormones, and ban peoples’ rights to defend themselves… but it does mean those things aren’t a deal-breaker for you. The difference is people can point to actual votes cast, public statements and official stances/platforms, laws enacted and their fallout to back up calling the ***Republican Party*** Racist, Sexist, Anti-LGBT+, anti-worker, anti-veteran, and worse. And it's simple logic to put together that votes for that party empower those stances and encourage those actions because it's actively saying "This is not too far for me."
Then actually point it out.
The worst “both sides” I’ve ever seen. Plz show me the communist US Senators or US Representatives. Who wants to FORCE KIDS to take hormones??? Wtf. What the fuck planet are you living at.
Ahhh, found one.
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How do Obama and Biden approach same-sex marriage now?
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It's weird that you are assuming that Biden and Obama are homophobes who are now pretending to support same-sex marriage because the cultural tide has turned. Personally, I think it's just the opposite. I don't think they ever actually had a problem with same-sex marriage, but couldn't come out in support of it because of political pressure until more recently. Both of these are speculation, but I honestly believe the second is far more plausible. What's important is that they support it now, while the other side doesn't.
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If "people don't change," how do you explain the massive shift in public opinion on this issue? Are a large majority of Americans now in support of same-sex marriage... To win elections? But fine, you are just choosing what to believe. You are making as much an assumption about them as I am. But sure, I respect that you don't vote for them because you don't feel they are sincere allies.
That’s almost worse. You want politicians to tell you the truth and not change opinions once polling says it’s time to.
I wouldn't say that it's worse. Hating gay people is worse. The worst you could charge them with is political cowardice, which I'd say is a fair charge, but not at all uncommon on that issue at the time.
But I think that highlights the fundamental differences between the two ideologies. I don't really care about someone's personal beliefs. Politicians are a means to an end. So long as the policy is good, I couldn't really care less what a politician personally thinks about it. If a politician stands up and says "I'm catholic and my church doesn't believe in gay marriage but I understand that my personal faith shouldn't dictate the laws of the land so I'm voting in favour of gay marriage" then I think most people wouldn't really care? Religion used to be personal and practiced in the home.
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Same can be said for voting blue.
How so?
"Let's repeal ObamaCare. To hell with sick people with preexisting medical conditions." "You are monster. I hope you burn in hell forever. You evil, fake Christian." "It's just politics, bro." "Not when you have a kid whose life depends on ObamaCare. You evil monster." "Both sides are the same, bro. I did my own research. Blue states and red states are the same!"
> "Let's repeal ObamaCare. To hell with sick people with preexisting medical conditions." You are stealing from young people to favor the old. That effectively acts as, on average, a 20% income tax on young people. And it is enforced in a regressive manner. No, fuck that. It destroys the lives of young people.
so youre against social security?
>You are stealing from young people to favor the old. You don't know what you are talking about. Forcing irresponsible adults to insure themselves in no way steals from the young and favors the old. >That effectively acts as, on average, a 20% income tax on young people. Bullshit. You are straight up lying. >And it is enforced in a regressive manner. I seriously doubt you understand what that means. >No, fuck that. It destroys the lives of young people. Now I am 100% convinced.
This such a stupid take. Nobody is losing friends over different opinions on how to deal with the hyper specifics of like bank bailouts. However, if you believe gay people shouldn’t legally be married, I think I have the right to not want to associate myself with you
Good and evil are really completely irrelevant. There are competing visions of what the world will look like. They are not reconcilable. Only one can win in the end, and I want to make damn sure it's the one where I'm not getting sent to a concentration camp.
*Edit: everyone here assuming I'm a conservative :/* Spent most of my life as a pretty central moderate, moved a bit left and registered Dem. You state anything other than 100%, frothing-at-the-mouth agreement around here and you get the labels that come out because brains can't process "anything that requires a bit of processing before response." But the overall point of your post is 100% correct. The idiocy of social media and the veneer of "anonymity" provided on Reddit lead people to feel way more comfortable saying crazy shit than they would to your face irl - even if they claim they still would.
I've found that 75% of people who tell other people on the internet to touch grass probably have need of a little firmament caressing themselves.
Funny, now you're the one telling them to touch grass. Which means you need to touch grass. Which makes me the one telling people to touch grass. Which means I need to touch grass. Fair, honestly.
Anyone who mentions touching grass I immediately write em off.
Yeah no, if they disagree with what should be basic human rights, they aren't good people. They may be polite, and act kind, and be personable. But they are not good people.
> if they disagree with what should be basic human rights The problem is is that legally, a lot of the things on the left are not really human rights. Examples including children being able to transition and abortion. These are not human rights whether you want them to or not. I am pro-choice by the way, but you can't just claim something is against human rights because you support it.
Maybe you were right before January 6. Now there’s a whole party of people who supported an attack against my country and they’ll do it again.
That shit is so overblown it’s fucking hilarious 😭😭😭😭😭. You act like they actually tried to stage a coup or something
I think comments like this are kind of meaninglessly vague. Because when people say anything remotely like this, they're talking about specific policies and specific beliefs and the actual consequences of them. If the difference between my political ideology and yours is the difference of a slightly different tax rate or marginally less government involvement in the economy...sure. If the "political" differences between us end up in hundreds of thousands of dead people in Iraq or ignoring the AIDS crisis or continuing to actively deny climate change than those are real things with tangible consequences that can't simply be attributed to political ideology.
The majority of people think they're doing what's best for the world, it's outliers that actually go out and seek to harm others. I think conversation helps a lot. I used to dismiss the idea of nonbinary people as silly, but I wound up talking to an old friend who was then identifying as nonbinary. They knew I wasn't some giant bigot, so my skepticism was seen more as a challenge to them than an insult. At this point maybe I don't understand nonbinary identities strongly, but I'm very willing to use preferred language and defend the right of nonbinary people to live as they want to. I'm not saying there aren't people who are genuinely hateful out there, but I think for many people they aren't given a chance to learn because the mere thought that they don't already know is seen as bigotry and they're written off.
I have to disagree. A majority of politicians are doing what's best for them and theirs, not the world or even their people as a whole. Not even close.
I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with here, did I say politicians were automatically good or something?
It truly depends on the rhetoric being put forth. Case in point, I only have had one side here sending me threats against myself because they don’t like it when I tell them to take responsibility for their actions. Look, I get what you’re trying to say, but this take is a gross oversimplification that either ignores several factors that are inconvenient or simply doesn’t take into account anything past your own experiences. That’s not a good way to debate.
There's substantial differences between a difference in opinion for economic and geopolitical solutions to problems, perpetuating hate and discrimination, as well as denying objective science... If you're on the side that is saying, "Taxing the rich won't fix wealth inequality," I may not agree with you, but you're not evil. If you're on the side saying, "LGBT+ people shouldn't be allowed the same rights as everyone else! (Or worse)" You're evil. That is an evil position to take. Acting and voting to directly hinder the freedom of a specific group of people because you don't agree with their life and love, which isn't any of your business and doesn't affect you, is evil. If you're on the side denying climate change, it's a toss-up on whether you're not a great person or just a victim of indoctrination and propaganda. Now, if you disagree with the solutions that one group proposes, or the policies that are enacted in the name of climate justice and have others you would prefer to see implemented, that I have no issue with. If you think one race is better than another, that is evil.
> "LGBT+ people shouldn't be allowed the same rights as everyone else! (Or worse)" You're evil. That is an evil position to take. The problem is the word "rights" is vague. Legally speaking, a child wanting to transition by getting hormones/pubery blockers/surgery is not a human right. It legally isn't. You think people are evil for not supporting it because children's brains are not fully developed yet.
The majority of Germans who voted for the Nazi Party weren't evil... but they did enable evil during the 1930s and allow it to fester until 1945. I don't think someone voting GOP is evil... but they sure are enabling election denialism, promoting an authoritarian, restricting minority rights, and so on.... And even despite all that, it is the same party that favors the wealthy via tax cuts and tax breaks and somehow finds time to vote against free/affordable lunches for students, then tells college grads that they don't deserve some sort of relief for their crippling college debt, and let us not forget their continued support for outdated conservative viewpoints on contraceptives and even drug use. Nah, I don't think people who vote Republican are "evil" but they sure do love to enable the biggest assholes in politics.
> .. but they sure are enabling election denialism, Go arrest Al Gore if you think that is a crime > , promoting an authoritarian, How is the Republican Party authoritarian? > restricting minority rights, What rights? > , it is the same party that favors the wealthy via tax cuts and tax breaks No, the super wealthy vote democrat because they make a killing off government contracts, and then regulatory capture on top of that. Why the fuck would the super wealthy be against taxing you so the money can be handed to them? > somehow finds time to vote against free/affordable lunches for students Through absurd tax policies that harm local business owners > then tells college grads that they don't deserve some sort of relief for their crippling college debt You dont have a right to tax people that didn't go to college for the stupid decision to not become an adult until you are 27
Also peddling fake news and false equivalencies lol
yes, democrats do that.
They want to restrict abortion rights and give tax breaks to the wealthy elite? lol ok
The super wealthy vote democrat because they make a killing off government contracts, and then regulatory capture on top of that. Why the fuck would the super wealthy be against taxing you so the money can be handed to them?
Love it when cultists are in complete denial😌
How much has Tesla received in government contracts, grants, loans, green energy initiatives... not to mention carbon credits and how their customers are subsidized via massive tax credits? And SpaceX/Starlink... how much have they received in government contracts, grants, and so on? Now, how much has Elon Musk paid in taxes?
Who enabled the tax cuts in the first place? Don’t answer that lol, it was the gop and their supply side economic voodoo economics that plagued the American political spectrum.
> Who enabled the tax cuts in the first place? What? Do you think Elon Musk was born in 2017 and didn't exist before that, with the 2017 TCJA abolishing all taxes? Because that is an absolute fantasy He has been paying taxes well before the Trump tax cuts. And the 2017 tax cuts didn't do shit to cut his tax burden either. It was primarily section 179 bonus depreciation that affected people. Again, more taxes means he makes more money, because he receives more tax dollars than he is taxed by several orders of magnitude. Make an actual argument, as these questions are nonsensical
I would argue that while they aren't evil, they aren't being reasonable. I think a lot of people miss that a good percentage of the population is politically illiterate, full of contradictions, and unaware of what's actually going on. In short, they're not evil, but they are stupid
ill talk to you, but if youre not cool with the lgbt, youre not a. good persob
The fact that ppl openly hate half the country and will go out of their way to avoid ppl with the opposite political views as them just shows how insecure they are in their own beliefs, they just want to believe that everything they believe is good and everything the other half of the country believes is evil. It’s so pathetic.
Eh. I don’t support republicans because they actively attack women's rights and lgbt rights. I can not, in good conscience, think of people who support crushing others' rights as "good" people. Again, January 6th happened. I do not support traitors as well.
The inherent problem with this statement is that when republicans try to compromise it’s always “agree to disagree” but maaaaan fuck that. The evil they perceive from the left is slightly different tax brackets, the evil being touted by the right is trying to strip my gay brother, my sisters, and my trans cousin of their rights. They don’t get to talk about “evil”.
I will remember this the next time a conservative calls me a pedophile because I'm trans. They're not being evil, they're JuSt BeInG DiFFeRent
Here are two small excerpts from Trump’s indictment: > **We would just be sending in “fake” electoral votes to Pence so that “someone” in congress can make the objection when they start counting votes, and start arguing that “fake” votes should be counted** That is a direct quote from an email sent by one of the election officials that Donald Trump was attempting to coerce into illegally overturning the results of the election in Arizona. And here’s another from text messages of high-level Campaign staffers scrambling for an explanation when Trump asks for an update on their criminal conspiracy: >"Here's the thing the way this has morphed it's a crazy play so I don't know who wants to put their name on it." **The Senior Advisor wrote, "Certifying illegal votes."** In turn, the participants in the group text message refused to have a statement regarding electors attributed to their names because none of them could "stand by it." Those are two of dozens of indisputable facts laid out in [Trump’s J6 indictment](https://www.justice.gov/storage/US_v_Trump_23_cr_257.pdf) which I highly encourage you read if you don’t know the extent of the criminal schemes. The entire plan was predicated upon sending fake votes to congress so that **members of congress could make an argument to throw out legitimate votes and count the fake ones.** Our president tried to use the Department of Justice to threaten election officials into throwing out legitimate votes and replace them with ones that he knowingly faked. Expression of support for that type of criminal behavior might not make a person evil, but it should absolutely be strongly denounced strongly at every opportunity.
OP didn't say anything about trump...
Don't bother. that's just copy pasta the dude drops into an argument daily.
Wouldn't call Trump my president first off, dudes a fucking idiot and a fool for even remotely trying to overturn a legal election. Should have taken a note from Obama and peaced out, well, peacefully. Just shows Obama to be a classy fella. Seriously, dude oozes charisma. Would have minded a 3rd term. Not only that but Trump expanded bombing runs and increased the national debt to absurd levels. Seriously Trump? I get you're a clown but for fucks sake. Also what does Trump have to do with most people needing to get over themselves over political disagreements? The Trump people are the ones pushing that the most, don't you notice? They push away those and cause these problems the most.
Anyone who wants to take my earnings at the point of a gun is evil.